Bharat Rakshak

Can someone explain how this was achieved?

Folks do you recall the dark days after Operation Blue Star? There were Sikh desertions and a palpable and severe drop in the number of Sikhs in the Indian army courtesy your favorite sycophants'r'us political party.

Could this "conspiracy" be aimed at redressing that? I have conspiracy theories too.

A very stupid and horrible way of going about it, if the case. Guranteed to be counterproductive in pissing off a whole bunch of Army in the process both Sikh and not Sikh.

So, as you put it, YOB anomaly was indeed the brilliant stroke of luck.

Problem is - this would be very difficult to support in a court of law. A stroke of luck for the conspirator is a stroke of misfortune for Gen VK Singh because there was actually an anomalous record. No court is ever going to convert one man's stroke of misfortune into reason for indicting another man. There are so many ways of ducking the questions as to why the record was not set right.

Sanku wrote:
shiv wrote:
Folks do you recall the dark days after Operation Blue Star? There were Sikh desertions and a palpable and severe drop in the number of Sikhs in the Indian army courtesy your favorite sycophants'r'us political party.

Could this "conspiracy" be aimed at redressing that? I have conspiracy theories too.


A very stupid and horrible way of going about it, if the case. Guranteed to be counterproductive in pissing off a whole bunch of Army in the process both Sikh and not Sikh.


Wasn't that what happened in Blue Star?

Viv in umpteen discussion that i have seen and from what i have read and spoken , the last 3 appointment including that of COAS has been done and accepted by VKS in writing keeping 1950 as DOB. Infact on one occasion he even writes back clearing any doubts or misgiving any one may have on he accepting 1950 as DOB as far his promotions goes.

Rest is a done for a purpose, not relevant for the postings or appointments. So asking for confirming DOB at a later date when all his promotions are given with 1951 is nothing but unsual.

Nelson ,can we have further elaboration on this point please?



Does it also implicate AKA too?

Austin,exactly what I asked,and he (Gen VKS can still find/has enough time to find some reason to haul up Gen. Bik, for let's say....insubordination,as allegedly plotted against him bt Gen.DK,and blot his copybook sufficiently for the GOI to have to overlook him?!

Well technically and legally you can sack an officer at the president pleasure without a reason (this is just an academic discussion)...for eg: if you suspect an officer of being corrupt or of spying but dont have enough evidence you can use this option

A stroke of luck which was converted into an opportunity using fraudulent means is the real issue.

Wasn't that what happened in Blue Star?

Nelson Ji, Judges do bullying all the time. It is also a way to test your convictions. The SC position is not clear as it didn't produce any judgement. What happens cross examination, is not to be taken as the position. General tactics of the lawyer is to start squealing or what we call a 'broken record technique'. Just keep praying your stance again and again and do not get lead by with the judge or the opposition. Use overt chaaploosi, words like 'my lord' and 'your grace' etc etc....

If still pushed to corner ask for time to discuss and revert. Bench says ' Well! you wrote the letters... how can you go back on your promise...?" you say "My Lord I was under tremendous pressure and i was assured the records will be corrected in future. Now I am here with my 38 years long reputation at stake." Bench Says " There is no honor and dignity in going back on your own written commitments." you say " My Lord I was under tremendous pressure and i was assured the records will be corrected in future. Now I am here with my 38 years long reputation at stake." Bench says "You consider your position otherwise I have no hesitation is producing a judgement." you say "Of course My Lordship! I am here for exactly that and I am sure if you consider case # this and this and this and subsequent judgments here and here and here you will see that I am a victim of circumstances and also My Lord I was under tremendous pressure and i was assured the records will be corrected in future. Now I am here with my 38 years long reputation at stake."

Surely, Bench would have gone back to Government asking tougher questions... At the least ask for another date...

Wasn't that what happened in Blue Star?

It seems so convenient that in order to make the succession plan work VK Singh had to become COAS. Was it necessary for dates to be fiddled with for him to become COAS?

Well lets assume what you say is right , but such unusal was accepted by VKS in writing not on one but three occasion and he did not approach the courts then to redress the unusual , which in itself is quite unusual.

Shiv wrote:


Hakim Sahib, I am really surprised that such a mischievous/loaded statement has come from someone like you.

