India's Sharm-el- Sheikh Harakiri...

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 21 Jul 2009 15:54

Sanku wrote:So either we are their full servants or we at war with them?

We are not servants. I see lot of benefits like Central Asia in future. America needs us badly but America has options, WE DON'T.

We would have not been war with America but we would have forced her to lean towards China. Is that what you want ?

And what documents India has signed that you are so angry with the government. Is it Talks with Pakistan or Baluchistan issue ?

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 21 Jul 2009 16:00

shravan wrote:
Sanku wrote:So either we are their full servants or we at war with them?
We are not servants. I see lot of benefits like Central Asia in future. America needs us badly but America has options, WE DON'T.

We would have not been war with America but we would have forced her to lean towards China. Is that what you want ?

This is BULL SHIT, there is no credence what so ever that if we didnt make such a muck of it in S e S then US will go towards China.

And if this is true tomorrow it will be "If India does not agree on Kashmir it will go to China" with such chicken little behavior Indian state is showing far less independence than the Congress cabinet during the Raj.

There is no logical tying up of S e S, potential gains in Central Asia and Chinese threat.

There is a clear logical connection between ineptitude and "yes master" spine less behavior and S e S.

AjayKK · Post by **AjayKK** » 21 Jul 2009 16:15

Seeing the "Chanakyan spin", one feels that the people who claimed to represent the nation blundered big time.
We should have included the statement " Kashmir and other areas" as well.

Then using "Chanakyan spin",
Kashmir = ALL of Kashmir including PoK would be "game" for India.
Other areas = Northern Areas.

That should have done it.
Maybe this is the next step in the"great leap forward".

Despite scepticism, PM was focused on resuming talks with Pak

NEW DELHI: Ahead of meeting his Pakistani counterpart Yousuf Gilani at the Egyptian resort of Sharm el-Sheikh, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh was very focused on resuming talks but few in his entourage anticipated this could mean delinking of terrorism from the composite dialogue process.

So apart from the B word, was the "delinking of terrorism from the composite dialogue process" arrived at later when the two sides met ?

Raja Ram · Post by **Raja Ram** » 21 Jul 2009 16:21

Every passing hour since Sharm-Al - Shiek Joint Statement it is getting proved beyond a shadow of doubt that our distinguished economist, brilliant statesman, PM has let this nation down. Even his own partymen, who are given to sychophancy to whosoever is in power or close to THE POWER (SoniaG), are expressing their reservations. There can be no argument anymore on this. Coming up with ingenious and fantastic chankian extrapolations to defend this is - to put it mildly - mere intellectual mastrubation.

The PM has done some one else's bidding and has gone against National Consensus. No one in India is clamouring for talks with pakistan. Talks with Pakistan should have been a reward to them. For delivering to us those responsible for Mumbai attack to start with. Not for something that Pakistan is doing for the US.

The most incredible excuse that has come up now on this forum is that if we did not do as told by the US and start talks with Pakistan, the US would have worked with China. Let them do so, they will get into a deeper mess then.This sort of argument only shows the low level of confidence on India's position in the world today. Is India really that weak a country that it has to do anything and everything to be seen as a friend of the US and stop China from being an US ally?

Gentle readers, please pause to think. Will China ever agree to something like this and open talks with Dalai Lama on Tibet or with Taiwan under threat from the US that it would otherwise enter into a strategic partnership with India?

The US cannot leave Afghanistan with some sort of victory without Indian involvement there. There can be no peace on Afghanistan without India's support. The US knows this.

I have been stating this repeatedly, all this positioning and accepting of a dhimmi status is stemming from the vision thing. This PM believes that this is what is India's rightful place. He believes strongly in this Gandhian vision of India as a moral super power with an economy that is up there with the leading power centers. He does not believe in other dimensions of power as something that is India's due.

From that perspective, he does not believe that he is letting down India. His party may also subscribe to this view now. It did not share such views before although it mouthed such platitudes. One thing though, this is the approach the majority of Indians want. They have clearly demonstrated this in two rounds of elections post Mumbai.

sanjaychoudhry · Post by **sanjaychoudhry** » 21 Jul 2009 16:24

I have been stating this repeatedly, all this positioning and accepting of a dhimmi status is stemming from the vision thing. This PM believes that this is what is India's rightful place. He believes strongly in this Gandhian vision of India as a moral super power with an economy that is up there with the leading power centers. He does not believe in other dimensions of power as something that is India's due.

