India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 17 Jun 2020 15:51

chola wrote:
We don't even know what his goals are. How do we prevent them?

I don't think most chinis know. He's a goddam dictator and does what he wants without domestic opposition.

The only way to bring him down is to sit 250K jawans on chini claimed territory like Aksai Chin and take it from him. Then he might be pilloried for losing land that Mao conquered.

We now his goal: take Galwan Valley.

Trying to take AC could reunite China. Indian goal should be at least to dethrone Xi. And, IF the ensuing free for all allow, then take AC.

AshishA · Post by **AshishA** » 17 Jun 2020 15:56

chola wrote:
AshishAcharya wrote:Btw the last all party Meet on a border conflict was way back in 1999 before kargil war.
Modi is uniting the clans for war. He doesn't need an all party for negotiation. The other shoe has to drop.

True that. It's a indication of how serious things are. I just hope at the end of all this we come out on top.

shuuro · Post by **shuuro** » 17 Jun 2020 15:56

PM makes a statement on India china clash

https://youtu.be/u2nKo05h-oo

Larry Walker · Post by **Larry Walker** » 17 Jun 2020 15:58

I had some hope and confidence in Modi, but today's statement is condemnable. He said "if provoked" we will respond - but is cold-blooded lynching and killing of our 20 bravehearts is not a provocation ?? What the hell.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 17 Jun 2020 16:00

somdev wrote:I am wondering if PlanetLabs are producing such detailed imagery, what our ISRO military satellites are/were doing? Is there a communication breakdown between ISRO satellite feeds and army MI/satellite imagery experts?

[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EasMoUsXsAk ... =large[img]

why would ISRO/Army MI foolishly put out military grade satellite imagery in the public domain.

AshishA · Post by **AshishA** » 17 Jun 2020 16:02

chola wrote:
AshishAcharya wrote:How about bleed china with a thousand cuts in Tibet?
Like Afghanistan and Vietnam? It'll take years. You also need a native population that'll do the cutting. Judging by how they locked up and basically pacified a far more radical muzzie population through internment in Xinjiang, I don't hold out much hope for Tibetan buddhists.

Not feasible in short term. Long term, Poo Bear might die of old age before the strategy comes to fruition.

NRao wrote:@chola,

Prevent Xi from achieving his goal/s and he is gone. IMHO of course.
We don't even know what his goals are. How do we prevent them?

I don't think most chinis know. He's a goddam dictator and does what he wants without domestic opposition.

The only way to bring him down is to sit 250K jawans on chini claimed territory like Aksai Chin and take it from him. Then he might be pilloried for losing land that Mao conquered.

I know that it will be difficult for India. But the dictators are paranoid people, they can't tolerate a single affront to their power. So even if a small amount of terrorist activities happen in Tibet or even Xinjiang, it will be enough to make the Chinese nervous and cause them to act rashly. Not the usual meticulous planning and ruthless. implementation.

And as for Xinjiang, I don't think it's pacified. The more they try to repress the more problems it will create for them

Larry Walker · Post by **Larry Walker** » 17 Jun 2020 16:03

NRao wrote:
We now his goal: take Galwan Valley.

Trying to take AC could reunite China. Indian goal should be at least to dethrone Xi. And, IF the ensuing free for all allow, then take AC.

Taking AC is the first step to show Chinese that XiPing is no Mao, first nail in his coffin.

nam · Post by **nam** » 17 Jun 2020 16:08

Deans wrote: They did lose an estimated million men in the Korean war, but never published casualty figures. Even the 62 war casualty figures were only released in 1994. I'm baffled as to why our media wait for the Chinese media to validate what they say.

If the balloon goes up, we need to make sure PLA losses are shown publicly so that CCP cannot get away hiding their losses.

The advantage of SM media, is all the details from our side will eventually filter through to atleast overseas Chinis... that will reach home.

Even the GT boy had to accept there were casualities... he knows it is not possible to hide it with such specific details coming from our side.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 17 Jun 2020 16:09

GB has to be taken. That will put paid to a lot of Chinese ambitions.

