People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Sushupti »

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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

Philip wrote:That would legitimise China's illegal occupancy of Aksai Chin.Instead we should warn both Japan and SoKo that India would destroy any such installation which was illegally constructed in India's opinion and taking part in such a venture a "hostile" act on their part,which would have serious strategic and diplomatic repercussions and would place the lives of their nationals in harms way.
No, the point isn't that Japan or SoKo would do anything - they won't - but that the gesture will tell PRC that we're toying with them in response to their trial balloon. They want to provoke an emotional reaction from us; our goal is to not do so, and instead provoke it from them. Frankly, excitement about 'legitimizing their illegal occupation' amounts to getting worked up on our part.

As to why Japan or Korea won't do anything there - there's NOTHING in it for them. Both have massive investments and stake in the Indian market. They also do in China, but the Chinese can't replace every loss in India if we retaliate against Japan or SoKo entities. Further, they'll be painfully aware that by doing so they're just putting their eggs in one basket - a very fickle basket at that, where CPC can arbitrarily grab their technology and marketshare. All in all, earning our enmity would gain them nothing.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by ShauryaT »

Suraj wrote:A nice counter would be to talk to Japan and Korea and have them request PRC to include India in the observatory plan as a requirement for their joining. That should provoke an interesting response from PRC.
I like it, but to handle Philip's objection, India should ask Japan/Korea to request PRC that a representative from the Dalai Lama should join! That will get a reaction from them 400%.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Lilo »

Philip wrote:That would legitimise China's illegal occupancy of Aksai Chin.Instead we should warn both Japan and SoKo that India would destroy any such installation which was illegally constructed in India's opinion and taking part in such a venture a "hostile" act on their part,which would have serious strategic and diplomatic repercussions and would place the lives of their nationals in harms way.
Philip & Suraj ji,
Japan and SoKo are financing a massive project in Gilgit-Baltistan through the auspices of ADB and which (borrowing "concerned NGO activist" speak) has massive "environmental" and "seismic" implications.
It's the Diamer Bhasha Dam - 4,500MW with an effing Dam height of over 270 meters. Infact, Diamer district was the location for a recent Shia bus massacre and was recently clamped down in a "barbaric" army enforced curfew (borrowing a concerned "human rights activist" speak.)

So, Why this Kolaveri di in GOI, MEA and DDM reserved only for the Cheeni Observatory in Aksai Chin?

Apropos, below is a previous post in Indus treaty dagha.
Lilo wrote:Is there a way for India to delay the Diamer Basha Project ??

The ADB is being looked upon to finance the bulk of the estimated cost of USD 12 Billion with the blessing of US.
This dam is a more than a fitting case to be rejected by ADB - like how the dam in arunachal has been denied funding (on prodding by China) and based on flimsiest grounds on which china's territorial claim to arunachal rests.

Considering the explicit dejure (Shimla pact) and defacto disputed nature of POK,
Some serious prodding by India onto Japan (which holds the largest share of voting rights within ADB) should be looked into. Ofcourse China and US will oppose this and we may well fail but then the double standards of multilateral banking institutions dominated by US/China will be exposed and erode their legitimacy and capablity for future mischief .

What ever may be the current chankian strategy of GOI on this, leaving the Diamer Basha dam uncontested in international fora will be a big mistake on our part.

And if we are really in a position to delay this project , Pakis should be made to settle Siachen and Sir creek on our terms to let the Dam to be built - because the dam as such is not that a bad furniture to be coming along with the house when we retake POK. Further its massive height and head load will also make the martial pakjabis downstream literally quake with collective browning of pants during times of war.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

The Diamer-Basha dam project funding is backed and driven by the US and the western bloc in the ADB - they collectively have 29% of the voting power, more than twice that of Japan's 14% and that of India and PRC, which both have ~6.1% voting share. Japan and SoKo will follow the western bloc initiative, and PRC will happily play along.

Further, the approved ADB loan was a $7.5m feasibility study loan, with the US directly contributing another loan of the same amount. This wasn't much different from the ADB Arunachal Pradesh flap, where the initial loan funding led to Chinese protests, and subsequent loans were held back, with GoI itself increasing funding out of its budget instead. If we want to block funding for the Diamer-Basha project the target ought to be the US, not PRC, Japan or SoKo.

