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PostPosted: 05 Nov 2012 22:26 
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kersi is deep state spy :)


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PostPosted: 05 Nov 2012 22:32 
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Snehashis wrote:
Kersi D wrote:
From various sources especially our BR database I infer
Sqdn 20, Sqdn 30 - Lohegaon
Sqdn 2 - Tezpur
Sqdn 8 - Bareilly,
Sqdn 31 - Halwara ???
Sqdn 102 - Chabua

Can some expert complete the list for this mango man ?

k



As per wiki :


Present Deployments

Bhatinda AFS: 34 Wing’s 17 Golden Arrows sqn with Su-30MKI since June 2012.

Chabua AFS: 14 Wing’s 102 Trisonics sqn with Su-30MKI since March 8, 2011.

Halwara AFS: 34 Wing’s 220 Desert Tigers sqn with Su-30MKI since September 25, 2012.

Jodhpur AFS: 32 Wing’s 31 Lions sqn with Su-30MKI since October 1, 2011.

Pune/Lohegaon AFS: 2 Wing’s 20 Lightnings sqn (since September 27, 2002) & 30 Rhinos sqn with Su-30MKI (since March 21, 2005).

Tezpur AFS: 11 Wing’s 2 Winged Arrows sqn with Su-30MKI since June 15, 2009.


Future Deployments

The above squadrons will in future be joined by:

Bhuj AFS: 27 Wing’s 15 Flying Lancers Sqn to begin converting to Su-30MKI in December 2012 and four Su-30MKIs will be tasked with strategic reconnaissance along the India-Pakistan borders with EL/M-2060P SAR pod.

Sirsa AFS: 45 Wing’s 21 Ankush sqn (now with MiG-21 Bisons, will convert to Su-30MKI by the year’s end and four of its Su-30MKIs will be tasked with strategic reconnaissance along the India-Pakistan borders with EL/M-2060P SAR pod.

Kalaikunda AFS: 5 Wing’s 18 Flying Bullets sqn will begin converting to Su-30MKI by June 2013.

Hashimara AFS: 16 Wing’s 222 Tigersharks sqn will begin converting to Su-30MKI by June 2013.

In addition to the above, an all-new Su-30MKI squadron will be raised for deployment to Thanjavur by 2015, and will be followed by the raising of three more Su-30MKI squadrons, leading to a grand total of 17 squadrons equipped with Su-30MKIs.


Wiki's data is erroneous, intentionally or un-intentionally

As Rajat said, WHERE IS BAREILLY ?

Me think there is 1 sqdn at Lohegaon and 2 sqdns at Bareilly.

Me thinks Sqdn 30, Rhino is at Tezpur, they were earlier flying Mig 21 of EAC at Hashimara or Bagdogra.

I think Sqdn 8 Pursoots gave also converted from MiG 21XYZ to SU 30MKI

I understand that Jamnagar, rather than Bhuj, will get 1/2 sqdns of SU 30 MKI.

K


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PostPosted: 05 Nov 2012 22:35 
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Surya wrote:
kersi is deep state spy :)


I thought that was a secret. Why don't you keep quiet ??????


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PostPosted: 05 Nov 2012 22:46 
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Wiki data is wrong. It doesn't mention 8 and 24 squadrons which are in Bareilly. The deep state spy is right. ;)


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PostPosted: 05 Nov 2012 23:08 
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sorry kersi next time :)


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PostPosted: 07 Nov 2012 13:45 
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Surya wrote:
kersi is deep state spy :)


:(( :(( :(( :(( :((


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PostPosted: 07 Nov 2012 19:28 
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just a thought
for the SU-30 and Rafale in the near future deployed in the North East , there main use will be
1. protect our air space against Chinese fighter
2. strike against enemy target inside the opponents territory

Now my concern lies for the point 2 above.

