GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

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ramana
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by ramana »

Now to finish up Durga.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by disha »

BTW, I think I also contributed to the success of GSLV-D5 in my own small way:

I contacted one Mr. Vidhnaharta, a very wise, intelligent and humorous person who runs heavenly business and slipped him a $20 donation true AAP style.

In true indic style, even if rationalization is required or not, all should be propitiated in small or big ways.

ISRO did its homework (or hardwork or both), and I think Mr. Vidhnaharta took care of the auspicious side of equations.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by disha »

<Mods., fortunately there is not much post launch discussions - so feel free to depassivate this thread just like CUS>
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

It would nice to read, in the coming days, some of the details of the travails and challenges ISRO went through to produce this cryogenic engine and stage. What gave them the most difficulty, engineering wise, manufacturing wise. How did they solve the peculiar engineering or manufacturing issue. What were the innovations, modifications they made over the years. What, if any, were the innovations, even patents, created in the process of developing the engine and stage.

Perhaps the next "Frontline" issue( coming out this Wednesday) will have an article by the dependable T.S.S, covering these aspects. One doesn't want any classified information, just elucidation and inspiring stories.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

dhiraj wrote:heard in DD , some ISRO official mentioned next GSLV flight in September
GREAT :D
Excellent news, if accurate! From what can be gathered from various sources, it looks like there will be a PSLV launch with IRNSS-2 in February-March, another PSLV with SRE-2 and probably a Cartosat in April, Astrosat with PSLV in June-July, GSLV in September. Also, somewhere in here is a purely commercial launch of SPOT satellite by PSLV. 5 more launches, 6 for the whole year when you include the GSLV that was just launched. The only doubt is about Astrosat, but they did say last year that it would be launched in 2014.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by sanjaykumar »

Yeah but what about the SDRE-1 mission?

Great job ISRO. Unfortunately you have just set the bar higher for yourselves.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by LakshO »

nrshah wrote:Great achievement. Will surely speed up development of heavy launchers.
beside i wish we see PSLV made entirely by some private sector and Isro move to more challenging things rather than 'aam admi' types PsLv
^^+1
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Bade »

Actually it is the GSLV which should be farmed out to industry over a period of time, since it will be used mainly for launching comm and military satellites, with occasional inter planetary probes/landers etc.

PSLV will be launching mostly research class satellites and the IRS series used by govt agencies largely and a variety of science payloads to LEO. So IMO it should remain within ISRO, except for more components which are farmed out to industry which I believe is already the case.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by ramana »

Acharya wrote:http://www.spaceflightnow.com/gslv/d5/1 ... snFCvRDtXE
Much of the attention on Sunday's launch will focus on the GSLV, the centerpiece of India's ambition to become a fully independent space power. Without the GSLV, India must launch its heaviest satellites on foreign rockets such as the European Ariane 5.

India grounded the GSLV following a pair of launch failures in 2010 - first a premature shutdown of the GSLV's Indian cryogenic upper stage in April, then an explosive mishap shortly after liftoff on another mission in December.

Engineers are confident they have fixed the problems.

"We are sure, with the adjustments we have made and the meticulous reviews we have gone through, this stage should perform precisely, and we'll have a very successful GSLV mission," said S. Ramakrishnan, director of India's Vikram Sarabhai Space Center, last summer before the Aug. 19 launch attempt. "I'm sure with the kind of teamwork we have, and the kind of people we have with us, we will be able to definitely overcome any issue or problem, and GSLV will also be operational one day as PSLV."

India's Polar Satellite Launch Vehicle, or PSLV, has racked up a string of 24 straight successful launches dating back to 1994. But the PSLV's capacity is limited to satellites bound for low orbits or smaller spacecraft heading for higher altitudes.

But the GSLV has a worse record. ISRO has declared four failures in the GSLV's seven launches since 2001.

The success of the all-Indian GSLV, known as the GSLV Mk.2, will give India an independent route to space for its communications satellites and planned interplanetary probes. India currently launches its largest communications payloads on foreign rockets, such as Europe's Ariane 5.

The GSLV Mk.2 configuration can loft payloads weighing more than 5,000 pounds to geosynchronous transfer orbit, the drop-off point for most communications satellites.

Sunday's flight will feature an Indian-built hydrogen-fueled third stage built to replace a Russian-provided engine used on the GSLV Mk.1 model, the rocket's early variant.

International missile and defense technology agreements stipulated Russia could only provide readymade third stages for the GSLV, forcing India to start an in-house program to design and build its own upper stage.

