Indian Naval Discussion

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 03 Dec 2010 13:24

In a year, India will have nuclear triad: Navy chief

NEW DELHI: Only three countries, US, Russia and China, can be said to have fully-operational nuclear weapon triads -- the capability to fire nuclear-tipped missiles from land, air and sea. India will gatecrash into this highly-exclusive club by 2012.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 03 Dec 2010 15:37

X-posted in the Intl. thread,excerpts posted there.Valuable read.

http://www.economist.com/node/17601487? ... 7&fsrc=rss

A special report on China's place in the world
The fourth modernisation
China is becoming a military force to reckon with in the western Pacific. How should America respond?
Dec 2nd 2010 | from PRINT EDITION

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 03 Dec 2010 16:24

‘Guarding our 7,600-km coastline is a challenge’
Hindustan Times

In an exclusive interview with the Hindustan Times, Vice-Admiral Sanjeev Bhasin, flag officer commanding in chief of the Western Naval Command, said securing India’s western coast is the Navy’s biggest challenge

The threat perception of terrorists using the sea route has increased.

India has a huge coastline, stretching 7,600 km, and we have island territories as well. We, along with the Coast Guard, have fortified patrolling. But there are grey areas where [unauthorised] landings can be carried out because the state governments concerned had not kept them under surveillance till 26/11 occurred. A detailed plan has been chalked out with the Coast Guard and the Director General of Lighthouses to revive lighthouses and set up 30 radar stations along the western coast. Trials of two such radar stations have started at Okha and Kandla in Gujarat.

The Navy has found it tough to monitor fishing boats.

This is a weakness identified [and exploited] by the terrorists. About 30,000 fishing boats are registered in Gujarat, 20,000 in Maharashtra, 20,000 in Karnataka and 2,000 in Goa. Radar stations fitted with the Automatic Identification System (AIS) have been planned along the coast. AIS devices will also be installed on these vessels. It is a massive problem and it cannot be taken care of only by the Navy and Coast Guard. We need fishermen’s cooperation; we want them to be our eyes and ears. They have been very cooperative.

What new inductions has the Navy lined and when are they expected to join the fleet?

There are 39 ships on order; 34 of them will be made indigenously. Over the next two years, we’ll see the induction of three ships in the Shivalik, Talwar and Kolkata class of destroyers. Two fleet tankers, Deepak and Shakti, are being made in Italy. The first one will be here this month. Apart from that, there are two survey ships being built indigenously. There has been some delay in the Scorpene submarine project, but we should see it commissioned by 2015.

When is the aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov, renamed Vikramaditya, and the indigenously built aircraft carrier expected to join the fleet?

Vikramaditya’s sea trials are scheduled to start in March 2011. It will join the western fleet by the end of 2012. Six MIG 29K’s — fighter aircraft — that will operate from the carrier are already flying from [the] Goa [naval base]. We will get the remaining aircraft in knock-down state soon and will assemble them at Goa.

As far as the indigenously built carrier is concerned, work is on at the Cochin shipyard. It will be equipped to handle both the MiG 29Ks and the naval version of the indigenously built Light Combat Aircraft. We expect the carrier to be commissioned by 2014.

How do you plan to prop up the naval aviation wing, which was recently criticised by the Comptroller and Auditor General for using non-operational aircraft?

We will have eight Boeing P8I aircraft [for long-range maritime reconnaissance] by January 2013. We plan to buy four more.

A global request for information [the first stage of procurement] has been floated to procure 56 Naval Utility Helicopters to replace the Chetak helicopters. We are also looking at replacing the anti-submarine warfare helicopter, Seaking.

When will we have the nuclear submarine that is being leased from Russia? How will it bolster our submarine capability?

Before getting to the leased submarine, we have our own indigenously built submarine, INS Arihant. Extensive sea trials are on. As far as the Akula-II class submarines, we plan to name it INS Chakra, and we should have it shortly.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 Dec 2010 22:39

Isnt it Navy Day today Dec 3?

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 03 Dec 2010 23:01

ramana wrote:Isnt it Navy Day today Dec 3?

Dec 4th

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 Dec 2010 23:42

Oh. OK.