SU-30 and later Super Su 30 are said to have very powerful radars and the weapon capability of Su-30 and Rafale are 8 and 9.5 tonne resp. but for that matter i have not yet seen the Indian Sukhoi having shown the capability to strike target in range greater than 300 km.
I know brahmos and nirbhay coming up but my point is for the present, do we have any such capability and if not then how does the powerful radar on them are helpful.
And secondly if we don;t have the capability and send these aircrafts near the target to strike then how successful will they be especially against the Chinese air defence.
Further from planning perspective if the Sukhoi have been with us for more than a decade now and if we still don;t have greater than 300Km strike capability from it (something like a storm shadow or TAURUS KEPD 350 [even Pakistan has a Raad missile ] ) then i think that we have not yet exploited the full capability of Su -30

Would definitely like to be corrected if i have misunderstood something


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PostPosted: 14 Nov 2012 20:32 
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Some Su-30Ks undergoing deep overhaul in Belarus... Looks like the ones we returned.

http://englishrussia.com/2012/11/13/belorussian-aircraft-repair-plant/


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PostPosted: 15 Nov 2012 03:39 
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dhiraj wrote:
I know brahmos and nirbhay coming up but my point is for the present, do we have any such capability and if not then how does the powerful radar on them are helpful.


No we don't have such a strike capability right now, the max is MKI with Kh 59, which might come at half the range depending on which version we have. One reason why additional stand off strike capability must be added soon and besides MKI/Brahmos, the Mirage 2000 upgrade could be an option as well. Spice 1000/2000 are under evaluation, Scalp cruise missile possible too.


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 10:14 
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Here u go

Russia and China reached preliminary agreement for 48 Su-35BMs
http://idrw.org/?p=15926#more-15926

and that too 48 Su 35 for only $1.5 billion . what is the price of the additional 42 Su 30 MKI (super version i beleive) that India is buying

With this deal will the Indian Su 30 MKI finally meet its match in the North or are they even better than the Indian version and if that is case then :evil: :evil: :evil:


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 16:45 
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Location: नशा भंग ते शराब दा उतर जाए परभात नाम खुमारी नानका चढ़ी रहे दिन रात !
dhiraj wrote:
and that too 48 Su 35 for only $1.5 billion . what is the price of the additional 42 Su 30 MKI (super version i beleive) that India is buying

With this deal will the Indian Su 30 MKI finally meet its match in the North or are they even better than the Indian version and if that is case then :evil: :evil: :evil:


Nah!!! Rambhas are the most capable of all flankers. See IAF got the best of all worlds in their birds : Indian, French, Israeli plus the russkie stuff.

New coming Super flankers are going to be the most capable of flanker lineage.

35s are going to have only one pilot, hence probably more fuel and more range too, though one man vs. two will be huge disadvantage.

1.5 billion is a killer price though, hope IAF buys 60 too, yummy soooo cheap for such a capable bird!


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 16:54 
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why buy those when they have their own super duper planes and why just 48 ??


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 17:01 
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The news of China buying 48 Su-35 is just not true its just rumours , Sukhoi has mentioned that they would get Su-35 to china in 2014 Air Show .... right now there is no confirmation of China buying it and they wont sell it either till the IP issues gets resolved


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 20:53 
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48 Su-35 for $1.5 billion is simply not possible. That would mean $31.25 million per bird.

The cost of Su-35 is upwards for $65million.


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 21:14 
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Sancho wrote:
dhiraj wrote:
I know brahmos and nirbhay coming up but my point is for the present, do we have any such capability and if not then how does the powerful radar on them are helpful.


No we don't have such a strike capability right now, the max is MKI with Kh 59, which might come at half the range depending on which version we have. One reason why additional stand off strike capability must be added soon and besides MKI/Brahmos, the Mirage 2000 upgrade could be an option as well. Spice 1000/2000 are under evaluation, Scalp cruise missile possible too.


Kh 59 ???


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 21:16 
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Sancho wrote:
dhiraj wrote:
I know brahmos and nirbhay coming up but my point is for the present, do we have any such capability and if not then how does the powerful radar on them are helpful.


No we don't have such a strike capability right now, the max is MKI with Kh 59, which might come at half the range depending on which version we have. One reason why additional stand off strike capability must be added soon and besides MKI/Brahmos, the Mirage 2000 upgrade could be an option as well. Spice 1000/2000 are under evaluation, Scalp cruise missile possible too.



IAF is supposed to have a Israeli air-to-surface missile which was intially called as Crystal Maze. It was to be on M 2000.

