Pakistan arms sales, ops, doctrine, etc

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 30 Sep 2015 21:06

Paul wrote:Safi does not appear to be a Pakjabi. He speaks with a Pushto accent, not shortage of anti India rhetoric though

Madam Mazari complained on Twitter that pathan Safi is stalking her because of her brain , brawn and beauty . She did not explain whether it was in real life or in dream world.

arun · Post by **arun** » 06 Oct 2015 20:45

X Posted from the “Pakistani Role In Global Terrorism’ thread”

The nefarious activities of the Intelligence Arm of the Uniformed Jihadi’s of the Punjabi dominated Military the Inter Services Intelligence Directorate aka ISI aka ISID..

New Taliban leader Mullah Mansour 'is businessman protected by Pakistan' :

Telegraph, UK

The New York Times Article cited by the Telegraph:

Taliban’s New Leader Strengthens His Hold With Intrigue and Battlefield Victory

arun · Post by **arun** » 06 Oct 2015 20:58

X Posted from the “Baluchistan: The Story of Another Pakistan Military Genocide” thread.

Pakistan's battle against Balochistan separatists sparks anger and suspicion

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 07 Oct 2015 09:21

China to build four submarines in Karachi
http://www.dawn.com/news/1211363/china- ... in-karachi

ISLAMABAD: China will build in Karachi four of eight submarines that it is selling to Pakistan.

Minister for Defence Production Rana Tanveer Hussain told at the inauguration of the Defence Export Promotion Organisation (DEPO) Display Centre in the federal capital that the deal for the acquisition of submarines from China had been finalised and four of them would be built here.
He further said that construction of the submarines would simultaneously begin in Pakistan and China.China, he said, would transfer the technology to Pakistan for submarine construction.Mr Hussain did not specify when the construction would begin, but said it would be happening soon. A training centre would be set up in Karachi for this purpose.The minister did not either say which type of submarines were being purchased from China. It is, however, speculated that the deal was for Yuan-class Type-041 diesel-electric submarines equipped with AIP systems.Navy has been pursuing different options for expanding its submarine fleet. Naval officials say that more submarines were needed to address force imbalance with India, which too is increasing and modernising its fleet of submarines.Pakistan had earlier explored the options of buying submarines from France and Germany, but those deals did not materialise.

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 07 Oct 2015 09:29

^Probably like they build ships in Myanmar, with everything but the geographical location Chinese.

sudeepj · Post by **sudeepj** » 07 Oct 2015 23:54

India needs to
1. Hold Parliamentary hearings and issue a list of state sponsors of terrorism every year.
2. Declare Pakistan a terrorist state.
3. Impose sanctions on those entities and economies that supply defense equipment to Pakistan.

If you sell anything to them, you arent selling so much as a nut here for the next 20 years. There is virtually no cost to suppliers of weapons to PakMil and we pay for those in blood.

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 08 Oct 2015 06:21

^Won't work, so long as Khan is their chief patron along with the cheapest source of high technology in the west, along with being a large source of foreign investment.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 10 Oct 2015 18:17

SSG video on Dunya TV by Wajahat Khan. Watch the Kathak in background, makes it interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5Vvzhc74vA

VKumar · Post by **VKumar** » 10 Oct 2015 18:38

India doesn't have the guts to declare TSP a terrorist state. Once that is done, there has to be follow through, which we cannot do.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 10 Oct 2015 18:59

nice program. our sikular MSM are too busy in trying to ignite communal riots, manufacture opinion and widen the cracks on any faultline than do any real reporting.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 10 Oct 2015 19:04

Thought we told him that. No?

Pakistan army 'godfather' of Taliban: US expert

Manish_P · Post by **Manish_P** » 10 Oct 2015 20:15

^ Nope

Not even close

It's the B@$%^#& child of the rich khan and one of his regular prostitutes

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 10 Oct 2015 20:18

VKumar wrote:India doesn't have the guts to declare TSP a terrorist state. Once that is done, there has to be follow through, which we cannot do.

pappi jhappi, aman ki tamasha, importing onions, ghulam ali shutting down samjautha exp, reducing paki embassy staff, paki "medical" visa, our religious visa, everything will come to a grinding halt

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 11 Oct 2015 06:54

The SSG kathak at the beginning of Wajahat's video reminded me of Pakeezah. Can you spotthe similarity?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubQ9hrKO6XI

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 11 Oct 2015 07:39

Paul wrote:The SSG kathak at the beginning of Wajahat's video reminded me of Pakeezah. Can you spotthe similarity?

