J & K news and discussion

Ananth · Post by **Ananth** » 01 Jan 2009 20:24

I am not sure if the thought of separatism is as deep and alive as it used to be. Surely, the Hurriyat represents a certain thought. I think that is dwindling. The more they keep themselves isolated, the more it will dwindle. It's time for them to come into the mainstream. In 2002 some separatist leaders were regretting that they didn't participate directly. This time their regret will be much greater. Sajjad Lone would be regretting because his party would have impacted more than 5-6 seats in Kupwara, North Kashmir. Now, they will have to wait for six years more and by then, they will be six years older. The Mirwaiz is a religious leader so he will have his standing otherwise also, but the Lone brothers could be forgotten. How long can you sustain yourself on artificial gas?

joshvajohn · Post by **joshvajohn** » 01 Jan 2009 22:28

comments - this is the right sentiment of the Kashmir youth and right way for Omar to go.

Gen-X pins hopes on CM-designate Omar

'Omar should focus on channelising youths towards jobs by focusing on building information parks, industries, bio-tech etc'

Jammu: With Omar Abdullah set to take over as the new chief minister, youths of Jammu and Kashmir are pinning their hopes on the young leader to address issues like under-development and unemployment, which they feel are the "root causes of militancy".

Noting that unemployed youths were being misused by militant outfits in the state, Choudary said, "Omar should focus on channelising youths towards jobs by focusing on building information parks, industries, bio-tech and pharma units and bring investments to J-K."

Echoing similar sentiments, a few other students said they expect Omar to develop the state's twin capitals – Jammu and Srinagar - on the lines of Bangalore, Hyderabad and Pune.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/genx- ... ar/405434/

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 01 Jan 2009 22:34

Echoing similar sentiments, a few other students said they expect Omar to develop the state's twin capitals – Jammu and Srinagar - on the lines of Bangalore, Hyderabad and Pune.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/genx- ... ar/405434/

My foot. I can bet that JK can never become like Bangalore, Hyderabad and Pune. JK will always live on the bakshish given by the central government. No company can come there because one cannot own the property or there is no gaurantee of security with mullas wielding AK-47s.

JK needs to reform a lot and it should allow anyone from other parts of India to buy and sell land.

lakshmikanth · Post by **lakshmikanth** » 02 Jan 2009 01:58

al-BBC dhimmi report from dhimmi reporter of the week: Andrew Whitehead (I Guess his mom wanted to name $hithead but dad had some problems with it coz he knew there was nothing in his sons head... clever man he was

):

Kashmir crisis comes full circle

Here are some of the dhimmi wet dreams mr $hit head has been salivating on:

Andrew's $hithead wrote:As the Kashmir valley prepares for a new state government and a new year, it must seem to some as if the Kashmir crisis has come full circle over the past 20 years.

Indian-administered Kashmir enters 2009 with a member of the Abdullah family poised to be the state chief minister - at the head of a coalition that brings together the Abdullahs' regional party, the National Conference, with India's governing Congress party.

That's just as it was when the bitter separatist insurgency erupted in Kashmir in 1989. {Saliva over flow... can't hold back... can't hold back}

Some commentators, particularly in India, have been encouraged by recent events to suggest that a corner has been turned in the long-running Kashmir crisis.

They point to the good turnout in the recent state elections and the success of parties regarded as "pro-India" - along with a decline in the level of armed militancy. {ooooh aaaaahhhhhhhh i... i.. came.... i had to put the quotes on top.... }

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 02 Jan 2009 02:38

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/armyterroris ... 764-3.html

Army-terrorists gunbattle on in Poonch, 1 jawan killed

Press Trust Of India

Time Published on Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 00:50, Updated on Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 01:07 in Nation section

Poonch: One jawan was killed and a Junior Commissioned Officer (JCO) reported missing during an encounter between Army personnel and six suspected Jaish-e-Mohammed(JeM) terrorists which continued for the second day on Thursday in the Poonch sector close to the Line of Control with Pakistan.

The six terrorists including JeM local commander Abu Dawood have been encircled by the security forces amidst intermittent gunfire that went on in Bhatidar late on Thursday night.

The encounter began Wednesday evening, Army sources said.

The sources said a clear picture was yet to emerge about any casualties suffered by the security forces amid unconfirmed reports that two jawans may have been killed in the encounter.
....

and from http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/st ... 0090078478

Harkatul terrorist killed in J&K encounter
Press Trust of India
Friday, January 02, 2009, (Poonch)

Harkatul Mujahideen district Commander Bilal Ahmad has been killed in an encounter with the Army at Sopore in Baramulla district of J&K.

One more terrorist is still holed up and the encounter is on.

