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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 07:02 
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Hu leaves G8 amid Chinese rioting

Is the unrest in Xinjiang really serious or is Mr.Hu trying to avoid scrutiny?
Quote:
Chinese President Hu Jintao has cut short a visit to Italy for the G8 summit amid ongoing unrest in Xinjiang.
...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8139065.stm


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 09:43 
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r_subramanian wrote:
Is the unrest in Xinjiang really serious or is Mr.Hu trying to avoid scrutiny?

How about both? :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 11:00 
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As expected,the Chinese have reacted to the riots in Urumqui by flooding the city with troops and a show of force."Gin & Tonic" has fled the G-8 summit scuttling back to try and defuse the situ,which has threatened to spiral out of control.Any armed crackdown against the Uighurs will only hasten an anti-China Islamic militancy,whcih will receive willing help from the likes of the sponsors of Al Q and even the west.The genie of anti-Han violence has however escaped,as it did in Tibet earlier and China's crude attempt at "social engineering",by dumping Han Chinese in non-Han regions,has finally come home to roost.The Chinese bubble of social stability has been blown apart by these riots and coming just after the anniversary of the bloody crackdown of Tian Men Sq.,does inspire little long term confidence in China's authoritarian rulers in finding a glue to hold China together.The pro-Chinese chants by the Hans show their clear underlying attitude of wanting dominance over the other ethic minorities.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 664340.ece
Quote:
Chinese troops flood into riot city as Hu Jintao flies home
Jane Macartney in Urumqi
Thousands of Chinese troops poured into the restive city of Urumqi early today in a massive show of force, as President Hu Jintao cut short a visit to Italy for the G8 summit to deal with the outbreak of ethnic violence.

Along one road ringing the capital of the western region of Xianjiang where 156 people died in riots on Sunday, The Times counted more than 30 paramilitary trucks, each followed by about two dozen men, many in black body armour, and most carrying riot shields, batons and fire arms.

The convoys included several white armoured personnel carriers accompanied by tear gas vans, all with paramilitaries standing ready to open fire if necessary. They were preceded by land cruisers, their sirens wailing as they moved almost at a walking pace through the town.

On the sides of the trucks were banners reading: "See the people as our father and mother".

How unrest in China flared to violence
Rebiya Kadeer denies accusations of militancy
Han mob marches for revenge against Uighurs

PICTURES: China unrest
In the centre of the city around People's Square, army helicopters circled overhead as hundreds more paramilitary troops marched in brigades of 20 to 30 chanting: "Defend the Motherland, defend the people."

A Han Chinese man surnamed Run said, as he watched the troops rolling by; "We support this. The government has to take action to protect the people. But they should have got here sooner. It took them three days to do this. Why so long?"

Mr Hu's decision to return home came after another day of strife in Urumqi on Tuesday, as thousands of Han Chinese roamed the streets looking for vengeance after Sunday's riots, which left 156 dead and more than 800 injured.

He left Italy early today "due to the situation in northwest China's Xinjiang Uighur Autonomous Region" Xinhua, China's state news agency reported.

Mr Hu decided to curtail his trip "given the worsening of the disorder in Xinjiang," Tang Heng, the first political counsellor at the Chinese embassy in the Italian capital told Italy's ANSA news agency.

Although China is not a member of the Group of Eight, talks at the summit were to include emerging powers including China and India.

State Councillor Dai Bingguo would take part in the summit on Mr Hu's behalf, Xinhua reported.

This morning, the streets were quiet and cars began moving agin. But although the angry mobs had not returned, many Han Chinese were still carrying makeshift weapons in the city centre and outlying districts.

"I'm carrying this just for my own feeling of safety," said a man named Li as he walked near the city centre carrying a martial arts nanchuk - two batons held together by a chain.

One woman in her 30s was seen walking on the street carrying a large stick with nails coming out of it, while others were carrying knives and steel poles.

Many shops and businesses remained closed and there were no buses or taxis running through the centre of town.

Chinese officials have already blamed the unrest on separatist groups abroad, which it says want to create an independent homeland of East Turkestan for the Uighurs. Ms Kadeer, the exiled Uighur businesswoman and activist blamed for the violence, denied having anything to do with it. She said: "These accusations are completely false."



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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 14:20 
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The uighurs are followers of the RoP, not peaceful Tibetan Buddhists,..they'll claw back at the Han in every way they can. The Han commie goons may have bitten off more than they can chew this time. If foreign RoP elements start flooding in, the commies will have their hands full.

I wonder if the latest round of violence was fomented by Unkil as 'gentle' reminder to PRC to watch it's step and not rock the boat too much wrt NoKo and $ currency replacement.


