Bharat Rakshak

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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 14:11 
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I'm setting up this thread
  • to study the history of British role in the Muslim world, especially in the Indian Subcontinent
  • to study Britain's past and present connections to global Islamic power brokers and Jihadi networks
  • to study Britain's influence on American and European policy makers w.r.t. to the Muslim World
  • to study Britain's policy of giving sanctuary to Islamic extremists
  • to study how far Islam and Muslim society has spread out within Britain
  • to study how Left-Liberals, Fiberals, Muslim "moderates", etc. have proliferated in British Academia, School Education, Media, Local Politics, who have been instrumental in whitewashing the threat posed by Islamists
  • to study how political correctness has been used in Britain to stop criticism of Islam

At some point in time, Britain would reach the tipping point when the British elite would start converting to Islam. This thread is also to be used to forecast how and when. It is to track Britain's role from puppeteer to hostage to white leader of the Islamic world and the danger this trajectory poses to the rest of the world, especially India, and naturally to Europe and USA as well.

BRFites are most welcome to contribute!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 15:08 
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Rajesh-ji
the topic is complex and has different phases and different emphasis by the british during those periods. Over the weekend, I saw the movie North West Frontier (Movie is set in 1905 but was made in 1959). In the movie, there were two clear themes

1. the british were not universally seen to be running the empire well or equitably - even by europeans. many references to 'divide and conquer' as being the root cause of the crisis that is central to the film.
2. the forces of jihad were always standing by to attack the empire - and this is a central part of the film's plot, including the dangers of recessed jihadis hiding in plain sight. in a sense, nothing has changed between then and now!

i think its actually quite a good movie, it deals with the complexities and doesn't shy away from criticism of the empire - in the final scene, the young prince who is saved by the british captain, says 'thanks, but now i have to throw you out of India'

i know that your hypothesis is that britain has encouraged jihad throughout the empire to the present day, but i think the reality is more complex. in 1857, the british considered islam to be the biggest threat to their power - hence a determination to brutally eradicate any remnants of mughal authority - across Delhi and the Doab. the anglo-afghan wars in the 1870's-1910's were fought in the backdrop to the revival of islam/mughal power to retake Delhi, even if the 'rebels' were holed up in the afghan hills and couldnt come down to peshawar.

it is the rise of the punjabi-mussalman-soldiering class that was compliant with the empire's wishes which brought about an alignment of views, more than a fundamental alignment of idealogies.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 15:42 
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Continuing from 'TIRP' Thread

shiv wrote:
The West has learned this trick of manipulating the Muslim elite for their own ends, so the entire "Muslim world" especially the more moronic Muslim countries in the "Green crescent" from Egypt to Pakistan are all slaves of the west, except Iran. Whenever an Islamic country tries to "break away" that is, when the moronic illiterate bulk of Islamic masses break away from control of their elite who are slaves of the west, the west punish them by various means ranging from sanctions to military action. But as long as Muslim masses follow the lead of the elite Muslims (who are slaves of the west) the countries get praise and aid that caters to Islamic pride. This is how Muslim countries are armed against Zionist Israel and Hindu India or against "Godless communists". In other words radical moronic Muslims actually earn praise and rewards from the west as long as they are killing each other and killing people and forces that the west seeks to keep "balanced" and unstable.
shiv wrote:
"Islamism" is defined as "not supporting the west"
"Moderate, enlightened, secular" is "supporting the west"


shiv saar,

I think the role of Britain is really central to understanding Islamism. The British seem to have very deep connections with the Islam Power Brokers, and to a large extent the British seem to be maneuvering USA to follow its own lead with respect to Muslim World. The British have convinced USA that they understand Islam better than Americans ever could which is true but it is also leading USA down the garden path.

The Arab Spring was a major break with established US policy on supporting moderate Sunni dictators who could then control the Arab Street and the Muslim sentiment. The model you refer to worked till then but Britain has convinced USA that the model was proving more and more ineffective and it was time to change the model, to shift support from "secular moderate" albeit dictatorial regimes onto overtly Islamic groups.

Before the Arab Spring, the model was for the West to give money and weapons to "moderate" dictatorial regimes, to give them advantages over any neighboring countries, to provide media support for them, etc. i.e. as long as they supported the West. The concessions given were at home in the Muslim countries.

This has shifted. As the West has transferred their support to the Islamist groups - the Muslim Brotherhood, Saudi controlled Wahhabists, etc. the concessions they are being forced to give include full support for overthrowing "moderate" regimes e.g. Syria, but more importantly concessions within their own Western democracies.

The thing about giving concessions within their own countries is something they would regret later, but that is the only way to expect support from the Islamists. This means with time one can expect more and more understanding for the Islamist position within the UK. The army of "moderate" Muslims at home in West and the army of white left-liberals who monopolize the academic and the media world are the buffers the West can use to keep their own population in check.

The British have been playing these games since 1914 when T.E. Lawrence was recruited to sway the Arabs and bring down the Ottoman Empire, and the British felt and tasted the intellectual power to channelize the Muslim mind to its own ends. The recruitment of Muslim soldiers in the EIC and then the British Army proved that the Muslims can be played. The Anglo-American establishments think that all this is business as usual but the new thing about Islamism is that they are now being forced to make concessions in their own living rooms, rather than in the palaces in foreign lands.

The price for Islamic cooperation is going to increase. The old Muslim elites do not have the same influence, especially since Islamic parties have firmly established themselves in the body polity of various Islamic countries.

Weapons is one way to get cooperation but here too the Anglo-Americans have competition - the Russians and more importantly the Chinese. So to retain the same level of cooperation from the Islamic elites, the Anglo-Americans would be forced to make even bigger contributions and sacrifices.

Basically the Anglo-Americans felt they had the Islamic balls firmly in their grip, but the Islamics also started groping a bit and got hold of one ball of the Anglo-Americans. Now the Islamics have started using a lot more oil on their own balls, so the Anglo-American grip is getting weaker. By giving so much concession after concession to Islam at home, the Islamic grip has become stronger with time, especially in UK and use of petrodollars and immigration has also helped. The other ball of Americans is firmly in Chinese grip, and both squeeze at times. But the American Via-gara-powered erection has been such that they have already thrown around 6 trillion USD at Afghanistan and Iraq and find it difficult to reassess the value of the Paki belly-dancer.

