Indian Space Program Discussion

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PratikDas
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by PratikDas »

Polarimetric Image from RISAT 1 on ISRO's Facebook page

Image


From the comments:
Tapan Misra: blue stands for single reflection typically flat surface, tilted surface. Red for double reflection, typically vertical surfaces of buildings. Green for depolarised targets like tree canopy, railway line with stone chips.
Prem Kumar
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Prem Kumar »

Glad to see ISRO's PR at work. Good photo.

I am hoping the twin sisters RISAT-1 & 2 are also creating TERCOM type maps of our neighborhood that could be fed into Nirbhay one day
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Shrinivasan »

Prem Kumar wrote:I am hoping the twin sisters RISAT-1 & 2 are also creating TERCOM type maps of our neighborhood that could be fed into Nirbhay one day
+1000000
Brahmos today... Nirbhay and her siblings tomorrow...
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by SSSalvi »

Is the page mentioned above a REAL ISRO page?

There are at least 8 facebook profiles with ISRO logo.
One profile ( http://www.facebook.com/pages/ISRO/1479 ... ts&fref=ts ) even has likes from (fake ) facebook profiles of .. Madhavan Nayar, K Radhakrishna, even ROSCOSMOS and DRDO :) .
Unfortunately ISRO website does not carry any link for facebook and as usual they don't respond to querries.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by PratikDas »

The particular profile I linked to might not be maintained by ISRO officially but this RISAT-1 image is not found elsewhere on the internet if Google Image Search is to be believed. Where did they copy it from?

It's interesting that the image seems to have a 'motion blur' along the horizontal plane but not the vertical plane. I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the movement of the satellite, earth or both. Since the picture isn't picture perfect and since we know RISAT-1 to have C-band SAR, not one of a higher frequency, I'm inclined to believe the result.

Added later: Here's a land SAR image from ESA's ERS. I'm not sure if it's from ERS-1 or ERS-2.

Wiki says ERS also has C-band SAR but a Ku band Radar Altimeter.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by vipins »

Got a mail from Team Bhuvan regarding new and improved BHUVAN
http://bhuvan3.nrsc.gov.in/bhuvan/bhuvan/bhuvan2d.html
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by ashish raval »

^^ not to belittle but honestly this is 15 years behind west.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

^^^ Do you mean satellite pictures were available to mango public in 1997?

Google Earth was released in 2005 as a commercial product. Bhuvan seems to be a free offering from ISRO. Not comparable IMHO. The technology is deliberately downgraded when released to the public. Higher quality images can be obtained if needed.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by ashish raval »

^^, why would someone have a second thought of even having a look at Bhuvan when high resolution imagery is available free on smartphones and tablets now a days. What is the point of developing for the sake of development. Could go down as learning exercise but not much real use.

Agencies may have an access to high res pictures no doubt about it, but then every other country with spy satellite has.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

^^^

Same old raag. Why should we launch satellites when US/USSr have done it? Why develop tanks when others have done it? Why not depend on everything on them? They were geneous enough to send us wheat in the 60s, its the stupid Indians who try to make themselves self sufficient. We should stop all forms of innovations since it is quite clear that the first attempt is not going to be better than existing products.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by darshand »

ashish raval wrote:^^, why would someone have a second thought of even having a look at Bhuvan when high resolution imagery is available free on smartphones and tablets now a days.
Take a look at the layers available in Bhuvan and you will have your answer:
->Ground water prospects
->Wasteland
->Soil
etc.
This tool provides information which is not available in any of the "high resolution imagery" products available. And it is now open to mango people who might want to access this data, without going to the Gobermund and filling up forms in triplicate.
Yes, there are problems and the user experience is not the best, but it's a start.
ashish raval wrote: What is the point of developing for the sake of development. Could go down as learning exercise but not much real use.
Not really. They did not build satellites etc. just to get Bhuvan running. The data was already available. What has been done is just making it available to the public. In fact, the Govt. agencies can request higher resolution data for specific areas (if I understood their terms correctly when I signed up). So now you have more people trying out the user interface, resulting in more feedback which should "theoretically" (yes, I know it's still a govt. agency) result in a better tool.
At the same time, it can generate interest in say students etc. who might want to contribute to improve it or are looking for employment opportunities there.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nash »

vipins wrote:Got a mail from Team Bhuvan regarding new and improved BHUVAN
http://bhuvan3.nrsc.gov.in/bhuvan/bhuvan/bhuvan2d.html
How it can be viewed in 3D?
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

ashish raval wrote:^^ not to belittle but honestly this is 15 years behind west.
won't say 15, 8 or 9 years is most believable, they need some good software developers...
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

^^^
Actually we are ahead of them. Most of western software providers are geared towards their home markets. Large swaths of India are still out of coverage and what little has been covered does not include many features that westerners take for granted (street view, traffic etc)
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

ashish raval wrote:^^, why would someone have a second thought of even having a look at Bhuvan when high resolution imagery is available free on smartphones and tablets now a days. What is the point of developing for the sake of development. Could go down as learning exercise but not much real use.

