Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Locked
rahulm
BRFite
Posts: 1247
Joined: 19 Jun 2000 11:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by rahulm »

Water detected on the Moon

This article talks about water being discovered by 3 probes, Cassini, M3 and Deep Impact.
Water particles have been detected on the surface of the Moon by three missions, including an Indian probe.
To find water on the moon was one of the main objectives," mission director Mylswamy Annadurai told AFP in Bangalore.

"The baby has done its job," a clearly delighted Annadurai said. "It's a major milestone, although we still have to quantify the findings
Previous artifacts are now being interpreted in a new light but the game changer was the Chandrayaan I probe. It deserves its rightful place in history for this.
Samples of lunar rock and soil brought back to Earth by Apollo astronauts in the 1960s also contained traces of water.

But the containers in which they were transported were not hermetically sealed so researchers dismissed the presence of water as coming from the Earth.
Rahul M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17168
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 21:09
Location: Skies over BRFATA
Contact:

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Rahul M »

pgbhat thanks.
rahulm
BRFite
Posts: 1247
Joined: 19 Jun 2000 11:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by rahulm »

Water found on moon could lead to lunar colonies
India's first lunar mission has found evidence of large quantities of water on its surface, The Times newspaper said.

Data from the Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft also suggested water was still being formed on the moon, the British newspaper said.
After further analysis is done, the next task for scientists will be to figure out how to exploit the water to move towards an international lunar base, director of the International Lunar Exploration Working Group Bernard Foing told MSNBC.
Chandrayaan I has done enough and more for India to be a founding and executive member of this lunar base. With GSLV Mk3 we will have heavy lift to the moon.
Sanjay M
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4892
Joined: 02 Nov 2005 14:57

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Sanjay M »

rahulm wrote:Chandrayaan I has done enough and more for India to be a founding and executive member of this lunar base. With GSLV Mk3 we will have heavy lift to the moon.
Nah, we would need a GSLV-Mk4 or that distant UMLV to do anything significant on the Moon.
We wouldn't even be able to send a lunar module with GSLV-Mk3. I'm hoping that Mk3 can be augmented or upgraded into a Mk4 or a Mk3XL specifically for lunar missions.
pgbhat
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4163
Joined: 16 Dec 2008 21:47
Location: Hayden's Ferry

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by pgbhat »

Confirmed: There Is Water On the Moon, and Lots of It
It's hardly a vast lake, and it won't yet support that lunar agricultural colony you've been dreaming of, but it's far more water than scientists ever expected to find on the moon, and it could prove a valuable resource to future lunar visitors. The researchers have also found that the concentration of water is higher toward the poles, lending credence to the theory that larger deposits of water near the poles, and researchers note that it's possible we'll continue to find wetter lunar regions in the future.

So where did all this water come from? Although meteors or comets may have periodically brought water to the moon, the prevailing theory among the three papers is that solar winds have carried hydrogen to the moon's surface, where it has bonded with the oxygen in the moon's own dust and produced water.
Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Singha »

so things are going as per The Prophecy. after aeons of watchful sleep, the Monolith is finally ready to awake.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14223
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by svinayak »

Singha wrote:so things are going as per The Prophecy. after aeons of watchful sleep, the Monolith is finally ready to awake.
Clemente probe may have already figured out the presense of water in the 90s
Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Austin »

I think this whole moon mission is all H&D , to justify the 100 plus crores they spent on the mission.

We cannot provide proper drinking water to the million poor of this country , yet brag about finding water on moon , whats next take a bucket and fetch it back to earth in Chandrayan-2 mission :lol:
ss_roy
BRFite
Posts: 286
Joined: 15 Nov 2008 21:48

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by ss_roy »

Austin,

The big difference between this find and others is:

We are now sure that there is enough bound water all over the moon to make extraction and use possible. While it might not support a city, it can certainly support a lunar colony of upto a few dozen people. The amounts in some of the more 'water rich areas' exceed a gallon per ton of lunar dust. If you utilized solar or nuke powered machines to do the job, it could provide enough water to top up the losses from a lunar colony, so supply shipments to such colonies would require far fewer trips (better logistics).
shyamd
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7101
Joined: 08 Aug 2006 18:43

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by shyamd »

Austin wrote:I think this whole moon mission is all H&D , to justify the 100 plus crores they spent on the mission.

