Aircraft Recognition

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 01 Oct 2010 19:36

Shameek wrote:
atreya wrote:The only difference I can spot in the Mitsubishi F2 and the F-16 is the canopy. Which then makes it hard to distinguish from the Lavi. Help!
Shiv has addressed the doubt. The Lavi is actually more similar in configuration to the J-10. (or vice versa)

Yes the J-10 has some heavy Lavi inputs.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 01 Oct 2010 21:55

Great thread! yearning for Bears, A10s/frogfoots, Storch successors, 707/herky airframe based shadowy crafts and other ugly looking workhorses like the above

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 00:17

nachiket wrote:
shiv wrote:Tubes with wings. Can anyone recall any others?
Republic F-84 Thunderjet

First fighter to utilize in-flight refueling.

Its swept wing brother the F-84F Thunderstreak.

Another larger image
http://www.usgennet.org/usa/mo/county/s ... /f-84f.jpg

Su-17

How about a pic of SU 22, the swing-wing version of SU 17 ?

K

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 07:46

Twin Tailboom aircraft (post WW2)

De Havilland Vampire - India's first combat jet

Hawker Siddeley Sea Vixen

Fairchild Packet

Cessna Skymaster

Sukhoi Su 80

Twin Tailboom Helo Ka-26

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 02 Oct 2010 07:58

^ Continuing the series.

Adam - A500 (civilian)

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 02 Oct 2010 08:12

North American OV-10D Bronco

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 08:13

nachiket wrote:North American OV-10 Bronco

Lovely - I forgot that one!

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 02 Oct 2010 08:27

Kersi D wrote: How about a pic of SU 22, the swing-wing version of SU 17 ?

K

Kersi saar, the Su-17 was a swing-wing version of the original Su-7. The Su-20 was its export (read downgraded) version. The Su-22 was a Russo-French upgrade of the Su-17 with a Phazotron/Thomson Phantom radar, new avionics, HOTAS controls etc. minus the laser rangefinder. I am not aware of any structural differences.

Su-17/20/22 Fitter

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 08:37

I was next going to make a list of swing wing aircraft. Does anyone want to have a go?

Does anyone want to make list of trainers? Helicopters of various types? Transports?

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 02 Oct 2010 10:41

a gent wants a list of helos and UAVs we might encounter. I will do that for PLAAF.

Pratik_S · Post by **Pratik_S** » 02 Oct 2010 11:05

shiv wrote: The Lavi has canards.

The F2 and F-16 are almost the same - teh F2 was derived from the F 16

the following Wiki illustrates the differences

Thanks for the comparative image, never knew that the F-2 was bigger in size than the F-16 !

Bala Vignesh · Post by **Bala Vignesh** » 02 Oct 2010 12:51

The F2 beats The Falcon in all aspects except in the engine thrust...

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 14:37

Rahul M wrote:a gent wants a list of helos and UAVs we might encounter. I will do that for PLAAF.

Thanks. I would appreciate any contributions to the thread. As we move on to trainers, transports and helo we are hitting territory that has not fascinated me personally as much as combat aircraft so my depth and breath of knowledge is lower. My lists get smaller. For example if you look at amphibian aircraft - I can offhand recognise and name only a handful.

I am still hunting for a suitable method of clubbing together helos that look similar to aid recognition, but am hampered by no recalling all the relevant makes/names. So I will need to pull out my books again. My own helo recognition skills are only passable. For example in the movies or on TV - I cannot definitely identify a helicopter that is shown.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 14:47

The following photo by member Bolasani posted the Misc photos thread is a classic example of my helo recognition disability. After some guesswork and digging into my memory I figured it must be a "Schweizer" S 300 or something.

I am not sure. It can be seen flying around HAL in Bangalore

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 02 Oct 2010 16:46

IL-78 Midas

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 02 Oct 2010 16:59

Airbus A330 MRTT

CLICK HERE for Large Size Image

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 18:08

shiv wrote:
For example if you look at amphibian aircraft - I can offhand recognise and name only a handful.

Come on Dr Shiv. Do not be modest. There are only a handful of amphibians in the past decades, post WWII.

Today Bombardier (formerly Canadair) and Beriev are perhaps the only manufacturers. Shorts Bros UK were a noted manufacturer, correct me.

Our old ( Yes he is OLD !! ) friend Philip is very keen on IN getting amphibian aircraft on which I support him. Philip can surely help out.

