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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 03:04 
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^How did he crossed the LoC which is covered by barbed electric wires throughout. :-?
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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 03:20 
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IIRC LoC is not wired but IB is.

-Ankit


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 08:06 
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Ankit Desai wrote:
IIRC LoC is not wired but IB is.

-Ankit


LoC is fenced but as anyone who's been around that terrain will testify to, it cannot be done right through all the natural features, especially those which involve H2O.


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 09:22 
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RajitO wrote:
LoC is fenced but as anyone....


If you fenced LoC than fence becomes permanent demarcation and LoC is no longer considered LoC. You may find some temporary or make shift arrangement but not same as SagarAg posted in the picture. You may find such temporary arrangements much inside Indian side (where pakis can not disturb it) than on LoC. I am sure you know what is the meaning of LoC.

The obstructive natural features you mentioned are applied to IB too.

check out maps.google.com .

-Ankit


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 10:36 
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Whatever, it means that Paki did not inadvertently cross it, he deliberately crossed it.


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 10:52 
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^^^ The fencing is at a certain distance INSIDE the LOC and not on the LOC.

Each side of LOC has a no-man's land where no structures can be build - at least theoretically. The depth of fence from LOC generally at the point where no-man's land ends. But, for various reasons like geography and lay-of-the-land, the alignment varies from location to location.

In case of recent cross border raid by PA BAT, they had ambushed Indian patrol between fence and no-man's land. And it so happens that the sector they chose is hilly will undulating terrain and fence sits a some depth from LOC. This allowed them to come in undetected and site an ambush.


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 13:44 
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Rohitvats ji, I learnt some time ago that the fencing is BEHIND the Army posts there. So, how exactly is it? Is it LoC--> No man's Land--> Army posts--> Fencing?


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 15:16 
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atreya wrote:
Rohitvats ji, I learnt some time ago that the fencing is BEHIND the Army posts there. So, how exactly is it? Is it LoC--> No man's Land--> Army posts--> Fencing?


As I said, from what I know, the fence generally sits at the same depth from LOC where the no-man's land ends.

As you have said, some of the army posts are between LOC and fence in this area. This could be because the fence is sited in depth for reasons of geography or nature of terrain or tactical considerations. Try and figure out the fence on Google Earth and see its alignment...in the plains of Jammu, it follows the alignment of LOC at a certain depth...the moment it reaches hilly and thence, mountainous areas, the alighment varies.


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 15:44 
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Was the fence constructed before, or after the ceasefire on the LoC? I guess that would also have some impact on the alignment


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PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 22:01 
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^^ Fencing in J&K started much earlier than ABV Govt ceasefire.

The first successful fence was on the Punjab border, followed by Bangladesh. The success of these fencing exercises were much higher than expectations. Thereafter the J&K fencing was started. The fence has been greatly instrumental in reducing infiltration.

The fence is among the greatest feats of military engineering of last century - though unrecognized by the nation & the world - given the nature of the terrain and the continuous firing & hostile activities by the Pakistani forces.

It is some distance behind the LoC, often exploiting natural defensive advantages of the terrain. There are posts beyond the fence.

BTW, for so much hue & cry of the lost Pakistani in the newspaper, he might as well have been on a survey/reco.


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PostPosted: 17 Feb 2013 11:40 
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tsarkar wrote:
^^ Fencing in J&K started much earlier than ABV Govt ceasefire.

The first successful fence was on the Punjab border, followed by Bangladesh. The success of these fencing exercises were much higher than expectations. Thereafter the J&K fencing was started. The fence has been greatly instrumental in reducing infiltration.

The fence is among the greatest feats of military engineering of last century 8) 8) - though unrecognized by the nation & the world - given the nature of the terrain and the continuous firing & hostile activities by the Pakistani forces.

It is some distance behind the LoC, often exploiting natural defensive advantages of the terrain. There are posts beyond the fence.

BTW, for so much hue & cry of the lost Pakistani in the newspaper, he might as well have been on a survey/reco.



So, the Indian RR soldiers were patrolling between LoC and post beyond the fence when the ambush took place. :?: :-? If yes then no further questions but if they were patrolling behind the fencing how did the Pak team ambushed them behind the fence?


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PostPosted: 17 Feb 2013 13:19 
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SagarAg, I don't know about the ambush day, but usually Army patrols with the fence to their back near the LoC. But if pics are to be believed, in Rajasthan and Gujarat, the BSF patrols BEHIND the fence, thereby giving them some measure of security.