PTI adds: Two army personnel were killed in an encounter with six suspected Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM) terrorists which continued for the second day on Thursday in the Poonch sector close to the Line of Control.

The deceased have been identified as Subedar Rakesh Kumar and Nayak A P Singh of Rashtriya Rifles, Army sources said.

The six terrorists that included JeM local commander Abu Dawood have been encircled by the security forces amidst intermittent gunfire.

The gunbattle was on till the last reports came in.

The encounter took place in the backdrop of Indo-Pak tensions following evidence that the November 26 Mumbai terror attacks originated from Pakistan.

Meanwhile, two pistols with its three magazines and 50 rounds of ammunition of pika guns were recovered in Nangali forest area in the same border district, the sources said.

Rishi · Post by **Rishi** » 02 Jan 2009 10:57

http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/web1/09jan02/news1.htm#2

JAMMU, Jan 1: Two Army jawans and a Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM) area commander were reported to have been killed in a fierce gun-battle at Bhati Dhar forests in Chatral area of Mendhar tehsil in Poonch district late this evening while a group of five ultras was still trapped in the area.

Official sources said troops of 39 Rashtriya Rifles joined by Special Operations Group (SOG) had cordoned off Bhati Dhar forests in Chatral area of Mendhar two days back after developing a specific information that a big group of six Jaish militants had taken shelter there.

Troops continued searches in the forests for two days. Late this evening, the militants, hiding in the forests, opened firing on Army personnel, who retaliated. Exchange of firing between the two sides continued for more than two hours in which a Naib Subedar and an Army jawan were killed.

A JeM area commander Abdul Gul was also reported to have been killed in the exchange of firing.

Sources said body of Army’s Naib Subedar, killed in the operation, was untraced while the body of Army jawan has been recovered.

Enforcement of Army and police have been rushed to Bhati Dhar forests to eliminate or apprehend five remaining militants as, according to preliminary reports, a group of six militants was hiding in the area. It was yet to be ascertained as to whether the militant group had recently infiltrated to this side or was exfiltrating t

o PoK.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 02 Jan 2009 18:29

Anti-Israel protests break out in Kashmir

tripathi · Post by **tripathi** » 03 Jan 2009 00:40

Two Army personnel, six ultras killed in two encounters in J&K

Two Army personnel, including a Junior Commissioned Officer (JCO), and six militants of whom two were of Jaish-e-Mohammad, were killed in two separate gunbattles in Poonch and Baramulla districts of Jammu and Kashmir, a police spokesman said on Friday.

JCO Rakesh Kumar and Naik PK Singh besides four militants were killed in a fierce gunbattle between security forces and militants in the forest area of Bhatidhar in Mendhar sector of Poonch, the spokesman said.

The encounter started last evening after Army troops and a special operation group of the state police jointly launched a search operation in the forest area following inputs of militants presence in a hideout there, the spokesman said.

The spokesman said reinforcements have been rushed to the area and the operation against holed up militants, believed to be about six in number, continues.

In another encounter, he said two JEM militants including a Pakistani national were killed in a three-hour long gunbattle at Bontingoo village of Sopore in North Kashmir's Baramulla district.

The gunfight took place around 6 pm when militants, hiding in a house of Rouf Ahmad Lone, opened fire on a joint search party of police and Army, the spokesman said, adding during the gunfight the house was completely razed.

Bodies of two hiding militants, identified as Bilal Ahmad Malla, a local militant, and his Pakistani associate Abu Bakhti, were recovered from the debris of the house today morning. Two ak assault rifles, six magazines and 105 rounds of ammunition were recovered from them, the spokesman said.

He said security forces also recovered two pistols, three magazines and 30 rounds during search operations at Nigil sahib forest in Poonch district on Thursday.

http://publication.samachar.com/pub_art ... extIndex=1

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 03 Jan 2009 00:48

God knows how many such sleeper modules are there in the dense forests of J & K , unfortunately launching an all out clearing ops would lead to a massive hue and cry in Kashmir by Extremists and activists leading to even more disruption of peace which temporarily at least , exists !!

sum · Post by **sum** » 03 Jan 2009 12:12

I would think that such all out attacks by the army and targeted assassination of Pig-e-leaders will be back now that the PDP is out of power...

RayC · Post by **RayC** » 03 Jan 2009 12:47

One should not forget that there is big money involved for all, the leaders and the footmen.

That fuels the embers of terrorism.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 03 Jan 2009 21:42

Porki editorial
A begrudging acceptance of on-ground reality?