What is Crystam Maze ? Popeye Lite ? Delilah ? Spice ?

Is it used on SU 30 MKI

Regards

D S Jasoos

(Deep State Spy)


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 21:36 
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crystal maze = popeye2 imo (150km, solid rocket motor), not popeye turbo(bigger,turbojet,300km).
its a weapon carried routinely by F-16I Sufa
even then the popeye is around 12 feet long.


http://www.missilethreat.com/cruise/id. ... detail.asp

In 1994, Israel tested the Popeye 2 “Have Lite” from an Israeli Air Force (IAF) F-16 Fighting Falcon, and the missile entered service the following year. It is currently deployed on F-16 and F/A-18 aircraft, each of which can carry two missiles. The Popeye 2 has been exported to Australia, Turkey, South Korea, and possibly Greece. A modified version was exported to India.

a domestic fleetwide weapon in that size and range would be the micro-brahmos they are exploring. can replace all of the KH29, KH31, KH59 in one shot with no restrictions on which ac russian, indian or western is compatible.


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 21:50 
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dhiraj wrote:
Here u go

Russia and China reached preliminary agreement for 48 Su-35BMs
http://idrw.org/?p=15926#more-15926

and that too 48 Su 35 for only $1.5 billion . what is the price of the additional 42 Su 30 MKI (super version i beleive) that India is buying

With this deal will the Indian Su 30 MKI finally meet its match in the North or are they even better than the Indian version and if that is case then :evil: :evil: :evil:


Dumb questions

1. Does it mean Chinese 5th gen project is not on time? Are they expecting severe delays that require them to buy su-35s?

2. Does it mean the current Chinese ding dongs j10, j11 and j25 are inferior to su-30mki?

3. Given 1 and 2 is Chinese 5th gen ding dong is hardly at su-30 level and cannot compete with FGFA?


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PostPosted: 23 Nov 2012 02:36 
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The figure of $1.5 Billion for 48 Su-35's is hopelessly wrong.

The only other sale the Su-35 has notched was for Mother Russia.

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20090818/155847516.html

48 Su-35's, 12 Su-30 and 4 Su-27's were sold for $2.5 Billion in 2009. No way, in 2012, 48 Su-35's will be sold for $1.5 Billion.

Someone somewhere has made a mistake or is deliberately quoting a wrong number.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2012 20:10 
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First production Su-35S for RuAF

http://www.mycity-military.com/imgs2/14 ... _hires.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LUIba.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/67U6p.jpg


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2012 20:28 
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Austin wrote:
First production Su-35S for RuAF


always like fighters in black , YF 23, F 22, Rafale and now Su 35.
Keep the Indian Rafale and Super Su 30 in black 8) 8) 8)


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 10:15 
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I have a question for gurus on flight training and tactics, I stay at pune close to airpost and as my observation on MKI flight schedules it covers 90 to 95 percent of it in day time; even max in morning and evening. So the question is, how we train our mki pilots for night operations and missions? Or is it any other base for such niche expertise?


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 10:26 
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keshavchandra wrote:
I have a question for gurus on flight training and tactics, I stay at pune close to airpost and as my observation on MKI flight schedules it covers 90 to 95 percent of it in day time; even max in morning and evening. So the question is, whow we train our mki pilots for night operations and missions? Or is it any other base for such niche expertise?


I think night flying is far more common from air bases far from urban centers that will be disturbed by the night time roar of jets. Even India has noise regulations. When Su-30s take off in the evening from Pune you will never know whether the same aircraft returned or went off to another base. Recall that it is light in Pune at 7-00 in the evening when it is darker in Bangalore and pitch black in central and east India due to the longitude difference.


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 13:17 
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there is a pic of a lineup of Su30 at kalaikunda , just about depart for a night exercise.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... Y8yOl714eM


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 14:08 
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Singha wrote:
there is a pic of a lineup of Su30 at kalaikunda , just about depart for a night exercise.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... Y8yOl714eM

but sinha sir I yet not get the point, as pune and khadagpur both are B grade cities (as the noise and disturbance norms are based on cities grading)and both have urban air bases close to city. Even the ganaga nagar air base of mki havevery intense night flights prectices. And I think there is same situ in banglore of regular schedule night flights. So why not such particualrly in pune the night flights are not regular , even it is a big base with three mki squadrons.