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 22:21 
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China asks Pakistan, other countries to unearth links with Urumqi violence
Quote:
A worried Hu Jintao, secretary-general of the Communist Party of China and the country's president left the G8 summit in Italy and rushed back to Beijing on Tuesday night as it dawned on Chinese authorities that the Urumqi violence might set off a chain reaction and eventually affect the party position.


Quote:
China wants several countries including Pakistan, Afghanistan, Kazakhstan, Turkey, Germany and the United States to help unearth links between their local citizens and the World Uyghur Congress, which Beijing considers to be behind the violence in Urumqi. One report suggested that foreign ministry officials are in talks with envoys of Afghanistan posted in Beijing on the issue.


If so called non-state actors will be involved than pakis will be in deep trouble. I hope world will come together and teach one or two lessons to pakis.

Ankit


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2009 22:53 
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Any Uyghurs in India?


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 03:34 
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The future
http://www.responsiblenanotechnology.org/Scenario7.pdf
Quote:
6 May 2014 - Follow-up investigations (again mostly by underground reporters) have shown the
devastating impacts of pollution in Chinese cities, towns, and countrysides that no one has
previously seen; truly massive protests in the major population centers against these appalling
revelations are provoking even more swift and bloody government crackdowns; and this in turn
leads to more investigative reports, more riots, more deaths, and more unrest. Can China hold
together?

5 Jul 2014 - It looks like the Chinese government is falling part.

23 Aug 2014 - The People’s Republic of China has ceased to exist. The largest nation in the
history of the world is imploding before our very eyes. Taiwan has moved in to claim some
territory, pieces of the Chinese Red Army are holding onto certain areas, while mass anarchy
prevails across most of the country. It’s being called “The Crash.” No one can say how many
thousands -- millions? -- will suffer, starve, or be killed in this horrific turn of events.

6 Jan 2015 - Given China’s former preeminence as the world’s major center for manufacturing of
consumer goods, it’s not surprising that a severe global recession followed last summer’s Crash.
We’re all facing bad times today.

10 Feb 2015 - Now, this is interesting. It turns out that China started a secret government
program back around 2010 to develop “desktop nanofactories.” Nobody knew about it, or knew
how close they were getting, until after The Crash.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 05:31 
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When we started this thread, it was *not* meant to be a general China news thread at all.

Its primary aim was to understand what happens inside Zhongnanhai, and the dynamics within the CPC and PLA, who's rising, who is being marginalized, etc. Their opaque nature means that it is difficult to tell whether there is a power struggle going on, until matters have already reached a crisis point.

In this regard, Hu Jintao's urgent return to China from the G8 summit in Italy seems odd. I wonder if there's a rift between the PLA and the CPC, or between a faction backing Hu and some other ? Note that Hu is not the PM (Wen Jiabao is), but the President, General Secretary of the CPC, and Chairman of the Central Military Commission. He was originally the CPC chief of Xizang (Tibet) Autonomous Region.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 06:32 
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I had started writing a piece on the political power of PLA for SRR but haven't managed to complete it. only a third has been completed till now with no signs that requisite time will be available to complete it in the near future. :oops:

here is the incomplete draft : http://ifile.it/cexajhy


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 08:32 
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Where are the AlQaeda threats?

Sarkozy makes one remark about burkhas, and AlQaeda is shrieking at him. But in China, hundreds of people are killed in rioting, and the jihadis are silent. Definitely one to rub in their faces, to remind them of their hypocrisy.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 12:55 
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Something that struck me about the Uighur crackdown is that one person appears to have not been mentioned at all in recent days - Prime Minister Wen Jiabao. During the last several public order problems - the early 2008 snowstorms, the Sichuan earthquake, and the pre-Olympics Tibet protests, Wen was the public face of the official response, while Hu was largely in the background. During the snowstorm, Wen travelled to the railway stations to plead for calm, and similarly travelled to Sichuan. He also responded strongly to the Tibet protests, both at home, and while visiting Europe. In the current situation, I have not seen any real mention of Wen responding publicly, and there's the cryptic case of Hu's hurried return from Italy. Someone appears to be about to be eased out...


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 13:01 
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suraj, jiabao is quite close to hu from very early days. you might find the related details in the link above interesting !

OT : thanks for the budget digest !


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2009 20:55 
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Deleted. This thread is about the Chinese political establishment, not a venue to start a flamewar.

Note to others: just report such posts instead of responding.


Last edited by Suraj on 09 Jul 2009 22:05, edited 2 times in total.
Provocative grisly pictures removed.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 00:17 
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Rahul M: I did read your document. Very interesting indeed, particularly that neither Hu nor Wen have the clear backing of the PLA. Jiang handled it by helping the PLA modernize. After 15 years of Jiang's feeding the PLA apparatus, just how can much a party man like Hu or Wen can do when trouble brews, even if they continued the policy of giving the PLA greater authority and financial backing ?


