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PostPosted: 06 Jul 2007 18:25 
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BRFite

Joined: 16 Apr 2007 23:58
Posts: 198
Location: Sayonara; Hanging Boots Camp
Quote:
For Users
*Attachments
*Ignore your "Foes"



What exactly does that imply for a newbie like me?
That I can attach videos and images to my posts and read only the posts of people that I like?

Small Bug in Gen JJ's Bio:
Quote:
During his tenure with the 7th and 9th Maratha LI and also while on higher command & staff appointments, General Singh has served in Jammu & Kashmir, Nagaland, Arunachal Pradesh, Sikkim and Joshimath in Uttranchal Pradesh.


Please change Uttaranchal Pradesh to Uttarakhand.

More hyperlinks in the article would help too.Terms like NDA,Maratha Light,PVSM,chief Of Army Staff,First World War,ARTRAC etc. appearing on the page cld lead to corresponding articles on BR.

I think there is a software which makes internal hyper-linking as easy as on wikipedia..[[--link--]].


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2007 19:17 
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 23:58
Posts: 198
Location: Sayonara; Hanging Boots Camp
Jagan wrote:
I can give one advantage (in terms of user friendliness) for limiting threads to 9 (or 10) pages.

When a thread is in 10 pages - you can access all the pages from the links generated at the top of the page - 1 to 10. The links will appear as

Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 Next

So going from one page to any page is merely a single click operation.

But when a thread goes into say eighteen pages, the software truncates the page links - to

Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 16, 17, 18 Next

So going from 18 to page 10 will involve ..... SIX clicks - which is maha-annoying.

its easier to navigate the page by manipulating the URL address. but who wants to do that anyway

Check some forums out there that allows page generation .. say

http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/v ... &start=255 and http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/v ... .php?t=587 (you will need an ACIG account to test drive them)



Sirs,

May I suggest adding a locked page 0.

This page must be "locked" in the sense that it will stay put while the discussion pages carry on.Something like a "sticky" for an individual thread.

On page 0,the person starting the starting the new thread must elaborate the scope of discussion that is unique to it and no other existing thread.

The thread admin/mod could list the best written posts that are most consistent with discussion or the posts that brought light to different aspects of the discussion.Such posts should marked/flagged by the admin/mod asap, so that when thread reaches page 9,the listing is done automatically.


For example's sake,suppose the very first page of the very first thread on the LCA should be made as page 0 for all future discussions.Then, moderator/admin would first outline the scope of LCA thread [what all is allowed to be discussed],and would fill the rest of the page with the posts/newlinks etc he/she considers the most relevant to the current re-booted discussion thread.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 07 Jul 2007 06:14 
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BRFite -Trainee

Joined: 10 Mar 2007 06:11
Posts: 76
Location: Milkyway
Jagan wrote:
Just test drove the PhpBB3.0 RC2 version. just one word - awweesommme!!!!

Significant Features

For Users
*Attachments
*Ignore your "Foes"

For Moderators
*Spambots bye bye - thanks to a better Captcha system
*Easy pruning of users - and deletions
*Warnings and Automatic Banning features.
*Merging topics
*Global Announcements and Stickys


Jagan/Shiv,

This (PhpBB3.0) is a good news.

I want to know in what ways can one help BR? Should there not be a thread, discussion with suggestions on how one can help make BR even better? I was thinking about writing emails to ISA (Indian students association) heads of all the major universities in the US and ask them to pass on a brief description of this website to all the Indian students. Some universities have as many as 5000 Indian students. Then, there can be postings on the internet forums of some of the big Indian colleges. I see that there is already one BR community on Orkut (with not too many members).

How can the discussion in the porkie thread be made more focussed? Sometimes there are multiple posts telling the same stuff. Should there be teams of people digging-in information at particular places and then presenting their analysis? Another point is that porkie thread gets way too much attention than all others. What can we do to make other parts of website more attractive?

