Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 28 Oct 2014 10:38

A_Gupta wrote:Understanding British Sikh politics:
http://www.publicspirit.org.uk/who-spea ... ish-sikhs/

Master Arun, you look like a socially equipped person. Can you find a non-forum way of getting in touch? I want to see if you have some spare bandwidth for wiki/facebook/dailykos and the like.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 28 Oct 2014 17:11

I'll find out how to get in touch. But this about British Sikhs was just - looking for who that Sikh is that stood on the stage with Bilawal at the MilliMoronMarch on the STFUP thread, looked for the names of UK Sikh politicians; came across this article, and posted it. I make no claim to scholarship, only to intense curiosity.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 28 Oct 2014 18:53

The Guardian ‏@guardian 2h2 hours ago

Police investigating exploitation of young girls arrest 11 in Manchester http://gu.com/p/42zfh/tw

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 28 Oct 2014 19:02

The Independent ‏@Independent 2h2 hours ago

UK child poverty is 'soaring due to Government's austerity measures' http://ind.pn/10wHYdC

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 28 Oct 2014 20:04

The Guardian ‏@guardian 1h1 hour ago

British women are still terrified of reporting rape, says Jinan Younis http://gu.com/p/42mff/tw

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 28 Oct 2014 22:05

A_Gupta wrote:I'll find out how to get in touch. But this about British Sikhs was just - looking for who that Sikh is that stood on the stage with Bilawal at the MilliMoronMarch on the STFUP thread, looked for the names of UK Sikh politicians; came across this article, and posted it. I make no claim to scholarship, only to intense curiosity.

Pakistan based Dal Khalsa, UK
http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/to ... nst-india/

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 28 Oct 2014 23:11

http://www.dnaindia.com/world/report-da ... ty-2030040

David Cameron labels Hindu encyclopaedia as 'great contribution to humanity'

British Prime Minister David Cameron termed the Encyclopaedia of Hinduism as a 'great contribution to humanity', adding that he is going to make use of this compilation. "This encyclopaedia is a great contribution to humanity. I love the saying, 'Let all noble thoughts come from all directions'. I am going to use this. This is beautiful," said Prime Minister Cameron, while launching the encyclopaedia here on Monday.

How very kamoonal .. Can some one let Pankaj Mishra know that his BIL (I think) has taken a liking to kamoonal fascist writings and he needs to write an op-ed in NYT denouncing that.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 29 Oct 2014 01:20

The Guardian ‏@guardian 2h2 hours ago

Exploited garment workers in India should have recourse to UK courts, campaigners say http://gu.com/p/42zeg/tw

Flawed fabrics, a report by the Centre for Research on Multinational Corporations (Somo) and the India Committee of the Netherlands (ICN), shows that in spinning mills in Tamil Nadu, in south India, teenage girls and young women are working under conditions that amount to slavery and the worst forms of child labour.

...
The modern-day slavery bill is going through parliament now, and the government has announced that it will table an amendment to require companies to report on what they are doing to eradicate slavery in their supply chains. This is a welcome development, but parliament needs to make sure that the new law leads to real change on the ground.

However, transparency isn’t enough, and will not directly help the victims. Where there have been clear abuses of people’s rights that result wholly or partly from the decisions of UK companies, the victims should be able to get justice and see the companies held to account in the UK. This would change the culture of impunity within brands’ and retailers’ sourcing decisions.

Access to justice in the UK could provide victims with a remedy as a parallel option to the slow, sometimes biased justice systems in low-cost sourcing countries.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 29 Oct 2014 06:14

Shreeman wrote:
A_Gupta wrote:Understanding British Sikh politics:
http://www.publicspirit.org.uk/who-spea ... ish-sikhs/
Master Arun, you look like a socially equipped person. Can you find a non-forum way of getting in touch? I want to see if you have some spare bandwidth for wiki/facebook/dailykos and the like.

You have a blog, with moderated comments?
I posted a comment there. Please be sure to moderate it

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 29 Oct 2014 06:30

^^^ An un-moderated comment has been deleted. Please feel free to follow up.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 29 Oct 2014 19:36

http://www.theguardian.com/football/201 ... CMP=twt_gu

FA official banned for telling female referee her place was ‘in the kitchen’

The Northumberland County FA vice-president, John Cummings, has been suspended for four months for telling a female referee “a woman’s place is in the kitchen and not on a football field”.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 31 Oct 2014 00:33

A_Gupta wrote:Understanding British Sikh politics:
http://www.publicspirit.org.uk/who-spea ... ish-sikhs/

interesting link.
I can't speak for all the Gurudwara's in the UK. However in my experience caste is a huge factor in support for khalistan.
I used to live in Southall. The gurudwaras that are against this nonsense are the Ramgarhria and Ravidass temples.
The main large one which is on Havelock road is Jat controlled and is all for khalistan.