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 01:38 
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Financial Crisis and unemployment among new college graduates
Quote:
One in three graduates jobless in China
Almost one in three new Chinese college graduates are unable to find a job, according to the official Xinhua news agency.

Citing the Ministry of Education, Xinhua said about 2 million graduates, or 32 per cent of the total of 6.11 million, were without work.

The figure is the highest since the ministry started collecting the data in 1996.
...

http://business.theage.com.au/business/one-in-three-graduates-jobless-in-china-20090709-debr.html


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 01:49 
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An Australian point-of-view on the arrest of Rio Tinto executive

The Chinese establishment is furious after its attempt to grab a chunk of Rio Tinto was rebuffed. Now they are trying to 'fix' the company and send a message to the Chinophile Mr.Kevin Rudd!

Quote:
Big risk in nasty business
THE arrest and detention in Shanghai of senior Australian Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu represents a grave crisis in Australia's relationship with China.

It is a serious miscalculation by Beijing, and threatens to do lasting harm to China's interests, not only in Australia, but throughout the Western world.

Rio Tinto is one of the biggest mining companies in the world. Recently it has earned the ire of official China (China Inc, as it's sometimes described) in two ways.

It has pulled out of a huge deal in which the wholly Chinese government owned Chinalco was going to buy nearly $20 billion of Rio. And it is involved in tense negotiations over iron ore prices.

And now Rio's number two man in China, a Chinese Australian, and three of his Chinese employees, are in custody, ludicrously on suspicion of espionage and stealing Chinese state secrets.

Often when the Chinese state is under stress it reverts to Cold War rhetoric and indeed Cold War impulses.

But really, to arrest a senior Rio executive for espionage? In 2009?

This surely is 30 years out of date.
...

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25759154-5013460,00.html


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 02:49 
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Suraj wrote:
When we started this thread, it was *not* meant to be a general China news thread at all.

Its primary aim was to understand what happens inside Zhongnanhai, and the dynamics within the CPC and PLA, who's rising, who is being marginalized, etc. Their opaque nature means that it is difficult to tell whether there is a power struggle going on, until matters have already reached a crisis point.

In this regard, Hu Jintao's urgent return to China from the G8 summit in Italy seems odd. I wonder if there's a rift between the PLA and the CPC, or between a faction backing Hu and some other ? Note that Hu is not the PM (Wen Jiabao is), but the President, General Secretary of the CPC, and Chairman of the Central Military Commission. He was originally the CPC chief of Xizang (Tibet) Autonomous Region.


I am talking to my Chinese(HK) friend who is an ex-banker.
He said the real power is with the Beijing Chinese and Chinese in the surrounding area around Beijing.
This Han group maintains the integrity of Chinese state and also owns the PLA,

The southern Chinese are said to be splittist and not reliable. Any sign of weak Chinese central control will break them to seperate.
Outer provinces such as Urmiqi and Tibet are really far outside the control of Central chinese govt. Only PLA has juristriction in those areas and maintains the logistics for mil and civilian trading operations.

The ruling elite has to win the confidence of the Beijing province and the PLA groups and be the head of the Central Military Commission.
Appointment of Hu as the president is a mystery but it looks like they had anticipated problems in the outer provinces and they had taken proactive actions.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 07:08 
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Your Hong Kong friend knows little about Chinese history, which was poorly taught under the British rule.

During the past 100 years all of the leaders of China, Sun, Kiang, Mao, Deng, Jiang and the current Hu are from Southern China, without even 1 single exception.

Beijing is the country's capital, but that's all. Through the Chinese history, not a single emperor family was originally from Beijing, also without 1 single exception.

At the first half of the 20th century, most of Chinese provinces were ruled by their local warlords especially in the southern part, but none of them showed even the least interest to found an independent country.

Acharya wrote:
I am talking to my Chinese(HK) friend who is an ex-banker.
He said the real power is with the Beijing Chinese and Chinese in the surrounding area around Beijing.
This Han group maintains the integrity of Chinese state and also owns the PLA,

The southern Chinese are said to be splittist and not reliable. Any sign of weak Chinese central control will break them to seperate.
Outer provinces such as Urmiqi and Tibet are really far outside the control of Central chinese govt. Only PLA has juristriction in those areas and maintains the logistics for mil and civilian trading operations.

The ruling elite has to win the confidence of the Beijing province and the PLA groups and be the head of the Central Military Commission.
Appointment of Hu as the president is a mystery but it looks like they had anticipated problems in the outer provinces and they had taken proactive actions.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 09:13 
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There has been a massive earthquake in Yunnan province, in Southwest China:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/0 ... index.html


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 09:35 
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I don't know if I will looked upon kindly
But just go to google news and search for Bharat Rakshak and a lot of chinese news websites show up in the search results.
The chinese are watching us :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 10:19 
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There's no need to call one another liars.
As an introduction to the north/south China dichotomy: wikipedia.