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 18:37 
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I have never been to pune or know anything about it. was just pointing out some other IAF bases get quite active at night.


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 20:35 
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An interesting paper on the challenges of training for nightflying in the USAF.

http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a240970.pdf


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PostPosted: 10 Dec 2012 21:01 
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^^ Lohegaon is being upgraded under MAFI project. Most likely night flying is on hold until the instrumentation is installed. I've seen Canberra's & Super Constallations night flying from Pune 40 years ago.

Added later - this is indeed the case http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... e-lohegaon

Quote:
Browne, who has headed the Lohegaon airbase, said, "All MAFI-I works will be carried out during night hours in view of the civilian flight operations, which occur during daytime. We have set up an independent training establishment at the 7 Tetra School near the airbase for training our personnel in the handling of MAFI equipment," he said.


Quote:
Barring the runway, MAFI-I augurs well for civilian flight operations as the project will see the Lohegaon airfield getting a new state-of-the-art instrument landing system (ILS), distance measure equipment, tactical air navigation system, automated air traffic management system, which is to be provided by US defence major Raytheon, and new runway lights, among others. The entire phase-I contract has been bagged by the Tata Power Strategic Electronics Division.


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PostPosted: 12 Dec 2012 22:12 
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New Ind.Exp reports that the IAF will base SU-30s at Thanjavur and Sulur (Coimbatore) in the futre,both bases being modernised for the same.The LCA will eventually arrive at Sulur,most probably after the Flanker induction.With the other report that the LCA needs another 1500 crores,we might as well nickname it as a "Black hole"!.


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PostPosted: 12 Dec 2012 23:32 
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Philip wrote:
New Ind.Exp reports that the IAF will base SU-30s at Thanjavur and Sulur (Coimbatore) in the futre,both bases being modernised for the same.The LCA will eventually arrive at Sulur,most probably after the Flanker induction.With the other report that the LCA needs another 1500 crores,we might as well nickname it as a "Black hole"!.


Care to compare the cost involved in developing other front-line weapon systems in the world..? it is really matter of parallel path of development (F-22--- Lockheed and Boeing), multiple engine options (F-35) which often helps Khan to cut down the development time which we do not have the luxury off...

kindly check this link.. which came out a week back..

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/most-expe ... 55071.html

Total program cost

1. F-35 --- $ 332 Billion +
2. BMD system ----$ 126.3 Billion +
3. DDG-51 Guided Missile Destroyer ---- $ 87.3 Billion
4. Pratt and Whitney F135 --- $63.8 Billion
5. V-22 Osprey ----$53.5 Billion

check the other 5 in the link....


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 04:41 
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Putin may announce $7 billion arms deal during India trip.

Russian President Vladimir Putin may announce about $7 billion worth of weapons contracts, including for Sukhoi fighter jets, when he visits India next week, according to three people in the defence industry.

During Putin’s visit on 24 December, the two countries will announce contracts for 42 Sukhoi Su-30MKI jets, made by United Aircraft’s Irkut Corp., and almost 1,000 AL-31 warplane engines to be delivered through 2030, according to the three people who asked not to be identified because the information isn’t public. Putin’s spokesman Dmitry Peskov declined to comment.

India, Russia’s top arms customer, has at least doubled its defence budget over the last decade as it looks beyond a traditional rivalry with Pakistan to counter China’s rising power. Putin, who returned to the presidency this year, has spearheaded Russia’s efforts to fend off competition for the contracts from the US and Europe.

“These will be truly historical deals if signed,” Konstantin Makiyenko, the deputy head of the Moscow-based Centre for the Analysis of Strategies and Technologies, said by phone on Monday. “I don’t remember a contract for 1,000 engines at all and deals for over 40 planes happen twice in a decade.”
Syed Akbaruddin, a spokesman at the Indian ministry of external affairs, wasn’t available to comment. Vyacheslav Davidenko, a spokesman for Russia’s state-owned weapons exporter Rosoboronexport, declined to comment.