Actually Islam has played its game quite well, in fact from the starting. All those Muslims dying by the thousands are basically firewood-Muslims and do not really matter in the scheme of things. What matters is what progress Islamic Core has made! I mean, what for do the Islamic fertility factories give birth to such Muslims if not for dying for the Islamic cause?!

shiv wrote:
The educated Muslim elite probably understand but they are powerless to change the course of Islam. But among the educated elite are a bunch of educated power brokers - for example the Paki army and RAPE class of Pakistan who profess to be devout Muslims and use the support of illiterate Muslim masses to simply kill someone or the other for personal goals/glory. Illiterate Muslims make great slave armies that can be manipulated by controlling the Muslim elite.


The educated Muslim elite, RAPE, is moving to the West to do their prescribed duty of pulling the wool over the eyes of Western society that all the violence in Muslim countries has nothing to do with Islam at all and that Jihad means "inner struggle". The educated Muslim elite which remains back in the Muslim countries would simply do their duties of looking after the administration and logistics in a political system ruled by the Islamic core. They don't really have a say in the matter any more.

The TSPA and ISI would merge with the Islamic Core, the thin veil of "moderation" gone because Anglo-Americans are now ready to deal with Islamists directly, as one sees in Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, Syria and earlier on was clear from the dealings between Anglo-Americans and the Gulf Sheikhdoms.

shiv wrote:
Islam is too primitive to understand this along with 90% of the world's Muslims. Such a situation was not even dreamed of 1300 years ago.


Yes. Most of the illiterate Muslims however do know that they are there to live and die for Islam, but are perhaps not aware that that is not simply a figure of speech and that for the Islamic Core and vested Islamic interests they are looked upon as simply firewood-Muslims. So are they happy that they are firewood-Muslims? I guess the answer is that they at least pretend to be happy about it, squealing like little piglets only when the ax is about to fall - like the Ahmadiyyas and the Hazara are now doing in Pakistan. But they too would move to a different place and hope that they are used as firewood not in internecine battles of Islam but for wars with the Kufr, so that they can die like martyrs and get their raisins.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 15:45 
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Lalmohan ji,

I hope we can get a better insight to the various complexities.

I do agree that it was only after the British broke any Muslim resistance to it in the Subcontinent that they co-opted them as tools for their wider agenda.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 15:51 
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Timely thread although much of this discussion also happens in the other UK-thread. One has to only go through Heathrow to realize that UKistan is truly f****d and they don't know it.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 15:53 
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anupmisra ji,

true, but in the other thread one cannot avail of the psy-op benefits. :)


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 16:11 
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Location: Kali blessing station No 5, Mleccha Defence Tower No 34, Harshavardhan Line - Western Sector
Rajesh-ji
the british and the americans do not really understand the sunni-shia schism in islam and have been complacent about the power of islam following the break up of the mughals, ottomans and egyptians as power bases a hundred years ago. the rise of wahab/saud on the back of oil has blind sided the west and steered them down a track they neither understand nor know how to deal with. the islamists are fighting the next round of the crusades, but the west doesnt really understand that. They are dealing with ideology, whilst their enemy is dealing with theology - and successfully co-opting them. 2/3rds of the paks are playing the crusader-resistance game whilst the jarnails and friends are milking the west for baksheesh ($$ and arms) to serve their own purposes. the west doesnt back them because of some grand plan or vision, but more out of ignorance and short term self interest
look at the debacle in syria and the arab springs to see how clueless the west is in dealing with the arab-islamist mindset
some get it, but they have to move the supertanker of public thought


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 16:22 
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Online Books

Image

Lawrence of Arabia


Image

Seven Pillars of Wisdom [Gutenberg] [eBook]
Author: T.E. Lawrence
Publication Date: 1926


Image

Revolt in the Desert
Author: T.E. Lawrence
Publication Date: 1927


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 16:46 
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Lalmohan wrote:
the rise of wahab/saud on the back of oil has blind sided the west and steered them down a track they neither understand nor know how to deal with. The islamists are fighting the next round of the crusades, but the west doesnt really understand that. They are dealing with ideology, whilst their enemy is dealing with theology - and successfully co-opting them. 2/3rds of the paks are playing the crusader-resistance game whilst the jarnails and friends are milking the west for baksheesh ($$ and arms) to serve their own purposes. the west doesnt back them because of some grand plan or vision, but more out of ignorance and short term self interest

look at the debacle in syria and the arab springs to see how clueless the west is in dealing with the arab-islamist mindset
some get it, but they have to move the supertanker of public thought


I look at it as West trying to balance a pole on their head. Sometimes the Anglo-Americans decide in which direction the pole tilts and sometimes they have to run along, get down under the pole to stop it from falling down. It is a difficult balancing trick.

There have been instances when the Anglo-Americans were able to use Islamics to further their strategic interests - Break-up of the Ottoman Empire, Partition of India, Defeat of the Soviet-Union in Afghanistan, Use in Bosnia-Kosovo-Chechnya to push back Russian interests, some control over Arab Nationalism, Kashmir, etc.

All this has given the Anglo-Americans the feeling that they are really capable of controlling the Islamic Tiger and so they ride it.

Much of their struggle lately has been their efforts to bring the tiger to heel, because that is the force of chaos that they can use against others, e.g. against China, India, Russia, etc, but first they have to get it under their own control. 9/11 and July 7, 2005 London Bombings did shake up the Anglo-American world, and they were forced in to take down Al Qaida. The control was getting tenuous.

But it is indeed illusory for them to think they can control the Islamics. The Islamics will take their concessions, make war, force more concessions and so on.

Now the Anglo-Americans have to show that they are aligned with Islamics fully so that they can show that they are still partners. Hence Syria! Only as long as Britain and USA work along with the Islamics, can they hope that they keep quiet at home, for at least till then they have some sort of "pact"!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 16:48 
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Cross-posting from 'TIRP' Thread

Neela wrote:
amit wrote:
I recently caught the new G I Joe movie which has been banned in Pakistan.
While the ostensible reason for the ban is that the opening scene shows the Paki nukes falling into the hands of terrorists and the Joes snatching them back, I think the real reason for the ban is further into the film.
Without giving away the plot let's just say that at the climax of the movie we have a scene where the leaders of all nuclear power states are seated at a negotiating table and the Indian PM has a pretty prominent part to play there both in calling the US "president" mad and in pushing the trigger to start bomb delivery. Heck you even had a North Korean guy in the scene.
So you have on the one hand Pakistan depicted in its true colours of terror central from where the Joes have to go and snatch the illegal nukes and you have India depicted as a big nuclear power along with France, Russia, Britain, China, Israel and even NoKo.
No wonder the Pakis got their chaddis in a twist. This film is following a trend of depicting the bad guys of being always based in Pakistan. The country has supplanted the "small Middle East country ruled by a dictator" as the source of all the evil which American special ops guys go in and destroy. And yes you had this pretty female Joe kick a**s of some guys dressed up exactly like the Talibunnies! Ouch!
What a fall for the TFTA self esteem. And like it or not, such movies shape public perception of foreign countries in Middle America.
:lol: :lol:


But wait. Does this also not speak of Amreekan stupidity. Does it now show how the tide has turned for the dashing pair of Amreekah and TSP. I would say that this is a effete , b@ll-less , cowardly attempt at the Pakis. The Pakis whipped Amreekis , made a fool of them since 2001 in a war that cost $1Beeelllion a week , got paid for that and in the end, shoving some real "moderate Taliban's" ***** down Uncle Sam's t***at.
And this is what Amreekah has to show in return? What a sore loser Amreekuh is!
Remember the same Amreekis and Pakis did nothing when despite taking sanctuary in the UN compound, Najibullah was castrated , dragged around and then killed.
Yesterday Pakis were Amreeki friends.Today Amreekis are Pakis' b1tches! :PToday they are enemies. Tomorrow who knows.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 17:15 
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rajesh-ji
i disagree on syria. i think it is an example of where the west have been coopted. they have been told by saudis that the alawites are backed by iran and therefore have to be overthrown. the sunnis are very clear that the alawites are heretics and have to be slaughtered - and they are working to that end, and restore the 'natural order of things' (back to the 14th century or thereabouts when the sunnis first massacred the alawites - the french at the end of WW1 promoted the alawites above the sunnis to take control, and then some alawites pursuing the baathist agenda rose to the forefront - namely assad. the current secular sunni resistance to alawite heavy handedness is rapidly being overtaken by the jihadists, who are eagerly funded by the saudi/wahabis and unkil and uk are going along with it because it is against iran, without really thinking that the sunnis are playing a longer game

i have been saying for some time that i dont understand syria - but now i totally get it

the west backed the sunnis against the soviets, and then against the baathists and iran - feels like its the price riyadh extracts for keeping the oil flowing

(if you are able, watch dan snow's documentary on syrian history on the bbc)


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 17:31 
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The Last White Kids [Imdb]
Broadcasted on Channel 4 "Cutting Edge" on October 30, 2003

Quote:
What is it like being an ethnic minority in Britain and white? This programme is a child's eye view of race and explores growing up in a world where nearly everyone else is a different colour. Set in Bradford, it is a compelling story of the Gallagher children who have to make extraordinary choices about race, identity and religion. Twelve-year-old Ashlene Gallagher is one of eight white pupils in her year at school. Her younger sister Amie and brother Jake go to a primary school where 95% of the children are Asian. Since they moved to the area two years ago Ashlene, Amie and their cousin Lauren have developed a fascination with Islam. Though they love Gareth Gates and Sean Paul, they are also drawn to Asian culture - its music, clothes and rituals. Intimately filmed over the past summer the film follows the children as the girls and boys are pulled in different directions. It's a fascinating and revealing insight into childhood at a time when these children are exploring their cultural identity.




Published on Oct 30 2003
By Sarfraz Manzoor
Isle of white: Guardian

What's it like to be white - and a minority. The Gallaghers, one of the few non-Asian families left in Manningham, know.

Sharon Gallagher is white but she knows what it is like to be part of an ethnic minority. For the past 18 months she has lived with her three children in the predominantly Asian district of Manningham in Bradford. This was once a white area, but over the past 30 years most of the whites have left; today Manningham is home to Pakistanis and Bengalis, halal butchers, Islamic book stores and mosques. And it is home to the Gallaghers. They are the only white family on their street and one of the last left in Manningham.
Sharon is 34, but single parenthood, homelessness and bad relationships have left their scars. When she speaks, I can't help noticing she has only two lower teeth. "You can walk all day round my street," she says, sucking on a cigarette, "and you can walk all the way to the shops and back and you won't see any whites."

There are four mosques in the area, one overlooks Sharon's home; five times a day, the call to prayer drifts from the minaret down to the backyard. It has become so familiar that the children can do a decent recital of the muezzin's words. At school, the Gallagher children are pink exceptions to a brown rule. Such intense exposure to a different culture has affected each child differently.

"If you're white and you ain't hard you're ****** It is a crisp bright Saturday afternoon, we are in a McDonald's restaurant in Bradford and 11-year-old Jake Gallagher is explaining what it is like being white in his neighbourhood. His sister Ashlene and cousin Jade listen in. "I used to get picked on at school," he says, fiddling with the baseball cap that partly hides his carrot-coloured hair. "They would call me 'white ******** and we would get into a fight."

Thirty years ago, it was young Asians who were bullied in Manningham. Children would be picked on as they walked to school, and their mothers were too frightened to walk outside their homes. Today, Asians are not so meek. They have long memories and some choose to take it out on those whites who remain. "I know they have troubles in places like Detroit," Jake tells me, "but if a white person from there came to Manningham for a week they would come home crying. It's not that I am harder," he adds "but you have to be tough just to live round here."

For young boys like Jake and his cousin John, the world is divided into two groups: the Pakis and the Porkies. The Pakis are the Muslims who seem to go to the mosque a thousand times a day, who fast and pray and have to watch what they eat. The porkies can be white or black or mixed race, but what unites them is that they are not Muslim. They call themselves porkies because, unlike the Muslims, they can eat pork. It is not a racial category you will find on any census form, but the concept of porkie says something new and profound about how some are forming their cultural identity in urban communities. The rise in mixed marriages has spawned a generation of children for whom the old race distinctions have blurred into irrelevance; it is not about whether you are black or white anymore, it is about whether you are a paki or a porkie.

Listening to Jake describe his fights with gangs of Pakistanis it is tempting to feel despondent. Until you meet his sister. Like millions of other teenage girls, Ashlene adores Gareth Gates, who is a local hero in Bradford, and even has a signed poster of him on her bedroom wall; she loves EastEnders and Hollyoaks and would like to be an actress or a pilot when she grows up. But Ashlene has another ambition: she wants to be a Muslim. Alongside her school exercise books are slim volumes with titles such as Islam for Children, The Supreme Prophet and The Rule of Allah Alone: Sunni Islam's answers to the problems of the modern world. The imam of the local mosque gave her the books.

The mosque is where most of the other children go after school for two hours of Islamic education. One afternoon Ashlene and her 10-year-old sister Amie decided to see what went on inside the mosque. Maybe it was curiosity that led them there, perhaps it was boredom from walking the deserted streets of Manningham, or maybe it was because they had nothing to go home to. Whatever it was, the imam was so impressed by them that he asked Sharon for permission to let them go regularly. They can now read and speak Arabic.

