Two-G (2G) Spectrum Scam Tapes and follow-up

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 28 Feb 2011 22:56

^ Thank you.

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 01 Mar 2011 07:00

RamaY wrote:
Vril wrote:
India 2010, Dr. Manmohan Singh, esteemed economist, former Governor of RBI, Deputy Chairman of Planning Commission, former Finance Minister, a man whose personal ethics and integrity are unblemished, takes oath to protect and safeguard the Nation and its assets. He appoints Raja, as his Cabinet Minister for IT & Telecom.

How could an intellectual man such as Dr. MMS missed this simple dharma? How did many pundits on BR miss this simple logic?

Indian polity needs a "back to basics" program.

Beyond failure on moral grounds, the most astounding aspect in this saga is complete failure to understand numbers involved here. Classic display of innumeracy by a supposedly genius economist. Given the qualification of Shri. MMS, he should have been a shark when he looked at the magnitude of the scam. Clearly his thinking about the numbers was not beyond that of the aam admi, for whom difference between 10 crores and 10000 crores is just big numbers beyond ones reach.

Deploying such a magnitude of monies, could easily rival the growth that one is after. Misallocation of capital, has multiplier effect with devastating outcome. That money could have been used to enhance human capital, education etc., But a handful of people have essentially laid seige and indentured Indians, by usurping the money. Many Indians have to expend their working hours to recoup this colossal loss. But Shri.MMS's friends will enjoy the fruits of labour of other indentures. Life is grand, when one can hide ones innumeracy by hiding behind intellectualism.

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 01 Mar 2011 07:27

^^ JwalaMukhi ji,

Many Indians have to expend their working hours to recoup this colossal loss.

Is there a way we can quantify the number of months that a person has to work in a year just to make up for inflation, price rise due to black money, taxes due to government running deficits that otherwise would not have existed if assets were sold at market rates. Is this even possible to quantify? If this can be done, it will be a powerful message as to how 2G scam has hit the pockets of individual citizens. I keep hearing this "its all politics, just watch and enjoy" from friends and relatives. But it is not all for enjoyment. All these scams have real consequences and we have to pay for it in the end.

PS - This idea came from a Brazilian co worker who tells me that in Brazil, one has to work for 5 months a year just to pay all the taxes.

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 01 Mar 2011 07:57

ManjaM avare,
Here is one set of quick calculations that was done earlier.
http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 7#p1029907

That's definitely possible. Without getting into Net Present Value and other metrics used by economists, a quick rough calculation will yield a ball park figure.
Per wikipedia the amount of 2G scam alone stands at $38.27 billion.
Per capita GDP for India in 2010 is listed as approx $1200. That would mean an average aadmi in India, has to work one year to earn $1200. That roughly translates to 31.9*10^6 years of labour by an average aadmi @ current rate. Or other way of saying that would be so many people working for 1 year at that rate. More sophisticated calculations could be done to clearly arrive at what it would cost each and every one of the workers.

Fun would be to calculate how many cars/(or other items used more commonly and easily identified) could have been brought using this money. Or how many color tv sets as is the wont could have been distributed.

Added later: Roughly, it would mean everyone (including newborn babies) in India (1 billion population) should work for 2 weeks (40 hr/week) when paid @ $1200 per year just to recoup 2G deal. Add all the scams and that will provide a good indication why "Garibi Hatao" will continue to be popular slogan for many years to come.

Vril · Post by **Vril** » 01 Mar 2011 18:03

that video of vishwa bandhu gupta has been removed from you tube.did any body save that video? please re upload it again.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 01 Mar 2011 20:43

Vril wrote:that video of vishwa bandhu gupta has been removed from you tube.did any body save that video? please re upload it again.

it is there

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZ_6OVR82HQ

Save it using VLC utube saver

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 01 Mar 2011 21:05

ManjaM, Jwalamukhi etc

Slicing it differently/

GDP of India in 2010 at official exchange rates = $1.43T

Loss from 2G scam ~40B, Loss from CWG games ~20B = Total ~60B scams within one year. Of course there are many more scams if people dig.