China's latest moves in Ladakh have to be seen from its necessity to secure GB. It is not merely protecting G219 as it was until some years ago.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 17 Jun 2020 16:10

Larry Walker wrote:I had some hope and confidence in Modi, but today's statement is condemnable. He said "if provoked" we will respond - but is cold-blooded lynching and killing of our 20 bravehearts is not a provocation ?? What the hell.

I think this is a message to not just China, but to all others that Bharat is done with patience.

AshishA · Post by **AshishA** » 17 Jun 2020 16:10

Larry Walker wrote:I had some hope and confidence in Modi, but today's statement is condemnable. He said "if provoked" we will respond - but is cold-blooded lynching and killing of our 20 bravehearts is not a provocation ?? What the hell.

We have already been provoked by this barbaric attack on our soldiers. That's what he meant. Please think a moment before posting.

SidSoma · Post by **SidSoma** » 17 Jun 2020 16:15

shuuro wrote:PM makes a statement on India china clash

https://youtu.be/u2nKo05h-oo

It feels like he has declared war.......Just wow

Mollick.R · Post by **Mollick.R** » 17 Jun 2020 16:15

somdev wrote:I am wondering if PlanetLabs are producing such detailed imagery, what our ISRO military satellites are/were doing? Is there a communication breakdown between ISRO satellite feeds and army MI/satellite imagery experts?.............

ISRO military satellites are/were doing ????

They are doing , what they are supposed to do for the intended/authorized user(s)

Is there a communication breakdown between ISRO satellite feeds and army MI/satellite imagery experts ?

What you expect ? ISRO to tweet or post on Instagram tagging MI/sat image experts and asking them to comment ???

@somdev jee i can understand tensed times it is. Take a break from BRF for few days.

Yesterday from suggesting KungFu squad to the above quoted one. Your posts are now pure trolling from BRF point of view.

Dhyaanabad

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 17 Jun 2020 16:17

somdev wrote:I am wondering if PlanetLabs are producing such detailed imagery, what our ISRO military satellites are/were doing? Is there a communication breakdown between ISRO satellite feeds and army MI/satellite imagery experts?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EasMoUsXsAk ... name=large

Hmmmmm.........

Is this sat pci even near Galwan River? Forget Valley.

For one the Galwan River flows through very deep areas. The shadows in that picture are too shallow, indicating very small risers.

Next, Galwan, this time of the year, has water flowing through it. Granted at some points it may go underground but at this time? I doubt it.

I doubt it is anywhere close to Galwan River, forget Valley.

Shivaji · Post by **Shivaji** » 17 Jun 2020 16:17

Larry Walker wrote:
Taking AC is the first step to show Chinese that XiPing is no Mao, first nail in his coffin.

Sir...and why should it matter to us? What is the guarantee that XiPing's successor would not continue his policies to undermine India.

China started this conflict. China wants to make an example out of India. And this is an opportunity for India to show China that we mean business. Mess at your own peril.

I wish Modiji to be a Shivaji for whom war is the last resort after all the options are exhausted and not some Bonaparte who waged wars for personal glory.

This dastardly act shall not go unpunished. But Aksai Chin is not our immediate priority, managing economy and Wuhan virus is.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 17 Jun 2020 16:18

Guys, somdev has received a warning for that post of his. Please do not discuss that anymore. Thanks

nam · Post by **nam** » 17 Jun 2020 16:21

The difference between PLA's earlier wars and any war with us is that we can throw numbers like they do. No other nation can. Chinis use their numbers to create a qura of fear.. we have the numbers. And west countries would be glad to provide kit to bleed PLA dry..

Something to note, PLA has won only ONE external war. 1962. Even then against a division sized troop number.