In one remarkable scene in a Channel 4 documentary about the family, the brown-eyed, freckled Amie astonishes a local pizza shop owner by reciting from memory some verses from the Koran. The shocked shop owner rewards her in the only way he knows how: with free pizza and coke.

Ashlene is one of only eight white girls in her year at her school. Twenty-five years ago, the student population at Belle Vue girls' school was evenly divided between Asians and whites. In the summer of 1978, Margaret Platts was a PE teacher there. "We knew even then that things were changing," she recalls. "The head at the time talked a lot to us about what an increasing Asian population would mean for the school."

In the intervening years, Bradford has come to symbolise the bruised state of race relations in this country. The Honeyford affair 19 years ago (when local headmaster Ray Honeyford was forced out of his job after saying white children suffered in schools with a large Asian population) prompted a white flight of frightened parents; there have been book burnings and race riots. When Platts returned to Belle Vue this autumn as head of the school, the comprehensive had become 98% Asian. "The separation of communities has become much more marked than it was before," Platts says quietly. "We used to draw some white children from the estates around the school, but now they bus out to other schools."

I was one of only a handful of Asians at my school; like any child I wanted to fit in and, for me, wanting to belong meant being more like my white friends. For Ashlene - who has grown up in the shadow of the mosque, and whose school friends are Muslim - wanting to belong means wearing a shalwar kameez to the mosque and declaring that she wants to be a Muslim.

When Sharon Gallagher was 12 years old she had a mixed-race friend who would scrub her skin to try to make herself white. Today, Sharon has one son who wants to be Eminem and a daughter who wants to be a Muslim. The Gallaghers may not have attended any citizenship classes, but her family offers a preview of a new urban identity. Sharon is facing many of the same issues that Asians have been dealing with for decades, but her neighbours treat her better than they were themselves treated in the past.

I left Bradford convinced that the Gallagher children are better for having lived where they do. I am less sure that can be said for their neighbours and classmates: the Pakistani and Bengali children being raised and schooled in an environment where they can forget that in the world outside Manningham it is they who are the real ethnic minority.

_______________________

Published on Nov 02, 2003
By Peter Hitchens
Will Britain convert to Islam?: Daily Mail UK

Could Islam one day become the established church of Britain? Might English women adopt the headscarves and enveloping robes of their Asian sisters, as the call to prayer rises and falls across the slate roofs of rainswept industrial cities?

The idea is not as impossible, as bizarre or distant as you might think. An astonishing Channel 4 programme last week - The Last White Kids -- showed two English children who live in an entirely Muslim district becoming enthusiastic attenders at the local mosque, wrapping themselves in Islamic draperies and learning the Koran.

Amie Gallagher, nine, and her sister Ashlene, 12, are all-too-typical children of modern Britain in some ways, daughters of a single-parent household where the father is absent.

In Islam they seem to have found something that would otherwise be missing from their lives. At the mosque there is authority, certainty, even disciplined education in the Arabic language and the Koran.

This has happened because the Gallaghers are the only white family in a suburb otherwise completely dominated by Asian Muslims.

If they move away, as they may well do, then perhaps the two girls' attachment to the mosque will fail. Their brother, Jake, has not followed them down the Muslim path and has instead become even more defiantly English than he might otherwise have done.

But this strange little story contains a warning for Britain as a whole, as it careers ever more rapidly down the path of permissiveness which began so gently in the Sixties and now slopes ever more steeply downwards towards sexual chaos, drunkenness, family breakdown and the epidemic use of stupefying drugs.
Sooner or later, as in every other era of human history, there will be a revulsion against this licence, a desire to stop the waste, cruelty and misery which these things bring, especially to children.

Where will that revulsion come from? In the 18th and 19th Centuries it came from Christianity and the mighty but forgotten Temperance movements which reacted against the squalor and misery of Hogarth's Gin Lane, and whose effects we still just feel.

But Christianity shows little sign of doing the job a second time. Its leaders are more concerned about foreign conflict than about domestic misery, and more interested in the sexual tastes of bishops than in trying to regulate the confused sex lives of Britain's young.

The Christian churches have all but disappeared from the lives of the British people. The chapels of Wales are gaunt ruins, the great Roman Catholic churches of the industrial North West are often empty and derelict, the Anglicans scuttle about in their hallowed, lovely buildings like mice amid ancient ruins, rarely even beginning to fill spaces designed for multitudes.
The choirs and the bells gradually fall silent, the hymns are no longer sung and one by one the doors are locked and places which in some cases have seen worship for centuries become bare museums of a dead faith.

Few listen to what these churches say. They have become exclusive clubs, whose members celebrate bizarre rituals which are baffling to outsiders.

The Christian message is a difficult and complicated one, which if not learned in childhood is hard for adults to understand. The Christian ceremonies, viewed coldly by an outsider unschooled in 2,000 years of tradition, are positively peculiar. Why would anyone eat God?

When Christianity was part of our culture and its beliefs were handed down in homes and schools, its familiarity kept it strong. Everyone knew Bible stories, hymns and prayers. Now it is at least as alien to many young people as Islam, if not more so because it does not seem to be interested in them.

But Islam is interested in them. And Islam is growing. More and more British cities have seen the domes and minarets of smart, prominently positioned new mosques rising in their neighbourhoods.

A large and imposing Islamic centre is now nearing completion in Oxford, one of Christian England's holiest places. Imagine what would happen if Anglicans sought to build a Christian centre in Qom, Isfahan, Najaf or anywhere on the soil of Saudi Arabia, and wonder what Muslim leaders think of Christian feebleness on such matters.

Thanks to the immigration of recent decades, Britain has a young, energetic and swelling Muslim population which is increasingly assertive about its faith.

Official Islam may disapprove of such things but there have even been signs of the Muslim intolerance towards Christianity that is a nasty feature of so many Islamic societies.

In the Bradford suburb of Girlington, not far from where the Gallaghers live in Manningham, Asian youths tried to set fire to an Anglican church. Soon afterwards, a Brownie pack leader was attacked in a nearby street by young men who snarled 'Christian bitch' at her.

An isolated and meaningless incident? You might hope so, but it would be unwise to be sure.

If you travel to these areas, you get the sense that Islam, one of the great forces of history, long ago defeated by the armies and navies of a mighty Christian Europe, is once again feeling its strength and finding that it has been able to penetrate what were once the most impregnable fortresses of its great rival.

Islam's appeal, wherever it has triumphed, has been in its simplicity. It requires submission to some basic, straightforward rules which are easily kept, and in return it offers that most wonderful and rare commodity, peace of mind. To modern Westerners, its attitude towards women seems incredibly backward and even hateful.

