J&K News and Discussion-2011

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Prem
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Prem »

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/kashm ... 120423.htm
Kashmir will be resolved without Pak help: Yasin Malik
( This inbred terrorist still wasting the oxygon of Human planet)
Separatist leader Yasin Malik has said his Jammu and Kashmir [ Images ] Liberation Front will make efforts to get the Kashmir issue resolved "without the help of Pakistan". "We will step up our efforts to resolve the Kashmir issue if Pakistan, India [ Images ] and other international stakeholders continue with their irresponsible behaviour towards it," he told reporters after meeting Jamaat-e-Islami chief Munawar Hasan at the party's headquarters in Mansoora on Sunday. "We feel that the issue is being sidelined despite the fact that the guns have been dropped and people are resorting to peaceful protests to raise the issue... We will make efforts to get it resolved without the help of Pakistan," he contended.He claimed that India and some Western countries had set a condition that if the Kashmiri people disarmed themselves and started peaceful protests, they would seriously take up their demand.
Malik said status quo would not be acceptable to Kashmiris as it would not help resolve the issue peacefully. Kashmir was not brought into focus since the start of the ongoing dialogue between Pakistan and India, he claimed."Now the Kashmiris have the impression that the issue is on the back burner," he said.Pakistan and India should not hope for lasting peace in the region without a solution to the issue, he said. He warned that if both countries were unable to find a peaceful solution, the Kashmiris would be forced to begin their armed struggle again.He said successive Pakistani governments had been mentioning the Kashmir issue but the current government was not even talking of the matter.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by wig »

in srinagar the stone pelting was used to demolish a temple mentioned in the Rajtarangini of Kalhan and Chinar trees uprooted during the curfew. obviously the Govt would be hand in glove to let this happen
In the summer capital too, land grabbing has now emerged as a major menace. Reports indicate that thousands of Kanals of forest and revenue land has been grabbed, not only in the brazenly denuded areas of Shopian on Mughal Road but also in the heart and periphery of Srinagar. According to a complaint under investigation of J&K Police, a group of highly connected businessmen, politicians and lawyers, has spent huge amount of money among stone pelters of uptown to ensure turbulence and resultant curfew for a full month in July-August of 2010.

Under the cover of turmoil and curfew, this group succeeded in acquisition of over 10 Kanals of land, reportedly belonging to a minority religious trust, demolished a small temple which finds mention even in Rajtirangni and uprooted four massive and green Chinar trees during curfew days to clear the chunk of land for construction of a Rs 100 Crore commercial complex. Only Deputy Commissioner is competent to issue permission of felling a falling Chinar tree.

This entire drama, according to the complaint, occurred in the backyard of the office of SP East and Kothibagh Police Station and Directorate of Information. The umpire, in which some separatist leaders have also a stake, is coming up fast with full knowledge of the Government, including Ministers, top Police officers and bureaucrats.

Yet another classical example of the state's helplessness or collusion comes from Humhama area. One of the powerful Ministers has allegedly grabbed land measuring over 10 Kanals of notified land outside the entrance of the most sensitive Srinagar Airport and built a palatial house. Over 300 Kanals of state land have been grabbed at Sheikhpora village and more than 1,000 Kanals in the nearby Narkara Numbal. Rather than initiating any action towards recovery, Government officials have regularised the occupation fraudulently under so-called Roshni Act.
http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/
rohitvats
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by rohitvats »

Please read this excellent interview - shows you what Counter-Insurgency is all about - that is having pulse of the situation and getting the perceptions and feelings and opinions of the people right. An intelligent man like him at the helm of affairs can do more than the military might of US Army.

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.in/2012/05/b ... sahai.html
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Anindya »

Institutionalized bigotry...remember, this dude is recognized as the official Mufti...

Declare Ahmadis non-Muslims: Grand Mufti
Kashmir’s Grand Mufti on Wednesday stirred up a real hornet’s nest by asking for declaring Ahmadis or Ahmadiyyas as non-Muslims through a legislation in the state Assembly.

The cleric, Mufti Muhammad Bashiruddin, who is recognised by both the state government and the Centre as official 'Mufti Azam' or Grand Mufti of Jammu and Kashmir, while speaking at a meeting of religious leaders here organised by the Jammu and Kashmir Muslim Personal Board headed by him, said that all legislators should jointly table a bill in the state Assembly during its coming session and ensure it was passed with voice votes as well to declare Ahmadis as non-Muslims.