Put together these two scams are of 4.2% of our GDP. So in essence, out of the 9% GDP growth India achieved in 2010, ~4% is stolen by INC wallahs under MMS watch. That means we are back to our "Congress Rate of Growth" 5% if we take the net effect.

If we analyze deeply, the story of every year of UPA rule is same. One year it is a jalayajnam project in AP another year it is a scam in Maharashtra, another it is Sensex scam and so on...

Only fools think India is truly realizing the 8+% growth it is achieving. While the national productivity is growing at 8-10% rate, the net benefits are growing at only 5-6% rate due to corruption at the highest level in GOI.

That is the saga of the great e-CON-artist Sri MMS, Prime Minister of India, Constable of Congress Party.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 01 Mar 2011 21:24

80% of our budget is wasted in admin and releated activities, that is non-planned expenditure.

20% is for aam aadmi. as per late rajiv gandhi's statement a rupee released from delhi becomes 10 paisa when it reaches the aam janata. i.e., only 2% of budgetted allocation reaches the janata.

This year's budget is 12+ lac crore.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 01 Mar 2011 21:37

Another aspect is this slow real rate won't scare the declining West!
In other words the scams could be a CBM for the West! They already worry about PRC!

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 01 Mar 2011 21:56

2G: Bhushan links Balwa to a Union Minister

New Delhi: Prashant Bhushan, the lawyer for the Centre for Public Interest Litigation, has sought to link Swan Telecom promoter Shahid Usman Balwa to a Central Minister. Bhushan informing the court that a CBI joint director YP Singh had taken voluntary retirement to join the International Cricket Council (ICC) which is headed by a Central Minister.
The lawyer, however, did not take the name of the minister.
He claimed that Balwa's company has had a Rs 100 crore deal with the ICC. The court asked Bhushan to give a written submission on these arguments.
Balwa, the promoter of DB Realty, was arrested by the CBI on February 8 for his alleged role in the 2G scam after in Mumbai.
He is the fourth person arrested in the 2G spectrum scam case. Former telecom minister A Raja and his key aides Siddharth Behuria and RK Chandolia were arrested on February 2.
Meanwhile, former Telecom Regulatory Authority of India chairman Nripendra Mishra has also been questioned by the CBI in relation to the 2G scam.

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/2g-bhushan-l ... 744-3.html

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 01 Mar 2011 22:48

RamaY wrote:.
That is the saga of the great e-CON-artist Sri MMS, Prime Minister of India, Constable of Congress Party.

Naa Izzat ki Chinta, Na Phikar koi Apman ki
Jai bolo Beiman ki, Jai bolo.
Sonya ki jai bolo,aurr Karo Roz Scam Ji
Jai Bolo..
PM ki seat par abb hai MM Singh padhare,
Raja, Ahmad patel, Da Babu bhi hai saath saath adhare
GDP growth ko addha kar de, auur pooja Amir Khan Kiii
jai bolo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Wd-f82BGWc

Good news about these scams coming out in full public view might do good in long term. Lets hope this might be the part of growing process for Desh . In past there was no real money to steal . Now at least we keep billions here and billions there otherwise it was pure csse of nanga nahaega kya ouur nachorega kya?

kshatriya · Post by **kshatriya** » 02 Mar 2011 01:03

Not sure if this is the right thread post it.. But did the Guruji's of BR saw this news ? ..This was making noise in a lot of blogs Post 2007 and then died away..Its back again..Is the Crown Prince rounded ?

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/hc-no ... 110301.htm

The Lucknow [ Images ] bench of Allahabad high court on Tuesday issued notice to Congress general secretary Rahul Gandhi [ Images ] on a petition seeking information about the whereabouts of a missing girl and her family.

The girl and her family are alleged to be "untraceable" ever since they called on Rahul during one of his visit to his parliamentary constituency, Amethi on December 13, 2006.

Moving a petition on behalf of the family, Kishore Samrite, former Samajwadi Party MLA from Madhya Pradesh [ Images ], has accused the Congress celebrity and his five foreigner friends of indulging in criminal assault on the 24-year-old Sukanya Singh.