The Indian upper stage failed during its first test flight in April 2010, when the engine's fuel turbopump failed about one second after igniting, dooming the mission. Another GSLV launch with a Russian third stage disintegrated in a fireball less than a minute after liftoff in December 2010, a failure caused by the "untimely and inadvertent snapping of connectors" between the GSLV's computer and the control system on its four liquid-fueled strap-on boosters.

Since 2010, Indian engineers made a number of improvements to the GSLV, including a redesign of the third stage engine's fuel turbopump to account for the expansion and contraction of bearings and casings as super-cold liquid propellant flows through the engine.

Officials also modified the third stage's ignition sequence to ensure the "smooth, successful and sustained ignition" for the main engine, steering engine and gas generator system.

India also made improvements to the third stage engine's protective shroud and a wire tunnel in the third stage. Engineers revised their understanding of the aerodynamic characteristics of the GSLV and added an on-board camera system to better monitor the rocket's performance in flight
.

Before approving the improved GSLV for flight, India completed two acceptance tests of the GSLV's third stage fuel turbopump to ensure it will not succumb to the same problem that plagued the April 2010 launch. Engineers also put the third stage engine into a vacuum chamber to simulate ignition at high altitude.

The third stage engine, designed to produce nearly 16,860 pounds of thrust, will take over 4 minutes, 54 seconds after liftoff.

The third stage engine will fire for 12 minutes during Sunday's launch to inject the GSAT 14 satellite into a geosynchronous transfer orbit with a low point of 111 miles, a high point of 22,353 miles and an inclination of 19.3 degrees
.

GSAT 14's own propulsion system will raise the low point, or perigee, of its orbit to an altitude of 22,300 miles and align its orbit over the equator to begin a 12-year mission.

disha, I don't know if you recall we had both tried to do a root cause and corrective action on the turbopump when the first failure happened. Here the bolded parts are the RC and CA which were completed prior to the above flight.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by SaiK »

I wish they had cameras in all the stages for public view and right up to payload deployed finally to orbit.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by hnair »

Ramanaji, a kudremukh talks about the bearings' sub-millimeter diff from design value, caused run away dhoti-shibering, that build up and shattered thingies that go whirr.

Btw, the significance of a reliable design in upper-stages is understood only when one realizes that khan keeps stroking his Centaur stage since the 50s and calls it "my precious" for a reason :D Goddamn thing has been polished to a highly reliable state since that grand master of fun designs, Karel Bossart dreamed up those stainless steel balloon tanks. The only thing they kept changing are the payload attachment thingies' diameter. Bossart's baby is as much a crown jewel of khan's space crown, as the more glamorous SSME and saturn V engines

Also, despite the conventional wisdom here in BRF, a nation with a reliable, large diameter solid booster should strongly prefer retaining a more stouter solid first-stage for any man-rated vehicle for just one reason - reliability (and at a later date, easy re-usability by splashdowns). Heck, even khan (canned Ares) and oiros (upcoming Araine VI' first and second stages) got the general idea - send crew in simplified, safe vehicles, while using cryo-shyo stages as separate cargo haulers (Atlas/Delta and Araine 5) for hauling the rest of mission's checkin baggage

Let those who invented "Crazy Ivan" moves and Middle-xeroxers, keep using semi-cryo

(those :(( endlessly about strapping on video cams, read the report above - looks like y'all are not invited to the party. Not yet... )
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by nvishal »

If the cryo is indeed production ready then we can mate it to the PSLV and loose its four strap ons?
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by SSridhar »

There was a question here about whether India makes cryo tanks.

HAL Supplied Cryogenic Fuel Tanks for GSLV-D05 - The Hindu
Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) supplied the cryogenic fuel tanks and the cryo stage structures that formed part of the GSLV-D5, which was successfully launched on Sunday, the public enterprise has said.

HAL integrated and provided the four small ‘L40’ booster rockets strapped on to the first stage. L40 denotes the 40 tonnes of liquid fuel they carry.

It also provided the basic structure of the communication satellite GSAT-14, an assembly of composite and metallic honeycomb sandwich panels with a composite cylinder. HAL routinely supplies these pieces of hardware for the Indian Space Research Organisation’s launch vehicle as well as spacecraft programmes.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by rohitvats »

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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Manish Jain »

An odd bit in reddit AMA -

"[–]ISROredditors[S] 2 points 13 hours ago*

Our cryo is based on a Russian engine built in the 60s. Our real breakthrough will be the Cryo engine of MKIII"

Basically, they were saying that present cryo is outdated and MKIII cryo will be up to date. Hard to reconcile it with what we've been reading here.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Singha »

its a huge challenge even to 'clone' such tech. I would imagine not even the manufacturing TOT for the 7 russian engines we got were fully transferred before Unkil put an end to that, let alone design secrets.