On the other hand, this observatory issue has no such broad economic imperatives; leaning on Japan on SoKo on this matter is different.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Rahul M »

we already have an observatory at nearby hanle. just ask the SoKos and Japs to come here. invite the chinis too.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Vikas »

Has India ever told China or Pakistan that it reserves the right to destroy any construction in PoK or Aksai Chin? Certain things are implied I guess in international diplomacy.
Then why so much heart burn over a non-event like observatory. When India will have sufficient power and balls, it will liberate both PoK and Aksia Chin & take over the observatory, ownership notwithstanding.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by shyam »

India's statement should be that it reserves the right to destroy constructions by unfriendly groups in all occupied area. In future it may include Tibet too.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by SSridhar »

Rahul M wrote:we already have an observatory at nearby hanle. just ask the SoKos and Japs to come here. invite the chinis too.
In fact, the Chinese, Koreans and the Japanese do not even have to go to Ladakh. This observatory is operated remotely from the comforts of Bengaluru.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by gunjur »

China may sink into oblivion trying to outrun America: Pravda

As per pravda, china may 'Literally' sink.
Over 50 Chinese cities are sinking into the ground because of the continuous subsidence of the soil. The excessive consumption of ground water is to blame.
Shanghai in 100 years sank by 3 meters, but in recent years the process has greatly accelerated
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Roperia »

China reacts cautiously, says India not rival


BEIJING/NEW DELHI: "China has taken note of reports on India's missile launch. The two countries have sound relationship. "During the (recently held) BRICS meeting (in Delhi) the leadership had consensus to take the relationship further and to push forward bilateral strategic cooperative partnership," Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Liu Weimin told a media briefing in Beijing when asked about the launch.

In Delhi, the diplomatic sources in the Chinese embassy said the "Agni-V launch can give rise to another round of arms race in this part of the world." (Shameless chinis! What happened to your principles when you gave all that nuclear and ballistic missile tech to pakis?)

They were also critical of the media commentary on the successful launch of the nuclear capable 5000 km-range Agni-V missile, saying it sounded provocative. Asked whether China was concerned as most of the country would come under the Agni's range, Liu said in Beijing that "both the countries are emerging powers. We are not rivals. We are cooperative partners. We should cherish the hard earned momentum of cooperation."

To another question whether it would affect the regional stability, he said "we hope Asian countries can contribute to peace and stability."
Agni-V launch: India demonstrates ICBM capability; China reacts cautiously, says India not rival - The Times of India
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by nvishal »

Indian and western media seem to have gone crazy after india's missile test.

Many of the headlines are bluntly stating the target as china.

The missile is not something new. It is just a modded version of the old agni series.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

The hectoring GlobalTimes article about Agni-V from PRC was actually quite tame. The English language site is the more measured one; the Chinese language Global Times (Huanqiu Shibao in Chinese) articles are far more strident, being one of the more nationalist Chinese language papers out there. Global Times is the tabloid version of People's Daily (Renmin Ribao), which is the CPC's official mouthpiece. Unlike the official People's Daily, the tabloid has more latitude to be bold.

Try running the Chinese version of the site through Google translate. To search easily for article references to India, look for the characters "印度" , or more easily, the first character 印 ("Yin").

There are several articles on India, complaining about everything from A-V to the US-India ties to Arunachal Pradesh, which is referred to there as South Tibet (Xizang Nanlu). The tone of the articles are all bold and accusatory, the reference to us being the word 'Asan' as translated by google. If you get past the continuous angry fingerwagging tone, it sounds quite funny actually - like climactic Tollywood movie dialogues.

It would be wise for us to spend more time reading the Chinese language news, even if badly machine translated. There's a significant gulf between the English and Chinese language versions of the same sites, GlobalTimes being just one example. It gives a better understanding of why the drones behave the way they do here - starting out with genteel condescension and then losing it when the plot goes south.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by JwalaMukhi »

China is overreacting. Where is the statement from India's minister assuring that India will not be supplying any missiles including this one to pakistanis to tackle terrorism. Pakistanis are already feeling very confident because of the chinese supplied "new clear weapons" to tackle terrorism.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

India still has to go a long way in missile technology. It is just a matter of time and India will surly match the best in the missile technology.
India would definitely like to be friends with China but China invaded India in 1962 nullifying the Panchsheel Pact and on top of that is arming Pakistan (which is a failed state) to teeth. China should instill confidence in India rather than issuing veiled threats over the South China Sea issue. Talking of double standards seems frivolous when geopolitics in involved.

