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PostPosted: 19 Nov 2012 00:41 
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Z-10 High end and Z-19 will form low end. There are 3 squadron of Z19 in service or 36 machines with production continuing.

sorry...but they look like Dauphin SA-365 knock off's, especially the fenestron tail rotored ones. Dauphins are licence built in the PRC by Shenyang or Avic or one of them, so no need there for extended multi layered industrial theft.
Dauphins are great sturdy platforms though. ONGC uses them back and forth to the Bombay High fields.


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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012 03:59 
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There are about 18-21 in service with China currently plus ten more coming soon..

http://www.interfax.co.uk/russia-milita ... -to-china/

Quote:
Rosoboronexport to deliver ten Il-76 transports to China

ZHUHAI, China. Nov 19 (Interfax-AVN) - Russia will deliver ten Ilyushin Il-76 transport aircraft to China following overall repairs, said Sergei Kornev, a deparatment head with the Russian state arms trader Rosoboronexport.

"Under a contract signed with China we will deliver ten Il-76 aircraft from the stock available, and we have already selected seven of the ten," Kornev told reporters at Air Show China in Zhuhai, where he had arrived as leader of the Rosoboronexport delegation.

The contract deals with military transports already used and put through overall repairs, he said.

Asked whether China had been offered the upgraded IL-476 to be produced in Ulyanovsk, he sad, "it would be premature to speculate before the plane has gone through the entire testing program."

The plane has been deeply upgraded and got new engines, wing and avionics, he said.

"We will promote this plane as it has a good export potential," Kornev said.


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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012 07:52 
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gnair wrote:
Z-10 High end and Z-19 will form low end. There are 3 squadron of Z19 in service or 36 machines with production continuing.

sorry...but they look like Dauphin SA-365 knock off's, especially the fenestron tail rotored ones. Dauphins are licence built in the PRC by Shenyang or Avic or one of them, so no need there for extended multi layered industrial theft.
Dauphins are great sturdy platforms though. ONGC uses them back and forth to the Bombay High fields.


Dauphin -> Z-9 -> Z-19.

Don wrote:
There are about 18-21 in service with China currently plus ten more coming soon..

http://www.interfax.co.uk/russia-milita ... -to-china/

Quote:
Rosoboronexport to deliver ten Il-76 transports to China

ZHUHAI, China. Nov 19 (Interfax-AVN) - Russia will deliver ten Ilyushin Il-76 transport aircraft to China following overall repairs, said Sergei Kornev, a deparatment head with the Russian state arms trader Rosoboronexport.

"Under a contract signed with China we will deliver ten Il-76 aircraft from the stock available, and we have already selected seven of the ten," Kornev told reporters at Air Show China in Zhuhai, where he had arrived as leader of the Rosoboronexport delegation.

The contract deals with military transports already used and put through overall repairs, he said.

Asked whether China had been offered the upgraded IL-476 to be produced in Ulyanovsk, he sad, "it would be premature to speculate before the plane has gone through the entire testing program."

The plane has been deeply upgraded and got new engines, wing and avionics, he said.

"We will promote this plane as it has a good export potential," Kornev said.


India has a few that could be refurbished.


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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012 20:23 
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http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/ ... J820121116

Quote:
AIRSHOW-China pushes exports, flags ambitions at arms fair


* China displays model of second stealth jet in Zhuhai

* Anti-aircraft missile, endurance UAV debut at show

* Z-10 attack helicopter in first public flight display

By Tim Hepher

ZHUHAI, China, Nov 16 (Reuters) - China is flexing its muscles as an arms exporter with a growing array of indigenous weaponry, offering something for most budgets in the global arms bazaar and revealing its wider ambitions to strategic rivals and watchful neighbours.

As a new leadership was anointed in Beijing and the world looked on to see what direction it might take over the next decade, military officials from Africa to Southeast Asia were shopping for Chinese weapons in the country's south.

Change has come fast in China, now the world's second-largest economy, and with its rise has come a new sense of military assertiveness with a growing budget to develop modern warfare equipment including aircraft carriers and drones.

All the signs point to newly named Communist Party chief Xi Jinping, who is slated to become president next March, continuing China's aggressive military modernisation.

