Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 23 May 2016 16:22

chetak wrote:Hope that you specifically did appreciate the attender's role in the tweets

Thanks, I did after your reminder here

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 23 May 2016 19:51

Suresh Prabhu, wow!
He is most likely India's BEST railway minister to date!

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 23 May 2016 20:21

So that is what all those car-carrier coaches were lying around at Arakonam!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 May 2016 08:37

Javee wrote:
chetak wrote:Hope that you specifically did appreciate the attender's role in the tweets
Thanks, I did after your reminder here

Never ever forget the little guys.

They are the ones who can actually make or break the system

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 24 May 2016 09:11

Javee wrote:
chetak wrote:Hope that you specifically did appreciate the attender's role in the tweets
Thanks, I did after your reminder here

Any reply from the Ministry of Railways?

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 25 May 2016 11:09

Prasad wrote:So that is what all those car-carrier coaches were lying around at Arakonam!

Looks like HMC is the first one to use the facility. SR is going to potentially bid for port bound cars as well. Dont know why it took SR, 20 years to figure this out

Any reply from the Ministry of Railways?

Nothing yet, I guess a picture would've made a big impact and also the delay in tweeting are may be the cause for no response. Monsoon will be here soon and I dont think these rakes get shared like the ICF ones, so either ways will get to know in a couple months

saip · Post by **saip** » 26 May 2016 00:15

What is this silly rule about no more than 6 bookings in a month (changed from 10) per account? I was trying to book tickets for a group of 7 on three segments. Because the railways wont allow more than six names at a time I have to make it in two groups 6+1. So three segments and two groups would make it six bookings except I booked a ticket on May 1 which was counted against my quota even though I cancelled it. I have to wait another week (June 1) to book the ticket for the one person left out. Now the railways would not allow me to book single tickets over two segments like Tanjavur to Chennai to Guntur. An airline would allow me (even Amtrack allows me). So why cant the railways get a better software?

I tried to book through makemytrip.com for that left our person but still ran into the same problem as that website too took me to railways website.

When i tried to send feed back I was limited to 250 characters and had to answer ALL the 20 questions before I could submit. The feed back wont allow me to put even the inverted commas in it.

One good thing is that after I entered the info for the six (like names, passport nos etc) it saved the data and allowed me to book tickets for the next segment without needing to reenter.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 26 May 2016 01:38

I ran into this myself recently!
IR needs to revert back to 10 at least.

Need to twitter this to suresh prabhu

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 26 May 2016 05:04

Cabinet approval for Rs 10,736 cr investment in railway projects

The Union cabinet chaired by Prime Minister Narendra Modi today approved an investment of Rs 10,736 crore in five railway projects involving decongestion of the existing network, through doubling and tripling of existing lines.

"Most of these lines are over-saturated with a capacity utilisation of more than 100 per cent. The doubling and tripling projects would benefit multiple states including Gujarat, Maharashtra, Uttar Pradesh, Odisha and Andhra Pradesh," rail minister Suresh Prabhu said.

He added the funds for implementing the projects would be sourced through a combination of Gross Budgetary Support (GBS) from the finance ministry and Extra Budgetary Resources (EBR). "Most of these projects would be completed in a period of three to five years or even before that," Prabhu said.

The projects include doubling of the 467-kilometer Pune-Miraj-Londa line in Maharashtra at a cost of Rs 3,627 crore; doubling of 116-Km Surendranagar-Rajkot project in Gujarat at a cost of Rs 1,002 crore; and doubling of 180-Km Roza-Sitapur-Burhwal broad gauge single line in Uttar Pradesh at an estimated cost of Rs 1,295 crore.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 26 May 2016 10:02

First Talgo HSR Trial Run on Bareilly-Moradabad route scheduled on May 29

Moradabad: The first trial run of Spanish-built Talgo train will be held on theBareilly-Moradabad rail routein Uttar Pradesh on May 29.

The first Talgo train trial will be conducted at a maximum speed of 115 km per hour for oscillation test.

The next trials of the Talgo trains, which are capable of hitting a maximum speed of 200 km per hour, will be conducted on Mathura-Palwal corridor and Delhi-Mumbai corridor.