We cannot provide proper drinking water to the million poor of this country , yet brag about finding water on moon , whats next take a bucket and fetch it back to earth in Chandrayan-2 mission :lol:
Wasn't one of the aims of Chandrayan 1 to scope the amount of rare minerals on the moon in order to be used for extraction in the future?
Gerard
Forum Moderator
Posts: 8012
Joined: 15 Nov 1999 12:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Gerard »

Spacecraft see 'damp' Moon soils
Now a remote sensing instrument on Chandrayaan-1, India's first mission to lunar orbit, has confirmed that there is a real H2O signal at the Moon.

Two other satellites to look at the Moon - the US Deep Impact probe and the US-European Cassini spacecraft - back up Chandrayaan.

Both collected their Moon data long before Chandrayaan was even launched (in the case of Cassini, 10 years ago), but the significance of what they saw is only now being realised.
The Indian Moon mission was launched late last year but radio communication with it was abruptly lost in August. Nevertheless, the Indian space agency (Isro) will consider the water discovery a major triumph and a vindication of its endeavours.
harbans
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4883
Joined: 29 Sep 2007 05:01
Location: Dehradun

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by harbans »

WTF!! The news leaked out from Washington and not Bangalore!! ISRO top Officials were disclaiming any knowledge. I was about to comment on that aspect before, but left it out.
Instead it was the revelation, slyly slipped to the media here by top ISRO officials, that before it had gone dark, the late Chandrayaan-1 – or rather a NASA-designed instrument which the moon probe was carrying – had confirmed the presence of large quantities of water on the moon. And, even more surprising, data from NASA’s Moon Mineralogy Mapper seemed to indicate that water was still being formed on the earth’s surface, according to the ISRO officials quoted in The Times of London and some Indian media outlets. But the officials were tight-lipped about the specifics because they had rather cheekily stolen the thunder from a NASA press conference scheduled for today with Dr. Carle Pieters, a Brown University planetary geologist who oversaw the moon mapping project.
http://thefastertimes.com/india/2009/09 ... r-pradesh/

Very slimeball article indeed..wish this guy is proved wrong.
Avinash R
BRFite
Posts: 1973
Joined: 24 Apr 2008 19:59

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Avinash R »

^Check this pathetic attempt at journalism from the same author, Jeremy Kahn.
http://thefastertimes.com/india/2009/09 ... ter-roads/
And one of the comments that puts sense into his commie mind.
Jackass Journalism says:
For the readers benefit, Jeremy is actually a visiting reporter in china. The chinese authorities have issued him with a visa to report on the free and democratic conditions that the chinese enjoy, with some 'minor' conditions: u must not say anything about the killings in tibet, the fight for the independence of tibet, the beggars turned away from shanghai, the closing down of hundreds of factories due to recession, loss of millions of jobs cos of export slowdown, the rebellion by muslims in a part of china province; "Jeremy please focus on the gleaming superficial buildings, skyscapers, airports, not on the millions of rural chinese poor, who have been brutalised, their homes seized to make way for this gleamy infrastructure." Jeremy looks puzzled for a moment, but his eyes are taking in by all the superficial shine and and gleam of shanghai. "And of course Jeremy", the chinese authorities continue "u must realize that china is a free and fair country and has more democracy and freedom of press than neighboring india, and as an example of our freedom of press, u r free to report on the shortcomings and poverty and problems of the other giant asian economy, which is as u know a backward, socialistic, disease driven and rotting society with no infrastructure, corrupt society, fake democracy and brown ugly people. Dont look at the fact that they have the biggest muslim population in the world, the only sikh people, the largest hindu congregation, huge christian population besides, buddhist, jews and so much so that this massive country of varied linguistic, religious gathering of people, live harmoniously and elect a new leader by successfully conducting elections every few years. Jeremy dont look at the fact, that this so called ancient indian civilization is a country that is littered with magnificent temples, glorious churches, ancient mosques, massive sikh temples and buddhist heritage sites. Jeremy dont pay attention to the fact that somehow, this 'inferior' country of varied religions, thousand languages, loosely held federation of states is also slowly but surely building up its infrastructure, new airports, metros, motorways etc. Dont look at the fact that india is now the 4th largest economy from a PPP perspective. Dont look at the fact that they have the largest middle class in the world and the largest number of companies after the USA. Focus on their poverty, their backwardness, their creaky roads." But the increasingly gullible Jeremy points out that in a democracy every decision is queried, debated and argued , things take time to implement, and comes up with the example of NASA in the US which has been debating on how to best use the funds of billions of dollars: on pouring those billions into the space station or building a new shuttle? While NASA is debating other nations are catching up in the space and technological race...such as China and India, he points out. The chinese authorities look shocked. They look sternly at him and order him not to compare china with india! "How dare you? There is simply no comparison. And, America? Its a bygone power of yesteryear!", the chinese look smug with this comment. "We chinese are able to merge the benefits of democracy with efficient communist governance. Look Jeremy its simple. For instance, when we wanted to erect an 8 lane motor way in shanghai we razed to the ground a 100 houses, trampled on the objections of the residents and completed the project in a matter of 18 months. Look on the other hand at india, if they want to widen the road in downtown mumbai, there are a thousand civil rights organisations who would fight for the rights of the residents, the vigilant press creates obstacles, and it takes 3 years of tedious negotiations before the project is completed! They are Jeremy a backward jealous society in awe of the great chinese civilization!" Jeremy looks to object, but the chinese continue..."We Jeremy, are a very tolerant and fair democratic society with a fair and open press. However these are our rules for press reporters and for those who publish articles that contravene these 'minor' rules, they could have their permits suspended, their visas cancelled. prosecuted, jailed and in some extreme cases they have even been known to have disappeared of the face of this earth..." Jeremy nearly chokes and hastily gulps down his cup of pale green tea. Then smiles awkwardly (noodles dangling out of his mouth), nods vigorously and jabs in the air with his chop sticks and says "u wait and see what stories i come up with, on those ignorant, illiterate, proud indians!" And his gracious pygmy hosts smile in satisfaction and offer him more of the noodles....
harbans
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4883
Joined: 29 Sep 2007 05:01
Location: Dehradun