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 05 Dec 2010 04:54

Latest of Vikramaditya
http://pilot.strizhi.info/2010/12/02/9041

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 05 Dec 2010 05:14

Transas Marine Pacific starts upgrading of ECDIS on Indian Navy ships

Transas Marine Pacific has successfully started upgrading Indian Naval vessels to its latest Multifunction Display 4000 MFD series as a proof of concept. In 2007 Transas supplied 139 Navi-Sailor 3000 ECDIS-I systems to the Indian Navy fleet under the contract with the Republic of India Ministry of Defence along with M/S Elcome Marine Services Pvt Ltd, India as the service partner. In continuation of successful cooperation between Transas Marine Pacific and Indian Navy, the frontline ships are now upgraded to 4000 MFD incorporating ECDIS, Radar and Conning.

The main advantage of the 4000 MFD concept is the integration and sharing of the radar image and other data amongst the workstations connected to the network, such as charts and databases, sensor data, radar data, route and voyage plan data, alarms and warnings, BNWAS, track history and electronic logbook. Transas is proud of a partnership with such a prestigious military organisation as the Indian Ministry of Defence and look forward for continuous cooperation.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 05 Dec 2010 05:23

Despite Scorpene delay, DCNS looks for more projects
The Hindu

Even as the Scorpene submarine project, which France cites as a unique example of its successful collaboration with India, is behind schedule, Direction des Constructions Navales (DCN) Shipyard hopes to take part in the future programmes of the Indian Navy.

One of the reasons for the delay in the Scorpene project is that besides being huge, it is a complex as well as challenging programme. “This programme is challenging both for the competence and industrial means involved… technical… integration of large teams of personnel from different countries… we faced teething problems,” Bernard Buisson, Chief of DCNS-India, told The Hindu. Earlier this week, Chief of the Naval Staff Admiral Nirmal Verma said that as per the revised schedule, the first submarine was expected to be with the Navy by 2015, and the last by 2018.

The MDL plans to cut the time lag in building the subsequent submarines from 12 to 9 months to make up for the delay. Mr. Buisson said the MDL were done with the work on the hulls of the first and second submarines; the hulls for the third and fourth were being built. The frame to receive the hulls for the fifth and six submarines was being made. The outfitting work was also progressing, and the work on the combat system equipment for the first submarine would be completed this year.

TECHNOLOGY TRANSFER

Besides transferring the technical data package, DCNS was working with the MDL to establish a group of suppliers for indigenisation of P75. It also hoped to be part of the next line of six submarines to be built under P75I, which the government cleared this year. While two will be built at overseas yards, three will be made in India. Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL), which was handed over to the Defence Ministry this year, will build one, entering a new area, as thus far it has been only into repairing submarines. The DCNS hopes to get a look-in, having responded to the Request for Information. Sources in the Navy said the Request for Proposal could be ready by the next few months.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 05 Dec 2010 07:06

shukla wrote:‘Guarding our 7,600-km coastline is a challenge’
When will we have the nuclear submarine that is being leased from Russia? How will it bolster our submarine capability?

Before getting to the leased submarine, we have our own indigenously built submarine, INS Arihant. Extensive sea trials are on. As far as the Akula-II class submarines, we plan to name it INS Chakra, and we should have it shortly.

Maybe its just me, but the difference in the way that the IN's Chief actually wants to talk about the INS Arihant first rather than the Russian Akula, pretty much shows up the difference in attitudes of the IN and IAF. The IAF Chief is always rather reluctant in discussing the LCA in all his interviews while being much more talkative about the foreign MRCA. The pride in the IN Chief's tone is quite evident and this is truly a tribute to the IN's vision and dogged determination to get maximum indigenisation of its fleet.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 05 Dec 2010 07:47

Kartik wrote: ---
Maybe its just me, but the difference in the way that the IN's Chief actually wants to talk about the INS Arihant first rather than the Russian Akula, pretty much shows up the difference in attitudes of the IN and IAF. The IAF Chief is always rather reluctant in discussing the LCA in all his interviews while being much more talkative about the foreign MRCA. The pride in the IN Chief's tone is quite evident and this is truly a tribute to the IN's vision and dogged determination to get maximum indigenisation of its fleet.

Its not just you. I had the same reaction but didn't say anything in the LCA thread because it would seem repetitive.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 05 Dec 2010 12:47

SNaik wrote:Latest of Vikramaditya
http://pilot.strizhi.info/2010/12/02/9041

Damn! Those are some interesting images - are those still the old MiG-29ks on deck?

Or are they the new ones? I thought they'd have all this off for the refit?