If we give all out on LAC, no amount of tech is going to save PLA from loosing in thousands. It is up to the Chinis if they want another Korean war, one which they many not be able to supply.

yensoy · Post by **yensoy** » 17 Jun 2020 16:22

NRao wrote:
somdev wrote:I am wondering if PlanetLabs are producing such detailed imagery, what our ISRO military satellites are/were doing? Is there a communication breakdown between ISRO satellite feeds and army MI/satellite imagery experts?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EasMoUsXsAk ... name=large
Hmmmmm.........
Is this sat pci even near Galwan River? Forget Valley.
For one the Galwan River flows through very deep areas. The shadows in that picture are too shallow, indicating very small risers.
Next, Galwan, this time of the year, has water flowing through it. Granted at some points it may go underground but at this time? I doubt it.
I doubt it is anywhere close to Galwan River, forget Valley.

It is very much Galwan river. Measure 2.4km from the LAC, on their side, as the crow flies and you will find it.

Aarvee · Post by **Aarvee** » 17 Jun 2020 16:28

SidSoma wrote:
shuuro wrote:PM makes a statement on India china clash

https://youtu.be/u2nKo05h-oo
It feels like he has declared war.......Just wow

I agree, It felt like it.

sajo · Post by **sajo** » 17 Jun 2020 16:29

Modiji just said, on live TV, no less , that Our Jawans died while killing the enemy (4.33 mins into the video posted above). I do not need any further proof or evidence than this. We are not Xi or Gafoora to be making up numbers or false bravado.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 17 Jun 2020 16:31

Amit Shah
@AmitShah
·
5m
The pain of losing our brave soldiers while protecting our motherland at Ladakh’s Galwan can not be put in words. Nation salutes our immortal heroes who sacrificed their lives to keep Indian territory safe and secure. Their bravery reflects India’s commitment towards her land.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 17 Jun 2020 16:31

FrontalAssault
@FrontalAssault1
·
13m
Big Breaking: All leaves of Indian Army cancelled.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 17 Jun 2020 16:32

@TIMx77
·
4m
All leaves of Indian Army cancelled and will report on the duty in 72 hours.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 17 Jun 2020 16:38

yensoy wrote:
NRao wrote: Hmmmmm.........
Is this sat pci even near Galwan River? Forget Valley.
For one the Galwan River flows through very deep areas. The shadows in that picture are too shallow, indicating very small risers.
Next, Galwan, this time of the year, has water flowing through it. Granted at some points it may go underground but at this time? I doubt it.
I doubt it is anywhere close to Galwan River, forget Valley.
It is very much Galwan river. Measure 2.4km from the LAC, on their side, as the crow flies and you will find it.

I have. And, given you reasons why I think it is not.

Besides, you really think India would allow that many Chinese vehicles into Bharat's territory? 2.5 Kms into Bharat? In broad daylight?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 17 Jun 2020 16:38

There was a mention yesterday morning that all service personal can use commercial airlines to get back to service and GOI will reimburse.

Pashupatastra · Post by **Pashupatastra** » 17 Jun 2020 16:40

Aarvee wrote:
SidSoma wrote:
It feels like he has declared war.......Just wow
I agree, It felt like it.

The message is most effective when it comes from highest echelon. Time to stand with leadership and our brave forces to give a reply the enemy will remember for long. We may have to make some hard decisions over next few weeks and even endure hardships if it goes all the way but this is the need of the hour.

schinnas · Post by **schinnas** » 17 Jun 2020 16:42

shuuro wrote:PM makes a statement on India china clash

https://youtu.be/u2nKo05h-oo

Is there a site or video with the full English transcript of this?

YashG · Post by **YashG** » 17 Jun 2020 16:47

SidSoma wrote:
shuuro wrote:PM makes a statement on India china clash

https://youtu.be/u2nKo05h-oo
It feels like he has declared war.......Just wow

A very open address. Depending upon your hope and sympathies u can make out anything u wish to from this address.
He may have declared war - if u wish to hear that or vice versa.

Maybe he wants to say nothing unequivocal right now, or maybe he is waiting for right moment or maybe he wont. Not much that you can make out of this.

kit · Post by **kit** » 17 Jun 2020 16:50

Aarvee wrote:
SidSoma wrote:
It feels like he has declared war.......Just wow
I agree It felt like it.

