Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad - News & Analysis

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 May 2012 02:05

Indian muslims trying some thing old!

Reshaping Islam for the modern age

Are they kidding? Its more back to the future.

Agnimitra · Post by **Agnimitra** » 18 May 2012 09:06

Nation of Islam brings the gift of Two Nation Theory to American multiculturalism. But Christian fanatics in America are discriminating against this minority. India should castigate the US for oppression of minorities and abuse of freedom of speech and thought.

Senate rejects Nation of Islam follower for human rights post

SPRINGFIELD — In a rebuke to Gov. Pat Quinn, the Illinois Senate on Thursday rejected a Nation of Islam follower whose website advocates black separatism for a third term on the state Human Rights Commission.

The Senate voted down public-access cable television personality Munir Muhammad for the $49,960-a-year post after Republicans condemned his group’s Web page, which warns against racial mixing and advocates a separate territory within the U.S. for the descendents of slaves, both ideologies advanced by Nation of Islam founder Elijah Muhammad.

Munir Muhammad’s group, the Coalition for the Remembrance of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad, also parrots Elijah Muhammad’s views on its website that blacks should not be taxed and black children be taught separately “by their own teachers.”

“To appoint someone with these radical views to the Human Rights Commission, I think, is a travesty,” said Sen. Tim Bivins (R-Dixon).

Bivins also pointed to excerpts from one of Munir Muhammad’s television broadcasts in which he praised Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as a “patient man.”

arun · Post by **arun** » 18 May 2012 21:27

X Posted.

Hindus and Sikhs in the UK are fed up with those originating in the Islamic Republic of Pakistan and following the Mohammadden religion being permitted to don the Burka / Burqa of the term “Asian” by the Media and Government in the UK in a bid to hide their frequent involvement in crimes such as paedophilic sex grooming:

Hindus and Sikhs consequently demand that the term “Asian” stopped being used to describe Pakistani Mohammaddens as the use of the term “Asian” is “wholly inaccurate and unfair to other communities of Asian Origin” besides the use of term is “a way of clouding responsibility”.:

Joint statement by Sikh and Hindu organisations on so-called 'Asian' grooming gangs

Date:14 May 2012

We note with concern that the so-called 'Asian' sex gangs recently and all too often in the news are in fact almost always of Pakistani origin. The use of the term 'Asian' to describe the perpetrators of these crimes is wholly inaccurate and unfair to other communities of Asian Origin.

By law the British Government requires all authorities including the police, CPS and prisons, to collect ethnicity figures, which use the categories set out in the Census; Asian/Asian British: Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Chinese and Any other Asian background. We believe that in this case the government itself is sanctioning the use of term Asian as a way of clouding responsibility.
It is also a cause for concern that the religion of each person is noted; when in custody in police stations; when on remand in prison and when a convicted felon. Yet the government in the CEOP report about child exploitation and in its dealing with the media has advised that this information does not exist.

We believe the reluctance of the media and the government to discuss the issue that there is a disproportionate representation of Muslims in such cases and why the victims are almost always non-Muslim girls is only adding to the vote bank of far-right groups such as the BNP and the EDL.

In addition we wish to bring to your attention the fact that the same sex gangs have also targeted Hindu and Sikh girls in the same manner and these cases are rarely reported on as they hardly ever reach the courts.

We believe that political correctness stifles debate and will not facilitate a frank and mature discussion or solutions to get to the root of why the above pattern is emerging in these crimes and how to help find a solution to the problem. This can only be done by working with the responsible majority in the community involved. We will not be able to do that if we mask the identity of those involved based on misguided views of ‘protecting a vulnerable community’ of the perpetrators and not looking at the vulnerable community of victims.

The Network of Sikh Organisations UK,
The Hindu Forum of Britain,
The Sikh Media Monitoring Group UK.

From here:

Hindu Forum of Britain

arun · Post by **arun** » 18 May 2012 22:43

In Indonesia, a country frequently help up as an example of a moderate Mohammadden majority country, a mob of Mohammaddens throw stones and urine at a place of worship used by followers of Christism:

Hardliners in Bekasi Throw Stones at Ascension Day Service

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 19 May 2012 19:29

Have they provided any socioeconomic factors behind the attack? Like economic deprivation, lack of development, etc that led to this absolute marginal but not-loony [the keyword can onlee be reserved for non-Muslim and non-Christian communities] fringe dance? Or maybe it was merely a law-and-order problem.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 May 2012 21:11

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 20 May 2012 03:05

Great video above..a must watch. This is exactly the equation as Bakri lays down that true Islam seeks with the 'unbeliever'. This must be made more public, so people know the truth. Moderates would like to hide this. The Ex-muslim always knows this is the truth and acknowledges it as it is. Imagine when this Ex-Miuslim says this what Bakri says to a moderate, how it will be denied and that Sharia means equality and this is Islamophobia etc..this is from the horses mouth. May more folks be aware. If a non muslim even after watching such videos is not afraid of Islamism..i'd say the person is nothing but a fool.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 20 May 2012 03:28

Beauty and Intelligence of the islamists
"WHEN PRACTICED RIGHT IN ISLAM MAN IS ALLOWED TO HAVE AS MANY CONCUBINES AS HE WANTS"IMAM
Right Hand Posession

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 20 May 2012 08:58

Animal Right activists are leading a call to ban Halaal Slaughter in the UK: Calls for Ban on Halal Slaughter

An Indian viewpoint that appears in today's papers: Halaal - As Cruel as it Gets

As the worldwide campaign for the mitigation, if not outright elimination, of cruelty to animals on the way to the slaughterhouse gains ground, the 'men of faith' seem to dig in their heels with barbaric impudence. The more the campaign for compassion to animal life becomes a socially-acceptable and practicable norm, the shriller gets the opposition by the 'faithful'.

The non-vegetarian community, especially in the West, gears to the challenges posed by the torture to the 'beast for the feast'. They suggest that the animal they feast upon be spared the agony of 'live slaughter'; instead, it be 'stunned' (anaesthetized) before it's slaughtered. In European countries like Sweden, Austria, Norway, Estonia and Switzerland it is mandatory by law to anaesthetize animals before they are slaughtered at the abattoir.

Even the puritanical Jews have by and large conformed to the raison d'etre of making animal-slaughter less painful, though the kosher ritual slaughter be allowed on occasions, they argued during a debate on banning 'live slaughter' in the Netherlands.

The stiff opposition follows only from the 'faithful' the world over. They seek - from West Asia to across the Atlantic and the Asia-Pacific - that 'halaal' be served to them in hotels and hospitals, no matter how tortuous the method for slaying the sacrificial lamb be. The process of 'halaal', which the faithful claim is prescribed as a tenet for slaughter by their religion, literally makes the animal die by inches, slowly slitting the jugular vein and the carotid artery to the recitation of a Quranic verse. Any other method, less painful, simply makes it 'haraam' (proscribed by religion) for these 'men of belief'.