But as the reactions of Ashlene and Amie Gallagher show, its discipline, safety and certainties have an appeal for girls lost in the churning seas of permissiveness, whose own families have been weakened by the crumbling of the two-parent family, the absence of fathers and the impermanence of husbands, if there are husbands in the first place rather than boyfriends and ' babyfathers'.

And in most societies it is the women who sustain religions in the home and among children. In a country in the grip of unbelief, those with strong, clear convictions and an uncluttered message have a great advantage over those who offer nothing but choices to the perplexed and cannot seem to make up their minds about anything.

So if eventually Britain begins to sicken of strong lager, pools of vomit, Bacardi Breezers, bouncers looming on every High Street, the battlefields in the streets of many towns on Friday and Saturday nights, ecstasy tablets, cocaine, football-worship, pregnant 12-year-olds, morning-after pills and all that goes with them, is it possible that puritan Islam will be the cause that benefits?

If bureaucratic police and feeble justice continue to fail to suppress crime and disorder, will the savage but simple remedies of Sharia law begin to appeal to the British poor, who are already weary of seeing dishonesty triumph everywhere and lawless violence go unchecked?

Might Islam become respectable among the politically correct middle classes, in a way that Christianity never really can, because Christianity is always associated in this country with the conservative, imperial past?

You will already find plenty of bright young Muslims in our universities, many of whom are impressive and diligent students, and their influence is bound to increase as they move into the professions.

The idea of an Islamic Britain may seem highly unlikely now, amid what still seems to be more or less a Western, Christian society. We are used to thinking of Islam as a religion of backward regions, and of backward people.

But we should remember that Muslim armies came within inches of taking Vienna in 1683 and were only driven from Spain in 1492. In those days it was the Islamic world that was making the great scientific advances which we now assume are ours by right.

And is it any more unlikely than the things which have happened here in the past 40 years, during which a country of peaceful, self-restrained, lawful and rather prudish men and women has been transformed into the land of sex and swearing on TV, ladettes, semi-legal cannabis and armed police?

If we don't respect our own customs and religion, we may end up, as Ashlene and Amie Gallagher have done, respecting someone else's. Don't be surprised.


Last edited by RajeshA on 02 Apr 2013 17:42, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 17:38 
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Lalmohan wrote:
rajesh-ji
i disagree on syria. i think it is an example of where the west have been coopted.

<snip>

unkil and uk are going along with it because it is against iran, without really thinking that the sunnis are playing a longer game

i have been saying for some time that i dont understand syria - but now i totally get it

the west backed the sunnis against the soviets, and then against the baathists and iran - feels like its the price riyadh extracts for keeping the oil flowing


Lalmohan ji,

this is what I also said about Syria, that the Americans are being pushed by the Saudis. UK however is more keen to be seen to be of service to the Saudis.

RajeshA wrote:
As the West has transferred their support to the Islamist groups - the Muslim Brotherhood, Saudi controlled Wahhabists, etc. the concessions they are being forced {on the West} to give include full support for overthrowing "moderate" regimes e.g. Syria, but more importantly concessions within their own Western democracies.
Quote:
Now the Anglo-Americans have to show that they are aligned with Islamics {Saudis} fully so that they can show that they are still partners. Hence Syria!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 17:53 
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Islamic Britain: Religion, Politics and Identity Among British Muslims [Amazon] [Google]
Author: Philip Lewis
Publication Date: Jun 01, 2002 (1st Edition: 1994)

Description
From the 1980s Britain's large Muslim community, a long established but little noticed group, suddenly became visible as controversies involving the education and dress of Muslim schoolgirls, the Rushdie affair and the Gulf War excited huge media interest. Caricatures and misconceptions began to spread and, with political Islam on the march in many Middle Eastern countries, fears of British Muslims becoming a bridgehead in the West for the establishment of an Islamic theocracy began to loom in the popular imagination. How do British Muslims really think about themselves, about their religion and their politics? What dilemmas do they face as they give up the "myth of return" that sustained first-generation immigrants and struggle to define a British Islam? In this important book, the first major study of British Muslims, Philip Lewis deals with the reality behind distorted media images through a rich, first-hand account of the Muslim community in Bradford - the city which became the epicentre of British Muslim anger and resistance to The Satanic Verses.

Published in Dec, 1995
Review by Daniel Pipes
Quote:
Bradford, a Yorkshire town with a population of 300,000, is about one-quarter Muslim; it became notorious as the place where volumes of The Satanic Verses were symbolically burned in 1989. Lewis, a specialist on Islam and an advisor to the bishop of Bradford on interfaith issues, provides a close analysis of the Muslim residents in Bradford. His erudite and careful analysis contains much fascinating information about that town, though not about all of Britain, as the title promises. In particular, Lewis excels at understanding Bradford's Muslims in their own cultural terms.

American readers will be impressed by just how much Islamic Britain differs from Islamic America. Some main points: some 80 percent of the million plus 14 British Muslims trace their origins to South Asia and, within that, from select small regions (such as Azad Kashmir and the Sylhet District); in contrast, American Muslims are ethnically diverse, with South Asians, Iranians, various Arabic-speakers, and black Americans all numerous. More important, whole communities migrated more or less intact to Britain, endowing towns like Bradford with a wide range of Urdu-speaking services; even today, a majority of Muslim religious leaders in Britain come from South Asia. As a result, divisions from the old country, whether ethnic (Gujarati vs. Urdu speakers) or Islamic (Deobandi vs. Barelwi) persist in Britain; also, this means that such practices as Qur'anic memorization are widespread in Bradford. The contrast with America is stark, and probably full of implications for both countries.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:05 
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What Will Happen When Islam Takes Over Britain



British Muslims want to take over the UK



England: No-Go Areas for Kuffar (Non-Muslims)


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:17 
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Cross-posting from "Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad - News & Analysis" Thread

Haresh wrote:
I have just found this page on FB.
A pretty useful one to see what is happening in the UK with regards to the RoP (MA)

https://www.facebook.com/blonde.zionist?fref=ts


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:20 
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Cross-posting from "Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad - News & Analysis" Thread

pankajs wrote:
Putin's method of dealing with Radical Islam - European security summit



Putin promises to cut off French journalist's d1ck at European security summit. Very illuminating! Watch the reaction of Javier Solana and Jose Manuel Barosso.


Perhaps an island of non-compromising attitude!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:22 
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Why do we need a separate thread for this? We have a UK thread. Too much overlap.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:30 
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RoyG wrote:
Why do we need a separate thread for this? We have a UK thread. Too much overlap.


We have a "Indo-UK News & Discussion" Thread. Question is why are we posting "Islam" stuff there?

