Mangalyaan: ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

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Pratyush
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Pratyush »

The first of 6 planned orbit raising maneuver was completed in the Morning.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by rahulm »

Details of 1st orbit raising:

Motor: 440 N
Time started : 1:17 AM IST
Burn duration: 7 minutes
apogee: raised from 23,566 km to 28,825 km
perigee: raised from 247 km to 252 km

next burn Friday AM 2:15 IST for approx 582 seconds

All data from ISRO raises Mars spacecraft’s orbit

In this mission, the burns have to be precise because Magalyaan does not have fuel margin.

Another article Mars baton shifts to ISTRAC

In addition to ISRO's own antenna's at Byalalu, NASA stations at Canberra, Madrid and Goldstone are providing support to ISRO to track Magalyaan. The Canberra station is actually at Tidbinbilla
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Gagan »

Congratulations ISRO !

These are the Mars Orbiter Mission Groundstations:
Image
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Bade »

From the link rahulm posted, this needs highlighting the most. This is a science mission. Even MAVEN will be exploring the methane issue. The point is earth based observatories have claimed large patches of methane on Mars. Curiosity has not seen it on the ground, but it is not like the rover went all over the planet in search for it.
The science looks good, too. There have been some criticisms of the decision to include a methane detector on the mission. Recent results from NASA's Curiosity Mars rover suggest that methane gas will be hard to find in the Martian atmosphere, and the Indian detector will return a negative result. This expectation is sometimes presented as if there is no point in flying the methane experiment on the Mars Orbiter Mission.

Again, this is silly. Science is not a treasure hunt. It is the quest for truth, even when the truth is not as inspiring as our expectations. The Indian mission will nicely complement the ground data from NASA's rover. Two independent results from different missions in different places will forge a stronger case. There is probably no methane on Mars, and the data from these two missions will settle the question.

In addition, there are four other scientific payloads on the mission, including a colour camera. All of them are worthwhile. The heavy focus on the Martian atmosphere by this mission also offers more bang for the buck.

The fate of the Martian atmosphere, which is believed to have been thicker in the past, is one of the hottest questions in planetary science today. Like NASA's upcoming MAVEN mission, itself largely focused on atmospheric questions, India's orbiter will help to resolve other mysteries besides the hunt for methane.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Bade »

Of all the articles and commentaries posted in this thread, the one from Mars Daily and the article written by Vahia of tifr are the best. Rest are mostly whine fest.

BTW, guess who hosted an International low-cost planetary mission workshop participated by all leading world agencies, it was none other than the ex-chairman of ISRO :lol: who has been whining the most.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by wilson_th »

It is also one of a small number of nations to have successfully recovered a satellite from space. Indian satellites are used in communications, weather observation and land management. This vast nation would be much worse off without the benefits of its space program.
When did we recover a satellite from space?
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by vinod »

Please pardon my ignorance:

Can some gurus explain why there is a lot of smoke when the rocket is lifting off? I was thinking by now we would have engines which burn cleanly. Is it because they use solid fuels and not liquid fuel? Compare the smoke trail to this chinese launch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aXRYZpFKfw
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Lalmohan »

the smoky engine is a common problem in indian aircraft and is due to the use of scooter helmets
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Sridhar »

See photos of a Prithvi launch (liquid) vs. Agni (solid) to see the different burn/flame/smoke patterns of liquid vs. solid engines.

The space capsule recovery experiment (SRE-1) involved launching a satellite into orbit, and then safely bringing it back to earth.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by negi »

vinod wrote:Please pardon my ignorance:

Can some gurus explain why there is a lot of smoke when the rocket is lifting off? I was thinking by now we would have engines which burn cleanly. Is it because they use solid fuels and not liquid fuel? Compare the smoke trail to this chinese launch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aXRYZpFKfw
All Ammonium perchlorate composite propellants give a very dense white smoke trail due to presence of aluminium oxide in the exhaust.
PSLVs boosters and 1st stage use HTPB bound solid ammonium perchlorate and aluminium compound.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by ramana »

yes vinod, when solid propellants burn a lot of smoke is generated. Need all those metal particles to add mass to the exhaust gases. The ISRO launchers have solid boosters and main stage made with solid propellants. Its soon to change once the semi-cryogenic stage SC 200 comes into play.

SRE-1 space capsule is a recovered satellite in a manner of speaking.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Rahul M »

wilson_th wrote:
It is also one of a small number of nations to have successfully recovered a satellite from space. Indian satellites are used in communications, weather observation and land management. This vast nation would be much worse off without the benefits of its space program.
When did we recover a satellite from space?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Cap ... Experiment
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by putnanja »

The schedule of orbit raising manoeuvres. The one on Nov 7th has been done successfully. The others will be done in the coming days.