Is it not tantamount to the invocation of the Sharia at a place where there is no legal scope for it and in a manner most retrograde to modern society? Isn't it as much a human behavioural anomaly as it's an anachronism in a civilized society?

Animal rights' protection groups -- cutting across the barriers of religion -- are vehement in their opposition to the very concept of painful slaughter of animals for satiating the carnivorous gastronomic human instinct. They argue, and logically so, if vegetarianism can not be adapted to -- in toto -- as a healthy food habit in a particular socio-climatic melieu, atleast what a non-vegetarian set of people can conveniently adopt must conform to a civilized behaviour-at-the-altar for the animal they feast upon.

In such a scenario the very constitution of 'Halal Development Authority' or 'Halal India' falls foul of international conventions aimed at guarding against infliction of avoidable pain to animals for slaughter. In the US, 'Humane Methods of Slaughter Act' expressly says, " No method of slaughtering or handling in connection with slaughtering shall be deemed to comply with the public policy of the United States unless it is humane… all animals are to be rendered insensible to pain by a single blow or gunshot or an electrical, chemical or other means that is rapid and effective, before being shackled, hoisted, thrown, cast or cut…"

More so, the demand by elite hospital chains, seeking certification for serving 'halaal' animal products makes a mockery of animal welfare laws besides providing a legal veneer to an exercise inherently illegal and repugnant to the idea of progressive society. The motive behind such a move by the hospitals is, indeed, economic in nature, inasmuch as medical tourism from the African-Arab region has a huge growth potential in India, yet conceding to demands like 'halaal' certification bodes ill for a progressive nation on the march to globalisation

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 20 May 2012 11:56

Absolutely candid video of Dr.Wafa Sultan in a debate with Sheikh Omar Bakri Muhammad.This needs to be publicized and more discussions need to be encouraged to the point that Islam in its current form is either banned from the civilized world or it transform completely into a new religion. The other alternative is war.

arun · Post by **arun** » 21 May 2012 20:55

X Posted from the Islamic Sectarianism thread.

Green on Green Intra Mohammadden religious hatred on display.

Cleric adhering to the Sunni sect of Mohammadenism, the Grand Imam of the influential Al-Azhar seminary, rejects the spread of the theology of the Shia / Shiite sect of Mohammaddenism and the building of Shia places of worship namely Imambarghas / Hussainiyas in Egypt:

Azhar: Shiite Hussainiyas threaten stability in Egypt

arun · Post by **arun** » 21 May 2012 21:59

X Posted from the TSP thread.

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan Mohammadden Cleric and Former Legislator Denounces Secular Education for Women, Justifies Honor Killings: "Killing of Women In the Name of Honor Is a 'Local Custom and Religious Practice,'" Warns Female Western NGO Staff that They will Be Captured and Given Away as Brides

MEMRI

Added later one more article on the fatwa of Maulana Abdul Haleem.

Express Tribune:

Curtailing ‘immodesty’: Ex-lawmaker ‘decrees’ against female education

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 May 2012 22:47

Haleem. Is that his name or that for a dish? He needs to change it if he wants to be serious.

RCase · Post by **RCase** » 21 May 2012 23:39

arun wrote:X Posted from the TSP thread.

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan Mohammadden Cleric and Former Legislator Denounces Secular Education for Women, Justifies Honor Killings: "Killing of Women In the Name of Honor Is a 'Local Custom and Religious Practice,'" Warns Female Western NGO Staff that They will Be Captured and Given Away as Brides

MEMRI

Added later one more article on the fatwa of Maulana Abdul Haleem.

Express Tribune:

Curtailing ‘immodesty’: Ex-lawmaker ‘decrees’ against female education

"The 'secular' education of women is against Islamic injunctions… If a woman gets education, she would also seek a job, which Islam doesn't allow in any way…."
"Getting education for degrees by women is repugnant to Islamic injunctions, because if a woman gets a degree, she may use it for job, an act which Islam doesn't allow in absence of mehram (close relatives)…."
"Several Hadith books [i.e. those containing reports of deeds and sayings of Prophet Muhammad] prohibit girls from receiving degrees and certificates in 'secular education'…. Formal education paves the way for girls to enter the job market."

During his stint as a parliamentarian, Maulana Haleem had also declared poppy cultivation in Kohistan ‘in accordance with Islam’.
Several girls from Maulana Haleem’s hometown are attending school while some women from the Maulana’s family are also working as teachers in the district, he added

So many questions befuddle this mind ....

Q. Were the nomads of Arabia so advanced in the 7th century that they had universities that gave out degrees and certificates?

Q. Does Maulana use any domestic help to tend to his large family of 8 sons and 7 daughters.

Q. How did the Maulana's female family members start working as teachers in the district? Does he consider collecting a paycheck from the district as work?

Q. Was poppy cultivated and consumed by the Prophet in the desert sands of Arabia to be deemed Islamic?

Q. Maulana endorsed honor killing and the non-requirement of 4 witnesses. Has he been a participant of such a killing(s)?

Q. Does Maulana's female family members get healthcare? If so, do they visit a male or female doctor? If male doctor, how could he let his womenfolk mix with na-mehrum? If female doctor, why did he not kill her for having an education and working in a job?

I wish the Maulana and his ilk to go warpspeed hurtling towards the 7th century .... God speed (Inshallah)!

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 24 May 2012 05:33

TALIQAN, Afghanistan, May 23 (Reuters) - More than 120 schoolgirls and three teachers have been poisoned in the second attack in as many months blamed on conservative radicals in the country's north, Afghan police and education officials said on Wednesday.

The attack occurred in Takhar province where police said that radicals opposed to education of women and girls had used an unidentified toxic powder to contaminate the air in classrooms. Scores of students were left unconscious.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/2 ... 38705.html

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 24 May 2012 06:05

Charlie wrote:National Post: Time to call Pakistan what it is — a state supporter of terrorism

Here in the West, the killing of Osama Bin Laden was considered a triumph. In Pakistan, where the al-Qaeda leader lived out his final years, attitudes are very different: On Wednesday, a Pakistani court brought down a guilty verdict against the Pakistani doctor who helped the CIA locate bin Laden in May, 2011. Having been convicted of treason, Shakil Afridi now faces a 33-year prison sentence.

Each story like this brings fresh evidence that Pakistan, a nominal Western ally in the war on terrorism, actually is doing more to enable the jihadis than fight them. We don’t yet have definitive evidence to suggest that the Pakistani military and intelligence establishment was actively housing and protecting bin Laden in the garrison town of Abbottabad. But that certainly would have been in keeping with long-standing Pakistani policies.