Suresh Prabhu rolls out Truckferrying (RO-RO) Service at Bihta Freight Terminal

Railways launch RO-RO service to attract more loadings from Bihta Freight Terminal under Danapur Division

Railways today launched a new service ‘Ro-Ro’ to carry loaded trucks on goods train in a bid to attract more loadings and reduce carbon emission.

Railway minister Suresh Prabhu on Wednesday inaugurated the ‘Roll-on Roll-off’ (RO-RO) service through remote from New Delhi for the heavy vehicles at a function held at Bihta freight terminal under Danapur division of East Central Railway (ECR) and also Roll-on Roll-off (RO-RO) service was launched across the Digha rail bridge between Bihta and Turki stations in Bihar.
...
[T]he freight charge for carrying a loaded truck up to 15 tonnes between Bihta and Turki terminals has been fixed at Rs 4,000. For an empty truck, railways would charge Rs 2,650. However, a sum of Rs 200 will be charged for every extra tonne of freight.
...
Under the scheme, loaded trucks would be moved on the flat rakes to avoid congestion on roads across Ganges. To start with, this service is being introduced from Bihta to Turki station in Muzaffarpur district covering a distance of 88 kms.

In a rake, approximately 44 loaded/ empty trucks will be moved. A rake will perform 3 trips per day.

“We want to get back the freight we lost to roads,” Prabhu added.

Besides sand, stones can also be transported using the RO-RO service. Railways will extend the service to to cover more commodities and destinations in future.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 26 May 2016 12:24

saip wrote:What is this silly rule about no more than 6 bookings in a month (changed from 10) per account?

The original intention was to deny the touts the chance to book unlimited tickets. The touts then tried to create multiple IDs to byepass the system. But in most cases all the IDs had the same e-mail ID or address

. IRCTC did some analysis on the user database and blocked the IDs having the same e-mail ID and address

.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 26 May 2016 19:44

Assamtribune

Modi to flag off train services to Mizoram, Manipur

AGARTALA, May 26 (IANS): Prime Minister Narendra Modi on Friday will flag off passenger train services to Mizoram and Manipur on the newly-laid broad gauge line, and Kamakhya-Vaishno Devi Katra weekly train, a Railway official said on Thursday.

"The Prime Minister, accompanied by Railway Minister Suresh Prabhu, will use the remote control from Shillong to flag off the passenger train services to Mizoram and Manipur, and the Kamakhya-Vaishno Devi Katra weekly train," Northeast Frontier Railway (NFR) chief public relations officer Pranav Jyoti Sharma told IANS.

"The Kamakhya-Vaishno Devi Katra weekly train was announced in the Railway Budget 2014-15," he said.

"The Prime Minister would also attend the 65th Plenary session of the North Eastern Council (NEC) in Shillong on Friday. He will flag off the train services in the afternoon,” an NFR official said.

The metre gauge to broad gauge conversion projects of Silchar-Jiribam (52 km) rail tracks in Manipur and Silchar-Bhairabi (120 km) tracks in Mizoram were part of the Lumding-Silchar and Badarpur-Agartala gauge conversion projects.

The 437-km Lumding-Silchar and Badarpur-Agartala gauge conversion works were sanctioned in 1996 and completed earlier this year.

Another NFR official told IANS that the prime minister was scheduled to lay the foundation stone of the Agartala-Akhaura (Bangladesh) railway project and flag off regular passenger train service from Agartala to Sealdah, and Agartala to Silchar on the newly-laid broad gauge line. But these events would be held in June in Agartala.

The Rs.968-crore Agartala-Akhaura (5 km on the Indian side and 10 km on Bangladesh) railway project was finalised in January 2010 when Bangladesh Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina met the then prime minister Manmohan Singh in New Delhi.

Subsequently, Modi discussed the railway project with Sheikh Hasina during his visit to Dhaka in June 2015.

saip · Post by **saip** » 27 May 2016 01:43

Sachin wrote:
saip wrote:What is this silly rule about no more than 6 bookings in a month (changed from 10) per account?
The original intention was to deny the touts the chance to book unlimited tickets. The touts then tried to create multiple IDs to byepass the system. But in most cases all the IDs had the same e-mail ID or address . IRCTC did some analysis on the user database and blocked the IDs having the same e-mail ID and address .

