Bharat Rakshak

it is somewhat mystifying though what the IAF hopes to achieve with just 22. surely 4-6 will be needed as a training unit. that leaves 16-18. assuming a 80% uptime over a 2 week war period thats just like 12 airframes.

even a bottle-fed munna like UK that will never need to fight a land war on its own, has 60 longbows.

perhaps IAF wants to get the apache in and then launch a bulk follow on order, without the hassle of another retender and testing.

it is somewhat mystifying though what the IAF hopes to achieve with just 22. surely 4-6 will be needed as a training unit. that leaves 16-18. assuming a 80% uptime over a 2 week war period thats just like 12 airframes.

even a bottle-fed munna like UK that will never need to fight a land war on its own, has 60 longbows.

perhaps IAF wants to get the apache in and then launch a bulk follow on order, without the hassle of another retender and testing.

22 Apaches may not be enough for a full blown 2-front war but they should be more than enough to snuff out jehadi infiltration very quickly with minimum casualties.



Not sure how effective attack choppers are in a MANPAD infested ground war, specially in open terrain. They seem more suited to hide-and-seek type combat in terrain which provides radar and visual cover--urban, forested or hilly/mountainous areas. Their USP is being able to see and engage from a distance without themselves being seen or heard.

it is somewhat mystifying though what the IAF hopes to achieve with just 22. surely 4-6 will be needed as a training unit. that leaves 16-18. assuming a 80% uptime over a 2 week war period thats just like 12 airframes.

even a bottle-fed munna like UK that will never need to fight a land war on its own, has 60 longbows.

perhaps IAF wants to get the apache in and then launch a bulk follow on order, without the hassle of another retender and testing.

The apaches are experts in tank killing. The plains of Punjab, Rajastan can prove pretty messy for enemy Armored units in the presence of these.
The Attack Choppers usually travel in groups, so if a lone MANPADS team tries to engage them, irrespective of their missile's hit they will be toast by the reminder of the birds.
This is not the case when MANPADS engage strike Jets.
This puts in a lot of pressure on the sneaky MANPADS squad and practically can deter them from firing. The choppers like Apache are very good at counter measures against MANPADS and are more likely to survive then any other type of a chopper.

That said, even Super Cobras are very good.

Ground troops, having recovered from the suppression air strike, opened up with small arms and other weapons. Lieutenant Jason King, pilot of Apache "Palerider 16", was hit by AK-47 fire in the neck and suffered a severe hemorrage

Raghu - a suggestion. Some Navy chaps got into trouble posting on Facebook. I hope you exercise sufficient discretion while posting on BR. Dont end up doing something in good faith that might lead to trouble.

India will induct its latest Mi-17 V5 armed helicopters from Russia that will greatly enhance its capabilities to carry troops and cargo at higher altitudes.

Defence Minister A K Antony will hand over the symbolic keys of the choppers to the IAF marking their formal commissioning, IAF officials said here. India has placed orders for 80 such choppers from Russia and the first batch was inducted in service in the last week of September, 2011. Over 20 such machines have already arrived and are deployed at various locations in the Northern sector, they said. "This helicopter falls in armed helicopter category, with substantial and effective firepower with the latest and more powerful engines that will greatly enhance its payload carriage capability at higher altitudes," IAF spokesperson said here. The new choppers will augment IAF's fleet of Mi-17 IV helicopters. "Mi-17 V5 is an upgrade of Mi-17 in the medium-lift category and is equipped with state-of-the-art avionics and on board Navigation Systems," he said. Commenting on its capabilities, officials said, "It has on board weather radar, state of the art autopilot and is compatible with the latest Generation Night vision Goggles." The Mi-17 variants have operated in various types of terrain, including the Siachen Glacier, and have also proven their mettle in UN missions.

I do see the flare dispensers below the engine the maroonish covered part.

Mi 17 v5 induction video. Avionics looks good. This beast can take down many when fully loaded.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei6ttsUE ... re=related

credit: torqueaviation

Am I right in calculating total 80 rockets can be loaded into those pods at any given time?

Aiming at strengthening its medium-lift helicopter fleet, the Indian Air Force (IAF) is planning to procure 71 more Mi-17 V5 choppers, including 12 for the Ministry of Home Affairs. These would be in addition to the 80 already ordered from Russia.

Of the 71 helicopters to be ordered, 59 would be provided to the IAF for replacing its old Mi-8 and Mi-17IV choppers and six would be given to the Border Security Force. The remaining six would be distributed among the other central armed police forces, IAF officials said. Earlier the IAF was proceeding with the acquisition of 59 choppers only but later on the MHA requested to club its requirements also in the same Defence Ministry proposal, they said.

On the machine's capabilities, an IAF official said, "It has on-board weather radar, state-of-the-art autopilot and is compatible with the latest generation night vision goggles." The Mi-17 variants have operated in various types of terrain, including Siachen Glacier, and have also proved their mettle in UN missions.