And those policies won’t change any time soon: With the Americans, Canadians and others having announced their exit date in Afghanistan, Pakistan has less incentive to co-operate in the war on terrorism than at any time since 9/11. In coming years, the better way to deal with Pakistan will be to acknowledge the reality that the country is nothing less than a full-blown state sponsor of terrorism.

This is not a new idea: It goes back almost 20 years. As former U.S. diplomat Peter Tomsen recently noted in an insightful essay published by the World Policy Institute, George H.W. Bush-era Secretary of State James Baker wrote a letter to Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif in 1993, warning him that Pakistan could soon be put on America’s list of terror-sponsoring nations. But the threat proved hollow.

At the time, Pakistan’s spy agency, the ISI, was actively supporting militant groups in Indian Kashmir. To this day, three of those groups — Harakat ul Mujahidin, Lashkar-I Taiba and Jaish-I Mohammad — are on the U.S. State Department’s list of terrorist organizations. Add in the groups that the ISI assists on the Afghanistan front — the Taliban, the Haqqani network, and the Hekmatyar outfit — and it becomes plain that Pakistani spooks effectively are co-ordinating a horizontally diversified terrorist empire spanning three nations.

As Mr. Tomsen argues, the United States — and the West, more generally — shares some of the blame for the expansion of Pakistan’s malign influence. The U.S. diplomat served as a special envoy to elements of the Afghan resistance (most notably, Tajik commander Ahmed Shah Masood, who was killed by al-Qaeda two days before 9/11) during the early 1990s. In that capacity, he bore witness to America’s policy of reckless indifference to developments in the region.

“From 1993 to September 11, 2001 — in perhaps one of the greatest blunders in American diplomatic history — the United States government outsourced America’s Afghan policy to Pakistan, which meant to the Pakistani military and the powerful ISI. American policy was, in practice, giving free rein to the fox in the chicken coup,” Mr. Tomsen wrote in the Journal of the World Policy Institute. “The unholy alliance of the ISI, al-Qaida, and Taliban radicals burrowed into Afghanistan. While bin Laden launched global terrorist attacks against the United States, Pakistan’s military and the ISI organized, armed, and supplied the annual military offensives besieging Masood’s northern enclave. American ignorance of Pakistan’s radical Islamist course in Afghanistan reinforced the isolation of the most successful Afghan commander fighting al-Qaeda and the Taliban.”

Pakistan’s motives in supporting terrorism and attacking its neighbours typically are described as a play for “strategic depth” against India. Mr. Tomsen argues that there are other goals as well — including the expansion of the military’s power within domestic Pakistani politics, and the creation of a unified Islamic power base in Central Asia.

Destabilizing Afghanistan through Taliban-led terrorism is consistent with each of these goals. And the ISI’s strategy for doing so, Mr. Tomsen notes, is a carbon copy of its playbook from 1994 to 1998, when it built up the Taliban the first time around.

For years, Western diplomats have been unable to speak freely about Pakistan, because we’ve depended on the country for logistical support in the Afghan mission. At the same time, the American campaign of drone strikes, which has decimated the senior ranks of Pakistani-based terrorists, has remained a low-profile affair, lest Pakistani sensitivities be offended.

Following the West’s phased withdrawal from Afghanistan, however, we will no longer have tens of thousands of soldiers being fed, housed, and air conditioned in the Afghan outback. No longer will the United States have to go through the cynical pantomime of “co-ordinating” border operations with the Pakistani military, an exercise that inevitably leads to the Taliban learning of America’s plans in advance.

It is a pity that the West will not be leaving Afghanistan in better shape. But having departed the country, the United States and its allies at least will be able to deal with Pakistan, the greater threat, for what it is: a country that is a haven for terrorists; and which punishes men, such as Shakil Afridi, who fight them.

jkay@nationalpost.com

— Jonathan Kay is Managing Editor for Comment at the National Post, and a fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies in Washington, D.C.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 24 May 2012 07:09

Three surprising things you probably didn't know about Islam.
This subject WILL affect you in the near future, so take the chance to inform yourself now - before it does.

Parts of the text have been strongly inspired by the website
http://www.citizenwarrior.com

Sources for ALL points:
http://www.bloggersbase.com/politics-an ... s/3-islam/
and here:
http://newstime.co.nz/three-things-about-islam.html

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 24 May 2012 07:14

A very important Psychoanalysis of Islamist behavior by Danish prison Psychologist Nicolai Sennels. This article has been doing the rounds in almost all of Europe and US media that understands the Islamist threat to peace and safety.

Report from the therapy room: Why are Muslims more violent and criminal?
by Nicolai Sennels

Nicolai Sennels (born 1976) is psychologist, a popular lecturer about Muslim integration and gangs, and author of “Among Criminal Muslims. A Psychologist’s Experiences from Copenhagen Municipality” (Free Press Society, 2009). This article summarizes his experiences and conclusions as a professional psychologist in the Copenhagen youth prison Sønderbro.

This article is an invitation to come behind the normally hermetically closed doors of the therapy room and get insights into the often just as closed Muslim culture and communities. As a psychologist in Copenhagen's youth prison I had a unique chance to get insights into the culture and religion of Muslims and the causes for the violent behaviour and high crime rates among Muslim immigrants. My Muslim clients told me their stories from their families and communities, about life in their home countries, about their experiences with and views on non-Muslims and the Danish society. I had around 150 Muslim and 100 Danish clients on my couch. They all came from the same age group (12-17 years) and the two groups had on average the same social and economic background. Most of them were found guilty, but a large part also proved to be innocent. I thus had a very good opportunity to compare Muslims and non-Muslims psychologically.

The conclusion is that there are strong psychological differences between Muslims and non-Muslims. It is also clear that Muslim culture influences Muslims in a way that makes them more likely to become criminal and display anti-social behaviour - especially towards non-Muslims and non-Islamic authorities.

The crime rate among Muslims in the West is catastrophically high. Seven out of 10 inmates in Danish youth prisons have immigrant backgrounds, and almost all of them are raised in Muslim families. The first seven or eight places on the top-10 list of criminals' nationality are occupied by immigrants from Muslim countries (Danes come in as number nine, followed by a long list of purely non-Muslim immigrants). This list is published by the Danish state's Bureau of Statistics, and is corrected according to the criminals' economic and educational status. The crime statistics also show that crime rates among immigrants get worse, not better, in subsequent generations. Time does not heal the problems, on the contrary. Second generation immigrants (born and raised in Denmark) in the age group 20-29 years are thus 76 percent more criminal than first generation immigrants (born outside Denmark) in the same age group. Second generation non-Western immigrants are five times more violent than Danes. 22 percent of the second generation immigrants between 20-29 years received one or more sentences in 2005 (http://avisen.dk/unge-efterkommere-er-d ... _6193.aspx). In 2006 the number had risen to 23 percent (http://jp.dk/indland/krimi/article1371018.ece). The share of immigrants among youth criminals in Copenhagen rose from 56 percent in 2007 to 67 percent in 2008 - that is an increase of 20 percent in just one year (http://politiken.dk/indland/article560520.ece).