Based on shape of canopy and spine, I'd wager they are the originals - after all this time!

CM.

arunsrinivasan · Post by **arunsrinivasan** » 05 Dec 2010 14:11

Just saw this on aroor's blog FWIW

Russians Give Indian Navy Big MiG-29K Induction Troubles

Hardly surprising anymore. Sources indicate that the MiG-29K induction experience is proving to be a real nuisance, with the Russians nitpicking over contractual provisions and delaying smooth operations at the Black Panthers squadron in Goa. I've been requested by my sources not to put down the precise nature of the problems, though suffice it to say that the Indian Navy is not in the least pleased with how the Russians are executing and following up on the K contract.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 05 Dec 2010 16:22

China's ASBM Programme Matter of Concern: Navy Chief
Outlook India

India today said China's programme for developing an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) is a matter of concern and that it needed to look at its deployment and put in place a mechanism to counter it. "As far as a weapon like ASBM is concerned, if it is operationally fielded, certainly it is a matter of concern," Navy Chief Admiral Nirmal Verma said at a press conference here on being asked about his assessment of China's programme in this regard. However, he said, India had to watch for the areas that these ASBMs would be operationally fielded and come out with an answer for this threat to its warships, particularly the two Carrier Battle Groups (CBGs) it plans to have in the future.

"The areas in which it (ASBM) will be deployed in our area of operation is something we need to look at. And certainly we need to have something in place with respect to ASBM-type of weapon and we will put it in place," he said.

Asked about China's venture into the Indian Ocean Region, Verma said since both India and China's economies were growing, there was a need for the protection of the sea lanes of communication. "The feeling of protecting the sea lanes is there in both countries. But, as far as Indian Navy is concerned, we keep the security scenario in mind before making our plans," he said.

On China building ports for Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, the Navy Chief said there were several Indian Ocean countries that sought help for building their infrastructure and that some or the other bigger nations in the region would certainly provide that help. He said it was no different with Sri Lanka or Bangladesh. But, he said, there was a huge difference between building a port and using them for their own military or economic purposes by these foreign powers. "And it has been amply made clear by these countries that someone is building the port and not using them," he added.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 05 Dec 2010 16:30

Kartik wrote: ..<snip>.. this is truly a tribute to the IN's vision and dogged determination to get maximum indigenisation of its fleet.

Further testimony to that fact..

India's first warship design centre to reduce dependency
Sify news

With the inauguration of the country's first warship design centre at Challiyar in Kerala's Kozhikode district in 18 months, 75 percent of the Indian Navy's vessels would be made in the country itself - reducing the dependency on other nations, an official said. Defence Minister A.K. Antony has been for long speaking of indigenising military hardware and this is one step towards that. 'In this centre, the design for warships will be drawn up and a prototype will be made. Once this is approved, the manufacture of ships can be taken up by the shipyards,' Kerala State Industrial Development Corporation (KSIDC) managing director Alkesh Kumar Sharma told IANS.

'At the moment, the ships of the Indian Navy are only around 25 percent indigenised. Through this new design centre, that would go up to as high as 75 percent,' he added. The foundation stone for the design centre will be laid next month, the official said. The Rs.600 crore (around $133 million) project will be set up under the defence ministry with the full support of three major ports in the country. The Kerala industries department will play the role of the local facilitator. Sharma said the state's share would be limited to the extent of the 41 acres of land that has been provided.

'The major participating companies in this mega project include Mazagon Dock Ltd and the Goa Shipyard. They will have a share in the equity, with the central government also chipping in,' he said. Due to Antony's efforts, the project has come to Kerala, which of late has seen a string of central projects setting up shop in the state. Kerala Industries Minister Elamaram Kareem said the state government has fulfilled the role assigned to it. 'The land for the project has been handed over and we have done what we were supposed to do,' said Kareem, who is happy as the project is to come up in his home district.

Another highlight of the project is that a training centre also is planned to be set up to enable professionals to be groomed in all aspects of warship building. 'More than the direct jobs, this industry provides for a wide range of ancillary industries to come up and it is here that the trained manpower will be able to find a good number of jobs,' Sharma said.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 05 Dec 2010 20:48

without any doubt the most impressive picture of the Mig-29k so far. although the report has some bad news.