And a minor nitpick, I don't think the ambushed patrol was that of RR. AFAIK, RR isn't involved in patrolling at the border, can't be sure of that though. Wasn't the patrol a regular Army unit?


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 05:13 
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Feud between army and BRO engineers hits road projects


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 10:17 
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VinodTK wrote:


From the above link, an important news item:

Quote:
A case in point is Durbuk-Daulat Beg Oldie road. About 160km of this 255km-long critical passage that provides connectivity to Daulat Beg Oldie - the last point before Karakoram - has been completed, but a 110km stretch needs to be re-laid. A problem in the road's alignment was noticed after sections were washed away by flooding from the Shyok river that flows along the link.


DBO has been maintained till date through air-maintenance. The surface link involves hiking through a very treacherous terrain and from Shyok Village along the Shyok river, DBO is easily 3-4 days trek.

The laying of this road should allow for easier movement of troops and material and reduce dependence on air-support. A long overdue requirement which is being thankfully now being met.

Added later:

The road will allow for surface connectivity of this vital sector - also called Sub Sector North (SSN) with both Nubra Valley and Chushul.

Please see the map link below:

http://wikimapia.org/#lat=34.1105896&lon=78.1118938&z=8&l=0&m=h

The cursor in the map is centered on Darbuk - which is situated prior to Pangong Tso Lake and Chushul further down. The road connects Darbuk with Shyok Village and thence follows north along the alignment of Shyok River in upper Shyok Valley.

What remains to be the seen is how it moves from Shyok River valley to Aksai Chin Plateau. The land route taken to reach DBO and thence KK Pass actually leaves the Shyok River and reached a point called Murgo which has a village and I think an ITBP Camp as well. From here, it goes to Burtse Camp, Qizil Langar and reaches the Depsang Plains.

The cursor on the map below is centered on Murgo:
http://wikimapia.org/#lat=35.0411581&lon=77.9366019&z=12&l=0&m=b&v=8

To North-East of Murgo you can see Burtse Camp marked on the map. North of this is Qizil Langar and Depsang Plain. Further North is DBO and KK Pass.

The new road will connect DBO with Nubra Valley and HQ of 102 Infantry Bde (responsible for SSN/DBO) and Chushul (HQ of 114 Infantry Bde). We will finally get much required connectivity between sectors. But mind you, Shyok is a very treacherous river. If you zoom on the river in maps linked above, you can see that it flows in multiple channels. On top of it, the side walls of river are very steep.

These two features pose two problems - (a) you cannot walk along the bank of the river as there is practically no bank. You have to walk on the river bed. (b) Because you have to walk along river bed and the river flows in multiple channels, you are forced to cross the river multiple times as you zig-zag your way from one bank to other.

Here is an example of river flowing in multiple channels:

Image


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 11:42 
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SagarAg wrote:
Indian RR soldiers
atreya wrote:
don't think the ambushed patrol was that of RR.
Side effect of using too much jargon. The Army Unit was Rajputana Rifles that SagarAg has abbrevated to RR. The official abbreviation is RajRif. RR referred by atreya is for Rashtriya Rifles, that operates on the CI grid.

@Rohit - Building a road along the river is highly risky - cloudbursts or melting snow can increase water levels in no time. Following the mountain slope with culverts for barsati nallahs is a better option. These roads will be expensive to build & will suffer from rockslides/mudslides but hopefully cant be flooded for long stretches of time.


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 11:59 
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tsarkar wrote:
<SNIP>
@Rohit - Building a road along the river is highly risky - cloudbursts or melting snow can increase water levels in no time. Following the mountain slope with culverts for barsati nallahs is a better option. These roads will be expensive to build & will suffer from rockslides/mudslides but hopefully cant be flooded for long stretches of time.


Correct.

I think that is what will be required to be done. The roads will have to be cut in the side walls at an elevation from the river bed. And in this case, to prevent requirement for river crossing (and associated bridge), the road will have to be on the eastern bank of Shyok river.


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 16:09 
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atreya wrote:
Rohitvats ji, I learnt some time ago that the fencing is BEHIND the Army posts there. So, how exactly is it? Is it LoC--> No man's Land--> Army posts--> Fencing?