Cool, composed, deliberate in action! Karma Yogi

nam · Post by **nam** » 17 Jun 2020 16:52

We need to clearly define our objectives. in Kargil, rightly or wrongly, we told the world Paks need to back to the LoC. This helped the world be in our favor as the condition was return to status quo. No one supports an open ended war.

The LAC is much more complicated. Hence it is even more important to define what we want.

The effect of the Galwan fight is now on the lake occupation by PLA. In hot spring they are on their side of LAC.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 17 Jun 2020 16:53

Press Trust of India
@PTI_News
·
8m
Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi speaks to External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar over phone: statement

Sonugn · Post by **Sonugn** » 17 Jun 2020 16:55

sooraj wrote:Press Trust of India
@PTI_News
·
8m
Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi speaks to External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar over phone: statement

And he has made an outrageous statement, that India punish its frontline troops for the incident!!

ricky_v · Post by **ricky_v** » 17 Jun 2020 16:57

Lads from here on out, please post with sources and proof, lets keep our calm we have been through this before with balakot

Lohit · Post by **Lohit** » 17 Jun 2020 16:59

If I try and empathize with China, the problem with China is that it is also fairly hemmed in

Oopar Russi and CIS satellites

Small but powerful countries to east like Japan or SoKo

South has US bases in Philippines, Singapore and Oz.

Only to east they have potential for lebensraum and there thorn is Indian civ. If it becomes vassal, they can expand till caspain.

Of course you've got to give it to the yellows for their enterprise and cunning. But I think Xi is confused on timing.

He should've ideally waited for a non-BJP gov that wouldve rolled over and let them have their way with Desh.

Problem is, for people like Modi and Shah, only reality is Bhagwad Geeta and only idol is Rana Pratap. They have zero problems in fighting a war to the last bullet and last man.

I think the speech shows Xi has made a big miscalculation.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 17 Jun 2020 17:00

What I can't make out in the India Today procured satellite image from 14July of Indian presence at the confluence of Shyok River coming from left - Galwan river/nallah joining it from the left, is the DBO road that was said to be under construction. No visible pukka road or black top.

Is the newly being constructed road to DBO supposed to be somewhere else?

chetonzz · Post by **chetonzz** » 17 Jun 2020 17:01

showing aggressive stance towards china- catch porkistan in surprise with full on blitzkrieg inside POK...once POK is ours, CPEC is history!

then for china- na rahega baans-na bajegi baansuri (since baans will be inside porkistani @**)

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 17 Jun 2020 17:09

The PRC FM call is about de-escalation. He asked for mil to mil and Special Rep conversations to resolve the matter paving the way for some de-escalation. GOI is still on guard and the mobilisation is about making sure PRC withdraw to positions pre-incident and showing readiness for a long fihgt.

I think this is the beginning of the end of this chapter.

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 17 Jun 2020 17:10

Asutos has posted a puke-worthy article on NDTV website blaming India for provoking China and asking India not to react. This makes Global Times look like Swarajya and Shoo Claw the biggest patriot we have had since Sardar Patel.

*Warning* not to be read if you have high BP! I'm putting this here as an example of the defeatist and downright traitorous mindset that some people have.

https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/for-modi-c ... topstories

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 17 Jun 2020 17:18

ANI
@ANI
· 27m
Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi says urges India to severely punish those responsible for conflict, control its frontline troops: Reuters

Larry Walker · Post by **Larry Walker** » 17 Jun 2020 17:19

After some cooling down, I think all this is happening because PRC is paranoid about future of CPEC. Ladakh and Galwan etc are just incidental names of places. I am of the opinion now that China has done hara-kiri. For Modi to extract nations revenge and honor, fighting PRC full-on is not a wise choice - but taking GB kills 2 birds in 1 stone - we retake what is our from Pakis and we destroy CPEC dream of PRC. I think XiPing has just accelerated the timetable to retake GB. As the saying goes - more you try to change the future, the more you help it happen. Om Shanti.