Sri Lanka - News and Discussion

[Comer]

schinnas, our objective should be to get them back safely without loss of face for the other party. Vaiko just throws tantrums till he is red in the face. He should not make it difficult for GoSL to negotiate.

[schinnas]

Saravana, I hear you. But Vaiko is not a national leader or an elected representative holding an office. His words should hardly have any bearing on SL. It would be a different matter if TN assembly has passed a resolution or TN CM issued a hard hitting statement.

Don't agree with Vaiko's tactics but realize that our population is not mature and of emotional nature. Having a Tamil jingoistic religion agnostic politician like Vaiko indulging in sabre rattling actually helps let out some steam and stops the crowd from indulging in violent protests or rallying behind EJ (such as Seeman) / pissful leaders who are forever waiting for opportunity and political space. Vaiko for one does not indulge in violent protests like Ramdoss or Vattal Nagaraj. Folks like Vaiko do serve a purpose in our system.

[Shanmukh]

@Schinnas,
What do you want the Govt. of India to do? How can they compel the Govt. of Sri Lanka to treat the Tamizh populations properly? Exactly specific actions do you want the Govts. of India and Sri Lanka to take? Please be specific, and please don't say `Govt. of Sri Lanka must treat the Tamizh people with respect' - this is the most impossible demand.

[chetak]

@Schinnas,
What do you want the Govt. of India to do? How can they compel the Govt. of Sri Lanka to treat the Tamizh populations properly? Exactly specific actions do you want the Govts. of India and Sri Lanka to take? Please be specific, and please don't say `Govt. of Sri Lanka must treat the Tamizh people with respect' - this is the most impossible demand.

@Schinnas. Seems not to have any ideas beyond mere rhetoric and romantic, impractical ideas of jagatguru and India's "moral" obligations to the world at large and srilanka in particular.

realpolitik is the way to go. We need to dispassionately discover what buttons the lankans have and push those to influence them in any way, if at all.

[schinnas]

@Schinnas,
What do you want the Govt. of India to do? How can they compel the Govt. of Sri Lanka to treat the Tamizh populations properly? Exactly specific actions do you want the Govts. of India and Sri Lanka to take? Please be specific, and please don't say `Govt. of Sri Lanka must treat the Tamizh people with respect' - this is the most impossible demand.

Nageshks@
Our strategic objectives in SL are two fold.
1. Ensure that SL has domestic peace and constitutionally guaranteed equal rights for its ethnic / linguistic minorities. A federal constitution similar to India or US or UK is the only way. Currently SL Tamil areas have very little autonomy in local governance. A united, harmonious and economically prosperous Sri Lanka is our interest and also in SL's interest. It is also what India stands for as a responsible regional power and emerging JagatGuru.
2. SL remains closely within India's orbit and does not use Pakis or CN card against India and stays away from giving any rights to CN in their ports.

Let us look at what we have done with SL in the past when we had a bolder foreign policy:
* In the past when Sri Lanka acted against India's interests and was expected to give permission to US to have a naval port there, Indira Gandhi exploited the Tamil / Singhalese faultline to eliminate the possibility of US having a naval port in SL. The other side of the picture is that we tried to give them rights for Katchathivu unilaterally to get into their good books at the expense of public opinion in TN.

* When Sri Lanka had a maoist problem on their hands and a coup was a possibility, Indira and Kao (the head of RAW) played their cards very deftly and tackled the problem by sending Indian soldiers to Colombu to put down a potential Maoist revolt / coup. SL govt for a while was very grateful. This operation is one of the key successes of India in SL but not widely discussed in our media.

* India used the situation of human rights violations (and resulting refugee problem for India) in SL to arm twist SL government into making the appropriate constitutional amendments which has since been rescinded by SL government.

* Misadventure: India sent IPKF (boots on the ground) and got royally screwed over by both LTTE and SL government, where SL government armed LTTE to fight against IPKF. It is one thing to send our armed forces for a one time operation (such as put down potential Maoist coup plans) and another to station ground troops / occupational force.

* After LTTE assasinated Rajiv Gandhi, India actively worked with Sri Lanka to eliminate LTTE. Sri Lanka could never have eliminated LTTE without for Indian help and Indian navy's blocade of LTTE supply lines. Unfortunately Sonia government failed to ensure that the war against LTTE does not degrade into ethnic elimination of Tamils. We failed to get commitment from SL of how they will move to a federal set up in return for our help in eliminating LTTE.

The one and only card Sri Lanka has against any Indian influence is to use Chinese bogey. Any one with even an iota of common sense in SL will acknowledge that geography and culture cannot be erased and it would be long term suicidal for SL to make an enemy of India. No need for us to do a dhoti-shiver.

India can follow a bold carrot and stick policy.

Carrots:
1. Work with Japanese and US to put together an aggressive economic and infrastructure development plan for SL including established ferry routes (short term) for people and goods, road and rail links from TN. The scope of this plan should be order of magnitude than what Chinese have invested and should have the potential to transform SL into a local trade hub. SL's part of the bargain would be to give constitutionally equal rights to ethnic minorities similar to what rest of civilized world does and to say NO to Chinese naval presence in SL.
2. Massive people to people contacts (indirectly bribe journalists, opinion makers, businessmen and politicians and academics like how US does) between both Tamils and Singhalese buddists to buy public opinion to support the above plan. Bribes can be in many ways - giving fellowships to academics, giving highly paid consultancy roles to various parties, advertising in media, giving seats in IIT, IIMS, AIIMS and Stephens college / Lyola college and the like to offsprings of influential people in SL. Half the problem is own if we win the PR and make SL thought leaders realize that giving equal rights to their own citizens and bringing the ethnic divide to closure is in their own interests! It should be common sense for everyone but some dimwit SL politicians fail to see it. Giving citizenship to part of SL refugees in TN and bribing some TN politicians will go a long way in removing misguided opposition in TN to any of our plans to have positive engagement with SL. But TN public should be convinced that there are tangible proof that our engagement with SL is making life of SL Tamils better. As part of it we should commission studies by McKinsey, etc., telling both SL Tamils and Singhalese what great rosy future they could have if India's plans can be made into a reality.
3. Get TCS, Infosys to invest heavily in SL giving highly paid employment to both Tamils and Singhalese.
4. Increase trade links substantially. Develop trade and taxation treaties so that FDI can flow through SL instead of Mauritius or Singapore.