A fractured mandate in Kashmir

Saturday, January 03, 2009
Rahimullah Yusufzai

Voters in Jammu & Kashmir have given a fractured mandate in the recent elections for the state assembly and once again forced the major political parties to form a coalition government. In the 2002 polls Mufti Mohammad Sayeed's People's Democratic Party (PDP) and the Congress made an alliance to rule the Indian-administered state and six years later the Omar Abdullah-led National Conference and the Congress would be forming the ruling coalition.

The mandate was certainly a split one but the turnout of 60 percent-plus was quite impressive. People voted in large numbers and many voters interviewed at polling stations said they haven't given up on the idea of "azadi" or independence but had opted to vote to elect assembly members to take care of their development needs and help resolve their problems. It would be wrong to dismiss the polls as "so-called" or "unrepresentative" in view of the enthusiastic participation of the electorate in the election process not only in the Hindu-majority Jammu and Buddhist-dominated Ladakh but also the Muslim-majority Kashmir valley.

In fact, a leader of the separatist Hurriyat Conference Sajjad Lone admitted that the high turnout was a setback for him and his allies and that there was a need to rethink the strategies of their pro-azadi alliance. Pointing out that they had been pursuing the same tactics and slogans since 1989 when the Kashmiris rose in protest against Indian rule, he felt it was a mistake not to delink the demand for "azadi" from the day-to-day issues of the people.

Unlike the moderate Sajjad Lone, the hardliner and most pro-Pakistan politician in Indian Kashmir, Syed Ali Shah Geelani, was still unwilling to accept the figures of the unusually high voters' turnout only some weeks after the massive protests in the Kashmir valley against the government's aborted decision to grant land-use rights to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board. He alleged that bogus voting and the invisible power of the Indian security forces had inflated the turnout figures. Also in denial was Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, the young head of the Hurriyat Conference, who had asked the voters to stay away from the polls or face social boycott. He too would be disappointed that the electorate didn't heed the call for boycott.

The turnout figures provided by the Election Commission of India, which has consistently proved to be an authoritative body capable of holding free and fair elections, showed that the highest polling recorded in any assembly constituency in Jammu and Kashmir was 69 per cent while the lowest was 55 per cent. Compared to the 2002 elections, the turnout rose by 22 per cent in the Kashmir valley and by 16 per cent in Jammu.

Though the parties and candidates taking part in the Jammu and Kashmir haven't made any serious allegations of rigging and the polls were generally accepted as fair and transparent by observers and the independent media, those who led the call for boycott didn't get a level playing field. In the words of Sajjad Lone, the Indian government provided an uneven playing field for the polls and showed a selective acceptance of democracy.

He pointed out that political leaders calling for boycott were jailed or put under house arrest, an undeclared curfew was imposed, peaceful protest marches were thwarted and the Kashmir valley suffered an armed siege. All these coercive steps in his view eroded the credibility of the voters' turnout percentages. Sajjad Lone's comments should carry more credence because he isn't a hardliner and doesn't fall into the category of the overly pro-Pakistan Kashmiri politicians.

Understandably, the Indian politicians, think-tanks and media are excited over the successful and largely peaceful conclusion of the seven-phase electoral process in Jammu and Kashmir. In particular, they were overjoyed by the high turnout at the polls. The huge protests by Kashmiri Muslims triggered by the land transfer to the Shri Amarnath shrine last summer and the consequent blockade of the Kashmir valley by Hindu protestors in Jammu had stunned most Indians and some were considering to accept the fact that India's efforts to integrate Kashmir into its fold was a lost cause. A number of liberal and respected Indian writers and intellectuals started advising their government to review its policy and take steps to remove the grievances of the Kashmiris. Some had even suggested that the Kashmiris should be granted the choice to decide the fate of their state if that is what they wanted. However, the big turnout in the state elections and the peaceful completion of the electoral process is contributing to a change in the thinking of many Indians who were giving up on Kashmiri people and prompting them to view the Kashmir issue in a different and new light.

The Times of India in an editorial termed the Jammu and Kashmir elections outcome as the best New Year gift to India. The results were announced after the traumatic Mumbai attacks and were certainly happy news for many dejected Indians. The failure of the boycott call by the Hurriyat Conference was described by Indian media as a rejection of the secessionists and an end to jihad in Kashmir. The reduction in violence in Jammu and Kashmir, the decrease in infiltration from Pakistani Kashmir and the outpouring of popular support for peace in the valley were seen as signs of a return to normalcy and the curtailment of Islamabad's role in Kashmir's affairs. It was even pointed out that the Kashmir problem required no other solution than resolving the autonomy issue under the framework of India's constitution.