Mao is from Hunan.
Deng is from Sichuan.
CKS is from Ningbo.
Hu Jintao and Jiang Zemin are from Jiangsu province.

By birth, they are all indeed south Chinese. But the problem is that history isn't so clear. There has been a lot of north->south and east->west migration in recent centuries, and with the Qing (Manchu) dynasty ruling China till 1911, and subsequently the Japanese ruling Manchuria, a lot of Hans moved further south. Even the capital was moved south to Nanjing (which literally means south capital; Beijing means north capital).

If there is a Beijing clique, it helps to know who they are. Unreliable hearsay does not help us.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 10:47 
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No thank you. There will not be personal attacks on other posters. I am going to delete that part of your last post.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 11:07 
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From Pakistani Press
Quote:
Mosques closed in China's Urumqi
The normally bustling mosques of China's Urumqi city were ordered shut on the main Muslim day of prayer on Friday with police out in force to prevent new outbreaks of deadly ethnic unrest.

Uighur Muslims said they had been directed to pray at home, as armed forces saturated the streets of the northwest Xinjiang region's capital five days after clashes that authorities said left 156 people dead.

"The government said there would be no Friday prayers," said a Uighur man
...


http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=82563


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2009 13:49 
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“Government Order to Filter Search Results”, Effective starting 7 pm today [July 8, 2009] which includes these black listed phrases:


“Bloody Xinjiang” “Xinjiang Blood”, “Xinjiang race massacre”

“Xinjiang Han Chinese, miserable” “Xinjiang Han Chinese, miserable position”

“Han and Uighur cannot live under the same sky” “Han and Uighur dogs cannot live under the same sky” “Han and Xinjiang people cannot live under the same sky”

And much more.


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 03:19 
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The continuing saga of the arrest of Australian-Chinese executive of Rio Tinto
The article below has appeared in this morning's edition of The Australian. Note the heading ('Intimidation') and the talk of Chinese going out of their way to humiliate and rebuff Australian officials!
Given that the iron ore prices are very depressed currently and China is the most important market for Australian iron ore, I am afraid that the Aussie government will have to like it or lump it!
Quote:
Beijing's intimidation
THE Chinese government has sent a message of crude intimidation and deep displeasure against Australia with the arrest of Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu, an Australian citizen, in Shanghai.

All the facts are yet to come to light, but the context and sequence of events are undeniable. Rio Tinto deeply angered Chinalco, the Chinese government-owned corporation, by walking away from a $20 billion partial sale of its key assets. Rio was denounced in the Chinese press as a "dishonourable woman".
...
The fact that the Chinese went out of their way to humiliate and rebuff Australian officials, and more broadly the Australian government, shows their clear intent to send a message to Canberra.
...

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25762558-25377,00.html


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 05:31 
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The Chinese are doing the same thing with the Dollar as a global currency. Bringing up the topic at the wrong time. It would be really funny if they arrest an American to force American hand. :)


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 06:12 
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Job Ad in China: "No Uighurs, Han Chinese Only"

China's worthless system doesn't protect anyone from discrimination or victimization. It's all about rule of the strong. Everyone is at the mercy of the Han majority, and their Han Communist Party dictatorship.


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 17:04 
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http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNew ... 7D20090710

Erdogan calls it genocide and speaks strong words...interesting coming as it does from the most moderate muslim state. Though of course, he is not exactly a moderate himself..

Wonder what the average Abdul in the streets of TSP and elsewhere thinks...


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 17:08 
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r_subramanian wrote:
The continuing saga of the arrest of Australian-Chinese executive of Rio Tinto
The article below has appeared in this morning's edition of The Australian. Note the heading ('Intimidation') and the talk of Chinese going out of their way to humiliate and rebuff Australian officials!
Given that the iron ore prices are very depressed currently and China is the most important market for Australian iron ore, I am afraid that the Aussie government will have to like it or lump it!
Quote:
Beijing's intimidation
THE Chinese government has sent a message of crude intimidation and deep displeasure against Australia with the arrest of Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu, an Australian citizen, in Shanghai.

All the facts are yet to come to light, but the context and sequence of events are undeniable. Rio Tinto deeply angered Chinalco, the Chinese government-owned corporation, by walking away from a $20 billion partial sale of its key assets. Rio was denounced in the Chinese press as a "dishonourable woman".
...
The fact that the Chinese went out of their way to humiliate and rebuff Australian officials, and more broadly the Australian government, shows their clear intent to send a message to Canberra.
...

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25762558-25377,00.html


A lesson for Obama and Rudd..you dont go crawling on all fours when you deal with evil. Iran and Russia have just wiped their hands having slapped Obama hard., now Rudd is nursing his cheek.


