Civil Aviation Development & Discussion

Theeran · Post by **Theeran** » 18 Jun 2015 20:58

I don't know how to paste the image. The data is here - http://www.aai.aero/traffic_news/Apr2k15annex3.pdf

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 18 Jun 2015 21:16

The PDF is even better. Thanks.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Jun 2015 06:50

Chennai and to some extent Hbad are quintessential 3rd World in disorganization and official ninocompoopism.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Jun 2015 08:53

Hyd did some h&d thing vs BIAL(not that BIAL set a high bar) and opened with more checkin counters (83 iirc) and a taller control tower than BIAL. they were ahead of their time but made losses due to higher upfront cost.

BIAL has only now in phase2 T1 reached around 80 checkin counters.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 19 Jun 2015 09:27

Karipur probe in wrong hands, say aviation experts
They say that under the Suppression of Unlawful Acts against Safety of Civil Aviation (Amendment) Act, 1994 (SUSCA), the Union Civil Aviation Ministry is to initiate action by deputing an officer specifically for the investigation. Aviation experts wonder why the Ministry has not invoked the provisions of SUSCA for the offences committed at Karipur.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 29 Jun 2015 23:15

Superjet Production Pictures

http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/64386/

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 01 Jul 2015 16:20

It looks more and more like a conspiracy to keep both Chennai and Kolkatta international airports under AAI. The privatization has been put on hold as a standing committee wants to understand why after spending 4000 crores of public money should be privatized. The numbskulls don't understand that the airport is hardly at par with Indian standards (leaky ceilings, bird poop, leaky AC's), let alone world standards. MAA is still the pre eminent gateway for international travelers (tourists) to the south and there is no reason why we need to put up with incompetent AAI.

"Majority of the members was opposed to privatisation of the two airports. They asked the aviation ministry as to why profit-making airports should be given to private companies. Some committee members like KC Venugopal and Kiranmay Nanda totally rejected privatisation of the two airports," an official source said.

Directed by the aviation ministry, state-run Airports Authority of India (AAI) had on December 30 last year issued request for qualification (RFQ) for operation, management and development (OMD) of four airports — Chennai, Kolkata, Ahmedabad and Jaipur on long-term lease through PPP.

http://www.mydigitalfc.com/news/mps-opp ... hennai-836

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Jul 2015 16:58

on another note BIALs architect goofed up on the curvy roof thing. barely 2 yrs after the expanded T1 started, they are having to replace most of the panels on the underside and some have peeled and fallen off. hoists and cranes are constantly at work lifting workers up.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 01 Jul 2015 17:53

Re: Airport privatization
I think the idea is to stall all development efforts and hurl as many scams as possible on the ruling dispensation. Formula for coming back in 2019 and win assembly elections since there is not much positive to deliver to the people. I don't know how much hold a parliamentary stanidng committee has on executive policy. If not they should just ram through. Even the UPA faced opposition and union strikes when it privatized. The region in Kolkata surrounding the airport looks like some village ghetto. Private investments have the opportunity to turn the area into something worthwhile.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 01 Jul 2015 21:24

Singha wrote:on another note BIALs architect goofed up on the curvy roof thing. barely 2 yrs after the expanded T1 started, they are having to replace most of the panels on the underside and some have peeled and fallen off. hoists and cranes are constantly at work lifting workers up.

I hope these issues ensure the Zurich Airport/Hiranandani consortium don't win the bid on the Navi Mumbai airport. Both GMR and GVK are in the fray and they deserve to win the bid much more so than the Swiss turkeys who built the current BLR. It looks nice on the surface, but it's a very good example of engineering without thinking ahead.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 01 Jul 2015 21:53

Supratik wrote: The region in Kolkata surrounding the airport looks like some village ghetto.

Still? Mumbai CSIT is superb. I was wondering aloud to my SHQ from where they got all the space for all the 5* hotels and the 4 lane approach road. She reminded me that that area was the largest slum in Asia - Dharavi - whose stink one would get even before the aircraft landed. But now all the land had been acquired and developed. Of course, once one comes out a mile or so from the airport, it is same old same old - the bombay of mahim creek though with lot more fly-overs.

