Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 24 Feb 2010 07:40

Rubbish being peddled
We have to thank UPA & Indian media for giving them ammo

http://www.asiantribune.com/news/2010/0 ... et-exposed

By Asif Haroon Raja
Indian Hindu political leaders have a track record of going to any extent to get their needs met. They have always been submissive to the powerful and pitiless against the weak. During 1000 years rule of India by the Muslims, the Hindus served the Muslim masters most submissively despite their intense hatred for the Muslims.
No sooner the British took over; the Hindus became their most obedient servants and joined hands with the new masters to persecute the Muslims. At the time of partition of India in 1947, Indian Congress leaders including Nehru got around Mountbatten and Lord Cyril Radcliff to snatch the whole cake and give only crumbs to Quaid-e-Azam led Muslim League that had demanded independent Pakistan. Having gobbled the cake they now want to eat the crumbs also.

Indian leaders religiously follow the guidelines given by their guru Chankya how to go about spreading doubts, suspicions and misgivings among target audiences. Going by Chankyan teachings, Indian leaders and psychological operators disregard morals and scruples, utter falsehood unhesitatingly and convert truth into half truths to achieve ulterior motives. They are adept in art of deceit, drama and propaganda warfare. They turn reality into fiction and indulge in all sorts of underhand tactics to create bad blood between friendly neighbors, communities and sects. They bend over backwards to win over a particular country which is powerful and can serve their interests.

Apart from subversive acts to create cleavages within various communities in Pakistan, Indian propaganda machinery has been consistently painting Pakistan in black by accusing it of all acts of terror in India. These included terrorist attack on Indian Parliament on 13 December 2001, Mumbai train blast on 11 July 2006, Malegaon blasts on 8 September 2006, Samjhota Express Train blasts on 19 February 2007, Hyderabad Mecca Masjid blast on 18 May 2007, Ajmer Sharif Dargah blast on 11 October 2007, serial blasts in Utter Pradesh courts on 23 November 2007, Jaipur blasts on 13 May 2008, Ahmedabad blast on 26 July 2008, Malegaon blasts on 8 September 2008, Delhi blasts on 13 September 2008 and Mumbai carnage on 26 November 200

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 24 Feb 2010 08:00

How about Islamic Banana republic of pakistan? Also terrorist banana republic of pakistan.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 24 Feb 2010 08:07

Actually Terrorist Talibanic Territory of Pakistan is more correct because Pakistan is not a state, it is a state of mind. A territory controlled by animals sharing common features - fanatic barbarianism, inability to live as human beings with people of other religions and a strong desire to revert to Babur era.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Feb 2010 08:08

Shiv, the 'inexplicable' part comes for two reasons.

One, the suddenness of the reversal of Indian position. India offered talks on Feb. 4 and was willing to host it within two weeks on Feb. 18 itself (possibly even earlier) after having consistently argued otherwise up until a few days before. May be they were building up everything to catch the Pakistanis on the wrong foot. On the Pakistani side, there was a flurry of meeting between the COAS and the PM; the COAS, PM and the President; and various other bit players.

Secondly, we know that all arguments and positions of Pakistan are scripted by the Army to the minutest detail, in any meeting with India. This means to me that the Army itself is under some stress. Kayani has recently given extension to two of his trusted Lt. Gens beyond their retirement age. The DG, ISI is likely to get a similar extension in the next couple of weeks. He just informed the PM (not his Supreme Commander, the President) of the extensions.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 24 Feb 2010 08:14

An absolute Must-Watch.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... ource=grid

The second half of the program, "Pakistan's Lost Generation" could have come straight out of a chapter from Shiv's e-book about the Paki education system.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 24 Feb 2010 08:21

India expects Pakistan to carp over Indus treaty

http://epaper.hindustantimes.com/Articl ... 018&mode=1

Malayappan · Post by **Malayappan** » 24 Feb 2010 08:23

SSridhar, Rangudu,

In the context of your discussions on the blacklisting issue, here is a piece in The News that laments the decision, in doing that says

The implications of blacklisting Pakistan are horrendous; no country would honour Pakistan’s letter of credit if an advisory is issued by the member countries of the FATF. This will not only hurt Pakistan’s international trade but will also have serious consequences for economic growth, unemployment, poverty and banking and finance

Wrongly targeting Pakistan

And indeed US seems to have bailed them out. In this report, pakistan is missing in the first list. It is in a second list
US Treasury backs listing threats to financial system

.....that blacklisted Iran, Angola, North Korea, Ecuador and Ethiopia

Bail out yes, but a pressure point nevertheless!