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by harbans »

Another pathetic attempt by same author:

http://thefastertimes.com/india/2009/09 ... ter-roads/

BTW: Carla Pieters had herself announce the day before the dates of the conference and that a major lunar discovery was about to be disclosed. It was obviously about water and her Colleagues and other paper contributors doled out small amounts of info that concluded that water was the thing that will be disclosed. It was not a secret. M Nair and Alex gave press conferences today on CY and that too very opposite views. Read the eco time headline: "India does not confirm water on Moon". I thought it was ridicluous till i realized DDM plucked his words out of context. Absolute falsehood. Here's the confusion that DDM caused:

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 049586.cms

http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20090924/98 ... d-isr.html
Chennai, Sep 24 (IANS) Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) Chairman G. Madhavan Nair has said he can't confirm the presence of water on the moon.

'Mineralogy matter has given 97 percent of the moon surface coverage. I can't confirm the presence of water now. Before the end of this week, we will let you know,' Nair told reporters Wednesday at ISRO's satellite launch centre in Sriharikota -- about 70 km from here -- after the launch of India's latest satellite Oceansat-2.

The American space agency NASA is expected to announce Thursday major findings of its moon mineralogy probe that went on board India's Chandrayaan-1.

Though the announcement is still under wraps, it is speculated it will be about the presence of water or ice on the moon.

Nair also said: 'Chandrayaan is a 100 percent success as far as ISRO is concerned. ISRO is studying the data sent by the satellite and is now focussing on Chandrayaan-2 which will be launched sometime in 2012 or 2013.'
I also have what Carla Pietrs and team were declaring in Washington..thats where the foreign networks picked this up. GOI should put up a case against this guy rather than against those 2 who reported soldiers injured in Chinese firing.
manoba
BRFite
Posts: 109
Joined: 06 Oct 2007 01:02

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by manoba »

NASA Science briefing "A New Moon" is going to start in fews seconds.

Linky: http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/index.html

Hope these (corrupted) clowns won't disappoint us.
shyamd
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7101
Joined: 08 Aug 2006 18:43

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by shyamd »

Started. A big thanks given to ISRO by NASA scientist. Showed a clip of the ISRO representative present at the press conference.