The question is of course: Why are Muslims so much more criminal, violent and seemingly non-empathetic than non-Muslims?

I conducted therapy with the Muslim and Danish inmates in both groups and individually: Individual therapy, Anger Management groups and Mindfulness training. During the hundreds of hours with both Danish (and a very small percentage of non-Muslim immigrants) and Muslim clients, a psychological profile of the Muslim culture became evident. We have to acknowledge the psychological differences between Muslims and Westerners if we want to understand the unsuccessful integration of Muslims in the West and its increasingly problematic consequences.

Read the full article for indepth insight into the following as applied to an Islamist upbringing

1)Anger vs. weakness
2)Honour vs. insecurity
3)Victim mentality vs. personal responsibility
4)Muslims vs. non-Muslims
5)Sexuality: Men vs. women
6)Anti-social behaviour vs. poverty
7)The Stigmatization Argument
8 )Integration vs. Muslim culture
9)Solutions

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 24 May 2012 07:52

As expected Muslims' en masse voting paterns to protect Ummah interests seems to have defeated Sarkozy and put a leftist in the French Presidents seat.

France: Plan succeeded: Muslim immigrants put socialist in power

JihadWatch saw this coming already before the French elections: "Demography. Enough Muslim voters to topple a president: 'Fed up' French Muslims mobilize to unseat Sarkozy". And I am not afraid to say it again: Loose Leftist immigration policy is a tool to import votes for - yes, shocker - the Left. It is now a fact that both France and Denmark would be ruled by conservatives, had it not been for Muslim votes. GalliaWatch:

The French did not put Hollande in office, the Muslims did. With the final tally showing that 1,131,067 votes separated the two candidates, and that 93% of the 2-3 million Muslim votes went to Hollande, it is fair to say - in a manner of speaking - that Nicolas Sarkozy won. He would have won had there been no Muslims.

A serious discussion is needed if democratic societies can survive when one section of the population (Muslims) en masse vote to preserve Ummah interests.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 24 May 2012 08:30

^ democracy and Secularism survive only as long as certain ideologies are in tiny minority.

No wonder why only the "secular"'dictatorships in ME are being attacked and not Islamic dictatorships.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 24 May 2012 10:18

Charlie wrote:As expected Muslims' en masse voting paterns to protect Ummah interests seems to have defeated Sarkozy and put a leftist in the French Presidents seat.

France: Plan succeeded: Muslim immigrants put socialist in power

JihadWatch saw this coming already before the French elections: "Demography. Enough Muslim voters to topple a president: 'Fed up' French Muslims mobilize to unseat Sarkozy". And I am not afraid to say it again: Loose Leftist immigration policy is a tool to import votes for - yes, shocker - the Left. It is now a fact that both France and Denmark would be ruled by conservatives, had it not been for Muslim votes. GalliaWatch:

The French did not put Hollande in office, the Muslims did. With the final tally showing that 1,131,067 votes separated the two candidates, and that 93% of the 2-3 million Muslim votes went to Hollande, it is fair to say - in a manner of speaking - that Nicolas Sarkozy won. He would have won had there been no Muslims.
A serious discussion is needed if democratic societies can survive when one section of the population (Muslims) en masse vote to preserve Ummah interests.

Before France, India has been a victim of this and has been a cheif reason for UPA-1 ANd II victories.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 24 May 2012 23:54

Charlie wrote:As expected Muslims' en masse voting paterns to protect Ummah interests seems to have defeated Sarkozy and put a leftist in the French Presidents seat.

France: Plan succeeded: Muslim immigrants put socialist in power

JihadWatch saw this coming already before the French elections: "Demography. Enough Muslim voters to topple a president: 'Fed up' French Muslims mobilize to unseat Sarkozy". And I am not afraid to say it again: Loose Leftist immigration policy is a tool to import votes for - yes, shocker - the Left. It is now a fact that both France and Denmark would be ruled by conservatives, had it not been for Muslim votes. GalliaWatch:

The French did not put Hollande in office, the Muslims did. With the final tally showing that 1,131,067 votes separated the two candidates, and that 93% of the 2-3 million Muslim votes went to Hollande, it is fair to say - in a manner of speaking - that Nicolas Sarkozy won. He would have won had there been no Muslims.
A serious discussion is needed if democratic societies can survive when one section of the population (Muslims) en masse vote to preserve Ummah interests.

There might come a time when we will have to discard the one person one vote system.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 25 May 2012 05:37

Muslims detained by FBI for spending too long in lavatory
Massa ka Tamacha

group of Muslims was detained Wednesday at Orlando Sanford International Airport, apparently because of a misunderstanding over an Islamic cleanliness ritual, authorities said.The captain of Allegiant flight No.625 from Allentown, Pa., radioed ahead and asked airport police to meet the plane when it landed about 8:30p.m., said Larry Dale, airport director and commander of its 11-member police force.Members of the group were lingering in the lavatory and asked for a cup, arousing suspicion, Dale said. An FBI agent was interviewing three men late Wednesday, but it appeared that the travelers were detained because of a religious custom dictating cleanliness and that they would be released."In today's world, we'd rather be cautious," Dale said.About half a dozen people and one child – at least some members of the same family – were traveling from Pennsylvania to Central Florida for a volleyball and badminton tournament, Dale said.The travelers are of Middle Eastern descent, and at least one of the women wore a head scarf, he said.Muhammad Musri, president of the Islamic Society of Central Florida, said devout Muslims customarily clean their private parts with water after using the restroom, and that is likely what members of the group were doing. The procedure is known as istinja.
They [the airplane crew] didn't understand it, probably," Musri said. "If you didn't know the reason, you'd say, 'Why do you need the cup? Why are you taking it with you into the bathroom?'"There was no disruption on the flight, Dale said."I'm glad they didn't have to divert the plane to another airport," Musri said. "Sometimes we overreact."

Kanishka · Post by **Kanishka** » 25 May 2012 07:49

Charlie wrote:As expected Muslims' en masse voting paterns to protect Ummah interests seems to have defeated Sarkozy and put a leftist in the French Presidents seat.