Sticks:
1. All the soft assets and soft skills we develop in the carrots policy can be used to selectively punish any politicians with PR war.
2. Develop a brief on any SL politician who is particularly against India and close to China and destroy their career. We can quickly develop the human assets to do this and China cannot match it for next several decades.
3. India (with support from US who is also wary of China's growing influence in Indian ocean)can raise the issue of war crimes and get sanctions enforced on SL. In the past India had lobbied on behalf of SL and worked with US to protect it from UN sanctions. We can do it other way.
4. India can do to SL what China is doing to small countries in South China sea. Dispute current status quo of Katchathivu and expand our no fly zone and economic zone into SL's zones citing some historic facts. All we would need to do is follow the China's playbook. Have our navy harass SL fishermen and make it highly prohibitive for them to do any coastal
5. It will be a dangerous game but India can nurture maoists / remnants of LTTE to bring SL to see sense if none of the carrots or above sticks fail. Any dent to tourism can significantly impact SL economy. We have done it in the past and even if we dont want to do it, we should make it clear to SL that if we are forced to do it, we will.
6. Last option - India can also do limited economic blocade of SL - though it is an extreme step and I am not the expert on international laws to know if it is even possible.

The current timid, clueless policy where we try meekly to so some backroom diplomacy and gift few boats without accomplishing any of our strategic objectives cannot continue for long. It is not solving the root problem of inequal rights for Tamils in SL and will continue to make parts of TN susceptible to influence by EJ and Jihadi elements who will love to use public resentment against GoI policies. It is not in our interest. We need to put _all_ options on the table and go with a bold approach and think big.

[schinnas]

@Schinnas. Seems not to have any ideas beyond mere rhetoric and romantic, impractical ideas of jagatguru and India's "moral" obligations to the world at large and srilanka in particular.
l.

Nageshks asked me a question and it is for me to respond which I did. You can focus on making rational and intelligent arguments for a change instead of being a troll on this thread.

[Comer]

schinnas, very good post on the situation and the suggestions. I think current Govt may focus more on maintaining a stable and prosperous neighbourhood than any other policy. Hopefully we get to see some implementations in the later part of this Govt's tenure.

[chetak]

@Schinnas. Seems not to have any ideas beyond mere rhetoric and romantic, impractical ideas of jagatguru and India's "moral" obligations to the world at large and srilanka in particular.
l.

Nageshks asked me a question and it is for me to respond which I did. You can focus on making rational and intelligent arguments for a change instead of being a troll on this thread.

@Schinnas.ji,

Leave the trolling part alone as it is a double edged and also a very sharp edged sword. It may easily cut your way first.

Apart from bribing and cheating the lankans do you have any practical ideas?? not the claptrap that you have put forth above

I vote again for leaving the lankans alone, what with their being a sovereign and democratic nation with the malum to solve their own problems without you throwing ferries and rail links at them and FDI thru wily lanka. Why do you want all this?? Are we going to annex them soon??

Billions upon billions of $ of investment for a few hundred thousands of non Indian tamils comfort?? Why ?? What if they f@ck up relations with the sinhalese in the future on some other count, will you go in again with your bull in the china shop methods. Why did they support the ltte in the first place?? They could have well revolted then to save themselves and maintain good relations with the sinhalese.

It would be far cheaper to give them all Indian citizenship and be done with it.

As it is there are enough of lankan citizens, tamils amd sinhalese, in India who came in during the troubles and settled illegally like the bangladeshis, in various cities in India and have never left to date.

[Shanmukh]

Schinnas-ji,
This is a good beginning, but there are still a few vague bits, for me at least. So let me summarise the vague parts.

1. Ensure that SL has domestic peace and constitutionally guaranteed equal rights for its ethnic / linguistic minorities.

Exactly in what way(s) are the SL Tamizh discriminated against? What specific changes should be done to the SL constitution, as it currently exists. I seriously doubt that the SL will agree to a request from India to throw their Constitution and re-write it from scratch.

A federal constitution similar to India or US or UK is the only way. Currently SL Tamil areas have very little autonomy in local governance.

I strongly doubt the SL will ever agree to this. All small countries are paranoid about their local nationalism. Local autonomy of what degree? In Jaffna, I would imagine that a Tamizh person is governor/CM (whatever their equivalent administrator is).

SL remains closely within India's orbit and does not use Pakis or CN card against India and stays away from giving any rights to CN in their ports.

True, but how is this connected with the first part you suggested. Why is it necessary that a harmonious SL will not play off China against India for cynical purposes, than a divided, reft SL? Even if SL gets perfect internal peace and the Tamizh of SL get equal rights, why will SL not play India and China off against each other, for their own advantage? This is their main card - why will they ever give it up? Also, will the SL Tamizh have any particular affection for India, say 20 years after they achieve equality? What would their Indian connection be?

I agree with the carrots and sticks bit, except the economic blockade - I don't think it can ever be done, unless SL begins sending terrorists into India or something like that. But I also see a problem with your sticks, particularly in coordinating with the US. Just as SL is cynically using China against India, we can use the threat of war crime investigations against the SL. But going with the US is a serious problem - the US has not given up its goal of converting off all heathens into Christians, and is playing for itself, not for India or Japan. Their interests are determinedly antagonistic to both Tamizh, and Lankans, and they merely want to fish in troubled waters for their own interests. How do we prevent the US from upstaging both India and China, because in any move in the UN, we will end up playing footsie to the US and they are guided by EJ and Pentagon interests?