How about running some ads in newspapers in India? I see that the top stories on TOI front page sometimes attract a million views.

Are monetary donations welcome? If yes, how can one do that? Assuming that the answer is yes, how much of donations are needed?

Any other ways in which one can help?

I am sure these topics must have been discussed in the past. Please be gentle :) . If there is a previous discussion, please point me to it, else, I will appreciate if a senior member can answer my questions.

-mayo :evil:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 07 Jul 2007 15:34 
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BRFite

Joined: 07 Feb 2007 16:58
Posts: 1987
Quote:
Database Error
An error has occurred while interacting with the database.

Back to the Gallery


Jagan,

the IAF site link for Philately does not open. It gives the above message when clicked in the home page. Please fix it.

Thanks

Vivek Ahuja


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 08 Jul 2007 13:27 
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BRFite -Trainee

Joined: 10 Sep 2006 10:25
Posts: 8
Location: Thane
Quote:
Database Error
An error has occurred while interacting with the database.

Back to the Gallery


The above error occurs when clicked on the 'Indian Army Gallery' link. Please have it corrected.

Thanks,
-Amit


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2007 11:16 
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BRFite

Joined: 06 Jul 2007 02:14
Posts: 233
I do not know if I this has already been discussed or not. If it has been, mod can delete it.

I am new to this site and I am pleasantly surprised to find a lot of information which I hitherto could not find. This site has a lot of Indian armed forrces related info but if someone is interested in a specific topic then it is a daunting task get dig up the relevant info. This is a common problem for many other sites which have forum for its members to discuss the topics. A 'ready-to-find' repository can help. For instance, if someone wants to get a clear picture of how British exploited India, then one should be able to easily get the related articles. This can be done in the same way as Muslim apostates in west are exposing radical and political Islam. They run forums like these but 'critical and well written articles' are lost in old threads. So they created www.wikiislam.com on the model of wikipedia, which is a 'one-click' kind of source. This avoids double search - (1) finding the appropriate thread and (2) finding the relevant article within the appropriate thread.

There can be many sections in the repository [if seniors think, it is worthwhile having it] like Role of Muslim League in Freedom Struggle, Unbiased articles by Pakistanis, DDM's Ignorance etc.

This will create awareness. People will then know what they should know and not what has been fed to them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2007 15:32 
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BRFite -Trainee

Joined: 29 May 2007 15:32
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Location: Mumbai
A page about What bharat - rakshak is all about would be of great help.
When was it started and by whom? its history and other stuff....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2007 18:49 
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Webmaster BR

Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Posts: 1246
Location: Planet Earth
Gaurav: There is an Origins page, but it appears the main BR site is down again. When it comes up, please click on this link;

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/main/Origins.php


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2007 06:05 
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Webmaster BR

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Posts: 1246
Location: Planet Earth
Amitabh wrote:
INS Jalashwa is L41, not LPD-41 as written on the ship's page.


Thanks for pointing out that error Amitabh. It has been fixed.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2007 06:14 
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Webmaster BR

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Location: Planet Earth
SonarDeshi wrote:
Small Bug in Gen JJ's Bio

Please change Uttaranchal Pradesh to Uttarakhand.


Thanks for the update. I have made the change.

SonarDeshi wrote:
More hyperlinks in the article would help too.Terms like NDA,Maratha Light,PVSM,chief Of Army Staff,First World War,ARTRAC etc. appearing on the page cld lead to corresponding articles on BR.

I think there is a software which makes internal hyper-linking as easy as on wikipedia..[[--link--]].


Good idea. I will look into that.

Please email me at koshyr AT hotmail DOT com


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2007 08:38 
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Webmaster BR

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Location: Planet Earth
SonarDeshi wrote:
More hyperlinks in the article would help too.Terms like NDA,Maratha Light,PVSM,chief Of Army Staff,First World War,ARTRAC etc. appearing on the page cld lead to corresponding articles on BR.

I think there is a software which makes internal hyper-linking as easy as on wikipedia..[[--link--]].