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 18:26 
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>>Erdogan calls it genocide and speaks strong words...interesting coming as it does from the most moderate muslim state.

In keeping with form, you can soon expect an editorial in the chaithanic state next door moaning about the weakness of Islamic states and that only Turkey had the cojones to stand up to China, etc. Why are things at such a pass and so on...

Turkey of course got its knickers in a twist for one reason only, and that is that the Uighurs are Muslim and Turkic. If they were only Muslim, then they would have had for them the same sympathy they have shown to the Kurds - particularly those tied to and dragged behind army tanks in the south-east Anatolia. You will also note that similar sympathies have not been shown towards the Baloch, or for that matter, even the Kashmiris in any real sense... For the Turks, ethnicity is important - even for the Islamists among them like Erdogan. And of course they look at the Arabs, when they look at them at all, with undisguised contempt. And that will apply to the Arab reaction to the Uighur plight too...


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PostPosted: 11 Jul 2009 23:43 
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Beyond Guantanamo: China's Uyghur Muslim Minority

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZ7rt6vRSQ


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PostPosted: 12 Jul 2009 01:53 
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Australian Trade minister meets 16th ranked official of Shanghai municipal government!
The latest developments in the case of the Australian-Chinese executive of Rio Tinto who has been arrested in China. To appreciate the full impact of what is being said in the report below, you must remember that the Australian trade minister Simon Crean was once the leader of opposition and still an important member of Australian cabinet.
He manages to meet one Mr.Sha Hailin whose position in Shanghai municipal government is described is as follows:
"In the Shanghai Government you have the mayor of Shanghai, eight vice-mayors, one assistant mayor and then below that you have 11 deputy secretary-generals," said a Shanghai diplomat. "Mr Sha is number five in the hierarchy of deputy secretary-generals."
Those 16 officials are, in turn, outranked by the top 16 in the Shanghai Communist Party!

Quote:
Australia snubbed as Hu left to languish
THE Rudd Government yesterday was forced to deliver its "strong concern" about the detention of Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu to a junior official in the Shanghai Government, again illustrating Canberra's lack of diplomatic traction in China.
...
Mr Crean met Sha Hailin, deputy secretary-general of the Shanghai Government, yesterday after trying but failing to meet more senior officials.

"In the Shanghai Government you have the mayor of Shanghai, eight vice-mayors, one assistant mayor and then below that you have 11 deputy secretary-generals," said a Shanghai diplomat. "Mr Sha is number five in the hierarchy of deputy secretary-generals."

Those 16 officials are, in turn, outranked by the top 16 in the Shanghai Communist Party.
Mr Crean said the fact that access was gained at short notice "demonstrates the recognition on the part of the Chinese Government of the seriousness with which we take the issue"
...
http://www.theage.com.au/national/australia-snubbed-as-hu-left-to-languish-20090711-dgrc.html


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PostPosted: 12 Jul 2009 12:14 
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A primer for understanding turkish kinship with the Uighurs and other central asian turksBasmachi revolt



Quote:
On July 30, 1921, with the Turkish War of Independence in full swing, Enver decided to return to Anatolia. He went to Batum to be close to the new border. However, Mustafa Kemal didn't want him among the Turkish revolutionaries. Mustafa Kemal had stopped all friendly ties with Enver Pasha and the CUP as early as 1914, and he explicitly rejected the pan-Turkic ideas and what Mustafa Kemal perceived as Enver Pasha's utopian goals (see: Kemalism). Enver Pasha changed his plans and traveled to Moscow where he managed to win trust of the Soviet authorities. In November 1921 he was sent by Lenin to Bukhara in Russian Turkestan to help suppress an uprising against the local pro-Moscow Bolshevik regime. However, instead he made secret contacts with some of the rebellion's leaders and, along with a small number of followers, defected to the basmachi side. His aim was to unite the numerous basmachi groups under his own command and mount a co-ordinated offensive against the Bolsheviks in order to realize his pan-Turkish dreams. After a number of successful military operations he managed to establish himself as the rebels' supreme commander, and turned their disorganized forces into a small but well-drilled army. His command structure was built along German lines and his staff included a number of experienced Turkish officers. [12]

On August 4, 1922, however, as he allowed his troops to celebrate the Idi Qurbon holiday and kept a guard of 30 men at his headquarters near the village of Ab-i-Derya near Dushanbe, the Red Army Bashkir cavalry brigade under the command of Yakov Melkumov (Agop Melkumian) launched a surprise attack. According to some sources, Enver and some 25 of his men mounted their horses and charged the approaching troops, during which Enver was killed by machine-gun fire. [13] In his memoirs Enver Pasha's aide Yaver Suphi Bey stated that Enver Pasha died of a bullet wound right above his heart during a cavalry charge. [14] Alternatively, according to Melkumov's memoirs, Enver managed to escape on horseback and hid for four days in the village of Chaghan. His hideout was located after a Red Army officer infiltrated the village in disguise. Melkumov's troops then stormed Chaghan, and in the ensuing combat Enver was killed by Melkumov himself. [15][16] [17]

Enver's body was buried near Ab-i-Derya. In 1996, his remains were brought to Republic of Turkey and reburied in Istanbul.


