Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

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Kakkaji
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Kakkaji »

Wanted to study last-minute issues: Defence minister Manohar Parrikar on deferred IAF deals
GURGAON: Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar today said he has deferred a decision on a joint bid by Tata Sons and Airbus to replace IAF's Avro transport aircraft fleet as also the procurement of 106 Swiss Pilatus basic trainer aircraft because he wanted more information on these deals.

He also said that though no decision has been taken on the next course of action as regards the scrapped minesweeper deal with a South Korean firm, the "general thinking" is that the eight vessels would be built at the Goa Shipyard.

"It was because I wanted to study the issues, some of which cropped up at the last minute," Parrikar told reporters when asked why the decision on the aircraft deals had been deferred.

Speaking on the sidelines of an event here, the minister, however, did not elaborate as to what the issues were.

He said the project could be again taken up when the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) next meets. Parrikar has already made it clear that instead of meeting just once a month, the DAC could meet whenever needed, even with a smaller agenda.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by wig »

MoD to change policy on blacklisting foreign firms
In an effort to strike a balance between tackling corruption in defence deals and having a method to deal with foreign companies who pay bribes, the Ministry of Defence will soon come out a policy of graded punishments and do away with ‘uniform blacklisting’ of foreign companies.

This will be in line with the decision the MoD took in August when it did not blacklist Finmeccanica, which owns AgustaWestland but offered a solution of graded punishment which ensured that no ongoing project would suffer. The company was contracted to supply 12 AW 101 helicopters for VVIP travel in India which was mired in allegations of kickbacks.

In August, the MoD took a decision that the company will go ahead with all contracts under execution; continue supply of spares and upgrades to India. However, all contracts in which the company had been declared lowest bidder after competition shall be put on hold till further orders. The MoD said in case of fresh tender or request for proposal, Finmeccanica will not be invited.

The company is in contention for Indian military contracts worth over $6 billion (approx Rs 36,000 crore).

Sources in the MoD said a new policy is being considered and ‘blacklisting’ a firm may not be good option as it just forecloses options for India. The challenge is from unscrupulous corrupt elements on one side and cutting down the delays in equipping the forces with the best equipment, weapons and aircraft, on the other.

The question remains how to deal with foreign companies who, despite being the best in their class, offer bribes or are forced to offer bribe to bag contracts in India.

“Blacklisting clearly has not deterred bribe-seekers in India, but may have contributed in slowing down acquisition. Punish the wrongdoer but why punish the forces by denying them technology and the equipment,” said a source.

A “partial ban” — instead of what could have been a “complete” one – was the option for Finmeccanica in August. It also marks a shift from the term of Defence Minister AK Antony who used to order “blacklisting” of armament companies after allegations of corruption and bribery. On March 28, 2012, speaking in Parliament, Antony confessed: “If a written complaint, even if anonymous, was received, I used to forward it for inquiry”.

The case in which the second such case after the Narendra Modi-led government ruled out blacklisting of global engine manufacturer Rolls-Royce, which too is under the CBI scanner for allegedly employing agents, on the grounds of “operational urgency and national security”.

The engine maker had agents for its contract for supply of engines to the petroleum and natural gas ministry and had nothing to do with the Ministry of Defence.

Minister of State for Defence Rao Inderjit Singh, who has had served under Antony in UPA-I, before he shifted his loyalties to the BJP and handles the same portfolio, has publically spoken about how blanket blacklisting was causing harm.

What it means

* The Ministry of Defence plans to do away with ‘uniform blacklisting’ of foreign companies and give graded punishment to wrongdoers

* This is in line with the ministry's decision in August to punish Finmeccanica, which owns AgustaWestland, but not blacklist it

* This will help keep unscrupulous elements at bay without affecting the supply of equipping and technology to the armed forces
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2014/20141125/nation.htm#13
Austin
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Austin »

Indian Radar Buys Prompt Thales Joint Venture

Image
Indian defense ground radar requirements have driven the creation of a new Franco-Indian joint venture between Thales and Bharat Electronics (BEL), after a two-year delay. BEL-Thales Systems will enable the French company to meet Indian offset and technology transfer commitments associated with an Indian Air Force (IAF) order for 19 radars.