Now the world's fourth-largest arms exporter, China laid out its wares this week at an air show in Zhuhai, a palm-lined port between Macau and Hong Kong that becomes a heavily armed industry showcase every other November.

In the 10 years to 2011, China's foreign military sales have increased 95 percent, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI).

Among dozens of items shown publicly for the first time this week were Chinese attack helicopters, missiles, unmanned aerial vehicles and air defences. As usual, the exhibit halls contained everything from shoulder-fired weapons to cruise missiles.

"China is getting more aggressive in the export market as its own industrial base develops," said Doug Barrie, senior fellow for Military Aerospace at the London-based International Institute for Strategic Studies.

"It looks at Russia and the U.S. as examples of how you can use the export arena to help develop your own industries."

Between them, Washington and Moscow account for more than half of the world's $410 billion in arms sales, but opportunities abound for China as the United States looks to cut its military spending to manage its mounting debt.

Still, U.S. spending dwarfs that of China. In its annual report on the Chinese military, the Pentagon in May estimated Beijing's total 2012 spending would be between $120 billion and $180 billion. Washington will spend $614 billion on its military this year.

Most of Beijing's trade is done with small states outside of the European Union, which like the United States, put China under an arms embargo after the crackdown on Tiananmen Square protests in 1989.

Pakistan, Bangladesh, Iran and Myanmar are among China's biggest clients, with aircraft at the top of their shopping lists, SIPRI data shows.

Beijing does not release official figures for arms sales. Foreign estimates put the figure at about $2 billion in 2011.

STAR OF SHOW: STEALTH FIGHTER

The undisputed star of the show this week was a sleek, quarter-sized model of China's second stealth fighter, dubbed the J-31 by most Western analysts.

Although officially a concept plane, it bore what industry bible Aviation Week called a "striking resemblance" to a mystery jet that flew briefly at the end of October.

Photographs of the jet leaked, or orchestrated to look like a leak, and emerged on the Internet days before this week's Communist Party Congress and leadership handover, and confirmed China's place in a select club of stealth-capable nations.

"China has stood up," said John Pike, director of Virginia-based GlobalSecurity.org, an expert on industry strategy.

Only the United States has successfully produced more than one stealth jet and the challenges facing China's less experienced developers are undoubtedly immense.

The unveiling also served as a reminder to its neighbours of China's growing clout as tensions rise over rival claims for territory in the East China Sea and South China Sea.

"China is doing this as part of a political equation," said Robert Hewson, editor of IHS Jane's Air-Launched Weapons. "It has had a rapidly staged coming out but I am surprised to see it here so soon."

By mixing domestic and international messages, the model also filled a void left by the absence of top Chinese government officials distracted by the transition in Beijing.

BASIC BUT RELIABLE

The business end of the show is about present-day realities.

After relying heavily on Russian and to a lesser extent Israeli technology in the 1990s, China is pushing exports of home-grown equipment to expand its influence in areas like Africa where it is busy buying land and forging new allies.

"The Chinese used to simply produce cheap knockoffs of their basic Russian equipment. They have made very considerable advances, but still have problems, particularly with engines," said Simon Wezeman, senior researcher at the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute.

"On some technology, they are now competitive on technology with European arms exports and very competitive on price."

China has sold defence systems and co-developed a derivative of a Russian fighter with Pakistan and done smaller deals with African countries. There is also interest from Latin America.

Western analysts say China has a reputation for selling basic but reliable equipment with relatively few questions asked about its use, a key selling point.

But the range of products on display in Zhuhai is both increasing and gradually moving up in value, while remaining a decade or two behind the most advanced U.S. equipment.

COPYCAT APPROACH

For the first time at Zhuhai, China showed an export version of a long-range surface-to-air missile, the truck-mounted FD-2000, and a Predator-style UAV called the Wing Loong.

There was also a focus on systems that build relationships such as the L-15 trainer, which won its first export deal to an unidentified country at the show.

Admittedly, China's other reputation for copying what it cannot make is unlikely to disappear any time soon.

A parlour game among delegates is to tick off the similarities between Chinese systems and foreign platforms.

"When you come and see these aircraft you relate them to what you have seen before. The K-8 is a Hawk, the J-10 a Eurofighter, the L-15 an Aermacchi M-346," said an officer with an African air force delegation, asking not to be identified.