“That will address the grievance of all the people in the state of Jammu and Kashmir,” he asserted, adding that the move had become imperative in the face of the “believers of Mirzaiat and Qadiyaniat only having increased their activities.”
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by svinayak »

The Kashmir dispute was created by Pakistan, and Pakistan itself is the result of a failed attempt by Middle Eastern culture to conquer and colonize the totally different culture of South Asia.

In 1839, the British Empire sought to expand the borders of its colony of British India, by launching a war of conquest against the neighboring Pashtuns. The Pashtuns, as a fiercely independent tribal warrior people, resisted ferociously, so that the British conquest of them was not very successful. The British were only able to conquer part of the Pashtun territory, and even that remained in constant rebellion against them. Meanwhile, the remaining unconquered portion of Pashtun territory became the nucleus for the formation of Afghanistan. In 1893, the British imposed a ceasefire line on the Afghans called the Durand Line, which separated British-controlled territory from Afghan territory. The local people on the ground however never recognized this line, which merely existed on a map, and not on the ground.

In 1947, when the colony of British India achieved independence and was simultaneously partitioned into Pakistan and India, the Pakistanis wanted the conquered Pashtun territory to go to them, since the Pashtuns were Muslims. Given that the Pashtuns never recognized British authority over them to begin with, the Pakistanis had tenuous relations with the Pashtuns and were consumed by fears of Pashtun secession.

When Pakistan applied to join the UN in 1947, there was only one country which voted against it. No, it wasn't India - it was Pashtun-ruled Afghanistan which voted against Pakistan's admission, on the grounds that Pakistan was in illegal occupation of Pashtun lands stolen by the British. Their vote was cast on September 30, 1947 and is an historical fact.


In 1948, in the nearby state of Kashmir, its Hindu princely ruler and Muslim political leader joined hands in deciding to make Kashmir an independent country rather than joining either Pakistan or India. Pakistan's leadership were immediately terrified of this precedent, fearing that the Pashtuns would soon follow suit and also declare their own ethnically independent state. In order to pre-empt that and prevent it from happening, Pakistan's founder and leader Mohammad Ali Jinnah quickly decided to raise the cry of "Hindu treachery against the Muslims" and despatched hordes of armed Pashtun tribesmen to attack Kashmir. This was his way of distracting the Pashtuns from their own ethnic nationalism by diverting them into war against Kashmir "to save Islam". These are the same Pashtun tribesman whose descendants are today's Taliban. Fleeing the unprovoked invasion of their homeland, Kashmir's Hindu prince and Muslim political leader went to India, pledging to merge with it if India would help repel the invasion. India agreed, and sent its army to repulse the Pashtun invasion. Pakistan then sent its army to clash with Indian forces, and the result was Indo-Pakistani conflict, which has lasted for decades.


Pakistan's fear of Pashtun nationalism and separatism, which it worries can break up Pakistan, is thus the root of the Indo-Pakistani conflict over Kashmir and also the root of Pak conflict with Afghanistan, not any alleged Indian takeover of Kabul. This is all due to the legacy of 1839, which happened long before Pakistan was even created.


When a communist revolution happened in Kabul in the late 70s, Pakistan's fear of potential spillover effects on Pashtun nationalism caused Pakistan to embark on fomenting a guerrilla war against Kabul that led to Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Aligned with with the USA, Pakistan then proceeded to arm the Pashtuns while indoctrinating them with Islamic fanaticism. The USA was not allowed any ground role, and was told it could only supply arms and funds to Pakistan, which would take care of the rest. Pakistan then simultaneously embarked on destabilization of India by fomenting insurgency there.

After the Soviets withdrew, Pakistan again feared that the well-armed Pashtuns would turn on it and pursue secession. So Pakistan then created the Taliban as a new umbrella movement for the fractious factional guerrilla groups under an ultra-fundamentalist ideology. Bin Laden's AlQaeda then became cosy with Taliban, and the result was 9-11.

When the 9-11 attacks occurred, the cornered Pakistanis then did a 180 and promised to help the US defeat the Taliban and bring the terrorists to justice. Meanwhile they were racking their brains hoping to come up with a way to undermine the War on Terror from within. Now that they have succeeded in doing that, and in bleeding US/NATO forces, they hope to jump horses by kicking the US out and aligning with China.


Because of Pakistan's attempts to illegitimately hang onto Pashtun land, it has brought itself into conflicts with so many countries - first against its neighbors and then against more distant larger powers. This is the reason why Pakistan is an irredentist state and can never be an ally against Islamic extremism, because Pakistan depends on this very Islamism as a national glue to hold itself together, and keep nationalistic ethnic groups like the Pashtuns from breaking Pakistan apart.