The LC fence does not run exactly along the LC. It is in fact, anything from a few hundred meters to upto five kms. There were small pockets of settlements which often straddle the LC, AFAIK these were also not relocated.

The LC fence is also not continuous as one might imagine as not only are these damaged more frequently but are also difficult to maintain but built along the traditional infiltration routes ie infamous nallah's. The idea being to bottle up attempts along certain areas which can be dominated along the ridgelines. they are built into the three-tier CI grid. With regular troops guarding the LC, some units which are dual-tasked followed by the RR Sectors.


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 18:09 
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There was some talk of making Sasser la motorable - would that be a feasible alternative route to Shyok valley ?


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PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 23:27 
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srin wrote:
There was some talk of making Sasser la motorable - would that be a feasible alternative route to Shyok valley ?


Never heard of that.

But I don't think we require it. One simply needs to follow the Shyok river due east and thence north to reach where Saser La would take one. The pass was used in summer because Shyok river would be in full flow and it was considered very dangerous to cross because of reasons I gave earlier.


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PostPosted: 19 Feb 2013 00:04 
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Finally found it - this was by a serving IA officer posted in Leh. http://www.bcmtouring.com/forum/travelogues-north-india-f61/leh-diary-family-pets-t19139-91/#post437318

Quote:
Now, a bit of news. During my last journey in the area (alone and via aerial route), I had clicked and posted a few pics of the Sasoma Loops. This road was under construction then. Today, this road to Saser La (52 Kms from Sasoma) is ready and is in use. These loops can be seen from far. It falls in restricted area but as per the news regarding new peaks being opened up for climbing, it will be thrown open to visitors in near future. As on date, area is out of bounds.


No point in building a road to Saser la, unless it goes down the other side to Shyok.


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PostPosted: 19 Feb 2013 11:27 
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VinodTK wrote:


Dear Friends this news Item is pure DDM.

The Head of BRO is always from the Army and thats the way it has been envisaged from the organisation was created. The news that anybody is upset because of this pure DDM based on worst kind of Chai Biskoot Tales.

Secondly, In the recent past (last 5 years or so) there has been significant expansion in the organisation and in the meanwhile some new command posts were created for which senior officers from the Army or BRO Civillian officers weren't immeditaely avaialble, to overcome this, as a stop gap measure some junior officers were posted on deputation to higher formations as Officers in Charge. This is routine.

As and when Army and Civillian officers are available on promotion or deputation these posts will be filled with the officers of desired rank/seniority.

All command officer ranks are split evenly between Army and Civillian Officers and postings to some key posts (Directors at DGBR) are rotated between Army and Civil officers, this is strictly adhered to. At any time the no of CE/Brig rank officers are shared at 50%. No single post is earmarked for anybody and all who mater know this.


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 00:39 
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Army Chief asks commanders to consolidate gains in J-K
Quote:
JAMMU: Army Chief Gen Bikram Singh today exhorted senior commanders in the Northern Theatre to further consolidate their gains in counter-insurgency operations achieved during the past two years.

Gen Singh had an interaction with Lt Gen K T Parnaik, GOC-in-C Northern Command, and other senior officers in the Command Theatre at Udhampur, 65 kms from here.

"Senior commanders should further consolidate on their gains in counter-insurgency operations achieved during the past two years," Gen Singh said during his brief visit to the Northern Command Headquarters.

Due to bad weather, the Army Chief's aircraft had to land at Jammu and he went to Udhampur by road.

Gen Singh was apprised of the current security situation and the operational preparedness of the Northern Command.


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 09:29 
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Forgotten IPKF Memorial Rediscovered in Palaly Radhakrishnan, The Hindu
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A long-forgotten memorial to soldiers of the Indian Peace Keeping Force inside the Palaly high security zone has been re-discovered.

“The memorial was found late last year,” Indian High Commissioner to Sri Lanka Ashok K. Kantha told The Hindu . After Jaffna Consul General V. Mahalingam and a team verified the structure, the High Commission requested the Sri Lankan government’s support in sprucing up the memorial befitting martyrs.

“The Sri Lankan government was very cooperative and we thank it for its support,” Mr. Kantha said.

Mr. Mahalingam said: “Some people found it, and they informed us. Initially, we were not sure. But they took a few pictures and sent them to us.”

Commander of Jaffna security forces Mahinda Hathurusinghe and his team helped clear the wild growth and assisted reclaiming the memorial.