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PostPosted: 12 Jul 2009 18:13 
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http://news.rediff.com/report/2009/jul/12/nervous-china-may-attack-india-in-2012-defence-expert.htm


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 00:06 
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First contact on Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu
Quote:
CHINA has rebuffed the Rudd Government and may force Australian officials to wait a further month for a second visit to detained Rio Tinto iron ore executive Stern Hu, The Australian reports.

As senior Australian ministers warned that China risked damaging its international trade relations over Mr Hu's arrest, reports emerged that Rio Tinto was seeking as much as $9 billion in compensation for breach of contracts from Chinese steel mills.

Foreign Minister Stephen Smith yesterday criticised Chinese efforts to communicate with the Rudd Government over the Hu case.

Quote:
It is now clear that the allegations against Mr Hu and his colleagues are directly related to prolonged and unresolved negotiations over benchmark prices for iron ore being sold by Australian miners to Chinese steel mills.

Chinese media reports said Rio - and possibly its one-time rival and new joint venture partner BHP Billiton - had been approaching Chinese steel mills in the past month, seeking compensation for broken contracts after the steel makers allegedly reneged on promises to buy certain volumes of iron ore.

"From the middle of June, Rio visited Chinese mills one by one, asking for compensation for contracts which were not fulfilled due to the financial crisis," the 21st Century Business Herald quoted an unnamed senior steel executive as saying.

"Rio calculated that they lost $5 billion in iron ore, and $4bn in shipments in the previous eight months due to the fact that Chinese mills postponed or even cancelled ships."


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 05:26 
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Sanjay M wrote:
Where are the AlQaeda threats?

Sarkozy makes one remark about burkhas, and AlQaeda is shrieking at him. But in China, hundreds of people are killed in rioting, and the jihadis are silent. Definitely one to rub in their faces, to remind them of their hypocrisy.


Americans, Canadians, Australians and Europeans have bombed Taliban folks....China didn't..may be thats the reason....I am slowly understanding that revenge comes first and then comes religion when talking about taliban-alkeeda.


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 08:44 
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Rediff

Why China may attack India by 2012

China will launch an attack on India before 2012.

There are multiple reasons for a desperate Beijing to teach India the final lesson, thereby ensuring Chinese supremacy in Asia in this century. The recession that shut the Chinese exports shop is creating an unprecedented internal social unrest. In turn, the vice-like grip of the Communists' over the society stands severely threatened.

Unemployment is on the increase. The unofficial estimate stands at whopping 14 percent. Worldwide recession has put 30 million people out of jobs. Economic slowdown is depleting the foreign exchange reserves. Foreign investors are slowly shifting out. To create domestic market, the massive dole of loans to individuals is turning out to be a nightmare. There appears to be a flight of capital in billions of dollars in the shape of diamond and gold bought in Hong Kong and shipped out in end 2008.

The fear of losing control over the Chinese masses is forcing the Communists to compulsorily install filtering software on new computers to crush dissent on the Internet, even though it is impossible to censor in entirety the flow of information as witnessed recently in Tibet, Xinjiang and Iran.

The growing internal unrest is making Beijing jittery.

The external picture appears to be equally dismal. The unfolding Barack Obama strategy seems to be scoring goals for democracy and freedom without firing a single shot. While Geoge Bush unwittingly united and arrayed against himself Islamic countries and radical Islam worldwide, Obama has put radical Islam in disarray by lowering the intra societal temperature vis- -vis America and the Muslim world. He deftly hints at democracy in his talk without directly threatening any group or country and the youth picks it up from there as in Iran. With more and more Chinese citizens beginning to demand political freedom, the future of the communists is also becoming uncertain. The technological means available in 21st century to spread democracy is definitely not conducive for the totalitarian regime in Beijing.

India's democracy is an eyesore for China

India's chaotic but successful democracy is an eyesore for the authoritarian regime in Beijing. Unlike India, China is handicapped as it lacks the soft power- an essential ingredient to spread influence. This further adds fuel to the fire.

In addition, the growing irrelevance of Pakistan, their right hand that operates against India on their behest, is increasing the Chinese nervousness. Obama's Af-Pak policy is primarily a policy that has intelligently set the thief to catch the thief. The stated withdrawal from Iraq by Americans now allows them to concentrate its military surplus on the single front to successfully execute the mission. This surplus, in combination with other democratic forces, can enable the Americans to look deep in to resource rich Central Asia, besides containing China's expansionist ambitions.