Thales holds 26 percent of the new company, and state-owned Bharat Electronics the other 74 percent. It has been created to design, develop, market, supply and support ground-based civilian and military radars. While Thales’s main strengths are in systems engineering, integration and testing, BEL has manufactured radars for the military. Thales will supply six of the 19 Ground Smarter (GS100) low level transportable radars (LLTR) that the IAF has ordered from France, with the other 13 to be assembled in BEL's facility near Delhi in Ghaziabad. Based on the Thales SR3D, the GS100 is a mobile, modular, multifunctional radar dedicated to tracking complex target maneuvers at low altitude. It offers operational performance out to 180 km.

Meanwhile, an indigenous 4D LLTR named Ashwini, using active arrays, is being developed by the Defense Research Development Organization (DRDO) radar design laboratory. The IAF has indicated an order for 18 and a total requirement for 67 of these. It is not clear if BEL-Thales Systems will manufacture Ashwini.

In the near future, meanwhile, the IAF is likely to issue an RFP for another mobile air defense radar requirement, for which the Franco-Indian partnership will offer the ControlMaster 60 radar. In fact, this could be the first product to be rolled out of the company's facility, AIN has learned. It is optimized for mobile air defense operation with a search-on-the-move capability and for engagement of conventional and asymmetric threats in harsh environments, clutter and intense jamming conditions and simultaneous multiple engagements.

The Indian army also has a large requirement for ground radar. It has sought bids for 66 Air Defence Fire Control Radars (ADFCRs) to begin the process of replacing as many as 450 older radars in its inventory. Airbus D&S last year reported that it was one of three bidders, offering a land-based version of its naval TRD-3D radar in cooperation with Indian partner Larsen and Toubro.

Thales is a major partner in Team Rafale, which is still trying to conclude the $20 billion medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) contract with the Indian Air Force. Despite the arrival of the new Indian government and the overhaul and clarification of offset and technology transfer rules, leading to the BEL-Thales joint venture, no progress has been reported in the MMRCA negotiations, which have dragged on for nearly three years.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Austin »

25-November, 2014 15:34 IST
Reducing Dependence on Weapon Imports ( MOD Press )

Government constantly reviews the security scenario and accordingly decides to induct appropriate defence equipment. This is a continuous process undertaken through procurement from various indigenous as well as foreign vendors to keep the Armed Forces in a state of readiness. Procurement from indigenous vendors accounts for a significant share in Capital acquisition.

The total expenditure on direct payments to foreign vendors for Capital Acquisitions for the Army, Navy and Air Force during the last five years was ₹ 103535.52 crore.

Defence Production Policy focusses on greater self-reliance in defence production. Government has also raised the FDI limit in defence production from 26% to 49% and liberalised the licensing regime. The Defence Procurement Procedure 2013 lays emphasis on providing the desired boost to indigenous Defence Industry by mandating a higher preference to the ‘Buy (Indian)’, ‘Buy & Make (Indian)’ and ‘Make’ categorisation in Capital Procurement.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri Manohar Parrikar in a written reply to Shri Husain Dalwaiin Rajya Sabha today.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

wig wrote: “Blacklisting clearly has not deterred bribe-seekers in India, but may have contributed in slowing down acquisition. Punish the wrongdoer but why punish the forces by denying them technology and the equipment,” said a source.
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2014/20141125/nation.htm#13[/quote]

I am just playing devils advocate here. A full ban could not deter, so a partial ban will help? What is the guarantee that the not banned part won't indulge in corruption?

I know a lot of people will attack me for saying this, but let me put it here anyway. BRADMINS can delete the post if unsuitable.

Think about it. A certain Minister shifts party when the black listings come into force and opposition to increased FDI. The party then starts attacking the blacklists. Then it comes to power and tries to work around the black lists and increases FDI. The certain minister is back on seat. can you connect this? The minister was ejected for alleged reason but could not be proved.

On the question if forces can be denied technology. The reply is no. But the question is who is causing corruption because of which the forces are loosing the technological edge?