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 24 Feb 2010 08:25

kisi ne yaad kiya?

Dances With Devils: Pakistan and the Taliban

A blogger called MinistryOfTruth writes in the Daily Kos that "Obama has caught more Taliban leaders in 1 month than Bush/Cheney did in 6 years."{someone else also observed this earlier here ; let's also watch the June10 prediction} It must be noted that this roll-up of Taliban leaders, including Taliban chief Mullah Omar's number two guy, Mullah Baradar, would not have been accomplished without the collaboration of Pakistan's House of Spies, the I.S.I. So what's up with that?

But the kids started feeling their oats, and thought, hey, let's take Manhattan, the Bronx and Staten Island, too -- or, in their case, Peshawar, the Swat Valley, and maybe even Islamabad. The I.S.I. seemed like any other parent: they'd lost control of their offspring.

The imprisoned Mullah Baradar and the other captured Taliban further down the food chain may have a new role to play. A report in the Financial Times tells us what to watch for:
As Mr. Baradar contemplates his future, two very different scenarios arise. If his arrest signals a lasting shift towards greater Pakistani co-operation with the US, then he may soon be joined in jail by more of his friends. If Afghanistan draws on its tradition of deal-making to set aside conflicts, there might even be a chance that Mr. Baradar will resurface one day with a post in Kabul.
It may take more than three cups of tea to pull that off, but don't rule it out. Stranger stuff happens all the time out there.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 24 Feb 2010 08:29

FYI
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Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 24 Feb 2010 08:33

Taliban relocating to Karachi, US Senate told

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Feb 2010 09:10

Teaching in mother tongue

East Asian countries like China, Japan, Korea and parts of India, where mother tongues have played a serious role, are much better off than North India (including Pakistan).

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 24 Feb 2010 09:45

Has anyone noticed...SIkander Shaheen is the new Shireen in pants at the Nutty Nation...

Incessant targeting of Pakistan

Nor is this the only targeting of Pakistan and Iran together. In the coming days we should gear up for a new nuclear related hype building up in the US media. Unfortunately, Dr Khan’s “letters” have been purchased by a leading US newspaper and will be used to target Iran. In the process Pakistan will also be targeted - killing two birds with one stone, so to speak. Would that our government undertake some proactive measures with the Iranians to deflect this new campaign but it hardly seems likely. So we need to brace ourselves once again for an onslaught against our nuclear capability and accusations of proliferation at a time when the US continues to proliferate to Israel and, post the 123 Agreement with India, to this South Asian aspiring hegemon.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 24 Feb 2010 09:48

I have been scouring the Net for opinion polls in Pakistan.

Pakistanis can't be a happy lot. Very briefly and off the top of my head Pakis feel the economy is bad, the US is a threat, India is a threat and the situation in Kashmir is a threat.

In the midst of all this one poll says 67% Pakis want better relations with India

There may be at work (in Pakistan) yet another version of the sorcerer's apprentice - where the magic has gone out of control. Pakistani governments have tried their darndest to educate Pakis to believe that India is a threat. We all know that, but let me give you an example of how being told that something is a threat reflects on your own attitudes depending on the seriousness of that threat. (There's piskology coming here)

Perhaps your mum taught you that cockroaches are a yucky threat. Perhaps she also taught you that tigers are a threat.

The first time a cockroach crawled up your leg you screamed, jumped, hated it and eventually got over your "fear" and thumping heart to crush the guy with a chappal or something.

But the tiger? You face a tiger - you will jump/scream etc but after that you can only crap from fear. Your chappal won't save you. In fact only your chappal will be left when the tiger has finished (with) you. Slurrp.

Now Pakis have been taught that India is a threat but have also been taught to consider India like a cockroach - "Ruled by "us" (Muslims) for 1000 years, will run from battle, are scared of gunfire" etc. But what Pakis are figuring out is that this thing they are looking at (India) is no cockroach. It's a tiger.