At the same time, Pakistanis don't dare own upto the Pashtun national question at any level, nor its effect on their national policies, because any attempt to do so would open up the legitimacy of their claim to Pashtun land.


Sovereignty is a 2-way street, entailing not just rights but obligations. Pakistan only wishes to assert rights it feels are owed to it from sovereignty, but wishes to completely duck the issue of any sovereign obligations to apprehend terrorists on what it claims as its own territory. This is because the fundamental reality is that the Pashtun territory is not really theirs, is not really under their control, and the Pashtuns don't really recognize Pakistani central authority over them.

Pakistan uses Islamic fundamentalism to submerge traditional Pashtun ethnic identity in a desperate attempt to suppress Pashtun ethnic nationalism, and to stave off the disintegration of Pakistan. The Pashtuns are a numerically large enough ethnic group possessing the strength of arms to be able to secede from Pakistan at any moment, should they rally toward that cause.


The answer is to let the separatists have their way and achieve their independent ethnic states, breaking up Pakistan. It's better to allow Pakistan to naturally break up into 3 or 4 benign ethnic states, than for it to keep promoting Islamic fundamentalist extremism in a doomed attempt to hold itself together. Pakistan is a failing state, and it's better to let it fail and fall apart. This will help to end all conflict in the region and the trans-national terrorist problem. An independent ethnic Pashtun state will be dominated by Pashtun ethnic identity instead of fundamentalist Islam, and thus AlQaeda will no longer be able to find sanctuary there. Conventional ethnic identity is far more natural and benign than trans-nationalist Islamism with its inherent collectivist political bent. Supporting the re-emergence of 4 natural ethnic states - Pashtunistan, Balochistan, Sindh and Punjab - would be far better than continuing to support a dangerous and dysfunctional failed state like Pakistan which continues to spew toxic Islamist extremist ideology in a doomed attempt to hold itself together.


Following the failure of the Vietnam War, many Americans later recognized that war was really a war of ethnic reunification by the Vietnamese people. It wasn't a case of one foreign country attempting to conquer another foreign country - indeed, the north and south Vietnamese were not strangers or aliens to one another - they were 2 halves of a common whole. The question was whether they would reunify under communist socialism or under free democracy, but because a blinkered American leadership refused to recognize the Vietnamese grassroots affinity for one another and their desire to reunify, it pretty much ensured that Vietnamese reunification would take place under communist socialism.


Likewise, the Pashtun people live on both sides of an artificial Durand Line (Afghan-Pak "border") which they themselves have never accepted or recognized. It's a question of whether they will politically reunify under close-minded theocratic Islamism or under a more secular and tolerant society. Because today's blinkered American leadership is again blindly defending another artificial line on a map, and refusing to recognize the oneness of the people living on both sides of that artificial line, America is again shutting itself out of the reunification process, guaranteeing that Pashtun reunification will occur under fanatical fundamentalist Islamism as prescribed by Pakistan (much as Hanoi's Soviet backers prescribed reunification under communist socialism.) It's only later on, much after America's defeat, that some Americans will realize too late that they should have seen that the Pashtuns on both sides of the artificial line were actually one people. Pakistan knows it all too well, because they've been living with the guilt and fear of it ever since Pakistan's creation - but that's why they're hell-bent on herding the Pashtuns down the path of Islamist fanaticism, using Islamist glue to keep the Pashtuns as a whole hugged to Pakistan's bosom.


If only Washington policymakers could shed their blinkers and really understand what's going on, then they might have a chance to shape events more effectively, and to their favor. Pakistan is rapidly building up its nuclear arsenal, as it moves to surpass Britain to become the world's 5th-largest nuclear state.The Pakistanis are racing to build up as much hard-power as possible to back up the soft-power they feel Islamist hate-ideology gives them.

The world needs to compel the Pakistanis to let the Pashtuns go, and allow them to have their own independent national existence, along with the Baluchis and Sindhis. Humoring Pakistan and allowing it to continue using Islamist hatred to rally the people towards unity to counter slow disintegration is not the way to achieve stability in the region, or security for the world.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

^^^

Please post the link so it can be used for research purposes.

Thanks, ramana
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Rony »

I beleive its from the comments section (by "sanman") in the below Economist link

http://www.economist.com/blogs/dailycha ... tes?page=9
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by shyamd »

Lifting Afspa not feasible, military chiefs tell Antony
Shishir Gupta, Hindustan Times
New Delhi, May 08, 2012

The Chiefs of Staff Committee (COSC) has conveyed to defence minister AK Antony that partial lifting of the (Afspa) at Srinagar, Ganderbal, Budgam, Jammu and Kathua was not feasible as it would give terrorists an opportunity to target its communications and logistics line to Leh sector and the
forward areas on the Line of Contol (LoC) in Jammu and Kashmir.