ISRO rehearses orbit-raising manoeuvres for Mars orbiter
“The overall health of the spacecraft is normal. Systems on the orbiter such as gyros, accelerometer and star-sensors have been calibrated. In the spacecraft, everything is working normally,” Dr. Annadurai said. ISRO Chairman K. Radhakrishnan told a press conference at Sriharikota on October 30 that after the Mars orbiter’s apogee is raised first on November 7 to 28,793 km, the second firing of the engine will take place on November 8 early morning. This second firing will take the orbiter’s apogee to about 40,000 km from the earth. The third orbit-raising operation will take place on November 9 when the apogee will be boosted to about 70,656 km. The fourth orbit-raising operation will take place on November 11 when the apogee will reach about one lakh km. The fifth manoeuvre will be done on November 16 when the apogee will reach 1.99 lakh km from the earth.

Dr. Radhakrishnan added: “We will then a have a crucial event — the trans-Martian injection [of the orbiter] from the earth-orbit towards Mars, which will take place at 0042 hours on December 1. This is the immediate action programme for the Mars orbiter. We have a long voyage of 300 days.


On September 24, 2014, we are planning to have the Mars orbit insertion of the spacecraft. Once it is successfully done, we will go for the experiments.”

The orbiter has five scientific instruments for analysing the Mars’ surface features, to find out whether it has methane and to study its mineralogy and the atmosphere.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by vinod »

ramana wrote:yes vinod, when solid propellants burn a lot of smoke is generated. Need all those metal particles to add mass to the exhaust gases. The ISRO launchers have solid boosters and main stage made with solid propellants. Its soon to change once the semi-cryogenic stage SC 200 comes into play.
Thanks negi, sridhar and ramana. Any explanation\article you guys have as to why ISRO chose solid and not liquid?

@lalmohan: hmmm.. interesting perspective. Since a lot of hot air is coming out through the back side, it may be due to a lot of bad dal being consumed! Did you consider that? :D
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Lalmohan »

vinod - sorry, couldnt resist - its a brf classic
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by rsingh »

6 more dhoti shivering moments before 1st Dec :eek:
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Rahul M »

@LM :mrgreen:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24851242
India Mars probe makes first engine burn
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by KJo »

Is ISRO a highly coveted employer in India? I mean, do the top students line up for interview?
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by negi »

^ Yep they are damn good. Going by what they have achieved them seem to have a very good eye for talent.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by NRao »

ISRO is also *managed* very well. Something that was recognized as far back as the 70-80s.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Rahul M »

and they have their own institute to train future talent.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by manoba »

The most immediate danger, right now, could be the sun belching out some major X class Solar Flares as it's ramping up towards its 11-year cycle of Solar maximum.

It has been shooting out some serious X2, X3 flares this way since late October. 5, Nov being the most powerful as it peaked to X3.3 and a magnetic crochet also recorded. It's not just MOM, but all other satellites and ISS may be at the mercy these storms.

More serious flares are expected and the sun will be very active for some weeks. All the space agencies are monitoring the sun closely.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Yayavar »

Rahul M wrote:@LM :mrgreen:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24851242
India Mars probe makes first engine burn
with the obligatory last paragraph..but otherwise good. Didnt know the maneuver is termed Hohnmann transfer orbit.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by SaiK »

^let us pray those flares bypass our mom. we can do a surya pooja to ward it off! ;)

read this:
http://www.firstpost.com/india/ignore-t ... 13461.html
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Sridhar »

Vinod,

The best reference for reading about ISRO's evolution, and also specifically about why it chose the technologies it chose is N Gopal Raj's book titled "Reach for the Stars". It was written in 2003 and hence does not cover more recent developments, but it is an excellent reference nevertheless.

The short answer is that ISRO chose a low-risk, high return strategy, progressively building on its solid capabilities developed since the early sounding rocket days, and crucially for the SLV-3. ISRO's capabilities in liquid engines was behind that for solid engines, and it could also be argued that the easy experience of acquiring the technology for the Viking engine (adapted as the Vikas engine) was meant to accelerate capability building on liquids, but had the unintended consequence of slowing it down. The capabilities for liquid engines are building up however, and will be fully tested in the GSLV-MK3 with its liquid core stage, and the future UMLVs with their semi-cryo stages.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by SaiK »

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/367 ... tists.html
while we dhoti shiver & god fearing, the amrikhans eat peanuts while the russians pea on the wheel nuts.

so, everyone has their belief system.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by ArmenT »

Gagan wrote:Congratulations ISRO !