Your suggestion has been incorporated, starting with the landing page on the Indian Coast Guard. Please refer to the 'Operational Commands' sub-section;

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Link1.html

Other pages will be hyper linked in a similar manner, as & when those pages are updated. Thanks.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2007 10:10 
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Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Posts: 38424
Jagan, Is it possible to enable post number in the thread? This way dont have to use the quote feature. Post numbers are visible when I get the thread into a single page format.

joey, I am an admin only on BRF.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 25 Jul 2007 02:46 
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I was told that one has to look at the Lord Curzon-Lord Kitchner tiff and the result as a way to understand the JL Nehru and his apathy for the IA officers. Dont know what is the meaning of all that.

The gist of it is that Lord Curzon had a tiff with Kitchner the C-i-C of British Indian army and matter was discussed in British Parliment the net result was that he was recalled. This left a bad taste among the civilians.
Another insight is that JLN was the occupant of the C-i-C 's house aka Teen Murti House after Independence.

Dont know what to make of all this. Why would JLN have panga with IA due to above reason?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 25 Jul 2007 16:48 
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Joined: 30 Dec 2005 18:28
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Location: In between wars in our time
was kitchener developing delusions of grandeur based on his command of the sword arm of the raj? the british hierarchy would have been acutely aware that the excesses of the east india company's army a few decades earlier had almost cost them the entire colony - therefore would have been keen to ensure that it was not repeated

ultimately british power rested on control of the british indian army


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PostPosted: 25 Jul 2007 20:27 
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Lalmohan wrote:
was kitchener developing delusions of grandeur based on his command of the sword arm of the raj? the british hierarchy would have been acutely aware that the excesses of the east india company's army a few decades earlier had almost cost them the entire colony - therefore would have been keen to ensure that it was not repeated

ultimately british power rested on control of the british indian army


I have looked up various sources on this Lord C-Lord K tussle and found that Curzon was mirroring/projecting his ideas on Kitchner. He was the one who wanted total control but couldnt. Also the year 1905 was significant for the partition of Bengal happened and most likely the British didnt want to send wrong signal to the locals by censuring the Army chief no matter how high the civil authority was. But these unstated reasons are in background and the lore is that the BIA got Westminister backing and maybe there was a fear in the Indian politicans that IA might get some heldover ideas.

Still we need to understand what was going on both stated and unstated reasons for the downgrading the IA officer cadre for it did have detrimental effects much later.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 25 Jul 2007 20:32 
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It also needs to be noted that even IG, who was far more cognizant of national interests than JLN subscribed to this view as well.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2007 16:08 
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Battle of Saragarhi: 21 Sikhs against and 10,000 Afridi Tribals - 1897.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Saragarhi


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2007 20:04 
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Manu wrote:
Battle of Saragarhi: 21 Sikhs against and 10,000 Afridi Tribals - 1897.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Saragarhi


Battle of Saragarhi :)
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORC ... garhi.html


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 Sep 2007 07:49 
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Rakesh,

This came up in a conversation with some friends the other day (we were discussing the movie "300"), so I just had to post it :-? . Did not check the BR archives, sorry.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2007 00:17 
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Joined: 10 Jan 2006 21:35
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Location: PA, USA
Well talking about Saragarhi!! this battle was documented by British and thus readily available. There are countless older battles fought with afridis, yusifzai, zaddozai, etc tribals under Hari Singh Nalwa, Akali Phula Singh, Ranjit singh, Sher Singh ,etc

Earlier afghanis use to simply pay tribute to Maharaja Ranjit singh but after 2-3 years of default., Hari Singh Nalwa was made Governor of Peshawar by the Maharaja.