So if you get past the Paki army's bluster and their Lashkar e G*ndus I am certain there is some very real fear of India. I have a thought here. Oh yes I do agree that there will be some Indians who desire to assuage Pakistani fears and say "We're not so bad" Fine. Let them do their job - they too have a role. But there is another job that other Indians must do to scare the brick out of Paki underwear i.e to talk of what India needs to do to clean up Pakistan. Saalon ko naani ki yaad dilayenge is a godo way of expressing what needs to be done

I think kgoan had something to say about that....

archan · Post by **archan** » 24 Feb 2010 09:59

I think kgaon's idea of having the threads that are clearly "out there" is a good one. There is a need for a team of dedicated users who will carry the threads forward, diligently report OT stuff so we can keep them focused on their clear, narrowly defined thread objectives. Let us try this out. If we need to create an email mailing list for this, then lets do it.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 24 Feb 2010 10:09

Okay for the record, a bit more on IA nibling across the LOC

Mazari's examples: ........ ingresses in Chorbat la (1972); Siachin (1984); Qamar (1988, I am unaware of such a place-possibly called differently by India); Bhimbet (probably Bhimber, 3 km trans LOC) and Marpola around Dras (date not given); Neelum Valley (1994);

Also Musharaff acknowledged the loss of some of these positions, http://www.jammu-kashmir.com/archives/a ... 0327c.html

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Feb 2010 10:11

Pakistani delegation to Feb. 25 talks will include a face reader !

When Pakistani negotiators start their dialogue with the Indians in New Delhi on Wednesday, they will be informally helped by one of their team members who can read the faces of people and predict what they are actually thinking and feeling — an art known as physiognomy.

Director-General for South Asia, Afrasiab Hashmi, may turn out to be a treasured guide for the country’s delegation by reading the faces of the Indian negotiators.Few people know about the God-gifted quality of Hashmi. He is an expert in judging a person’s character or personality from that mans facial characteristics and structure. Physiognomy and its practice dates back to the ancient Greece but was abandoned later.

Hashmi is said to have harboured this skill by birth, not learning through any special courses. It becomes very difficult to hide one’s inner-self in front of Hashmi, people close to him say, though he gives his frank opinions only to frank friends.

The Foreign Office spokesperson confirmed Hashmi’s mastery in face reading but said he was unaware of its utility at the official level.Hashmi, an officer of 12th Common, has previously served as Pakistan’s deputy high commissioner in India, China, Austria and the United Nations in New York. His initial posting after joining the foreign service was in the United Nations where his accurate predictions caught many by surprise.

He also has some skills in predicting the immediate future. The story goes a senior Pakistani diplomat was briefing his junior colleagues on August 16, 1988 about the upcoming visit of the then-president Gen Ziaul Haq to the UN General Assembly. He won’t come, a budding diplomat seated on the backbenches shouted. How do you say so?, his boss inquired worryingly, prompting him to shout the same line again. He then ran outside the room.

Hashmi was nervous, tired and terrified. As he was consoled and when asked he refused to open his lips till Zia’s plane crash made rounds of the whole world the next day.Well before Hashmi had joined the foreign service, Gen Zia knew about his skills and is believed to have sent him a huge portrait of himself out of curiosity to know what’s up for him in the future. Hashmi was then a student of the Government College Lahore.

It couldn’t be known what Hashmi had forecast about Zia at that time. One of his staffers, who served with him in India, shared how a top Indian Army officer was running after Hashmi as he came to know about his skills. These were the early days of Hashmi in India. When he was invited to a reception, also attended by a former army chief, Hashmi shook hands with the uniformed officer and turned to his wife to say hi. As he saw the general’s wife, he pointed out that she was suffering from Migraine. Hashmi said her face was unusual and extraordinary. He had also told her the pain was due to her habit of excessive reading, which surprised her husband who dashed to his residence the next day for further information about his own home affairs.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 24 Feb 2010 10:22

[="SSridhar"]Pakistani delegation to Feb. 25 talks will include a face reader !
When Pakistani negotiators start their dialogue with the Indians in New Delhi on Wednesday, they will be informally helped by one of their team members who can read the faces of people and predict what they are actually thinking and feeling — an art known as physiognomy

What does Hashmi say about inbreeding and retardness in Paki society? Has he done any study on Paki society being number one in child rape, mostly done by close relatives?