sure the MkIII CUS might be a more cleansheet design, but there is no need to beat ourself up on the mkII engine as well....it need lot of attempts to this launch done properly.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by TSJones »

Btw, the significance of a reliable design in upper-stages is understood only when one realizes that khan keeps stroking his Centaur stage since the 50s and calls it "my precious" for a reason Goddamn thing has been polished to a highly reliable state since that grand master of fun designs, Karel Bossart dreamed up those stainless steel balloon tanks. The only thing they kept changing are the payload attachment thingies' diameter. Bossart's baby is as much a crown jewel of khan's space crown, as the more glamorous SSME and saturn V engines
:D :D

....not only that the space droids here in the US (including me) are furious over the suspension of the J-2x engine for the upper stage SLS orion rocket package. They're going back to the 1950's RL10 upper stage engine. They said the J-2x was too powerful and not needed for the next 10 tears. :(
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Austin »

Manish Jain wrote:An odd bit in reddit AMA -

"[–]ISROredditors[S] 2 points 13 hours ago*

Our cryo is based on a Russian engine built in the 60s. Our real breakthrough will be the Cryo engine of MKIII"

Basically, they were saying that present cryo is outdated and MKIII cryo will be up to date. Hard to reconcile it with what we've been reading here.
I think the key is to have reliable engine that can throw up 2.5-3 T in GTO orbit and do it consistently.

New Engine with new technology, material is all great and fine but bleeding edge also needs to be reliable.

These days Satellites are more expensive than launch vehical one can afford to loose a vehical but not the expensive payload it carries.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by wasu »

Passion and dedication like this is what keeps ISRO apart.

http://www.bangaloremirror.com/columns/ ... 480061.cms

This scientist has worked with a single-minded passion for 31 years despite the hectic schedule

Dr K Sivan (56) GSLV Project Director

When the GSLV-D5 rocket, powered by an indigenous cryogenic engine, lifted off at 4.18 pm from the launchpad in Sriharikota, the mission control room erupted in a joyous roar. The man spearheading the mission, GSLV Project Director, K Sivan stood in the centre, content. It had been his 'mission' for the last year or so. Sivan calls himself and the PSLV twins, having joined the Polar Satellite Launch Vehicle system from the day it was approved by the Government of India in 1982. From then on, Sivan has moved across various departments of the PSLV project till he finally took charge of the GSLV mission in March 2011. A genial scientist, Sivan speaks to Bangalore Mirror.

You encountered repeated failures before the successful launch of the GSLV-DF. There's a water-cooler joke that GSLV loved the sea more than the sky. How did you keep at it in trying times?
I have dealt with major worries and painful issues. No question about that. However, I was always determined to achieve the end result, which is a successful launch. Whatever I did, it was towards this goal. Money is not my motivation. I don't mind not getting my salary even. It is the joy of creating something that kept me motivated. I love my work. Isn't that the greatest motivation of all?

What have been your major takeaways from this mission?
I like telling my team that there are three factors they should understand when working with the GSLV: there are known knowns, known unknowns and unknown unknowns. The first is a stable quantity that we know and understand. The second quantity is something we know will be a problem but by keeping a clear margin even if we can't correct it we can sail through. Dealing with the unknown unknowns is the dicey bit. There is the suspense of what can go wrong on the day of the launch, something that we haven't even anticipated. This is where our past failures come to the rescue. We learn from them. Plus, the first test flight gives us a lot of valuable lessons on what can happen. Right from my PSLV days, I am prepared to deal with these three calmly.

The last few years must've been hectic for you. When does your day begin?
I have given my heart and soul to my work. I will begin by telling you when my day ends. I finish by 12 pm or 1 am. Depending on how tired I feel, my day begins anywhere between 5 am to 7 am. This is the way it has always been. Earlier I used to be interested in listening to music. But the past few years left me with little time for such things. Still, when things get too hectic or chaotic, I like to listen to old classic film songs in Hindi, Tamil or Malayalam. I love every song from the film Aradhana. I have absolutely no hobbies or what they call, de-stressors. Family time is on Sunday, sometimes even Saturday evenings. But if there is some urgent matter, then I go to work. Work has been pretty much my life.

Give us a glimpse of how you prepared for D-day?
Like any other day actually. I make it a point to sleep with a cool mind and wake up calm every day. That is required for my job. And every morning, to get that inner calmness, I meditate. Before going to office, I go to the temple. That gives me the right attitude to tackle the day ahead. As a scientist, I know that there is a lot of uncertainty. So by praying, I have the right frame of mind to cope with uncertainties.