However, it would be premature and wrong to believe that recent Jammu and Kashmir elections have done away with the need for a comprehensive solution of the Kashmir issue involving India, Pakistan and, most importantly, the people of the undivided Jammu and Kashmir state as it existed prior to 1947. Similar elections have been held in the past as well and the Kashmiris have voted in large numbers. Every election raised hopes of an ultimate, India-centric solution of the Kashmir issue but it didn't happen the way New Delhi would have wished.

Apart from other factors, the high turnout in the recent polls became possible due to the absence of violence by militants' groups such as Hezbul Mujahideen and Lashkar-e-Taiba and the unusually big number of candidates, with one assembly constituency reporting 27 contestants. The pro-boycott political forces and the militants were also reported to have become complacent after leading the unprecedented protests over the Sgri Amarnath land transfer issue. The army of candidates did door-to-door campaigning and the voters due to local, village, regional and political reasons responded by voting in large numbers. Issues of water and electricity supply, roads and bridges linking communities, and availability of jobs are always on the mind of the voters and this cannot happen if there are no assemblies and lawmakers. Economic issues matter more for the common voter and they are keen to vote whenever an opportunity arises. Even otherwise, boycott of elections is well nigh impossible as we have so often seen in Pakistan.

It would be pertinent to conclude this piece by quoting from a post-elections statement by Mehbooba Mufti, president of the pro-India PDP and daughter of Mufti Sayeed, former chief minister of Jammu and Kashmir and once the interior minister of India. Her party raised its tally of assembly seats from 16 to 21, all won in the Kashmir valley, and emerged as the biggest party backed by Kashmiri Muslims. Its rival, National Conference, oldest party in Jammu and Kashmir founded by Omar Abdullah's grandfather, Sheikh Abdullah, did win 28 seats but it also won seats in Jammu region and was runner-up to the PDP in the Kashmir valley. This is how Mehbooba Mufti commented on the outcome of the elections: "The over 60 per cent turnout is not the end of the road as Jammu and Kashmir is different than other states and its people hold different perceptions and ambitions." In other words, the recent elections were no doubt a democratic exercise and the voters voted for parties and candidates of their choice but the polls cannot be a substitute for a durable solution of the Jammu and Kashmir issue.

The writer is resident editor of The News in Peshawar. Email: rahimyusufzai@yahoo.com

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 03 Jan 2009 22:25

This "Indian intellectual" a.k.a. TSP piglet is mighty worried that the harried rats might loose ground particularly the scum bag he reveres: Geelani Sahib and urges him to show the way

http://www.dawn.com/2009/01/03/op.htm#2

sum · Post by **sum** » 03 Jan 2009 23:05

Porki editorial
A begrudging acceptance of on-ground reality?

Cant believe that a Paki wrote this!!!!

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 03 Jan 2009 23:13

No company can come there because one cannot own the property or there is no gaurantee of security with mullas wielding AK-47s.

About the latter, yes, can't do much. About the former "one cannot own the property" - that is no bar to economic development. E.g., in China, only the state, and no private party owns the land. In effect, every facility in China is on leased land. Doesn't seem to hurt their economic growth very much.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 03 Jan 2009 23:30

Has Lord Avebury opened his trap lately? That British peer was awarded Pakistan's highest civilian honor, Sitara-i-Pakistan, for all the crap he shot at India over Kashmir.

Then in the late 90s when India started inviting furriners to come and have a look-see in J&K, he visited the Hurriyat leaders and came away disappointed - that they were not democrats, and civil liberties were not their goal. After that as far as I can tell he has not spoken up.

The point to remember about the so-called "freedom" movement is that it is **NOT** for anything any civilized person would recognize as freedom. It is for the "freedom" to be talibanized.

Kashmiris may perhaps realize this, but continue to speak of their struggle like the descendants of the former Confederacy in the United States, who claim to this day that the Civil War was not over slavery, but other nobler issues. You only have to read the articles of secession to realize how Porki-like-reality-denying that is. However, for the sake of civil society, most people let it pass without arguing the point.

As long as the Kashmiris are - as they proved in this election - participants in India, don't take the rhetoric too seriously, it is necessary for some for their H&D.

{A prolonged Talibanization of NWFP would, IMO, help shake some sense into at least some of the misguided. If the Paki newsreport is correct and one-third of the population of Swat has moved because of the Taliban menace, then it basically proves that aam junta has no appreciation of the Taliban, but are unable to stand up to the bullies.}

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 03 Jan 2009 23:45

A_Gupta wrote:
No company can come there because one cannot own the property or there is no gaurantee of security with mullas wielding AK-47s.
About the latter, yes, can't do much. About the former "one cannot own the property" - that is no bar to economic development. E.g., in China, only the state, and no private party owns the land. In effect, every facility in China is on leased land. Doesn't seem to hurt their economic growth very much.