The only bonus of your suggestions that I can see is that we would end up binding TN more closely to Delhi, by taking out some of the takleef about SL atrocities on Tamizh. How concerned are the Tamizh about the SL Tamizh, anyway? Sure, I have seen some Tamizh concerns sentiment in the magazines, mainly in the comment sections (Yes, I can read Tamizh), but in all my campaigning for the BJP in TN (Chennai, and north TN, mainly), I have never found any substantial interest in what is happening in SL - not in recent times, at least. I would be glad to be contradicted if there is some serious interest in SL Tamizh anywhere in TN. Vaiko screams hoarse about the SL Tamizh and gets 3% votes for his troubles. Nevertheless, I take your point about binding TN closer to Delhi. All this anti-Delhi politics is dangerous, could get worse in the long run.

[schinnas]

Schinnas-ji,
This is a good beginning, but there are still a few vague bits, for me at least. So let me summarise the vague parts.

1. Ensure that SL has domestic peace and constitutionally guaranteed equal rights for its ethnic / linguistic minorities.

Exactly in what way(s) are the SL Tamizh discriminated against? What specific changes should be done to the SL constitution, as it currently exists. I seriously doubt that the SL will agree to a request from India to throw their Constitution and re-write it from scratch.

nageshks-ji,
Please dont "ji" me. To be specific, SL needs to just honor the commitment they made earlier to Rajiv Gandhi in the India - Srilanka accord as of 1987. Per wiki, "the Sri Lankan Government made a number of concessions to Tamil demands, which included[1][2] Colombo devolution of power to the provinces, merger (subject to later referendum) of the northern and eastern provinces, and official status for the Tamil language."

Recently, the SL government has been going back on these by splitting the northern and eastern provinces, even more power centralization (so that the local governments are truly toothless and exist only in namesake), forcible creation of Singhalese settlements in majority Tamil areas from lands taken from Tamils, etc.

A federal constitution similar to India or US or UK is the only way. Currently SL Tamil areas have very little autonomy in local governance.

I strongly doubt the SL will ever agree to this. All small countries are paranoid about their local nationalism. Local autonomy of what degree? In Jaffna, I would imagine that a Tamizh person is governor/CM (whatever their equivalent administrator is).

As mentioned, the Northern province CM is there as a namesake. Has little power than a small town mayor in India. Decentralization / federalism that SL agreed to in their 1987 accord needs to be enforced if not true Indian style constitution.

Sir, imho (must stress the humble part here), the asks are very simple and basic. No civilized state can find fault with the asks I have mentioned (I have distilled the minimum asks needed to ensure a life with equal opportunity and self respect for SL Tamils). Even a country such as Singapore that has only 7% Tamils recognizes Tamil as a state language and ensures enough translation services in Tamil. Sri Lanka with a much larger Tamil population does not recognize Tamil as a state language. This argument is akin to saying South Africa (during its aparthied times) will not agree to letting go of their aparthied policies. Sri lanka came around to doing it during Indira and Rajeev's time. Since then our foreign policy lost its balls and we made a series of myopic blunders complicating the issue.

SL remains closely within India's orbit and does not use Pakis or CN card against India and stays away from giving any rights to CN in their ports.

True, but how is this connected with the first part you suggested. Why is it necessary that a harmonious SL will not play off China against India for cynical purposes, than a divided, reft SL? Even if SL gets perfect internal peace and the Tamizh of SL get equal rights, why will SL not play India and China off against each other, for their own advantage? This is their main card - why will they ever give it up? Also, will the SL Tamizh have any particular affection for India, say 20 years after they achieve equality? What would their Indian connection be?

A Sri Lanka that is harmonious will naturally have a huge amount of trade and tourism (including educational links and medical tourism) with TN and will naturally come into our orbit. The amount of trade and people to people connection between TN and SL can reach as much as the connection between two Indian states. It will become increasingly difficult (and be just silly) for SL to play off China card at that point. We ofcourse would need to nurture it with bold economic co-operation and trade pacts that I mentioned in the list of carrots.

I agree with the carrots and sticks bit, except the economic blockade - I don't think it can ever be done, unless SL begins sending terrorists into India or something like that. But I also see a problem with your sticks, particularly in coordinating with the US. Just as SL is cynically using China against India, we can use the threat of war crime investigations against the SL. But going with the US is a serious problem - the US has not given up its goal of converting off all heathens into Christians, and is playing for itself, not for India or Japan. Their interests are determinedly antagonistic to both Tamizh, and Lankans, and they merely want to fish in troubled waters for their own interests. How do we prevent the US from upstaging both India and China, because in any move in the UN, we will end up playing footsie to the US and they are guided by EJ and Pentagon interests?

US state does not have many options now. With their pivot to Asia and with a belligerant Russia and whole of middle east in a boil, US has nobody other than India to partner with it to avoid Chinese hegemonic designs. It is true that EJ's influence US policy through their lobbying efforts, but Americans are amongst the most practical of all people. As US - India trade further increases, the pro-India lobby will become stronger and reduce the impact of the EJ lobby. Already in the past several years, Pentagon has become pro-India. SD with its cold war hangover will also soon change its course. I don't see any other option for US. Besides EJ problem is all over India and we will need to deal with it independent of SL threatre.

The only bonus of your suggestions that I can see is that we would end up binding TN more closely to Delhi, by taking out some of the takleef about SL atrocities on Tamizh. How concerned are the Tamizh about the SL Tamizh, anyway? Sure, I have seen some Tamizh concerns sentiment in the magazines, mainly in the comment sections (Yes, I can read Tamizh), but in all my campaigning for the BJP in TN (Chennai, and north TN, mainly), I have never found any substantial interest in what is happening in SL - not in recent times, at least. I would be glad to be contradicted if there is some serious interest in SL Tamizh anywhere in TN. Vaiko screams hoarse about the SL Tamizh and gets 3% votes for his troubles. Nevertheless, I take your point about binding TN closer to Delhi. All this anti-Delhi politics is dangerous, could get worse in the long run.

[/quote]

What you are saying regarding only a smaller percentage of TN population caring deeply about SL Tamil is true, but I derive a different conclusion. In most stable nations, the aam admi cares primarily about roti, Kapda, makkan, and increasingly infrastructure and availability of electricity. However, as long as they harbor an undercurrent of resentment against the state or a religion it can be exploited to a very large extent by any of the usual suspects. It is always a small minority of population that cares materially about identity issues and larger social issues. My personal observation is that amongst the non Chennai TN population, and specially amongst those that care about anything other than basic quality of life needs, the resentment and disappointment regarding the SL Tamil issue is high. To draw a parallel, if we had observed such subtle undercurrents in time and acted accordingly, ISI's efforts to create trouble in Punjab in 80s could have been nipped in the bud. TN is not at that level and hopefully will never go that path.