I understand that. Considering that my account was created several years ago and was never misused, they could have made an exception. They could (or the software could) look at my history. Another thing when I tried to create my account originally it failed twice and I succeeded the third time. But the emails I used for the first two attempts were locked and so I do not think you can use the same email for multiple accounts. They also need an Indian cell no (they wont accept my us number) and said will verify it.

Touts use their account every month and people like me use it may be once a year.

Right now one of group is booked till Chennai and have to wait till Jun 1 for his ticket!

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 27 May 2016 10:44

>>They could (or the software could) look at my history. Another thing when I tried to create my account originally it failed twice and I succeeded the third time.

Agree. Such checks should be based on patterns and learnings rather than a simple and crude if statement in code.
if (bookings > 6)
{
return ;
}

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 27 May 2016 11:07

From June 15, Railways to start trial in which passengers can opt out of meals on Rajdhani, Shatabdi

Four decades after the first Rajdhani Express made food a compulsory facility of premium train travel in India, passengers are finally going to get the choice to not eat railway food — and not pay for it either — served on such trains.
June 15 onwards, Railways will start the much-awaited trial in which passengers can opt out of meals while booking tickets of Rajdhanis and Shatabdis.
If the passenger chooses not to eat, he/she will not have to pay either. This means paying around Rs 300 less — the catering charges levied by Railways for serving food. For trains running longer distances, catering charges are higher. The rates are different for different classes as well.
To begin with, the 45-day trial will be carried out on the Patna Rajdhani, the Delhi-Mumbai August Kranti Rajdhani, the Pune-Secunderabad Shatabdi and the Howrah-Puri Shatabdi. But officials are certain that the trial is a mere formality. The element of “freedom”, they said, will be received positively by passengers.
Complaints over food constitute majority of the negative feedback from Railway passengers. Earlier, food served on Rajdhani used to be its USP. But over the years, there has been a rise in customer complaints over quality and quantity.

The Railway Ministry has issued the policy directive and the software enabling this choice into the ticketing system has also been tested. This is how it works: while booking tickets on the IRCTC portal, the website shows a popup that asks whether the passenger would like to opt out of the meals. Selecting ‘yes’ means the payable ticket price gets reduced after the catering charges are excluded. For tickets issued at counters, the onus lies on booking officials and other staff to tell people that such an option is now available. “We will have to keep telling people till it becomes common knowledge,” said a senior official. Officials estimate that once passengers opt out of meals, they would use the huge number of e-catering options available on the website or on designated phone numbers. Third party vendors — several well-known brands have already signed up — will deliver food in the compartments. Once a passenger chooses to opt out, she cannot change the decision during the journey. This is because based on the choices, the caterer will load the required amount of food in the train. It was also proposed that if a passenger changes her mind during the journey, she could be charged around 20 per cent over and above the catering charges for availing the facility. But in the final directive, that provision has not been included.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 27 May 2016 11:10

imo their entire system needs a clean sheet rearchitecture, having been done in mid 80s around 30 years ago and with bolt on fixes since then. I think siemens info systems tried once and failed to make headway or maybe some other co - not sure of the name.

problem is whatever solution is used , the existing system still has to be 'live' as the new one is slowly brought up, tested on live flows and finally tested at the highest scale with a mix of real and simulated flows before the final cutover. some kind of web load balancer that redirects a configured fraction of traffic into the new system slowly increasing that % would work.

its better they go with a clean sheet design that caters to both browser and mobile apps use and operates at fbook scale using the latest in technology than even more bolt on updates to the existing system. being just tickets the 'tail of history' to be kept is just any pending refunds and a 2 month or whatever is the advance booking window. they could engage a cloud service provider with india wide datacenters to lease servers at various points in india to cut down latency also. the application would deploy to all such sites and reconcile different sites as I believe it does even today..this is a standard distributed database functionality....

needless to say a very complex problem, but such problems have been solved in the past worldwide. if you consider global picture, the airline ticketing systems handle more load than irctc.

this could be another signature initiative by the Rail mantri..inertia against change to a working stuff is strong and risk aversion is there is all places...FAA moved out ferrite core memory ATC computers a decade ago , they were still paying some vendor for such memories till then and I posted in US arms thread how NORAD/SAC still uses computers with 8" floppy disks with replacement due in 2017

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 27 May 2016 12:39

^^^^^^^

aren't the big airline ticketing systems world wide running on fortran systems hosted on jurrassic park vintage hardware systems, just like the back end of all major credit card companies??

no one is talking of fixing these systems, because they are extremely robust and they almost never break.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 27 May 2016 12:48

Banks! Even banks run on ancient mainframes or worse.