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2010/12/ru ... g-29k.html

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 05 Dec 2010 23:59

Interview: Mig-29K, N-Tejas

shanksinha · Post by **shanksinha** » 06 Dec 2010 00:50

^^^ The afore mentioned Aroor's "report" begins with an opinionated sentence and quickly ends with show words like Big Trouble, and the so called source actually requests not to go into anything concrete. Wouldn’t be surprising at all if this "source” turns out be someone from Lockheed Martin or Boeing. Trash reporting at its best.

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 06 Dec 2010 00:52

^^^Kartik: "Maybe its just me, but the difference in the way that the IN's Chief actually wants to talk about the INS Arihant first rather than the Russian Akula, "

That and the fact that the Arihant is here. The Akula is still 'on its way' just like the Vik which is now slated to arrive December 2012. We'll be lucky to see it arrive in 2013 if the past is anything to go by. IMHO, we are likely to see IAC 1 before the Vik.

The Russians just don't believe in adhering to contracts. I shudder to think of all the frustration we'll be expressing as and when we sign the PAK-FA/FAK-PA 'development contract'.

With delays and problems like these, who needs sanctions?

The MiG-29K problem is just another indication of how badly the Russian supply chain is fractured. They have to buy Mistrals for amphibious ops and UAVs from Israel. During the Georgia war, the Russian soldiers were asking journalists for directions because they had non-working radios and lacked GPS.

negi · Post by **negi** » 06 Dec 2010 01:05

^ What is the issue with Mig-29K , do we even know as of now what the fuss is all about ? . Btw Arihant is there and Ru has a fair share in it, so what gives ?

shanksinha · Post by **shanksinha** » 06 Dec 2010 01:07

What is this MiG 29K problem? Do blog posts naming unkown sources constitute a Problem? Its in marked contrast to the things said in the interview posted by Austin. Anyway in the precious few sentences Aroor devotes to this latest "MiG problem" never mention any supply chain related issues but only a hazy reference to nitpicking on contract.

Its no secret that Russian military industrial complex went haywire in 1990s and certainly everything isnt hunky dory today. But then these are not 1990s and things havent remained the same either.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 06 Dec 2010 02:02

Austin wrote:Interview: Mig-29K, N-Tejas

Thanks Austin. I think that this one para illustrates everything about the IN that has been extolled so much on BRF and the IAF really really does need to take a leaf out of their book.

How effective can the LCA Navy be for carrier-based roles given that it is only an eight ton platform? What endurance can it have and what loads can it carry?

I wish we could straightaway develop a Rafale. But seriously, we have to look at the Indian Navy and its commitment towards indigenisation. I agree that we have made a modest start, but it has been a huge learning experience. LCA Navy will remain a modest platform with an uprated engine which will give us adequate capability at sea. It may not be what we want but it is our own aircraft. We are committed to being a builder’s navy. While it is easy to buy from abroad, sometimes it is extremely difficult to support those platforms. Our past experiences tell us that it is worth committing resources to develop our own assets.

If only the IAF had men at the top who believed in this philosophy, right back in the 1970s-80s. They might have then been more than just an end-user who can afford to be critical, aloof and rather dis-interested in the rigour, hard work, labour and (sometimes sheer disappointment) of doing one's own R&D. There are many dividends to such effort of course, and I hope that the IAF learns that it has to be a stake-holder and deputise high-level and empowered teams to HAL/ADA right from the beginning. Once they have a feeling of the product being their own as well, they will tend be more balanced in their opinion rather than simply being critical when things don't pan out just as they expected.

the IN's attitude in this case is more like that of the PAF, which supported the JF-17 to the hilt, even though its a mediocre platform at best. And they have even less to do with the JF-17 than what we had to do with the Su-30MKI (not a single worthwhile part on the JF-17 is of Paki origin). Maybe its a case of lower budgets making people more pragmatic.

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 06 Dec 2010 02:30

Kartik wrote: the IN's attitude in this case is more like that of the PAF, which supported the JF-17 to the hilt, even though its a mediocre platform at best. And they have even less to do with the JF-17 than what we had to do with the Su-30MKI (not a single worthwhile part on the JF-17 is of Paki origin). Maybe its a case of lower budgets making people more pragmatic.