Agencies may have an access to high res pictures no doubt about it, but then every other country with spy satellite has.
shut up and gohome if you don't want it...it is a good start and must be developed more, whinners like you are the one who also whine why we need satellites when others have built them, why we need to build tanks when others are already doing it... why we need army when other have it?? :rotfl:
BTW how old are you kid?
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

nakul wrote:^^^
Actually we are ahead of them. Most of western software providers are geared towards their home markets. Large swaths of India are still out of coverage and what little has been covered does not include many features that westerners take for granted (street view, traffic etc)
Can't disagree, :) :D These whinners really need to shut up and mind their own business, ISRO should focus more on improving this system and include better features when they release the next installment, that I agree with, all other whines of "Who will buy it when we have googal" is pure bullshit... googal is not Indian, what more reason do you want?? :mrgreen:
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

For every dollar spent on ISRO, we get many dollars back or a somewhat similar statement is oft made. Till now it was only the fishermen, planners & farmers reaping ISRO's benefits. Now internet hindus can do it too.

The US can afford to be all uppity about private venturism since they have already done their load of work in the 60s. Even after 50 yrs, they ares struggling with a pvt space courier. Some things cannot be left to pvt enterprises. It was DARPA (a US owned govt agency) that helped create the internet which is allowing you & me to communicate :)
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by ashish raval »

^^ Internet was a world wide effort not only USA. Btw, what is wrong in commenting on the quality of a product in this case bhuvan does it make someone a whinner ? And you a isro champion ?
Private sector can do anything they want if government does not place any restrictions on them. Look at space x. They did things in 15 years what NASA did in 50 years. No doubt technological leapfrog was already behind them. There is no budget restrictions in isro for right kind of projects. I have many scientist f and above friends who work here on several inter governmental projects here. The only scarcity is decent project managers who deliver things.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

The problem is nt about the comment per se. Its about the attitude. Its clearly unfair to compare a first timer (ISRO is not a sw giant) to an industry veteran (Google). People often comment on how Kaveri is poor compared to the GE414 engine. When comparing to products, it is important to consider the context.

Space X has yet to reach the moon. Nor does it have the technology to do so. It is doing what NASA did in the 60s. More than 50 yrs have passed & doing the same stuff is not really progress. But the point is that US can afford to do so now since it has invested a lot of money. We are in the same space situation that US was in the 60s. If one says that India should leave it to others, it is similar to saying that NASA should not have sent man/satellite to space since USSR was better at it.

IF the same comment is made in 2060 after ISRO has become as strong as NASA is today, it makes sense. Comparing 2 objects without their historical context is pointless. The first attempt seldom succeeds. You can overtake the giants only by taking small steps first.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by ashish raval »

^^ isro is not a newbie in the field with history nearing 50 years. It had state of the art equipments way back in 90's too. Isro was Indian governments highest priority and still is. Isro had iconic and very best Indian minds at its disposal. No doubt many of them left India for better shores but India is like a glacier of brilliant minds which keeps flowing.
If software development is not a strength of an organisation, it can be outsourced to private sector or stronger sw development arm of government of India.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Bade »

There is some merit in the complaint. ISRO is very protective of its assets. It has steadfastly refused to outsource many of its activities, which organizations like NASA regularly does for the past 20-30 years. At least in the case of software and IT projects, with the Indian industry having been mature with service oriented model for the past two decades, ISRO should have been championing the initiative, with lots of tangible gains all around.

The idea of releasing less crisp imagery for public (mango man) consumption, while keeping the good stuff under lock and key for government use only, is not helping either.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by vasu raya »

One of the biggest problems in the Agri sector is fragmented land holdings due to numerous small farmers, govt. policy should promote schemes wherein adjacent land holders are given better prices for the crop provided they agree to plant same crop as promoted by the govt.

the adjacent farm plots (cells) when consolidated into one large area allow usage of machine based farming equipment, a microlevel land records database greatly helps this consolidation. Hopefully Bhuvan will evolve such applications
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by pentaiah »

Absolutely born into a family with farming traditions. I have witnessed first hand the wastage and the consequent inability use mechanization of process.

