Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Singha »

the aussies were supposed to release their ocean current modeling work in march this year but not done so far.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

UBCN is reporting that there is no truth to rumors that several partially burned tickets marked "London to Kuala Lumpur via Ukraine" have also been washed up.
Sorry, I know, very poor taste etc. but at this point there is way too much reason for elementary skepticism. Reunion Island IS a French colony with military presence... France is in NATO..
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by wig »

MH370 search
This morning, a suitcase was found by beach cleaners in Bois Rouge, the same place where the debris washed up.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 26340.html
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

The wing part doesn't look too light from the way they are carrying it. I still don't see how it floated for so many months. It does look like composite/fiberglass from the way the edge is all eaten up. Barnacles grown in the edges too - it may have been wedged in some rocks? Can't say much about the 'suitcase' - looks like a garment bag, but with something big stuck into it.

Guardian blog:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2 ... ion-island

Latest CNN claim: Images suggest that flaperon came off in the air. (which means mijjile strike off DG, hain?) But they say it shows that the plane was in a high-speed spiral descent and exceeded flutter speed.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Singha »

sometimes storms and tides also bring up stuff from deeper waters ... thats how sea shells accumulate on beaches after a good storm.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Shreeman »

My personal 777 has been grounded since that part fell off and the service center said the warranty was over. Costs too much new. It has been gathering dust for want of that little part. Do you think they will return it back if I asked nicely or will it have to be a government to government deal? Also what might be the postage from ascension to bangalore, kerala? Money is a bit tight since the taxi is sitting in the garage for this part.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Philip »

The plane ending up in the IOR near OZ to me was the biggest piece of disinformation,that made almost everyone look in the wrong direction. With the entire focus of attention,searching near Oz,no one looked elsewhere despite the reports of an aircraft flying low seen at the tip of the Maldives. This gave whoever was responsible,enough time to dispose of the aircraft so that no debris would be found at the scene of the crime. The "pings" could've easily come from a deliberately placed device by an aircraft,ship or sub to lead searchers astray. The "flaperon" is only the tip of the icebrg. The true story is unlikely to be known.Bad luck for (the conspirators) with the debris reaching Reunion.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Shreeman »

Phillip,

I do not believe icebergs have flaperons. Otherwise one would have avoided the titanic. Icebergs have a vertical tail and yes, even ailerons but no flaperons.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

07.25

One group of independent observers has said that the damage to the component -- a right wing flaperon -- should give authorities a good indication that the piece came off while the plane was still in the air.

The group, led by American Mobile Satellite Corp. co-founder Mike Exner, points to the small amount of damage to the front of the flaperon and the ragged horizontal tear across the back.
10.22

The families of MH370 victims are now seeking greater compensation in light of the flaperon discovery, Cate Gower reports.

Following the discovery of the plane debris washed up on Reunion Island, aviation lawyers told Reuters that family members of passengers who were on board MH 370 are resuming efforts to receive greater compensation.

Joseph Wheeler, special council at Maurice Blackburn Lawyers in Melbourne, told Reuters that the discovery “is triggering renewed monitoring and recommendations to families”. He stated that “if there is evidence that the aircraft has failed, that very well may trigger a wave of lawsuits from around the world”.
from:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -live.html
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

Mike Exner:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jfninslr7z5ku ... 9.pdf?dl=0
The trailing edge damage (#5 above) could conceivably be the result of two possibilities
:
 Separation of the trailing edge due to contacting the water with the Flaperon in a down position, consistent with slow flight configuration for landing, or banking at the time of impact
 Separation of the trailing edge due to high speed flutter at some unknown altitude above the
ocean, followed within seconds by separation to the Flaperon from the wing, both prior to the
main aircraft impact.

However, the lack of leading edge damage points to the second scenario only. If the Flaperon was on the aircraft when the aircraft contacted the water, it is very likely that there would be some compression damage on the leading edge. But there is virtually no apparent compression damage. This is much more consistent with the Flaperon being “torn” from the wing while in high speed flight (forced rearward by the airflow).In addition, the ragged tear along the trailing edge is indicative of flutter induced stress and ultimate fatigue failure, not a break off due to high bending moments
at impact.