Hari Singh Nalwa created many small forts all the way from the fort of Rohtas on the banks of Indus to the Khyber Darra or "Khyber Pass" just across the current Durand line (I think over 25 such small forts were constructed). The garrison forces of these forts ranges from 50 soldiers to 500 soldiers(that is a small fort). And a dash by a single cavalry man from khyber's Jamrud fort to Peshawar (or to next fort) to pool up against a tribal attack. Even when Hari Singh nalwa was shot outside the fort of Jamrud he told his people to leave his body in the middle of the fort so that Tribals could see him!! as then they would not dare to attack the fort.

These forts were very effectively used by Ranjit Singh after Hari Singh Nalwa through his Son Prince Sher Singh (who became overall in charge of Khalsa army) and Diwan Mokham Chand, the general.

So! Sikhs have history of facing thousands of tribals in the defending forts in this area, even before Saragarhi.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2007 06:08 
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SBajwa wrote:
So! Sikhs have history of facing thousands of tribals in the defending forts in this area, even before Saragarhi.


Sandeep:

Why don't you write about the military aspects of some battles fought by the Sikh armies from the time of Guru Gobind Singhji through Maharaja Ranjit Singh's time, in the 'Battles in Ancient and medieval India Thread'?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 15 Oct 2007 05:56 
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Her Majesty's Guinea Pigs - The Indian Army


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 15 Oct 2007 07:59 
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Gen J.J. Singh (Retd), Ex-Chief of Army Staff


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 06 Nov 2007 15:09 
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https://www.ideals.uiuc.edu/bitstream/2 ... i_IPKF.pdf

Quote:
The IPKF Experience in Sri Lanka
P. R. Chari
Centre for Policy Research
New Delhi, India


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 27 Nov 2007 21:48 
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http://www.indianexpress.com/story/240755._.html

[quote]Truth of ’62 is locked away

Shishir Gupta

Posted online: Monday, November 19, 2007 at 0000 hrs

To set both history and policy straight, it’s crucial to make public the Brookes-Bhagat Report on that war.

Forty five years ago to the day, the Zhou Enlai government offered the Indian charge d’ affairs in Beijing, P.K. Bannerjee, a humiliating ceasefire to end the month-long 1962 conflict across the 4,000 kilometre-long, mountainous border. Although the war officially ended two days later, the psychological scars it caused still remain rooted in the Indian mindset. Symbolic of this manifestation is the Henderson Brookes-P.S. Bhagat Report on the operational aspects of the 1962 conflagration, which lies buried in the vaults of South Block since it was submitted to the Nehru government in May 1963.

Prepared between December 1962 and May 1963, only one copy of this three-volume report exists today and the authors, as well as all the major players except the then director, Military Operations, D.K. Palit, have passed away. Yet successive governments at the Centre have adopted a “let the past bury its deadâ€


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2007 19:50 
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- Hail to the Chiefs! The biographies of all the previous Army Chiefs have been updated, with the help of the Indian Army. Some very rare images have also been added. A must see for Indian Army history buffs!

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2007 21:19 
the unthinkable has happened !

Ajai Shukla ji has just mentioned Bharat-Raksak as an official source of history on 62 and 71 wars on NDTV X-factor.

The discussion on X-Factor was about Govt curtailing official version of 62 on pretext that China would get offended.

Aired on 10 p.m. Tuesday, Dec 04, 2007.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2007 01:46 
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Just saw the report on NDTV. Contrary to what i thought (maybe BR was mentioned in passing), this was a report exclusively devoted to how the official histories can be accessed on the 'popular defence website bharat-rakshak.com'

the title on the report was sensationalist "ARMY HISTORIES LEAKED" or something similar. :D :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2007 03:49 
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here are the links on the NDTV website - both reports by Ajai Shukla

http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/vi ... x?id=20338
Report - History or Mystery

http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/vi ... x?id=20343
Discussion - Can India's people not be trusted with the story of India's wars?

Will Rakesh Koshy be sent to jail next time he visits india :D?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2007 03:53 
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Raju wrote:
the unthinkable has happened !

Ajai Shukla ji has just mentioned Bharat-Raksak as an official source of history on 62 and 71 wars on NDTV X-factor.