This thread deals specifically with viewing UK as an arm of Islam, which is responsible for pushing this policy in the Indian Subcontinent and also responsible for pushing Islamic interests in the West (Europe & USA) under political correctness, liberal values, moral high ground, freedom of religion, business relations with Gulf countries, negotiating with the Taliban, etc. One would always notice these patterns in British behavior.

This attitude needs to be nailed down for what it is! It is a thread catering to a specific psy-ops mission.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 18:48 
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Cross-posting a post by jrjrao in 'TIRP' Thread

Published on Apr 02, 2013
By Rob Crilly
Why are we giving aid to Pakistan?: Telegraph UK

Quote:
The decision to re-organise the way Britain's Department for International (DfID) spends its £10 billion was made two years ago when Andrew Mitchell was in charge. His review of spending was in many ways sensible, switching cash away from countries such as China and Russia which are wealthy enough to run their own foreign aid projects (and space programmes). The big winner was Pakistan which is now on course to become the biggest recipient of British foreign aid – some £450 million per year by 2015.
Quote:
Theresa May, the Home Secretary, elucidated it most clearly in a speech to police officers (who proved an unreceptive audience):

"If you get aid right in certain parts of the world, such as Pakistan, it will reduce the possibility of terrorism on the streets of the UK," she said.

The theory is obvious. More schools would keep young Pakistanis out of madrassahs, where they risk being radicalised, and a decent education means they are less likely to end up unemployed, poor and angry. So far so good.

What is less obvious is whether the theory is true. Remember the 9/11 hijackers? They were well educated and from generally middle-class families. The Times Square bomber too came from a prosperous family and had settled legally in the US, working as a financial analyst.

No, the real threat to Britain is not poor young men from the badlands of North Waziristan, it is from our own home-grown radicals, as the example of the 7/7 bombers shows.

Of course, the training camps in Pakistan do remain a problem. Threats to the UK may originate there or British "clean skins" may be trained in areas controlled by the Pakistan Taliban or Haqqani network. Perhaps Britain's ambitions aid plans can protect our shores by depriving the camps of the local men who run, protect and supply them.

Maybe. But there is growing evidence that the US drone programme has already disrupted the bases, and that foreign volunteers no longer have the time to learn the sophisticated tradecraft they need to avoid detection and launch successful attacks in the West. For years, analysts have talked of "Kramer Jihadists" (after the Seinfeld character) – bumbling radicals who make basic errors and who can be rounded up easily. That's not to say there is no threat – but that the threat has changed.

And so far most of the academic studies into a link between poverty, democracy, education and terrorism have struggled to find much of a correlation. When they have, it has been the wrong one, suggesting poor people suffer more as a result of terrorism and are more likely to be turned away from extremism.


The reasons given are nonsense. The British politicians know that any aid they will be giving to Pak are not going to be reducing either poverty, illiteracy nor any threat of terrorism to Britain itself.

Britain simply wants to use its aid to be able to influence the levers in a key Islamic state which possesses a big potential of causing chaos and mayhem in the Subcontinent and in the world. It is through these levers over Islamic groups that Britain these days exercises its international influence and shows its worth both to USA and to Europe. UK wants to simply be a good middleman of Jihadi terror. This way it stops some terror closer to home but also redirect some of it abroad perhaps towards choicer targets which suits its international agenda. Britain wants to remain in the game! Considering its decreasing economic standing, connections with Jihadi groups is its ace.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 19:03 
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At some time in the near future, USA would take the decision of denying UK the Visa Waiver Program. I think that would be a milestone in recognizing Britain as a hub of Islamic Extremism, Jihadism and Britain's descent into an Islamic country.

The Visa Waiver Program (VWP) is basically the measure of which country belongs in the Western Civilization and which does not (with a couple of exceptions)!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 20:26 
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Published on Nov 25, 2010
By Robert Hardman
Modest Queen covers her head and goes barefoot to the mosque in Abu Dhabi: DailyMail

Image

Image



Ensuing discussion: QUEEN OF DHIMMIS, EMPRESS OF THE ANTI-EMPIRE, DEFENDER OF THE ISLAMIC FAITH, HEAD OF THE SURRENDER OF ENGLAND


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 20:33 
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Cross-posting a post by Carl in 'India-EU News & Analysis' Thread

But in Londonistan, they're sounding the alarm for Far Right terrorism (like Congress' fear of "saffron terror"):
UK 'faces threat of murderous terror attack from Far Right extremist'
Quote:
Britain faces the threat of a murderous terror attack from a Far Right extremist similar to the mass murderer Anders Breivik who gunned down 77 young Norweigans, the Security Minister warned today.
...
He disclosed that one in ten cases referred to a Home Office scheme to stop youngsters being caught up in terrorism related to the Far Right.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 20:41 
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Published on Oct 29, 2005
By Thomas Lifson
A disaster for the British monarchy: American Thinker

Quote:
The Prince of Wales will try to persuade George W Bush and Americans of the merits of Islam this week because he thinks the United States has been too intolerant of the religion since September 11.

The Prince, who leaves on Tuesday for an eight—day tour of the US, has voiced private concerns over America's "confrontational" approach to Muslim countries and its failure to appreciate Islam's strengths.

Prince Charles, who is about to embark on his first official foreign tour since his marriage to the Duchess of Cornwall, wants Americans — including Mr Bush — to share his fondness for Islam. He has agreed to attend a seminar on religions at Georgetown University, Washington, on Thursday: the only event where he will not be accompanied by the Duchess.

"The seminar will look at how faith groups can alleviate social problems in their community," a royal aide said.

The Prince and Duchess will attend a lunch and dinner with President Bush and his wife, Laura, at the White House on Wednesday.

Prince Charles has done more than any other member of the Royal Family in history to understand Islam. He said in 1994 that when he became Supreme Governor of the Church of England, he would rather be "defender of faiths" than "defender of the faith".


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 20:55 
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Released on Jun 01, 2012
British Muslims and Muslim Council Celebrate Queen's Reign


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:06 
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Prince Charles - Follow Islam to save the World




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Published on Nov 09, 2003 (continuously updated)
By Daniel Pipes
Is Prince Charles a Convert to Islam?