Was the ban ineffective, or did someone make the ban ineffective.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by kit »

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/russia ... erboardrss

Something that catches the eye despite all sorts of weapon procurements .... Everyone forgets that the nuclear deterrent is still the core security policy and posture of all the major nuclear powers.
and that includes the hyper power USA as well
Kakkaji
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Kakkaji »

chackojoseph wrote:
Was the ban ineffective, or did someone make the ban ineffective.
Chacko Saar:

Anthony Bhai's bans were very effective - in denying equipment and technology to the Indian Armed Forces. :roll:
Victor
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Victor »

chackojoseph wrote:
wig wrote: But the question is who is causing corruption because of which the forces are loosing the technological edge?
What corruption? It seems a simple allegation made by an anonymous phone call was enough for Shri Anthony, the Minister of Defenselessness.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

So, the corruption does not exist. Why even partial bans? Give them a clean chit. Who stops them from doing it now? What is a partially corrupt company?

How many cases are there where a mere anon phone call has resulted in black listing without investigation?
Karan M
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

Why dont you just get to calling Modi names, whilst praising the Saint and be done with it? Thats where you end up at anyways. So cut to the chase.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Rahul M »

denel was blacklisted (destroying bhim project) on the sole basis of an article in a little known south african magazine.

here's the best part, the mag was owned by a paki and shut shop a few months after that. anti-corruption my foot !
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

The number of idiotic blacklists includes IMI - the sole source of our Anti tank ammo, the collaborators in our 155mm ammo program, Arjun consultancy.. includes Rheinmetall, the makers of the Ahead Gun combo and 120mm tank ammo.. making sure our AAD options foreclosed (nor did Saint do anything to kickstart local alternatives)...Agusta's overpriced VIP choppers were cleared whereas IAF requirements for bread and butter ones grew longer, and then AW gets blacklisted, lol.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

Who got it blacklisted? The corrupted or the corruption buster? The buster gets the blame. What about the corrupt?

Denel, IMI cases were proved by law. There were no arbitrary blacklists.

My 2 cents.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

The dude was probably so corrupt that he selectively black listed firms. Another two bits.
Karan M
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

Where was IMI case proven by law.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

IMI lost even the blacklist contest in court in 2013.
Karan M
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

LOL, what happened to the CBI prosecution of the OFB guys btw under the Saint? Enquiring minds want to know. All the kings horses and the kings men can't disguise that twits actions.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by tsarkar »

CJ,

The Denel blacklist was criminal. As Rahul said, based on an obscure South African newspaper, the entire Bhim project was scrapped.

Imagine if we got Bhim 10-15 years ago. It was beyond anything anyone had.

It still is, hope the project is revived.
Last edited by tsarkar on 01 Dec 2014 09:14, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Avarachan »

Rahul M wrote:denel was blacklisted (destroying bhim project) on the sole basis of an article in a little known south african magazine.

here's the best part, the mag was owned by a paki and shut shop a few months after that. anti-corruption my foot !
Rahul M, thank you for your post. I didn't know this. (In general, I don't follow Army news/developments ... I focus on the IAF.) It seems that there was an intentional effort by certain parties (and willing collaboration by others) to hobble the Army. I wish RM Parrikar success in straightening out this mess.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Paul »

I recall Renuka Chaudhary playing a role in the sordid episode where Denel was banned. She may have written the letter to the Raksha Mantri which led to the ban
Karan M
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

Avarachan wrote:
Rahul M wrote:denel was blacklisted (destroying bhim project) on the sole basis of an article in a little known south african magazine.

here's the best part, the mag was owned by a paki and shut shop a few months after that. anti-corruption my foot !
Rahul M, thank you for your post. I didn't know this. (In general, I don't follow Army news/developments ... I focus on the IAF.) It seems that there was an intentional effort by certain parties (and willing collaboration by others) to hobble the Army. I wish RM Parrikar success in straightening out this mess.
Aji, just check out how bad Su serviceability got under Antony's tenure, the ammo issue for IA, the naval fracas ...he basically twiddled his thumbs while Rome burnt.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

I won't bat for Denel, but most here already know my disappointment with cancellation of Bhim project, which was close to my heart as I did my best to defend the Arjun project. When Denel was blacklisted, we reacted with aghast and wow. Aghast that Bhim is off and wow that India was serious about rooting corruption. Opinions and blacklisting parameters changed from there on. At the same time, as I remember from the past, the Bhim project was a 'Project' and one among the competitors for the same. There was no assured induction and we all knew Army's attitude towards the Arjun project. That is my perspective.