During a meeting between the three armed forces chiefs, Antony and national security advisor SS Menon at South Block in April-end, the armed forces said lifting of Afspa would release the pressure on around 300-350 terrorists in Jammu and Kashmir. They said the move would be counter-productive in the present scenario, with 42 terrorists camp still active in PoK, and around 2,000-2,500 terrorists awaiting their chance to enter the country and build up strength across the LoC.

After hearing the chiefs out, Antony made it known that no decision on lifting Afspa would be made without taking the forces on board. However, home minister P Chidambaram and Kashmir chief minister Omar Abdullah are in favour of lifting Afspa from the five districts in the state, and have already executed a plan to remove 54 paramilitary bunkers from Srinagar as part of confidence-building measures.

The army has made it known that partial lifting of Afspa from Srinagar, Ganderbal, Budgam and Jammu would expose its Leh and LoC-bound convoys to terrorist attacks. Moreover, any counter-action taken would invite lawsuits in the absence of Afspa.

Further, the armed forces have told Antony that partial lifting would lead to public agitations in the state as people from other districts, including terrorist-infested Baramulla, Kupwara and Anantnag, would start protesting. To drive home their point, the armed forces cited the example of Imphal – where the law-and-order situation worsened after Afspa was lifted in August 2004.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Advait »

I have said this before and will say it again. The only solution to the Kashmir problem is to reduce the Muslims there to a minority. The Chinese did that with Ugyurs in Xinjiang.

If Marathis can be reduced to a minority in Mumbai then what's wrong if the same happens to KMs. And its not like anybody is stopping them from practicing their culture (whatever that is).
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by vishvak »

Advait wrote:I have said this before and will say it again. The only solution to the Kashmir problem is to reduce the Muslims there to a minority. The Chinese did that with Ugyurs in Xinjiang.

If Marathis can be reduced to a minority in Mumbai then what's wrong if the same happens to KMs. And its not like anybody is stopping them from practicing their culture (whatever that is).
Regarding settling of Indians in J&K, SSwamy had some idea of settling 1 crore people including defense personnel in J&K.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

Whoa! Can Kashmir handle a large influx? First of all whats the demographic breakdown of the state?

One can see that US support for Cahsmere is waning with need for TSP support in confronting FSU. Once FSU became Russia, the whole effort evaporated till the Pakis executed 9/11 with their OBL proxies.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Advait »

Ramanaji, you have a better solution?

If little Mumbai can support 20 million Indians and more(no limits to pop. growth there, cause that would be undemocratic!) then Kashmir valley can handle 20 million people, no? :-?

6 million KMs + 12 million Hindus and others = 1/3 % onlee of the faithful. :mrgreen:
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by shyamd »

You forget one thing those 20 million in mumbai are supported by the economy. If you create opportunities in Kashmir for people, migration will take place automatically.

So you have a few solutions:

1) develop the economy and the people will follow
2) create subsidies, cheap land for building houses , put all the migrants on the dole. Agree a timeline for the dole to be cut off at some point. Practically it will be extended by every party as they can win votes - costing the exchequer a lot of money.

Take your pick.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by jamwal »

Best option is forcible sterilization of these vermin.

Authorities decided to install some new fans in Jammu Civil Secretariat building and left the stock in various offices of the building to be installed after Dubar move. These inbreeding thieves stole every single fan and carried them to their homes in Kashmir in Durbar move traffic before electricians could get there. This is just a small example of what even well paid government employees from this community are doing with our money.
Even a grade 3 govt employee gets Rs 10000 every time offices move between the two capitals. But greed of these ROPers is insatiable.
Got the information from people who work there, don't ask me for links
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Roperia »

This year's first summer infiltration bid. All 5 piglets sent to their 72! :)
The army is expecting infiltration to go up. "Due to the void created by the successful anti-militancy operations in Jammu and Kashmir, infiltration from across the LoC is expected to gain momentum in the coming days," had warned General Officer Commanding of 15 Corps, Lieutenant General S A Hasnain on April 6 when five militants were killed in north Kashmir...
Army foils infiltration bid, five militants killed in Kashmir
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by vishvak »

40 flee PoK for Dubai, enter India via Nepal
For the first time, a large group of about 40 persons, including former militants and their families, have fled Pakistan-Occupied Kashmir together and surrendered before Indian authorities last month for amnesty under the J&K government’s rehabilitation policy.
The Indian Govt. is not always decisive for minorities in pak fleeing to India but militants are rehabilitated by state policy.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ShauryaT »

Acharya: Where is that post from?