Btw one of the lines recently upgraded to BG -

schinnas · Post by **schinnas** » 27 May 2016 13:26

chetak wrote:^^^^^^^

aren't the big airline ticketing systems world wide running on fortran systems hosted on jurrassic park vintage hardware systems, just like the back end of all major credit card companies??

no one is talking of fixing these systems, because they are extremely robust and they almost never break.

They generally run on very powerful mainframe hardware and the hardware itself keeps getting updated. It may be vintage language and architecture design, but the hardware maal is often new and expensive. IBM mints money by upgrading these mainframes to newer versions.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 27 May 2016 13:43

^^ True. They are frequently updated. Those mainframes are designed in such a way that before you update HW/SW, the new one starts and takes over the job and Then only you remove the old one. There are examples of Main frame systems which have never been rebooted in 4-5 decades, but obviously are kept updated both in SW and HW, is what I read once somewhere. COBOL is still used in IBM/Accenture for mainframe programming.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 27 May 2016 13:57

nileshjr wrote:^^ True. They are frequently updated. Those mainframes are designed in such a way that before you update HW/SW, the new one starts and takes over the job and Then only you remove the old one. There are examples of Main frame systems which have never been rebooted in 4-5 decades, but obviously are kept updated both in SW and HW, is what I read once somewhere. COBOL is still used in IBM/Accenture for mainframe programming.

There is a company in kolkata that I visited some time ago. They do back end work for a large credit card company from the US.

FORTRAN is still used. The Main frame systems not rebooted for decades is true. The systems are so reliable that no one dares to even think of replacing them.

Enough of this sub topic for now, guys. This is way off thread onlee.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 27 May 2016 17:15

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 439292.cms?

First phase of Spanish high-speed train trials to begin on May 28

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 27 May 2016 18:24

chetak wrote:^^^^^^^

aren't the big airline ticketing systems world wide running on fortran systems hosted on jurrassic park vintage hardware systems, just like the back end of all major credit card companies??

no one is talking of fixing these systems, because they are extremely robust and they almost never break.

US nuclear forces (or whatever) still use floppy discs and some very basic language. They can save millions of USD just by switching to USB stick Salam.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 27 May 2016 20:02

well most of them do not have the load factors of irctc.
wall street invests big in latest low latency gear, message queuing systems, databases etc....they do not skimp on stuff. special fibers are laid to get few nanosecond trade execution advantages

so while fortran and cobol systems exist, there is lot of new stuff going in as well.

SRoy · Post by **SRoy** » 27 May 2016 21:20

Singha wrote:imo their entire system needs a clean sheet rearchitecture, having been done in mid 80s around 30 years ago and with bolt on fixes since then. I think siemens info systems tried once and failed to make headway or maybe some other co - not sure of the name.

Aha, that project was an add on system over whatever CONCERT runs. Portions we got to touch were stuff running on UNIX using flat ASCII files.

vsunder · Post by **vsunder** » 28 May 2016 04:15

Engine rolling has taken place between Lohardhaga and Tori on the new line in Jharkhand. Project is finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel after 14 years since being sanctioned in 2002. In 2010, Naxals had torched construction equipment and abducted workers. With the completion of this link, distance between Ranchi, the capital of Jharkhand and Delhi has been shortened by 110km with a saving of 3 hours of travel time. Tori is on an electrified and doubled line that connects via Daltonganj to Dehri-on-Sone on the Howrah-Mughalsarai grand chord. Currently Rajdhani etc from Ranchi travels the wrong direction, East and makes a huge loop before moving west towards Delhi.