From that perspective, he does not believe that he is letting down India. His party may also subscribe to this view now. It did not share such views before although it mouthed such platitudes. One thing though, this is the approach the majority of Indians want. They have clearly demonstrated this in two rounds of elections post Mumbai.

Indians will learn the hard way that power flows only through the barrel of a gun. The rest -- moral power, economic power, soft power, cultural power -- is self-deluding nonsense. This is what America is doing to India -- take away its "barrel of the gun" power and flattering it to consider itself a moral or economic power or a "strategic ally." Indians are being lead to their slaughter by the White Christian bahu and the American stooge.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 21 Jul 2009 17:42

Maleeha Lodi, on S-el-S

The third aspect of the future engagement relates to issues that have poisoned relations in recent years and added new layers of mistrust, but have not featured on any formal agenda of the bilateral talks. Many of these have strategic implications and did surface during the talks in Egypt, raised to his credit, by Prime Minister Gilani. They include Islamabad’s serious concerns about the role of the Indian consulates in Afghanistan, especially in fomenting destabilisation in Balochistan, as well as Delhi’s campaign to malign Pakistan internationally.

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s publicly stated willingness to address the former is welcome. But this will need to be tested in the talks ahead. Instead of pursuing these issues haphazardly there may be merit in both countries considering an agreement embodying mutual assurances of non-interference and non-intervention in each other’s internal affairs. This could provide a framework to deal with this vexed problem.

Looking forward, what will determine stable relations is whether a habit of dialogue to solve problems can be fostered. If the diplomatic efforts ahead are to be a new beginning and not a false start, this habit has to be able to trump and transcend the mutual hostility and suspicion that are immediately revived by the eruption of any incident or problem.

Unless this happens, it is hard to see how past patterns can be broken. In that case the fundamental prerequisite for a stable peace will continue to be elusive.

enqyoob · Post by **enqyoob** » 21 Jul 2009 18:17

A Tubelight Moment 4 me!

Ahead of meeting the terrorist-lovin' Groper, Poojya Pradaham Mantriji Manmohan Singh was very focused on resuming talks but few in his entourage anticipated this could mean delinking of terrorism from the composite dialogue process.

Now WHY would this be? It occurs to me that the reason is very simple. The present GOI Top Layer have NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO intention of ever responding to Pakistani terrorism with force. They have NOOOOOO interest in defending India, and see NOOOOO security threat from Pakistan.

They just want to see how to sell more Bollywood DVDs and arrange more IPL and ICL matches to get money from ppl on both sides of the border (oh! WHAT border?)

Why else would one NOT scrutinize a statement drafted by Pakis and not wonder why they want to mention Balochistan and ALL Outstanding Issues regardless of any terrorism?

Well... vox populi, vox Dei. What u and I believe does not matter. Indians are not interested in defending India, and at the very Top, they probably get their intelligence from The Hindu and Times of Islamabad, and the New York Times, and their foreign policy advice from JNU.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 21 Jul 2009 18:25

shravan wrote: US Charge d'Affairs Peter Burleigh meets Advani
May 13, 2009
US Charge d'Affairs Peter Burleigh on Wednesday met BJP's Prime Ministerial candidate L K Advani here and discussed the bilateral ties and regional matters, particularly developments in Pakistan.

--

I am saying is BJP would also have done the same thing...

You still think its a Mistake ?

So if someone meets LKA and the bill still passes it is BJP's capitulation. Very good logic.

When comparing INC and BJP, it would be more accurate to compare their actions when they are in power.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2009 18:31

Raja Ram wrote:This sort of argument only shows the low level of confidence on India's position in the world today. Is India really that weak a country that it has to do anything and everything to be seen as a friend of the US and stop China from being an US ally?

Similar low level confidence was exhibited during the USA elections. There was a school of thoughts which said the Democrats were bad for India; and implied Republicans were better. They cited the strengthening relationships in the last tenure of Bush as one example. It is a sign of times where we have given up hope on our own leaders and have resigned to the expectations of having friendly leadership/regime outside our own shores to look after Indian interests. Who rules Unkilland matters to only an extent, who rules from Dili matters more for Indian interests.

Muslim & European Invaders had tougher fight, in India, than what is being offered to Unkil.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 21 Jul 2009 18:38

narayanan wrote:A Tubelight Moment 4 me!