That said, the primary reason for India's foreign policy towards SL should be based on some guiding principles so there is a vision and consistency to it. The impact to TN is important but should not be the only aspect that drives our SL relationship. SL is under a fascist mindset. A more civilized harmonious SL is in our good interests because it increases trade and economic co-operation between south India and SL. Secondly more closer people to people ties and trade will keep SL, which is strategically important given its location in Indian ocean in India's orbit.

[Comer]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 008757.cms

Despite India's strong reservations about a Chinese nuclear submarine at the Colombo port in September, the government has learned that Sri Lanka has permitted another Chinese attack submarine to dock at a Lankan port.

According to the information received, the second docking is likely to take place very soon

[Aditya_V]

I thin Rajapakse is in trouble with the High Interest rates the Chinese have been charging for the loans in recent years and has been trying to get India to bail himout, I think we should put pressure through Sri Lankan with Business Interests in India and start punishing Shipping companies which operate through Colombo port, and other economic tools in our hand to make him act in Sri Lankan interests. I feel his present policies are going to run SL into the ground.

[schinnas]

I thin Rajapakse is in trouble with the High Interest rates the Chinese have been charging for the loans in recent years and has been trying to get India to bail himout, I think we should put pressure through Sri Lankan with Business Interests in India and start punishing Shipping companies which operate through Colombo port, and other economic tools in our hand to make him act in Sri Lankan interests. I feel his present policies are going to run SL into the ground.

Chinese are notorious for influencing politicians using bribes and honeypots while they are on a visit to China or a neutral territory. No telling which SL politicians are in their bankrolls. In our immediate neighborhood we should have developed really great HUMINT and have a file on every tier I and tier II politicians. Rajapakse, while he got credit for eliminating LTTE, he is acting as a fascist instead of making SL a progressive civilized state. SL needs a peace time President who can heal wounds and develop friendly relations with neighbors. Ranil might be lot better for SL (and India) now than Rajapakse.

[Philip]

The Chinese are highly unpopular in SL.A friend in recent times,who was very pro-PRC for decades,suprised me with an outburst against them.When I smirked and reminded my pal about his arlier love affair with China,he snorted and said ,"look what's happened to Norocholai!"

The power plant is in a mess.Cheap Chinese eqpt. is breaking down and the GOSL cannot run it.They've now asked the Chinese to run the plant for them.This is equally dangerous as it allows the PRC to have a large trained force of engineers,technicians,etc. permanently on lankan soil.Perhaps this is what they planned right from the beginning!

Meanwhile,the second sub visit to Cbo by a PLAN sub has raised the hackles of the GOI.The TN fishermen who now face death for alleged drug trafficking-which they plead innocence of,is another burning issue. I don't see relations improving as the current GOSL imagine that they are indispensable and that nothing can happen to them.If only they would look at what happened to another "invincible" Lankan president,one JR Jayawardene,who boasted after winning his second term,that" all that he could not do was turn a man into a woman".We know what happened after that! Whom the Gods wish to destroy,they first turn mad.

[chetak]

The Chinese are highly unpopular in SL.A friend in recent times,who was very pro-PRC for decades,suprised me with an outburst against them.When I smirked and reminded my pal about his arlier love affair with China,he snorted and said ,"look what's happened to Norocholai!"

The power plant is in a mess.Cheap Chinese eqpt. is breaking down and the GOSL cannot run it.They've now asked the Chinese to run the plant for them.This is equally dangerous as it allows the PRC to have a large trained force of engineers,technicians,etc. permanently on lankan soil.Perhaps this is what they planned right from the beginning!

Meanwhile,the second sub visit to Cbo by a PLAN sub has raised the hackles of the GOI.The TN fishermen who now face death for alleged drug trafficking-which they plead innocence of,is another burning issue. I don't see relations improving as the current GOSL imagine that they are indispensable and that nothing can happen to them.If only they would look at what happened to another "invincible" Lankan president,one JR Jayawardene,who boasted after winning his second term,that" all that he could not do was turn a man into a woman".We know what happened after that! Whom the Gods wish to destroy,they first turn mad.

Philip ji,

The lankans are playing hardball. They see in NaMo, perhaps a naive person interested in the well being of all. Doval will put an end to their overactive imagination.

The BJP is foolishly whispering about connecting the mainland to the island. This is also delights the EJs, because it's exactly what they want to further their cause of eelam. The sinhalese see it as their god given right, given their imagined superior culture and civilization ethos as opposed to the vanar sena populace on the mainland

The chinese can do a lot of things but can never, ever provide mainland connectivity which the lankans so desperately want. It's another bangladesh in the making for us. Another cashmere is also primed and waiting in the lakshadeep islands. We are futilely providing the same subsidies as in cashmere with almost identical results, not overtly stated in the press but very apparently made clear by the locals, to anyone who even makes a casual visit there.

[member_28714]

What will a Lankan Naval Blockade cost for India? And what will it cost the Lankans? We need to make sure that they understand this math. And soon. If Lanka wants to be China's Cuba, its their choice. We have to ensure that they drive vehicles made in 2010 till the end of the century.

Not to mention, our own Guantanamo Bay in Hambantota where we interview pissfuls.

[chetak]

What will a Lankan Naval Blockade cost for India? And what will it cost the Lankans? We need to make sure that they understand this math. And soon. If Lanka wants to be China's Cuba, its their choice. We have to ensure that they drive vehicles made in 2010 till the end of the century.

Not to mention, our own Guantanamo Bay in Hambantota where we interview pissfuls.

We already have blockaded the island earlier to contain the ltte menace but it will become a whole new ball game with the chinese involved. The chinese are making the not so subtle point that if India can bugger around in the south china seas then they too can jolly well bugger around in our backyard.