Claiming to have learnt this from some news website, the petitioner has stated, "I was moved by the news. So I came all the way from my home in Balaghat, Madhya Pradesh to Amethi where I found the girl's house locked. Local villagers were tight-lipped about the whereabouts of the family."

He has, therefore, sought the intervention of the Allahabad high court "to issue a writ of Habeas Corpus to Rahul Gandhi to produce the missing girl Sukanya, her father Balram Singh and mother Savitri Singh."

While issuing the notice, a single judge bench comprising Justice SN Shukla did not fix any date for hearing the case, the petitioner's advocate Surya Mani Raikwar told rediff.com.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 02 Mar 2011 01:47

Murugan wrote:80% of our budget is wasted in admin and releated activities, that is non-planned expenditure.

Murugan ji,

That is not correct.

5% goes to unplanned aid
7% goes to planned contribution to states and UTs
9% goes to subsidies
11% to Defense
11% other unplanned expenditure
17% states share in taxes
18% interest (This includes interest on both internal and external debt) I think india should pay off some of external debt whenever possible. That means overall internal/external debt burden should be ~2-3 times total budget @6% interest rate)
22% planned expenditure.
...

On the other hand the revenue includes 27% coming from loans.

That is natural. One has to maintain 65,000+ KMs of roads, millions of Govt. buildings, etc., It costs money.

With a 12 Lakh crore budget 20% of planned expenditure is like Rs240,000 crores. With that money, India can do many wonders; if it is done in a phased manner (at least that was supposed to be the idea behind 5 yr plans and planning commission).

Yes! we cannot produce a baby within 1 month by bringing 9 mothers, but GOI can comeup with a 10 year modernization plan with clear goals.

All it takes is 10 years of focused administration to push India into the next orbit. Entire Govt administration can be organized by project.

Imagine you define 10-12 national objectives and define necessary manpower resources (skills, numbers, locations etc) and ask Govt employees to choose the program and location they want to be part of. From that point make their career progression based their contributions to the realization of that program...

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 02 Mar 2011 02:04

edit: deleted after request by ramana ji.

Sorry about that.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 02 Mar 2011 02:20

Hey this is not germane to the thread. Self delete before admins get to do it.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 02 Mar 2011 02:35

Raja could have helped cut our fiscal deficit by another 0.5% by auctioning the 2g spectrum

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 02 Mar 2011 10:59

All is not well inside the Congress party

There is intense speculation on the leaks into the various scams, which have hit the headlines recently. Those who should know acknowledge that exposes of the magnitude of the 2G spectrum scam and the now annulled Indian Space Research Organisation-Devas deal -- and the way they have tumbled out without let-up -- usually take place when the powerful in the system fall out with each other. ....

A curious episode was the one relating to the Bofors order. The hearing of the Income Tax Appellate Tribunal on Bofors was suddenly and inexplicably advanced from January 4 to December 31, and was delivered a day before the plea to close the case against Italian businessman Ottavio Quattrochi was to come up.

The Tribunal had concluded that both Win Chaddha and Quattrochi took commissions in the howitzer-gun deal and many Congress party men expressed surprise at the reference to Quattrochi in the order when the appellant in the case was only Chaddha's son.

That apart, it was the timing of the order, which dumped the fat in the fire.

Several Congress party leaders read 'political intent' in it, and senior leader Digvijay Singh saw the hand of an 'insider'.

The order will make it that much more difficult to close the case against Quattrochi, and in all likelihood, keep the Bofors sword hanging over the heads of Sonia and Rahul.

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 110302.htm

Any idea who was behind the preponement of the IT Tribunal hearing?

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 02 Mar 2011 21:33

Pranav wrote: Any idea who was behind the preponement of the IT Tribunal hearing?

your namesake

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 02 Mar 2011 21:46

IT comes under which ministry!

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 02 Mar 2011 21:50

ramana wrote:IT comes under which ministry!

Finance

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 02 Mar 2011 22:24

deleted sorry wrong thread

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 03 Mar 2011 09:27

RamaY ji,

The capital outlay in budgets of Defence and other essential services is very less compared to revenue part.

