Bharat Rakshak

Sunil

Hi,

Firstly I would like to thank Capt. Hali for his response.

I will post on the issue later in the day.

Sunil

It could be that the unnamed official is an idiot - it would not be surprising that such an idiot would find himself in a position of power - I hear rumors that the promotion policy for flag officers has been modified considerably to promote loyal - as opposed to capable subordinates. The alternativ...

Sunil

Shiv, I agree with this idea of yours In this context - I believe that the threat to Musharraf is not from the pillais and the syed yusufs. They are the establishment's children, and as such represent a creamy layer in Pakistan. The real problem for Mushy may be between the creamy layer and the laye...

Sunil

Hi Tilak, If you read my first post on the thread - it clearly states that the thread is aimed at Pillai and Syed and other Pakistani lurkers. Ever since Capt. Hali was kind enough to type the words Bharatrakshak.com in the Nation newspaper, every Pakistani worth his salt in Islamabad is logging int...

Sunil

Tilak,

Thanks for your concern, but I actually want Pillai to participate. I have been trying to convey something to him and I worry that I might not have gotten through. I want to know if atleast he understands what I am saying.

Sunil

Pillai, So please quit being funny Sunil Miyan. How is the present situation any graver than the time, Paki foreign minister flew to Delhi and told Indian authorities about the F-16 waiting on the tarmac, with a mated nuke?? hain?? This sort of nuclear brinkmanship in the Indo-Pak context usually me...

Sunil

Hi, I think another matter needs some clarification. When I said "credible" I meant from a Pakistan perspective - *not* from an Indian perspective. Those are two different things. From an Indian perspective - every Pakistani threat is as credible as the last one but from a Pakistani perspe...

Sunil

Why are we assuming that pakistan's only real deterence is JDAM. If china can provide them with nuclear blueprints, Nucler fissile material, Nuclear capable ballastic missiles then why should we assume that they dont work. Is there something that I am missing. Hi Nav, Nuclear tipped missile tech ro...

Sunil

I think I should be more precise on this JDAM issue. You can only get past this threat if both sides agree to get past it. It can't happen as long as one side keeps relying on that idea to keep its end of the deterrence regime up and worse still is deeply psychologically wedded to it. You can't get ...

Sunil

Hi Anoop, The "trust" I am refering to speaks to the level of confidence that the current GoI has about its current counterpart in Islamabad's ability to deliver on any promises it makes. How precisely "trust" was established with regards to the Zia ul Haq regime when the Sri. Ra...

Sunil

If I find that confusing --- will the Pakistanis understand? I hope so. It isn't that hard to understand really esp. for the Pakistanis .. after all it boils down to the following points. 1) Pakistan cannot ever mate its warheads to its missiles and this fact is public knowledge now. Any attempt to...

Sunil

So whats the prognosis here? Well for starters... lets see... the cruise missile test was to preserve Pakistan Army's honor and dignity (H&D) so a public retraction of the "nuclear tipped submarine launchable cruise missiles" claim would amount to a loss of Pakistan's national manhood...

Sunil

Anoop, The Pakistanis later told us that the "cores weren't mated with weapons" or something to that effect and Pakistan's friends in the US and UK said reassuring things, but the matter has never been completely cleared up. Either ways Ravi Rikhye wrote his book about a planned Indian mil...

Sunil

Continuing on: Why would the Pakistanis want to do this? Shiv has come up with a very satisfactory answer to this. Their military leadership is feeling impotent and is losing moral authority to rule in Pakistan. So this is largely a PR stunt to shore up the sagging image of the military. As Shiv sug...

Sunil

Hi, I am not quite done with this yet. Irrespective of whether there was any test of any cruise missile at all. I want to make absolutely sure that the crux of my post has gone through and I would like Pillai and Syed Yusuf to confirm that they atleast have have understood what I was saying. For the...

Sunil

Pehle yeh mating wala funda clear karo phir we talk about Aegis.

Sunil

as a patriot all I care about is that (literally) "Babur" doesnt become "Ghenghis Kahn" for India.....and so again as I have asked all others ...what do you think is the best way to counter this missile.....and for once lets factor in that in the next couple of years Pakistan in...

Sunil

If TSP for whatever reason makes it clear that it has or will deploy SLBMs or SLCMs then China has crossed the line with us. Here is the deal - the reason TSP wants SLCMs is not for a guaranteed first strike (which they can easily get by producing BMs in numbers) but for dissuading India's retalati...

Sunil

D_Prem, It really helps to think before you post. PN surface vessels are not a threat. I have read the Howard Bloom article a year ago - and that was not possible due to a lack of technology on the Pakistani side. Then there is the "no mating" rule to consider. The Pakistanis do not want I...

Sunil

Folks keep the random chitchat down! It helps to understand the basics of deterrence between nuclear adversaries. 1) Deterence works only as long as there is enough time for the decision makers to react rationally. That means that if the delivery system is aircraft then there have to be radars. If t...

