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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 05:32 
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BRFite

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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 05:42 
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BRF Oldie

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One question. If it is already painted in IAF colors, why does it have our flag on its tail instead of the IAF's usual fin flash or roundels?


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 05:49 
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It is not a full IAF bird yet - it still has a Brazilian civilian registry number (PT-ZNA) - so no roundels or fin flash. (My best guess.)


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 06:13 
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Antonio from Brazil has the video of the flight! :) This aircraft is a real beauty!



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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 07:08 
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No reverse thrusters.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 07:21 
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BRFite

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huh looks like this was not the first flight. At 2:20 an unpainted aircraft lands. So, they must have already done some flight testing and decided to reveal the flying ac only after initial flight tests were passed.

Or are there two prototypes. But both seem to have PT-ZNA as the tail number (not clear on the unpainted ac though).


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 07:53 
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Aditya_V wrote:
Hmm aldready Painted IAF and not DRDO??.


See it again- its an Indian flag, not the IAF fin flash and no IAF roundel either.

This thing looks f****n awesome ! Going to be my wallpaper for some days till we get pics of NP-1's first flight.


Last edited by Kartik on 08 Dec 2011 08:47, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 08:13 
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:D :D :D :D

Congratulation DRDO/IAF


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 08:20 
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the blending in of that unpainted primer a/c landing was a good chini touch by our brazilian friend. leaves open the question as to how many are flying or the lone proto flying for how long and whether people are lying about no systems being integrated yet...he he he.....ofcourse a bit of shrubbery in the foreground and having to run with a jerky handheld camcorder when a local cop car arrives would be have been better.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 08:35 
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Embraer rocks!


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 08:48 
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BRF Oldie

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They surely do. Dec 7th was the date given for first flight and they've not disappointed.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 09:21 
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takeaway - get rid of the corpse called Indo-Rus MTA and hook in with them for MTA-Nuova.

atleast we will see it in our lifetimes and IAF order will reduce unit cost.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 09:22 
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Singha don't say that - you do not want philip saar to lump brazil witht he capitalists, zionist etc etc group


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 10:25 
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Raman wrote:
It is not a full IAF bird yet - it still has a Brazilian civilian registry number (PT-ZNA) - so no roundels or fin flash. (My best guess.)


spot on...!!


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 12:15 
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a comment on livefist. from a brazilian pov...

Gilberto Rezende said...

We in Brazil are very happy with that joint with Embraer and DRDO because the success of that project could be a first of many Hindu-Brazilian projects.

IF this endeavor proves it is possible effective work two almost opposite tech cultures, Brazil and India could do much help to each other.

India is much more advance in military technologies in general than Brazil and spend so much more but in some areas despite the monetary inferiority Brazil have some to present as a partner.

Must because that lack and continuity of funding Brazilian military and their engineers must be much more careful and conservative in their projects to nail it precisely...

If we can work the cultural tech differences, the result could be very good if both countries manage to increase projects just when Brazil could finally raise the military investments due the near waited oil commercial exploitation in the pre-salt area in the next 5 years.

IF the MMRCA contest and the Brazilian FX-2 goes goes both to the French Rafale it will open a large avenue to many military projects may be target to possible collaboration between Brazil and India...

I hope will be the case...
Lead by this pilot project...


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 12:34 
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BRFite

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sorry to rain on the parade.. but I am not sure what was overall DRDO input in the design of the aircraft and its overall superficial look...

following image is of the same platform for Brazilian Air Force..sure Embraer has been class act for a while...

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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 13:34 
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Prithwiraj wrote:
sorry to rain on the parade.. but I am not sure what was overall DRDO input in the design of the aircraft and its overall superficial look...

following image is of the same platform for Brazilian Air Force..sure Embraer has been class act for a while...
......


Why do you even bother to ask? Can't you really see what has been changed in the exteriors? other than the ERJ regular shape, every thing is damn different.

do you really expected the modification look like F-22 or USS Enterprise?


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 13:51 
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chackojoseph wrote:
Prithwiraj wrote:
sorry to rain on the parade.. but I am not sure what was overall DRDO input in the design of the aircraft and its overall superficial look...

following image is of the same platform for Brazilian Air Force..sure Embraer has been class act for a while...
......


Why do you even bother to ask? Can't you really see what has been changed in the exteriors? other than the ERJ regular shape, every thing is damn different.

do you really expected the modification look like F-22 or USS Enterprise?


real fun in not the exteriors.. that's all I meant.. if you start jumping in joy by looking at the exterior of an .....


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 15:15 
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Surya wrote:
Singha don't say that - you do not want philip saar to lump brazil witht he capitalists, zionist etc etc group


By the way Brazilian chick are "better" than any Natasha.
K


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 15:17 
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Singha wrote:

Gilberto Rezende said...

We in Brazil are very happy with that joint with Embraer and DRDO because the success of that project could be a first of many Hindu-Brazilian projects.
military projects may be target to possible collaboration between Brazil and India...


.....Hindu-Brazilan projects.

I LIKE THAT


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 16:00 
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its good that the balance beam and the extra vertical antennas were reused from the Ereyie design. these affect the aerodynamics of the plane and embraer would already have licked any stability and stress issues for their national AF. our puppy has more bulges and antennas because we will look to cram in powerful SIGINT and EW capabilities that brazil which operates in a low threat env does not need to care about - yet.

the pakis should also be happy as they can do == given the similar size of the balance beam housing.

if you notice the legs of the balance beam, ours are much fatter and flat looking indicating our radar may be heavier than the original ereyie...whether this is due to "more power" or we are lacking in radar tech vs that ericsson radar is not clear to me.
our beam is also longer imo - there is a overhang ahead of the front legs and the back end goes upto between the twin engines.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 18:12 
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What a mean-looking plane.
Can anyone start figuring out what those antennae and sensors might be?