On Wednesday, Mr. Kantha, Mr. Mahalingam and others paid floral tributes at the place.

The memorial pays homage to 33 men of the Indian elite special forces, the 10 Para Regiment, who were cremated there. It comprises seven structures and has the names of all the soldiers. A release said the lives were lost in IPKF operations in the Northern Province between 1987 and 1989.

The regiment suffered significant casualties in one of its first battles. A company of 10 Para Commando, was heli-landed into the Jaffna Fort to raid the LTTE headquarters in the opening stages of the campaign on October 12, 1987.

The LTTE greeted the commandos with a hail of gunfire. It is not clear if all those buried in Palaly are from the first battle or from multiple battles.

My salute to these bravehearts and their families.


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 12:08 
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SSridhar wrote:
Forgotten IPKF Memorial Rediscovered in Palaly Radhakrishnan, The Hindu
Quote:
A long-forgotten memorial to soldiers of the Indian Peace Keeping Force inside the Palaly high security zone has been re-discovered.
............

The LTTE greeted the commandos with a hail of gunfire. It is not clear if all those buried in Palaly are from the first battle or from multiple battles.

My salute to these bravehearts and their families.


Something I didn't know. Is this mistaken reportage, or standard IA practice in the field (I didn't think so, but then I'm no expert).


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 12:09 
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SSridhar wrote:
Forgotten IPKF Memorial Rediscovered in Palaly Radhakrishnan, The Hindu
Quote:
A long-forgotten memorial to soldiers of the Indian Peace Keeping Force inside the Palaly high security zone has been re-discovered.
...
The memorial pays homage to 33 men of the Indian elite special forces, the 10 Para Regiment, who were cremated there. It comprises seven structures and has the names of all the soldiers. A release said the lives were lost in IPKF operations in the Northern Province between 1987 and 1989.
...
The regiment suffered significant casualties in one of its first battles. A company of 10 Para Commando, was heli-landed into the Jaffna Fort to raid the LTTE headquarters in the opening stages of the campaign on October 12, 1987.

The LTTE greeted the commandos with a hail of gunfire. It is not clear if all those buried in Palaly are from the first battle or from multiple battles.


Even here DDM strikes. :roll: In the Jaffna university raid, Para Commandos lost 6 men whereas this memorial has 33 listed - how can they all be from the 1st battle?


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 17:38 
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An Army Colonel among 6 detained for allegedly carrying illegal drugs


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 18:10 
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A shade off topic but this seems to be the appropriate thread....there were articles eons ago wherein the future soldier kit/weapons etc were being discussed...can we, just for theoretical brainstorming, discuss with images of what should the complete BDU with kit/weapon be for Indian soldiers in the next 5/10/15 years right from boots to the cap/helmet and everything in between?


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 18:11 
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^^^^^ i forgot to add terrain wise


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PostPosted: 24 Feb 2013 20:14 
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its DDM

there is no burial there - its a memorial


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PostPosted: 25 Feb 2013 20:10 
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Although, situation has changed dramaticaly after beheading of the Indian soldiers this article albeit dated looks still relevant from a few POVs. Found it interesting in light of the good general's aquittal from the encounter case last week.Tried to find the link in IE, TOI for the news but strangely could not. Posting the article in full. Hope, it is not posted before. Any comment, Gurus? http://www.newsinsight.net/Stop,chief.aspx#page=page-1
Stop, chief
Sly moves are afoot to withdraw AFSPA from Jammu and Kashmir.

By N.V. Subramanian (7 November 2012)

New Delhi: Whilst military writers are justifiably exercised over suggestions of track 2 peaceniks to pullout from Siachen, their anger must simultaneously focus on the army chief, General Bikram Singh, and his alleged shenanigans with the Jammu and Kashmir chief minister, Omar Abdullah, to withdraw the Armed Forces’ Special Powers Act (AFSPA) incrementally from the state.

AFSPA provides legal cover to the army in counterinsurgency operations. Under AFSPA, army personnel cannot be prosecuted for their actions without the consent of the Central government, which is rarely given. In J and K (as in Punjab and Assam earlier), it is the army which has contained terrorism. There was a time in the early 1990s when the Centre had given up on the state, when the first of the “pro-azadi” groups had spread its influence rapidly. It is the army which retrieved the situation when Central intelligence failed and the local police sided with the insurgency. AFSPA was amended and applied to J and K, and all told, it has assisted the state to keep on top of the terrorism situation.