The east African Sikhs I have known are not really into it, they get on fine with their Gujarati brothers from Africa and talk about old times.

I think some real Indian Sikhs need to visit them to apprise them of the situation.
The entire thing was a massive £uck up by congress and the Gandhis.
Terrible tragedy, however both sides need to take a good look at themselves.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 31 Oct 2014 02:16

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... seats.html

Labour faces electoral wipeout in Scotland as new poll shows party will hold just four seats

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 31 Oct 2014 23:08

Labour has surrendered principles for votes

Maureen Lipman abandons Ed Miliband over Israel

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... srael.html

Shanmukh · Post by **Shanmukh** » 01 Nov 2014 00:46

Haresh wrote:Labour has surrendered principles for votes

Maureen Lipman abandons Ed Miliband over Israel

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... srael.html

The same thing is going to happen in US as well. Muslims will soon outnumber Jews in the US, and the support for the Palestinians is going to rise, and support for Israel will fall. With the Left-Islamist alliance becoming more and more powerful, India, Israel, etc are all going to feel the heat. Expect US & UK to join hands with the Islamists to screw the rest of the world.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 03 Nov 2014 11:44

Frau Merkel shows Cameron the little finger!
Frankly,you can't have your cake and eat it too.All the nations of the EU have to abide by common laws and agreements on migrant labour,etc.Britain can't be the odd man out.Either it quits,as UKIP adviocates and plows its lonely furrow,or stay and get integrated more with the EU,watering down its independence of action and irrelevance of its parliament whose powers are constantly being usurped by Brusels.

Auf wiedersehen, Britain: 'Merkel ready to cast UK adrift' over quotas on migrant workers
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 34484.html

[quote
The German Chancellor, Angela Merkel, has warned David Cameron she would be prepared to see Britain leave the EU rather than give in to his demands for new quotas on migrant workers coming to the UK.

Ms Merkel is understood to have told the Prime Minister he is approaching a “point of no return” where his demands for changes in Britain’s relationship with the EU are not acceptable to Germany.

Her comments come ahead of a key speech, currently being worked on in Downing Street, in which Mr Cameron will spell out his plans for EU Labour market reform as part of his proposed renegotiation of Britain’s membership.

Last month Downing Street sources suggested that the Prime Minister was looking at a system to control EU migration by capping the national insurance numbers issued to foreign workers.

But the out-going President of the European Commission suggested that such a proposal would be incompatible with the principle of freedom of movement which was an “essential” part of the union. This is a sentiment shared by Ms Merkel.

Der Spiegel cited sources in Berlin saying that if Mr Cameron insisted on limiting the number of immigrants from other EU states, “there will be no going back”. It quoted the sources as saying: “Should Cameron persist [in this plan], Chancellor Angela Merkel would abandon her efforts to keep Britain in the EU. With that a point of no return would be reached. That would be it then.”

Speaking after a meeting of the European Council last month, Ms Merkel said Germany would not interfere with the basic principle of freedom of movement, but emphasised: “That doesn’t mean that there aren’t various problems.”

Ms Merkel added that she had discussed these problems with Mr Cameron, including benefits for unemployed EU migrants. She added: “However, it is my view that this must be resolved in a way that on the one hand allows us to tackle abuses, but on the other, does not deviate from the basic principle of freedom of movement in Europe.”

Yesterday there were signs that the German warning may have been heeded by Mr Cameron. The Sunday Times reported that the Prime Minister was looking at ways to stretch existing EU rules “to their limits” rather than insist on measures that would require a treaty change.

This could include deporting foreign nationals after three months if they had not found a job and were unable to support themselves.

“The focus is on drawing up a German-compliant package of measures,” one minister said. “Cameron needs to square Merkel or we won’t get anything. We’ve got to stretch the existing rules to their limits. There is no right in the EU to stay somewhere if you can’t support yourself after three months. That will be part of the package, I have no doubt.”

Mr Cameron has said he will hold an in-or-out referendum on EU membership in 2017 if he wins the May general election. He has said he wants Britain to remain inside a reformed EU but it is far from clear that the reforms he wants will be accepted by other members.
][/quote]

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 03 Nov 2014 14:40

London Mayor Boris Johnson says India was fortunate to be ruled by British

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/bo ... 33222.html …

Here's the exact quote:

"He would have been very proud at the continuing legacy of Britain in those places around the world, and particularly I think he would have been amazed at India, the world's largest democracy, and a stark contrast with other less fortunate places that haven't had the benefit of British rule, if I can say this on the record.... why not? It's true, it's true.”