If China continues to placate Pakistan and posture itself as a bellicose neighbour ignoring genuine Indian concerns i don't see an Indo-China new world order being born any time soon. It is an absolute necessity to unsettle nefarious designs of some western powers which want to pitch India and China against one another. Why isnt China taking the lead is something that needs to be looked into.. Is it the fear of US influence in Pakistan?
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

My wife is an academic at the University of Alabama. I have seen several letters to Chinese grad students and professors from the Chinese government. While I do not read Chinese, the people tell me that they say that all conscientious Chinese citizens should support the Republican Party with donations because it is the GOP that China wants to work with. There are instructions as how to make these contributions without getting into trouble --- for example, donating to GOP "educational" PACs or giving other people money to make the actual donation. The Chinese people we know scoff at the idea and say that it shows that the Chinese government is out of touch. But who knows how many other Chinese are quietly doing what their government requests.

The GOP needs to get out of bed with the Communist Chinese government and stop giving them our tax dollars.
Check this in a comment
http://world-news.newsvine.com/_news/20 ... t#comments
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

Global Times Chinese article on A-V, through machine translation. We need to strive to read their Chinese language articles, not the tamer English ones.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Venkarl »

Philip wrote:That would legitimise China's illegal occupancy of Aksai Chin.Instead we should warn both Japan and SoKo that India would destroy any such installation which was illegally constructed in India's opinion and taking part in such a venture a "hostile" act on their part,which would have serious strategic and diplomatic repercussions and would place the lives of their nationals in harms way.
This is exactly what China wants us to do. Have us warn them and build the gap between us and 2 Democratic countries. None of us(SoKo, Japs & US) should fall for this trap.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by brihaspati »

Venkarl wrote:
Philip wrote:That would legitimise China's illegal occupancy of Aksai Chin.Instead we should warn both Japan and SoKo that India would destroy any such installation which was illegally constructed in India's opinion and taking part in such a venture a "hostile" act on their part,which would have serious strategic and diplomatic repercussions and would place the lives of their nationals in harms way.
This is exactly what China wants us to do. Have us warn them and build the gap between us and 2 Democratic countries. None of us(SoKo, Japs & US) should fall for this trap.
Actually we should thank SoKo and Japan and China for investing in infrastructure in POK. There should have been OpEd's stating how grateful India was for such "FDI"'s from the three into Indian territory, since it would all come in handy in the future for Indian regimes. Just request that the quality of the work be good, so that it will last.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by brihaspati »

Acharya wrote:
My wife is an academic at the University of Alabama. I have seen several letters to Chinese grad students and professors from the Chinese government. While I do not read Chinese, the people tell me that they say that all conscientious Chinese citizens should support the Republican Party with donations because it is the GOP that China wants to work with. There are instructions as how to make these contributions without getting into trouble --- for example, donating to GOP "educational" PACs or giving other people money to make the actual donation. The Chinese people we know scoff at the idea and say that it shows that the Chinese government is out of touch. But who knows how many other Chinese are quietly doing what their government requests.

The GOP needs to get out of bed with the Communist Chinese government and stop giving them our tax dollars.
Check this in a comment
http://world-news.newsvine.com/_news/20 ... t#comments
Democrats need not panic so early on to try to use China against the Repubs. Obama is still the best horse in race [agreed it could change by the middle of August]. China's needs are looked after anyway by the admin and so-called military-industrial complex of USA - regardless of which admin is in place. Dems were not that unfriendly to China.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

That is not the point. The threat of China to US is a fake one. They have used China against India for the last 50 years and most of the Indian elite are not even aware of this. Lot of Indian elite consider US to be friendly to Indian interest but have no clue.