Picklu · Post by **Picklu** » 01 Jul 2015 21:59

Javee wrote:It looks more and more like a conspiracy to keep both Chennai and Kolkatta international airports under AAI. The privatization has been put on hold as a standing committee wants to understand why after spending 4000 crores of public money should be privatized. The numbskulls don't understand that the airport is hardly at par with Indian standards (leaky ceilings, bird poop, leaky AC's), let alone world standards. MAA is still the pre eminent gateway for international travelers (tourists) to the south and there is no reason why we need to put up with incompetent AAI.
"Majority of the members was opposed to privatisation of the two airports. They asked the aviation ministry as to why profit-making airports should be given to private companies. Some committee members like KC Venugopal and Kiranmay Nanda totally rejected privatisation of the two airports," an official source said.

Directed by the aviation ministry, state-run Airports Authority of India (AAI) had on December 30 last year issued request for qualification (RFQ) for operation, management and development (OMD) of four airports — Chennai, Kolkata, Ahmedabad and Jaipur on long-term lease through PPP.
http://www.mydigitalfc.com/news/mps-opp ... hennai-836

Aah, Kiranmay Nanda. He was the Fisheries Minister in the Left Front cabinet in the state of West Bengal since 1982 till 2011. What do you expect?

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 01 Jul 2015 22:00

vayu tuvan wrote: Still? Mumbai CSIT is superb. I was wondering aloud to my SHQ from where they got all the space for all the 5* hotels and the 4 lane approach road. She reminded me that that area was the largest slum in Asia - Dharavi - whose stink one would get even before the aircraft landed. But now all the land had been acquired and developed. Of course, once one comes out a mile or so from the airport, it is same old same old - the bombay of mahim creek though with lot more fly-overs.

The slums on Airport land were only a small part of Dharavi (if they can even be counted as part of Dharavi). Some land has been reacquired but there is a legal dispute going on between MIAL and some developer about slum rehabilitation. many of the slums are still there. Dharavi slums of course lie untouched if I'm not mistaken.

Granted though, that MIAL has done a wonderful job in the space that was available. Ideally, Mumbai really needed two parallel runways. But the existing cross-runway arrangement and inability of MIAL to reacquire all the slum land (land which legally already belonged to the airport but no politician was going to move the huge votebank of slum-dwellers from there), put paid to those plans early on.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 01 Jul 2015 22:05

Suraj wrote:It looks nice on the surface, but it's a very good example of engineering without thinking ahead.

Which I said all those moons ago and was roundly frowned upon for. BIAL was a turkey that some Architect experimented on in India. Bad design masquerading as sensitive to native requirements. There isn't even a proper plan for Aero-bridges with planes randomly parked all over the tarmac several KM away from the terminal. Like back in the bad old 1950's with prop planes. And there is no easy way to expand the thing either with construction already on all sides of it. PWD level planning and design I said back then and still true. Esp. with the exploding growth in traffic the place is grossly inadequate. Best thing to do is to tear it down, chalk it up to experimental error, hire a proper designer and start again. Trying to make this turkey work will cost more in the long term and cost in efficiency all the time.

Chennai is not there but it worked much better in terms of planning and for the future. That 1980's Kamaraj terminal needs to be torn down and replaced and the 2 ends linked in. If nothing else for that horrible toilet on the main concourse.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 Jul 2015 20:31

In yet another such instance, a glass door at the airport collapsed here, but none was injured, officials said.

The incident happened at Gate No 2 of domestic arrival area, generally used for VIP movement, they said.

Puducherry Governor Lt General Ajay Kumar Singh was among those who had to pass through the area.

With the incident happening prior to his exit, he waited briefly and then proceeded out, officials said.

Since the inauguration of the ₹2,000 crore airport complex in 2013, instances of glass panels breaking or false ceilings giving away have become a regular affair here.

Picklu · Post by **Picklu** » 05 Jul 2015 21:51

For all their incompetence, AAI in Kolkata at least separated the entry and exit levels while designing the new terminal. It is a different matter that the roads in the surrounding area are absolute mess and hence even the separated ramps can not help much.