A serious discussion is needed if democratic societies can survive when one section of the population (Muslims) en masse vote to preserve Ummah interests.

darshhan wrote: There might come a time when we will have to discard the one person one vote system.

OT here.. but please do suggest a solution if any one of you have one to prevent this abuse of democratic process. Maybe in some other thread? I feel this is an urgent issue which is a significant cause of many ills in our political system.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 May 2012 21:55

Did Muhammad Exist?
An Inquiry into Islam's Obscure Origins

by Robert Spencer
ISI Books, 2012. 254 pp. $27.95

Reviewed by Aymenn Jawad Al-Tamimi

The American Spectator
May 25, 2012

http://www.meforum.org/3251/did-muhammad-exist
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Be the first of your friends to like this.

Go to a high-street or online bookstore, and one can find numerous biographies written about Muhammad -- the reputed founder of Islam -- by the likes of Karen Armstrong and Tariq Ramadan. These works -- generally apologetic in nature -- wholly rely on the traditional Islamic accounts of the Prophet's life, and if they ever delve into the question of the reliability of those sources, it is only in the hope of explaining away incidents in Muhammad's life that might come across as unsavory to modern readers.

Such an approach, however, simply will not do for genuine historical research. One cannot adopt a pick-and-mix method to determining what aspects of Muhammad's life actually occurred on moralistic grounds. It is in this respect that Robert Spencer's latest book differs from the writings of Armstrong and Ramadan.

Without indulging in polemics or pushing a partisan political agenda, the author simply investigates the question of whether we can really trust the traditional Islamic accounts for the life of Muhammad and the supposed early days of Islam during the Arab conquests.

To be sure, serious scholarship on Islamic historiography dates back to the latter half of the 19th century -- with the works of the Belgian Jesuit Henri Lammens and the acclaimed Geschichte des Qorans by Theodor Noldeke, to name just two pioneers of the field -- and Spencer makes no pretense to originality.

Yet a traditional problem with Islamic historiography has been the intended audience: that is, the academic specialist assumed to have extensive background knowledge, rather than the general reader. Thus, Spencer's book serves a useful purpose, for it flows nicely while providing the reader with a firm grounding for delving deeper into the subject. Indeed, the author provides a handy "Further Reading List" (pp. 239-40) for anyone interested in consulting specialist works. Spencer also deserves credit for integrating his sources nicely into his writing, avoiding the practice of simply quoting verbatim large chunks from other authors.

SO WHAT ARE THE MAIN arguments against the historicity of the traditional Islamic accounts of Muhammad's life and the subsequent rise of Islam through the Arab conquests?

To begin with, contemporary non-Muslim sources of the 7th century do not corroborate the canonical story. For example, the Doctrina Jacobi (a document dating to 634-40 CE and probably written by a Christian living in Palestine; p. 20), an account of the Arab conquest of Jerusalem by Sophronius -- the patriarch who is said to have surrendered the city in 637 -- and a letter written in 647 by the patriarch of Seleucia make no reference to the Arab conquerors as Muslims, or show any awareness of a religion called Islam.

The earliest account that can reliably be taken to refer to Muhammad is a chronicle by the Armenian bishop Sebeos, dating either to the 660s or 670s but containing material that sharply diverges from the traditional Islamic accounts: thus he has Muhammad "insisting on the Jews' right to the Holy Land -- even if in the context of claiming that land for the Ishmaelites, acting in conjunction with the Jews" (p. 32).

Only by around 730 CE, nearly one hundred years after Muhammad's death in 632 CE according to the canonical story, do we see an account by John of Damascus make detailed reference to parts of the Qur'an, but even then he does not name the Qur'an or allude to the existence of a complete holy book for those he calls "Hagarians," "Ishmaelites" or "Saracens" (but not Muslims).

Instead, we have reference to Qur'anic chapter titles like "The Women" (this is the fourth Sura of the Qur'an today), implying that he was drawing on fragments of text that were later incorporated into the Qur'an.

Arabic epigraphic evidence from the 7th century similarly fails to validate the canonical account. An inscription attributed to the first Umayyad caliph -- Muawiya -- in 677 or 678 CE makes reference to belief in God but gives no indication of belief in Muhammad as his messenger or the Qur'an as revealed scripture.

On coins from this period, we do find the word "Muhammad" inscribed, but curiously the inscription comes under kingly figures bearing a cross, a symbol of Christianity that is totally antithetical to traditional Islam (pp. 43-4).

Bearing in mind that "Muhammad" can also mean "the chosen/praised one," the coins could well be conveying the idea that the ruler is praised or chosen in God's name (p. 45). Alternatively, they could be referring to Jesus -- at a time when the religion of the Arab conquerors was still a vague monotheism -- or a proto-Muhammad figure still very much unlike the man depicted in the traditional accounts of his life. Even the inscriptions on the Dome of the Rock -- completed in 691 CE and often thought to be the first elaborations on traditional Islamic theology -- could be referring to Jesus, explaining how he ("Muhammad") is a mere messenger and not divine as orthodox Christianity held (pp. 56-7).

IT IS ONLY TOWARDS the middle of the 8th century (735 CE onwards) that we begin to see very clear epigraphic evidence referring to Muhammad as we know him from the Ahadith (plural of hadith) and Sira (pp. 61-2). This observation leads nicely to an examination of the reliability of biographical material from the Ahadith and Sira concerning the sunna (i.e. example) of Muhammad. The centrality of the Ahadith and Sira in interpreting various Qur'anic verses, whose meaning would otherwise be entirely obscure, cannot be overstated.

However, as Spencer points out, it is notable that the invocation of Muhammad's example begins with the same caliph who had the Dome of the Rock built and issued the first coins invoking Muhammad as the Prophet of God: Abd al-Malik (p. 69), whose successors would do likewise.

Since Muhammad now became such an important figure as a paragon of moral virtue, there naturally arose a need for people to know what the Prophet said and did in various matters of life. The Ahadith in particular then became political weapons, liable to be completely fabricated. Even in the first half of the 8th century, one Islamic scholar wrote that the "emirs forced people to write hadiths" (p. 71).

Factionalism is an especially noteworthy phenomenon here behind the invention of Ahadith.

For example, in the midst of the dispute between the followers of the caliph Muawiya, who Shi'a believe usurped the place of Ali's son and designated successor Husayn, and Ali's followers who would later become the Shi'a, a hadith arose in which Muhammad declared that Ali's father was burning in hellfire (p. 73), while Ali's partisans invented a hadith in which Muhammad declared, "I go to war for the recognition of the Qur'an and Ali will fight for the interpretation of the Qur'an."

It is little surprise that in light of all these disputes, the Ahadith are riddled with contradictions.