Chinese mode is across China. How can u have a different model for JK where as in every state the CMs are competing with each other with freebies. See how Guj CM can get Nano. What can JK offer to Infosys, Wipro or TCS where as the CMs of AP, KT and others are queing to give thousands of acres of land for free. Where will JK fit in the economic scheme of things in India. All it can get could be government funded.

The population of JK who dream of such cities in JK should shed their uber-superiority and join the mainstream SDREs.

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 04 Jan 2009 00:08

Where is Arundhati Roy to write opinion pieces about how to welcome Kashmeer back in to the Indian union given the 60% turnout in elections? Will she pen her diabolical diarrhoea only to ask us to give more things?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 04 Jan 2009 06:17

Even after 48 hours Poonch encounter continues

Jammu : A Special Police Officer (SPO) was killed when the encounter between militants and security forces, which started on Thursday, resumed in the forest area of Mendhar in Poonch district of Jammu and Kashmir, official sources said on Saturday. The slain SPO has been identified as Naresh Kumar of the Special Operation Group (SOG), Poonch. JCO Rakesh Kumar and Naik P K Singh, besides four militants, have so far been killed in the ongoing gun-battle. A retired assistant sub-inspector of J-K police, Muzaffar Hussain Shan, was arrested for his alleged links with the terrorists who are engaged in the encounter. He is a resident of Tope near Batidhar.

No terrorists were reported to be killed on Saturday in the operation. On Friday, four terrorists were killed by security forces. The fierce gun-battle between the terrorists and the security forces comprising Army and Jammu and Kashmir Police is still continuing.

Official sources said the operation has been joined by the troops of 37 RR. Earlier, the joint operation was started by the 39 RR and the Special Operation Group of the Jammu and Kashmir Police. Sources said about half a dozen terrorists were still firing indiscriminately on the operation team. The terrorists were armed with highly sophisticated weapons, including hand grenades which they are lobbing at the operation party.

The apprehended retired ASI has been sent to Joint Interrogation Centre, Jammu, for interrogation. Sources pointed out that the terrorists, engaged in the Mendhar encounter, were staying in the Batidhar forest area and had been getting logistic support from a few locals before the joint operation by the security forces was launched following specific tip off regarding presence of terrorists in the forest area.

Meanwhile, the Border Security Force on Saturday gunned down an intruder from Pakistan on the international border in RS Pura sector of Jammu district. Official sources informed that patrolling party of the Border Security Force observed suspicious movement along the border in the wee hours of Saturday at Kharkola border outpost. The troops of the 141 Bn searched the area, during which they noticed a man coming towards Indian side, sources informed. When the BSF men called out to the man, he did not respond and continued to approach the Indian territory. Following this, the BSF troops opened fire, killing the man, sources informed. Later, sources informed that nothing was recovered from his possession, and the intruder has not been identified.

Sources added that the BSF is yet to inform its Pakistani counterpart and a flag meeting in this connection has not been held yet. The killed intruder was in his 20s, officials pointed out.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 04 Jan 2009 06:21

J&K: Gujjars demand Deputy Chief Minister post

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 04 Jan 2009 07:16

Muppalla wrote:Even after 48 hours Poonch encounter continues

NDTV reporting that the terrorists had built concrete underground bunkers within the area.

vavinash · Post by **vavinash** » 04 Jan 2009 08:13

Why not use a bunker buster? Surely russia or israel or even US can provide some.

vsudhir · Post by **vsudhir** » 04 Jan 2009 17:11

shyamd wrote:
Muppalla wrote:Even after 48 hours Poonch encounter continues
NDTV reporting that the terrorists had built concrete underground bunkers within the area.

Time to battle-test the Smerch system now....

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 04 Jan 2009 22:18

Bunker busters on a small hole (6-8 feet dimensions) lined with a few cm thick layer of concrete.built on an highly uneven terrain(a few on mountains), under dense foliage and like? Further no idea if the bunkers have any terrorist inside or not.

These "bunkers" are just some small fox-holes. It's almost like firing a Tomahawk on a cloth tent.

SPOs are in news after a long time.

Moppalla jee,
Factories can be set up in southern districts of Jammu division..Kathua, Samba and Jammu have some industrial plants.
You don't need to "own" the land, even a lease can suffice as is the case with many plants. It isn't as bad as you think.