While I agree that IN's attitude has been most commendable, it would be wrong to compare IN to PAF in this regard. PAF went for JF-17 because they had no other choice. It was either JF-17 or J-7. Other than that, there was no alternative.
Compare that to IN. Even with its lower budget, IN could have easily gone for more Mig-29ks, Rafales etc if it had wanted to.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 06 Dec 2010 02:48

not sure what exactly drove this mindset but even in 80's every CNS was speaking of being a 'builder's navy'. it's a long term vision that has been institutionalized and the results are for all to see.
while we have been making guns, tanks and fighters under license for donkey years, only in case of warships have we seen a well laid out plan that has been taken to its conclusion. from the rather average license built leanders to the shivaliks and kolkata's of today has been a difficult journey yet one that has seen the support of successive generations of naval officers.
had there not been the HDW scam and consequent knee jerk reactions from the politicians we would have had our own SSK designs rolling out of MDL by now.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 06 Dec 2010 03:06

negi wrote:^ What is the issue with Mig-29K , do we even know as of now what the fuss is all about ? . Btw Arihant is there and Ru has a fair share in it, so what gives ?

There seem to be multiple entities in "Russia" (as there are at least two in China)(as there must be in all countries - nothing new to Russia). Instead of going with Arihant, let us go to a simpler level: Sukhoi vs. MiG. Tho' under the same roof, for some odd reason, they seem to act rather differently.

However, what seems to be common to all of them seems to "contractual". I translate this as funds. As India has grown economically Russia seems to be sqeezing (nothing wrong with it) more funds out of India. However, IN seems to put her foot down every time. Happened with the Talwar IIRC, now the nuke sub training, .............. IN does not take custody of a product until satisfied. (Perhaps IAF is also that tenacious.)

negi · Post by **negi** » 06 Dec 2010 03:11

Rahul one of the factors responsible for above is large presence of ex naval personnel in the private ship building industry also there are several small sized companies run by ex IN guys which are preferred partners of sorts for the IN when it comes to carrying out repairs/maintenance or even supply of spares.

negi · Post by **negi** » 06 Dec 2010 03:23

NRao Sukhoi and Mikoyan have merged some time back and as far as India is concerned the front office with which MoD deals with is 'Rosoboronexport' also if this is contract related then I am afraid to say this plagues all our deals irrespective of the supplier country in question all in all more than the supplier itself it tests the ability of the MoD/GoI to dodge such maneuvering. And btw if you go by CAG reports even cost per unit for MKIs has escalated, so what gives ?

We do not know what the issue with Mig-29K deal is , I would wait for more information .

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 06 Dec 2010 03:40

Austin wrote:Interview: Mig-29K, N-Tejas

How many fighters have you got already and how many more are expected in what time frame?
India has contracted for MiG-29K in two phases. The first contract was for 16 aircraft followed by another for 29. The delivery of the first phase has started and we have got six aircraft here. By the middle of next year, we expect all the 16 aircraft to be here.

What is the induction schedule for the MiG-29Ks?
The first contract is for 16 aircraft. Six have already come, of which we have accepted four and we expect others to follow shortly. I understand that we have signed a subsequent contract for 29 additional MiG-29Ks. This should cater for, I believe, two squadrons and adequate reserves.

what is the meaning of 'accepting' only Four out of Six.

Anoop · Post by **Anoop** » 06 Dec 2010 06:33

Perhaps the IN's commitment to indigenization comes the high cost per platform, as compared to the IAF's and the IA's? This limits the number of platforms it can purchase and needs to field. Plus, the IN with the exception of the past couple of years, when it has deployed extensively for anti-piracy missions and joint exercises, has enjoyed a relatively peace-time tenure compared to the IA and to some extent the IAF, giving them time to plan ahead. Also, until a couple of years ago when the expansion of the PLAN took it to the Indian Ocean, the IN needed to count only the PN as it's adversary over which it enjoyed a significant edge, giving it time for proper perspective planning.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 Dec 2010 08:09

It would be good if Shiv Aroor quotes his source by stating this C0 or Admiral said this is the problem with 29K , it lends credibility to stories and you can trace it to the person for accountibility pretty much fair and square
Else it could be the case like Ajai Shukla source in LM who thinks mmrca should be scrapped for JSF , jurnos are entitled to their personal opinion but serious allegation should be backed up by named source or documents.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 06 Dec 2010 08:41

direct naming would not be feasible - our system is too effed up to allow frankness

If some rank is mentioned,problem is that it can be checked and the source narrowed down and sometimes the concerned officer can get into trouble. The OSA hangs like a sword on top of everything. MI sometimes can be effective