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:10 
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British women who turn to Islam

Quote:
The Muslim population in England and Wales has increased by 80 percent since 2001 according to a British government census. With 2.7 million known adherents — 40 percent living in and around London — Islam has emerged as Britain’s second-largest religion after Christianity. Immigration accounts for most of the increase but conversions are on the rise making Islam the UK’s fastest-growing faith. Data from mosques indicates there may be more than 100,000 converts in Britain of various ethnicities. There were 5,000 conversions in 2012 of which three quarters were young females. What’s fueling this trend?
“Make me a Muslim,” a documentary that recently aired on BBC World, begins with “growing numbers of white British women are converting to Islam and asks but why would they want to give up all the freedoms their Western life allows?” It seeks to discover the challenges they face following the precepts of their new faith within a society known for its liberal, freewheeling lifestyle.
The program’s Muslim-born presenter Shanna Bukhari, a successful model and former Miss Universe contestant who announces that she’s a modern British Muslim and always will be, travels around the country interviewing five women converts who ironically inspire Bukhari to reevaluate her own attitudes to Islam. Converts are often more conservative than born Muslims embracing their new beliefs with enthusiastic fervor, so it’s not surprising that Bukhari felt she was being judged for not covering her hair or attending a mosque. When she was obliged to wear a hijab to accompany one the interviewees to a mosque, Bukhari appeared disturbed explaining that she no longer felt “pretty.”
There are numerous reasons why young British women choose Islam. In many cases, it’s because they want to please Muslim fiancés and husbands, to be accepted by Muslim-in laws or to bring up their children in one cohesive faith. However, as the BBC documentary illustrates, others see Islam as a safe haven within a society that denigrates the female form in newspapers and magazines and celebrates a pub/club culture where regular nights out with “mates” getting “sloshed” or popping hallucinogens is more the norm than the exception.
Societal permissiveness, where family life has broken down in the absence of traditional mores, has made demands on young women, valuing them accordance to their physical attributes. Islam offers those women a sense of belonging, a community of like minds in areas where there is a substantial Muslim population. It provides structure to their life, a blueprint for living and a sense of personal security; it gives them renewed dignity and, as they perceive it, increased worth as a human being. There are cases where women have gone through hard times and see their conversion to Islam as a re-birth, a wiping clean of the slate.
Committing to Islam by saying the Shehada for those who are emotionally ready is the simplest part of the process. Most converts have a hard time explaining their decision to family members holding preconceived ideas about Islam as a faith that oppresses womanhood. As the documentary illustrates, parents are sometimes taunted by friends who ask “Does your daughter still wear that thing on her head?” Lifelong friends often fade away because of irreconcilable worldviews or because the convert can no longer join them on the pleasure train.
More often or not, fair-haired, blue-eyed converts not only face insult from passersby on the street but struggle to be taken seriously by Muslim communities. Unmarried converts face difficulties in finding a husband because of the bar on the mixing of sexes in the usual social settings unlike born Muslims who are introduced to prospective partners via family connections or community leaders. Muslim families are sometimes unwilling to allow their sons to wed converts, preferring to find wives within their own ethnic group; others fear converts might one day decide to break away from the religion and revert to their old habits. This means that converts often tie the knot with other converts triggering a mushrooming of Internet sites like muzmatch.com that also organizes events permitting singles who are serious about marriage to meet-up.
Tony Blair’s sister-in-law Lauren Booth, a well-known pro-Palestinian activist, columnist and TV presenter, elicited a storm of controversy when she embraced Islam in 2010. The “screams of faux horror from fellow columnists on hearing of my conversion to Islam prove that this remains the stereotypical view regarding half a billion women currently practicing Islam,” she wrote. The will to convert was a slow process for Booth. “Almost unnoticed to me, when praying for the last year or so, I had been saying “Dear Allah” instead of “Dear God”… then came the pull, a sort of emotional ebb and flow that responds to the company of other Muslims with a heightened feeling of openness and warmth.” She glimpsed “the great lie” that “consumerism, materialism, drugs and sex will give us great happiness” and finally felt “what Muslims feel when they are in true prayer: A bolt of sweet harmony, a shudder of joy in which I was grateful for everything I have (my children) and secure in the certainty that I need nothing more (along with prayer) to be utterly content.”


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:14 
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Published on Jun 10 2010
By Rebecca English
'Follow the Islamic way to save the world,' Prince Charles urges environmentalists: Daily Mail

Quote:
The prince was speaking to an audience of scholars at the Oxford Centre for Islamic Studies - which attempts to encourage a better understanding of the culture and civilisation of the religion.

His speech, merging religion with his other favourite subject, the environment, marked the 25th anniversary of the organisation, of which he is patron.

He added: 'The inconvenient truth is that we share this planet with the rest of creation for a very good reason - and that is, we cannot exist on our own without the intricately balanced web of life around us.

'Islam has always taught this and to ignore that lesson is to default on our contract with creation.'


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:17 
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Published on Mar 14, 2013
By Gordon Rayner
Prince Charles takes private Arabic lessons: Telegraph UK

He has long been fascinated by the culture and art of the Middle East, and now the Prince of Wales is taking his interest to a new level by having lessons in Arabic, it emerged today.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:26 
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rajesh-ji, the quote from charles is pretty out of context... he is speaking at an event where one would expect to say such things - interfaith harmony and all that...


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 21:33 
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Lalmohan ji,

but I did not add any masala of my own to that!


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:02 
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Published in September 1997
By Ronni L. Gordon and David M. Stillman
Prince Charles of Arabia: Middle East Quarterly

Quote:
"So perhaps no one should be shocked by the suggestion in a forthcoming book that Prince Charles has converted to Islam."

This claim was put forward by no less a personage than the grand mufti of Cyprus: "Did you know that Prince Charles has converted to Islam. Yes, yes. He is a Muslim. I can't say more. But it happened in Turkey. Oh, yes, he converted all right. When you get home check on how often he travels to Turkey. You'll find that your future king is a Muslim."


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:06 
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BRITAIN’S SELF-ISLAMIZATION

Quote:
Image
(Avon and Somerset Police)
Police Community Support Officer Nora Ndiaye and Assistant Chief Constable Jackie Roberts of Avon and Somerset Constabulary




The Islamization of British Police

Quote:
Image


Last edited by RamaY on 02 Apr 2013 22:11, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:10 
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The Islamization of London: A Photo Tour

Quote:
When I arrived in London in September it had been more than forty years since I had last spent any time in the city. If I hadn’t kept up with recent events through my British contacts, the changes would have been startling indeed.

The most popular tourist spots appear much the same, and the commercial areas are still thronged with shoppers. No matter where you go, however, the presence of Islam makes itself felt. With the rapid increase in the Muslim population over the past decade, the capital of Britain has moved that much closer to becoming an Islamic city.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:15 
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http://ussneverdock.blogspot.com/2005/1 ... itain.html
Quote:
As you'll see, the Islamization of Britain encompasses all facets of life. The police, media, politicians, the Royals and all the way up to Number 10, are all involved in the process. Will Britain wake up before it's too late? Not if the BBC has it's way.