Yash · Post by **Yash** » 05 Jan 2009 01:55

More of the same...
Jammu encounter enters fourth day

Wonder if we're being restrained in not using full air power from all sides and bunker-busting bombs. hate to see our jawans losing life over these scumbags.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 05 Jan 2009 02:47

jamwal wrote:Moppalla jee,
Factories can be set up in southern districts of Jammu division..Kathua, Samba and Jammu have some industrial plants.
You don't need to "own" the land, even a lease can suffice as is the case with many plants. It isn't as bad as you think.

I am all for development of JK and I understand that the above region could be developed via leasing of land etc. Needless to say that most the forum members wish the same for JK.

Does the new government has vision to do the following:
1) Create Export/Electronic Processing zones and that too in Jammu region.

2) Compete with states like Guj, TN, KT, Maha and AP by means of incentives. In fact GOJK need to give a very large scale incentives to attract investment because they are easily avalilable as the CMs of these states are falling over one another to grab the opportunities to their states. WB inspite of it recent competitive spirit lost the competition.

3) Allow skilled labour ( all the DOOs - Desi Oracle Operators) with their infrastructure of day/night shifts in these zones. Large scale residential quarters needs to be built. I am not saying that Jammu does not have skilled labour but you need free movement of labour. They need to bring anyone from anywhere freely. OffCource these kids today need Discos/Pubs and other anti-mulla stuff too for them to take positions.

Now a million dollar question: Assuming the GOJK pulls this off and obviously they want to show this in both valley and Jammu region. Will the new Mulla-Omar allow if the market forces prefer only Jammu region and not the valley for obvious reasons. What could be the reaction?

Rishirishi · Post by **Rishirishi** » 05 Jan 2009 05:54

Muppalla wrote:
jamwal wrote:Moppalla jee,
Factories can be set up in southern districts of Jammu division..Kathua, Samba and Jammu have some industrial plants.
You don't need to "own" the land, even a lease can suffice as is the case with many plants. It isn't as bad as you think.
I am all for development of JK and I understand that the above region could be developed via leasing of land etc. Needless to say that most the forum members wish the same for JK.

Does the new government has vision to do the following:
1) Create Export/Electronic Processing zones and that too in Jammu region.

2) Compete with states like Guj, TN, KT, Maha and AP by means of incentives. In fact GOJK need to give a very large scale incentives to attract investment because they are easily avalilable as the CMs of these states are falling over one another to grab the opportunities to their states. WB inspite of it recent competitive spirit lost the competition.

3) Allow skilled labour ( all the DOOs - Desi Oracle Operators) with their infrastructure of day/night shifts in these zones. Large scale residential quarters needs to be built. I am not saying that Jammu does not have skilled labour but you need free movement of labour. They need to bring anyone from anywhere freely. OffCource these kids today need Discos/Pubs and other anti-mulla stuff too for them to take positions.

Now a million dollar question: Assuming the GOJK pulls this off and obviously they want to show this in both valley and Jammu region. Will the new Mulla-Omar allow if the market forces prefer only Jammu region and not the valley for obvious reasons. What could be the reaction?

It is very simple:
All you have to do is to give a few industries Tax free holidays and there are plenty that would move to the state. For example if they remove excise duty on a few type of products. Also remove incometax and sales tax.
As for leagal rights, just look at China. There no one can own land, or property, yet the market is booooming. Simple solution is to lease out the land for say 125 year. Problem solved. Also creat "save havens" for the pundit refugees and settle 3-4 million non Kashmiris in the vally. That sould solve the entire Kashmir issue for ever. Both for Pakistanis, as they then can "gracefully" forget about Kashmir and for the sepratists who will not have the numbers on their side any more.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 05 Jan 2009 23:03

Something like that is already happening, but apparently not on a large scale. I say, let Jammu be an industrial hub and get richer in the process. That'll probably teach Kashmiris something.

Pranay · Post by **Pranay** » 06 Jan 2009 02:49

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indi ... 936044.cms

Fierce gunbattle in Poonch continues for fifth day
5 Jan 2009, 0951 hrs IST, IANS

JAMMU: A fierce gunbattle between security forces and militants continued to rage for the fifth day on Monday in the thick forests of Jammu and
Kashmir's frontier Poonch district in which seven people - four militants and three soldiers - have been killed already. ( Watch )

The shootout between security forces and militants in the forests in Mendhar area of Poonch erupted on Thursday. The army laid siege to the Pati Tar mountainous forest near Mendhar following a tip-off about the presence of a group of hardcore militants in hideouts there.

Some top commanders of Pakistan based Jaish-e-Mohammad (JeM) and Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) terror outfits are reported to be present in the hideouts.

According to officials, seven people - four militants and three security personnel - were killed in the first two days of the gunbattle. A Special Police Officer (SPO), Naresh Kumar, was killed Saturday morning. SPOs are temporary recruits in the police force to assist anti-militancy operations.