This report says, the planned expenditure is not even 20% during this fiscal. It has just been increased to 18.33%

http://www.financialexpress.com/news/un ... 35/755880/

The Plan expenditure is the government spending on social sector schemes such as Bharat Nirman, rural employment guarantee and National Rural Health Mission. Besides, it includes Centre's assistance to various states and Union Territories Plans.

Explains why we are so low at Human Development Index.

Our tax money is used less on plan expenditure than unplanned. Most of the unplanned expenses are towards subsidies, running costly govt machineries and payin debt and interest. Once these expeditures are reduced to diverted to planned one will make huge difference.

Major heads covered under non planned expenditure:

http://indiabudget.nic.in/ub2005-06/eb/stat04.pdf

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 03 Mar 2011 09:48

Now Sri Sri Joins Ramdev

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/retur ... nd/756732/

(In Hindi)
http://www.bhaskar.com/article/RAJ-OTH- ... 96342.html

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 03 Mar 2011 10:06

(In Hindi)

Anti Graft/Corruption Rally in US of A by NRIs in line with Dandi March. This rally is of the same length that of Dandi March 390 kms

Will start from Martin Luther King Junior Memorial Park (California?) from 12th March, To end in Los Angeles Gandhi statue on 26th March

http://www.prabhatkhabar.com/news/75531.aspx

(No mainstream english media has reported this so far)

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 Mar 2011 10:20

Must be the heat.

Never heard of a more irrelevant thing.

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 03 Mar 2011 10:29

Newsflash: SC strikes down the appointment of PJ Thomas as CVC.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 03 Mar 2011 12:20

^^ Home Minister alongwith Prime Minister's integrity will be questioned.

PC's chances of getting a promotion completely diminished.

a Game by ruling junta to bring aka?

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 03 Mar 2011 16:13

Another Blow

The Supreme Court on Thursday came down heavily on the Centre for failing to crack the whip on black money hoarders. The court ordered the immediate reinstatement of three key Enforcement Directorate (ED) officials who were allegedly transferred midway through a foreign exchange law violation probe against Pune businessman Hassan Ali Khan.

Who is Hasan Ali Khan?

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/Story ... -khan.html

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 03 Mar 2011 17:47

Murugan wrote:^^ Home Minister alongwith Prime Minister's integrity will be questioned.

PC's chances of getting a promotion completely diminished.

a Game by ruling junta to bring aka?

If there are things like shame and moral responsibilitiy.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 03 Mar 2011 18:12

Murugan wrote:Another Blow

The Supreme Court on Thursday came down heavily on the Centre for failing to crack the whip on black money hoarders. The court ordered the immediate reinstatement of three key Enforcement Directorate (ED) officials who were allegedly transferred midway through a foreign exchange law violation probe against Pune businessman Hassan Ali Khan.
Who is Hasan Ali Khan?

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/Story ... -khan.html

He is a horse trader from Pune.

madhu · Post by **madhu** » 03 Mar 2011 18:56

i think Sonia has learnt a lesson and the lesson learnt is that having a puppet PM, President and CVC is not enough. She even needs a corrupt/puppet chief justice also.

Next term we can see appointment of another corrupt CJI.

Pranay · Post by **Pranay** » 03 Mar 2011 19:43

http://news.outlookindia.com/item.aspx?713718

The Supreme Court today came down heavily on the Centre on the issue of black money hoarders and asked why stud farm owner Hasan Ali Khan and other alleged offenders were not being subjected to custodial interrogation despite probe agencies possessing sufficient material.

"What the hell is going on in this country?" the court asked, while virtually snubbing Solicitor General Gopal Subramanium when he tried to make certain submissions.

The court also ordered that three key ED officials allegedly transferred midway into the probe in a case of alleged foreign exchange violation by Hasan Ali Khan, the Pune-based businessman, be reinstated forthwith. The court called the transfer as unfortunate.

A bench of justices B Sudershan Reddy and S S Nijjar also indicated that if the government fails to act, it would be compelled to appoint a special officer for supervising the probe against the offenders.

The apex court also wanted to know what prevented the government from subjecting Khan and other alleged black money launderers to custodial interrogation.