The discussion on X-Factor was about Govt curtailing official version of 62 on


Yes.. I saw it too last night. I was in bed, nodding off to see that and Shuklaji wrapped up the program saying "Well we will tell you where to find them.. go to bharat-rakshak.com and you will see the official histories".

Gosh..! I literally fell off the bed on hearing that! ..

Actually, I am turning into a fan of the reformed and "cured from hard knocks on T-72 sides" Shuklaji . His writing has actually started making sense and a welcome break away from the Harrumphing and being a drummer boy of "Arjun Dabba onlee.. T-72/90 ..world best " into something a lot more objective and reasonable.

Maybe he needed that time to break away from that regimented army thinking (well. no one ever accused the army of being intelligent and independent thinkers) and start looking at the wider world with open eyes and that the spanking he got at BRF actually did him a world of good.

Time to get him in back from the purgatory /dog house and "rehabilitate" him. After all Allah is most forgiving and merciful onlee.

Welcome back Shuklaji..(come on , everyone knows that you read BRF, though you will be loath to admit it)..


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2007 15:45 
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More power to all demanding release of Henderson report! We should highlight this time and again till the govt does the needful. :x

Jagan wrote:
here are the links on the NDTV website - both reports by Ajai Shukla

http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/vi ... x?id=20338
Report - History or Mystery

http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/vi ... x?id=20343
Discussion - Can India's people not be trusted with the story of India's wars?

Will Rakesh Koshy be sent to jail next time he visits india :D?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2007 06:18 
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Webmaster BR

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Jagan wrote:
Will Rakesh Koshy be sent to jail next time he visits india :D?


It certainly appears so! :lol:

It seems that they just recently (post Dec) took footage of the BR Army's History Page, as I updated the history section (with the Army Chiefs) on 01 Dec 2007. But overall, very happy to see the BR main site on Indian TV. Right on!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2007 18:11 
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http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/1503/naval.html

Quote:
The last Portuguese naval action in Goa (1961)


For those who do not have easy access to what is being published in Portuguese and in Portugal, here is a reference that could fill in more details about the 1961 military action that led to the end of the Portuguese rule in India. The Vol. VIII (1808-1975) of "Batalhas e Combates da Marinha Portuguesa" by Saturnino Monteiro (Lisboa, Liv. Sá da Costa Editora, 1997). The author is a retired Naval Officer (Capitão-de-mar-e-guerra) and former professor of Naval Academy.

Pages 149-182 cover the Goa event (including the naval encounter at Diu). The author presents a very objective picture of the Portuguese political and strategic weaknesses at the time. Refers to the Portuguese complacent attitude vis-a-vis the post-World War II hegemonic tendencies and decolonization process. Quotes on p. 150: "This has nothing to do with us. There is no racism in our colonies. Our blacks (pretos) are happy with us and the idea of becoming independent is nowhere in their heads".

The book describes in quite some detail the military (particularly naval) strength and weaknesses of India at the time. Describes how Salazar relied in vain upon the diplomatic support of USA and UK, and had requested Pakistan and China to create border pressures. The author praises the last Governor General of Goa for ignoring the instructions of Salazar to resist till the last man. According to this account, two batches of artillery men were sent at the very end disguised as football teams. They were to handle the two obsolete anti-air guns the Portuguese had in Goa.

A request from Goa military asking for sausages (meaning ammunition for these artillery pieces) was responded literally by Lisbon authorities with various brands of Portuguese sausages! It became a joke among the Portuguese during a long time to come. Not many in Goa are aware of it as yet.

The book provides a very detailed description of the strategy and action (with maps indicating the battle positions) that ended the last Portuguese naval battles at Mormugão and off Diu. The names of the Portuguese officials who participated in these actions and lost their lives get a due mention.