Col. D.K. Kachari, spokesman of army Northern Command at Udhampur, said that the bodies of the militants had not yet been recovered, but added: "Soldiers on the ground have sighted the bodies."

But residents of Mendhar contest his claim. Mohammad Iqbal told IANS over telephone: "No militant has been killed. It is such a deep and dense forest that no one can see far."

Army and police officials have not ruled out reports that the militants have erected bunkers or hideouts in the area.

"We feel that this could be the transit and arms dumping ground of militants," said Iqbal.

Security officials, however, declined to comment on the matter. An official said: "Our priority is to conduct the operation and flush out militants."

A security expert said on condition of anonymity: "If there are concrete bunkers and arms dumps here, then without hesitation it is an intelligence failure."

The expert added that security forces had claimed to have totally "sanitised" the area ahead of the recently concluded assembly elections in the state.

The forested area in Mendhar is on the map of traditional infiltration routes of militants sneaking into the Indian side from Pakistan across the Line of Control that divides Kashmir between the two countries.

Senior army and police officers are camping in the area to monitor the situation.

An official had said late Saturday: "We do not have any idea about the number of militants present there as they are firing from different positions, which means that either they are changing their locations or have split themselves in groups."

He said the militants were equipped with heavy weaponry and have a large quantity of arms and ammunition with them. "They are frequently firing from Pica Guns."

"We also cannot say as to how long this operation will last," he added.

It's the fifth day, and the battle still continues.

Initial news indicated that the battle died down at night and picked up in the morning, today, NDTV, mentioned the opposite, that the battle picked up at dusk and died down during the day.

A few questions,

1) Why isn't there 24 hour pressure on these terrorists? Different batches of the army keep up the firing on these guys around the clock.

2) Have not heard of any reported use of NVG's / Thermal detectors.

3) Have also not heard about any use of UAV's to pinpoint their location, nor use of any armed helicopters to lay down a carpet of lead on these people.

4) Unlike possible hostage scenarios during the Bombay attack, no such mitigating factors exist for the security services in quickly eliminating these people. There is talk in the media of the difficult terrain and lousy weather, but, so what??

We cannot have 10 or so terrorists, be it in Bombay or in this ongoing encounter carry on the battle with the Indian security forces for so long...

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 06 Jan 2009 03:01

I say, let Jammu be an industrial hub and get richer in the process. That'll probably teach Kashmiris something.

As long as they are in India, they should be treated no better and no worse than any Indians.

sunilUpa · Post by **sunilUpa** » 06 Jan 2009 04:30

Rishirishi wrote: It is very simple:
All you have to do is to give a few industries Tax free holidays and there are plenty that would move to the state. For example if they remove excise duty on a few type of products. Also remove incometax and sales tax.
As for leagal rights, just look at China. There no one can own land, or property, yet the market is booooming. Simple solution is to lease out the land for say 125 year. Problem solved. Also creat "save havens" for the pundit refugees and settle 3-4 million non Kashmiris in the vally. That sould solve the entire Kashmir issue for ever. Both for Pakistanis, as they then can "gracefully" forget about Kashmir and for the sepratists who will not have the numbers on their side any more.

Very true..just look at Himachal pradesh or Goa. They announced a tax holiday for Pharma industry and a bunch of Indian pharma majors moved their manufacturing operations there! It was tough initially as qualified manpower was scarce.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Jan 2009 04:34

Omar Abdullah was in the Bollywood movie 'Mission Istanbul' where he spoke of he lack of appreciation by media of the normalcy being restored in J&K. Guess he will now as the CM have a chance to realise his 'reel' role.

vsudhir · Post by **vsudhir** » 06 Jan 2009 04:39

'Stop playing divisive politics in J&K':Omar

'Divisive politics', eh?
Seems like a new sloganostrum to try to subvert the Jammuites automony movement from Srinagar.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 06 Jan 2009 14:49

Kashmir comment, Obama's first big foreign policy mistake

The statement by President-elect Barack Obama regarding American intervention in Kashmir is his first "foreign policy mistake", a leading US expert on South Asia said on Tuesday.

A Kashmir initiative by America, however "veiled", can undermine improving Indo-US ties, Selig S Harrison, director of Asia Programme at the Center for International Policy and a senior scholar of the Woodrow Wilson International, said an opinion piece published in The Washington Times.

"President-elect Barack Obama has made his first big foreign policy mistake -- pledging US intervention in the Kashmir dispute between India and Pakistan," he wrote.