Sunil

Okay TSJ thanks, but you said earlier you can't prevent them from doing things in their defence right? Now I want to hear it from one of their mouths and someone better tell the Chinese about it. Hello Hali, Tere PAF College Sargodha waale seniors ko pooch kya chal raha hain aur phir Nation mey arti...

Sunil

Okay deep breath taken - in a calm voice I ask a simple question. Does this talk of a nuclear tipped cruise missile in the hands of the Pakistan Navy imply that the Pakistanis are now mating their warheads on to their weapons? This needs to be cleared up here. If Hali can read BR so can the rest of ...

Sunil

Where is that post Hali is quoting? I can't find it. Can someone point out the post to me please.

Sunil

Syed Yusuf, The current state of the Pakistani arsenal per the assurances given by Lt. Gen. Khalid Kidwai to a number of western nuclear experts is in a "demated condition" i.e. the warhead and the missile are stored in separate locations and the warhead is under guard (with entry and exit...

Sunil

D_Prem, You're doing it again. Think before you post. We're screwed if Pakis go on to installing their new Cruise missiles onto the Agostas: Why are we screwed? How are the Pakistanis going to install the cruise missiles on their Agostas? How long will it take them to design and build an indigenous ...

Sunil

Guys absolutely no flaming. Syed Yusuf, The Army in Pakistan is everything. Why would they share the power of a nuclear armed missile with the navy? Yes other countries have a cruise missile in their navy or airforce. But these countries have specifically stated that nuclear weapons will not be dep...

Sunil

They can't launch that thing during a conventional escalation. We will simply not know if it is conventional or nuclear. We will be forced to move assuming that it is nuclear - I need not outline the consequences of that. They can't use the cruise missile to do something that can be done with an LeT...

Sunil

With the current bunch of p*ssies in power and another bunch of p*ssies in opposition - Who is going to give the command to retaliate on this scale against Pakistan and cause so much death and devastation? IMO the Indian political class and its will to use force should not underestimated. The polit...

Sunil

Hi Uday, If I was the US I would be more keen to use an existing fellow as a stalking horse. I think everyone subconsciously uses the "Ayub-Yahya" model or the "Zia-Beg" model but I feel Ehsan is closer to Akhtar in terms of job description so I am proposing the stalking horse hy...

Sunil

Hi Nav, Where it really concerns me is if the missile is ever used on a dam such as Bhakra nagal. If Pakistan hits the Bhakra Nangal Dam - we will hit Mangla and Tarbela. That will be the end of Pakistan - the drought will kill millions of Pakistanis and the Pakistanis will have to negotiate for mor...

Sunil

Hi TSJ, I am going to let you go on with this "oh we really can't get them to..." act - simply because it amuses me. The act itself gives away the fact that you want to see the India-Pak situation be volatile and that is why you are keen to put it out there that "Pak is not nuke nude&...

Sunil

Hi, As discussed earlier with Ramana, the presence of Ehsan ul Haq instead of Pervez Musharraf seems to say all sorts of things. All in all I think it marks the rise of Ehsan Ul Haq. We may soon be hosting a "who is Ehsan ul Haq" thread on BRF. This latest test imo is not a threat to India...

Sunil

They are saying it again and again and we are getting mixed up with this bs about range and counter missiles systems - it has imo nothing to do with that. The Pakistanis are ticked off at the Indian refusal to accomodate cruise missiles in the notification system. The Pakistanis plan to sell that in...

Sunil

Hi,

Dileep got it. Thanks

Singha - let him get it to me and then we will see if it reads well and you want any changes to it.

Sunil

Hmmm.. thought about something. Uncle sam seems awfully quiet about this and musharraf is going to town telling everyone how babur is missile capable. Shaukat sultan made it a point to let everyone know that the test was conducted without notifying India as treaty does not require it. Chinese base i...

Sunil

Hi

Shishir just took up the task of putting Singha 1-4, and Guest-2 into a story. Singha as soon as he gets it in to me - I will send it you. Guest whoever that is should contact me as well.

Jay got to me with his collection.

Dileep please send me your copy.

Sunil

Hi, Shiv and Rudradev I agree with your views here. Rudradev, Ehsan ul Haq managed to turn the ISI's relationship with the US around. At a time when Mehmood's double dealing approach had alienated the ISI's old friends in DC, Ehsan helped calm people down. Why exactly AOSS's testimony Ehsan ul Haq's...

Sunil

Oddities in the test so far. 1) General Musharraf is not present at the site which odd since the whole test is being passed off as his "birthday present". Gen. Ehsan ul Haq is. You may recall that Ehsan was Corps Commander XI corps at Peshawar at the time of the Sept 11 attacks and AOSS in...

Sunil

Please continue all discussions here and post relevant news items here. Images: Yahoo: image http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050812/photos_wl/mdf639784 http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050811/ids_photos_wl/r4124689163.jpg http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050811/i...

Sunil

All right!..

I have a way to do this. So whoever is interested in writing please email me/admins. With luck we can turn this into a factory for SRR output.

Bharat Rakshak

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