Most importantly the land that is not truly utilized to full potential are the bunds erected between each small plots by subdivision with in a small holding, for reasons to block water from seepage especially in paddy fields.
Although for the second crop starting in Jan the bunds are utilized to grow ( to a small extent) pulses like red gram black gram green gram some times chenna dal or planting coco nut trees.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by nakul »

ashish raval wrote:^^ isro is not a newbie in the field with history nearing 50 years. It had state of the art equipments way back in 90's too. Isro was Indian governments highest priority and still is. Isro had iconic and very best Indian minds at its disposal. No doubt many of them left India for better shores but India is like a glacier of brilliant minds which keeps flowing.
If software development is not a strength of an organisation, it can be outsourced to private sector or stronger sw development arm of government of India.
ISRO is a bachcha is software. Please understand the context. In ISRO vs Google, the former is a space research org & the latter is a sw org. The comparison was for sw not space research.

There is no Google equivalnt in India, yet. So we do what we do. Google sources its images from Digital Globe. If Digital Globe were to go solo (without Google), the results would not have been anywhere as good as they are. Anyway my last post post on this topic
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23360 »

ISRO FB page, seems like official page

https://www.facebook.com/isro.org
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by vasu raya »

pentaiah wrote:Absolutely born into a family with farming traditions. I have witnessed first hand the wastage and the consequent inability use mechanization of process.

Most importantly the land that is not truly utilized to full potential are the bunds erected between each small plots by subdivision with in a small holding, for reasons to block water from seepage especially in paddy fields.
Although for the second crop starting in Jan the bunds are utilized to grow ( to a small extent) pulses like red gram black gram green gram some times chenna dal or planting coco nut trees.
For most farmers farm land is a lifeline and Bunding is needed to secure it, and they built a farming strategy around it over time, however in this age, bunding can be replaced with secure digital maps (courtesy Bhuvan) and ownership can be considered as land equity

these changes lead to collective or co-operative farming methods, and the derivative benefits include,

1) Crop insurance where in the scale ensures that individual farmers are't at risk curbing suicides
2) Elimination of middlemen for better pricing
3) Due to increased mechanization, manual labor which was the norm so far can be done away with and the 'more hands needed in the field' mindset of the rural folks changes leading to population control

At the field level, Bunding can be realized by the way of surveying devices, which maybe rolled into the smart phones that govt. intends to distribute to farmers, so sense of land ownership remains
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by AbhiJ »

Source

India is planning to conduct the first flight trial of its Hypersonic Technology Demonstrator Vehicle (HSTDV) in the next 12 to 18 months, according to Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) officials.

The HSTDV programme aims to produce a hydrocarbon-fuelled scramjet test article capable of Mach 6-7 and autonomously guided flight. The HSTDV will pave the way for a hypersonic cruise missile and platforms that can perhaps be applied to other tasks, such as very high-speed reconnaissance.

According to DRDO sources, initial ground tests with the kerosene-fuelled scramjet (supersonic combustion ramjet) have been completed and the propulsion system is now being integrated with the air vehicle. Roughly 10 engine runs have been completed although the development team has yet to undertake a sustained 20-second burn, which is the operating time required for initial flight trials. This milestone will be achieved "soon", IHS Jane's was told. This contradicts some previous reports that stated the 20-second mark had already been reached.

From its main facility at Hyderabad, the DRDO's Defence Research and Development Laboratory (DRDL) is responsible for the programme's current phases.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23360 »

any news on next GSLV flight (GSLV D5) ?
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Shankar »

Earliest launch of gslv mm 2 is march 2013.the cryogenic engine needs some more tests before stage integration
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Hiten »

ISRO planning to acquire Ka-Band Communication satellites for India [Space]
The Indian Space Research Organisation [ISRO] has sought 'Expression of Interest' [EOI] for construction of communication satellites operating in the Ka-band of the frequency spectrum.

The company, whom ISRO would eventually award the contract to, would be required to build one such satellite initially, with the possible option of a follow-on order to build one more. The manufacturer would be required to supply the satellite within three years from the time of signing the contract. With the 'requirement specifications document' being made available on November 6, responders have time up to December 20 to send in their EOI. Thus, assuming it takes one year to execute the various steps prior to the actual inking of the agreement, the first of these satellites would be placed in orbit sometime in 2016 or beyond...................
http://www.aame.in/2012/11/isro-ka-band ... lites.html
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23694 »

Shankar wrote: mm 2 is march 2013.the cryogenic engine needs som
Honestly i will be surprised if the launch is before april - may 2013 (most optimistic), considering that we have not heard any news with regard to the successful test of full stage test of the cryo stage for the complete duration and with the kind of cautious approach being followed by ISRO expect delays
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23694 »

Please check this link in youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQNJG8MPcIc

Falcon 9 launch video. Best part was the coverage (except for some issue in video), but stage burn / seperation and ignition of another stage, satellite seperation all those video being broadcasted, it really made watching the satellite launch experience much much better than viewing the blinking dots on the screen and hearing a few claps.