There is also the religion which has been supported by the republicans who consider PRC to be their own. So this deep US connection inside China is here to stay for long. They will support even PRC occupation of Tibet and help them from behind to keep their economy stable and even support them in the event of war with India.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Prem »

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... _for_china
April Is the Cruelest Month … for ChinaBeijing's leaders are finding out the hard way that being a superpower isn't all it's cracked up to be.
For China's cautious leadership, no news is good news -- and this has been a bad month. Rising tensions with the Philippines in the South China Seas have reached a point that Beijing has deployed ships. The ceasefire in Syria seems to be fraying -- again. Sudan and South Sudan are again engaged in armed conflict. And the United States, whose decline the Chinese leadership continues to trumpet, continues to pivot closer to Asia and is on the brink of dispatching an ambassador to Burma. The only good news seems to be North Korea's failed rocket launch. ... What is most threatening to Chinese leaders, however, is the scandal of deposed Chongqing Party Secretary Bo Xilai, arguably the biggest domestic political crisis in China since 1989. The year 2012 appears unlikely to play out at home or abroad the way the Chinese leadership had hoped -- with a smooth political succession underscoring China's rise to a global power. The state media directives of the past week suggest the Communist Party is scrambling to impose a return to normalcy; it's likely that the government will be very risk-averse in the coming months as it tries to contain the fallout from Bo's ouster.
More diverse actors, too, are pressuring Beijing on human rights issues. Just in the past month, China has had to contend with pressure closer to home: In early April, Japanese Diet members adopted a highly unusual resolution on Tibet calling for the Chinese government to resume talks with the Dalai Lama. Beijing also found itself forced to respond to critical South Korean press reports that China had forcibly repatriated North Koreans; in response, Beijing allowed a handful of North Koreans sheltered in the South Korean consulates in China to depart for SeoulMany of the voices in China who could suggest an alternate course have been muzzled. It remains difficult for the Chinese media to press its government to act more responsibly internationally. According to the domestic press, the Philippines is the aggressor in the South China Seas skirmishes; China remains a "firm advocate of peace" in Syria and has "made unremitting efforts" to "resolve the current crisis," while the London Book Fair "opens a new chapter in nation's cultural exchange." There is precious little discussion of the occupation of the Quito Embassy or of the Japanese resolution on Tibet. Weibo and other online platforms provide an opportunity for some to debate these issues, suggesting healthy domestic interest in foreign policy. And even in state media, cracks are beginning to show: After an unprecedented evacuation of more than 35,000 Chinese people from Libya, critiques were published suggesting that the government had failed citizens overseas. But this remains a far cry from allowing -- or soliciting -- broad public input on policy.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Prem »

Coment in the above link
tamagawa_D9 5 pts China's efforts at supplanting American soft power strike me as... how to put this.. really damn creepy. The best example is Beijing using a state-backed production company to finance Hollywood
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Prem »

No storm can shake China’s composure
http://english.people.com.cn/90883/7794288.html
The Philippines recently took a series of irresponsible actions in the waters around the Huangyan Island, which is an inherent part of China’s territory. Its irresponsible move affected the peace and tranquility in the waters, and could threaten China’s diplomatic relations with neighboring countries. China’s foreign policy toward neighboring countries features the creation of an amicable, secure, and prosperous neighborhood. This is neither a high-sounding statement nor a temporary policy. Creating a harmonious and peaceful neighborhood and seeking common development with neighboring countries is a natural choice for peacefully rising China, and is also one of the country’s long-term goals. China has won the respect and understanding of most neighboring countries for its ability to control itself in the face of severe challenges or complex situations. By exercising self-control, the country has carried out fruitful cooperation with more and more countries and regions, and helped people grasp the role of a rapidly rising power in the international arena. :eek: The Huangyan Island is an inherent part of China’s territory, and China's sovereignty over the island has full legal basis. Safeguarding territorial sovereignty is a sacred mission of Chinese diplomacy, and even the slightest violation of the country’s sovereignty will not be tolerated.
Great national strength is neither China’s fault nor the weak link of Chinese diplomacy. Any country that carries out vexatious acts is doomed to be hit hard no matter if it is weak, no matter how pitiful it pretends to be. In the Huangyan Island dispute, there is no such thing as the strong bullying the weak. China’s determination to defend its territorial sovereignty will not be hindered by the “China threat theory.”
( These guys are delusionals)
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

On par with China, India doesn't inform neighbor about launch
India did not formally inform China about the launch of its intermediate-range ballistic missile Agni-5 from the Odisha coast yesterday, although it did notify all the other big powers about the event. According to government officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity, China was the only permanent member of the UN Security Council that Delhi did not speak to about the launch.

In fact, in the wake of the highly successful test that makes India the only developing country on a par with other missile powers like the US, China, Russia and France, and brings most of China under its radar, the ministry of external affairs continues to deliberately down-play the event. The Agni-V launch finds no mention at all on its website.

