Air Force Tejas Mk1: News & Discussions: 02 January 2022

[Pratyush]

Congratulations to both ADA and DRDO.

[basant]

Since FOC.

With firing trials o ground and in air ?

No news about firing in air, just ground testing is known publicly.

[wig]

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/t ... 2023-08-23

Combat aircraft Tejas successfully test fires India-made missile ASTRA
extracts

Indigenously developed Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas on Wednesday successfully test-fired an indigenously developed ASTRA beyond visual range (BVR) air-to-air missile off the coast of Goa.

According to defence ministry officials, the missile release was successfully carried out from the aircraft at an altitude of about 20,000 feet and all the objectives of the test were achieved with a perfect launch.

[basant]

Great development. Hopefully it will be inducted soon.

[ernest]

No news about firing in air, just ground testing is known publicly.

there's video of aerial firing on twitter. shared by DRDO updates, HVTIAF, and many BRFites
https://twitter.com/DRDO_India/status/1 ... 2270268445

[basant]

No news about firing in air, just ground testing is known publicly.

there's video of aerial firing on twitter. shared by DRDO updates, HVTIAF, and many BRFites
https://twitter.com/DRDO_India/status/1 ... 2270268445

I was answering for the integration of gun. You don't want to test BVR in ground.

[ramana]

Finally Indian-designed plane fires Indian-designed BVR.
And IAF has 40 planes that can fire Astra.

[ashishvikas]

Hope Astra stockpiling is being done on war footing without waiting for Astra MK2 etc.

A new order of Astra mk1 must be placed immediately.

[basant]

Indeed. News from last year: Bharat Dynamics will supply 400 Astra Mk1 missiles and their associated equipment, to be delivered in four years.

[ernest]

I was answering for the integration of gun. You don't want to test BVR in ground.

Mea Culpa

Can't see beyond CY3 and Astra mk-1 today due to all the unfurled lungis

[Prem Kumar]

Great news and an amazing video! Love the pop-up the Astra does once is clears the aircraft

While the 400 missile order is a good start, its nowhere near enough to confront 2 adversaries. Just for comparison, beggar Pakis have stockpiled 500 AIMs

Hope the IAF is not waiting for Astra-Mk2. Need a massive repeat order of Astra-Mk1 to regain our edge in BVR combat

[disha]

Great news and an amazing video! Love the pop-up the Astra does once is clears the aircraft

While the 400 missile order is a good start, its nowhere near enough to confront 2 adversaries. Just for comparison, beggar Pakis have stockpiled 500 AIMs

Hope the IAF is not waiting for Astra-Mk2. Need a massive repeat order of Astra-Mk1 to regain our edge in BVR combat

Finally Indian-designed plane fires Indian-designed BVR.
And IAF has 40 planes that can fire Astra.

^ I came here to post congratulations to Tejas+Astra team and above posts summarizes all my thoughts succinctly! Many thanks PremJi and RamanaJi.

On a personal note: I have been asked to make do with a single party for two epochal events. So hope next time the "good news for jingoes team" staggers their "good news". Even though "yeh dil maange more", the heart can take only so much!

[basant]

Finally Indian-designed plane fires Indian-designed BVR.
And IAF has 40 planes that can fire Astra.

Ramana garu, I am confused. IAF has 40 a/c that can fire Brahmos. As for Astra, it should be all Sukhois and Tejas, much more than 40.

[Rakesh]

Tejas Mk1 deliveries are all complete.

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1694303746271191050?s=20 ---> The Chief of Air Staff Air Chief Marshal VR Chaudhari reviewed the status of the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) program in Air Headquarters yesterday. Also in attendance were senior functionaries from the Ministry of Defence, DRDO, HAL and ADA. Opening the proceedings, the CAS brought out that the LCA has been the flag bearer of the Indian Air Force's (IAF) efforts towards indigenisation of its aircraft fleet.

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1694303970238529931?s=20 ---> During the review, it was brought out that all the contracted fighter variants of the LCA Mk1 had been delivered to the IAF. Representatives of HAL assured the Chief of Air Staff of the timely delivery of the contracted twin-seaters in the coming months, as well. Further to the LCA Mk 1, 83 LCA Mk-1A aircraft have also been contracted by the IAF in 2021. The Chairman & Managing Director of HAL assured those present that the deliveries of this advanced variant of the LCA would commence by Feb 2024.

...

...

Missing the first flight date of SP-36 on Page 1 of this thread. Any info?

[basant]

No Admiral, I have no news on that. Apologies.

[Rakesh]

How would you like to die today?

https://twitter.com/DefenceDecode/statu ... 67441?s=20 ---> Air-to-air missiles on Tejas.