AFSPA has been a bugbear for Omar Abdullah for no other reason than that he has been a failure as J and K’s chief minister and finds it politically expedient to demand its withdrawal. Omar has excellent communications skills but zero vision, in which he resembles the dynasts in power in Delhi and Lucknow. To boot, he has a fiery opposition leader in Mehbooba Mufti of the PDP who has an accommodative relationship with the insurgent elements of the state. When young and misguided Kashmiri stone-throwers two summers ago almost seemed to get the better of Omar Abdullah, another dynast, Rahul Gandhi, threw him a lifeline, on which basis he continues as chief minister.

Early in his tenure, Omar cooked up a bizarre scheme with the then Union home minister, P.Chidambaram, to hand over the paramilitaries’ anti-insurgency tasks to the local police, which is both mixed up with the separatists and otherwise inadequate for a bigger fighting role against them. Framed-up rape charges against some paramilitary troops in Shopian (later disproved) became the reason to seek the ouster of the paramilitaries from the Valley, nearly bowing to which demand Omar Abdullah and Chidambaram played into the hands of the terrorists, until this writer explained the insidious psy-war (Commentary, “Bad news”, 3 July 2009). Omar Abdullah’s demand for AFSPA’s withdrawal from Jammu and Kashmir has predated that crisis and grown stronger since.

Omar Abdullah believes AFSPA’s removal would open the Kashmiri floodgates of love and affection for him. Not true. Sheikh Abdullah was an iconic leader of Kashmir, and Kashmiris were willing to forgive him quite a lot. His son and Omar’s father, Farooq, is a bit of a buffoon, with no vision for Kashmir, but he is a genial mixer. Farooq gets on easily with his people, even though they may not agree with his politics. Omar Abdullah, on the other hand, is the least sociable of the Abdullah clan. He prefers running Kashmir with a handful of officials from the safety and security of his chief minister’s bungalow. He is distant with his own party colleagues and has little interaction with the people. There is no connect between Omar Abdullah and Kashmiris. He might as well be administrating the state from Delhi.

Omar Abdullah knows he is on a very weak wicket in J and K, and that he will be thrown out in the next election. He needs something -- anything -- to befuddle and bamboozle Kashmiris. Kashmiri politicians in their engagements with the Centre have traditionally played the Kashmir card, which in substance means, “After me, the Deluge.” With Kashmiris, these same politicians pose as being anti-Centre. Being politically savvy, the Kashmiris have seen through this game long ago. But Omar Abdullah, all the same, cannot give up posing, and in one of those poses, he wants AFSPA to be rolled back from Kashmir.

No army chief or field commander has supported Omar Abdullah. In his own inoffensive way, the defence minister, A.K.Anthony, has rejected Abdullah’s demand. In its confused libertinism, the Manmohan Singh government may yet agree to AFSPA’s withdrawal, but the rest of the political class, and particularly the BJP, will object. The strategic community will not stand for it. Faced with a wall, Omar Abdullah seemed to have reconciled to the continued operation of AFSPA, but the appointment of a new army chief, General Bikram Singh, appears to have given him a new unexpected opportunity.

The chief hurdle that General Singh faced in his appointment was a case of alleged human rights’ violation in 2001 in Anantnag in a place called Janglat Mandi. As a brigadier, he is supposed to have killed a beggar in a false encounter. A relatively unknown J and K NGO filed a PIL against him, which in turn became the basis for a second PIL in the Supreme Court against General Singh’s appointment as army chief, which was rejected. The Kashmir NGO, however, is pursuing its PIL in the state high court, and press reports allege a section of the army is trying to hush the matter in the interest of the chief.

There is new intelligence that suggests the army chief has allegedly pressed on Omar Abdullah to somehow bring the false encounter case to a closure. In return, General Bikram Singh has reportedly assured that the army will not oppose his demands on AFSPA as before. Except that a crucial army commander who has to author and initiate this changed line has refused, saying that any dilution of AFSPA will lead to a successful terrorists’ disruption of the 2014 general elections in the state, a key aim of Pakistan to internationalize the Kashmir issue all over again. General Bikram Singh has allegedly threatened the obdurate army commander with a transfer to a lesser command, but he remains unfazed. The army chief has now plans to get a supine army commander who will agree with his scheme to weaken and eventually remove AFSPA from Jammu and Kashmir.