In the book Mr Johnson claims in his book that Churchill viewed the Raj as a “restraint on barbarous practises – suttee, bride-price”. However, as a review in the Spectator points out, Suttee (or sati) was banned in the Raj by early 1829 and there is some scholarship that suggests the imperial presence actually exacerbated the practise, rather than curtailing it.

Pukeworthy as usual. jeez.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 03 Nov 2014 16:57

^^^

Tsk tsk. Proud of India not because of British rule. But because despite it you old senile little clumsy fool Boris.
And careful holding Churchill's coattails. Very slippery.

In a weird way, I am actually glad that Britain has such proud people who think good of the British Raj and its benevolence. Behind the haughtiness lies ignorance of economics & history. And that is good. For India.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 03 Nov 2014 19:43

^^^I am rather surprised at the comments, fully expected then to be racist, but looks like it's not controversial enough for the normal brishit guy to jump in and comment.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 04 Nov 2014 11:30

BoJo may be right...but only in comparison with the Yanquis,French,German,Italian,Dutch,Japanese,Russians and other imperialsts and colonialists.We may have been much better off with the French.They gave citizenship to all peoples under their colonial rule.The food would've been far better too.We would've ahd a thriving global wine industry centuries ago! The Yanquis were the worst of all.too crude to be a good imperial power.Churchill was an imperialistic bigot,steeped in the mistaken belief that "God was an Englishman. He made no bounds about his beliefs of British superiority and native inferiority. Copious quantities of booze kept him going. Boris Johnson's book on him revealeded that it was his oratory and personality that prevented a peace with Hitler from taking place after the fall of France,when the British cabinet met in special session to discuss the same.He was a great wartime leader,"cometh the hour,cometh the man",but a peacetime disaster.
The royals,of German ancestry were mostly for a compromise with "Herr Hitler",who would be a bulwark against those awful Communists who had slaughtered the Czar and his family,relatives of the royals.

Happily,the thinking these days is rather different,with the debate about the raj being "good for India" coming a cropper.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 04 Nov 2014 11:37

Phillip,

Mass murder is mass murder. There is no "lesser" or "better" mass murderer. That is a trap and an imperial apologist like BoJo will like to use it to his advantage.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 04 Nov 2014 13:50

I see Boris's "barbaric practices like Suttee, bride-price" and raise you The Trial of Warren Hastings:

Project Gutenberg: THE WORKS OF THE RIGHT HONOURABLE EDMUND BURKE

On the same principle, and for the same ends, virgins, who had never seen the sun, were dragged from the inmost sanctuaries of their houses, and in the open court of justice, in the very place where security was to be sought against all wrong and all violence, (but where no judge or lawful magistrate had long sat, but in their place the ruffians and hangmen of Warren Hastings occupied the bench,) these virgins, vainly invoking heaven and earth, in the presence of their parents, and whilst their shrieks were mingled with the indignant cries and groans of all the people, publicly were violated by the lowest and wickedest of the human race. Wives were torn from the arms of their husbands, and suffered the same flagitious wrongs, which were indeed hid in the bottoms of the dungeons in which their honor and their liberty were buried together. Often they were taken out of the refuge of this consoling gloom, stripped naked, and thus exposed to the world, and then cruelly scourged; and in order that cruelty might riot in all the circumstances that melt into tenderness the fiercest natures, the nipples of their breasts were put between the sharp and elastic sides of cleft bamboos. Here in my hand is my authority; for otherwise one would think it incredible. But it did not end there. Growing from crime to crime, ripened by cruelty for cruelty, these fiends, at length outraging sex, decency, nature, applied lighted torches and slow fire—(I cannot proceed for shame and horror!)—these infernal furies planted death in the source of life, and where that modesty, which, more than reason, distinguishes men from beasts, retires from the view, and even shrinks from the expression, there they exercised and glutted their unnatural, monstrous, and nefarious{89} cruelty,—there, where the reverence of nature and the sanctity of justice dares not to pursue, nor venture to describe their practices.
These, my Lords, were sufferings which we feel all in common, in India and in England, by the general sympathy of our common nature. But there were in that province (sold to the tormentors by Mr. Hastings) things done, which, from the peculiar manners of India, were even worse than all I have laid before you; as the dominion of manners and the law of opinion contribute more to their happiness and misery than anything in mere sensitive nature can do.