I more suggestion. Make this a STICKY thread. Subsequently make this thread into an archive / article that future BR members can use it easily

K

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 18:17

shiv wrote:
I am still hunting for a suitable method of clubbing together helos that look similar to aid recognition, but am hampered by no recalling all the relevant makes/names. So I will need to pull out my books again. My own helo recognition skills are only passable. For example in the movies or on TV - I cannot definitely identify a helicopter that is shown.

Suggestions. Categorise the a/c as

SIZE, maximum Take Off Weight
Upto 5 T, eg Mi 2
5 T to 10 T
10 T to 20 T
Beyond 20 T eg CH 53 ?,

FUNCTION
Utility, civil
Utility, military eg. Mi 8 / Mi 17
Utility, civil & military eg. Drruv
Attack eg Rooivalk, AH 1, AH 64
Anti Submarine, SH 3, Seaking, Mi 14

SPECIAL CONFIGURATION
Flying crane, Mi 12
Tandem Rotors (without tail rotors) eg. CH 46, CH 47

Do not forget my favourite, Mi 12

K

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 18:31

Can a I list out some ac not seen above ? At least I have not seen them.Ganntet

1) The Blackburn Buccaneer. It is one of the few post WWII ac to have an internal weapons bay.

2) Seahawk & Alize of IN 1971 fame

3) Gannet. Maybe we should list out all shipboard prop driven

4) The V bombers, Valiant and Victor. Vulcan was listed in the delta wing ac.

5) SU 24 'Fencer'

6) SU 25 'Frogfoot'

How about 'special' ac like

1) U 2

2) YAK 25 'Mandrake'

And what about the BEST ac UK NEVER had, TSR 1

K

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 02 Oct 2010 18:35

Here is a list of the common swing wing aircraft:

MiG 23 Flogger

MiG 27 Flogger D

Grumman F-14 Tomcat

Su 17/20/22 Fitter

General Dynamics F-111 Aardvaark

Panavia Tornado

Rockwell B-1B Lancer

Tu 160 Blackjack

Tu 22 Backfire

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 18:40

[quote="Shameek"]Here is a list of the common swing wing aircraft:

MiG 23 Flogger

MiG 27 Flogger D

Grumman F-14 Tomcat

Su 17/20/22 Fitter

General Dynamics F-111 Aardvaark

Panavia Tornado

Rockwell B-1B Lancer

Tu 160 Blackjack

Tu 22 Backfire

No FB 111 seen till now ?

What about a very uncommon swing ac, the Mirage G ?

K

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 02 Oct 2010 19:12

Some more swing wing aircraft:

Su 24 Fencer

Dassault Mirage G

Bell X-5

Grumman Jaguar

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 19:44

Kersi D wrote:Can a I list out some ac not seen above ? At least I have not seen them.Ganntet

1) The Blackburn Buccaneer. It is one of the few post WWII ac to have an internal weapons bay.

2) Seahawk & Alize of IN 1971 fame

3) Gannet. Maybe we should list out all shipboard prop driven

4) The V bombers, Valiant and Victor. Vulcan was listed in the delta wing ac.

5) SU 24 'Fencer'

6) SU 25 'Frogfoot'

How about 'special' ac like

1) U 2

2) YAK 25 'Mandrake'

And what about the BEST ac UK NEVER had, TSR 1

K

You can tell an old codger by the kinky things he thinks of..

Yes I was going to put a few of these in a "oddball" category. Buccanneer is definitely oddball. But thnaks - you have expanded teh oddball list

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 02 Oct 2010 20:08

shiv wrote:The following photo by member Bolasani posted the Misc photos thread is a classic example of my helo recognition disability. After some guesswork and digging into my memory I figured it must be a "Schweizer" S 300 or something.

I am not sure. It can be seen flying around HAL in Bangalore

You are right shiv, it is a Sikorsky/Schweizer 300, formerly known as the Hughes 300. Schweizer is now a subsidiary of Sikorsky.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 20:12

nachiket wrote: You are right shiv, it is a Sikorsky/Schweizer 300, formerly known as the Hughes 300. Schweizer is now a subsidiary of Sikorsky.

I knew that shape as a Hughes helicopter - but the change of hands of company threw me off track.

A lot of things have changed from the old days and many companies have now been consolidated into super-firms. Names like McDonnell and Douglas have all gone.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 02 Oct 2010 20:34

A (incomplete) list of transports (post WW2). Please add.