"That is why some people don't want to send their planes here. You come back in five years and it's called a J-something."

Organisers said a record 650 companies from 38 countries showed up to present exhibits at the ninth Zhuhai show.

A few yards and a Chinese wall separate the military part of the show and Western aerospace suppliers striking deals with China's fledgling civil aerospace industry.

This week's flying displays included a surprise debut of the Z-10 months after U.S. company United Technologies admitted selling software that helped Beijing develop its first modern military attack helicopter.

"China's aviation industry is turning out reasonably decent products," said Pike in a telephone interview. "They are not there yet and they have a long way to go. But they are open for business."


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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2012 09:50 
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So its official J-31 is powered by Russian Engine

Russian Officials Reveal J-31 and Describe Engine Sales to China

Quote:
China’s recently flown second stealth fighter is powered by a pair of Russian-supplied Klimov RD-93 turbofans, AIN has learned. A large model of the design, which has been dubbed the J-31 in unofficial reports, was on display at Airshow China in Zhuhai last week, labeled as “an advanced multi-role fighter for the international defense market.” Russian officials at the show described the supply of military

Speculation that the new fighter uses Russian powerplants was confirmed by Vladimir Barkovsky, deputy general director of the Russian Aircraft Corp. “MIG” and head of its engineering center named after Artyem Mikoyan. Although he mentioned certain design flaws, Barkovsky gave a generally positive general assessment for the new Avic fighter design. “It looks like a good machine, and although it obviously has some design solutions already tried on the U.S. fifth-generation fighters, it is not a copy but a well done indigenous design,” he told AIN.

Barkovsky expressed regrets over the Russian MoD’s decision not to develop a next-generation lightweight fighter, saying that it may lead to Russia losing out in this distinct market segment. RAC MiG’s most recent MiG-29M2 and its exportable derivative the MiG-35D, belong to the 4++ generation, he explained. Barkovsky further said that the Chinese fighter manufacturers have achieved notable progress with durability and reparability of their products. They have also improved their after-sales support system, which was deplorable a few years ago, he added.

Sergei Kornev, head of the aviation department of Rosonboronexport, told journalists at Airshow China 2012 that, with help from Belarussian advisors and specialized companies, the Chinese fighter manufacturers have managed to create a workable system of after-sales support. For its part, he continued, Russia has sold to China the documentation on overhaul and lifecycle support of the AL-31F series engines and helped it establish a well functioning system for keeping them serviceable.

Kornev added that during the next meeting of the Sino-Russian interstate committee for military-technical cooperation, which opened on November 21, Moscow and Beijing are expected to sign a number of agreements relating to intellectual property rights. Kornev said that this should further ease the transfer of Russian knowledge and expertise in the sphere of combat aviation and its after-sales support.

Engines account for more than 90 percent of all Russian aerospace exports to China. “In the past two years, we have signed large contracts with China for several hundred additional engines of the AL-31F, AL-31FN and D-30KP2 types. Shipments are now ongoing,” Kornev said. The D-30KP2 powers the Ilyushin Il-76 transport, while the AL-31 family powers the Su-27/30/34 series of combat aircraft, and the Chinese J-11 derivative. In addition, Russia has delivered improved performance AL-31FN Series 3 and later turbofans for China’s indigenous J-10 fighter.

Asked whether Russia has assisted China in its development of the WS-10A Tai Hang engine that is broadly similar to the AL-31F, Kornev answered that Russian specialists have not been briefed on this design and that Russia has never delivered AL-31F design documentation to China. Regarding the RD-93, which China mainly uses to power the JF-17 (FC-1) fighter, Kornev said that Russia has completed deliveries of 100 of the engine under a framework agreement for 500. Negotiations on the next batch are ongoing. “All juridical formalities regarding new sales are agreed upon; our negotiations are purely about commercial aspects, including price,” he insisted.


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PostPosted: 24 Nov 2012 23:52 
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The eagle has landed.

Image


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 00:10 
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Is it just me or are the shadows of the fighter and the grease-monkeys not in the same orientation? You know... the length and angle thing.
:-?