A country and its actions outlives its generations.
When have Indian history lessons ever shown this barbaric , primitive and cruel nature of the British peoples.
Compare that to modern day German history lessons at school where they go into the grisly details of the Third Reich including political killings and the death camps.
It is this silence from India that allows Boris Johnson to write so. What I wish should be happening now is that Britain discuss "The case for reparations".

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 04 Nov 2014 14:11

No better than ISIS courts of bandits, currently dispensing tribal justice in the Levant, supported by NATO member Turkey and Arab ganglords.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 04 Nov 2014 17:15

The forgotten story of India’s colonial slave workers who began leaving home 180 years ago

http://qz.com/290497/the-forgotten-stor ... years-ago/

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 Nov 2014 03:30

UK police get armed to teeth in London in face of Islamic terrorism

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2820780/

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 05 Nov 2014 12:27

Libyan Soldiers Sent Home After UK Sex Attacks

The decision follows allegations of sexual assault against five recruits, including the rape of a man in Cambridge.

http://news.sky.com/story/1366495/libya ... ex-attacks

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 05 Nov 2014 12:56

The Raj taking control of India was an evolutionary process. The Europeans came primarily to trade not rule.Our own kingdoms used the EICo. mercenaries to bolster their own interests.The Europeans exploited our divisions and became indispensable.Once the nose of the camel or "redcoat" was in the tent,the cause was lost.After the Sepoy Mutiny (first war of Independence),the Raj took over from the EICo.,Victoria Rani became Queen Empress.From trading outposts at the start of the 18th C, British military dominance saw it gobble up the weaker "native states" and extend its reach from the south to the Indo-Gangetic plain even into Afghanistan.Before the rulers of the Indian kingdoms realised it,the Brits were top dog.Had we shown unity the firangs could've been thrown out centuries ago.

The conquests that had begun in the 1750s had never been sanctioned in Britain and both the national government and the directors of the Company insisted that further territorial expansion must be curbed. This proved a vain hope. The Company's new domains made it a participant in the complex politics of post-Mughal India. It sought to keep potential enemies at a distance by forming alliances with neighbouring states. These alliances led to increasing intervention in the affairs of such states and to wars fought on their behalf. In Warren Hastings's period the British were drawn into expensive and indecisive wars on several fronts, which had a dire effect on the Company's finances and were strongly condemned at home. By the end of the century, however, the Company's governor general, Richard Wellesley, soon to be Marquess Wellesley, was willing to abandon policies of limited commitment and to use war as an instrument for imposing British hegemony on all the major states in the subcontinent. A series of intermittent wars was beginning which would take British authority over the next fifty years up to the mountains of Afghanistan in the west and into Burma in the east.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 05 Nov 2014 20:33

BBC Breaking News ‏@BBCBreaking 1h1 hour ago

18-year-old Kazi Jawad Islam from east London charged with preparing to commit acts of terrorism, Scotland Yard says

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 Nov 2014 21:04

bartanaia also ruled over such success stories as TSP, myanmar, SL, Iraq, Iran, Egypt....the french ruled over other success stories like libya and mali. the success of lack of it of these places should also be laid at UK's rules door.

the new-age london cops resembles a pvt blackwater contractor more than a urban cop now

the kit looks a bit downmarket compared to the ferguson missouri tactical kit though..but amrika has always been the gold std in police kit..one of them seems to have a gopro type camera mount to record things.
http://www.slate.com/content/dam/slate/ ... mlarge.jpg

member_28797 · Post by **member_28797** » 05 Nov 2014 21:10

pankajs wrote:
BBC Breaking News ‏@BBCBreaking 1h1 hour ago

18-year-old Kazi Jawad Islam from east London charged with preparing to commit acts of terrorism, Scotland Yard says

Wow, nanha jihadis starting early. Doing Jihad before even completing high school
subhan balla

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 06 Nov 2014 00:53

Wish they did their whole evolutionary thing not at others' cost. By others' I mean the whole world where sun doesn't set and so on.

member_28797 · Post by **member_28797** » 06 Nov 2014 02:05

Philip wrote:The Raj taking control of India was an evolutionary process. The Europeans came primarily to trade not rule.Our own kingdoms used the EICo. mercenaries to bolster their own interests.The Europeans exploited our divisions and became indispensable.Once the nose of the camel or "redcoat" was in the tent,the cause was lost.After the Sepoy Mutiny (first war of Independence),the Raj took over from the EICo.,Victoria Rani became Queen Empress.From trading outposts at the start of the 18th C, British military dominance saw it gobble up the weaker "native states" and extend its reach from the south to the Indo-Gangetic plain even into Afghanistan.Before the rulers of the Indian kingdoms realised it,the Brits were top dog.Had we shown unity the firangs could've been thrown out centuries ago.