Ahead of meeting the terrorist-lovin' Groper, Poojya Pradaham Mantriji Manmohan Singh was very focused on resuming talks but few in his entourage anticipated this could mean delinking of terrorism from the composite dialogue process.

His entourage consisted of EAM S M Krishna, NSA M K Narayanan, Foreign Secretary Shiv Shanker Menon, etc.

The question is whether the aforementioned gentlemen approve of the Joint Statement. What role did they play in the formulation? It will be interesting to know how much of our establishment has been compromised by senility and emotionality.

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 21 Jul 2009 18:38

RamaY wrote: So if someone meets LKA and the bill still passes it is BJP's capitulation. Very good logic.

When comparing INC and BJP, it would be more accurate to compare their actions when they are in power.

About the logic i have posted two articles check the date and the highlighted part. Still if you can't understand i can't do anything about it.
----

Who was going to challenge Af-Pak strategy ? Advani ?

Is Gen. Kapoor a American Agent ?

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2009 18:39

Raja Ram wrote:This PM believes that this is what is India's rightful place. He believes strongly in this Gandhian vision of India as a moral super power with an economy that is up there with the leading power centers. He does not believe in other dimensions of power as something that is India's due.

From that perspective, he does not believe that he is letting down India.

Very very well put. One gets a sense that he has his values and perspective; just that it is different from some jingoes here. The citizens of Unkil or West realize the benefits of progressive and liberal policies leading to the World singing Khumbhya, the Indian citizens are joining that platform little realizing that the West has these thoughts from the position of power while India is not yet there with power. Simply put MMS has a vision that some of us don't resonate to.

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 21 Jul 2009 18:47

Did Clinton say soft power or software power

? They surely have helped us position to become one (if we are not already).

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2009 18:59

Shravan: You better edit the last question in your last post - unless you can provide proof. You could get hurt in a jiffy by the admins.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 21 Jul 2009 19:17

shravan wrote:
RamaY wrote: So if someone meets LKA and the bill still passes it is BJP's capitulation. Very good logic.

When comparing INC and BJP, it would be more accurate to compare their actions when they are in power.
About the logic i have posted two articles check the date and the highlighted part. Still if you can't understand i can't do anything about it.
----

Who was going to challenge Af-Pak strategy ? Advani ?

Is Gen. Kapoor a American Agent ?

Shravanji and all others who see Chanakya's influence in this GoI's s-e-s performance, Please refer to the following 2 pieces of wisdoms (both copy pasted from Wiki)

The Duck Test : If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.

Occam's razor : "Entities should not be multiplied unnecessarily" i.e. When competing hypotheses are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selection of the hypothesis that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest entities while still sufficiently answering the question.

Now try to understand what the pessimists here and elsewhere on the net are saying or rather not saying aloud about a possible Ghar Ka Bhedi.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 21 Jul 2009 19:27

We can't trust the congress when it says that they are against the statement signed by MMS. With the congress, one is not sure who they are opposing, MMS or the statement itself.

From the looks of it, the clamour is more towards getting rid of MMS, who's comfortably sitting in the PM's gaddi, while other maha-mahims are on the dust trodden road.

It was clear from geelani's and the pak delegation's reactions that they got more than they expected. Giving concessions to geelani has no value because he can't deliver anything. If he claims that he persuaded kiyani and the army brass to go ahead with the cases against the 26/11 terrorists, well we havn't seen the convictions come in yet.

Pakistan is using the speed of their 26/11 perpatrators trails as a bargaining chip with india to keep india on a good behaviour, while kiyani in all likelyhood has several plans on his desk to attack india, waiting approval.

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 21 Jul 2009 19:49

SwamyG wrote:Shravan: You better edit the last question in your last post - unless you can provide proof. You could get hurt in a jiffy by the admins.

No i will not.

Can you provide me proof that Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is not working on India's interest or he has become a Pawn of America ?

Lot of Members here are blaming that Congress has sold India - Have any proof of that ?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Jul 2009 20:00

Gagan wrote:We can't trust the congress when it says that they are against the statement signed by MMS. With the congress, one is not sure who they are opposing, MMS or the statement itself.

From the looks of it, the clamour is more towards getting rid of MMS, who's comfortably sitting in the PM's gaddi, while other maha-mahims are on the dust trodden road.

The porkis were always very wary of dealing with the congress.