Please ISRO u can provide a better live feed of satellite launches
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

dhiraj wrote:Please check this link in youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQNJG8MPcIc

Falcon 9 launch video. Best part was the coverage (except for some issue in video), but stage burn / seperation and ignition of another stage, satellite seperation all those video being broadcasted, it really made watching the satellite launch experience much much better than viewing the blinking dots on the screen and hearing a few claps.

Please ISRO u can provide a better live feed of satellite launches
This is not related to ISRO dhiraj, please do not act like a fanboy and stay away from making fan boyish comments.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23694 »

P.Bhagat wrote:This is not related to ISRO dhiraj, please do not act like a fanboy and stay away from making fan boyish comments
Sorry i did not get what u meant with the statement. I know it is video of falcon 9 developed by a private entity in US.
I am a big fan of ISRO and just a humble request if ISRO could also provide such a live feed for its satellite launches at least for PSLV, it would just make the launch viewing more spectacular. What is such a big technological challenge with this, every one around the world is doing. Does it not look good :D ?
(FYI i have watched at least 95% of the launches done by ISRO which has been broadcasted live)
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by Varoon Shekhar »

"Honestly i will be surprised if the launch is before april - may 2013 (most optimistic), considering that we have not heard any news with regard to the successful test of full stage test of the cryo stage for the complete duration and with the kind of cautious approach being followed by ISRO expect delays"

It would be nice if ISRO spokesmen stopped making unrealistic( and as it almost always turns out, totally incorrect) projections. Even for PSLV launches, they are inaccurate by a figure of 6 months to a year, often. And for the GSLV, whether mark 2 or mark 3, they are nowhere close to what they originally stated!

Knowing this, as they must, why don't they try to err on the side of caution for a change? So as not to get people's hopes up too much. Hey, now there's an idea.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23694 »

No Saral on 12-12-12.
http://zeenews.india.com/news/space/isr ... 12325.html

Can ISRO stop announcing dates please.... :-?
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

dhiraj wrote:
P.Bhagat wrote:This is not related to ISRO dhiraj, please do not act like a fanboy and stay away from making fan boyish comments
Sorry i did not get what u meant with the statement. I know it is video of falcon 9 developed by a private entity in US.
I am a big fan of ISRO and just a humble request if ISRO could also provide such a live feed for its satellite launches at least for PSLV, it would just make the launch viewing more spectacular. What is such a big technological challenge with this, every one around the world is doing. Does it not look good :D ?
(FYI i have watched at least 95% of the launches done by ISRO which has been broadcasted live)
Whatever it maybe please don't post foreign videos here. I am pretty sure there is a thread for international discussion. Your repeated fanboyish comments are a little annoying and I would like if you tone it down. There is no reason to whine over little failures.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by member_23677 »

dhiraj wrote:
P.Bhagat wrote:This is not related to ISRO dhiraj, please do not act like a fanboy and stay away from making fan boyish comments
Sorry i did not get what u meant with the statement. I know it is video of falcon 9 developed by a private entity in US.
I am a big fan of ISRO and just a humble request if ISRO could also provide such a live feed for its satellite launches at least for PSLV, it would just make the launch viewing more spectacular. What is such a big technological challenge with this, every one around the world is doing. Does it not look good :D ?
(FYI i have watched at least 95% of the launches done by ISRO which has been broadcasted live)
Whatever it maybe please don't post foreign videos here. I am pretty sure there is a thread for international discussion. Your repeated fanboyish comments are a little annoying and I would like if you tone it down. There is no reason to whine over little failures.
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Re: Indian Space Program Discussion

Post by AbhiJ »

ISRO Designing GEO Imaging Satellite
Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) is designing a satellite – GEO Imaging Satellite (GISAT), which will be placed in geostationary orbit of 36,000 km. GISAT will provide near real time pictures of large areas of the country, under cloud free conditions, at frequent intervals. That is, selected sector-wise imaging every 5 minutes and entire Indian landmass every 30 minutes at 50m spatial resolution.

GISAT will carry a GEO Imager with multi-spectral (visible, near infra-red and thermal), multi-resolution (50m to 1.5 km) imaging instruments. It will provide pictures of the area of interest on near real time basis including border areas.
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