All to save his skin.

General Bikram Singh has been bad news for the Indian Army from the start. That it would get so worse still comes as a surprise. Next you know he will signal a withdrawal from Siachen. This man must be stopped.


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PostPosted: 25 Feb 2013 20:25 
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^^^

We told you so?


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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2013 05:10 
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Army renews hunt for bunker-bursting rifles 8 years after bribery scandal
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NEW DELHI: The Army is launching a fresh hunt for anti-material rifles, meant for "bunker-bursting" as well as "penetrating" light-armoured vehicles, eight years after its earlier project with South African company Denel got derailed mid-way due to kickback allegations and political mudslinging.

The Army is now ready with the technical parameters, or GSQRs (general staff qualitative requirements), for the fresh global tender for the anti-material rifles. The force wants the rifle — weighing not over 15 kg to ensure two soldiers can carry it -- with an effective range of over 1,000-metre to take on enemy bunkers and other field fortifications, "soft-skinned" armoured vehicles and low-flying helicopters, say sources.

The new anti-material rifle project will be a major one, with the first lot being imported directly and the rest indigenously manufactured after transfer of technology (ToT). The Army, apart from its other arms, wants each of its 355 infantry battalions to have at least four such specialized rifles that can fire special calibre high-explosive incendiary/armour-piercing ammunition.

The long-delayed quest for these rifles is just one of the several military modernization projects that have gone for a toss due to corruption scams and consequent blacklisting of armament majors. "The guilty should be hung...the entire procurement system needs to be overhauled to ensure national security requirements are not hit time and again," said a senior officer.

For instance, Army's failure to induct even a single advanced 155mm artillery gun since the Bofors scandal of the mid-1980s. "Blacklisting has proven counter-productive. Most major artillery manufacturers, like Denel, Rheinmetall, Singapore Technologies and Soltam, are blacklisted by India...It's only now the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB) and private players like the Tatas are developing 155mm howitzers," said a MoD official.

The anti-material rifles' story is similar. The UPA-I government in April 2005 had put on hold all dealings with Denel after it came to light that 12.75% commission was allegedly paid to a firm, Varas Associates, to swing the five contracts signed between July 1999 and March 2005.

The contracts were for 700 anti-material rifles and 398,000 rounds of ammunition, followed by ToT to OFB along with "knocked down kits" for another 300 rifles. The Army had inducted just around 300 rifles when the CBI registered the case in June 2005.

At that time, the Congress was using the case — along with the emergency purchases for the 1999 Kargil conflict and the Tehelka tapes — to go after George Fernandes, who was the defence minister in the NDA regime when the initial rifle contracts were inked. The CBI, however, is yet to make any major headway in the case.

Now, Army wants to induct light-weight anti-material rifles that are "man-portable" with a two-jawan crew. "The Denel rifles, while they have performed well, are quite heavy at 28-29 kg apiece. There are also major problems in importing its specialized bullets and ammunition," said an officer.


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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2013 11:19 
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Denel rifles were great till they were imported. Now OFB has reverse engineered it, so it is junk.


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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2013 11:22 
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Is it Parnaik who the chief allegedly threatened?


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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2013 11:23 
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vic wrote:
Denel rifles were great till they were imported. Now OFB has reverse engineered it, so it is junk.


Is Vidhwansak the reverse engineered version ?


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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2013 22:01 
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Yes, and we should use indigenous solutions as far as possible. Use a three men team till we are able to develop a lighter version of Vidhawank.


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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013 03:55 
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Also consider kinetics. The mass is high due to the energy that has to be absorbed. May be the OFB model can have a Ti stock etc for weight reduction.

A dont see how 15 kg model can fire a 20mm shell? The OFB version has three different calibers and can barrels can be.


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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013 08:56 
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There is a news flash that a senior militant has been killed in the "Keri forward belt in Rajouri", no injuries or casualties for security forces. this seems to be an Army operation (may be RR)


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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013 20:01 
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I am not saying that Vidhawansk is best but it is adequate and can be used. Also like Reinmetal may have trying to kill indigeous AD gun similarly I wonder about need for light anti material gun and Singapore Technologies offering one.


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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013 20:32 
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Well the Denel Gun was banned as part of Aman ki Asha since it was causing too many Pakistani casualties. Vidhwansak can be made in numbers whiel reserch can go on to reduce weight. This saga is ridiculous.


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