The congress knows the true facts about the porkis since before independance and their true nature.

They welcomed the chance to deal with Vajpayee. They were very disappointed when BJP lost.

The congress is the most implacable enemy of porkistan, a fact acknowledged by the porkis themselves.

But the porkis have somehow managed to detach mms through pappi jappi or have mms influenced externally without the congress being in play. I think that the unfortunate events in SeS has caught them unawares.

I do not think that the congress will trust mms on his own again.
Their reactions and body language reeks of strong condemnation.
Expect a big contingent to run interference for the congress whenever mms ventures out again like a babe in the woods.
They will never let him deal alone with gilani or zardari again.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 21 Jul 2009 20:06

Raja Ram wrote:This PM believes that this is what is India's rightful place. He believes strongly in this Gandhian vision of India as a moral super power with an economy that is up there with the leading power centers. He does not believe in other dimensions of power as something that is India's due.

From that perspective, he does not believe that he is letting down India.

Cart load of rubbish with all due respect. That may be part of his vision, but the key diabolical part of his mindset that led to the shameful surrender at Sharm is that he does not feel the evil intent of Pakis. He sees Hindu nationalism as more pervicious than Paki terror. Look at the manner, non-comproimising manner in which he went after Magelon blast suspects. It is because of this f$%^&ed up thinking that he is a darling of the west for whom natioanlism from any other people than white Chrstians/Jews is anathema. In other words, he is a quintessentail South Asia type with this holier than though sanctimonious condescending attitude that westerners have: "we will bring Indians and TSPians together". He is a little puppet in the execution of this racist doctrine: all of 'South Asia's' issues are coblled together with no distinction made to Paki perfidy. From an Indian perspective, this is treason, whether he realizes it or not. But the sad part is that there are millions who subscribe to this. Thats why I am saying India has failed as a nation state.

RayC · Post by **RayC** » 21 Jul 2009 20:09

Gandhiism and Gandhigiri are two different things.

Now, was this Balochistan issue during the Congress rule?

Or is the good humble Dr doing a oneupmanship?

And anyway, Gandhi and Jesus Christ was two of their type. All can't pretend to have the same aura!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Jul 2009 20:15

RayC wrote:
And anyway, Gandhi and Jesus Christ was two of their type. All can't pretend to have the same aura!

RayC ji,

In the end both met the very same fate.

Do gooders are invariably treated like this onlee.

derkonig · Post by **derkonig** » 21 Jul 2009 20:25

chetak wrote:
RayC wrote:
And anyway, Gandhi and Jesus Christ was two of their type. All can't pretend to have the same aura!
RayC ji,

In the end both met the very same fate.

Do gooders are invariably treated like this onlee.

Lets not debate actions and fate. Everyone must be responsible for their actions and must face the consequences. Question is will MMS/Congress ever take responsibility of the damage to the national sovereignty that they are heaping by the hour?

AnimeshP · Post by **AnimeshP** » 21 Jul 2009 20:27

Lets not debate actions and fate. Everyone is responsible for their actions and must face the consequences. Question is will MMS/Congress ever take responsibility of the damage to the national sovereignty that they are heaping by the hour?

I don't think any political party will ever admit to making a blunder. The question should be whether they will be held accountable for their actions by the media and the public?

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2009 20:51

shravan wrote:
SwamyG wrote:Shravan: You better edit the last question in your last post - unless you can provide proof. You could get hurt in a jiffy by the admins.

No i will not.

Can you provide me proof that Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is not working on India's interest or he has become a Pawn of America ?

Lot of Members here are blaming that Congress has sold India - Have any proof of that ?

I don't need to provide any proof because I have not accused MMS of anything sinister. Blaming a party is different from questioning the integrity of military personnel in a military forum. Your wish.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Jul 2009 20:55

the PM does not act alone. To come to a course of action, the cabinet, the party and the civil service have to be aligned - not only on the decision but also on the execution and the PR

we also need to see what else madame klingtong has offered us

lets not be too hasty (just yet)

either way, this is all about lending legitimacy to the 10%i/gilamonster combo instead of the kiyanahi/isi combo... lets see how the cookie's crumbling

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 21 Jul 2009 21:00

SwamyG wrote: I don't need to provide any proof because I have not accused MMS of anything sinister. Blaming a party is different from questioning the integrity of military personnel in a military forum. Your wish.