Well only partially egging you on

A pisko analysis on this would be interesting to know why so many langots are in a twist. Mine certainly are

2G Spectrum Scam Demoralizes Indian Army

Recently, the Chief of Army Staff of the Indian Army (COAS), General V.K. Singh had openly stated that the Indian Army became a demoralized lot after the infamous 2G Spectrum scam that rocked the whole country. The scam is said to have caused Rs. 1.76 lakh crores loss to country's exchequer.

The after-effects of the scam were felt in the Indian Army too, which had so far not echoed its opinion on any of the past scandals. Considering the enormity of this fraud on the nation, Indian Army staff were fuming in private, saying that guarding the country's boundaries day and night in inclement weather served no purpose since these scams were eating the vitals organs of the country.

Those were dark days indeed.

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No need to assume, thats SOP. . There is a post posted previously indicating that VKS pursued the matter even after so called acceptance. That means he did not accept it. Nothing unusual. Legal team did not project and got cowed down by SC.

At the outset it may look like a innocuous DoB issue of an Army officer, or merely an army affair but many, who is beyond the Army family are taking interest in this case becoz they believe that this has direct and important connection to the Scams such as 2G and Adarsh scam happened and many other scams waiting to happen.

Surely you seem to be a Lawyer. This is what happens most of the time. Legal team was inexperienced and as Kunal pointed out was also late in coming to the court.

Its quite unusually for some one to accept some things in writing ( not verbally ) and then pursue it after so called accepting it in which ever ways he felt was right , even with all good intentions it wont be legally tenable. .

One general fights for one issue and here people are cursing journalists, army, government, courts ,everything - and connecting everything with the general's fight. You see you may be well intentioned but if you have one person who does not like you that person is going to conclude that you are bullshitting about unrelated issues and that your support for the general is also nonsense. How does that help the general's case. At best it won't affect it, but it just does not do to curse everyone who disagrees.

The scams were there before and will continue after, but how is the general's date of birth issue connected with 2-G scam which you have now brought up? It is all about corruption in the country no? So it is connected. I had to pay a bribe yesterday. That is also connected no? With the General's date of birth issue.

It seemed to me that the main issue was of having a rant, which every concerned person has had. To me it seemed like the issue had been taken from "cow" to "cow is tied to coconut tree so let us talk of coconut tree".

Is there any evidence that you are not biased yourself? This is the simplest and most obvious way of tearing down your views. That is exactly what happens and I think you know that.

Its quite unusually for some one to accept some things in writing ( not verbally ) and then pursue it after so called accepting it in which ever ways he felt was right , even with all good intentions it wont be legally tenable.

If he had signed thrice and still feel it is not acceptable to him then I think its his problem and the way he tackled it is he went to the apex court.

That is the reason they keep saying that read before you sign any document and that is how these insurance company deny you claims by putting in caveats that you have signed and are suppose to read.

That question would have arisen or proven if SC rendered judgement on merits. It played Katta Panchayatdar so legal tenability is untested and your opinion.

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The plan sounds too improbable to me. Can someone explain how this was achieved? I understand the thought that there are "deep" conspiracies. But you cannot win a case on "deep conspiracies" without laying them credibly bare.

Its quite unusually for some one to accept some things in writing ( not verbally ) and then pursue it after so called accepting it in which ever ways he felt was right , even with all good intentions it wont be legally tenable.

That is the reason they keep saying that read before you sign any document and that is how these insurance company deny you claims by putting in caveats that you have signed and are suppose to read.

The onus is on you to prove that I am biased. Do not pass it on to me.

Austin Ji. if was the lawyer, I'll setup the case in a way that Bench asks GOI... Remember it's always easy to debunk such issues specially when they are exception....

Bhindrawalla was a creation of the INC and brought to centre stage in Punjab to counter the Akalis, but later the man turned out to be a Frankenstein monster who even went out of the control of the Congress. Things had reached a stage where operation bluestar became a must. Did India really have an alternative at that time? India paid the price for the follies of INC in Punjab and things reached such a pass that operation had become a must at that time.

think VKS may have been in no position to refuse and fight with JJ Singh after the latter assured him that it would be addressed in due course.

My opinion is SC did a very Fair and Just stand in this case , if it had been something else it would have been dissapointing.

Probably if he was promised something by JJ or some one in return for some thing verbally and lets assume he was assured verbally thrice before he signed on the dotted line , then its a serious error of judgment on his part.