Finally, how did you motivate your team to make this journey with you?
I have a core inner team of 50 members and then a larger outer team. I tell my core team people that whatever work has been given to them is theirs. That's it. I don't know if that is motivation but by telling them that their tasks are their responsibilities, the situation is under control. Fortunately, my team is as passionate about their work as I am. So, they are motivated by the sheer love for the job. I know that all are willing to volunteer their services for free. Such is the passion.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by rahulm »

Second orbit raising operation completed

Second orbit raising operation of GSAT-14 is successfully completed by firing the Apogee Motor for 2,629 seconds on Jan 07, 2014. Realised orbit is 32,160 km (Perigee) by 35,745 km (Apogee) with an inclination of 0.6 deg.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

[quote="SSridhar"]There was a question here about whether India makes cryo tanks.
]Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) supplied the cryogenic fuel tanks and the cryo stage structures[/b] that formed part of the GSLV-D5, which was successfully launched on Sunday, the public enterprise has said.

HAL integrated and provided the four small ‘L40’ booster rockets strapped on to the first stage. L40 denotes the 40 tonnes of liquid fuel they carry."

Thanks, good to know. How can they call the L40 boosters 'small'. They are larger than some aircraft, and longer than the stage 2 engine.
They all have the turbo pump inside feeding the engine. This must be a newspaper editing problem!
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by ramana »

Long time back India Today had an article on the GSLV development giving the manhours and the time schedule. It is a very cost effective agile program.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by member_22872 »

Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) supplied the cryogenic fuel tanks and the cryo stage structures
Interesting, thought BHPV has this capability, didn't know HAL is into cryogenics. Long time back ISRO was into negotiations with Air Liquide India for cryo storage tanks.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

Varoon Shekhar wrote:
SSridhar wrote:There was a question here about whether India makes cryo tanks.
]Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) supplied the cryogenic fuel tanks and the cryo stage structures[/b] that formed part of the GSLV-D5, which was successfully launched on Sunday, the public enterprise has said.

HAL integrated and provided the four small ‘L40’ booster rockets strapped on to the first stage. L40 denotes the 40 tonnes of liquid fuel they carry."

Thanks, good to know. How can they call the L40 boosters 'small'. They are larger than some aircraft, and longer than the stage 2 engine.
They all have the turbo pump inside feeding the engine. This must be a newspaper editing problem!
have you seen the beasts that power the saturn and the roosi maal? :shock:
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by member_28041 »

RD-170/171. This is the highest thrust liquid propulsion engine ever. Power : 7.8 MN, used on Energia and Zenith

Rocketdyne F-1(Highest thrust single chamber liquid propulsion engine) . Power : 6.77 MN, used on Saturn


Truly monsters indeed !!!!
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by KrishG »

TSJones wrote: ....not only that the space droids here in the US (including me) are furious over the suspension of the J-2x engine for the upper stage SLS orion rocket package. They're going back to the 1950's RL10 upper stage engine. They said the J-2x was too powerful and not needed for the next 10 tears. :(
No worries! RL10 will be for Block 1. The next block should have to J-2X.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by KrishG »

nitinraj wrote:RD-170/171. This is the highest thrust liquid propulsion engine ever. Power : 7.8 MN, used on Energia and Zenith

Rocketdyne F-1(Highest thrust single chamber liquid propulsion engine) . Power : 6.77 MN, used on Saturn


Truly monsters indeed !!!!
If all goes as planned India will have an engine in that class. It'll be a cluster of 3 of our semi-cryogenic engines producing 6 MN of thrust together (each engine generates 2MN). It's planned to be used as the booster (recoverable/reusable booster which flies back 8) ) for TSTO RLV. And....on the conceptual monstrous Indian Moon rocket.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by rahulm »

The prime contractor for cryogenic storage and plumbing systems was MECON who in turn contracted INOX India (it's an Indian company based in Vadodara with factories in Halol and Kandla) to supply and install major cryogenic systems for the 2nd launch pad. I had a brochure somewhere from a few years ago that I can't seem to find now.

Added later: Found it online Cryogenic gas fuels for satellite launchers The second page has a wealth of information.

Recently. INOX was contracted directly by ISRO to supply a cryo cooler to cool Helium at the launch pad.

and finally, INOX supplied ISRO with India's first indigenous liquid hydrogen tank for the SLP.

This company was started by Mr. Jain, has small humble origins and used to be privately held. I don't know the ownership structure now. They had a remarkable work and safety culture with a motivated staff at all levels and a smart dynamic CEO.