If they would have given similar thought process to rest rooms, I would be quite happy with that effort.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 06 Jul 2015 10:01

in earlier AAI airports, the rest rooms were not made part of the central AC and instead just had their own exhaust fans...plus bad design of the urinals releasing into a open drain or grated drain at the bottom...the reason for the pervasive stink and yellow salt deposits ... this has been rectified I noted in places like chennai and guwahati while passing through.

would not claim its super, but okayish.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 06 Jul 2015 20:30

I did not see any issues with toilets at Kolkata airport (intl terminal) six months back. They look as good as any out there in India.

deejay · Post by **deejay** » 13 Jul 2015 16:46

Unsure of the best thread, I am posting this video here. It is Civil Aviation - Indonesia - Susie Air. The film is made by a British team covering mostly British expats but the whole experience of how challenging hill flying can be, mostly in uncontrolled air space and some amazing footage to see (specially between 33 mins to 35 mins). There is sequel available on Youtube.

[youtube]XqkjRxzztJQ#t=1409[/youtube]

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Jul 2015 17:30

http://www.theverge.com/2015/7/9/892427 ... -like-this

next time you are stuck on a american internal flight and think its bad, well it could be badder

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 13 Jul 2015 18:43

^^ might be more economical to sedate, palletize and stack us horizontally, floor to ceiling. No need for beverage service or flight attendants. heck, just pop a pill, walk through that door, lie down and wake up a few hours later at hopefully, the intended destination.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 15 Jul 2015 17:51

I was told that Chinese navigation system is one of the most advanced in the world (after Unkil). Basic GPS or Gagan receptors measure their position by comparing inclination angle relative to more then 3 sats at a precise time. So signals are received by receptors and that is all. But chinese system has a two way canal ie Sat receives some signals from the receptors..........distress calls,SOS signals etc.

Sathish_A · Post by **Sathish_A** » 16 Jul 2015 12:13

Of course, when you can steal the idea and system concept by being part of Galileo Joint Undertaking. They paid some money sent their foot soldiers to be based in Brussels for 3-4 years and walked away from the project conveniently.

The came up with idea of having a constellation of navigation satellite without iota of difference in concept. But what they lack is the network of sensor station and rights to frequency.

Galileo is capable to even informing the users if the signal is trustworthy or not. Let me see if panda can reach even the halfway mark.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 16 Jul 2015 16:46

vayu tuvan wrote: Still? Mumbai CSIT is superb. I was wondering aloud to my SHQ from where they got all the space for all the 5* hotels and the 4 lane approach road. She reminded me that that area was the largest slum in Asia - Dharavi - whose stink one would get even before the aircraft landed. But now all the land had been acquired and developed. Of course, once one comes out a mile or so from the airport, it is same old same old - the bombay of mahim creek though with lot more fly-overs.

I think they reclaimed the BKC area and Andheri Airport Authority land where these Hotels have come up and not the Dharavi Area , The Dharavi area still exist by and large the same except the new building on the edge of highway that cover the Slums behind and are part of redevelopment.

I think Dharavi area has nothing to do with CSIT they are far apart , In any case having spent my childhood at Bandra and Mahim , the Creek is still there thats the Mithi River that joins the sea but polluted enough to be called the gutter.

The stink was not due Dharavi but mostly due to Jhonson & Jhonson factory out there which used to make stuff used in surgery and they used to use animal product that was left to dry in the open that make it stink , Now the factory is closed.

Dont call Dharavi a stinking place we wouldnt have won an Oscar for Slum Dog Millionaire had it not been for Dharavi

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 16 Jul 2015 18:01

GVK has about 200 acres for development (out of a total of 2000 acres for airport) as part of the deal out of which they have about 140 in their possession and the rest still occupied by slums. GMR got 500 acres for development but the airport land is 5000 acres in Delhi's case.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 Jul 2015 12:16

MH370 piece confirmed found in a small island near Madagascar!

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... mh370.html

if other debris are found nearby might prove the plane few near maldives and then on to the south...

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 30 Jul 2015 20:29

Diego Garcia is not far from there.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 30 Jul 2015 21:36

Singha wrote:MH370 piece confirmed found in a small island near Madagascar!

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... mh370.html

if other debris are found nearby might prove the plane few near maldives and then on to the south...

Not necessarily. The ocean currents are westerly, so it could have crashed closer to Australia, and the current driven the piece to Reunion Island. After 1+ year in the water, it's very hard to make a definitive claim about the crash site.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 30 Jul 2015 21:53

hopefully they find the growth on the part to be unique to some areas, and reverse engineer the currents and narrow down to some search area...

and where there's one part floating, surely there are other parts floating as well??? just a matter of time before more is found?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jul 2015 07:25

nobody has searched the region between Maldives-diego-Mauritius-reunion.