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 24 Feb 2010 10:28

Malayappan wrote:Granting that SSS is no Pulitzer winning seeker of truth :

With all due respect, but don't give importance to this Pultizer crap. Repeating pentagon and state dept propaganda laden with some "superficial facts" and winning Pulitzers is no great virtue. A good number of Pultizer prize winners were peddling the Iraqi WMD and "Saddam is going to use bio/chem weapons" lies. And not one of those slime balls has the moral conscience to tell the truth: Iraqi oil loot. And don't forget "embedded reporters" more apt to refer to them as embedded mouthpieces, repeating what Stanley boy tells them and win Pulitzers. And of course, the same mouthpieces are dilgently doing their national duty ganging up on Iran; I am sure Bibi nuttinyahoo will recommed them for Pulitzers. And finally, how many of these Pultizer winning clowns have had the forthrightness to tell it like it is about TSP and the billions their govt has poured into TSP coffers even as the slaughter of Indians continues unabated by TSP-sponsored terrorists? Pultizer, my foot, its not worth a Charmin roll.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Feb 2010 10:28

There used to be a guy in RECW in those days who was face reader and could figure out who was airing vapors by looking at the face. Maybe Hashmi is of same genre.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 24 Feb 2010 10:30

Indian negotiating team members can wear pig mask to hide their face expressions. Let Hashmi work hard by staring at them>

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 24 Feb 2010 10:34

Prem wrote:Indian negotiating team members can wear pig mask to hide their face expressions. Let Hashmi work hard by staring at them>

I was thinking what would he say if asked to read Musharraf

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Feb 2010 10:34

Are you back?

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 24 Feb 2010 10:55

ramana wrote:Are you back?

Yes, came back last night after Lufthansa ditched their most beloved customer and went on strike. I did bring your precious gift of divine blessings from deep South .

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Feb 2010 11:06

Thanks. Will meet up sometime this week.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 24 Feb 2010 11:17

SSridhar wrote:Pakistani delegation to Feb. 25 talks will include a face reader !

Frankly, and with no intention to brag - I too am a "face reader" because I have to read faces all the time along with other body parts.

The thing about face reading is that it is completely useless if the face is not lying. So if you are talking to Paki and you are telling it like it is - your face won't be telling lies and face reading is useless. Better to read Paki faces. they should be more scared.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 24 Feb 2010 11:20

Just make faces at him when he is looking at you

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/2621/face0002fr9.jpg

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 24 Feb 2010 11:32

Subjects just up my street!

Physiognomy ,whose founder was the immortal Johann Lavater,a man who studied the faces of the great men and women of Europe,is not the science of facial fortune telling,but determining a person's character from the facial features.I have discovered another aspect of facial detail which has even escaped even Lavater.It is an absolute truth,a goldmine for HR,which I must keep secret,especially from the Pakis! Another interesting science is phrenology,the study of "skull bumps"! Perhaps the most interesting is that of psycho-graphology,analysing character from handwriting (I once saw a sample of Panditji's handwriting and said that he was a spendthrift,shocking the curator of the Nehru museum who said that I was right as there were letters from his father warning him about his spending habits),which can also indicate illnesses,etc.If the renowned Paki physiognomist is present and tries to predict the future from the Indian faces,let me assure you that his efforts will be a catastrophic failure!

If he however uses the art of body language,quite a science these days,used by the CIA,etc.,etc.,he may have more success at understanding whether our mandarins are speaking the truth or not.I suggest that to unnerve him,our mandarins all wear dark/tinted glasses and keep their hands firmly hidden from his view.Or if they are super smart,deliberately make (false) signs to mislead (as Shiv has suggested) the Paki fakir! Mrs.Rao,are you listening?

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 24 Feb 2010 11:52

shiv wrote:
Yes Terrorist Taliban State of Pakistan sounds good. It has all the elements of Pakistaniyat. Admins?