[SSridhar]

SL is punching way above its weight. Need to put it in its place.

[member_28714]

What will a Lankan Naval Blockade cost for India? And what will it cost the Lankans? We need to make sure that they understand this math. And soon. If Lanka wants to be China's Cuba, its their choice. We have to ensure that they drive vehicles made in 2010 till the end of the century.

Not to mention, our own Guantanamo Bay in Hambantota where we interview pissfuls.

We already have blockaded the island earlier to contain the ltte menace but it will become a whole new ball game with the chinese involved. The chinese are making the not so subtle point that if India can bugger around in the south china seas then they too can jolly well bugger around in our backyard.

Why whole new ball game? Is china going to send in her refurbed AC to defend the lankans? That will be fun. Cheen cannot do any naval force projection despite their hollering right now. But in 10 years things could be different. So why wait to convince the lankans?

Second, Vietnam is Vietnam and SL is SL. Biiiiig difference of about 6 million trained reserves to piss into cheeni skulls. China wont do squat if we blockade SL. A 6 months blockade is more than enough to bring rajapaksa to his knees as the economy would be in the gutter.

[Paul]

^^They have been doing this at least since 1971 when they allowed refueling facilities to Paki planes flying to E Pakistan. They know how to play India. India needs to consider its options in opening the Tamil card again.

[Philip]

SL allowing Paki planes to refuel in the island allowed us to monitor them easily.The war was over long before it made any worthwhile difference.

The situ today is that the
GOSL is playing with fire.As days pass on the popularity of the regime is decreasing and its bumchums keep getting smaller.The Chinese are doing everything to turn it into a vsssal state.The GOI has hard and soft options.The regime will do well to heed India's concerns.India is just minutes away and Chins is thousands of miles away,
.Rajapkse and family cannot change the island's geography no matter how many billions of Chinese aid they might receive.

[member_23692]

To all the Sri Lanka and Tamil experts here (and anyone who has an opinion, of course, did not mean to exclude anyone).

1. What are India's options in Sri Lanka now, considering Rajkapase's decision to have the Chinese Ship dock ?

2. What leverage does India have, specifically, against Sri Lanka ?

3. What is Doval likely to do ?

4. What should India do, in the immediate future, as a part of the long term strategy ?

Not knowing much about India-Sri Lanka relations, its history and the state of current relations and what leverage has, I would very much like to get enlightened.

Thanks.

[member_28722]

One option for us it to build the Dhanuskodi canal route and make it capable of handling 60000 ton ships and develop a port at its BoB head.

[chetak]

One option for us it to build the Dhanuskodi canal route and make it capable of handling 60000 ton ships and develop a port at its BoB head.

Any suitable Indian port in the vicinity, to take away business from colombo, as well as, very important for us, to also keep said Indian port away from the corrosive clutches of the kerala trade unions should hit the lankans really hard. This should also have an integrated ship building / repair yard for added value .

[Philip]

My inference is that the second sub visit was on the cards some time ago.One does not give a foreign sub permission to dock like a tatkal train tkt.! Indo-Lankan jt. army exercises are taking place right now. One has to see how the GOSL performs in the future.India has agreed to supply it with naval patrol vessels,etcc.We have to wait and watch.

The Pamban route instead of the Sethu canal-a disaster of a project,which needs to be dumped and buried for 10000yrs,is a far better option.It will allow the ships using Tuticorin,upto 30/35000t to navigate around the Indian peninsula.The Pamban bridge if "tweaked" will allow for faster operations and allow more ships to use the route than at present.The rail link to Dhanushkodi is already on the anvil.The infrastructure for the entire tip of India needs to be improved.With a new Min. from Kanyakumari,one hopes that he will speed up the required needs.Apart from KKMNPP,there is the huge ISRO test facility at Mahendragiri and thermal power plant at Tuticorin.The area is of vitla strat. importance given the Palk Straits. The coastal highway from Kerala to K-Kumari should be prioritised. There is regular pilgrim tourism,Suchindram and Tiruchendur temples are nearby. If the Tutti-Colombo ferry proposal gets off to a start,Indo-Lankan trade from the south will dramatically improve and Indo-Lankan eco ties further strengthened.

Who knows,one day we might even have a bridge across the Palk Straits......built by the Chinese!

[member_24684]

.
Phillip Sir you also Forget one think that's a Big Natural Harbor in Colachal . I heard somewhere The Navy planning to Build a Massive Harbor there to ensure more operational Credibility . where the Commercial port Moved into Vizinjam Kerala

[Comer]

Problem in implementing those promising solutions is the recalcitrant attitude displayed by Rajapakse on one end and politicians like VaiKo(and upstarts like Seeman). VaiKo doesn't have a constituency to lose, so it is convenient his maximalist positions. Thugs of Naam Thamizhar(of Seeman) group is trying to hustle visiting Srilankans out.
Right now it is better to have Kerala route to SriLanka.

[jagga]

Indian peacekeepers raped many Tamil women during LTTE war: Lankan minister

Sri Lankan minister today accused the Indian Peace Keeping Force of raping Tamil women during the LTTE war.

48-year-old Vinayagamurthi Muralitharan alias Karuna, who was a former LTTE leader and now a deputy minister in the Mahinda Rajpaksa government, told the parliament that the IPKF who conducted peacekeeping operations in Sri Lanka between 1987 and 1990, had raped several Tamil women while also killing Tamil's.

"There is evidence for that," Muralitharan, who was then the LTTE's feared eastern leader said.

The IPKF was invited into north and eastern Sri Lanka in terms of the Indo-Lanka Accord of 1987.

Karuna brokeaway from the LTTE in 2004 to form his own movement and later his own political party.

He was later allied with Rajapaksa's ruling coalition to become a deputy minister. He was also appointed a Vice President of the dominant party in the ruling coalition, Sri Lanka Freedom Party (SLFP).

Meanwhile, the opposition United National Party (UNP) said that Karuna, a terrorist leader has become a senior member of the SLFP.

Karuna warned the UNP saying he will not hesitate to reveal a lot of information which will cause the main opposition party much embarrassment if they continued to raise allegations against him.