The conquests that had begun in the 1750s had never been sanctioned in Britain and both the national government and the directors of the Company insisted that further territorial expansion must be curbed. This proved a vain hope. The Company's new domains made it a participant in the complex politics of post-Mughal India. It sought to keep potential enemies at a distance by forming alliances with neighbouring states. These alliances led to increasing intervention in the affairs of such states and to wars fought on their behalf. In Warren Hastings's period the British were drawn into expensive and indecisive wars on several fronts, which had a dire effect on the Company's finances and were strongly condemned at home. By the end of the century, however, the Company's governor general, Richard Wellesley, soon to be Marquess Wellesley, was willing to abandon policies of limited commitment and to use war as an instrument for imposing British hegemony on all the major states in the subcontinent. A series of intermittent wars was beginning which would take British authority over the next fifty years up to the mountains of Afghanistan in the west and into Burma in the east.

Ok so you are defending the british genocide? And who are you kidding really? Isn't it true that entire India was joined in the revoluntionary movement? Stop spouting BS if you have no clue about how british rule started and spread

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 06 Nov 2014 02:38

^^ You might want to tone down your indignation a bit buddy. Where in the above post is Philip sir defending genocide?

As for this,

narendranaik wrote:Stop spouting BS if you have no clue about how british rule started and spread

Why don't you enlighten us, since you seem to know everything about it.

Also, some gyan on this would be appreciated:

narendranaik wrote:Isn't it true that entire India was joined in the revoluntionary movement?

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 07 Nov 2014 21:05

BBC Breaking News ‏@BBCBreaking 3h3 hours ago

Four men held over alleged terror offences in London and Thames Valley by police probing Islamist-related terrorism http://bbc.in/1xcn6n3

This has become a never ending serial ..

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 07 Nov 2014 21:21

Seems the faithfools have not availed of faculties of consanguinity post "plea" by the member of royalty, Prince of Wales Charles, to faith leaders over persecution of Christians, be it the middle east or elsewhere in the world.
link

..
He said that faith leaders must ensure their followers respect believers in other faiths “rather than remaining silent”.

His comments came in a special message recorded for the publication of a new report which concludes that Christians are the “most persecuted religious minority” in the world and that Muslim countries dominate the list of places where religious freedom is most under threat.
..
It also argues that religious freedom is in “decline” in the UK and other western countries, because of both a fear of extremism and a growing belief that faith should have no place in public life.
..

Some straight talk by Jewish participant, rest is mostly al-taqiya.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 08 Nov 2014 02:13

Scottish nationalists storm back after referendum defeat

Just weeks after seeing their dream of an independent Scotland wiped out in an historic referendum defeat, Scottish nationalists have turned failure into a revival which could transform British politics at next year's UK general election.

The Scottish National Party (SNP) may have failed to persuade voters to back independence from Britain, but appears to be winning the argument that it can do a better job fighting for Scottish interests than Scottish branches of London parties.

The result could be a wipe-out for the Scottish chapter of Britain's center-left Labour Party, which has dominated Scotland's delegation to the UK parliament for generations, and a thumping SNP victory that could make it kingmakers in London.

According to a poll by Ipsos-MORI last week, the SNP which now has just six seats in the House of Commons in London, would win 54 of the 59 Scottish seats in the UK parliament next year.

That would potentially turn it into the Britain's third party, able to pick which of the UK-wide parties could form a government to rule Britain, the country it tried to leave.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 08 Nov 2014 15:07

Britain has sold its soul with the Qatari deal
Our latest defence accord is with a country that plays host to terrorists at home and funds them abroad

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -deal.html

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 09 Nov 2014 00:04

The US and the British are very open about their dealings with Saudi/Qatari/Pakis. No BS built around secularism could come in the way there. The EU is openly arming 'moderate' rebels in the middle east. It is only others who have to keep the fantasy alive.

If I remember correctly, NATO bombed Serbia to create Islamic enclaves around Serb population - or that is what I read.

kancha · Post by **kancha** » 09 Nov 2014 23:40

Pamphlets circulated during the Million ~~Paki~~ Kashmiri March last month

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 10 Nov 2014 00:21

Another little newsbyte from derby-abad
Isis suicide bomber from Derby who called for gays to be executed 'kills eight in Iraq'
Read it all. Now will not Iraqis ask why UK let this deluded zombie off the hook who went to Iraq and killed 8 policemen and injured staff members of a hospital?

Following a trial at Derby Crown Court, Ahmed and two co-defendants Ihjaz Ali and Razwan Javed were convicted of distributing threatening written material intending to stir up hatred on the grounds of sexual orientation.