OK, looks like from here http://www.economist.com/node/18712274/comments
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

By the way, FWIW, today, May 14th is the 10th anniversary of one of the most heinous terrorist attacks against India. The Kaluchak massacre, where LET terrorists entired an army residential compound, and massacred civilian relatives of army personnel. Have any army publications or units mentioned the incident.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

Pioneer Op-Ed:

Stop demonising the Army in Kashmir

The author protests the recent psy-ops by a journalist duo. The duo is foreign based masters of psy-ops. The premise of that book is India kidnapped and got the five tourists killed. If this were true the TSP would have gone to town and made a lot of hulla in those days itself. So its untrue and baseless lies.

Recall how Bill Clinton in his foreward to Albright's bio said that GOI had massacred the Sikh laborers in order to bring pressure on TSP. Same type of idiotic thinking.

On the other hand that might be what they would do if it were upto them and hence they mirror the GOI with that type of actions.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by vishvak »

Perhaps Indians have not made the most of Fai episode that went on for decades.

Such kind of nonsense could just continue to make Indians look guilty out of nothing. These psy-ops should be taken to task so that hit jobs doesn't pass off as normal.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by svinayak »

ramana wrote:
Recall how Bill Clinton in his foreward to Albright's bio said that GOI had massacred the Sikh laborers in order to bring pressure on TSP. Same type of idiotic thinking.

On the other hand that might be what they would do if it were upto them and hence they mirror the GOI with that type of actions.
The Pakistan lobby was very strong during Bill Clinton time and the lobby used to pay money so that President does not visit India. This is one of the reason why the POTUS never visited India for 22 years.
The lobby money made sure that the book talked about the massacre of the Sikh laborers by India.
That is how the system works in DC.
vishvak wrote:Perhaps Indians have not made the most of Fai episode that went on for decades.

Such kind of nonsense could just continue to make Indians look guilty out of nothing. These psy-ops should be taken to task so that hit jobs doesn't pass off as normal.
Lobby makes sure that Fai could operate without questions with ISI money inside US for a long time. Same thing with LeT able to raise money inside US for more than 10 years.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Aditya_V »

shyamd wrote:You forget one thing those 20 million in mumbai are supported by the economy. If you create opportunities in Kashmir for people, migration will take place automatically.

So you have a few solutions:

1) develop the economy and the people will follow
2) create subsidies, cheap land for building houses , put all the migrants on the dole. Agree a timeline for the dole to be cut off at some point. Practically it will be extended by every party as they can win votes - costing the exchequer a lot of money.

Take your pick.
ShyamD , Indian Govt has tried this for the last 60 years and many Kashmiris in Srinagar are happy taking the Doles, free power and joining the Stone Throwers. The amount Invested in Kashmir at the expense of the poor in India in other parts has failed. Better to first shut the tap on Saudi funds flowing to Hurriyat, the Hurriyat has large support within the INC and it seems some top INC leaders also get a cut in these Hawala channel of funding. In a way INC ensures that the Kashmir Valley people like NC can never again support an NDA govt. Any other country would have taken down the Hurriyat and many of its International network easily. There is a reason these guys are specifically allowed to meet Paki embassy staff and travel to Saudi, CHina etc.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by sum »

J-K: LeT militants decamp with service rifles of cops in Pulwama
Suspected Lashkar-e-Toiba militants disarmed two policemen guarding a minority village in Tral area of Pulwama district and decamped with four service rifles of the cops, official sources said today.

Five to six militants descended on the minority protection picket at Arigam in Tral area, 35 kms from here, at around 10.30 pm last night, the sources said.

They said the ultras overpowered the two cops present inside the picket and snatched three SLR rifles and one INSAS rifle along with eight magazines and one radio set from them before fleeing from the place.

The sources said four policemen were posted on duty at the picket but only two were present at the time of the incident.

An alert has been sounded across the south Kashmir range and an operation has been launched to trace the militants, the sources said, adding fresh deployment has been carried out at the Sikh village for the protection of the inhabitants.

This is second incident of weapon snatching in south Kashmir this month.