Paul I watched 3 minutes of that 35 minute SSG video. I could not see any "kathak" or did you mean Kathak in a humorous sense ie there was some background movement which you call as Kathak. Could you post a time link to where Kathak happens? Can't watch 35 minutes of Paki propaganda to understand what you are talking about. Also such inline videos take a lot of time to load on mobile devices in India where speeds do not exceed 3G unless one is near a wifi connection, and I can't even ignore the video because it does not allow the text of other posts to load.

One of the objections I have to such Paki videos is that they advertise the Paki SSG and not all Indian viewers are going to think it is funny. Many will take it seriously and be in awe of Paki army methods and time and again I find Indians critical of a shoddily made media Doordarshan presentation of Indian army versus this obvious ISPR propaganda video.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 11 Oct 2015 08:05

Doc, I changed the inlined link to post the URL. If you watch from 6:00 min - approx 10 min of that video you will see the SSG personnel steps at the correspendent's back are kinda similar to the courtesans performing Kathak behind Meena Kumari's back in the Pakeezah song in the other video I posted. I found it entertaining and thought I would point it out.

Wajahat is known for ISPR sponsored progs on Pak TV. I have been following him for some time since he asked that infamous question to the previous Indian army chief. He is obviously an ISI asset (probably an army brat) and now that I think of it it is disturbing that he was allowed preferred access to ask questions of the IA chief at an Indian today conclave. The video is posted in utube somewhere.

The other purpose of of that video is see if any data mining can be done sto identify any interesting tactic or equipment used by SSG. One thing I found is that the heaviest caliber of their Anti material rifle is 12.7mm and there are much heavier weapons available on the arms market.

member_29089 · Post by **member_29089** » 11 Oct 2015 08:31

Paul wrote:SSG video on Dunya TV by Wajahat Khan. Watch the Kathak in background, makes it interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5Vvzhc74vA

Truly impressive weapons and training. But it seems like an overkill to deal with the raa agents operating in every major cities of pakistan. Even in pakistan the raa agents mostly carry Thair Saadam. And it's no match for the array of weapons the SSG have. I hope DovalJi takes notice. We are far far behind dealing with violence in the neighborhood.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 11 Oct 2015 08:38

SSG is the cream of the PA, it will get preferential access to all weaponry. If SSG has a Barrett aniper rifle it does not mean all the battalions of the PA will get this weapon. The rest of the PA has to make to with Dragunovs. Obviously funding is a constraint. This video is a marketing gimmick to bolster the image of the PA in the eyes of the aam abdul. The target audience is within pakistan, not outside the country.

On top of this, I don't think SSG has more than 2-3 brigades with one more unit for the navy as compared to the Indian army which has Special forces running into thousands if you count SFF, Marcos, NSG etc. I am not even including the Paras here.

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 11 Oct 2015 08:41

^Why are the kammandus so scrawny. Even tribal naxals seem more TFTA than paki downhill experts these days.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 11 Oct 2015 09:07

What is interesting to me is the consistent ability of Pakistan to use propaganda in a way that makes Indians look really stupid. Of course our armed forces are bringing out better videos now but our media simply do not have the skill. interest or awareness.

If you watch Discovery weapons programs there is this macho looking baldy who looks badass talking about badass weapons - but this badass guy is just that little bit deferential towards the actual military guys - a deliberate ploy that says "You think I am tough? Wait till you meet these guys"

This Pakis has copied that style. Watch the way he walks around - like a tough guy. Of course he has not learned his lines well and keel saying "uhhh". But the production is aimed at showing the toughness of the Paki army. Folks I can make a video showing how tough anyone can be - it's all in the way it is done.