C-119 Flying Boxcar

C-124 Globemaster II

C-133 Cargomaster

C-130 hercules

C-141 Starlifter

C-5 galaxy

C-17 Globemaster III

Antonov An-12

Antonov An-22

Antonov An-26

More coming..

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 02 Oct 2010 20:51

Antonov An-32 (IAF)

Antonov An-70

Antonov An-72

Antonov An-124 Ruslan

Antonov An-225 Mriya (Largest aircraft ever built)

Alenia C-27J Spartan

Il-76

Transall C-160

Kawasaki C-1

C-2 Greyhound

C-1 Trader

Airbus A400M

Missed an important one

Boeing C-135 Stratolifter

Probably missed several others. Please fill in the gaps.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 02 Oct 2010 21:21

Attack helicopters (heavy)

American

AH-64 Apache

AH 1 SuperCobra

AH-1Z Viper (upgrade of SuperCobra, can be identified with 4 blade rotor)

Russian

Mil Mi 24

Mil Mi 28 (Similar to Mi 24, can be differentiated by the nose; this one has nose sensors)

Kamov Ka 50

more coming.....

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 21:25

Please try and select images to fit the forum window for ease of comparison.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 02 Oct 2010 21:28

I edited my post for that very reason! The Ka 50 is still big for the window, but couldn't find a better one. Please edit if some does.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 02 Oct 2010 21:40

Transports

Shorts Skyvan

CASA 212

Hawker Siddeley Andover

De Havilland Caribou

CASA/ITPN (Indonesia) CN 235

Shorts Belfast

Do 328 Turboprop

Do 328 Jet

Avro 748

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 02 Oct 2010 21:53

European

Agusta A129 Mangusta (Italy)

Eurocopter Tiger/Tigre (differentiated from Mangusta by the sharper nose)

Westland Apache (British version of Apache Longbow, very hard to spot the difference. Need help here. I guess colour is different)

Other

Denel AH2 Rooivalk (South Africa) (Similar to the Mangusta, but this one has round intakes and cockpit glass is a bit rounded)

HAL Light Combat Helicopter (technically, a light attack heli, but included here nevertheless)

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 02 Oct 2010 22:02

atreya wrote:Mil Mi 28 (Similar to Mi 24, can be differentiated by the nose; this one has nose sensors)

There are some more ways to differentiate the two.
- The Hind has windows since it can carry troops. The Havoc is a pure attack heli.
- The Hind has a retractable undercarriage.
- The nose gun assembly is different.

The Havoc is more like an Apache. Both are equally ugly.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 02 Oct 2010 22:48

Chotu Ustad , Sukhoi SA-20P

neerajb · Post by **neerajb** » 02 Oct 2010 22:52

nachiket wrote: C-119 Flying Boxcar

C-82 Packet. C-119 Flying boxcar was developed from C-82. 2004 movie "The flight of the Phoneix" shows C-119 whereas the original novel with the same name had C-82. This was done purely for aesthetic appeal.

Cheers....

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 23:08

Shiv,

I remember on more delta wing, the Gloster Javelin.

And what about the REAL pioneers.

The Gloster Meteor

The Me 262

And the rocket fired M 163.

Any pics ?

Kersi

neerajb · Post by **neerajb** » 02 Oct 2010 23:12

C-123. Aircraft used in Con Air.

Cheers....

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 23:14

There was an VTOL ac Hawker Siddeley Kestrel, P 1127, which subsequently became the Harrier

Kersi

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Oct 2010 23:23

May a give a few more names, as I remember them, taxing my biological ROM / RAM / HDD / FDD etc.

French Sud Aviation Vatour. I think it was also supplied to Israel. Just for info Sud Aviation are the designers/manufacturers of the famous Caravelle jet passenger ac which served with the Indian Airlines too.

There were a few USAF / USN ac called Banshee, Demon, Cutlass, Phantom (not THE F 4). Do not know anything more them.

Kersi

Victor · Post by **Victor** » 03 Oct 2010 04:25

Hindustan HF-24 Marut

Helwan HA-300

Couple of jet designs by famous WW2 German designers-- India's HF-24 Marut by Kurt Tank of FW190 fame and Egypt's Helwan HA-300 by Willy Messerschmitt of BF109 fame. Both were hobbled by underpowered engines and never made it.