The bench granted time till Tuesday to the Centre to file its response failing which it said the court would be constrained to pass necessary orders.

VinayB · Post by **VinayB** » 03 Mar 2011 21:15

Muppalla wrote:INC becoming too nervy with Baba Ramdev is just one reason and that is North India. INC wants Baba Ramdev to become big so that there are two fighting poles for hindu causes. It did that on the regional fronts in TN and AP and also Maha. Now it needs to do that in places where there is a straight fight between BJP and INC. By being critical on Baba Ramdev his prominence will increase. I will even bet that there will be more followers to Babaji in the coming months and then there will be a lot of slush money that these followers will use to increase the following for Baba.

Ramdev, Ram Jethmalani, Agnivesh, Subramanian Swamy - is this supposed to become a political group? If so, what kind of politics - leftist, rightist, hindutva, maoist?

May be this group can fill up a few town squares in a few of our cities. But India has a opposition party with a fairly national presence, about 118 seats in parliament etc. So who are behind this project?

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 03 Mar 2011 21:57

VinayB wrote:
Muppalla wrote:INC becoming too nervy with Baba Ramdev is just one reason and that is North India. INC wants Baba Ramdev to become big so that there are two fighting poles for hindu causes. It did that on the regional fronts in TN and AP and also Maha. Now it needs to do that in places where there is a straight fight between BJP and INC. By being critical on Baba Ramdev his prominence will increase. I will even bet that there will be more followers to Babaji in the coming months and then there will be a lot of slush money that these followers will use to increase the following for Baba.
Ramdev, Ram Jethmalani, Agnivesh, Subramanian Swamy - is this supposed to become a political group? If so, what kind of politics - leftist, rightist, hindutva, maoist?

May be this group can fill up a few town squares in a few of our cities. But India has a opposition party with a fairly national presence, about 118 seats in parliament etc. So who are behind this project?

Heh...maoist? but yeah it feels like everyone right of center is slowly coming under one umbrella to put pressure on the Congress on the issue of corruption. However, I do feel that this "movement" will eventually address other issues like governance, national security, etc.

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 03 Mar 2011 22:30

I think it is becoming apparent to the Swamis, that if they will attack Congress individually.. they will be vulnerable to the tricks that Congress is known to pull and have insinuated against Ramdev a few days back.

So Ramdev seems like a smart guy, for bringing together a lot of people who together might scare away Congress.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 04 Mar 2011 11:55

Watch Out!

Delhi court to decide on CBI plea to close Quattrocchi case today.

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/verdi ... case-89286

If the pleas is accepted, it will be challenged in higher court for sure.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 04 Mar 2011 12:13

Supreme effect in 24 hours

Income Tax Tribunal issues a showcause notice to Hasan Ali
http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/black ... -ali-89353

ED summons Pune businessman Hasan Ali
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/Story ... n-ali.html

Caustic remarks of SC to Govt on Hasan Ali and his ilks' free run

"There are instances when minor offenders are shot down for violating Section 144 CrPC, but you don't take any action against these people. We are very sorry. All these people are now free," the court said.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 04 Mar 2011 12:13

Deleted by self

AjayKK · Post by **AjayKK** » 04 Mar 2011 12:43

madhu wrote:... the lesson learnt is that having a puppet PM, President and CVC is not enough. She even needs a corrupt/puppet chief justice also.

This is truly the quote of the day

One thing i can't understand is the need to appoint Poor Joke Thomas in the first place. Any other mere mortal could be arm-twisted and appointed as the CVC by the HPC, which is always in a 2-1 majority. What is the need to insist on Thomas knowing very well that it may blow up soon? Is it because he was the was Telecom Secretary and was expected to go "slow" on Raja-2g scam? Or did the Kerala lobby/church insist on him? He was taking shelter in a place of worship for the past two days, insisting that " God was with him and he would win the case in Supreme Court” !

http://www.zeenews.com/news691058.html

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 04 Mar 2011 16:00

Delhi court allows closing of case against Quattrochi

According to Justice Vinod Yadav:

"If the logical conclusion of a case is not possible then it is better to leave the issue," he said.