On May 4, militants had decamped with service rifles of four cops posted on guard duty at a village inhabited by Kashmiri Pandits in Shopian district
.
Something suspicious here!!
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Sachin »

^^^
1. I would not be surprised if this was a joint deal between the terrorists and the J&K police men manning the picquet. I dont think loss of weapons are treated as a minor case any where. Hope the agencies investigating also check the antecedants of the police men who were on duty.
2. If more security with more reliable personnel is not provided to the village of Pandits, there would be high chances that the village would be targetted by terrorists. Infact this attack may even stop any Pandit to go back to the place.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by RamaY »

It is a dangerous problem with scary outcomes...

Often times the corrupt security forces 'sell' their weapons and ammunition to their opponents. This could be such situation, while I hope I am wrong.

It shows that the weapons supply from across border is successfully contained.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Prem »

Green Snake Raises Hood again. Eating Indian salt but loyalty with the Viper Pit
The fractured Hurriyat
A.Gaddar Noorani
UNITED we stand, divided we fall’. The All Parties Hurriyat Conference (APHC) consistently flouted this admonition which is blazoned across the cover of its constitution in bold letters. The violent clashes that erupted recently at the headquarters of the Hurriyat in Srinagar between the supporters of Shabir Ahmed Shah, leader of the Democratic Freedom Party, and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq reflected the rift.This is the background to the crisis in the APHC (M). On May 6, a rally was held at Sopore at which Prof Abdul Ghani Bhat dropped a bombshell in the presence of the Mirwaiz and some other members of the APHC’s executive. “The UN resolutions constitute the legal basis of the Kashmir dispute.” After declaring the orthodox position, he said: “These resolutions cannot practically be implemented with reference to the language of the resolutions which, in my opinion, is complex. That means probably these resolutions may not be implemented at all. We have, therefore, to explore the possibilities of finding a solution to the problem through dialogue.” He urged that the four-point formula of former president Pervez Musharraf should be taken up “systematically”.
The APHC’s constitution proves that this was no heresy. Chapter II Clause (i) pays obeisance to the resolutions only to accept in clause (ii) “an alternative negotiated settlement of the Kashmir dispute amongst all the three parties to the dispute” — the two states plus “the people of the state.Recent statements by Kashmiri leaders give ground for hope that a common front on the basis of the four points is not unattainable. In that lies hope. For, that formula ensures the Kashmirs reunification de facto, self-rule to both parts, demilitarisation and a joint mechanism between east and west Kashmir. All Kashmiris, across the political divide, should demand that the leaders of India and Pakistan stop dragging their feet and move ahead to clinch an accord which was very much in sight in 2007
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by jamwal »

In 90s, Kashmiri muslim policemen and BSF/Army were often on different sides. It was common opinion that army had to deal with hostile or at best uncooperative police making counter-terror operations very difficult
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by AdityaM »

X-posting http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 1#p1287501
From Book review in HindustanTimes:
http://books.hindustantimes.com/2012/05 ... he-meadow/
Five others trekkers — two Americans, John Childs and Don Hutchings, a German, Dirk Hasert, two Brits, Keith Mangan and Paul Wells — had also been kidnapped on July 5, 1995. Childs had escaped three days later. The kidnappers demanded the release of 21 Pakistani and Kashmiri militants, including Masood Azhar, the son of an influential Deobandi cleric and an ace propagandist for Harkat ul-Ansar.
...
the authors reveal that the hostages were not killed by Al-Faran or Harkat, but by Nabi Azad or Alpha, a dreaded counter-insurgent who operated from the mountain villages of Anantnag and worked with the anti-militancy Special Task Force (STF) of Kashmir Police, intelligence agencies, and the Rashtriya Rifles of the Indian army.
...
The prolonged hostage crisis served a strategic purpose: to show the western powers that Pakistan, the ‘epicentre of terrorism’, was behind the insurgency in Kashmir. Both Tikoo and the tenacious detectives of his department realised that the government did not want to save the hostages
...
The detectives pursued the case till they got an eyewitness. “No one could risk the hostages being released and complaining of collusion, having seen uniforms and STF jeeps, possibly hearing things they understood. We led them into the trees, a good, hard walk behind the lower village. I remember that the snow was heavy and deep. And there they were shot,” the eyewitness said. The date of murder was December 24, 1995
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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Bhim seeks PM’s intervention to rescue the Kashmiri Pundit Migrants
by Scoop News May 26, 2012

Jammu, May 26 (Scoop News) – Prof. Bhim Singh, Chairman, National Panthers Party has urged Dr. Manmohan Singh, the Prime Minister for his urgent intervention to rescue thousands of Kashmiri Pundit Migrants from the cruel treatment being meted out them by the J&K Chief Minister in their so-called migrants camps at Jagti, Nagrota-Jammu.