[Prem Kumar]

Tejas Mk1 deliveries are all complete.

......

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1694303970238529931?s=20 ---> During the review, it was brought out that all the contracted fighter variants of the LCA Mk1 had been delivered to the IAF. Representatives of HAL assured the Chief of Air Staff of the timely delivery of the contracted twin-seaters in the coming months, as well. Further to the LCA Mk 1, 83 LCA Mk-1A aircraft have also been contracted by the IAF in 2021. The Chairman & Managing Director of HAL assured those present that the deliveries of this advanced variant of the LCA would commence by Feb 2024.

I think this was a key reason to announce the plan for 100 Tejas MK1A yesterday. The delivery completion of MK1 would have given the IAF confidence that HAL can be trusted to do this.

[Rakesh]

The War in Ukraine has finally woken up Air HQ. That is also a huge factor in the decision.

[Pratyush]

Or maybe the IAF top brass has been told that it's not Maggie that you are buying. This is a product that requires a supply chain. Supply chain can only be created and sustained when the top brass gives order to manufacture the damm jets.

[JTull]

The War in Ukraine has finally woken up Air HQ. That is also a huge factor in the decision.

Or maybe the IAF top brass has been told that it's not Maggie that you are buying. This is a product that requires a supply chain. Supply chain can only be created and sustained when the top brass gives order to manufacture the damm jets.

Both are correct.

First MRFA aircraft from an Indian production line won't come before 2028 even if orders are placed today. And, that'll be with 80-90% imported components. You can't fight tomorrow's wars with such dubious supply chains.

LCA Tejas are already being rolled out of a working production line. Once GE 404/414 line becomes operational, we'd have a very high degree (~90%) of control over the supply chain. And, we already have impressive list of upgrades that are coming when compared to the first Mk1A that will roll out in Feb-24, viz, Uttam with optimised desi radome, and weapons integration with Astra Mk1/2/3 and Astra launcher family(incl ejector, dual rack, etc), RudraM family, SAAW with quad launchers, ASRAAM, ASPJ, etc. And, I am not even talking about the capabilities of Mk2.

Besides the aircraft, pilot training will become so much easier. Imagine 100s of pilots that transition Mk1 -> Mk1a -> Mk2 almost seamlessly. It'll feel like a simple type-conversion.

Chandrayaan-3 and soon Gaganyaan euphoria will sub-consciously help improve trust of desi products designed by our scientists.

[ashishvikas]

Tejas Mk1 with DRDO ASPJ Pod

https://twitter.com/Duorope/status/1695 ... 85761?s=20

https://twitter.com/SoumyaR57322232/sta ... 64498?s=20

[fanne]

can the aspj be conformal?

[ernest]

I hope the recent developments make it easier for Tejas to secure orders from Argentina too. Shows faith of our armed forces in domestic product. Better return on replacing British components with the scale of orders we have now. Create indigenous alternatives for some more components. R-73 + Astra combination will be enough for Arg.

[yensoy]

can the aspj be conformal?

Yeah exactly, why isn't the self-protection jammer capability built right into the aircraft itself?

[Pratyush]

Because when the aircraft was being designed, such capabilities were not considered integral to the aircraft.

Only much later on was such capacity considered integral. Remember one of the later criticisms of the aircraft as it not being fitted with an internal jammer.

Which is one of the reasons why the IAF was so keen on Mk2.

[Manish_P]

Noob question

Can the ASPJ be attached under the nose? Or will it have conflict with the radar.

If it could be done a valuable wing hardpoint can remain free for a munition

[Aditya_V]

Noob Question why can ASPJ fitted near the Tail or even a Jaguar style Over wing point, but we don't know the changes required in the internals, Aerodynamic effect, effect on FBW etc. Ideally this can be placed beside the Brake Parachute or small hump -much smaller than MIg 29 UPG.

[ashishvikas]

^^
Internally there's no space and outboard pylon - It's as per plan and details provided by Indranil Roy & Nilesh Rane.

Now even while ADA was developing the Tejas Mk2 for the IAF, HAL proposed a simpler interim upgrade. Thus emerged the Tejas Mk1A which will be equipped with an ELTA EL/M- 2052 active electronic scanned array (AESA) radar along with a compatible electronic warfare suite, which would include a self protection jammer (SPJ) pod carried on the outboard wing pylon. This position was found to derive maximum performance out of the pod. On the the outboard pylon, two CCMs would be carried on a dual-rack pylon as shown in Figure 1. This configuration was found to have lowest drag penalties among a variety of studied configurations.

https://delhidefencereview.com/2019/02/ ... er-part-i/

[VishnuS]

I hope the recent developments make it easier for Tejas to secure orders from Argentina too. Shows faith of our armed forces in domestic product. Better return on replacing British components with the scale of orders we have now. Create indigenous alternatives for some more components. R-73 + Astra combination will be enough for Arg.