The officials pointed out that a general notice to marine traffic (NOTAM) had been issued and certainly with the Indian media widely talking about it, “there was nothing secret about the launch of the Agni-5.”

Delhi’s refusal to beat its chest is part of its recent pragmatic approach to foreign and security affairs, borrowed from the Deng Xiaoping school of thought, that it should keep its head down while pursuing a goal of making India a country to be reckoned with, which includes the maintenance of high economic growth.

According to Srikanth Kondapalli, professor of Chinese studies at the Jawaharlal Nehru University in Delhi, “Even if you have hundreds of Agni-5 missiles, the fact is that a nuclear weapon is a political weapon, it is a deterrent, it is never going to be used. However, the successful launch of the missile demonstrates to the Chinese that if you cross the red lines, India will have to think twice.”

That is why, government officials said, Delhi would continue to engage with the Chinese government as if it were business as usual. “The Chinese respect strength. We are not here to poke each other in the eye, but to continue to engage as equals,” one official said.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

http://www.phayul.com/news/article.aspx?id=31181&t=1


Japanese lawmakers tell China to “fundamentally rethink” Tibet policy

Phayul[Thursday, April 05, 2012 23:29]
DHARAMSHALA, April 5: Sixty Japanese Parliamentarians from across party lines unanimously adopted a resolution expressing grave concern over the ongoing wave of self-immolations in Tibet and called on China to “fundamentally rethink” its approach towards Tibet.

“Years of restrictions on Tibetans’ rights are the underlying causes of the protests by way of self-immolations,” the resolution read. “It is clearly time for the Chinese government to fundamentally rethink its approach by listening to and addressing the Tibetans’ grievances.”

The adoption of the resolution coincided with Kalon Tripa Dr Lobsang Sangay’s maiden visit to the island nation as Tibet’s de facto Prime Minister.

“We call on the Chinese government to respond positively to outstanding visit request from the Special Rapporteur on the freedom of religion or belief and halt the repression of human rights immediately,” the Japanese lawmakers said in the resolution.

33 Tibetans in Tibet have set themselves on fire since 2009, demanding the return of His Holiness the Dalai Lama from exile and freedom in Tibet. Chinese security personnel have resorted to open firing to quell peaceful protests by unarmed Tibetans, resulting in several deaths and injuries in recent months.

The Japanese parliamentarians, while expressing “serious concern” over the self-immolation protests in Tibet, called on the Chinese government to resume “direct and result-oriented dialogue” with the Dharamshala based Central Tibetan Administration.

The resolution further urge Beijing to disclose the whereabouts and well being of Tibetans arrested in connection with the self-immolation protests and also pushed for independent media access to Tibetan areas.

According to the official website of the CTA, Dr Sangay, on the last day of five-day visit, briefed the parliamentarians in detail about the situation in Tibet and answered their questions.

Kalon Tripa visited Japan at the invitation of former Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

Besides speaking to foreign correspondents in Tokyo and interacting exclusively with a group of Chinese overseas journalists, Dr Sangay delivered a talk on “Global warming with special emphasis on the fragile Tibetan environment” and addressed a conference titled “Freedom in Asia and the Wave of Democratisation,” organised by a leading Japanese think-tank.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Prem »

http://english.people.com.cn/90883/7794713.html
Russia-China joint naval exercise starts
,
April 22 (Xinhua) -- Russian naval deputy chief of staff Rear Admiral Leonid Sukhanov announced here on Sunday the official start of the joint exercise with the Chinese navy.Ding Yiping, deputy commander of the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Navy, delivered exercise tasks.The war game is scheduled to be held from April 22 to 27 in the Yellow Sea of the Pacific Ocean
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Christopher Sidor »

Jhujar wrote:http://english.people.com.cn/90883/7794713.html
Russia-China joint naval exercise starts
,
April 22 (Xinhua) -- Russian naval deputy chief of staff Rear Admiral Leonid Sukhanov announced here on Sunday the official start of the joint exercise with the Chinese navy.Ding Yiping, deputy commander of the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Navy, delivered exercise tasks.The war game is scheduled to be held from April 22 to 27 in the Yellow Sea of the Pacific Ocean
The image below is the generally expected boundary of the yellow sea. Observe the location of Korea and Shanghai. Also Japan is just a stone throw away from the Korea Strait on the right.
Image

This is the same area in which US was planning to conduct its naval exercise with South Korea, after North Korea sank a South Korean naval vessel.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