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 00:13 
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Prepare to take off
Image


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 00:18 
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watch the edge of the runway on the first pic, the rope pulling it back will not extend that far, if the plane has traveled that far while landing, it will be a go around usually


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 00:25 
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what is this?


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 01:29 
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Katare wrote:
what is this?

Nothing, really. Just the first bunch of carrier landing pics.
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2012-11/2 ... 998037.htm


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 01:49 
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When/How did they get planes (Su?) that have folding wings and arrestor hooks for landing on an aircraft carrier?

Have they bought these recently?

Sorry but I think I am more ignorant than I thought about this chinese saga!


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 02:07 
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IIRC, it is another clone. The J-15 is clone based on the T-10Ks, an Su-33 prototype, from Ukraine. Goes back a few years - 2005ish or so.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 02:55 
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SNaik wrote:
Katare wrote:
what is this?

Nothing, really. Just the first bunch of carrier landing pics.
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2012-11/2 ... 998037.htm

Wow those are nice pics. Did not realize they can achieve it so quickly.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 04:56 
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J-15 first takeoff and landing drill on aircraft carrier LiaoNing.

Starts at 1:20


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 05:45 
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Will they buy the machinery /engine from Russian Su-33 line now that Russia thinks Su-33 is obsolete and going with Mig-29K.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 07:21 
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^^If the above pics are actually real, I have just one thing to say "China is the best thing that ever happened to Indian defence." Really, if this does not light a fire under a$$es of our defence department, I do not know what will. The plans for the new aircraft carriers should be expedited as soon as possible and so should the plans for NLCA.

It has been surprises galore for some months with regard to Chinese equipment and though we have had to deal with shoddy photoshopping in the past, these days it seems like the real deal (no idea how well it works, but at least it actually flies and sails).

We just need to make sure we do not slack our efforts and put enough men, money and muscle behind our projects. There are rumours of two more aircraft carriers being built in China. If that is true, they are not even waiting to actually learn how to use one before making two more of them. No matter how effective or ineffective their efforts are, one cannot fault China for not trying.

Well, I hope there are more jolts from China to shock the UPA from its slumber. Because in the end, I think the worst anyone could do to India is not threaten it (that is the only way we will be ready to defend ourselves).


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 07:27 
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carriers being long lead items and the basic design of the varyag probably being followed for the next two, there is no point for china in delaying construction. infact more carriers they have , more people and planes they can put to work in training and reach maturity sooner.

they dont need to crush the khan, only create a untenable situation for khan carriers to enter west of the philipine-japan-indonesian chain using a mix of ships, submarines, ASBMs, PLAAF , PLANAF, cruise missiles and so on.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 09:41 
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The first official video of WZ-10 drill is released at the same day :)


starting from 0:18


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 13:46 
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Singha wrote:
carriers being long lead items and the basic design of the varyag probably being followed for the next two, there is no point for china in delaying construction. infact more carriers they have , more people and planes they can put to work in training and reach maturity sooner.

they dont need to crush the khan, only create a untenable situation for khan carriers to enter west of the philipine-japan-indonesian chain using a mix of ships, submarines, ASBMs, PLAAF , PLANAF, cruise missiles and so on.


Precisely.Khan will rather keep its face.It wont fight them unless china becomes bold enough to threaten their mainland, by the way things are going.They would prefer a stronger neighboring country to start a fight with china.They can sell arms and make money in the bargain.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 15:24 
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Don wrote:
SNaik wrote:

Nothing, really. Just the first bunch of carrier landing pics.
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2012-11/2 ... 998037.htm

Wow those are nice pics. Did not realize they can achieve it so quickly.


Why?

First and foremost every technology is begged, borrowed or stolen. So, there should not be any surprise about the speed at which it is going.

Second, China does have a land based deck where these guys (who landed on this ship) must have practiced like hell.

The only segment will be operations and then live operations (as in real war - under threat). Strangely, that is one part that neither the Russians nor the Ukrainians have too much experience. Or the only nations that have real experience (war time) are opponents of China. (Cannot recall if Brazil has such experience.) France who is willing to sell their mother, for the proper price, may help.

IF China was more transparent such things would have been a lot more predictable.