Replacement of Martin Baker seats is going to be the real issue!!

Desi replacement is going to cost us a fortune and I doubt IAF would like to replace MB with Desi....

Rest of the stuff, I think our large order can help HAL/ADA to justify the replacement.

If I remember correctly, Argentina was quoted some $600M for making these changes

[VishnuS]

Noob question

Can the ASPJ be attached under the nose? Or will it have conflict with the radar.

If it could be done a valuable wing hardpoint can remain free for a munition

Sirji, with dual rack pylons are going to be available soon, so this should not be an issue.

[Cybaru]

How would you like to die today?

LOL

[Manish_P]

Noob question

Can the ASPJ be attached under the nose? Or will it have conflict with the radar.

If it could be done a valuable wing hardpoint can remain free for a munition

Sirji, with dual rack pylons are going to be available soon, so this should not be an issue.

I get that sir. What i was wondering was why not a dedicated under-nose hard-point

The Tomcat had such an arrangement for the IRST

[Prem Kumar]

Given that ASPJ is compatible with only EL-2052 & later Uttam and not with the Tejas-Mk1 radar, I am assuming that the current pictures we are seeing of MK1 with ASPJ is to test out the airflow characteristics, which would be more or less common between Mk1 and Mk1A?

[basant]

Can't see the tail number but the prototype of Mk1As are flying too. So it could be more than aerodynamics.

[Rakesh]

Can't see the tail number but the prototype of Mk1As are flying too. So it could be more than aerodynamics.

Aircraft is LA-5015. You can see it here, right above the left wheel in the MLG.

[mody]

There used to be a Litening-IV pod fitted on a dedicated 8th pylon, in front of the center fuselage hard point on the right edge of the fuselage.
Over the past couple of years, hardly any photos have been seen with the same.
Has this option been discontinued? The Litening-IV was to act as LDP, FLIR and also possibly a poor mans IRST. I remember a few years back there was a lot of discussion on whether the Litening could actually work like an IRST pod.
However, now the photos of Tejas with the Litening pod are few and far between. Is this option still being used? If not, what will be the LDP on the Tejas?

[Bala Vignesh]

There used to be a Litening-IV pod fitted on a dedicated 8th pylon, in front of the center fuselage hard point on the right edge of the fuselage.
Over the past couple of years, hardly any photos have been seen with the same.
Has this option been discontinued? The Litening-IV was to act as LDP, FLIR and also possibly a poor mans IRST. I remember a few years back there was a lot of discussion on whether the Litening could actually work like an IRST pod.
However, now the photos of Tejas with the Litening pod are few and far between. Is this option still being used? If not, what will be the LDP on the Tejas?

I recall seeing the LDP on the static display Tejas at AI'23. I am trying to find pics of the same and will put it up once I find them.

My guess is that the photos with LDP were mostly during the weapons testing phase of the bird. Now that its mostly done and dusted may be it is not being utilised as much.

[maitya]

Normally don't post pics and videos ... but just couldn't control myself on this video.
Stunning is the one word description ...

[Jay]

Normally don't post pics and videos ... but just couldn't control myself on this video.
Stunning is the one word description ...

This is some gorgeous flying and camera work. Thanks for sharing!

[mody]

There used to be a Litening-IV pod fitted on a dedicated 8th pylon, in front of the center fuselage hard point on the right edge of the fuselage.
Over the past couple of years, hardly any photos have been seen with the same.
Has this option been discontinued? The Litening-IV was to act as LDP, FLIR and also possibly a poor mans IRST. I remember a few years back there was a lot of discussion on whether the Litening could actually work like an IRST pod.
However, now the photos of Tejas with the Litening pod are few and far between. Is this option still being used? If not, what will be the LDP on the Tejas?

I recall seeing the LDP on the static display Tejas at AI'23. I am trying to find pics of the same and will put it up once I find them.

My guess is that the photos with LDP were mostly during the weapons testing phase of the bird. Now that its mostly done and dusted may be it is not being utilised as much.

If the LDP is to be used only for air to ground weapons and that too particularly for Griffin-III/Paveway-II/IV LGBs only, then it would suggest that it will not or cannot be used as an IRST pod as well. If the pod is good enough to function as a viable IRST, then it would be used for most of the mission profiles.
All other air to ground guided weapons planned for the Tejas, like the SAAW, Gaurav/Gautam, Hammer, RudraM-1/2/3, possibly Rampage, possibly SPICE, do not require the Litening pod.