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by peter
24 Apr 2016 19:20
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Does anyone (johnny?) have all references to Saraswati in Valmiki ramayana handy? How does one determine which is the oldest ramayana text we have? स प्रान् मुखो राज गृहात् अभिनिर्याय वीर्यवान् | ततः सुदामाम् द्युतिमान् सम्तीर्वावेक्ष्य ताम् नदीम् || २-७१-१ ह्लादिनीम् दूर पाराम् च प्रत्यक् स्रोतः त...
by peter
24 Apr 2016 19:16
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Tradition, Culture, Religion & Law in Indian Society
Replies: 441
Views: 49149

Re: Tradition, Culture, Religion & Law in Indian Society

^^^ Some excerpts from a Rajiv Malhotra post: It never ceases to amaze me how many of our folks cannot see the forest for the trees. Their cognitions are fragmented and broken into tiny views, much like the two small openings in a burqa. I have called this the burqa of the mind. When I point this o...
by peter
24 Apr 2016 19:12
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Tradition, Culture, Religion & Law in Indian Society
Replies: 441
Views: 49149

Re: Tradition, Culture, Religion & Law in Indian Society

Someone please riddle me this There were, according to the British census of the humanimals of India 3000 castes and 90,000 subcastes spread out in 500,000 villages each with a mix of these "castes". If we are to apply the rigor that we Indians take so much frickin pride in when we work i...
by peter
22 Apr 2016 17:15
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

If 7000 odd years between the two epics then each king will have to rule for 250 odd years. Or there are much simpler and common sense explanations for this, with demonstrable evidence in support of such explanation. I have covered them extensively in my book (The Historic Rama), so won't repeat th...
by peter
22 Apr 2016 04:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

For Ramayana, there is a date: Rāma-Janam: Nov 29, 12240 BCE as provided by Nilesh Nilkanth Oak. Anybody who has a problem with that, needs to disprove his theory. For Mahabharata, there is a date: Start of War: Oct 16, 5561 BCE as provided by Nilesh Nilkanth Oak. and 3138 BCE as believed by tradit...
by peter
19 Apr 2016 20:03
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

.. With time, in fact, Śaka Era was done away with, and possibly because it reminded people of foreign rule. But as long as the Śakas were there, this calendar continued to be widely used, and sometime later also as not every dynasty was considered fit to initiate their own calendar. Many Hindus al...
by peter
19 Apr 2016 20:01
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

.... This man's intent as a closet evangelist should be perfectly clear from the bolded part. The imagination that he knows how Hinduism is practised and others don't is pompous and dismissive. He seems harmless shiv. If you do not like him would it be better to criticize him privately? I feel John...
by peter
18 Apr 2016 14:58
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

.. With time, in fact, Śaka Era was done away with, and possibly because it reminded people of foreign rule. But as long as the Śakas were there, this calendar continued to be widely used, and sometime later also as not every dynasty was considered fit to initiate their own calendar. Many Hindus al...
by peter
18 Apr 2016 14:45
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Which Shaka king gave the name to the shaka era? He tentatively suggests Chastana is the king who was coronated at the epoch of Śaka Era on 19th February 583 BCE. My problem is this ( and who am i to have a problem anyway ?) no one has heard of Chastana . Why would Indians/Hindus name an era named ...
by peter
18 Apr 2016 14:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

If I have a problem with that book, it is the sub-title "Victim of Concoctions and Distortions"... Completely unnecessary. Just state it confidently, "Chronology of Ancient India" and leave it at that. This "victim" bleat is never edifying and immediately renders a pol...
by peter
16 Apr 2016 18:20
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

I c that u guys have done a nice jaab of conphirming Aryan Tourist Theory. AFAIK, there is no way to get from Afghanistan (Hazari whatever or Gaandahar) to Patna (Pataliputra?) except by crossing the mountains (Kyber / Bolan?). Yet I have seen very little discussion of this formidable trek, like &q...
by peter
15 Apr 2016 05:36
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Christianity that we know today is not what it started as. Some hold rather strongly and with reasonable evidence that early christians believed in transmigration of soul. Later pope etc got rid of all this. I will post a link to a book by an english author on this. Transmigration of Christ Please ...
by peter
15 Apr 2016 05:31
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Published on Jan 04, 2001 Inscription throws light on Afghan Hindu ruler : PTI PRESS TRUST OF INDIA Kolkata, Jan 4: A stone inscription in Sanskrit, recovered from the city of Mazar-i-Sharif of northern Afghanistan a few years ago, has thrown new light on the reign of the Hindu Shahi ruler `Veka' i...
by peter
15 Apr 2016 05:21
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