Worms in a very nice looking apple.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 15:31 
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China lands J-15 jet on Liaoning aircraft carrier

Quote:
'Floating casino'

The Liaoning, formerly known as the Varyag, was constructed in the 1980s for the Soviet navy but was never completed.

When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, the Varyag sat in Ukraine's dockyards.

A Chinese company with links to China's People's Liberation Army (PLA) bought the ship just as Soviet warships were being cut for scrap.

It said it wanted to turn the Varyag into a floating casino in Macau and in 2001 the ship was towed to China.

The Chinese military confirmed in June 2011 that it was being refitted to serve as the nation's first aircraft carrier.


White lie?


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 16:32 
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Beg, borrow or steal... They have done it today!

Today is the day to swallow some pride and applaud.

The INS Vik ain't gonna reach our shores before Jul '13 and our first landing is not expected till Oct '13. Lets twiddle thumbs in the meanwhile :(


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 16:38 
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I can't decide which is more funnier chinese posters having orgasms over their first AC or Indian poster peeing in their pants seeing things chinese do what IN did decades ago. Can anybody help me decide ????


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 16:41 
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in the last decade the only innovation in naval terms I have seen from Cheen has been mounting long wave radars on a few ships.
other than that, just following the herd, multiple evolutionary dead ends, playing catch up etc etc.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 17:09 
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anand_sankar wrote:
Beg, borrow or steal... They have done it today!

Today is the day to swallow some pride and applaud.

The INS Vik ain't gonna reach our shores before Jul '13 and our first landing is not expected till Oct '13. Lets twiddle thumbs in the meanwhile :(

This is the thread for applauding. What India should do about it goes in a different thread. But no one seems to take the China threat seriously on the thread dedicated to taking the threat seriously. And everyone applauds China and worries about India on this thread.


Last edited by shiv on 25 Nov 2012 17:10, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 17:10 
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Sagar G wrote:
I can't decide which is more funnier chinese posters having orgasms over their first AC or Indian poster peeing in their pants seeing things chinese do what IN did decades ago. Can anybody help me decide ????

Supersonic jet arrestor landing and ski-jump take-off decades ago? Are you sure? :wink:


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 17:55 
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SNaik wrote:
Supersonic jet arrestor landing and ski-jump take-off decades ago? Are you sure? :wink:


So because a few things have changed in the game you mean to say that IN has to start from scratch now ???


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 18:20 
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http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2012/11/ ... ite-china/

Quote:
Long March 4C launches Yaogan Weixing-16 spy satellite for China
November 25th, 2012 by Rui C. Barbosa

Following the postponement of the Zhongxing-12 (ChinaSat) communications satellite launch, the Chinese kept up their impressive launch pace with the lofting of the Yaogan Weixing-16 satellite by a Long March (Chang Zheng) 4C rocket on Sunday. The launch took place at 4:06am UTC from the Jiuquan Satellite Launch Center.

Chinese Launch:

Chinese media refer to the new satellite as a new remote sensing bird that will be used for scientific experiments, land survey, crop yield assessment, and disaster monitoring. As was the case with previous launches of the Yaogan Weixing series, western analysts believe this class of satellites is being used for military purposes.

In particular this mission is similar to the Yaogan Weixing-9, with three satellites flying in formation in a type of NOSS system. Being similar to the YG-9 mission, the triplet comprises an electro-optical surveillance satellite, an synthetic aperture radar (SAR) satellite, and possibly a electronic/signal intelligence satellite.

Designed for location and tracking of foreign warships, the satellites will collect optical and radio electronic signatures of the maritime vessels that will be used in conjunction with other information valuable for the Chinese maritime forces.

This was the 172nd successful Chinese orbital launch, the 172nd launch of a Chang Zheng launch vehicle, the 55th successful orbital launch from Jiuquan and the fourth from Taiyuan this year. It was also the 17th successful orbital Chinese launch in 2012.

Looking back to the Yaogan Weixing launch series:

The first Yaogan Weixing satellite (29092 2006-015A) was launched by a Chang Zheng-4C (Y1) from the Taiyuan Satellite Launch Center on April 27, 2006. Developed by Shanghai Academy of Spaceflight Technology (SAST), the details about this satellite were closely guarded, but later it was said that this was the first Jianbing-5 satellite, equipped with the first space-based synthetic aperture radar (SAR).