If i follow other members here who are saying India has sold it self, then the next question which comes to my mind is -- What is Gen. Kapoor doing in America talking with those Evil Americans ?

I am scared now...

Am I wrong ?

Raja Ram · Post by **Raja Ram** » 21 Jul 2009 21:01

CRamS
You can call it cartload of rubbish. But India being a moral super power vision, being nice to pakistan even if they have evil intentions were cornerstones of Gandhiji and his approach towards partition and pakistan. He lived by that ideology and died for it. You may not agree with that vision or with Gandhiji. MMS probably does.

Judging by elections over the years, this kind of vision is what most Indians aspire for. Gandhian vision stems from the civilisational ethos of India but welcomes and equates the external influences that have shaped India with equal respect. Even if the invading ideas and religions do not offer the same respect. It is therefore very much an Indian vision. This vision gives premium to non-voilence and trying everything possible to achieve peace and avoiding voilence and war. It also calls for being steadfast in one's commitment to a principled stand. Despite immense provocation. It believes in the adversary's innate good nature and the inevitability of them changing to a just viewpoint.

To say that the above is the only vision of India or the only right vision of India, to some Indians at least, is wrong. They have a more balanced vision. It has a place for superior ideal called dharma and stems from the myraid philosophical enquires that are broadly ascribed as Sanatana Dharma. In this there is a place for Artha, there is a place for Rajaneeti, there is a place for Danda and there is a place for yuddha. Nothing is overemphasised and the overarching principle of upholding Dharma is the one that binds everyone and everything.

It is this alternate vision that lacks a voice, it is this eternal genius of Indian thought that has been emasculated by Maclauyte thought and overemphasised Gandhian vision. When a new generation of post independent India arises with an increasing demographic shift, it is being pulled in different ways. The new generation does not want to be a prisioner of the past, yet is increasingly being aware that there is a lot about the past that is hidden from them. They are not apologetic about India and its civilisation as they discover there is a lot that we did get right. At the same time, they want to be move ahead and be amongst the best. They want to have the same trappings of success that the rest of the world has and they feel that they must become like the west to achieve them.

This contrasting and confusing pulls will make many of us react differently at different times. But the uniqueness of India is that these can co-exist and there will be a blending of modernity and civilisational ethos. Most Indians do not think there is a lot of good in Indian thought or civilisation and it is better to adopt western ways and means, and just keep some parts of the traditions alive that is non-offensive to the west. MMS and his party, the congress, celebrate this viewpoint as many others.

But there will be a gradual realisation that India does not western acquisence for taking its righful place in the world. It does not even need their acknowledgement. When that realisation comes, there will be a return to the more balanced approach to things. Till then, it looks like it is going to be a tough wait.

Sorry for the OT post.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 21 Jul 2009 21:07

Raja Ram ji,

eloquent as usual! Chapeau!

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 21 Jul 2009 21:21

Raja Ram:

All this Gandee crap is just cowardice and treason masquerading as some great vision. Gandee traits from a position of strength are a virtue, not from a position of abject weakness. When my house is on fire, I must first take care of my family, and then worry about my neighbor's house's fire.

sanjaychoudhry · Post by **sanjaychoudhry** » 21 Jul 2009 21:21

But India being a moral super power vision, being nice to pakistan even if they have evil intentions were cornerstones of Gandhiji and his approach towards partition and pakistan.

Promoting Muslims and short-changing Hindus at every turn was actually the policy of the British. (Remember, the creation of the Muslim League was called by a specator as a "command performance" at the signal of the viceroy. Pakistan was engineered by the British, with Jinnah as a mere tool. Jinnah was zero without British support.)

Gandhi and Nehru turned this anti-Hindu, pro-Muslim worldview of the British Raj government into the policy of the government of independent India. Why they did this is a long story and if you do more research, it will forever change your view of these two gentlemen and who manoevered them into high positions and public limelight.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 21 Jul 2009 21:22

BijuShet wrote: The Duck Test : If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.
.

Something I was forced to use in the other thread.

1) The engineering answer -- its a duck
2) The MBA economist liberal art answer -- this is a speculation on a non sentient being, belonging to a different species, as such this is purely speculatory and biased by the typical anthropomorphic tendencies that humans have.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2009 21:25

What a post that was Raja Ram! Please grant me express permission to quote that with due credits to you and BRF.

awww....and I am going to miss the BRF-Chennai meet with gurus like Raja Ram and Sridhar.