This company as David gave the Goliath BHPV the dhoti shivers.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Prasad »

Interesting article/blog in the hindu today on the GSLV -
And the GSLV flew!
An overlook on the tech needed to make this launch happen.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by member_22872 »

When I was about to leave AL, I remember they were preparing documentation for bidding for cryo storage plants for ISRO. Many employees of BHPV at that time formed AL India. It appears BHPV lost big in terms of personnel and projects to others.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by sanjaykumar »

Wht z AL and BHPV? R thz stnd abbr?

Way too many acronyms and abbreviations, focus folks please.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by ramana »

BHPV= Bharat Heavy Plate and Vessels (A public sector company)
AL= Ashok Leyland (A Hinduja company now)
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by vasu raya »

The sat weight is given as 1982kgs, while its dry mass is 851kgs, since the GTO injection was way better than the error margins, wonder how much fuel it would save on the sat reaching GEO?
Last edited by vasu raya on 08 Jan 2014 05:42, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by rahulm »

I think in the present context perhaps AL = Air Liquide but the author can clarify.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by rahulm »

GSLV-D5 launch: What the success means

Upcoming GSLV payloads - GSAT-6, 7A , 9 and Chandrayaan II.

'20 years of toil has paid off' Says Radhkrishnan
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

Prasad wrote:Interesting article/blog in the hindu today on the GSLV -
And the GSLV flew!
An overlook on the tech needed to make this launch happen.
Sorry Prasad, but that article sucked! I thought there were going to be in depth descriptions of the various technical challenges and issues in the different stages and sub-systems, particularly the cryogenic stage. Giving the lay reader a feel for the staggering complexity of the GSLV with its hundreds of thousands of parts. The first generation SLV had over a 100,000 parts to it. It stands to reason that the GSLV would have ten times that number, and they would all have to work flawlessly.

You expected something along the lines of "One of the toughest challenges was to fabricate the turbo-pump with all its support assemblies, and make it run at 35,000( or whatever) RPM in flight. The engineers devised this by ... etc". Or some technical details on the avionics of the vehicle, or information on the control systems and stage separation systems, that have to work with clockwork precision. Or details on the software. Even the specials materials and alloys that comprise the casings, engines, nozzles, pumps, injectors et al.

Come on, blogger! I hope tomorrow's issue of "Frontline" carries an article by T.S.Subramaniam with a thorough write up on these matters. Or at least the next issue in two weeks.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by member_22872 »

I apologize, yes I meant AL= Air Liquide.
BTW, they also supply Cryo propellant tanks for Araine.
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by partha »

rahulm wrote:The prime contractor for cryogenic storage and plumbing systems was MECON who in turn contracted INOX India (it's an Indian company based in Vadodara with factories in Halol and Kandla) to supply and install major cryogenic systems for the 2nd launch pad. I had a brochure somewhere from a few years ago that I can't seem to find now.
Good to see such contributions from private sector. INOX acquired a cryogenic storage and transport company from US in 2009. It seems to have paid off for them. Hope they will continue investing in R&D.

http://articles.economictimes.indiatime ... inox-india

Question: does ISRO make such acquisitions if required?
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by vic »

I think that while developing GSLV-III we should continue to evolve GSLV-Mark-2 itself. One of the configurations could be to put S200 stage instead of S139 in GSLV Mark-2. While GSLV is a huge achievement put in practical terms we have moved from GTO ability of 1.5 tons given by PSLV to 2 tons of GSLV. Payload of GSLV-2 to GTO can be improved in present configuration till around 2.5 tons but we should then evolve it further till 3.5 tons by using improved engines.

Also GSLV-2 will allow us to put much heavier recce (& spy) satellites in low orbits, say upto 3-4 tons.
Sridhar
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Re: GSLV-D5 Launch status and post launch discussions

Post by Sridhar »

S-200 is different in length and diameter to the S-139. It would change the dimensions, weight and aerodynamic characteristics of the launcher, and hence will not be just an evolution of the MK2 but a new vehicle altogether.

Any improvements in the MK2 will come about through efficiency improvements without significantly changing the external dimensions of the vehicle. The PSLV gained capacity through improvements in the mass fraction of the propellant in the solid first stage (by reducing the mass of the casing, allowing for 139 T of propellant instead of 125T in the original version) and slightly bigger boosters (12T instead of 9T) which likely did not hugely change the aerodynamic characteristics of the vehicle. Some similar improvements might be feasible in the MK2, but anything beyond that will involve going back substantially to the drawing board. This might make it more likely that ISRO will focus instead on the MK3 and the future ULV family of launchers.
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