Two extremely good men had their military careers ruined by one of our Delhi based journalist with a well known mag. Luckily they have continued on with think tanks.

but the other side of it with the integrity of journalists in the toilet how does one believe them.

no easy answers.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 Dec 2010 09:14

A good journalist would verify the story and if there is some truth to it he may not name the source but would take opinion from all sides say the MOD,OEM and experts ( retd Admirals,Air Chief etc ) and present a view from all sides and let its reader decide and come to some conclusion. In this way he maintains his integrity and protects his source.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 06 Dec 2010 09:18

Kanson wrote:
Austin wrote:Interview: Mig-29K, N-Tejas

How many fighters have you got already and how many more are expected in what time frame?
India has contracted for MiG-29K in two phases. The first contract was for 16 aircraft followed by another for 29. The delivery of the first phase has started and we have got six aircraft here. By the middle of next year, we expect all the 16 aircraft to be here.

What is the induction schedule for the MiG-29Ks?
The first contract is for 16 aircraft. Six have already come, of which we have accepted four and we expect others to follow shortly. I understand that we have signed a subsequent contract for 29 additional MiG-29Ks. This should cater for, I believe, two squadrons and adequate reserves.
what is the meaning of 'accepting' only Four out of Six.

After going through madatory inspection by IN , they probably found out some defects/problems in the rest , or the rest are waiting to under the inspection by IN

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 Dec 2010 11:33

I think these are flown in CKD format and they are assembled here by OEM the necessary flight testing takes place and then the Navy accepts it once its satisfied.

narayana · Post by **narayana** » 06 Dec 2010 12:11

shukla wrote:Despite Scorpene delay, DCNS looks for more projects

If we are absorbing the tech of scorpenes, why dont we go for the 6+6 for same price offer?,New subs can be added without delay because of P75I

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 Dec 2010 12:38

^^ Indeed and that is what I have been advocating for long , it makes logistical sense and keeps the inventory ,weapons and shore and training facility as standardised as possible , instead of opting for another design like Amur or U-214 it would always be expensive to operate two different types with its nuances.

There is no great tactical advantage in operating submarine of two different design but it simply burdens your operating and maintenance cost.

I think a large Scorpene design with AIP like Spanish S-80 will be an ideal choice for P-75I.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 06 Dec 2010 14:34

My neighbour's cook's cousin's co-brother's second wife's lover's third mistress,who has a distant relative in Goa,said that his feni supplier told him that he overheard while delivering hooch to the kitchen staff at Dabolim,that a waiter at the mess overheard a pilot's wife saying,"Aaiyo,all instructions are written in Russian men,who can understand?!"
However,in a recent conversation with a man in know,things are "going well".Whom does one believe?

I dare say that with every new induction,and the IN is just beginning its happy sojourn with the Fulcrum,never having operated Russian fighters before,helos in service though,that there will be niggling problems at the start,only to be expected.The plus point is that we have two years before the Gorky/Vik is commissioned.During this period,all niggling hitches can and will be sorted out well in time allowing for the IN to train its pilots extensively and hone its skills well in advance of the carrier's arrival.As for only Russian products giving us problems,what about US fire-control radars and the Army's angst,Scorpene's delay and cost overruns,Derby missile's non-performance,etc.,etc.? I am sure that if the IN is unhappy with the MIG-29K after operating its first batch,it may want another aircraft for its future carriers.

saurav.jha · Post by **saurav.jha** » 06 Dec 2010 15:04

Philip wrote:My neighbour's cook's cousin's co-brother's second wife's lover's third mistress,who has a distant relative in Goa,said that his feni supplier told him that he overheard while delivering hooch to the kitchen staff at Dabolim,that a waiter at the mess overheard a pilot's wife saying,"Aaiyo,all instructions are written in Russian men,who can understand?!"
However,in a recent conversation with a man in know,things are "going well".Whom does one believe?

.

Thats a very credible source..Cant be wrong

This seems to be yet another propaganda started due to god knows what reason..
Russians are not foolish (not yet ) to behave like this when they have much more important FGFA and P-75I ahead..

SriSri · Post by **SriSri** » 06 Dec 2010 17:39

Navy Launches Fourth Naval Offshore Patrol Vessel - NOPV Sumitra

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 06 Dec 2010 17:47

Sri,any pics available? Can these OPVs also launch Danush as in the earlier OPVs?