Russian Helicopters also recently unveiled its new Mil Mi-26T upgrade, which features an improved power-to-weight ratio and better handing characteristics in the flight regime. This version of the heavy-lift helicopter is competing against the Boeing Chinook for an order from India, which already operates four Mi-26s. The Mi-26T2 is intended for both military and civilian customers and uses “some flight control algorithms already proven on the Mi-28N,” said Aleksei Samusenko, general designer at Mil. The model passed preliminary manufacturer’s trials this year, and certification trials are to start soon. Rostvertol, an Mi-26 manufacturer that fell under control of the Russian Helicopters in late 2010, is providing most of the funding.

The Mi-26T2 is powered by two Ivchenko-Progress D-136-2 turboshaft engines with Fadec, each developing 12,500 shp in emergency power mode and delivering an extra 250 shp in takeoff mode. The big helicopter features the BREO-26 digital avionics suite from the Ramenskoye PKB. It has a glass cockpit on five LCD displays, a digital autopilot and a Glonass-aided navigation system enabling IFR operations. The upgraded model requires two flight crewmembers, down from five, but an additional crewmember is needed when cargo is carried on sling. A Transas TSL-1600 searchlight working in either standard or infrared mode allows better observation of cargo being carried on the sling.

Showdown

Competition intensified last week in Singapore, with major manufacturers pushing their products at the last major air show before a series of contract announcements begins with an Indian order for 197 light helicopters valued at about $1.5 billion. Eurocopter, based in Marignane, France, is offering its AS550 C3 Fennec in the competition to replace aging Aloutte models built by predecessor Sud Aviation, which sold its first helicopter in Asia in 1962. Russian Helicopters, formed to consolidate the country’s rotorcraft industry, is offering the Kamov Ka-226 -- which has the NATO reporting name ‘Hoodlum’ -- with a winner to be declared in March or April, Ducrot said.

India, whose existing chopper fleet is dominated by Soviet models, also has a contest underway for 55 naval helicopters, worth $2.2 billion, for which Eurocopter is pitching the NH90 against Sikorsky’s Seahawk and Textron Inc.’s Bell 429. The south Asian nation is also seeking 22 attack choppers in a tender for which Chicago-based Boeing says its AH-64 Apache has been selected as preferred bidder over the Russian Mil Mi-28 Havoc, together with 15 heavy-lift models that have attracted proposals from the Boeing Ch-47 Chinook and the Mi-26 Halo.

Combat-Proven

Boeing is offering the Chinook model used in Afghanistan, defense spokesman Hal Klopper said. That may enhance its credentials for operation in the Himalayas, where Indian and Pakistani forces are ranged against each other at high altitude. With India also due to issue proposals for coastguard helicopters this year, “there are potential tenders for all the armed forces,” said Ducrot at Eurocopter, a unit of European Aeronautic, Defence & Space Co. which lifted revenue 13 percent last year a record 5.4 billion euros ($7 billion). The surge in Asian helicopter purchases mirrors a jump in combat-plane orders led by an $11 billion Indian contract for 126 fighters, the biggest in years, provisionally awarded to Paris-based Dassault Aviation SA’s Rafale last month.

given these helis will never take part in direct assault role , if the Mi26T is reliable and cheap, with a decent supply chain we should get it instead of the Chinook.

Singha,

The MI26 is a huge fuel guzzler and the running costs are too high to keep it operational over extended periods of time. Also, spares are an issue. They practically serve very little purpose except when you have to carry huge nuclear missiles over Serbia during heights of cold war.

During the Kargil Operations, two Mi-26s logged about 25 hours airlifting heavy equipment and guns to the Kargil area.

One Mi-26 (Z3076) was written off after it crashed at Jammu airport on 14 Dec 2010. It was involved in the heavy lift of tunneling equipment for the Northern Railways. The crew escaped with injuries. This was the first and till date the only major airframe loss for the Mi-26 in nearly 25 years of service.

The Mi-26s have been utilised in the sky-crane role over the years.

- Feb 89, MI-26 helicopter undertook the only of its kind underslung operation taking Pontoon bridge form Ludhiana to Sirhind canal.
- Early 1999, a crashed MiG-21 was airlifted by the Unit to Chandigarh.
- 21 Nov 2001, the Mi-8 which crashed in the Rann of Kutch was helilifted by the Mi-26s to Bhuj.
- 2002, a MiG-21 Bison which crashed in the fields near Ambala was airlifted by the Unit to Ambala Air Force Station.
- In Jul 2002 the Mi-26 recovered the first civilian aircraft (Beechcraft), which had met with an accident at Kangra airfield. Another first was achieved as the unit flew the longest ever underslung flight (3:15 hrs).
- 22 Feb 2006 - An Mi-26 flown by the CO, Wg Cdr Sushil Ghera, airlifted an Mi-17 that forcelanded in a river bed a few days earlier to Chandigarh Air Force Station.
-Sept 2007 - Mi-17 1V airlifted from Bandipore to Awantipura
-In 2010, the helicopter was actively used to lift heavy equipment for the Katra-Quazigand Railway project providing rail connectivity to the Srinagar Valley.

I will throw my last card on the table. given its vast internal dimensions and load bearing capability could be G version be made with a 105mm auto loading cannon pointing out of the side, and a couple of GSH23 type cannons for backup?