The second satellite on the series, the Yaogan Weixing-2 (31490 2007-019A), was launched on 25 May, 2007, by a Chang Zheng-2D (Y8) from the Jiuquan Satellite Launch Center. Details were also restricted, though it is claimed that this spacecraft is an electro-optical military observation satellite also known as JB-6 Jianbing-6, complementing the results of the Yaogan Weixing-1.

Another SAR mission similar to Yaogan-1 was launched on November 11, 2007 - with the Yaogan Weixing-3 (32289 2007-055A) satellite orbited by a Chang Zheng-4C (Y3) launch vehicle from Taiyuan.

Yaogan Weixing-4 (33446 2008-061A) was then launched on December 1, 2008. This was the second electro-optical satellite on the series and was launched by a Chang Zheng-2D (Y9) from Jiuquan.

Other satellite in the Jianbing-6 series were Yaogan Wexing-7 (36110 2009-069A), launched on December 9, 2009 from Jiuquan by a Chang Zheng-2D (Y10), and Yaogan Weixing-11 (37165 2010-047A) launched on September 22, 2010, by the Chang Zheng-2D (Y11) launch vehicle from Jiuquan.

The first second-generation electro-optical reconnaissance satellite developed by CAST, Yaogan Weixing-5 (33456 2008-064A), was launched on December 15, 2008. The launch took place from Taiyuan by the Chang Zheng-4B (Y20) rocket.

Yaogan Weixing-12 (37875 2011-066B) was other second-generation electro-optical reconnaissance satellite, launched on November 11, 2011, by the Chang Zheng-4B (Y21) launch vehicle from Taiyuan.

Yaogan Weixing-6 (34839 2009-021A), launched by a Chang Zheng-2C-III (Y19) from Taiyuan on April 22, 2009, was a second-generation SAR satellite developed by SAST

Other second-generation SAR satellites were the Yaogan Weixing-10 (36834 2010-038A) launch on August 9, 2010, by the Chang Zheng-4C (Y6) launch vehicle from Taiyuan; and the Yaogan Weixing-13 (37941 2011-072A) launch on November 29, 2011, by the Chang Zheng-2C (Y20) launch vehicle from Taiyuan.

The Yaogan Weixing-8 (36121 2009-072A), launched on December 15, 2009, by the CZ-4C (Y4) from Taiyuan was a new generation of optical reconnaissance satellite. Similar to the Yaogan-8 was the mission of Yaogan Weixing-14 launched on May 10th, 2012 by the Chang Zheng-4B (Y12) from Taiyuan.

The YaoGan Weixing-9 mission, launched March 5, 2010 from Jiuquan, had an architecture different from the previous missions on the series. Launched by Chang Zheng-4C (Y5) rocket, the mission put not one but a triplet of satellites in Earth orbit. Flying in formation this three satellites form what looks like a type of NOSS system.

The Yaogan Wrinxing-15 was a optical reconnaissance satellite launched on May 29, 2012 by the Chang Zheng-4C (Y10) from Taiyuan. The launch used a Long March 4C (Chang Zheng-4C) launch vehicle, an optimized version of the Long March 4B (Chang Zheng-4B), using an upper stae with restart capability and a new interstage adapter between the first and second stages. This vehicle also used a 3.35m diameter fairing for the Yaogan 15 ride uphill.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 19:18 
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anand_sankar wrote:
Beg, borrow or steal... They have done it today!

Today is the day to swallow some pride and applaud.

The INS Vik ain't gonna reach our shores before Jul '13 and our first landing is not expected till Oct '13. Lets twiddle thumbs in the meanwhile :(



Another genius joins the fray. Cheers to the new wise one. My humble suggestion is that you take this to the "Preparing for Defeat by the Dragon " thread, where we can all bask in the light that is your knowledge.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 19:54 
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shiv wrote:
anand_sankar wrote:
Beg, borrow or steal... They have done it today!

Today is the day to swallow some pride and applaud.