Also non-interlocking work and track linking going on this weekend between, Silyari and Raipur for third line between Bilaspur and Raipur. This will complete third line between Champa to Durg(200kms) in Chattisgarh on the extremely busy and saturated Howrah-Mumbai trunk line. Durg-Rajnandgaon is being tripled and Rajnandgaon-Gondia-Nagpur sanctioned in the last budget for tripling, de-congesting a major route for moving coal and minerals. Good developments.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 28 May 2016 04:41

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 28 May 2016 14:19

Looks like a Matador pulling a BMW. i hope they get a better looking engine.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 28 May 2016 17:05

WAP 5 should go well with it, as the loco is also white.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 28 May 2016 21:36

Never understood why we have those 3 steps to get onto our coaches. And vertical too like ladders. Utterly uncomfortable and unsafe for the elderly, infirm and children.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 28 May 2016 21:46

Also, platform heights are very uneven. Hope with remodeling of the stations, these things are taken into consideration.

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 29 May 2016 07:57

Another LHB rake roof incident, this came in the news. The Chennai Mysore Shatabdi roof supposedly tore when the train was traveling, it had to be stopped midway for repairs.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 29 May 2016 15:42

ndtv

Bareilly: In a step towards realisation of India's bullet train dreams, the Railways has successfully conducted sensor trials of the Spanish Talgo coaches between Izzatnagar and Bhojipura stations.

Officials said the "super luxury" coaches were pulled by an Indian engine.

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"The coaches, which Talgo had manufactured 30 years ago, have been successfully tried in 12 countries, including Tajikistan.

"The coaches have a number of sensors and to check whether they were functioning properly, the mechanical engineer of the Railway Board had directed for a censor trial," an official said.

The speed trial of the coaches will start today between Bareilly and Moradabad and continue till June 12. The coaches would run at a speed of 115 km per hour, they said.

In another trial at Mathura-Palwal section, the coaches are expected to achieve a speed of 180 km/hour and 200 km - 220 km/hour on the New Delhi-Mumbai route.

Public Relation Officer of North-Eastern Railway, Izzatnagar division, Rajendra Singh said the sensor trial of the coaches was successful.

A three-member team of the Railway Board had arrived at the workshop on Wednesday and were given information about the Talgo coaches. A Spanish team gave a presentation and share with them detailed information about each and every equipment, he said.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 May 2016 09:20

footage of Talgo trial first run. the coaches are much lower to the ground, so one can just step in rather than climb up steps. relatively very large windows

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 May 2016 09:21

the WDG engine looks very industrial and out of place hauling the chi chi finished coaches!

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 May 2016 12:20

good pics here - they are clearly testing a shatabdi type chair car config for now, and using sandbags to simulate passengers .... and two locos

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india/in- ... xzOKL.html

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 May 2016 12:32

Talgo envisages the journey between Delhi and Mumbai can be completed in about 12 hours as compared to 17 hours at present.

Besides the officials, the coaches were filled with sand bags. There will be trial with empty coaches as well. After the trial run on the Bareilly-Moradabad line, it will be tried on Rajdhani route between Mathura and Palwal for 40 days with speed up to 180 km per hour.

^^^ at present there would be 50+ daily mum-del flights.....if we factor in 1.5 hrs flight + 2 hrs reporting before dep + 0.5 to claim baggage + 1 to reach city center in offpeak and 2 in peak .... comes to 5-6 hrs for a insipid kind of journey.

I think it will find a lot of takers esp kids (!) if they can really run this in 12 hrs and provide a couple of decent packed and heated meals with some TV entertainment. people will eat for 2 hrs , watch TV/read for 3 hrs and sleep/look at scenery for the rest...

a section of rajdhani pax will also upgrade

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 30 May 2016 13:14

If you offer in-train wifi, even paid, it might even turn some business travelers.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 30 May 2016 13:19

If IR chooses Talgo, they need to increase width of the coach by 6-7 inches. Right now, there is a big gap between train and platform.

Wondering who will the manufactures of Talgos in India, I wish it will be by private companies. Govt of India should make sure that Indian private companies hold 74% or 51% in that join venture. Unlike some smaller nations, Indian market is very big for Talgo, so Govt should make sure our companies get control of any joint ventures.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 May 2016 14:51

yes the coaches need to be wider to accomodate the 3+3 IR seating. right now its 2+2