If the Flaperonseparated from the aircraft while still in flight, it indicates an in-flight breakup, most likely due to very high speeds, flutter and perhaps loss of hydraulic/electrical power to the Flaperon actuator post fuel exhaustion.

This scenario is consistent with the steep, spiral descent observed in the B777-200 simulator. If the in
-flight separation is confirmed, it would reduce the likelihood that the plane flew on any significant distance past the 7thARC as some have speculated, and reinforce the theory that the POI is relatively close to the 7th ARC
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

Ppl seem to have missed the main point about this piece: the paint. I think MH370 777's upper surfaces were blue. That stmt is not based on this image, but on what I read in the first report of the flaperon. Always remember the first report - it's done before they decide what to lie about. When the discovery was first made the report said it may be 'coated with some other substance' due to sea water etc. Then that main point seems to have dropped out. If anyone has actual images of that particular airplane (not generic MH or 777) pls save them because they may all disappear. May have to search cache and soon.

See this image: claims to be of the same aircraft, taken in 2011. The wing upper surface is a different color from the bright white of the fuselage top. The horizontal tail upper surface IS blue, so the wing must also be like the one shown above: blue. The relevant aircraft number is apparently 9M-MRO per Wikipedia (I don't know if that changed in the past few days or months, so please check against other sources).

Maybe the Ukraine 777 was white.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

. A Yemenia Airways Airbus A310 crashed in the ocean not far from Réunion in 2009, so “it could be part of that aircraft, or MH370, or some other wreckage from even some old airplane, who knows.”
http://www.wired.com/2015/07/tell-wreck ... lly-mh370/
If this flaperon did come from MH370, it would probably have been carried by the Indian Ocean gyre, which moves clockwise. (If the wing had traveled by gyre, there would have to have been some insulation or trapped air to keep it afloat.) To check that theory, the inspectors would have to check the flaperon’s paint and metal for corrosion, expecting to see damage that looked about a year old. Tytelman points out that the wing section does not have any sea grass on it, suggesting that it had not been at sea for long.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malay ... xperts-say
Nik Ahmad said marine biologists could lend a hand in investigations.

“They could check on the marine life encrusted on the debris and ascertain how long that it has been in the water.”

He said the wings of aircraft are made of composite, not metal, and does not rust.

“When I saw the picture, the flaperon was white instead of the usual grey. The seawater might have caused the colour to fade.

“But I’m certain that it is part of a wing of a large plane,” he said.
- See more at: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malay ... HGukU.dpuf
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

More in-depth studies of it are now underway which are, for example, looking closely at its colour scheme alongside Malaysia Airlines’ livery to try and establish a match.
http://www.copybook.com/airport/news/mh ... g-777-part
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Suraj »

UlanBatori wrote:Ppl seem to have missed the main point about this piece: the paint. I think MH370 777's upper surfaces were blue. That stmt is not based on this image, but on what I read in the first report of the flaperon. Always remember the first report - it's done before they decide what to lie about. When the discovery was first made the report said it may be 'coated with some other substance' due to sea water etc. Then that main point seems to have dropped out. If anyone has actual images of that particular airplane (not generic MH or 777) pls save them because they may all disappear. May have to search cache and soon.

See this image: claims to be of the same aircraft, taken in 2011. The wing upper surface is a different color from the bright white of the fuselage top. The horizontal tail upper surface IS blue, so the wing must also be like the one shown above: blue. The relevant aircraft number is apparently 9M-MRO per Wikipedia (I don't know if that changed in the past few days or months, so please check against other sources).

Maybe the Ukraine 777 was white.
That picture is a stock MAS 777. Here's a picture of 9M MRO itself:
Image
In fact, the piece that was found is that thing short downward-bent flaperon piece between the two wider flaps, right behind the engine exhaust, but from the left wing.