Maybe I am too naive to understand, but I don't see the point of emphasizing Taliban here. After all, let us say the US had actually managed to eliminate the Taliban permanently during it's Afghan war. Would Pakistan have ceased to be a terrorist state with respect to us as a result? No it would not.

Bringing in "Taliban" to the title is misleading because it can lead to the confused notion that "Talibanism" is responsible for the terrorist nature of the Pakistani state. It is not. Pakis began using terror tactics in Kashmir 50 years before there was either Taliban or Talibanism. Pakistan has used ethnic cleansing and genocide in Bengal a quarter century before the first Taliban came out of it's Madrassas, before it was even operating any Madrassas of the Binori variety with which the term has become synonymous today.

Finally it seems that even internationally there is a growing acceptance of the Taliban as an inevitable stakeholder in the future Kabul dispensation... a total turnaround from the completely isolated pariah regime of 9/12/2001. If this is the case aren't we actually giving credit to the Pakis for a victory that Talib Pakhtuns fought and died to achieve... if we confer a "Taliban" epithet upon the identity of the Terrorist State of Pakistan?

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 24 Feb 2010 12:54

archan wrote:I think kgaon's idea of having the threads that are clearly "out there" is a good one. There is a need for a team of dedicated users who will carry the threads forward, diligently report OT stuff so we can keep them focused on their clear, narrowly defined thread objectives. Let us try this out. If we need to create an email mailing list for this, then lets do it.

I'm up for the email list and subsequent efforts, count me in.

In theory the revised nuclear doctrine could materialize in one possible way as:

1. Revision of No First Use to something along the lines of Russia's new doctrine: nuclear weapons will be used as deemed necessary to deter aggression of any kind against our vital interests.

2. An unambiguous declaration that the stability of the Karzai government in Kabul after the NATO withdrawal from Afghanistan is a vital interest of India, and that any covert or overt aggression or destabilization attempts against it will be considered a threat to our vital interests and responded to accordingly.

3. Thus effectively we will bring the Karzai government in Afghanistan- including whatever Pakhtun elements are co-opted by Karzai's own negotiations (as opposed to an ISI brokered coalition) under the Indian nuclear umbrella.

4. When the first TSPA-strengthened Taliban columns cross the Durand line to reclaim "strategic space" this will give us an immediate causus belli and an opportunity to conduct a massive first strike against TSPA assets, Pakistani strategic weapons sites and ISI terrorist training camps.

4. Any attempted retaliation by the Pakistanis will result in an even more extensive second strike against all large and middle sized Pakistani urban centres.

5. In effect we will make plain our intent to exercise our nuclear deterrent against any repeat of a large scale combined Talib-TSPA invasion of Afghanistan that enabled the quick rise of the Taliban in 1996-99.

This will leave the Pakistanis with only sub-conventional options of terrorism and destabilization against Kabul. Our armed forces and intelligence services will meanwhile assist Afghan intelligence in building it's capability to retaliate against Pakistan through sub-conventional means. The balance of power in Af Pak will thus be maintained even after NATO's withdrawal.

6. With NATO out of the picture in Afghanistan and India's own NWS status widely accepted in the world today, Pakistan will not be able to get out of this situation by negotiating with a gun to it's own head. The West will not care if India nukes Pakistan once it is safely out of the region. "Nuclear Flashpoint" arguments hold no water whatsoever in the post 123 era when India has NSG recognition and civilian nuclear deals with five or six countries. In truth there will be nothing stopping us from conducting a massive first strike against Pakistan, once the US is out of Afghanistan.

6. If the Pakis call our bluff and try to invade Afghanistan, we make short work of the TSPA and it's crown jewels with 50 or 60 Agni, Prithvi and Brahmos delivered warheads within the space of about 6 hours. Phalcons will remain aloft to detect anything incoming that the Pakis actually have a chance to get off the ground.

7. The beauty of this strategy is that the Pakistanis won't see it coming unless they actually believe we would nuke them for Afghanistan's sake. Given our past behavior the very idea is so unlikely that the Pakis will not have prepared themselves for it at all (as compared to an eyeball confrontation with IA along the LoC/IB when they will be loading their nukes onto F16s and shrilly advertising the fact). They will think we are bluffing until they actually see the suns rise at night.