However, it does not diminish my reasoning from my previous posts.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by ramana »

AKA was Minster for Defencelessness.
Traitor was irresponsible and made India defenceless

He did not stop corruption. Case in point Augusta helicopters and what else.
By his blacklisting he made sure India was disarmed.

by cutting off funds he made sure Kilos didnt have batteries.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by PratikDas »

chackojoseph wrote:On the question if forces can be denied technology. The reply is no.
This is just wrong. Someone who works with news should know better.

The Congress government's anti-corruption ruse was most effective in denying the Indian armed forces much needed hardware. AKA was part and parcel.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by uddu »

Is there any plans to fit the ATAGS turret to Arjun chassis?
Let them bring three variants, towed, tracked and wheeled variants.
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Post by chackojoseph »

PratikDas and Ramanna,

AKA is long gone. The political factor is not my point and hence I have avoided it as visible. The current points are on my first post, which includes a politician in question.

Secondly, it is factually incorrect that there were no spares due to "MoD blacklist." Or can someone point that out if it was and to what extent it was? Rolls Royce was not blacklisted as it effected the operational issues. As I see, newer projects were disrupted.

Antony not providing funds, being ineffective etc are not pertaining to black listing for corruption. I am not mixing it up.

I am hoping someone will reply to the first post, where we have taken corruption as an necessary evil to equip our forces.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by PratikDas »

chackojoseph wrote:On the question if forces can be denied technology. The reply is no.
You were wrong about this. You lose respect and credibility for even stating this as someone who manages news. If anything, you've only volunteered yourself as a prime example of bias in India-centric news media.
chackojoseph wrote:I am hoping someone will reply to the first post, where we have taken corruption as an necessary evil to equip our forces.
You are wrong about this as well. We have done nothing of the sort. You have only wrongly assumed it to be the case. We have only decided to punish the wrongdoing individuals and not the organisation. I work in a company of more than 100,000 employees. If one rotten apple in my company, a leader in its field, is found guilty of corrupt practices, I certainly hope my whole company isn't portrayed as being corrupt and excluded from providing world-best technology to the customer.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

I don't mind loosing respect which I have been threatened with regularly. You can skip that point. nowdays, i take it as implied. I do not understand what is wrong with the sentence "On the question if forces can be denied technology. The reply is no." I have no idea what you are talking about.

Rotten apple in the company is company's problem. Company want wash away it's hands. As for the customer, he is company's representative.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by PratikDas »

After you have finished playing the victim, you state
chackojoseph wrote:I do not understand what is wrong with the sentence "On the question if forces can be denied technology. The reply is no." I have no idea what you are talking about.
Yes, you do. You wrote that with the implication that the previous method for dealing with corruption did not result in the denial of technology to the Indian armed forces. This is just wrong and you know better but you pretend not to know that and you pretend not to even understand what was so wrong.

Reminds me of how some famous Americans have survived examination in court, "I have no recollection of that".
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by PratikDas »

chackojoseph wrote:Rotten apple in the company is company's problem. Company want wash away it's hands. As for the customer, he is company's representative.
He may only been one of many representatives from the company to that customer. What do you do with this inconvenient data point?
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by chackojoseph »

You are inventing it up. Where i have said that "previous method for dealing with corruption did not result in the denial of technology to the Indian armed forces. "

On the rotten apple, why is it convenient? it's obvious. Show me the counter. A company representative, especially at CEO and top management level is the company's face to the customer. I do not agree with you.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by PratikDas »

So now you have proof of CEO level bribery?
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

chackojoseph wrote:I don't mind loosing respect which I have been threatened with regularly. You can skip that point. nowdays, i take it as implied.
Those who cant give respect etc etc, pot calling kettle etc etc
Simply put because of personal political preferences when you loath the current PM and establishment so much, and venerate the prior gent who was culpable to a high degree in undermining Indian national security, its hard to take any of your other pronouncements about them seriously.
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Post by chackojoseph »

KaranM,

The problem here is not me. It is corruption. I am not the subject of this discussion. I am a participant and creator of this discussion. I am entitled to have my views. If you do not like it, you have no reason for personal attacks. If you have nothing to say about the corruption part, you have a choice to leave the discussion.