In his speech in the parliament he praised the Sri Lankan Navy of preventing poaching in Lankan waters by Indian fishermen.

[member_24684]

.

Fukin Idiot ...

The same words are all over in the Tamil Nadu about Military Mans ..They Raping Tamils in Lanka and Raping Muslims in Kashmir

Karuna actually a Traitor ..he can do whatever to Blame India on it's IPKF mission.

we will not Going no more friendship with the idiot Lankans anymore

[chetak]

Posted without comment

Dated article, but gives one a handle on the sinhalese thinking...

Plz to follow links embedded in the article for more clarity

Seething Sri Lanka feels betrayed by India

Ankit Grover
MAR 22, 2013

Sri Lanka hasn’t taken lightly to what it sees as India’s “unwarranted betrayal” at the UNHRC. It has already retaliated by deciding to repossess part of a strategic oil storage depot from Indian Oil.

India had, on Thursday, voted for a US-sponsored resolution that Sri Lanka claimed was ‘unacceptable’, pessimistic and replete with misrepresentations.

The media in Sri Lanka too, felt party to India’s betrayal and lambasted the Indian Government for failing to stand by its southern neighbour.



Newspapers in Sri Lanka questioned India’s moral right to demand accountability from Sri Lanka when it itself had accountability issues in Kashmir. The media also lambasted the Indian Government’s on its ‘double standards’ with regard to its policy of non-interference.

The media also expressed outrage at India’s lack of support towards Sri Lanka, and opined that the Sri Lankan Government will have no qualms in welcoming China into the country.

“Delhi will eventually mend its relations with Colombo, for it must. The increasing Chinese influence in Sri Lanka may not be the ideal political backdrop for this tiny island, but it is the perfect antidote to keep India in her place, when the need arises,” Ceylon Today said.

The Island newspaper in its editorial Geneva: A Triumph for hypocrisy , said that India, by turning its back on Sri Lanka, “will realise its folly sooner or later; it is digging itself into a hole.”

It also pointed that India’s vote against Sri Lanka will be widely seen as a “diplomatic bêtise vis-à-vis India’s accountability issues in Kashmir.”

The Sri Lankan media has vehemently protested against attacks on its citizens and has warned of increasing hostilities between Colombo and Tamil Nadu, if the crisis wasn’t dealt with.

The Sri Lanka Guardian, in Does Tamil Nadu really care, slammed the UPA Government for falling prey to the political gimmick of Tamil parties that wish to reignite the ethnic conflict.

It called the imbroglio spurred by the DMK as “pre-resolution histrionics” aimed at garnering the Tamil vote, but also outlined the “grave concern” for New Delhi and Colombo over attacks on Sri Lankan citizens in Tamil Nadu.

The editorial in Daily News called the resolution against Sri Lanka the UN’s “grandest indictment” that only served the interests of a “few member States.”

It ridiculed the UN Human Rights Council for being nothing more than a “very big bad joke” which only pandered to the interest of powerful nations that fund the rights body.

[schinnas]

/\/\
If anyone who should be seething in rage at SL, it should be India. Firstly SL backstabbed India during IPKF time and armed LTTE. Secondly they went back on the Indo-Sri Lanka accord to give equal constitutional rights to SL Tamils. Only a total moron will try to do == between SL and Kashmir. In fact the solution for SL problem is to give constitutional rights like India has given to all of her states (not talking about special privileges).

During last days of war and afterwards, SL government behaved like ISIS. It was natural that they were going to get condemned by rest of the civilized world. India is part of the civilized world and has a stake in ensuring peace in SL. Only a moron in SL would expect India to condone their constitutional ethnic discrimination. If anything, India should have taken a stronger stance at that time.

Either SL comes out of its Singhala fascist mindset or is taught a lesson and asked to mend its ways. both would be beneficial to India. Letting current status quo continue where SL pokes its fingers into India and its corrupt politicians push their country into Cheen orbit is NOT acceptable to India from a strategic perspective. Anyone that naively thinks that they can persuade SL by gifting boats is smoking some good stuff! That is just a reckless waste of taxpayer money with nothing to show for.

[Shanmukh]

@schinnas,
I have no idea about the travails of the SL Tamizh and the various rights/wrongs committed by all involved parties. But I must concede you have one point at least. I spoke to a few of my old BJP friends in N TN, and many of them took an unexpectedly strident line on SL. This was rather new to me. I used to hear contemptuous remarks about LTTE and idiots who played into its hands, but this time, I heard a considerable amount of bitterness and angst against SL. Just to prevent TN from slipping into an anti-Delhi mindset, we should start listening to what the people on the ground say.

[chetak]

/\/\
If anyone who should be seething in rage at SL, it should be India. Firstly SL backstabbed India during IPKF time and armed LTTE. Secondly they went back on the Indo-Sri Lanka accord to give equal constitutional rights to SL Tamils. Only a total moron will try to do == between SL and Kashmir. In fact the solution for SL problem is to give constitutional rights like India has given to all of her states (not talking about special privileges).

During last days of war and afterwards, SL government behaved like ISIS. It was natural that they were going to get condemned by rest of the civilized world. India is part of the civilized world and has a stake in ensuring peace in SL. Only a moron in SL would expect India to condone their constitutional ethnic discrimination. If anything, India should have taken a stronger stance at that time.

Either SL comes out of its Singhala fascist mindset or is taught a lesson and asked to mend its ways. both would be beneficial to India. Letting current status quo continue where SL pokes its fingers into India and its corrupt politicians push their country into Cheen orbit is NOT acceptable to India from a strategic perspective. Anyone that naively thinks that they can persuade SL by gifting boats is smoking some good stuff! That is just a reckless waste of taxpayer money with nothing to show for.

Following your thought process, India should do in srilanka what Russia did in the ukraine. Unfortunately (and critically), the only things missing from the muscular equation are the big brown hairy b@lls.