There are a lot of pictures of this craft on the airliners photo site:
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.s ... rch=9M-MRO
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Gagan »

Diego Garcia has military flights with lots of boeing wide bodied jets flying off and landing. One must also consider that this might belong to one of those boeing crashes.
Military cargo planes crashes are typically not headline making news.

That it is boeing or Airbus, should be known already.

But these guys are saying they know it to be belonging to a B 777.

The only thing I don't understand is, how could the debris have been missed on mil sat pictures?
That means that the area of the crash is different from the search area :(
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by RoyG »

It was probably hijacked and shot down by the US military. I remember reading something about it changing route and heading for Diego Garcia.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by RoyG »

It was probably hijacked and shot down by the US military. I remember reading something about it changing route and heading for Diego Garcia.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Suraj »

Even mil sats would have a hard time distinguishing debris from wave foaming, particularly if this plane crashed as it is alleged - trying to ditch in the water. That would explain the damage to the rear of the flaperon in the downward landing position as in the picture above. There would also be no major debris field if it went down largely in one piece.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

Maybe a shark thought it was a surfboard.. From the pic posted above, the color does **NOT** match. This surface is exposed to >400kph flow even if it is only pulled out during landing approach because it is in the suction region of the wing. Surely they don't put paint on this surface that will be scraped off even by flight through rain/snow storms for hundreds of landings?? Malaysia Kuala Lumpur itself is coastal/equatorial/ very wet and salty.

The flow over such a highly curved surface, with Coanda effect, wall jet and all, does depend on surface roughness, so the paint is very carefully chosen. How can that be so cleanly wiped off by gentle sloshing of sea-water? IOW, it does not appear 2 b from MH370. Given that it **IS** from a 777 (part serial number) and no other 777s are unaccounted-for, the Ukraine theory comes back. Could someone pls check on the paint scheme of THAT MAS 777? Suraj? Was it also blue/gray?
Last edited by UlanBatori on 01 Aug 2015 05:05, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by A_Gupta »

UB, consider the color of the dress?
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

A_Gupta wrote:UB, consider the color of the dress?
Well... then L'Inspecteur Clouseau De Reunione who is also in the pics, would have to be green :lol: Those colors are pretty normal in the pics.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Singha »

imo people should take a look at a globe where you can appreciate true size of the IOR. its a gigantic ocean and unlike the others has very very few islands in the middle (volcanic)....mostly its few miles deep and nothing for 1000s of km in the southern part. I doubt anyone has devoted their mil sats to checking the entire ocean even if it were possible to make out debris in a moving sea.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Suraj »

Mh 17 was 9M MRD. It had the same paint scheme:
http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.s ... rch=9M-MRD
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

Scratch one more CT :( Then 'they' must have picked this out of the trash bin at Singapore where the 777 tail is made, IIRC. Or is it AUSTRALIA? :idea: Took a lot of tries b4 they got the composite autoclaves just right...
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Muppalla »

come on. It is shot by Indian naval command in Andman while it is trying to crashland on Indian assets.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

Isn't Reunion directly south of TSP? This may be the main wing of the new PITA666
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by UlanBatori »

Nicely written article:

A lot of pieces may have washed up and been burnt.
Mr Periamagom, in a cowboy hat and white shirt, was convinced that the wreckage of the plane had washed up on his isle.
“They found two bottles on Friday,” he said conspiratorially. “And they were definitely from the plane, because they were special drinking water given to pilots to keep them awake during long flights.”
The two local police standing nearby smiled and rolled their eyes.
For the past four days the beach has been abuzz with activity; on Friday around a dozen police patrolled the beach, while helicopters hovered overhead. Local people took it upon themselves to fly drones over the waves, in the hope of spotting more debris...
“In the month of May, if I had realised, there would have been even more bits,” said Mr Ferrier. “There was a lot of evidence on the beach. But the sea took it away. “I think they’ll find more though," he added. “I’ve seen quite a lot – and I wasn’t even looking.”
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by nawabs »

Apparently a plane door has been found in Reunion.

http://news.sky.com/story/1529113/mh370 ... ky-sources
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Philip »

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -door.html
MH370: Police urge caution amid reports of washed up 'plane door'
While locals on the island of Reunion say they found "a large metal object with foreign writing", police tell our reporter not to "believe everything you hear on the radio
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ramana »

So what other important islands are near Reunion Island?