Chinese Military: Home > > International > > Reading
India’s successful launch of the fire five Chinese situation is difficult, or permanent loss of the territory of southern Tibet
http://www.cnmilitary.info/indias-succe ... ern-tibet/
However, according to the analysis of other media, the fire of the range of -5 may be up to 8000 km. It seems that India’s ambitions can not be small convergence did not like what he said, specifically tailored for China, Pakistan, but otherwise Foreign media analysis, India to conceal the true range of the Agni -5, in order to avoid provoking the United States, Russia and other countries, a range of 5000 km, just them and throw the magic potion. On TV, see Zhang Zhaozhong general analysis, that will range from 5000 km to 8000 km is technically not difficult, only need to add a fuel. Successful test-firing of Agni-5, but also to India’s success into the intercontinental missile club.

fire will include most major cities in China including Beijing, Shanghai, into the Indian missile within range of -5. China suffered nuclear threat from India, put forward higher requirements for China’s anti-missile system. Agni -5 equipped with the most advanced guidance system, manufactured by DRDO against distant targets with alarming accuracy. It is not only a high precision, and highly mobile, mobile launchers in the road! India has nuclear long-range strike capability, giving a touch on the Indian god of oil, let them excited.

just decided to many factors of the outcome of war, in fact, even with long-range nuclear strike capability, not to say that the hands of the all-conquering, invincible magic. Long-range nuclear strike capability is only used to deter others, and to the equipment of their own venture. The face of India to master long-range nuclear strike capability, the Chinese do not have too fear! Chairman Mao has long taught us: “To despise the enemy strategically and tactically to attach importance to the enemy!” U.S. imperialism’s intercontinental ballistic missiles to carry nuclear warheads, all the time targeting China’s major cities, but also seen him throw a few over. China has many nuclear bombs targeting U.S. imperialism and other countries, nuclear weapons is a big country in the hands of a killer, less than a last resort when no one will easily open the nuclear Pandora’s box. Because we all understand, once we open the nuclear Pandora’s box, nuclear magic will be brought to the world the devastating disaster! And even to the destruction of Earth.

recently in India for a series of acts of view, many places in China as the biggest enemy and opponents, or to care for the last! India did not give up, always keep in mind 62 years, the shame of defeat, and always wants to revenge. Spans one of the most difficult to cross the divide – territorial disputes between China, India, Southern Tibet to become the biggest obstacle to affect normalization of relations, India.
statement
Kanishka
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Kanishka »

Indian Democracy, Chinese Autocracy
Debate on India & China Economy & Future.
Published Jun 21, 2011 (51 minutes). TVO.
Mods please delete if posted/discussed before.
svinayak
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

Very intersting

http://www.chinaintheworld.com/2012/04/ ... se-expert/
China to return to peaceful rise: expert
April 21, 2012 by Michael Walsh | 0 comments
BEING NEIGHBORLY::Chong-Pin Lin said the aggressive stance China adopted beginning in 2009 has backfired, and that it was partly spurred by Bo Xilai’s rise

By Shih Hsiu-chuan / Staff reporter

Sun, Apr 22, 2012

After seeing that its assertive measures have harmed its national interests, China is expected to partially return to its previous policy to improve relations with neighboring countries, cooperate more with the US and be patient on the Taiwan issue, an expert said.
Chong-Pin Lin (林中斌), a professor at Tamkang University’s Graduate Institute of International Affairs and Strategic Studies, presented an analysis of Chinese diplomacy’s shift in 2009 — from its previous pursuits of good relations with neighbors, known as “three neighbor” policy, to “assertiveness” — at a forum held in Taipei earlier this week.
Lin said China had a bountiful year in 2008 as its diplomacy advanced under the principle of a “peaceful rise” proposed by Chinese President Hu Jintao’s (胡錦濤) chief adviser, Zheng Bijian (鄭必堅), when “there was no country in the world that was not having good relations with China or was not improving relations with China.
With the peaceful rise approach and the “three neighbor” policy — make the neighbors feel secure, make them friends of China and make them prosper — China secured an agreement with Japan incorporating 17 items of cooperation, signed agreements with Russia and Vietnam on disputed borders and launched the three direct links with Taiwan in 2008, Lin said.
“Suddenly, everything changed in 2009,” Lin said.
Lin said that three factors were behind Beijing’s rising assertiveness after 2009: the decline of former Chinese vice president Zeng Qinghong’s (曾慶紅) influence, China’s post-financial crisis hubris and its domestic tensions.
China’s assertiveness has clearly backfired, Lin said, saying that India’s stance became tougher, Vietnam welcomed US navy ships, and Malaysia and the Philippines became less receptive to Beijing’s appeals and more ready to adopt a common ASEAN approach intended to counter Beijing’s assertiveness regarding fisheries, resources and sovereignty claims.
Other examples were that Australia agreed to host a US Marine Corps unit, Singapore broadened its cooperation with the US, as did Malaysia, and Burma radically shifted its domestic and foreign policy approach toward closer ties with the West and distancing from Beijing, while only Cambodia and Laos remained aligned with China as de facto satellites, he added.
Despite this fallout, China continued its assertiveness, partly because of the decline of Zeng, “the key figure of pragmatic policymaking” responsible for not only domestic reform, but for improving relations with Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong and the US, Lin said.