BBC Headlines on TV reads: Indian Moon Mission finds evidence of water on the moon.
and gives further details on Chandrayan.
Bade
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7212
Joined: 23 May 2002 11:31
Location: badenberg in US administered part of America

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Bade »

suryag
Forum Moderator
Posts: 4041
Joined: 11 Jan 2009 00:14

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by suryag »

In the same page is the line, puffs up my heart with pride
Credits: ISRO/NASA/JPL-Caltech/USGS/Brown Univ
Kailash
BRFite
Posts: 1083
Joined: 07 Dec 2008 02:32

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Kailash »

seems to me like there is a lot of hypothesizing on the water formation. NASA is either clueless or not sharing much.

India gets a trivial mention, though at the very start of the program. Program ended with how NASA is for the people by the people.... blah blah..

ISRO should seriously consider learning some PR tricks from NASA. This could have very well been a program aired from bengaluru, jointly represented by ISRO and NASA folks if India wanted it that way.
Kailash
BRFite
Posts: 1083
Joined: 07 Dec 2008 02:32

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Kailash »

All the images discussed in the program.

Seems like the water is concentrated over the polar regions, though even equatorial regions contain traces. Water formation seems to be changing with day and night.

IMHO, NASA could not answer questions convincingly. They are taking a re-look of older data from Cassini etc because M3 forced them to. No confirmation on the formation/age etc of the moon. No any information about specific(aka interesting) mineral distributions, apart from water.
Raja Bose
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19478
Joined: 18 Oct 2005 01:38

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Raja Bose »

Is the NASATV broadcast announcing the discovery of large quantities of water by CY-1 archived somewhere? I missed the live session.
SwamyG
BRF Oldie
Posts: 16267
Joined: 11 Apr 2007 09:22

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by SwamyG »

Real nice to see ISRO (and there by India) getting credits.
Raja Bose
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19478
Joined: 18 Oct 2005 01:38

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Raja Bose »

CY-1 mission proves once for all that when you launch space missions for the benefit of science and nation as opposed to mere national prestige (like our neighbors to the north) one gets the results which are unattainable to the rest. Well Done ISRO - They truly embody the meaning of the shloka which summarizes the Gita's teachings! The head of research here got a bit of a scare today morning when after reading B-R, I burst into his room and yelled "Did you know, Chandrayaan has found large amounts of water on the moon"! :mrgreen:
hnair
Forum Moderator
Posts: 4635
Joined: 03 May 2006 01:31
Location: Trivandrum

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by hnair »

Raja Bose-saar, the ways of easily scrutable Indians are baffling and results are mystifying. No one thought a bullock cart picking up all sorts of bhanjaras from the wayside will find El Dorado. Particularly driven by an inexperienced driver. Nice
pgbhat
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4163
Joined: 16 Dec 2008 21:47
Location: Hayden's Ferry

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by pgbhat »

Character and Spatial Distribution of OH/H2O on the Surface of the Moon Seen by M3 on Chandrayaan-1 ---- Abstract ;)
The search for water on the surface of the anhydrous Moon remained an unfulfilled quest for 40 years. The Moon Mineralogy Mapper (M3) on Chandrayaan-1 has now detected absorption features near 2.8-3.0 µm on the surface of the Moon. For silicate bodies, such features are typically attributed to OH- and/or H2O-bearing materials. On the Moon, the feature is seen as a widely distributed absorption that appears strongest at cooler high latitudes and at several fresh feldspathic craters. The general lack of correlation of this feature in sunlit M3 data with neutron spectrometer H abundance data suggests that the formation and retention of OH and H2O is an ongoing surficial process. OH/H2O production processes may feed polar cold traps and make the lunar regolith a candidate source of volatiles for human exploration.
ravi_w
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 1
Joined: 25 Sep 2009 01:44

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by ravi_w »

Raja Bose wrote:Is the NASATV broadcast announcing the discovery of large quantities of water by CY-1 archived somewhere? I missed the live session.
They are on youtube now. I tried hotlinking using youtube tag but that seems to have a problem. so posting URLs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPJyds4s ... annel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHFe0cG7 ... re=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04Z603U- ... re=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5ypqo-m ... re=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2Mnbwgk ... re=channel
Last edited by Gerard on 25 Sep 2009 02:18, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: username changed to conform with forum guidelines
Raja Bose
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19478
Joined: 18 Oct 2005 01:38

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Raja Bose »

Does any of the sea-near jingos (N^3 ityadi) or talibs still in universities have access to the full text PDF on Science - a pvt circulation amongst BR members wouldn't hurt, no?
pgbhat
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4163
Joined: 16 Dec 2008 21:47
Location: Hayden's Ferry