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 31 Jul 2015 12:03

Pictures from the distance apart, the quality of civil works -- sidewalks, crossings, roads in general around IGIA is pathetic for anyone on foot. And pickup arrangements are still ad-hoc. None of your park/receive/drive for the majority. Why is the outside so poorly done from a walking perspective?

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 31 Jul 2015 22:22

Shreeman wrote:Pictures from the distance apart, the quality of civil works -- sidewalks, crossings, roads in general around IGIA is pathetic for anyone on foot. And pickup arrangements are still ad-hoc. None of your park/receive/drive for the majority. Why is the outside so poorly done from a walking perspective?

T1 or T3 ?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 03 Aug 2015 10:29

fb
Virendra Shah
I Sharing this story from a passenger who rode an airline going to HK. This can happen on any airline going to any destination. These are very hard times for a lot of people!!!

"I would like to draw your attention to an attempted robbery on a flight into Hong Kong last week. With an hour to go, during the flight, I thought I noticed my bag being replaced in the overhead locker. I wasn't sure and decided it was probably a fellow passenger, moving it to access their own bag.

I dismissed any thought of any wrong doing, but upon arrival in HK, something told to me to retrieve the bag, just to make sure nothing suspicious had occurred. When I opened the overhead locker (not above me) and saw my leather bag was the only one occupying the space I knew there was a problem. I examined the content, only to find all of my wife's jewellery, along with some cash had been stolen, during the flight.

I raised the alarm and my wife and I quickly blocked both aisles to stop anyone at the back of the plane disembarking....there were around 120 passengers....

My wife and I both shouted for assistance from the stewards and stewardesses. Eventually a steward told me that security had been called but passengers were becoming very agitated and unwilling to show patience or understanding....they just wanted to get off the plane....my wife and I were the only people controlling the passengers.

I pleaded with the passengers to check their own bags at which point three fellow travellers reported they had also been robbed. It was only at this point, did I see any evidence from the cabin crew that they were willing to provide any meaningful support.

I vaguely remember seeing a passenger wearing black, sporting a white base-ball cap and pleaded with the rest of the passengers to see if they could remember anyone fitting my description.
It turned out to be a passenger standing in front of me, who once identified proceeded to offload money, jewelry, camera equipment and false documents, running into tens of thousand, if not hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of stolen goods.

By this time security had boarded the plane, the Captain had been informed and was standing in the rear section watching the events unfold.

Eventually a policeman boarded the plane and I was able to explain the events leading up to my apprehending the thief. I have since been informed this criminal activity is reaching epidemic proportions and the authorities caught three thieves, just last week, (with 30 already on remand since early December) on flights into HK, with all the criminals coming from the same town in China.

It is estimated that only 5% are being caught judging by the reports of passengers contacting the police after they have arrived at their destination.

They sit in the back row of the plane observing where bags are behind or away from the passengers and systematically pull them from the overhead lockers, while passengers rest or watch movies, take them to the back of the plane and steal any valuable contents.

They prey on foreign airlines as the penalties are so lenient, the pay-off makes it worth the risk.

I naively have never thought of robbers operating on planes, but now I have experienced it first hand, there are a few takeaways:

1. Hand luggage should ALWAYS be locked.
2. Do not assume luggage under your seat is safe....last week one passenger had her purse stolen by the guy sitting next to her while she slept !!
3. If in doubt, wear or keep any valuables ON YOU at all times !!
4. Don't assume, like me, that everyone on a flight is a law-abiding citizen.
5. Do not assume business class travel is secure....robbers can be wealthy.

SHARE THIS TO SPREAD AWARENESS!!

chilarai · Post by **chilarai** » 03 Aug 2015 12:27

^^ happened in singapore often. Mostly the culprits were PRC national. I anyway always keep my passport at least on my person no matter how uncomfortable it is tohave passport in pocket sitting in a cramped seat !

http://travel.asiaone.com/article/news/ ... jail-terms

http://travel.asiaone.com/article/news/ ... taking-off

http://travel.asiaone.com/article/news/ ... onths-jail

http://travel.asiaone.com/article/news/ ... nd-silkair

http://travel.asiaone.com/article/news/ ... ing-flight

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 04 Aug 2015 15:19

Suraj wrote:
Shreeman wrote:Pictures from the distance apart, the quality of civil works -- sidewalks, crossings, roads in general around IGIA is pathetic for anyone on foot. And pickup arrangements are still ad-hoc. None of your park/receive/drive for the majority. Why is the outside so poorly done from a walking perspective?
T1 or T3 ?