Mauritius, Seychelles, ...?
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by nachiket »

ramana wrote:So what other important islands are near Reunion Island?

Mauritius, Seychelles, ...?
Reunion is between Mauritius and Madagascar. Seychelles is ~1000 miles north.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Philip »

Here is one con.theory about the missing plane. Years ago a US warship in the Gulf shot down an Iranian airbus by accident,when it wrongly identified the civilian aircraft as hostile. This was a big setback for the US,worldwide condemnation,etc. The US then decided that their air defence.identification systems needed revamping especially when warships were operating in the littorals,to detect hostiles from the huge clutter of civvy aircraft. various tests were carried out.

Unfortunately,the system failed again in a simulated test off the US coast According to many analysts,the TWA-800 flight that "crashed" off the US coast due to a supposed explosion in the wing fuel tanks,was actually shot down during an exercise by an errant US missile.
Friday, July 19, 2013
DID U.S. NAVY SHOOT DOWN TWA FLIGHT 800?
The author of a new book says and errant ‘mass-seeker’ missile fired from a U.S. submarine in 1996 shot down TWA flight 800 and the navy immediately covered it up.

BOOK AUTHOR: QUESTIONS LINER IN TWA FLIGHT CRASH
By Bill Hoffmann

Newsmax
July 18, 2013The ill-fated TWA Flight 800 was blown out of the sky by a submarine missile being tested by the Navy — a tragic accident that was covered up by the U.S. government, a top expert in crash scenes claims.

" have Navy documents saying that they had significant Naval assets in that area that night. All of these years they’ve lied about it," James Sanders told Steve Malzberg on Newsmax TV.

"It was a mass-seeker [missile] . . . deliberately fired. But it got away from them."

The disturbing theory comes 17 years after the Boeing 747 exploded in midair and crashed into the Atlantic Ocean off Long Island, N.Y., just 12 minutes after taking off from John F. Kennedy International Airport.

All 230 people on board the flight headed to Paris were killed — the third-deadliest aviation accident in U.S. history.

While the National Transportation Safety Board concluded the probable cause was an explosion of flammable fuel, there were reports from eyewitnesses that a missile had hit the plane.

Sanders — a retired police investigator who specializes in crash scene probes and is author of "The Downing of TWA Flight 800: The Shocking Truth Now Updated" — said a source told him on the night of July, 17, 1996, a Navy submarine was testing an "experimental underwater missile."

"It was all supposed to come together in what’s called the CEC Program, Cooperative Engagement Capability … [a] missile system that locks into the destroyers and cruisers and aircraft carriers and it all comes together and it works perfectly. Well, it didn’t quite work."

Sanders said FAA radar and Navy radar revealed that the missile was launched just southwest of where Flight 800 was flying overhead and immediately after the strike, a cover-up was launched.

"The Navy then redacted portions of their radar that showed the missile as it closed in on the right side of TWA Flight 800," he said.

"[But] two key witnesses saw that missile approach the right side of the plane and explode . . . where the leading edge of the right wing goes into the fuselage.

He said "a political decision" was made at the White House immediately after the crash to lie about the cause of the crash

"Politics immediately became involved and then we all know what happens when politics get involved."


Even veteran journo Pierre Salinger,JFK's former aide said this:
http://www.welfarestate.com/twa800/pierre.htm
PIERRE SALINGER'S TWA FLIGHT 800 MISSILE NEWS CONFERENCE
Pierre Salinger Claims Navy Missile Shot Down TWA Flight 800

Friday, November 8, 1996
By Jocelyn Noveck Associated Press Writer
CANNES, France (AP) - Veteran American newsman Pierre Salinger said today he has a government document saying that Navy gunners accidentally shot down TWA Flight 800 while conducting missile tests, killing all 230 people aboard.