8. The benefits once we have nuked them? Obvious. The Gordian knot of Paki-US dynamics we have been talking so much about, will have been slashed... the only workable solution. US love for it's whore will simply not be an issue anymore... who is the US going to bed at any cost to us, when we have demolished the whorehouse itself?

Besides, in truth, 2 or more of Pakistan's 3.5 friends will secretly heave deep sighs of relief that the migraine is gone for good. In fact our use of a nuclear first strike to solve the Pakistan problem will open up a new spectrum of solutions that they can now freely explore as solutions to their own problems... solutions they never dared consider openly before for fear of the Hiroshima taboo.

Like the guy in a social situation who is the first to belch/fart/yawn/cough... we will be doing the FODP a favour by making it ok for them to do the same also. And once the initial unpleasant odor or noise has cleared... they will thank us for it.

As for PRC... I think they will sense a new urgency to resolve outstanding issues with us and move on to a mutually beneficial relationship, once we have shown the capacity to resolve our own outstanding issues in a proactive manner.

Then we can go on to fulfill our goals of social development, economic growth and cooperation with our neighbours in an environment of genuine peace. As opposed to "peace with Pakistan".

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 24 Feb 2010 13:08

Jamaat-ud-Dawa easily evades ban

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/daw ... -ban-ss-03

Long-haired jihadis toting automatic weapons patrolled a mosque last week as the cleric who heads the militant network blamed for the Mumbai attacks preached inside. The group's supporters collected funds in the courtyard and later marched through this eastern Pakistani city, calling for the death of those who insult Islam.

...

But the group has scored a few wins in court against the government and is up and running again, exposing Islamabad's unwillingness to fully crack down on militants.

The resurgence of the group could chill the first round of peace talks between Pakistan and India since the attacks.

...

Members of Jamaat say there is no link between it and Lashkar. But even Rana Sanaullah Khan, who is the law minister in Punjab, said the two are simply different wings of the same group.

...

Even before the court ruling, however, critics said Pakistan was not aggressively enforcing the ban.

Saeed has exploited the legal limbo and openly challenges the government's attempts to tamp down his group.

On the government's Kashmir Solidarity Day earlier this month, Saeed addressed supporters in Lahore who waved Lashkar flags and shouted ''Here comes Lashkar to kill the Hindus.''

''If America with the help of Nato and all its weapons could not maintain its occupation in Afghanistan, India too will not be able to hold on to Kashmir anymore,'' Saeed told the crowd.

Frustration at the impunity groups like Jamaat seem to enjoy angers some lawmakers.

''It is shocking to see how banned terrorist organisations are allowed to challenge the writ of the state,'' Sherry Rehman, a lawmaker with the ruling party, told parliament on Tuesday.

''What is the point of our innocent civilians and soldiers dying in a borderless war against such terrorists, when armed, banned outfits can hold the whole nation hostage in the heart of Punjab's provincial capital?''

Security and government officials in Lahore offered several reasons for the lack of action against Saeed and his group. They said India had presented no evidence of his involvement in the Mumbai attacks; stressed he was not involved in any of the attacks by militants that have struck Pakistan over the last year, several of them in Lahore; and they said that closing the group's schools would deprive thousands of an education and health care.

But analysts said Pakistan had strategic reasons for not acting against Jamaat.

''Pakistan is keeping these groups as a gray area of its policy, and it will continue doing so long as there are no guaranteed steps from India,'' defense analyst Hasan Askari Rizvi said, referring to moves to resolve the Kashmir dispute. ''Pakistan does not see these groups as completely undesirable if there is no progress on its issues.'' – AP

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 24 Feb 2010 13:34

Gentlemen,much wider issues and moves on the "Great Game" chessboard are being moved .The Indo-Pak situ is a sideshow to what is being planned for the entire subcontinent and Middle east region.Pl. check into this paper/report on the "Impending Explosion: U.S. Intensifies Threats To Russia And Iran".The acute need of the hour for the US is to keep India and Pak from engaging in any spat,with the Paki interests kept first,being the primary priority of the US interests in the sub-continent.If we examine these moves ,then a better understanding of the Indo-Pak imbroglio becomes clearer.