My political preference and my opinion of the current PM has not been articulated by me here and you have no right to assign such motives on me. My ballot is secret.

As mentioned earlier, I am not willing for a political debate, except to the one I have mentioned in my first post which is relevant to current situation. You are free to debate it (meaning subject to rules of the forum and decision of Mod's), but don't drag me me in personally or don't manufacture my political allegiance or hate for someone.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Karan M »

Chacko, pointing out your political bias colors all your "assessments" is hardly a personal attack.

Unfortunately, you have the habit of taking any and every critique personally, so I guess your response on similar lines was to be expected.

You have made no secret of your contempt for the current PM and his dispensation with the use of frequently provocative language & abuse, claiming that it is not out in the open and not on this forum is to take everyone for a grand ride.

Meanwhile, your love and respect for the prior DM is also obvious, with your frequent defense of his actions.

Why deny your beliefs? Admit it & be done with it.

On the one hand, you have been yelling from the pulpit about how you are justified about your views & on the other hand you wish to deny the reality?

You are welcome to your beliefs & welcome to hold on to them & abuse, hate the PM & the current dispensation. Its a free country.

As are we, to point out how your political bias ensures that your pronouncements of being objective need to be taken with a ton of salt.

As regards corruption, the record of the prior DM - turning a blind eye to the Tatra scam, the umpteen other scams/misappropriations that went on in his tenure with the armed services hitting a nadir in terms of serviceability and capability, speak for themselves.

You can continue to, as they say, put lipstick on a pig, but it doesnt fly.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Kakkaji »

Government clears 10 proposals for manufacturing defence equipment
NEW DELHI: The government has cleared 10 proposals for manufacturing defence equipment and explosives, besides several industrial licences of companies including Tata Motors, Punj Lloyd and Pipavav that had been pending for the past several years.

The licensing committee chaired by the department of industrial policy and promotion (DIPP) secretary Amitabh Kant on Tuesday cleared most of the 35 projects listed for grant of industrial licence.

Applications for defence production from major players like Piramal Systems and Technologies, Bharti Shipyard, Tata Motors, M&M, Bharti Shipyards, Punj Lloyd and Pipavav got approval, along with the permission to procure foreign direct investment.
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments

Post by Thakur_B »

Kakkaji wrote:Government clears 10 proposals for manufacturing defence equipment
NEW DELHI: The government has cleared 10 proposals for manufacturing defence equipment and explosives, besides several industrial licences of companies including Tata Motors, Punj Lloyd and Pipavav that had been pending for the past several years.

The licensing committee chaired by the department of industrial policy and promotion (DIPP) secretary Amitabh Kant on Tuesday cleared most of the 35 projects listed for grant of industrial licence.

Applications for defence production from major players like Piramal Systems and Technologies, Bharti Shipyard, Tata Motors, M&M, Bharti Shipyards, Punj Lloyd and Pipavav got approval, along with the permission to procure foreign direct investment.
Some of these companies, like Punj Lloyd have had small arms and artillery licences for years now. They are yet to introduce one original design/concept/prototype.
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Post by pankajs »

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/defence-mini ... 585-3.html

Defence ministry clears proposals worth Rs 4,500 crore
The defence ministry on Wednesday cleared procurement proposals worth around Rs.4,500 crore, ministry sources said.

The proposals were cleared by Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar-headed Defence Acquisition Council (DAC), the apex decision-making body in the ministry.

The proposals include one for acquiring four survey vessels for the navy worth Rs.2,324 crore.

The DAC also cleared an upgradation along with annual maintenance contract of the Samyukta electronic warfare system for the army at an estimated cost of Rs.1,682 crore.

The sources also said a proposal for heavy drop system P-7, which is a platform for dropping heavy vehicles with a parachute, was also cleared. The amount sanctioned for the project was Rs.400 crore.

The sources added that the decision paves the way for issuance of a fresh Request for Proposal by the navy for four survey vessels.

An amount of Rs.36 crore was also sanctioned for buying engines for offshore patrol vessels of the Coast Guard.
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