To be sure, Muslim scholars did try to devise criteria by which to separate forgeries from Ahadith they deemed to be authentic: for instance, how well a hadith is in accordance with the Qur'an. Yet however reasonable such a criterion may be, "it doesn't get us any closer to what Muhammad actually said and did" (p. 81).

Another devised standard was the supposed reliability of an isnad (chain of oral transmission from the Prophet to the narrator), but this is even more dubious.

While Arabia may well have had "an established practice of memorizing poetry" (p. 84), the Ahadith are not pieces of poetry, and in any event must have been plagued by "embellishment, clarification, or alteration of any kind until the hadiths were finally collected and written down in the ninth century" (p. 85).

In fact, I would add that even if we suppose that we are dealing with poetry in an oral culture, it is erroneous to think that oral poets can transmit verses with perfect recall, word-for-word. Oral poetry is constantly subject to reworking and improvisation.

Hence, for example, the Iliad and the Odyssey were certainly not transmitted through generations of oral poets until they were finally written down. Rather, we understand each of these epics to be the work of a single poet, who would have picked up numerous "formulaic phrases" and stories and then improvised and reworked his material numerous times, while striving for an artistic structure.

In all probability, the poet had his work dictated to a scribe. If the Iliad and Odyssey were subsequently memorized wholesale by bards, the bards were working from written texts, not via oral transmission of the poems.

If the Ahadith cannot be taken as a reliable guide to what Muhammad said and did, then what are we to make of Ibn Ishaq's Sira? It is often noted that Ibn Ishaq's biography, which does not in fact survive intact and is only partially preserved by later transmitters, dates over 100 years after Muhammad's death in 632 CE. Tradition tells of earlier historians, but their purported works have not survived and little is known about their lives.

That Ishaq's work dates so long after the time in which Muhammad supposedly lived is not proof of the Sira's unreliability, but the fact is that Ibn Ishaq would undoubtedly have been working from oral material that would have been embellished and fabricated.

Many of the stories transmitted by Ibn Ishaq would have been tailored to convince the audience that Muhammad was a prophet of God, hence tales of Christians already recognizing him as a prophet in his youth before his prophetic career began (p. 96).

NOW COMES A CRUCIAL PART of the book. One of the key reasons many critics of Islam think that the traditional accounts of Muhammad's life are rooted in historical reality is the argument from embarrassment: that is, Muhammad is presented as doing things that might be deemed abhorrent to pious sensibilities. Ibn Hisham states that his own transmission of Ibn Ishaq's work omits "things which it is disgraceful to discuss" (p. 88).

Even in the traditional accounts, there are still events recounted that have embarrassed Muslim apologists of the modern era: perhaps most notably, Muhammad's marriage to his daughter-in-law Zaynab.

Yet as Spencer notes, "what constitutes a negative depiction is not necessarily constant from age to age and culture to culture" (p. 111). This is certainly true, for example, of the tradition that Aisha married Muhammad when she was six and consummated the marriage with him when she was nine: no one in the traditional accounts is shown having a problem with this betrothal (p. 112).

In any case, Spencer shows that the Zaynab incident is likely to have been a much later invention to explain the fact that there is an apparent doctrine in the Qur'an of a "prophetic bloodline": that is, "the prophetic office is handed down from father to son" (p. 115).

Since Muhammad is regarded as the final prophet, it had to be emphasized that he did not have any sons -- biological or adopted -- who reached puberty. Thus, the status of Zayd as Muhammad's adopted son had to be marginalized, hence the attendant Qur'anic doctrine delegitimizing adoption (Qur'an 33:4) and the emphasis that "Muhammad is not the father of any one of your men" (Qur'an 33:40).

Nevertheless, if the Sira and Ahadith are unreliable, the question arises of where the Qur'an came from. A superficial reading -- noting the consistent message of uncompromising monotheism -- might suggest that the book is the work of a single author.

On closer examination, however, there are good grounds to hypothesize that the Qur'an developed over the 7th and 8th centuries in the religious and cultural milieu of the Arab conquests, rather than just within Arabia itself during Muhammad's purported lifetime (570-632 CE).

For one thing, the Qur'an displays a lack of careful organization: frequently there is an abrupt shift in subject matter and grammatical persons, suggesting at the minimum a rather clumsy process of redaction.

Islamic tradition itself hints at early losses of parts of the Qur'an, with one hadith as follows: "Let none of you say, 'I have acquired the whole of the Qur'an.' How does he know what all of it is when much of the Qur'an has disappeared? Rather let him say, 'I have acquired what has survived'" (p. 137).

Also of interest here is the Qur'an's repeated emphasis that it is a work of "pure" Arabic. This could only be in response to claims that the Qur'an was not wholly Arabic. Indeed, there is evidence of a substantial non-Arabic substrate, as evinced by numerous loan words in both religious and cultural vocabulary. Even the word for God -- Allah -- is thought to derive from Syriac (p. 156). What follows in Spencer's book is a nicely summarized exposition of the arguments of recent scholars like Christoph Luxenberg who have theorized that the Qur'an was originally -- at least in part -- a Syriac Christian liturgical text. This hypothesis does explain many of the linguistic obscurities of the Qur'an.

I am still unsure what to make of this theory, but even if we suppose a text wholly derived from Arabic oral traditions, the canonical accounts of the Qur'an's origins are not vindicated, for reasons outlined above in this review as regards oral transmission and poetry.

In light of this research vis-à-vis the Qur'an, taken together with the fact that the conquered peoples had no idea of the existence of a Muslim holy book in the mid-7th century, it seems unlikely that the third caliph -- Uthman (579-656 CE) -- was responsible for the compilation and distribution of the Qur'an as we know it today, despite the claims of Muslim orthodoxy.

There are reputed Qur'anic manuscripts dating back to the 7th century, but since they lack the diacritical marks that are integral to the Arabic alphabet, we cannot tell whether they were written as the Qur'an in the first place, or separate documents later adapted as part of the Qur'an (p. 192). There is also no complete Qur'an dating from the first century of the Arab conquests.

Moreover, it is possible that the Qur'an's second and longest sura (chapter) was originally a separate book. As late as 730 CE, John of Damascus referred to the "text of the Cow" (p. 196: "The Cow" being the name of the Qur'an's second sura), implying it was a separate text, which in turn suggests that the Qur'an "was not yet fixed in its present form" even towards the mid-8th century (p. 197). It was noted earlier that the first caliph to invoke Muhammad as a messenger of God was Abd al-Malik.

Thus, "from the historical records available to us, it makes sense that the Qur'an was not collected until Abd al-Malik's reign" (p. 197), as part of a collaborative effort between Abd al-Malik and Hajjaj ibn Yusuf, the governor of Iraq (661-714 CE). The work of Hajjaj in collecting the Qur'an is in fact attested in many Ahadith. The compilation was then traced back to Uthman in an attempt to give the project an authentic feel.