On the 17th Chief of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces General Nikolai Makarov was quoted by his nation's Interfax news agency as stating, "The U.S. is currently conducting two military operations - in Afghanistan and in Iraq. A third one would be a disaster for them. So, as they're tackling their tasks in Iraq and Afghanistan, they could deliver a strike against Iran." [42]

Washington and its NATO allies launched two of the three major wars in the world over the past eleven years in March - against Yugoslavia in 1999 and against Iraq in 2003. The war drums are being pounded anew and the world may be headed for a catastrophe far worse than those in Yugoslavia, Afghanistan and Iraq.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/4/Impe ... 1-935.html

Excerpt:

The Pentagon is simultaneously deploying land-based and ship-based interceptor missiles throughout the Persian Gulf to render Iran incapable of retaliation against massive missile attacks and bombing runs from the U.S. and its allies. [36]

After a five-day tour to Afghanistan and Pakistan to oversee the escalation of the wars in both nations, U.S. National Security Adviser James Jones - former Marine Commandant and NATO Supreme Allied Commander - said that Washington was pursuing tighter sanctions against Iran and revealed what the true purpose of such economic warfare is: "We are about to add to that regime's difficulties by engineering, participating in very tough sanctions," which "could trigger regime change." [37]

On February 14 Chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Michael Mullen arrived in Israel to meet with Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak and military Chief of the General Staff Lieutenant-General Gabi Ashkenazi, and stated that the option of war against Iran "is still on the table." [38]

During his trip it was reported that "Mullen's visit follows a visit last month by U.S. National Security Adviser James Jones and a leaked secret visit two weeks ago by Central Intelligence Agency director Leon Panetta." [39]

In a masterful analysis of the current crisis in Yemen, American professor Robert Prince examined that nation's role in American plans for armed hostilities against Iran.

In addition to "countering Chinese access to Middle East and African oil and gas moves, in the long run Yemen offers the United States strategic access to the Horn of Africa Somalia, Sudan, Kenya all of which are in varying degrees of turmoil and opens the door for expanding the roles of either AFRICOM or NATO not only in the Middle East, but in Africa.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/4/Impe ... 1-935.html

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 24 Feb 2010 13:52

Already India had this psy-ops of nuking Pakistan by first strike. It was so "well received". Well, if forum wants to have a similar version, here is a small help from me.
http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/papers7/paper604.html

In January 2000, the American publication DEFENSE NEWS carried a report quoting an Indian Foreign Ministry Official as saying: “ 'No First Strike’ policy does not mean India will not have a first strike capability. The foundation of deterrence is based on having overwhelming superiority over the enemy to launch nuclear strikes. I would say we are working towards having a first strike capability, but how to exercise this option within the ‘no first strike’ policy will be the subject of political decision making.”

In this connection it may also be useful to draw attention to Michael Krepon’s (Stimson Center USA) observations that: “A doctrine of massive retaliation appears strong and purposeful on paper, or in public declaration. But it is not suited for the fog of war when national leaders seek to avoid unintended escalation.” India too should declare its preference for a first-strike doctrine, if peace is endangered, and not opt for NFU and await destruction of a magnitude that it destroys its ‘second strike’ capability.

The public airing of India's option of foregoing production of Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles (ICBMs) twice within the last few weeks is strategically disconcerting and unwise. These assertions were made by a Joint Secretary of the Ministry of External Affairs during the NRI meet and later by a DRDO official at another seminar.

But we never stopped the Agni programme.

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 24 Feb 2010 14:43

philosophy of one country, one religion, one language generated hatred

A seminar organised by Sindh Graduates Association (SGA) in connection with the International Mother Languages Day, rejected the official lingua franca of calling Pakistan’s all national languages as ‘regional languages’. The seminar proceedings were conducted in different languages including Urdu, Sindhi, Punjabi, Seraiki, Hindko and others as a symbol of respect for all languages of Pakistan.