Russian defence-industry exports have exceeded $14 billion this year, higher than the government’s target, Putin said on Monday. The country has signed new contracts worth $15 billion in 2012, he added.

Then-defence minister Anatoly Serdyukov said 10 October that Russia expected to sign a deal to ship 42 Sukhoi jets to India by the end of the year, RIA Novosti news service reported.

India has already received about 150 Russian jets, according to CAST estimates.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 07:42 
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good. but we should ensure Sukhoi continues to improve on the AL31 engine and delivers EPE and EDE enhancements in future tranches rather than just taking our money to improve the 117(pakfa) and 117s(su35bm). I believe something called the AL31FM2 is there in prototype format and could be adapted to the TVC as a AL31FP2


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 09:11 
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http://bmpd.livejournal.com/410074.html

$5 billion deal with Rosoboronexport for license production of 970 AL-31FP engine for MKI


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 10:07 
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970 Al-31FP, where we use this many of engine.Since ~150 MKI already inducted and 120 left. 240 will go there.still 700+ left , so either we use all the remaining ones as spares or we can say in future number of MKI, in super 30, will increase.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 10:31 
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Prithwiraj wrote:
Philip wrote:
New Ind.Exp reports that the IAF will base SU-30s at Thanjavur and Sulur (Coimbatore) in the futre,both bases being modernised for the same.The LCA will eventually arrive at Sulur,most probably after the Flanker induction.With the other report that the LCA needs another 1500 crores,we might as well nickname it as a "Black hole"!.


Care to compare the cost involved in developing other front-line weapon systems in the world..? it is really matter of parallel path of development (F-22--- Lockheed and Boeing), multiple engine options (F-35) which often helps Khan to cut down the development time which we do not have the luxury off...

kindly check this link.. which came out a week back..

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/most-expe ... 55071.html

Total program cost

1. F-35 --- $ 332 Billion +
2. BMD system ----$ 126.3 Billion +
3. DDG-51 Guided Missile Destroyer ---- $ 87.3 Billion
4. Pratt and Whitney F135 --- $63.8 Billion
5. V-22 Osprey ----$53.5 Billion

check the other 5 in the link....


Philip has a right to have his own opinion. He doesn't want Bharat to start any single new project on its own. He wants us to buy only second hand stuff from brishiters. He wants us to buy their unfinished queer-something-aircraft carrier. This way Bharatvarsh doesn't have to go through the pain and learning of developing new systems, his favourite country will carry that burden for us.

Very compassionate of Philip and his beloved britain about whom his opinion is :

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5366&p=1375310#p1375310

".......betrayer of the favourite British virtues of truth and justice and his Anglican heritage for the Catholic Church,......."

Sorry didn't know, I only remembered brits for their cunning genocides like 'artificially created famines' which killed 5 million bengalis??? and churchill the believer of this "favourite British virtues of truth and justice" is known to have said compassionately "Indians will breed like rabbits again......"

Nope this 1500 crore will go to lazy PSU workers salary, back in desi economy, and our good for nothing DRDO scientists. The british have the first and last right to this and all other funds being used to develop platforms indigenously. The british can use this money to develop new aircrafts, ships, systems and we can buy their old second hand systems. Yup this is the way to go.

Everybody on BR must now remember how Philip had said years ago that instead of developing Tejas we should just work of Mig 21 improvisation. Now look what happened we're going to face the pain of learning to setup production lines for LCA. We shouldn't do that, its all black hole.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 11:28 
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what will we do of 1000 engines? :O

AMCA!


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 11:50 
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^^ Engine life is much lesser than airframe life, so an aircraft needs multiple engines over its lifetime. Especially since Russian design philosophy is fully replace rather than multiple overhauls.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 11:56 
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>> Philip and his beloved britain

:rotfl: dont be misled by the name, he is very much indian and many senior brfites know him.
he would be most upset to be taken as a bartania supporter, quite the opposite in fact!


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 11:57 
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@tsarkar
but for that case, wouldn't it be wise to wait till MLU and get the best suited technology then.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2012 12:12 
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^^ Agree, in that wisdom Jaguar is getting a different engine from the original one.


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