The NPP Chief told the Prime Minister that the power supply is cut at 10 p.m. and the children, the women and the old have to stand roasted in the oven-like one-room migrants’ camps at Jagti. He said that the Chief Minister with his revengeful attitude has directed the authorities to not to supply power to the migrants in the night and all affairs of the migrants are being looked after by the Chief Minister himself.

Prof. Bhim Singh said that he visited the migrants’ camps at Jagti last week where he could only hear the suppressed voices of the voiceless Kashmiri Pundit Migrants. There is no electricity and no drinking water when temperature is above 40 degrees.

http://www.groundreport.com/Business/Bh ... ir/2946363
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Miscreants try to set Kashmir Catholic church on fire
M Saleem Pandit, TNN | May 26, 2012, 05.11PM IST

SRINAGAR: Two scooter-borne youth tried to set a century-old Catholic church on fire at Residency road here on Thursday evening. The main door of the church was partially burnt.

The incident has been captured by a Closed-Circuit Television (CCTV) installed in the church. The CCTV footage shows two scooter-borne youth carrying petrol in a bottle. After entering in to the premises of the church at about 8.15 PM on May 24, 2012, the duo sprinkled petrol on the main door of the church and set it on fire. The two youth, whose faces were uncovered, afterwards walked out of the church premises through the main gate, the footage shows.

The fire however extinguished on its own due to cold weather and rain. Father Mathew Thomas, priest of the church, discovered the incident on Friday and reported it to the Jammu & Kashmir police immediately.

The century old church, also known as holy family catholic church, is attended by over 60-70 people every Sunday.

Miscreants earlier set a motor bike, of one of the church employees, on fire on January 28, 2012 inside the church premises. The matter was reported to the Jammu and Kashmir police and an FIR lodged in the Kothi Bagh police station but no action was taken, father Thomas told the TOI.

"This time, the police have taken action and started an investigation. They even offered me security for the church but I declined," he said.
SP East, Tahir Sajjad Bhat said the police have registered a case under FIR No.41/2012 and started investigations. However, the CCTV footage does not show faces of the miscreants, he said.

Mufti Azam (chief Muslim cleric) of Kashmir Mufti Bashir-ud-Din headed a self-styled Sharia court in January, 2012 announcing a "fatwa" against Christian schools in Kashmir and ordered three Christian priests to leave the valley after a controversy arose over the conversion of some Muslim youth to Christianity last summer.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 526834.cms
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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SRINAGAR: Two scooter-borne youth tried to set a century-old Catholic church on fire at Residency road here on Thursday evening. The main door of the church was partially burnt.
Must be the evil minority community there...cant be done by the majority since "Kashmiriyat" doesn't allow it.. :roll:
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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Didn't knew Bhim Singh was that much of a politician. :lol: Power situation is really bad in whole state. Most of Jammu city except for a few pockets suffer 6+ hours power cuts daily and he wants uninterrupted power supply in a new housing colony built in arse end of nowhere.

I met a young Pandit living in that colony. According to him, the flats aren't luxurious but are much better than the cramped tin shacks they had been living in for 2 decades. Unfortunately or in just the usual manner, massive corruption did happen and undue favours were granted.
Even after all that these flats mean nothing. This guy's family had a multistory house, pretty big orchards and shops in prime locations. The house has been burnt down by peace loving muslim neighbours and shops occupied without rent or compensation. They don't see any money from the orchards either and some of more 'friendly' muslim neighbours were trying to buy the orchards at a very 'favourable' price . The grandfather refused to sell anything but his children are too scared to go back even for that property worth crores.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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^ gives good insight into various piskologies thrown around in India

1. Living conditions of Kashmiri pandits
2. The peace loving nature of kashmiri muslims
3. That economic progress alone (crores of properties) cannot buy security and cannot create peace.
4. The well proven concept of mafia-religious gangs occupying your lands/properties and then demanding "favorable" conditions...
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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When you tie the below information with other snippets of information - things begin to fall into place:
- the demonstrated links between state police in J&K and terrorists/separatists
- the taped voices of separatists asking for more killings (circa 2010)
- the constant flow of money from Pakistan into the hands of separatists

Most or all of the killings may well have been done by separatists funded by Pakistan.

Jammu and Kashmir police using CRPF as scapegoat, says study
The Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), India's biggest paramilitary force, seems to be caught between the devil and the deep sea in Kashmir.

The J&K Police emerges as the biggest villain in a 23-page study - "Role and Functioning of the CRPF" - as the paramilitary personnel believe that the state police use them as a shield and pass on the blame to them while committing human rights violation themselves.