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 19:51 
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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 21:08 
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Prithwiraj wrote:

real fun in not the exteriors.. that's all I meant.. if you start jumping in joy by looking at the exterior of an .....


Without all those extra antennae our AEW&C would not have the added capabilities that it is designed to have (as compared to other ERJ145 based systems).

Indian side decided on what antennae to put and where to put them. Not a trivial job as there are 50 antennae on a plane that small. Indian side decided on the design of the AESA even wrt to it's aerodynamic profile.

Interiors would be relatively easier as the a/c is already qualified to take that load and you would not change the aerodynamic characteristics by putting stuff inside it (as opposed to modding the outer shell).

Sorry to say but you seem to lack some basic understanding of the project and what work (from indian side) will go into it.

I suggest you view this entire presentation made in the previous Aero-India about AEW&C.



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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2011 21:15 
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Craig Alpert wrote:
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Imagine we modify our Rambha similarly as a high end ELINT/Jammer. Porkis and *deleted* will be shitting in their pants.

I love the a$$ part of this AWACS.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 08:22 
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rambha is the ideal platform for a desi growler...hopefully this project brings to the table a lot of modules and sw necessary for a growler role.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 09:17 
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Nice looking chick. I like them petite :wink: but as far as AEW&C are concerned this one seems a lil to petite. Wonder what kind of platform we will move to for the next batch.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 09:24 
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Embraer does have bigger jets upto around 737 size in its stable...but if the idea is to contain cost and offload some fns to ground based nodes, the EBM145 or its next larger cousin the EMB175 is the sweet spot. if you look at their website, all their planes have a 2100nm type of range, with the bigger ones carrying more passengers....so unless we need the extra space for more processing racks or operators, smaller is cheaper and more chankian.

the turkish and australia wedgetail looks like a ideal size to me for our next batch of phalcons but remains to be decided with Elta if they can provide a similar T-shaped system or current triangle is still better. we could either go 737 or A330 route. this would be the big dog in the hunting pack with full onboard processing.

http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/i ... ast_lg.jpg


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 10:05 
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Should it not need an yell-band unit? I am sure we need it track and support pak-fa-ish as well. SYRE people up north east will start yelling "jai 20" by 2020.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 11:49 
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BRFite

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Question: Maybe this should be in the newbie thread.

With modern radar arrays, we do not need a rotating antennae system. So we are seeing this antennae unit as a piggy back long this, kinda of like a cylinder. Now the question is wouldn't it be possible to have the array in the tail of the aircraft. Please note that yes conformal skin antennae's are being talked around , but I am not talking of them. What I am saying is, have two tails, with the outer sides of them having the array inside and the inner side having the cooling array. This is the solid part of the tail. The trailing edge of the tail has the usual rudder for control. So what I am saying is a slightly fatter tail section, with the radar array inside it.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 12:48 
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BRFite

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i have a small query can an embraer 195 able to accommodate our future AEW&C equipment if we go for a rotordome :?:


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 13:43 
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VinayG wrote:
i have a small query can an embraer 195 able to accommodate our future AEW&C equipment if we go for a rotordome :?:


no ... yes .. may be


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 13:48 
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probably not


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 16:19 
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Kersi D wrote:
Singha wrote:

Gilberto Rezende said...

We in Brazil are very happy with that joint with Embraer and DRDO because the success of that project could be a first of many Hindu-Brazilian projects.
military projects may be target to possible collaboration between Brazil and India...


.....Hindu-Brazilan projects.

I LIKE THAT


in many parts of the world, particularly latin cultures, "hindu" == indian and "indian" == native american


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 22:36 
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the real fun will begin when we replace the currently planned radar with a local GMTI/SAR radar tuned to our enemies and change the operator sw for the ground battle control role. no cismoa, no eula, no lectures or advisories.

night will turn to day and the fog of war finally penetrated on a 24x7 basis.

my spider feeling is , its the 2nd product that will come off this basic EMB145 design...and it will follow closely.


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PostPosted: 09 Dec 2011 23:11 
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Vinay G wrote:
i have a small query can an embraer 195 able to accommodate our future AEW&C equipment if we go for a rotordrome :?:


Anything can be done at a cost of redesign.

Just as a FYI, the "rotodome" normally rotates. In the case of the Phalcon it does not rotate. And, the "rotodome" is designed to generate a lift that is about the same weight as itself.


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2011 00:10 
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BRFite

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Singha, when we have the Mark II of this bird, we will have a Desi JSTAR... sort of a DEATH STAR for the Pukes and the Lizard!!!


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2011 00:17 
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SDRE's with the AEWC Courtesy: Tarmak007

Prying plane co-piloted by ASTE CTP Gp Capt Tiwari


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2011 19:44 
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Masha-allah, subhan allah. This baby looks deadlier then even our Phalcons. We must procue atleast 100s of this awacs.


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2011 20:48 
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Prithwiraj wrote:
sorry to rain on the parade.. but I am not sure what was overall DRDO input in the design of the aircraft and its overall superficial look...

following image is of the same platform for Brazilian Air Force..sure Embraer has been class act for a while...

Image


I can see some glaring differences.
Image


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