Salinger, an ABC News correspondent from 1978-83 and former spokesman for President Kennedy, said he was willing to give the FBI the document and its ``very important details that show the plane was brought down by a U.S. Navy missile.''


Various airline experts including the head of Emirates say that the aircraft had to be under command during the tracked flight,which avoided various radars into the Indian Ocean.It could not have flown on its own due to the various aspects of its flight path. If the aircraft was heading for DG,either by intent from the US or by other entities,with malicious intent,it could very well have been similarly shot down by US forces protecting DG. Shooting down the aircraft would pose no problem to the US given the previous cover-up! This would however provoke another storm of condemnation and huge claims for compensation. Remember,that the majority of passrs. were Chinese! The flight was going to Beijing. One theory has already done the rounds that the aircraft landed at DG ( an alleged call made by a passr. from there) and was later "disposed" of passrs.cargo et al.

Why DG if was alternatively a hijack? DG has been in the news for its infamous secret "rendition" concentration camp,with the US setting up such camps at various places around the world,where terror suspects plucked from various countries have been secretly incarcerated like those at Camp Gitmo (some Brit subjects found to be absolutely innocent after years of torture and imprisonment). If the aircraft was hijacked by individuals attempting to do another 9/11 at DGin an act of revenge, the US would've had no alternative but to shoot it down,but had to cover it up as was allegedly done with TWA-800. Here it would've been much easier with the whole of the IOR to hide the aircraft/debris.The entire search team was sent on a wild-goose chase scouring the seas and seabed near Oz,when the plane was anywhere but there.The entire search hunting for the elusive "pings" took a few months,by which time a clean-up op to salvage as much debris as could be would've been completed far from the search region.

Everyone knows that OZ is a staunch mil. ally of the US,its closest in Asia (one of the 5-eye nations who have the closest intel relationship with the US) and would've been a willing co-conspirator. That's why the OZ establishment kept on saying that the search of the aircraft was doing well,success imminent. If one remembers right,there were reports that DG issued a no-go for all aircraft,etc. on dates at the same time as the aircraft was missing,with one report even alleging that Brit royal family members had a pit stop there on their way to Oz.

Let's wait for more debris to arrive on island beaches.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Prem »

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missin ... ry-n404546
MH370 Mystery: Officials Confirm Fragment Is From Missing Flight
The airplane fragment that washed up on an island last week was a piece of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, investigators confirmed Wednesday — the first definitive physical clue to the greatest mystery in modern aviation."I hope that this confirmation, however tragic and painful, will at least bring certainty to the families and loved ones of the 239 people on board MH370," said a somber Prime Minister Najib Razak of Malaysia. "They have our deepest sympathy and prayers."The fragment — a 6-foot-long, barnacle-encrusted wing flap — was discovered on July 29 by a crew cleaning the beach on Reunion Island, a French territory in the Indian Ocean off the southern tip of Africa.Investigators had already determined that it came from a Boeing 777, and Flight 370 was the only plane of that model missing in the world.French investigators were also analyzing a shredded suitcase found on Reunion Island, but there was no immediate word on a conclusion about that piece of debris.Experts have cautioned that the wing piece, known as a flaperon, could provide a clue about the moment when plane hit the water, but will not resolve the basic question of what went wrong on its journey from Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, to Beijing.It is also unlikely to pinpoint the location of the body of the airplane, and thus the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder. For months, international teams have been searching a swath of the ocean depths much closer to Australia.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ramana »

How far is this debris from Diego Garcia?
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ldev »

ramana wrote:How far is this debris from Diego Garcia?
Image

2375 km
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ramana »

Now overlay with the ocean currents map.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ldev »

Image

Image
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by ramana »

S. Equatorial could have brought debris near Reunion.
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Re: Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

Post by Aditya_V »

RoyG wrote:It was probably hijacked and shot down by the US military. I remember reading something about it changing route and heading for Diego Garcia.
I doubt it, if that was thee case, the news would have been buried 2 days after the crash.
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