[manju]

nageshavarei if u dont mind pliss to email me at
e m a i l r e d d y t o d a y at googlymaildotkam

u may be able to help me... dhanyavadegalu.. writing from ganigaLa naadu .. kannada naadu

[Shanmukh]

nageshavarei if u dont mind pliss to email me at
e m a i l r e d d y t o d a y at googlymaildotkam

u may be able to help me... dhanyavadegalu.. writing from ganigaLa naadu .. kannada naadu

Done.

[manju]

nageshavarei if u dont mind pliss to email me at
e m a i l r e d d y t o d a y at googlymaildotkam

u may be able to help me... dhanyavadegalu.. writing from ganigaLa naadu .. kannada naadu

Done.

no mail received yet. checked spam folder too... it is a ...@gmail.com

[Shanmukh]

no mail received yet. checked spam folder too... it is a ...@gmail.com

Sent again now.

[chetak]

Focus on Indians in Arab jails too

Focus on Indians in Arab jails too
By Kanchan Gupta |Posted 08-Nov-2014

Tamil Nadu has found a distraction from the rather raucously dramatic (and on occasion tragic) breast-beating over J Jayalalithaa being packed off to jail after being held guilty of corruption. Under the new law that has disqualified Lalu Prasad Yadav from contesting elections and holding public office for his role in the infamous fodder scam, Jayalalithaa too stands stripped of office and power. That, understandably, is cause for much grief among her fans.
But I digress. This is not about Jayalalithaa or her current misfortune. It is about why Tamil Nadu is in ferment all over again. Five Indian fishermen in Sri Lanka’s custody have been held guilty of smuggling heroin, and along with three Sri Lankan nationals, presumably their accomplices, given the death sentence. The judgment of Colombo High Court has led to renewed outpouring of anger among Tamil ‘nationalists’ in Tamil Nadu: They are at once outraged and inconsolable.
Five Indian fishermen in Sri Lanka’s custody have been held guilty of smuggling heroin and given the death sentence by the Colombo High Court. The Government of India has committed itself to trying to secure the repatriation of the convicted men. representation
Five Indian fishermen in Sri Lanka’s custody have been held guilty of smuggling heroin and given the death sentence by the Colombo High Court. The Government of India has committed itself to trying to secure the repatriation of the convicted men.
The facts which are known, and over which there’s no dispute, are simple. The five men had sailed forth from Rameswaram in November 2011, ostensibly to fish in the high sea. Their boat was intercepted by a Sri Lankan Navy patrol and the men were arrested. Subsequently they were charged with smuggling heroin. The families of the five men and Tamil ‘nationalists’ (who have been waging a relentless campaign against President Mahinda Rajapaksa ever since he decimated the global terrorist organisation called Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam) insist the men were framed.
Sri Lankan authorities insist that the charges are genuine; that the trial was fair; and, that the five Indians, along with three Sri Lankans, were given the death sentence in accordance with that country’s law to combat trafficking in narcotics. The Indian High Commission in Colombo, whose consular officials have been tracking the trial and providing assistance to the Indians, has not categorically stated that the trial was unfair or the charges baseless. The High Commission has said it will help the convicted Indians contest the verdict in the Supreme Court.
Since Tamil ‘nationalist’ sentiments transcend party affiliations in Tamil Nadu and politicians are prompt in pandering to those who rage against Sri Lanka, both the AIADMK and the DMK have demanded that India should immediately intervene and secure the release of the five convicted men; due process of law or sovereign rights of Sri Lanka be damned. It has even been posited that India should take a cue from Italy, which has been playing ducks and drakes with India’s justice system to save its marines who killed Indian fishermen off the Kerala coast.
The Government of India has committed itself to trying to secure the repatriation of the convicted men. A precedent has been found: The death sentence given to two Indians in a previous case was commuted to life sentence and they were repatriated to serve time in an Indian jail. In the event the Supreme Court upholds the High Court verdict, it is hoped the President will commute the death sentence. If the verdict is struck down, then the task becomes that much easier.
It would, however, be in the interest of India’s own attempts to combat trafficking in narcotics and trans-national organised crime to address two issues. First, the Government of India should make public its own assessment of the charges against the five convicted men and the trial in Colombo High Court. Have the charges been proved? Was the trial fair? Second, the Ministry of External Affairs, having committed itself to helping the convicted Indians in Sri Lanka, should now make a larger policy announcement: That it will, henceforth, extend all help to Indians arrested for violating the laws of other countries. As a first step, the Ministry must publish full details of Indians held in prisons in Arab countries, the charges against them, and the nature of help provided by the government in each case. In the event of any Indian being sentenced to death, the government must promise to exhibit similar alacrity in rushing to their defence.
Anything less than this would suggest that the Government of India continues to be led by its nose on the ‘Tamil issue’ and is not particularly perturbed by questioning the legitimacy of a sovereign nation’s laws. Those laws may be repugnant to our sensibilities but that does not invalidate them. Sadly, we see no difference between poaching in Sri Lankan waters and smuggling drugs (till 2009 our fishermen were also smuggling arms and ammunition) into that country. Yet, we wouldn’t be so callous and disdainful with, say, Saudi Arabia. What does that tell of us as a nation?
The writer is a senior journalist based in the National Capital Region. His Twitter handle is @KanchanGupta

[Comer]

^^ Most parts of the article is fair enough.
But the author can't resist taking a dig against TN for JJ arrest related theatrics thereby giving a little unnecessary disdainful colour to the article. Why bring in LTTE and Rajapakse if you don't want to prejudice the readers.
What the heck has this issue has to do with Saudi Arabia anyway? If the author has no time for worrying about everyone in the world, let folks decide what they should worry about.
---
On second reading, it is personally enlightening how subtly the message is pushed despite overall display of fairness and recounting of details
1. The first para is a digression, admitted by the author himself. Since he is writing and not speaking, he could have gone back and deleted the words but no. It is useful to frame it TN as a place where lot of agitation happens due to dumb reasons. What a kooky state!
2. Second para is about the reason for latest wacky antics. The last couple of lines paint that even though they are Indians, *only* the Tamil "nationalists" are whining.
3. Now presenting the sequence of events and facts. Subtly bring in LTTE as a way of prejudicing the reader. So not only the agitators Tamil "nationalists" they support LTTE as well, gasp! The observant reader will notice that only the families and the Tamil "nationlists" claim they are being framed.
4. Next the subtle mixing up of Tamil "nationlist" sentiments and Tamil sentiment. If people are upset in TN that some Tamils are being given death penalty it is Tamil "nationalism" not concern for fellow Tamil.
5. Now like NDTV like painting of the larger picture. If GoI helps these Indians, it must do so only if it does it for all indians. Otherwise it is pandering to "Tamil issues".
6. Bringing issues like poaching, smuggling into this case. How germane is this to the current case? This is damning the prisoners for someone else's acts.