"By questioning Indian control of the Kashmir Valley, the United States would strengthen jihadi forces in both Islamabad and Srinagar, the capital of the state of Jammu and Kashmir. More importantly, it would undermine improving US-India relations," he argued.

"A US Kashmir initiative, however veiled, would poison relations between New Delhi and Washington," he said.

Harrison said the rationale for intervention is that fear of India requires Pakistan to strengthen its western front in Afghanistan by supporting the Taliban.

"The appointment of a high-level regional envoy in South Asia to promote cooperation among India, Pakistan and Afghanistan in combating al-Qaeda and its allies would be desirable in the aftermath of Mumbai. But Kashmir indeed would be a tar pit for such an envoy," Harrison said.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 06 Jan 2009 18:04

can't one smoke 'em out?

why wait and watch? tear gas is good enough!?

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 06 Jan 2009 21:51

vsudhir wrote:'Stop playing divisive politics in J&K':Omar

'Divisive politics', eh?
Seems like a new sloganostrum to try to subvert the Jammuites automony movement from Srinagar.

when he spoke on NDTV the night of the election, he refered to the PDP as the devisive politicians

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 06 Jan 2009 22:49

sanjaykumar wrote:I say, let Jammu be an industrial hub and get richer in the process. That'll probably teach Kashmiris something.

As long as they are in India, they should be treated no better and no worse than any Indians.

I'm all for it. But has it been done sincerely till now?
Why not let Jammu get developed by integrating more with rest of India while letting the Kashmiris rot with their slogans of Pakisatan and azadi. Intelligent people among them will soon realise the stupidity of their "struggle"

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 07 Jan 2009 06:15

jamwal wrote:Why not let Jammu get developed by integrating more with rest of India while letting the Kashmiris rot with their slogans of Pakisatan and azadi. Intelligent people among them will soon realise the stupidity of their "struggle"

Abdullas and Muftis know the end result. If they allow massive industrialization of Jammu region, what will they show to valley people. I do not think they can do the same way in Srinagar while competing with soft-separatist approach to get the votes. They have to keep the Jammu underdeveloped the same as valley for their and their masters' interests. This is where the de-limitation and ruthless Hindu religion based voting by Jammuites is necessary. They should vote blindly to a percieved anti-muslim party(95% of Dalits in UP vote to Mayavati and this should be Jammuites approach for tactical purposes) and if they do they can push the change.

archan · Post by **archan** » 07 Jan 2009 20:02

SaiK wrote:can't one smoke 'em out?

why wait and watch? tear gas is good enough!?

I was wondering about that as well. If they are hiding in a natural cave, why not shoot something inside the cave that emits some kind of a gas that they have to run out?

Pranay · Post by **Pranay** » 07 Jan 2009 20:13

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7815641.stm

Additional details about the continuing encounter in Mendhar...

Kashmir stand-off in second week

By Binoo Joshi
BBC News, Jammu

Indian troops have been fighting an insurgency since 1989
Indian security forces say efforts to overpower militants surrounded in a remote area of Indian-administered Kashmir have entered an eighth day.
The authorities say the militants are "holed up" in a mountainous area surrounded by thick forest in the Poonch district of Jammu.
Poor weather and difficult terrain are hindering progress, the military say.
The army says seven people, three of them security personnel, were killed in the first two days of fighting.
There were overnight clashes on Tuesday and more fighting on Wednesday morning.
Violence in Kashmir has decreased in recent years but militants are still fighting to end India's rule in the portion of Kashmir it controls.
Tens of thousands of people have been killed since 1989, when an armed insurgency against Indian rule began.
'No bunkers'
Brig Gurdeep Singh told reporters the army is not sure how many militants are surrounded.

"But one thing is certain," he said. "There are no bunkers - the terrorists are using natural caves as their hideouts."
He said only about 350 soldiers were taking part in the operation - contrary to media reports which he said gave an "exaggerated figure".
A team of commandos was also on stand-by, he added.
Brig Singh said that air strikes were not planned against the militants and that "the army is capable enough to succeed in this operation".
However he said it was impossible to predict how long it would take before it was concluded.
Brig Singh said that some militants had tried to breach the security cordon on Tuesday night, but troops "pushed them back into the forest".
He said that the army had recovered ammunition, communication equipment and rations from two hideouts captured last week.
The army says that seven people - including four militants and three security personnel - were killed in the first two days of the operation.
Local people have disputed the figures, arguing that no militants have been killed.
The area where the stand-off is taking place is one of the traditional infiltration routes used by militants crossing into Indian-administered Kashmir from Pakistan.
It offers access routes to the Kashmir valley through mountain passes. The valley has been the centre of militant attacks for much of the last decade although the authorities say that the number of such attacks is decreasing.