The fact that China quickly recovered from the 2008-2009 global financial crisis together with the impression that US officials and academics were despondent about the US economy, which was manipulated by hawkish elements to bolster Chinese national pride, placed pressure on Hu and Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao (溫家寶), who had been accused of meekness abroad, to take assertive actions, Lin said.

Lin said the challenges posed to Hu and Wen by former Chongqing party boss Bo Xilai (薄熙來) since 2009 was also a factor, because China always externalizes its internal conflicts by taking tough action abroad.
Bo challenged Hu and Wen on domestic policy after he began his “Chongqing model” campaign to “strike the black” and “sing the red” in 2009, and his supporters and allies took that to the international sphere because they comprised ultraconservative and nationalist elements, Lin said.

The “strike the black and sing the red” campaigns were efforts in Chongqing to crack down mafia elements and corrupt officials and to promote communist culture.
As the dust of the Bo incident settles, China will “partially return to the ‘three neighbor’ policy” and its cooperation will outweigh its conflicts with Washington, Lin said.
The guideline dou er bu po (鬥而不破) set by the late Deng Xiao-ping (鄧小平) in May 1982 that China “struggles with rivals, but makes sure not to break the relationships” will be observed even more carefully, Lin said.
“As the Bo incident gradually settles down, we see several things happening,” Lin said, pointing to the response to the Wukan village incident in December last year, the announcement of a project to expand private lending in Wenzhou and the way China has handled the latest standoff with the Philippines.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by svinayak »

Chinese newspaper, Global Times(Beijing), hit out at Western countries for double standards for not condemning the test firing of the Agni-V. “The West chooses to overlook India’s disregard of nuclear and missile control treaties,” the editorial said. “The West remains silent on the fact that India’s military spending increased by 17 percent.”

This Indian non compliance to the global treaties is a major kujli for a country like PRC which was tricked into signing the treaty
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Suraj »

China has for the last few decades depended on three factors to retain its relative power differential over India:
* Arm Pakistan to divert our military, strategic and political energy towards them, while in the process boxing us into a regional rivalry role.
* Use the consequences of our actions to constrain us. The existing tech denial and export control regimes played that role. They negotiated their way inside and used it against us.
* Maintain an aura of hard power and control over the terms of debate by creating issues and demanding settlements, while we reacted.

The first method has been hampered by Pakistan's own progressive descent into chaos. The third has been progressively eroding, as we build a more robust response to their currently much superior standoff ability. The second option suddenly stopped being available on April 19; to their, and admittedly even my surprise, not only did no one oppose it, but many sources mentioned that it was China-specific. In this regard, the recent efforts on our part to join these control regimes makes sense.

On a related note, I'm struck by the extraordinary lack of maturity of the Chinese language press. Never mind the naked propaganda, or even the poorly argued 'dwarf A-V' argument that seems to presume their readers (PRC citizens) are all dumb and can't see through the poor logic. The characterization of other nations is blatantly crude; the language is like some Indian magazine liberally dehumanizing them and calling them ch*nks . Sounded like the kind of pre-PC era WW2 US propaganda posters of 'Kill every last vermin Jap!' or the like. Sure it's a tabloid and it's machine translation, but the tone is unmistakable. It reminded me of one of botox babe's early fiery speeches.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by shyam »