These are the Mars Orbiter Mission Groundstations:
Looks like DD's infographic dude doesn't know where Port Blair is. :evil:
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by manoba »

SaiK wrote:^let us pray those flares bypass our mom. we can do a surya pooja to ward it off! ;)

read this:
http://www.firstpost.com/india/ignore-t ... 13461.html
Pessimist, no Sir. Far from it. MoM is protected. 400% sure. It has its good ration of Shree Yantra to attract luck and ward of evil eye, Surya Yantra to dodge solar flare, Sandal paste-Kumkum on MoM's Agni Moola to appease heat and radiation, Mangal Yantra to go Tango with Mangal graha and a Rajni Kanth photo to take care of the rest :mrgreen:

Only, we humble admi don't know these classified details. Now, they call me a conspiracy theorist, sigh.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by SaiK »

NRao wrote:ISRO is also *managed* very well. Something that was recognized as far back as the 70-80s.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/saritharai/ ... ate-costs/
5 points by forbes:

1. “I don’t like the phrase ‘frugal engineering’. ISRO’s general philosophy is cost effectiveness. The Russians look for robustness and the Americans go after optimization. Our aim at ISRO was how do we get the Mars mission done on a budget.”

2. “We adopted a modular approach. Take the launch vehicle, for instance. We acquired the technology for the Vikas engine in the 1970s by working with the French. There was no money transaction. We have since produced 120 such engines with Indian materials and fully fabricated here. For every successive launch, we have taken the base of our previous, proven launch technology, modified and built on it. Here, we had to add the cryo to the previous module as we needed higher power. We used the same modular tactic with our payload. Our approach gave us cost and schedule advantages.”

3. “When we conducted ground tests – which are time consuming and expensive – we kept the number of tests small but wrung out the best out of each. This is our way, historically.”

4. “For transferring Mangalyaan from the earth’s orbit to Mars’ orbit, we used a couple of strategies to bring down fuel consumption drastically.”

5. “We are schedule-driven to the extreme. That prevents cost over-runs. This mission has taken 15 months from the time our Prime minister announced it in August last year it to the liftoff. In parts of Europe, even space scientists have 35-hour work weeks. Here, 18-hour days are common. During the launch period, many of our scientists were working for 20 hour-days. Being time effective makes us cost effective.”
4 - 6 hours sleep onleee :shock: !
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by KJo »

Allah rehem kar!
I hope ISRO doesn't have the beemari of our ITVITY companies of oneupmanship over how many hours a day one worked!

After a certain point one's decision making gets impaired.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by ramana »

Vinod, Sridhar has answered the question on why ISRO chose solids first.

I too dont like cheap, frugal etc.

Its AGILE and Lean and Affordable.
ALA to use KoJo's phrase!
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by disha »

^^Vinod,

If you study the space shuttle, the solid rocket boosters provide some 80% of the thrust. And Solid motor technology is getting efficient.

Solid motors are not going to go out of fashion. Atleast in the next 50 years, their demise has been constantly predicted and is still considered premature.

So what gives? As space applications evolve, a rocket designer would like to have a choice of engines around. Ranging from Solid to clustered liquids to cryogenic to semi-cryogenic. Since it has its advantages and dis-advantages.

Think of solid rocket engines as truck engines. Or mules. They may not be sophisticated (in reality they are actually very sophisticated) but they provide the muscle. On the other hand think of cryogenic engines as lamborghini (or my fav. tesla "engines") they are sleek, powerful, exotic. And they can get certain jobs done better than solid engines and worse than solid engines.

Hence for each space application, given a choice of well-tested engines, a rocket designer can customize a solution! To haul say two geo sats (10 tonnes!) -something like 5 school buses - you will use solid boosters to provide major thrust and liq./cryo for fine tuning., course correction etc.

On the other hand if you are say launching a gaganviharin (moi is getting old :-()., then a liq/cryo with some legup using a solid booster will do.

So the discussion of solid is better vs. cryo is better vs. liq. is better is moot. It is like comparing a truck with a lotus (another car) with Honda van. It has its uses, you do not put kids and lumber in your lotus, or your GHQs/SHQs in your truck (some do, based again on application as I say) ...
Sridhar wrote:
The best reference for reading about ISRO's evolution, and also specifically about why it chose the technologies it chose is N Gopal Raj's book titled "Reach for the Stars". It was written in 2003 and hence does not cover more recent developments, but it is an excellent reference nevertheless.

The short answer is that ISRO chose a low-risk, high return strategy, progressively building on its solid capabilities developed since the early sounding rocket days, and crucially for the SLV-3. ...
Sridharji, I would not call ISRO' choice as "low risk", it was given the budgetary and industrial constraints a prudent choice. And ISRO is not behind liq. tech either - PSLV is a very well designed stack of solid and liq. stages!!