In the days before videos - Pakis used to publish some really good propaganda pics. The Indian media are simply not there yet. the fact is we get some great videos from the US and Russia as well. We need someone who can understand what needs to be shown and what needs to be hidden. Bollywood does not cut it

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 11 Oct 2015 09:50

^+1. More like bollywood bred on paki money just doesn't want it nor does the congi lick spittle presstitutes.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 11 Oct 2015 10:09

Paul wrote:The SSG kathak at the beginning of Wajahat's video reminded me of Pakeezah. Can you spotthe similarity?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubQ9hrKO6XI

Good video , The host himself is very knowledgeable person on matters of small arms.

The guys looks like NSG equivalent of Pakistan SF , specialised in AT ops

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 11 Oct 2015 10:35

Paul wrote:SSG is the cream of the PA, it will get preferential access to all weaponry. .

A whole lot if jihadis out of uniform are trained by SSG and are killing our men. Pakistan has a bigger army and bigger body of kamandu trained men than meets the eye. Border action teams are jihadis+SSG

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 11 Oct 2015 10:43

shiv wrote: If you watch Discovery weapons programs there is this macho looking baldy who looks badass talking about badass weapons - but this badass guy is just that little bit deferential towards the actual military guys - a deliberate ploy that says "You think I am tough? Wait till you meet these guys"<SNIP>

Shiv - that bald 'bad ass' guy is himself an ex Navy SEAL.

So, information coming out from his mouth will sound that much more authentic to western English speaking audience who've been fed tales about invisibility of SEAL, Green Beret, Delta and SAS.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 11 Oct 2015 10:57

the program looks like a total paid advert though. no critical evaluation, all fluff words.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 11 Oct 2015 11:03

rohitvats wrote:
shiv wrote: If you watch Discovery weapons programs there is this macho looking baldy who looks badass talking about badass weapons - but this badass guy is just that little bit deferential towards the actual military guys - a deliberate ploy that says "You think I am tough? Wait till you meet these guys"<SNIP>
Shiv - that bald 'bad ass' guy is himself an ex Navy SEAL.

That is the way to make a good video no? Take an out-of-job SEAL and make him an actor

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 11 Oct 2015 11:50

Rahul M wrote:the program looks like a total paid advert though. no critical evaluation, all fluff words.

As it is supposed to be, when its a program featuring your own soldiers.

We who have been fed on a steady diet of hostile, masochistic, self-flagellating, ignorant drivel by presstitutes who cannot identify the ass end of a rifle from its business end, might feel uncomfortable seeing this, but this is how it should be (save for the corny kathak moves and such).

Usually, we have a bunch of morons presenting such programs over here (save for the scarce faujis who do it themselves), hence we are unfamiliar with the style we think is reserved only for the TFTA western sahibs.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 11 Oct 2015 14:29

nope. it is stupid and anyone with half a brain will see through it. the trick is to adopt a faux neutral tone and put in a couple of token criticisms in order to appear balanced. the bbc types do it very well.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 11 Oct 2015 14:36

seriously what's with the kathak, they are making a mockery out of a weapons drill by doing it in this fashion just for this dude and the show. its way beyond the usual 1-2 drills forces usually perform for media crew. its not even a public event. the pakistani army will pimp themselves for any bit of PR.

and that compere, trying to act tough with a bandanna and what's with the faux hip holster, holding what? his cell phone??

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 11 Oct 2015 14:39

I think SSG is way ahead of Indian special forces in one aspect. SSG is not only a regiment, but also a formation with command level leadership and controls the training establishments. The helicopter aviation there is under the Army so it all seems to be very tightly knit.

Over here IA could not even pull off a separate SF regiment. And all talk of Special Forces command has been just that. The training is handled party by Air Force thru PTS and part by Army.

We also have a multitude of units with different mandates and org setup like NSG who is under MHA has a police structure and leadership and 22SF/Mavericks who probably report to PMO. In Pakistan SSG handles all these tasks and is thus a focal point.