"In several instances, while the firing was done by the local police, the blame was passed on to the CRPF. In some cases, when the CRPF wanted to lodge FIRs, they were not lodged while people's FIRs against the CRPF were quite easily lodged," the study, undertaken after the massive protests in the Valley in 2010, says.

The study conducted by the Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses (IDSA) - an autonomous research body funded by the defence ministry - has painted a gloomy picture of the force's morale. Personnel posted in Kashmir say the state government is exploiting them while the central government is indifferent to their concerns. The CRPF is the mainstay of law and order in the Valley.

The CRPF, whose 326 companies (each company has more than 35 personnel) are deployed in the Valley (figures of March 2011), was blamed for a majority of civilian deaths but the study suggests the force might just be a convenient target.
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Post deleted by moderator. Check your PM.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/
It is overdoing the things and thus counterproductive. If the team's approach was unbiased and laced with ultra-humanism, then it should not have advertently sidetracked recommending inquiry into the Theo-fascist upsurge in the valley in 1989-90 and its fallout especially on minority community, Indian secularist practice and much trumpeted Kashmiriyat. In the calculus of Team Interlocutors, genocide (or akin to genocide in the words of the NHRC), exodus, ethnic cleansing, general loot of property, internal displacement and highly doubtful return and rehabilitation of a defenceless religious minority of Kashmir did not merit even half a paragraph in a 170-page Report on Kashmir in which two full pages are devoted to the promotion of so-called cultural activities like mushairas, storytelling, dancing, singing, farce (bhand pather) etc. (p.60-62) to build bridges of harmony. Another vague and illogical recommendation (p. 109) is this: "Finally, this Group recommends that agreement on a political settlement should not be made contingent on whether Pakistan is willing to enter into it." It means to say that the Centre should go ahead with entering into an agreement of sorts with the APHC (M) even if "Pakistan in not willing to enter into it." This is naivety par excellence. Who does the team want to befool?
there is an editorial opinion by an author, namely, K N Pandita in the daily excelsior, published from Jammu appearing on 26, 27, 28 and 29 may 2012. those interested in going through the entire series of writeups can click on the link reproduced uppermost. it is a concise and comprehensive critique of the GOI interlocutor team. I have copied a para from the above to show the mindless, and utterly biased approach of the interlocutors. it is disgraceful that these persons were working at the expense of the public exchequer.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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Anonymous doesn't like the "unlawful occupation of Kashmir"
Greeting’s citizens of the World. We’d like to give you tonights entertainment.

It has come to the attention of the collective that the Indian Military has been
committing multiple human rights abuses in Kashmir. These stem from arresting protestors
to systematically raping villages, all in the attempt of crushing dissent and forcing
obedience.

The unlawful occupation of Kashmir has been something that has been swept under the rug
of international affairs. It appears that Human Rights is a term that has been tossed
around for only the convenience of political parties. It appears that Human Rights
don’t matter when it is a country that presents a financial interest to the United States
of America. This struggle has gone on for decades in the worst styles of abuse, but has gone largely
ignored.

So we come to today, while protestors in Kashmir have, yet again, taken to the streets, Anonymous
has taken to the internet in support of their struggle. The current protests regards the un-investigated
deaths of 358 infant deaths in Srinagar. Omar Abdullah has failed to address the problem
during his visits to the region. He has felt it justified to sweep these incidents under
the rug.

But Anonymous does not forget, and neither do the people of Kashmir. We have acted in
support of the protests on the ground. The people are calling for their promised plebiscite.
We will continue to press for reform in the region of Kashmir. The acts of the Indian Military
Machine in that region have gone on long enough.
In support of the protestors of Kashmir we have taken down the following sites:

Jknc.in
jkpolice.gov.in
indianarmy.nic.in
http://anonpr[dot]net/opkashmir-official-pressrelease-371/
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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^
Took 3 sites down in 1 day. What would these guys do without the internet ... chase the newspaperwala?

Yaseen Mullick is in dawn op-ed, for reference.
http://dawn.com/2012/05/29/wheres-kashm ... new-order/

Where’s Kashmir in the new order?
Tailpiece: Whatever the exigencies and reasons for talking to the Taliban, the gesture and the approach has implications and consequences for Kashmir and the Kashmiris. The natural conclusion and implication that Kashmiris will draw from this is that violence pays.

It is only violence that gets the attention of policymakers and makes them come to the negotiating table. The new generations of Kashmiris will then draw this lesson and may take to the gun as a means of protest to make themselves heard.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

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^ I hope he picks up an AK again. Will be easier to get rid off.
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