Also with GSLV, barring manufacturing defects, the liq. tech. is good - it is the cryo stage where ISRO is working things out.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by krisna »

some sdres and some good goras are giving it back to those DIE and assorted gora log regarding Mangalyaan mission-
My dear friends please wait unitl 2030 the scenario will change. The developed countries too more than hundred years to become “Developed” If you go back to the ancient history India was the most developed country then.. :) ) So please give us some more time folks. George Washington became the first President of US in 1789. India got independence only in 1947. US is 158 years ahead of India.. India will take another 15-20 years to reach that level..
That is what they said when India sent satellite in the 1970… But today more than a 100000 where saved in one of the states from a cyclone stronger than Sandy… Just imagine the loss if the warning was not available. We can say that the amount spent on this was earned by saving those people thereby. saving some financial loss. ISRO earned the amount and has the right to do more research and use it as it likes to use. Imagine 100 years down the line if minerals have to be bought back from Mars. Indian rockets can do it in at the cost that you make a movie..

The Hollywood film Gravity took 100 million dollars to make.
India’s mission to mars took 75 million dollars to fund.

… it costs more to make movies about space, than to actually go to mars. Good job India!
the one
of course many more in other articles-- Internet yindoos on the rise. 8)
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by svinayak »

Ancient Chinese saying
“As poor as India is, New Delhi managed to carry out its Mars exploration programme with a budget of only $73 million, much less than the spending of China and Japan,” the newspaper said.

“Nonetheless,” it added, “it is not immune from critics at home and abroad, who wonder whether it’s worthy for a country where more than 350 million people live on less than $1.25 a day and one third of the population are plagued by power shortages to spend millions of dollars travelling hundreds of millions of kilometres for a few Mars pictures.”
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Comer »

08-11-2013
The second orbit raising manueour of Mars Orbiter Spacecraft, starting at 02:18:51 hrs(IST) on Nov 08, 2013, with a burn time of 570.6 seconds has been successfully completed.The observed change in Apogee is from 28814 km to 40186 km.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Victor »

wilson_th wrote:
It is also one of a small number of nations to have successfully recovered a satellite from space. Indian satellites are used in communications, weather observation and land management. This vast nation would be much worse off without the benefits of its space program.
When did we recover a satellite from space?
SRE-1, Jan 2007
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by shyamoo »

saravana wrote:
08-11-2013
The second orbit raising manueour of Mars Orbiter Spacecraft, starting at 02:18:51 hrs(IST) on Nov 08, 2013, with a burn time of 570.6 seconds has been successfully completed.The observed change in Apogee is from 28814 km to 40186 km.
What was the expected apogee?
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by SriKumar »

^^^ Per putnanja's posted link to Hindu article, it is 'around 40,000 km'. The other apogees are also mentioned below in boldtype.
putnanja wrote:The schedule of orbit raising manoeuvres. The one on Nov 7th has been done successfully. The others will be done in the coming days.

ISRO rehearses orbit-raising manoeuvres for Mars orbiter
“The overall health of the spacecraft is normal. Systems on the orbiter such as gyros, accelerometer and star-sensors have been calibrated. In the spacecraft, everything is working normally,” Dr. Annadurai said. ISRO Chairman K. Radhakrishnan told a press conference at Sriharikota on October 30 that after the Mars orbiter’s apogee is raised first on November 7 to 28,793 km, the second firing of the engine will take place on November 8 early morning. This second firing will take the orbiter’s apogee to about 40,000 km from the earth. The third orbit-raising operation will take place on November 9 when the apogee will be boosted to about 70,656 km. The fourth orbit-raising operation will take place on November 11 when the apogee will reach about one lakh km. The fifth manoeuvre will be done on November 16 when the apogee will reach 1.99 lakh km from the earth.

Dr. Radhakrishnan added: “We will then a have a crucial event — the trans-Martian injection [of the orbiter] from the earth-orbit towards Mars, which will take place at 0042 hours on December 1. This is the immediate action programme for the Mars orbiter. We have a long voyage of 300 days.
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by Vinod Ji »

vnmshyam wrote: What was the expected apogee?
Image
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Re: Mangalyaan : ISRO's Mars Orbiter Mission

Post by member_23901 »

I have a question regarding the efficiency of the fuel consumption. I am not aware of ISRO's score on this and tried doing research on same but proving futile. Though, somebody had suggested for our Agni V that the reason for its range to weight ratio being so low compared to its peers might be due to inefficient burning of fuel. Can somebody shed some light in this regard.
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