From all these findings, the most plausible conclusion to draw is that Islam as we know it emerged over a protracted period between the 7th and 8th centuries, developed in such a way as to (i) unify the vast empire created by the Arab conquests that conquered a vast amount of territory (stretching from Spain to Sindh by 750 CE) and (ii) justify the expansionism.

This "imperial theology" (to borrow Spencer's term; p. 208) was based on a monotheism that perhaps was more tolerant towards Judaism and Christianity in its very early days (hence Qur'anic verses such as 2:62 that include Jews, Christians and Sabaeans in the fold of salvation; p. 209). Yet from the end of the 7th century onwards, Islam takes on a much more distinct identity, with a separate prophet and holy book, supplanting Judaism and Christianity.

SPENCER'S EXPLANATION FOR THE ORIGINS and development of early Islam is significantly corroborated by analogy with the rise of the Roman imperial cult after Augustus' creation of the Principate.

Needing to hold the Roman state together with concentration of power in his hands, he made much of the reputed divine descent of his family line (the Julian line), and commissioned Virgil to write an epic celebrating the founding of the Roman race by his supposed ancestor Aeneas. In the same way, we have Muhammad as the founder of Islam and the Muslim ummah. For the first time, we see a coherent and emphatic articulation of an expansionist outlook:

tu regere imperio populos, Romane, memento (hae tibi erunt artes), pacique imponere morem,  parcere subiectis et debellare superbos

Remember, Roman, to rule the peoples with your power (these will be your skills), to impose mos on peace, to spare the subdued and war down the proud' -- Aeneid 6.851-3.

Here we have ideas that closely parallel Islamic expansionism in the concept of jihad, as articulated in the classical theology that developed from Muhammad's life and example as a warrior prophet: the notion of establishing peace through warfare and bringing civilization to the subdued.

Though the above lines are instructions from Aeneas' father Anchises to the hero, they have the force of emphasizing the Romans' destiny. The divine mandate to rule the world is corroborated by the chief god Jupiter's famous saying: "imperium sine fine dedi" ('I have given empire without end' -- Aeneid 1.279). Like Mohammed, Aeneas engages in fierce warfare, becoming master of Latium in central Italy.

While the Aeneid's borrowings from earlier epics are apparent, the text also drew on the value system promoted by Augustus and his inner circle (in particular Maecenas) that drew on Stoicism. Thus, the poem had a paradigmatic function, becoming a virtual school-text for Roman boys, and Aeneas himself soon became an idealized figure in the same way that Muhammad came to be seen as a moral paragon among Muslims.

The point of this comparison is not to say that the Arab conquerors borrowed ideas of expansionism and the like from the Romans (they didn't), but rather that Spencer's explanation of the rise of Islam should not be implausible from a historical perspective. It is therefore hardly shocking that Islam was bound with politics from the beginning (p. 214).

As for the question of Muhammad's existence, Spencer gives a concise answer to round off his book: "the full truth of whether a prophet named Muhammad lived in seventh-century Arabia, and if he did, what sort of a man he was, may never be known" (p. 216), but for too long, the topic of Islamic historiography has been confined to highly specialized academia, with the growing problem of Islamist intimidation.

Thus, an accessible primer on the subject as we have here is most welcome. In addition, the project of translating this book into Arabic is to be commended.

In the years to come, it would be good to see Spencer's book prescribed as introductory reading for courses on Islam in schools and universities. I myself have taken the step of donating his book to Brasenose College's library, and hope that others will similarly distribute the work upon reading it.

Aymenn Jawad Al-Tamimi is a student at Brasenose College, Oxford University, and an adjunct fellow at the Middle East Forum.

What does Bernard Lewis say on this subject?

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 26 May 2012 03:01

All the early western scholars doubted authenticity of everything attributed to M. On the other hand, even if there are contradictions within the ahadith - not all ahadith are contradictory, and there are some pretty good convergences on issues that concern the non-Muslim.

The cross marked stuff has always been borderline speculated on [in the context of the position given to Jesus within the Quarnic tradition and in ahadith] as that M was originally a radical Christianized Arab, perhaps closely related to the iconoclastic branch of the Byzantine church - the so-called Paulicians. There were many such Christianized Arab tribes in the vague frontier between byzantium and the parthian empire. [And Zoroastrianized Arabs too- each side representing two opposing imperialist camps, and perhaps opportunistically using the inter-imperial conflict for their own local conflicts and contests]. The Shia-Sunni would be a continuation of that conflict.

In fact interestingly, it is tantalizing to speculate if the tradition and driving forces of history are not continuing in the same old mould - with just a change of names and faces and pretensions!

If we model Islam as the EJ/extreme-radical version of Christianity with the pre-medieval context [violence/genocide/imperialist hunger] that captivated the Arabs as an effective tool to employ for their own ambitions, and Persian side of the same game in the parthian/Zoroastrian substrate giving us the modern GCC vs Iran contest - we have the same stuff repeating.

The Christian "west's" extremist locust output is still acting as the vanguard of western imperialist ambitions.

arun · Post by **arun** » 26 May 2012 07:38

In Jordan, a Kaafir Dhimmi follower of Christism is forced to conform to Mohammadden religious practise somewhat denting the frequently used cliché by adherents of Mohammaddenism that theirs is a religion in which there is no compulsion:

Jordan bank fires Christian woman for refusing to wear headscarf

arun · Post by **arun** » 26 May 2012 07:41

Hook handed Mohammadden Cleric who characterised the Space Shuttle Columbia accident as “It is a punishment from God. Muslims see it that way. It is a trinity of evil because it carried Americans, an Israeli and a Hindu, a trinity of evil against Islam.”, does not manage to get a SIM card hidden under the burka of his daughter-in-law past prison guards:

Abu Hamza's daughter-in-law caught smuggling SIM card into prison beneath burkha

Agnimitra · Post by **Agnimitra** » 27 May 2012 00:44

Internationally reputed Turkish pianist accused of insulting Islam

ANKARA, Turkey — Turkey's state-run news agency says a prosecutor has proposed charging an internationally known Turkish pianist and composer with insulting Islamic religious values in comments he made on Twitter.

Anadolu Agency said Friday that an Istanbul court will decide whether to accept the proposed indictment against Fazil Say, who has played piano with the New York Philharmonic, Berliner Symphoniker, Israel Philharmonic, Orchestre National de France, and Tokyo Symphony.

The prosecutor accuses 42-year-old Say of inciting hatred and public enmity, and insulting "religious values." Say, who has served as a culture ambassador for the European Union, allegedly mocked Islamic beliefs about paradise.