T3, incoming international flight late at night but prior to the usual multi-flight mayhem. Post the terminal glass door it might have been new delhi railway station that day.

Kakkaji · Post by **Kakkaji** » 09 Aug 2015 07:50

How can such projects be viable? This is supposedly India's first greenfield private airport:

Durgapur airport's wings jammed

Less than 100 days after take-off, 2 airlines stop flights for lack of demand; airport gets barely a dozen passengers a day

Initially, the fare was fixed at Rs 2,500 but Air India is now having a promotional offer of Rs 999 (excluding taxes) for a one-way journey on the Durgapur-Kolkata route. The Air India flight takes off from Kolkata at 5 pm and lands at Andal at 5:45 pm daily. The return flight takes off from Andal at 6:05 pm and reaches Kolkata at 6:50 pm.

Many say there are cheaper and more convenient ways to go to Kolkata from Durgapur. Including taxes, one will have to pay about Rs 1,300 for a one-way journey now. “A passenger needs to report to the airline counter two hours before departure. Then, there is a 45-minute flying time. After landing, one has to spend some time collecting baggage and then at least half an hour to drive from Andal to Durgapur. Compare that with a road journey on a Volvo bus or an express train which takes about three hours,” argues Travel Agents Federation of India Chairman (East) Anil Punjabi.

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 09 Aug 2015 17:24

India lacks a robust General Aviation segment. Without this critical "filler", smaller airports will struggle to be viable for precisely the reasons mentioned in the article.
Providing hangar space, easing import concerns, smoothening out DGCA issues and providing 100LL fuel at most airports will improve connectivity, boost the "Make in India" as well as the Skill development initiative. I, however, don't see this happening in NDA's first term at least.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 09 Aug 2015 19:42

The Andal airport is going to pick up once they connect to other places in India rather than kolkata. It has been done with a long term vision.

nandakumar · Post by **nandakumar** » 09 Aug 2015 20:24

Traffic into Jamshedpur, Ranchi, Bokaro etc from North, West and South are best served from Durgapur. The trick is to make landing and take off charges at Durgapur as next to nothing. Which it should be as traffic is next to nothing as there is no need for expensive ATC infrastructure. Then airlines would be tempted to try Durgapur as a transit point. Indeed it can even be a hub for North Eastern traffic such as Guwahati and Agartala.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 10 Aug 2015 23:12

Meanwhile... ...same old same old at that old money hole. GOI just handed AI folks another Rs 800 Crore check for a job well done. No interest or repayment expected. Its a good life I tell you....

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/opi ... 417889.ece

VIPs shouldn’t treat Air India as their private airline

Two recent incidents of VVIPs delaying Air India flights point to a deeper malaise that affects Indian society — the readiness of the system to buckle under VIP pressure.

Take the case of Maharashtra Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis and party travelling to New York. Normally, a passenger may not be issued a boarding card till the staff are satisfied that the individual is travelling with valid documents. In this case, the person is not checked in and check-in baggage not accepted. In this instance, the delegation delayed the flight instead of asking the official without the proper documents to take another flight.

Air India’s excuse is it would have taken longer to off-load the bags than to rush someone to the official’s house to get the correct travel documents. But why did it not follow protocol? Because the airline is surviving on money that the exchequer is giving it, and Mumbai is one of its main operating bases. How could any staff member afford to antagonise the State’s top bosses?

The second incident again shows that well laid-down procedures were given the go-by. Globally, it is not uncommon for airlines to request passengers who have been given a boarding pass to volunteer to take a later flight to make room for another passenger urgently needing to travel. In such circumstances, the passenger who yields place is compensated financially and provided hotel accommodation. But according to media reports from Leh, boarding cards were taken back without any mention of compensation for the passengers offloaded to accommodate Minister of State for Home Kiren Rijiju and Jammu and Kashmir Deputy Chief Minister Nirmal Singh.

The only gumption displayed was by those who brought these incidents to light. Netas need to step back for a minute and see what their actions are doing — to the airline, to passengers and to themselves.

Deputy Editor