Where are the drones, when we need them? :twisted:
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Kanishka »

shyam wrote:Where are the drones, when we need them? :twisted:
They are on stand by mode.. waiting for instructions.
I think the implications of this test is beginning to sink in... expect upping of the ante in coming days and months. Enjoy!
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

"On a related note, I'm struck by the extraordinary lack of maturity of the Chinese language press. Never mind the naked propaganda, or even the poorly argued 'dwarf A-V' argument that seems to presume their readers (PRC citizens) are all dumb and can't see through the poor logic. The characterization of other nations is blatantly crude; the language is like some Indian magazine liberally dehumanizing them and calling them ch*nks . Sounded like the kind of pre-PC era WW2 US propaganda posters of 'Kill every last vermin Jap!' or the like. Sure it's a tabloid and it's machine translation, but the tone is unmistakable. It reminded me of one of botox babe's early fiery speeches."

Well said, and it applies to the legion of China supporting drones who appear on Indian message boards. There are a few like Badabing, Supercaste, Borat et al who have been posting crude, Nazi like messages on the Times of India website, under the recent Aksai Chin issue. I feel like something of a loner arguing with them. Then again, maybe other Indians/persons of Indian origin are wiser than me in simply ignoring such garbage. In a way, responding dignifies it.
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by Hari Seldon »

From twitter. TIFWIW

>>Reuven Cohen ‏ @ruv
China's 70 richest law makers are worth a combined $90 billion. The top 600 US law makers $7.5 billion. Qinghou @ $5.6bln Vs Romney @ $200mm

If true, wow. Or what?
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by sooraj »

Acharya wrote:Chinese Military: Home > > International > > Reading
India’s successful launch of the fire five Chinese situation is difficult, or permanent loss of the territory of southern Tibet
http://www.cnmilitary.info/indias-succe ... ern-tibet/
However, according to the analysis of other media, the fire of the range of -5 may be up to 8000 km. It seems that India’s ambitions can not be small convergence did not like what he said, specifically tailored for China, Pakistan, but otherwise Foreign media analysis, India to conceal the true range of the Agni -5, in order to avoid provoking the United States, Russia and other countries, a range of 5000 km, just them and throw the magic potion. On TV, see Zhang Zhaozhong general analysis, that will range from 5000 km to 8000 km is technically not difficult, only need to add a fuel. Successful test-firing of Agni-5, but also to India’s success into the intercontinental missile club.

fire will include most major cities in China including Beijing, Shanghai, into the Indian missile within range of -5. China suffered nuclear threat from India, put forward higher requirements for China’s anti-missile system. Agni -5 equipped with the most advanced guidance system, manufactured by DRDO against distant targets with alarming accuracy :D . It is not only a high precision, and highly mobile, mobile launchers in the road! India has nuclear long-range strike capability, giving a touch on the Indian god of oil, let them excited.

just decided to many factors of the outcome of war, in fact, even with long-range nuclear strike capability, not to say that the hands of the all-conquering, invincible magic. Long-range nuclear strike capability is only used to deter others, and to the equipment of their own venture. The face of India to master long-range nuclear strike capability, the Chinese do not have too fear! Chairman Mao has long taught us: “To despise the enemy strategically and tactically to attach importance to the enemy!” U.S. imperialism’s intercontinental ballistic missiles to carry nuclear warheads, all the time targeting China’s major cities, but also seen him throw a few over. China has many nuclear bombs targeting U.S. imperialism and other countries, nuclear weapons is a big country in the hands of a killer, less than a last resort when no one will easily open the nuclear Pandora’s box. Because we all understand, once we open the nuclear Pandora’s box, nuclear magic will be brought to the world the devastating disaster! And even to the destruction of Earth.

recently in India for a series of acts of view, many places in China as the biggest enemy and opponents, or to care for the last! India did not give up, always keep in mind 62 years, the shame of defeat, and always wants to revenge. Spans one of the most difficult to cross the divide – territorial disputes between China, India, Southern Tibet to become the biggest obstacle to affect normalization of relations, India.
statement

Agni -5 equipped with the most advanced guidance system, manufactured by DRDO against distant targets with alarming accuracy :D
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Re: People's Republic of China, Dec. 27 2011

Post by pankajs »

Chinese daily calls for 'small-scale war' against Philippines
As the stand off between the Chinese and Philippine navies continue over the disputed islands in the South China Sea, a state run Chinese daily has said that Beijing should be prepared to wage a "small scale war" with Manila, besides imposing sanctions.
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