An interesting article: http://indiafacts.org/flawed-sheet-anchors-of-indian-history/ "Flawed Sheet Anchors of Indian History" Is it possible to devise any litmus tests to nail this forever? What would be wrong if we date the material used to build delhi iron pillar? Any idea why we are n...
by peter
06 Apr 2016 19:07
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

refer Purusha Sooktham. Christian creationism is closer to Puranas and Ithihaasa. You have evaded my question. ... Christianity that we know today is not what it started as. Some hold rather strongly and with reasonable evidence that early christians believed in transmigration of soul. Later pope e...
by peter
06 Apr 2016 16:07
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

refer Purusha Sooktham. Christian creationism is closer to Puranas and Ithihaasa. You have evaded my question. ... Christianity that we know today is not what it started as. Some hold rather strongly and with reasonable evidence that early christians believed in transmigration of soul. Later pope e...
by peter
19 Mar 2016 09:12
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

The Indian Interest ‏@indianinterest A 1898 Yale University study map showing where Svastikas were found. Why no modern research by Indian historians? Location of India is right in the middle. Haan! Were ancient trading routes same ? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CdsEmgtVAAE1i7z.jpg Very interesting ...
by peter
20 Jan 2016 00:39
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

People have tried asking these questions but the answers they seek from their own lens. Earliest written records of sanskrit are late in fact later than those written in prakrit. How does one devise a litmus test to nail that sanskrit was indeed the language spoken at a certain date in indian subco...
by peter
20 Jan 2016 00:27
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Peter, the issue is language. The Mongols and Arabs conquered but did not replace the language with their own. In the case of the Saraswati Sindhu civilization the story is that the language was completely replaced (at least it was 96% replaced). This has never happened anywhere else and the idea t...
by peter
20 Jan 2016 00:16
Forum: Military Issues & History Forum
Topic: Historical Battles in Ancient & Medieval Bharat
Replies: 2455
Views: 381510

Re: Historical Battles in Ancient & Medieval Bharat

^Atri, I also read that Aurangzeb green lighted Tarabai to crown her son Rajaram, Shivaji's other son and this led to divisions among the Marathas. In fact Balaji Vishwanath changed sides and supported Shahu to become the Chatrapati at Satara, and was made the Peshwa. Sirji, Rajaram was younger pri...
by peter
20 Jan 2016 00:11
Forum: Military Issues & History Forum
Topic: Historical Battles in Ancient & Medieval Bharat
Replies: 2455
Views: 381510

Re: Re:

Atri/All, Would you know the history of Sahu who as a child was captured by Aurangjebe? Was the young Sahu converted? No.. Shaahu was not converted. Aurangzeb's daughter personally took care that he receives all education (including dharmik) as per all the traditions. He was the maratha emperor whi...
by peter
17 Jan 2016 18:43
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

1) The Saraswati-Sindhu civilization had an expanse that's the size of Germany & France put together . It was fairly heavily populated as far back as 3000 BC 2) Such a well-settled civilization was completely replaced by trickles of nomadic immigrants who left Bedouin Arabs , who are nomadic, w...
by peter
17 Jan 2016 08:26
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Even without going into the finer details, AIT fails the bullshit meter test for the following simple reasons: I like your approach where you are arguing about some litmus tests. Let me nitpick some: 1) The Saraswati-Sindhu civilization had an expanse that's the size of Germany & France put tog...
by peter
12 Jan 2016 19:19
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

..... You have pointed out that mutation rate is questionable and you are right. But even this paper ("Upper Paleolithic genomes..) uses mutation rates to date their material. I have a naive/stupid question/suggestion. Why do we have to wait for some study to be done by someone else? What is m...
by peter
12 Jan 2016 19:17
Forum: Military Issues & History Forum
Topic: Historical Battles in Ancient & Medieval Bharat
Replies: 2455
Views: 381510

Re: Re:

Atri/All,
Would you know the history of Sahu who as a child was captured by Aurangjebe? Was the young Sahu converted?
by peter
02 Jan 2016 14:28
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

From the supplementary tables: South Asia Ntotal R1a-all Pakistan North 85 14 Pakistan South 91 30 India North 98 19 India East 124 5 India Northeast 68 19 India Northwest 127 31 India Central 36 5 India South 97 5 Mixed India 40 5 Nepal Tharu 170 14 Nepal Hindu 25 17 India/Hindu/New Delhi 49 17 In...
by peter
20 Dec 2015 15:21
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Is M576 above or below M420 on the tree? It is not on the tree at all as far as I can tell Another point to note R1 is older than R1a which is older than R1a1 which is older than R1a1a etc. Even if R1 developed in Iran or Sweden or Timbuktu, it does not rule out a later development of R1a1a1 M17 in...
by peter
20 Dec 2015 06:46
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