As you read these, keep in mind that no one seems to mind Muslim crimes against Christians.

1. British theater censors play so as not to upset Muslims.

2. Tate museum censors art so as not to upset Muslims.

3. Islamization at Number 10
Quote:
ADVISERS appointed by Tony Blair after the London bombings are proposing to scrap the Jewish Holocaust Memorial Day because it is regarded as offensive to Muslims.

The recommendation, drawn up by four committees including those dealing with imams and mosques, and Islamaphobia and policing, has the backing of Sir Iqbal Sacranie, secretary-general of the Muslim Council of Britain

Bibles are banned in Saudi Arabia because it is offensive to Muslims and now they seek to ban things they feel offensive here. Where does it end? I find Muslims offensiveness to our western cultural offensive.


4. Rangers Football Club decides to produce strips without the Carling Beer logo after complaints from Muslim fans.

5. In Bristol they have seperate swimming times for Muslim women. This is on top of the Asian only sessions.

6. The Islamization of the Royals.

7. Britain adopts Islamic laws.

8. FA makes rules change to appease Muslims.

9. Muslims censor billboards deemed un-Islamic.

10. Radical Muslim Knighted.

11. Piglet banned so as not to offend Muslims.



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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:23 
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X-posting an old post from Islamism thread:

Dr. Tahir ul-Qadri, considered the most respected 'Alim and Pakistan's gift to the Moslem world, is a darling of Pakistan's Anglo masters also because he has written a convoluted thesis on why "terrorism" is un-Islamic.

Tahir ul-Qadri also toured India recently, and his mureeds organized massive audiences. Sometimes they used kabootar-baazi tricks to get a dove to perch itself on the mic into which His Holiness spoke, and then on various Islamic fora on the internet the pics were posted to show it was a divine sign of the state of his peaceful heart.

Years ago when he rose to prominence in Pakhanistan, Tahir ul-Qadri revealed that the Prophet Muhammad (saw) had appeared in his dream and said that he had come to stay in Pakistan, but only if Tahir ul-Qadri himself agreed to be his personal host.

Just came across this good video of how Tahir ul-Qadri piously practices taqiyyah.



In the Anglosphere, Tahir ul-Qadri has certain groups that invite him, kiss his hand, and make sure he has access and influence there. Typically, the higher ups in these networks are educated Brit and American converts, while the Paki immigrants form the lumpen bulk of this demographic. E.g. the British convert and now Sheikh Abdal Hakim Murad. Not surprisingly, Sheikh AHM's writings show a virulent anti-India and anti-Hindu bias. He will typically pick up and throw everything and the kitchen sink to put India and Hinduism down - Leftist theories (which they otherwise despise), distorted portrayals of Hinduism, Aryan Invasion Theory, etc. One gem from his book of "Contentions" to be researched and meditated upon by disciples -- "Vedas were an invasion; Muhammad bin Qasim showed the Way." Another example in the US is Sheikh Hamza Yusuf, though he is far more diplomatic than the likes of Sheikh AHM in Londonistan.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:41 
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RoyG wrote:
Why do we need a separate thread for this? We have a UK thread. Too much overlap.


Actually, I am ok with it now. Its more "illuminating".


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 22:43 
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RajeshA wrote:
Published on Mar 14, 2013
By Gordon Rayner
Prince Charles takes private Arabic lessons: Telegraph UK

He has long been fascinated by the culture and art of the Middle East, and now the Prince of Wales is taking his interest to a new level by having lessons in Arabic, it emerged today.


And why not? His family traces its origins to the profit.


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 23:30 
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RajeshA wrote:
Cross-posting from "Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad - News & Analysis" Thread

pankajs wrote:
Putin's method of dealing with Radical Islam - European security summit
Putin promises to cut off French journalist's d1ck at European security summit. Very illuminating! Watch the reaction of Javier Solana and Jose Manuel Barosso.Perhaps an island of non-compromising attitude!


Putin Singh Phadke Raya !


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PostPosted: 02 Apr 2013 23:58 
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RajeshA, Lalmohan is right that the 1857 war was turning point in the British view of Islam. The problem as they saw in India was that first Mughals have to be extriminated to prevent rallying round the throne. Hodson massacred all the princes and the Mughal Emperor Zafar Shah Bahadur was exiled to Burma and buried in Rangoon.

The next step was to prevent the unity of Hindus and Muslims to overthrow the Britsh rule of India. Here one W.W. Hunter comes into the picture. He commissioned an ethnographic survey of peoples of India and wrote a book on "Punjaabi Mussalman" (its on google books). The short thesis is that Pakjabis form a homogenous large group of Muslims and could be used to further the Crowns interests in India. One outgrowth of this was the large canals that were dug in West Punjab, which was Muslim populated and the later shift of capital from Calcutta to Delhi the historical capital of India and buidling New Delhi in the 20th century. Lord Kitchner was raising a large expeditionary force to fight in the Central Asia when the time is right and reorganised the Britsh Indian Army located many cantonments in what is known as West Pakistan. This got interrupted by the First World War and the collapse of Tsarist Russia. Kitchner died in asubmarine sinking in the Baltics(?)


Along comes another guy Wilfrid Scaewen Blunt who wrote "Future of Islam"(again in google books) and makes the further leap of faith and proposes that the British Queen liberate the hejaz from Ottomon rule and the West Punjabi Muslims will honor her as their leader and being the largest homogenous Muslim group would be the natural leaders of the liberated ummah. There are pictures of Arabs carrying rich Indian Muslims on Haj in planquins and scattering gold coins for dirt poor Arabs to pick up.

BTW it was a delegation of Indian Muslims that met Ibn Saud after the Ikhwan conquest of Hejaz and told him to be mindful of his new status as the "Custodian of the Two Mosques" (Hatred's Kingdom By Dore Gold)

All this was before oil was discovered in KSA by Americans in 1930s. Lowell Thomas the photographer of Lawrence of Arabia, got the rights to drill for oil and Aramaco was formed. In the middle of WWII, FDR met Ibn Saud on a ship and signed a pact for post War accomodation. One of the supposed items was creation of a new homeland for Indian Muslims.i.e Pakistan. The oil embargo after the 1973 Yom Kippur war led to the rags to riches rise of KSA and the funding of spread of Wahabi ideology in the world.

So the begining was by the Brits but the ball was carried by the US. All these were studied in the forum after 9/11 and umpteen pagesd were written on the subject.

Long ago I had submitted that the end trajectory for the British is to convert to Islam as they are running out of steam after losing the Empire.
Some of the members might recall this.


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