To offset this adverse scenario, while overtly pretending to side with the West, the Chinese covertly ordered their other proxy, North Korea, to test underground nuclear explosion and carry out trials of missiles that threaten Japan and South Korea.

The Chinese anxiety is understandable. Under Bush's declared policy of being 'a strategic competitor' alongside the 'axis of evil', they shared a large strategic maneuverability with others of similar hues. However, Obama policies wisely deny such a luxury by reclaiming more and more international strategic space ceded by the previous administration.

The Communists in China, therefore, need a military victory to unite the disillusioned citizenry behind them. This will assist to market a psychological perception that the 21st century belongs to China and to commemorate their deep belief in the superiority of the Chinese race. To divert attention from the brewing internal dissent is essential to retain the Communist Party's hold on power. In an autocratic system normally the only fodder to unite the citizenry is by raising their nationalistic feelings.

The easy method for Beijing to heighten the feeling of patriotism and thus national unity is to design a war with an adversary. They believe that this will help them to midwife the Chinese century too. That is the end game rooted in the firm belief of the Communists that Chinese race is far superior to Nazi Germany and is destined to 'Lord over the Earth'.

At present, there is no overall cost benefit ratio in integrating Taiwan by force with the mainland since under the new dispensation in Taipei, the island is 'behaving' itself. Also, the American presence around the region is too strong for comfort. There is also the factor of Japan to take into account. Though Beijing is increasing its naval presence in South China Sea to coerce into submission those opposing its claim on the Sprately Islands, at this point of time in history it will be unwise for the recession-hit China to move against the Western interests, including Japan.

Therefore, the most attractive option is to attack a soft target like India and forcibly occupy its territory in the Northeast.

Ideally, the Chinese believe that the east-wind should prevail over the west-wind. However, despite their imperial calculations of the past, they lag behind the West, particularly America by many decades.

Hence, they want the east-wind to at least prevail over the other east-wind, i.e., India, to ensure their dominance over Asia. Beijing's cleverly raising the hackles on its fabricated dispute in Arunachal Pradesh to an alarming level is the preparatory groundwork for imposing such a conflict on India. A sinking Pakistan will team up with China to teach India 'the final lesson'.

The Chinese leadership wants to rally its population behind the Communist rule. As it is, Beijing is already rattled, with its proxy Pakistan, now literally embroiled in a civil war, losing its sheen against India. Above all, it is worried over the growing alliance of India with the United States and the West, because the alliance has the potential to create a technologically superior counterpoise

All these three concerns of Chinese Communists are best addressed by waging a war against pacifist India to achieve multiple strategic objectives. But India, otherwise the biggest challenge to the supremacy of China in Asia, is least prepared on ground to face the Chinese threat.

How will India face and respond vigorously to repulse the Chinese game plan? Will Indian leadership be able to take the heat of war? Have they laid the groundwork adequately to defend India? Is Indian military equipped to face the two-front wars by Beijing and Islamabad? Is the Indian civil administration geared to meet the internal security challenges that the external actors will sponsor simultaneously through their doctrine of unrestricted warfare?

The answers are an unequivocal 'no'. Pacifist India is not ready by a long shot either on the internal or the external front.

It is said that long time back, a king with an excellent military machine at his disposal could not stomach the violence involved in winning wars. So he renounced war in victory. This led to the rise of the pacifist philosophies. The state either refused to defend itself or neglected the instruments that could defend it.

Any 'extreme' is dangerous, as it tends to create imbalance in statecraft. We saw that in the unjust unilateral aggression in Iraq. It diminished the American aura and recessed the economy. China's despotic regime is another extreme, scared to permit political dissent. This will fuel an explosion worse than the Tiananmen Square. Despite use of disproportionate force and demographic invasion of Tibet, Beijing's hold remains tenuous. Pakistan's over-aggressive agenda in the name of jihad haunts it now to the point of fragmentation of the state.

Similarly, India's pacifism is the other extreme. More 26/11-like attacks will occur on a regular basis as it infects policymaking. Such extreme postures on either side invariably generate wars. Armed with an aggressive Wahabi philosophy, Pakistan, in cohort with China, wants to destabilise a pacifist India. India's instruments of state steeped in pacifism are unable to rise to its defence.

In the past 60 years, instead of offering good governance, the deep-rooted pacifism contributed to the civil administration ceding control of 40 per cent of the Union's territory to the Maoists and ten percent to the insurgents, effecting a shrinking influence internally, as well in the 'near abroad'.