So bow does cheetah example help in invading aryan theory,especially when Iran could be part of India back then. To say now that Aryans from Iran invaded instead of some TFTA gora Caucasian Aryans from invaded is a bigger farce it looks like, bigger even then AIT. The genetic science approach shows...
by peter
20 Dec 2015 06:44
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

From the supplementary tables: South Asia Ntotal R1a-all Pakistan North 85 14 Pakistan South 91 30 India North 98 19 India East 124 5 India Northeast 68 19 India Northwest 127 31 India Central 36 5 India South 97 5 Mixed India 40 5 Nepal Tharu 170 14 Nepal Hindu 25 17 India/Hindu/New Delhi 49 17 In...
by peter
16 Dec 2015 03:54
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

The 2015 paper by Underhill et. al. suggests that India can not be considered the origin of R1a. Link please. The 2014 paper posted by AGupta does not say that. The only "South Asia Origin" part of R1a is R1a1a1 (M 17). The Underhill paper posted above goes into more detail down below tha...
by peter
15 Dec 2015 18:10
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

From Twitter: manasataramgini ‏@blog_supplement 1 can estimate that approximately at least 50% of the Y-chromosomes of varNa populations as a group originated from invading Aryan males So, he is saying that upper castes are progeny of foreign invaders? I think this is nonsense. Firstly, today, Indi...
by peter
15 Dec 2015 18:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

A_Gupta wrote:From Twitter:
manasataramgini
‏@blog_supplement

1 can estimate that approximately at least 50% of the Y-chromosomes of varNa populations as a group originated from invading Aryan males

Does he say what he bases his estimation on?
by peter
15 Dec 2015 18:05
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

From Twitter: manasataramgini ‏@blog_supplement 1 can estimate that approximately at least 50% of the Y-chromosomes of varNa populations as a group originated from invading Aryan males Utter Bullshit Sengupta S, Zhivotovsky LA, King R, Mehdi SQ, Edmonds CA, Chow CE et al. (2006) Polarity and tem- p...
by peter
30 Nov 2015 05:23
Forum: Military Issues & History Forum
Topic: Historical Battles in Ancient & Medieval Bharat
Replies: 2455
Views: 381510

Re:

Akbar's attack on Chittor (1567-68) as illustrated in the Akbarnama miniatures..... The battle for Chittor lasted 123 days (23 October 1567 to February 24 1568). towards the end of 1568 Akbar concentrated his forces around the fort of Ranthambhor, held by a vassal of the Maharana of Chittor, Rao Su...
by peter
30 Nov 2015 05:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

^^^the article is important as it exposes Mohan Guruswamy's shoddy understanding of history! This man is so worried about ultra-nationalism that he is willing to ignore the exta-nationals invading the very identity of Indians. The issue can be ignored at great peril given educated folks like Kharge...
by peter
23 Jun 2015 17:30
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Virendra ji, thanks for your comments and help. I did read the academia.edu article earlier. Well the Islamic sources do not mention him, so I was wondering if Bappa Rawal could be a figure from pre-Islamic times! They had hard time with Indian names. And perhaps not highlighting a defeat is also r...
by peter
23 Jun 2015 17:27
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

peter ji, If Rama is considered ~67 generations after Ikshvaku, then Harita Rishi is considered 52 generations after Ikshvaku, as grandson of Ambarisha, an ancestor of Rama. So if Bappa Rawal is supposed to have met him, we are speaking of considerable antiquity. Also there is speculation that the ...
by peter
18 Jun 2015 04:20
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

peter ji, If Rama is considered ~67 generations after Ikshvaku, then Harita Rishi is considered 52 generations after Ikshvaku, as grandson of Ambarisha, an ancestor of Rama. So if Bappa Rawal is supposed to have met him, we are speaking of considerable antiquity. Very interesting. But how do we asc...
by peter
17 Jun 2015 20:17
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Virendra ji, Requesting some help here. Need to find out as much as I can about Bappa Rawal, however the info on the net seems to be limited. I feel the story of Bappa Rawal is placed much much too late. Do you know of any early texts which may not have undergone colonial revising? Bappa Rawal as p...
by peter
10 Jun 2015 18:26
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5327
Views: 654538

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

I said pre-Islam. You seem to be very confused reading posts, or this is nothing more than trolling. You are highly contradictory as is clear from your earlier messages. ... Question that you keep contradicting yourself on is whether any Islamic population adopted the fire worshippers religion and ...

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