The agency says Say could face a maximum 1 ½ years in prison, if he is formally indicted, tried and convicted.

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 27 May 2012 00:52

Crosspost from TSP thread

Roperia wrote:After one UK politician, of Paki origin, said that there must be something wrong with the Pakis if there is an exceptionally large # of Pakistanis convicted for Child grooming, Pakis protest and chant "Pakistan ka matlab kya La Ilaha Illa Allah" on the streets of London.

I'm telling you, if Pakis stay away from the west, the common westerner will feel that Paki culture is different and we should respect that. On the other hand, if Pakis keep showing their true colors, it'll be absolutely clear that Paki culture is not only different but bad and immoral!

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 27 May 2012 00:58

Alerted by one of my sources of a potential Al-Qaeda website. I checked the website. Genuine information available for Jihad watchers.
DO NOT OPEN FROM YOUR OFFICE OR CORPORATE ISPs.
USE ANONYMOUS BROWSERS,SPOOF YOUR MAC,HIDE YOUR TRACKS.

Code: Select all

http://ansar1.info/forumdisplay.php?f=30

GOOD LUCK

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 27 May 2012 05:14

Carl wrote:Internationally reputed Turkish pianist accused of insulting Islam
ANKARA, Turkey — Turkey's state-run news agency says a prosecutor has proposed charging an internationally known Turkish pianist and composer with insulting Islamic religious values in comments he made on Twitter.

Anadolu Agency said Friday that an Istanbul court will decide whether to accept the proposed indictment against Fazil Say, who has played piano with the New York Philharmonic, Berliner Symphoniker, Israel Philharmonic, Orchestre National de France, and Tokyo Symphony.

The prosecutor accuses 42-year-old Say of inciting hatred and public enmity, and insulting "religious values." Say, who has served as a culture ambassador for the European Union, allegedly mocked Islamic beliefs about paradise.

The agency says Say could face a maximum 1 ½ years in prison, if he is formally indicted, tried and convicted.

Weren't there voices here on the forum trumpeting how all that Islamism in Turkey was gaming onlee? play school stuff onlee? Even now - any pointer of the underlying Islamic intent when surfaced - deeper than the ocean and taller than mountain Islamist inner "sources" say - it is "all for show onlee"!

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 27 May 2012 05:15

Islamist Parties in Power: A Work in Progress

arun · Post by **arun** » 27 May 2012 09:23

brihaspati wrote:
Carl wrote:Internationally reputed Turkish pianist accused of insulting Islam ..........{Snipped}..........
Weren't there voices here on the forum trumpeting how all that Islamism in Turkey was gaming onlee? play school stuff onlee? Even now - any pointer of the underlying Islamic intent when surfaced - deeper than the ocean and taller than mountain Islamist inner "sources" say - it is "all for show onlee"!

The past week has seen troubling articles on events in the Mohammadden world showing intolerance in countries routinely used by the Mohammadden’s to demonstrate that theirs is a faith that is tolerant.

In Indonesia, one of the two other countries besides Turkey touted as a model to shown the tolerant aspects of Mohammaddenism , a series of incidents that display intolerance for Non-Mohammadden’s and minority Mohammadden sects:

Ask Atheists, Christians, Shiites and Ahmadis: Indonesia Is No Model for Muslim Democracy

In Malaysia, the other of the two countries besides Turkey touted as a model to show the tolerant aspects of Mohammaddenism, a book is banned as it “is believed to have elements that can deviate Muslims from their faith and which insulted Islam”:

Home Ministry bans Irshad Manji's book

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 28 May 2012 03:31

From Dutch teacher suspended over anti-Muslim tweets

The Dutch press reports that Fioritti College in Lisse has suspended a teacher named Anand Soekhoe and will not be renewing his contract, after he posted anti-Muslim comments on Twitter.

In a series of Islamophobic tweets Soekhoe declared his support for Geert Wilders and the PVV, warned that anyone considering voting for leftists, liberals or Christian Democrats should think of their grandchildren ("Otherwise future generations will speak Arabic! And Islam will be the state religion), quoted the Hindu-supremacist Bharatiya Janata Party as saying "never trust Muslims", adding that the BJP was increasingly shown to be right, and concluded with the observation that "Islam is not a religion but barbaric backwardness".

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 28 May 2012 03:38

Malaysia’s Kelantan demands Islamic designs in Buddhist building

A controversy is brewing over the proposal for the construction of a Buddhist building here after the PAS-led state government ruled that new buildings should include Islamic designs to reflect the state capital’s status as an Islamic city.

State Local Government, Culture, Arts and Tourism committee chairman Takiyuddin Hassan said developers must incorporate some Islamic elements in their plans or the proposals would be rejected.

“We will ensure development will be based on Islamic principles and features,” he told a press conference here.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 28 May 2012 05:23

Anindya wrote:From Dutch teacher suspended over anti-Muslim tweets

The Dutch press reports that Fioritti College in Lisse has suspended a teacher named Anand Soekhoe and will not be renewing his contract, after he posted anti-Muslim comments on Twitter.

In a series of Islamophobic tweets Soekhoe declared his support for Geert Wilders and the PVV, warned that anyone considering voting for leftists, liberals or Christian Democrats should think of their grandchildren ("Otherwise future generations will speak Arabic! And Islam will be the state religion), quoted the Hindu-supremacist Bharatiya Janata Party as saying "never trust Muslims", adding that the BJP was increasingly shown to be right, and concluded with the observation that "Islam is not a religion but barbaric backwardness".

Dutch society is already split heavily down the middle. Going after Geert is no political escape route for his political opponents. Geert is clever and has widened his appeal over economic steps too. Anand can possibly take the legal route and in the immediate future, Dutch society will change along its current trajectory for Anand to be vindicated and supported.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 28 May 2012 05:31

Liberal societies to blame for assaults on young girls:

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 28 May 2012 05:49

^Bji

When a society loses its consciousness and becomes a mere instrument, it gets played by others

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 28 May 2012 08:31

NSFW pic.

An ex-Muslim Pakistani female expat has a picture posted of a Koran placed in front of her vaXXX. With Following message.

Islam, like other religions, is patriarchal, oppressive, and abusive. It not only offends humanism in general by its war-mongering and prejudice preaching doctrine, but it especially hurts the feminist cause of equality and freedom by subjugating women under irrationality and subjecting them to an inferior status. This self-portrait of mine shows how god and his patriarchy is meek before powerful femininity and how, because of its massive power, god and the men who invented him have always wanted to control and stomp over the basic human rights that women, too, are entitled to.

http://secularlyyours.files.wordpress.c ... .jpg?w=590

http://secularlyyours.wordpress.com/201 ... -feminism/