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by pgbhat »

RB I don't have access to that journal in Univ but found this. ;)
http://m3science.geo.brown.edu/?p=167
kasthuri
BRFite
Posts: 411
Joined: 02 Jan 2009 08:17
Location: Mount Doom in Mordor

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by kasthuri »

Does any of the sea-near jingos (N^3 ityadi) or talibs still in universities have access to the full text PDF on Science - a pvt circulation amongst BR members wouldn't hurt, no?
I have a copy but don't know how to attach it. Can somebody tell me how to attach a document in a post?
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 59773
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by ramana »

Put it in a site (upload or slide share etc)and link it here.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14223
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by svinayak »

Kailash wrote:seems to me like there is a lot of hypothesizing on the water formation. NASA is either clueless or not sharing much.
http://www.gearlog.com/2009/09/scientis ... on_the.php
September 24, 2009 4:27 PM

So how the hell did NASA miss this after all of their lunar missions? They're either totally incompetent or not disclosing the whole truth.
Raja Bose
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19478
Joined: 18 Oct 2005 01:38

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Raja Bose »

post-graduate saar, that link also takes you to a pay-up-or-else site on science.

kasthuri, please upload the on one of the file uploading sites such as rapidshare and post the link you get after submission, here. Thanks!
suryag
Forum Moderator
Posts: 4041
Joined: 11 Jan 2009 00:14

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by suryag »

What are the chances that the M3 instrument also found helium and we are not aware of it
Arun_S
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2800
Joined: 14 Jun 2000 11:31
Location: KhyberDurra

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Arun_S »

Good job and full credit to ISRO:

As luck will have it, in a radio interview I gave to a Australian Radio station 5 years ago (that has luminaries like Ex chairmen of ISRO Kasturirangan) where I said Chandrayan will discover many new scientific aspects of Moon.
Atri
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4152
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:07

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Atri »

Raja Bose
BRF Oldie
Posts: 19478
Joined: 18 Oct 2005 01:38

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Raja Bose »

Chiron wrote:AoA...

http://rapidshare.com/files/284568305/1 ... 1.pdf.html

Supporting material - http://rapidshare.com/files/284569732/1.pdf.html

only ten jingos can download it..
Thanks! 8)
sourab_c
BRFite
Posts: 187
Joined: 14 Feb 2009 18:07
Location: around

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by sourab_c »

Finding water on moon is extraordinary. While most scientific papers and credible news channels are acknowledging that this was an "Indian" success, most of the American and Australian channels are broadcasting it as a purely American achievement.

here is an example- http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/ ... 721093&ch=

Even in NASA's official speech, they "thank" India for its contribution as if NASA was the one doing everything. This, IMO is plagiarism.

ISRO should be more cautious about American contributions (however small it may be) in its future space missions. This sort of PR is "very" important for any space agency (and much needed in India's case), especially if you have a commercial branch.

ISRO should have had a major press conference inviting all major international news channels to announce this, with firecrackers, balloons,sweets and drums.
Sanjay M
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4892
Joined: 02 Nov 2005 14:57

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Sanjay M »

Look, NASA has to sing for its supper and fight for funds like everyone else. They're now going to make a sales pitch to Obama to avoid abandoning the Moon program entirely, either revitalizing the existing effort or else coming up with a viable new replacement agenda.

I don't think that Obama's necessarily going to be able to do a whole lot with his welfare state core constituency clamouring to be fed. Obama's going to have to climb down from some of his ambitious promises, if he wants to retain American leadership in space.

I think India should keep going on with the joint ventures with whomever can advance our trek to the Moon - Russians, Americans, Europeans, Japanese, etc. The task is too big to go it alone. The Americans too are going to have to learn to swallow some of their pride and collaborate with others, if they want to be able to afford such endeavours.
Sanjay M
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4892
Joined: 02 Nov 2005 14:57

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by Sanjay M »

Oh, and btw, I think that after this rollercoaster ride, we need a Bollywood movie to be made about Chandrayaan. Victory from adversity! 8)
vera_k
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 20 Nov 2006 13:45

Re: Chandrayan-1 moon mission

Post by vera_k »

sourab_c wrote:with firecrackers, balloons,sweets and drums
And Mayawati's pet elephant!
Locked