India must rapidly shift out from its defeatist posture of pacifism to deter China. New Delhi's stance should modify, not to aggression, but to a firm assertion in statecraft. The state must also exclusively retain the capability of intervention by use of force internally as well as externally. If it permits the non-state actors to develop this capability in competition, then the state will whither away. On the contrary, the state machinery should ensure a fast-paced development in the Red Corridor even it if has to hold Maoists' hostage at gunpoint. The state's firm and just intervention will dissolve the Maoist movement.

Keeping in view the imminent threat posed by China, the quickest way to swing out of pacifism to state of assertion is by injecting military thinking in the civil administration to build the sinews. That will enormously increase the deliverables on ground -- from Lalgarh to Tawang.


Columnist: Bharat Verma, Editor, Indian Defence Review.


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 15:25 
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Raging in Beijing

Extracts
Quote:
Rio Tinto is the latest of a series of mistakes that China has made recently. Why, and why now?

“Drawing that direct link” the Wall Street Journal says “between the fortunes of (Chinese) steel mills and the interests of the Chinese state has alarmed foreign officials and businesspeople.” It refers to the arrest—on espionage charges—of four employees of Rio Tinto, a British-Australian mining company, amid tense negotiations over the price of iron ore. Coming as it does a few weeks after Australian shareholders rebuffed an attempt by China’s state-owned aluminium company to acquire a bigger stake in Rio Tinto, the possibility exists that China’s move was in part motivated by a sense of retribution.


Quote:
But the more important question is: why has China shed the pretence now? It is unlikely that China’s leaders would want the “peaceful rise” theory to be shattered over relatively trivial matters as the price of iron ore. Or for that matter, over an ADB loan programme to India. China cannot aspire to topple the US dollar as the world’s reserve currency unless it has the support of countries such as India and Australia.

One explanation is that it’s gone into their head and the Chinese leadership is flexing its muscles ignoring Deng Xiaoping’s advice to “keep your head down” (of course, his aphorisms were a lot less prosaic).

The other is that the balance of power within the ruling Communist party has become unstable—the factional intrigues within the leadership have resulted in several embarrassing or self-defeating incidents in recent months: making the ADB a platform to push a bilateral dispute ended in China’s total isolation; a poorly-conceived, poorly executed internet monitoring policy that ultimately ended up sparking a trade dispute with the United States; Pyongyang’s belligerence has killed the six-party talks, and undermined China’s regional standing; ethnic rioting in Urumqi and Hu Jintao’s absence at the G-8 summit prompted renewed concern over China’s political stability; and, of course, haggling over the price of iron-ore has successfully alienated the most China-friendly Australian government in more than a decade.

So much bungling in such a short period of time—from a regime that is seen as a deliberate, strategic player—rules out mere incompetence. While an outright leadership struggle is be unlikely, it could well be that a fratricidal war of succession is raging in Beijing.


Lets hope PRC keeps up the good work. :)


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 16:36 
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I need to ask a question of economic/financial gurus.

I have read on 2-3 other threads the opinion that China will sk Unkil to do xyz with India as quid pro quo for bailing unkil out.

But..

How on earth can China bail unkil out?

I thought that China is not in a position to bail unkil out. The way i understood it is that China can screw unkil - but will screw itself in return. The maximum that China can do is not to mutilate itself by screwing unkil.

Let me explain that.

China has 1 Trillion US dollars. If China starts dumping those $$$ the value of the US $ will plummet and China's own assets will be eroded. So China cannot dump $$$.

If China hordes those $$ the Dollar value will be maintained but nobody is rescuing anybody, nor enabling any quid pro quo favors against India.

One thing China has done is to keep the value of its own currency - the Yuan high. If China devalues the Yuan, it could export a lot of stuff even more cheaply to the US keeping the US market happy, but the average Cheen mard would get a lot less bang for the buck with a devalued Yuan and an already straining mass of Cheenis will protest. So westChina is not about to devalue the Yuan.

What China is trying to do is to try and peg all currencies against a basket of foreign currencies rather than the US dollar - so that it can perhaps rescue itself from the death-like embrace it has got itself into with the US.

The west and certainly the US for too long have kept their currency values so high that any devaluation to what they are worth will kill the Chinese and the West.

So what is all this business of China striking deals with the West to "rescue" the US in exchange fro screwing India. I don't see that happening.

Any gyan will be appreciated.


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PostPosted: 13 Jul 2009 17:34 
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shiv wrote:
One thing China has done is to keep the value of its own currency - the Yuan high


Shiv saar - correction....china has kept its currency artificially low. making it attractive for exports. Some say it is under valued as much as 40%.

Currently, 1 dollar can buy 7 yuan worth of products. if yuan is floated and gains strength, 1 dollar may buy only 4 or 5 yuan worth of products. Cost of china-made products go up and that in turn can bring some relief for manufacturers world wide.

However, this is a simplistic analysis that discusses one variable.


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