There is reference to Indian navy having sensed the presence of a submarine. This was later confirmed to have been a British submarine on its way to Far East. The Indian navy was prepared for such an eventuality and several anti-submarine frigates, such as "Trishul", "Kuthar", "Kirpan" and "Khukri" were inducted in the operation. This book should be read alongside the "Operation Vijay" published by the government of India (ed. S.N. Prasad, National Archives of India) with details of Indian military documentation.



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PostPosted: 06 Dec 2007 18:41 
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Aditya G wrote:
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/1503/naval.html

Quote:
The last Portuguese naval action in Goa (1961)


For those who do not have easy access to what is being published in Portuguese and in Portugal, here is a reference that could fill in more details about the 1961 military action that led to the end of the Portuguese rule in India. The Vol. VIII (1808-1975) of "Batalhas e Combates da Marinha Portuguesa" by Saturnino Monteiro (Lisboa, Liv. Sá da Costa



Great find - Hope someone does an english translation of it.


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PostPosted: 06 Dec 2007 20:28 
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I found one entire website dedicated to this operation .... plenty of stuff for history and trivia junkies:

http://www.supergoa.com/pt/40anos/entrada.asp

Image

Quote:
Chief of Army Staff, General P.N. Thapar (to the right) with the Vassal Portuguese Governor and Hisses (to the center).


One more surrender photo for the archives :twisted:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2007 17:25 
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Aditya G wrote:
One more surrender photo for the archives :twisted:


You mean this image? :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2007 19:56 
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Show off! :D

Rakesh wrote:
Aditya G wrote:
One more surrender photo for the archives :twisted:


You mean this image? :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 08 Dec 2007 03:18 
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Rakesh wrote:
Aditya G wrote:
One more surrender photo for the archives :twisted:


You mean this image? :)


but mine is bigger than yours :D

actually most of the Goa Ops Pictures on the Internet are from the Official War History - Op Vijay published by the MoD. Nice book, Nice photos. The list of captured equipment at the end of the book even more interesting for chaps like us.

Tried to get the AF officer in the pic identified - but no luck...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: 08 Dec 2007 19:41 
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http://www.mailtoday.in/epapermain.aspx ... =12/7/2007

Image
Friday, December 07, 2007 Mail Today Main Issue Page 2

I refused to shoot him in the back & paid a price for it
Harkirat Singh was soon shunted out and never promoted
By Rajesh Ramachandran in New Delhi


Rajiv Gandhi, the then Prime Minister of India, ordered the cold blooded murder of V. Pirabhakaran, the Tamil Tiger chief in September 1987. An order was given to this effect to the Indian Army on peace-keeping duty in Sri Lanka at that time.

Pirabhakaran was invited by the chief of the Indian Peace Keeping Force (IPKF) Major General (retd.) Harkirat Singh, for a meeting on September 16, 1987 to find ways to implement an accord signed between Rajiv Gandhi and Sri Lankan President J.R. Jayawardene to bring peace to Sri Lanka.

At midnight on September 14, Maj. Gen. Singh received a call on the special army communication network. The call was from Colombo — J.N. (‘Mani’) Dixit, then Indian high commissioner to Sri Lanka, wanted to speak to the general officer commanding, IPKF.

The general was ordered to kill Pirabhakaran, when he would come over for a meeting on September 16, under the white flag, to discuss the formation of an interim administrative council. This despite the fact that no professional Army would kill an adversary called for a meeting under the white flag.

But Harkirat Singh refused to execute the order, because he says, “Good soldiers do not shoot an adversary in the back.â€


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PostPosted: 13 Dec 2007 20:32 
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One interesting detail from Zaloga’s narrative is Pakistan’s use of the Cobra anti-tank missile. Even though the notorious 9M14 was in the spotlight by 1973, anti tank missiles were apparently used in both the 65 and 71 conflicts. I was interested about the Cobra so I read into it and found out that India also procured the missile at one time. The cobra was designed by Oerlikon in the early 1950s and was gradually improved. I was wondering if anyone knew when it entered service in the IA and when/if it was phased out.


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