Raja Ram · Post by **Raja Ram** » 21 Jul 2009 21:28

sigh.... I give up CRamS... I disagree with your view that we are a failed nation state.....all I can say is that you need to learn a lot more.....All the best!

I just stand by my statements that India was let down by this PM in S-e-S. On that, I guess there is no disagreement. You ascribe ulterior motives to the PM. I ascribe a different vision, that which I find reprehensible and not commensurate to what India deserves. I also acknowledge that most Indians are comfortable with the vision that this PM stands for. I differ. I also believer that his party and some of his partymen do not share such a vision. The congress party of yore was not party to such a circumscribed vision of India and would never be a party to putting Indian interests secondary to the interest of any power, no matter what the economic benefits would be.

This PM has done that this time. India deserves better than this PM. On that too I hope we are not in disagreement.

Raja Ram · Post by **Raja Ram** » 21 Jul 2009 21:34

SwamyG...thanks...what is posted in BR, belongs to BR...if it is of some use, please use it. I am no guru like some of the brilliant minds here..just a rambler who makes occassional sense....you can always have mini BR meets in chennai when you are here.

samuel · Post by **samuel** » 21 Jul 2009 22:06

I suggest people read PM Singh's dissertation to understand his approach:
"http://www.amazon.com/Indias-Export-Pro ... B0000CM8AL"

Many things about his approach will become (hopefully) clear.

S

John Snow · Post by **John Snow** » 21 Jul 2009 22:07

But India being a moral super power vision, being nice to pakistan even if they have evil intentions were cornerstones of Gandhiji and his approach towards partition and pakistan. He lived by that ideology and died for it. You may not agree with that vision or with Gandhiji. MMS probably does.

Folks I just returned to Massa land after 5 weeks of touring SA, Zimbabwae, Mozambique, Namibia, Kenya.

I want admins persmission to post a comprehensive report covering Political, Cultural, strategic, economic and geo political goings in the Southern African continent part . A continent rich with resources and thanks to Indian diaspora who have been there since 1800s where India does resonate in a positive way still.

Now this picture from Kwazulu Natal province where Gandhiji started his mission to uplift the down trodden.
His original ashram was burnt down during 1984 roits and was reconstructed by her grand daughter (i am told).

Note on the left bottom of the picture ADT 24 hour Armed response, this is how Ahimsa is to be protetcted.

Please dont compare the pigmies like MMS SG and Co to the giant called Mahatma. I have been humbled with what I have seen and read and been told. I have lots of pictures of everything.

*******
SwamyG garu
All the pictures are with Minolta Dynax 7 Digital SLR. onlee 6 Meg Pixels

This one was with 70-300 zoom lens on the Minolta camera made by Quantray (Ritz Camera folks get it manufactured by Sigma I am told)

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 21 Jul 2009 22:11

Raja Ram wrote:One thing though, this is the approach the majority of Indians want. They have clearly demonstrated this in two rounds of elections post Mumbai.

. For one, less than 1 out of 3 Indians usually votes for the party that forms the government. And for another, even amongst this 1/3rd, not everyone supports the party for the same reason.

enqyoob · Post by **enqyoob** » 21 Jul 2009 22:16

Snow garu: add to this, please?

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 21 Jul 2009 22:24

Raja Ramji adding to what you already said a large number of Indians believe in "vaadi paapanna vaade pothadu"( this is in telugu) which loosely translates to he will reap appropriate fruits for his bad deeds, may be MMS thinks like this too and is focussed on riding the moral steed and focussing only on economic progress. But given this, one thing that beats me is why did this reference to baluchisthan come up ?

AnimeshP · Post by **AnimeshP** » 21 Jul 2009 22:25

vera_k wrote: . For one, less than 1 out of 3 Indians usually votes for the party that forms the government. And for another, even amongst this 1/3rd, not everyone supports the party for the same reason.

vera_k ... I am a pretty pro-BJP guy but we can't have it both ways ... when we argue that NaMo has been vindicated by his getting re-elected twice in Gujarat, we will have to accept that MMS/Cong policies have been vindicated by their re-election. That is how our parliamentary democracy (first past the post system) works ...
Paraphrasing NaMo's own words "In India out of a 100 people, 50 vote and the person who gets 26 votes gets to rule and set policy".