Speaking on the occasion, renowned Punjabi poet and researcher Ahmad Salim was of the view that language problems and controversies had emerged at the very inception of Pakistan, as one language was promoted at the cost of discouraging the rest of the Pakistani languages. He observed that declaring Urdu as the only one national language and associating it with religion and the two-nation theory sparked language violence and hatred among different ethnicities and cultures within Pakistan.

bart · Post by **bart** » 24 Feb 2010 15:47

Guddu wrote:
Suppiah wrote:How bout Fanatic Barbarian Terrorist Talibanic State of Pakistan thread
or just TTSP (Terrorist taliban state of pakistan), this will maintain continuity of thought with TSP.

I think, as with great brands like Rolls Royce, or Rolex, the name says it all. Simply Pakistan should suffice.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 24 Feb 2010 15:52

India and Pakistan to Resume Diplomatic Talks

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/25/world ... india.html

India’s security establishment is also assessing the recent Pakistani assertiveness in arresting Taliban leaders inside Pakistan.

Few analysts think Pakistan is responding to Indian demands to fight terror. Instead, Pakistan is seen as trying to position itself for when the United States begins negotiating an exit strategy from Afghanistan.

“The India-Pakistan dialogue is only a sideshow,” said K. Subrahmanyam, a leading Indian strategic affairs analyst. “For most Indians, the central issue is India and Pakistan. For me, the central issue is that the Americans are fighting the Taliban groups inside Pakistan.”

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 24 Feb 2010 15:53

amdavadi wrote:How about Islamic Banana republic of pakistan? Also terrorist banana republic of pakistan.

How about Confused Retards Al Pa'astan or C.R.A.P. ?

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Feb 2010 15:58

No Hafiz Saeed issue at talks

On the eve of the Indo-Pak foreign secretary-level talks, Pakistan today said that India's demand for handing over of JuD chief Hafiz Saeed, the mastermind of the Mumbai attacks, should not be bracketed with the parleys as it would be "counter-productive.

"In my view it is better not to view this (tomorrow's talks) from the point of success or failure. Let's wait till tomorrow. There will be more clarity on this tomorrow and we'll take it from there," foreign secretary Salman Bashir told reporters here in reply to a question before leaving for New Delhi.

Responding to a question on India's alleged interference in Balochistan and whether he would raise it during the meeting, Bashir said all this is part of counter-terrorism and if that issue is raised Pakistan will discuss this matter.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 24 Feb 2010 16:04

Is this posted already? (Guess I was actually the first to post)

Even B Raman, who bashed BRF as a Hindutvavadi type place has this to say?

Since then, the Pakistani governments -- first the one headed by Gen Musharraf and then the present one headed by President Asif Ali Zardari [ Images ] -- have been trying to wriggle out of this linkage without meeting much resistance from Dr Manmohan Singh.

In the attempt to wriggle out of this linkage, Musharraf scored Pakistan's first success at his meeting with Dr Manmohan Singh at Havana in September 2006, and Pakistan Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani [ Images ] took this success further at his meeting with Dr Singh at Sharm-el-Sheikh in July, 2009, at which Dr Singh practically conceded Pakistan's point of view that there should not be any linkage.

.....

Dr Singh wriggled out of the Sharm-el-Sheikh agreement not because he realised that he was wrong to have conceded Pakistan's point of view, but because he was taken aback by the public outcry against the concessions made by him to Pakistan.

.....

One can hope for India insisting on the restoration of this linkage only if one sees signs that Dr Manmohan Singh has now come to be convinced that such a linkage is necessary.

One sees no such sign.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 24 Feb 2010 16:19

I am not sure how changing the name of the thread will bring about any change in the situation but if at all we are changing it I would like to suggest associating the word 'terrorist' very firmly with the name Pakistan, instead of using short forms like TSP, when ever we mention it. Let the search engines pick it up every time we mention it and if there is any truth in the words of those who say we at BRF are obsessed with TSP, then Google chacha will start throwing up interesting results for the 'terrorist' word search pretty soon.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Feb 2010 16:37

I do not particularly see a reason for changing the name of this thread.

As Bart said, soon a time will come, Insha Allah, when universally the word terrorism will be superfluous when mentioned along with Pakistan in the same breath. Who knows, English language might add a new word to its rich repertoire.

Till that time, the thread title should carry Terrorism, Pakistan and TSP.

Anyway, that is my personal opinion, not as an Admin.