This article is definitely a keeper.

[chetak]

Signals from Sri Lanka less than reassuring

Signals from Sri Lanka less than reassuring
Monday, 10 November 2014 | Balbir Punj | in Edit

Sri Lankan President Mahinda Rajapaksa has made many overtures to China by ignoring Indian bids for projects in the island country and awarding them to Chinese firms. He is playing China against India

The sentencing of five Indian fishermen in Sri Lanka to death for alleged drug-smuggling across the waters that separate the two countries, would have been seen as a purely judicial process in normal circumstances. Nothing has been so normal with reference to Sri Lanka in the last five years, especially after the Sri Lankan Army crushed the Tamil Tiger rebellion with a heavy hand, creating concern across the world on the violation of human rights of the minority Tamils in that country. This concern was the highlight of the UN Human Rights Council vote last year on the US-backed resolution on events in Sri Lanka in the context of the war against the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam and subsequent Army mayhem in the Tamil areas of the island country’s north-east. Sri Lanka’s President Mahinda Rajapaksa got his own Army chief Sarath Fonseka involved in a scandal and then jailed him effectively eliminating a rival to his power play.

Gen Fonseka was contemplating challenging the President at the general election subsequent to the crushing of the LTTE resistance. A number of journalists have been incarcerated or their newspapers banned for being critical of the ruling party, and especially of the President. The Buddhist extremists are blocking any move towards real autonomy for the Tamil areas that President Rajapaksa promised in his discussions with Indian Government leaders in the aftermath of end of the rebellion. Many observers have felt that the post-rebellion series of events including the general election there have steadily taken the country on the path of a power-addicted President. It is not without reason, therefore, that New Delhi has viewed the sentencing of the Indian fishermen with suspicion. Surely, the President wants to play to the gallery in his country.

Relevant in this context is the fact that the Sri Lankan Constitution envisages equal status to both Sinhala and Tamil-speaking people and says the Government should be carried out in a bilingual mode — that is, in both the languages.

The current wave of anti-Tamil politics in the island country has blocked the implementation of the Constitution amendments that President Rajapaksa promised, to give the Tamils real autonomy in the Jaffna-centered northern and eastern regions.

But it is also true that the LTTE, though its series of murder and mayhem, had destroyed the middle ground of Tamil politicians and alienated good parts of the middle ground of the Sinhala counterparts as well.

This has affected India-Sri Lanka relations, with New Delhi having to contend with the Dravida parties in Tamil Nadu who compete with extremist stands on issues of Sri Lanka that affect the Tamil populations there. Meanwhile Colombo dithers over creating a political climate where the two groups could work out a co-partnership after the decades of mutual killings and targeted violence.

New Delhi has sought to earn goodwill in Colombo all along, curbing the growing demand in Tamil Nadu for an extremist stand against the Sri Lankan Government. The last UPA Government abstained from a vote in the UN Human Rights Council on investigating human rights violations in the island country, despite the high-pitched demand from the two leading parties of Tamil Nadu to insist on an international investigation into the atrocities.

The Narendra Modi Government took one more step towards harmony by inviting President Rajapaksa to the swearing in of the new regime in New Delhi in May. That invitation deliberately ignored the demand of the Tamil parties here to keep Colombo out of the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation group invited to the function, to underline India’s opposition to what was happening in Sri Lanka. Unfortunately, despite Mr Modi’s gesture, Sri Lanka has been trying to deliberately provoke India by various dubious means.

The strategy of the Rajapaksa Government seems to be to play China against India in an apparent bid to keep New Delhi out of asserting pressure on Colombo to implement the full autonomy to the Tamils that the Sri Lankan ruling party has promised.

This is despite the fact that the UPA Government had not intervened when the Sri Lankan Army had in 2009 acted ruthlessly to eliminate the separatist violence in the Northern Province. The cry in Tamil Nadu to stay the hands of the Rajapaksa regime even as it was killing a large number of civilian Tamils in the Army action, was ignored by the UPA Government for the quite good reason of advancing India’s larger interests in the region.

In any case, the LTTE was hardly considerate towards Indian opinion, with its conspiracy to kill Rajiv Gandhi and target several other Indian politicians. The LTTE had little sympathy from India after the 1991 assassination of Rajiv Gandhi. Successive Governments in New Delhi since 1991 have invariably gone out of the way to be sensitive to the requirements of Colombo to end the menace of armed violence by the Tamil group, even though pro-Tamil parties such as the DMK had been part of both the first NDA and the two UPA Union Governments. For India, good relations with Sri Lanka are of critical importance as the Chinese are increasingly wandering into the southern Indian Ocean with their aggressive expansion of Beijing’s naval strength. Last February, China launched a two-month long naval presence with surface and submarine ships, under the pretext of friendly naval exercises, in the region.

Subsequently, China has obtained Sri Lankan permission for repeated naval visits to its ports for “refueling and refurnishing of its ships and relaxation of the crew”. In the context of China’s belligerent intentions in South China Sea and its growing presence in the Indian Ocean, these moves cannot be seen as normal naval sailings. Besides, China has been hinting at its interest in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands that are vital for India for the defence of the eastern coast. Geographically, Sri Lanka reduces the distance between these islands and the mainland coast China is also building up the Gwadar port in Pakistan and port facilities in Sri Lanka as well.

President Rajapaksa has made many overtures to China by ignoring Indian bids for projects in the island country and awarding them to Chinese firms. By all accounts, again, he is playing China against India. For India, the message of the story is that it must speed up its naval expansion and strengthen it further. That alone will keep the balance in its favour.