The INS Vik ain't gonna reach our shores before Jul '13 and our first landing is not expected till Oct '13. Lets twiddle thumbs in the meanwhile :(

This is the thread for applauding. What India should do about it goes in a different thread. But no one seems to take the China threat seriously on the thread dedicated to taking the threat seriously. And everyone applauds China and worries about India on this thread.


Is there a "Why are Indians surprised when China does something patently obvious?" thread ???? Can we start one? You've scene the Varyag under refurb for 10 years, you've scene the J-15 for two years, yet somehow when the Chinese put the two together it's still a big surprise.

Okay, here's another one... You've scene the world's largest networking company (Huawei) and you've scene the world's largest computer company (Lenovo), yet in your mind the Chinese aren't capable of network and sensor fusion in their 5th gen fighters even when most military electronics these days is heavily COTS based. Yup, be prepare to be surprised again and again by the patently obvious.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 20:10 
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Wong

Why Do the Chinese need AC?


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:09 
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wong wrote:

Is there a "Why are Indians surprised when China does something patently obvious?" thread ???? Can we start one? You've scene the Varyag under refurb for 10 years, you've scene the J-15 for two years, yet somehow when the Chinese put the two together it's still a big surprise.

Okay, here's another one... You've scene the world's largest networking company (Huawei) and you've scene the world's largest computer company (Lenovo), yet in your mind the Chinese aren't capable of network and sensor fusion in their 5th gen fighters even when most military electronics these days is heavily COTS based. Yup, be prepare to be surprised again and again by the patently obvious.


The only thing that surprises Indians is how well the Chinese steal. The above named companies are going to go a long way in helping with that. Huawei is already banned in any sane country that fears for its secrets, the only question is when Lenovo is gonna follow.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:14 
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wong wrote:

Is there a "Why are Indians surprised when China does something patently obvious?" thread ????
*snip*

Yup, be prepare to be surprised again and again by the patently obvious.

Strange, the words "patent" and "obvious" appearing together in this thread.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:21 
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^^

In war, the equipment that shows up to the battlefield matters about an order of magnitude more than the place of its birth or whether it was fairly or unfairly obtained.

Indian people. Kindly note, and move your rear ends, accordingly.

(and that includes me !)


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:35 
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^^The usual genius joins the fray, HURRAY. Please show the great kindness to share your thoughts in the appropriate thread made specifically for great minds like yours.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:50 
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mahadevbhu wrote:
^^

In war, the equipment that shows up to the battlefield matters about an order of magnitude more than the place of its birth or whether it was fairly or unfairly obtained.

Indian people. Kindly note, and move your rear ends, accordingly.

(and that includes me !)


Don't you think what it 'Shows Up' is also important, na? If all that equipment can only shows its rear end, do you think that will do?


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:54 
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Congratulations China---- great achievement at an incredible pace......

down with skeptics who are spending time in analyzing the angle of shadow and possible photo-shopping...

as someone pointed out from time to time .. we need kick in our butt to move on ... hopefully these kicks are potent enough....


And for people who are crying foul on others praising Chinese effort.... --- Grow up...


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 21:56 
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wong wrote:
Is there a "Why are Indians surprised when China does something patently obvious?" thread ???? Can we start one? You've scene the Varyag under refurb for 10 years, you've scene the J-15 for two years, yet somehow when the Chinese put the two together it's still a big surprise.


Wong, do you think just like Chinese in mainland who are apologists to their CPC masters, all Indians are all that absurd?

wong wrote:
Okay, here's another one... You've scene the world's largest networking company (Huawei) and you've scene the world's largest computer company (Lenovo), yet in your mind the Chinese aren't capable of network and sensor fusion in their 5th gen fighters even when most military electronics these days is heavily COTS based. Yup, be prepare to be surprised again and again by the patently obvious.


Wow, wow! Very impressive logic - Largest network and Later computer company. Ok before all that largest of the largest logic, for Sensor fusion first of all, where is the sensor? Even you taller than tallest, deeper than deepest, closer than closest friend, Pak seems not very convinced about your hardware.


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PostPosted: 25 Nov 2012 22:02 
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Prithwiraj wrote:
down with skeptics who are spending time in analyzing the angle of shadow and possible photo-shopping...


Ok, alright, let leave those skeptics. So what you analyzed to warrant such post ? Chinese military or Indian solitaire?


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