Paul wrote:SSG is the cream of the PA, it will get preferential access to all weaponry. If SSG has a Barrett aniper rifle it does not mean all the battalions of the PA will get this weapon. The rest of the PA has to make to with Dragunovs. Obviously funding is a constraint. This video is a marketing gimmick to bolster the image of the PA in the eyes of the aam abdul. The target audience is within pakistan, not outside the country.

On top of this, I don't think SSG has more than 2-3 brigades with one more unit for the navy as compared to the Indian army which has Special forces running into thousands if you count SFF, Marcos, NSG etc. I am not even including the Paras here.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 11 Oct 2015 14:48

the 'capt.' abid (?) is probably a pashtun, going by his accent.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Oct 2015 14:54

The presenter has modelled himself on the takla who goes around on natgeo or discovery ultimate weapons to pimp American and Israeli kit. Pzh2k was only exception. Takla muscular "israeli security agent types" are also invited by such programs to explain some things like krav maga or cornershot.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 11 Oct 2015 16:31

Rahul M wrote:the 'capt.' abid (?) is probably a pashtun, going by his accent.

I was about to post that!! even the sniper najeeb is a pashtun.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 11 Oct 2015 16:35

Singha wrote:The presenter has modelled himself on the takla who goes around on natgeo or discovery ultimate weapons to pimp American and Israeli kit. Pzh2k was only exception.

this dude was breathing heavily after even going around on his knees for 5 mins. all show and hype while copying desi style onlee.
http://mybigredbag.com/wp-content/uploa ... nkPant.jpg

and PA put on a show and tell of its entire SSG armory for the show. note, no robots/IED handling devices. no UAVs. no mention of any advanced comms.
for all the talk of super sophistication TFTA and angrez and sooper educated, the SSG seem to be struggling with angrezi. the punjabi guy sounds paindu. what was that again about TFTA sophistication, hain jee? journo tapping soldier on helmet and acting all fancy. looks like feudal satrap coming to visit his rustic orderlies. even so, interesting program.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Oct 2015 19:05

the only one with worse dress sense than damadji is siddharth mallya...

http://www.missmalini.com/wp-content/up ... 2132_n.gif

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 12 Oct 2015 06:39

Rahul M wrote:nope. it is stupid and anyone with half a brain will see through it. the trick is to adopt a faux neutral tone and put in a couple of token criticisms in order to appear balanced. the bbc types do it very well.

Ah, but that is true only for the BBC's target audience. This is directed at the SDRE types in paki land (even if the RAPES consider themselves otherwise, their minds are and will always be SDRE). When our citizens become as "sophisticated" as the western audiences, I guess such nuanced and subtle tricks will be employed here as well. Currently, the only criticism we see in our media is the destructive type rather than the constructive type.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 12 Oct 2015 17:36

puhleez, pakis are not worthy of being SDRE's. they are TFTA and let them remain so.

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 12 Oct 2015 18:01

Rahul M wrote:puhleez, pakis are not worthy of being SDRE's. they are TFTA and let them remain so.

Touche, you are right, my bad

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 14 Oct 2015 21:26

Pakistan will build 4 of 8 purchased in China submarine S-20

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1523113.html

Model of Chinese export submarine S-20 (c) sina.com.cn

As part of the July deal on the purchase of the Pakistan Navy 8 Chinese submarines of Project S-20, a total value of up to $ 5 billion, four boats will be built with the participation of Chinese experts in Karachi, said the Minister of Defense Industry of the country Rana Tanvir Hussain at the opening of the exhibition center Organization support for defense exports in Islamabad.

This boat building in Pakistan and China will start at the same time, he added. China will give Pakistan a significant amount of technology, and to train personnel in Karachi, Pakistan Chinese will set up a special training center.

S-20 - a smaller version of the Chinese non-nuclear submarines of Project 039A Yuan, they have a submerged displacement of 2,300 tons, the crew of 38 persons, cruising range of 8,000 miles. The boat has a modular design and on request can be equipped with AIP. The deal to sell S-20 to Pakistan - the largest contract in the history of Chinese arms exports.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 14 Oct 2015 21:36

any junk china makes, pakistan buys