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by peter
08 Dec 2017 21:23
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Haraxavati the river in Iran never reaches the sea. And drains into inland lakes. Both Saraswati and Haraxavati are supposed to be cognates according to "experts" and derive from the same root which denotes lakes. I don't believe them but that is the consensus today. Balls consensus. Sinc...
by peter
08 Dec 2017 21:20
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

If you were to look at the woods hole study published sometime back it says that saraswati river started breaking up around 3000 BC. That is when the lakes started forming according to this paper. There are so many studies that speak of drying up long before that. But because of heavy rainfall huge...
by peter
08 Dec 2017 07:53
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2016/01/difference-between-language-dialect/424704/ What's a language, anyway? With this above as background, I'd say, emanating from the Saraswati-Sindhu region, via largely cultural influences, not permanent movement of people, but perhaps aided b...
by peter
08 Dec 2017 07:42
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

A different take on Arundhati-Vasishta and other observations in the Mahabharata: http://insa.nic.in/writereaddata/UpLoadedFiles/IJHS/Vol41_1_1_RNIyengar.pdf (PDF file) Iyengar, R. N. (2006). Some Celestial Observations Associated with Krsna-Lore. Indian Journal of History of Science, 41(1), 1. A d...
by peter
08 Dec 2017 07:33
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Not quite. We consider sea to be samudra. While all the "experts" think of samudra as a big lake. So Saraswati draining into a lake happened as late as 2000 BC. Wait for the full paper before you jump to conclusions. And don't be so defensive to protect the opinions of the people whom you...
by peter
06 Dec 2017 13:47
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

... Fact is: Veda speaks of massive Saraswati river flowing to the sea Fact is: Paleo geological studies confirm a large river parallel to Indus and east of it reached the sea up to 8000 BC Ergo Vedas date back to 8000 BC Not quite. We consider sea to be samudra. While all the "experts" t...
by peter
17 Sep 2017 09:02
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Sure. There are many astronomical observations in Mahabharata. Winter solstice, eclipses, sequence of repeating eclipses, movement of pole star etc. If you were to identify the dates for each of the observation and some of these observations may be satisfied on multiple dates what distribution of d...
by peter
11 Sep 2017 21:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

.... Per historical account, RanaPratap did escape from the battlefield, and anybody who escapes the battlefield can not be considered victor of that specific battle. So, no, RanaPratap did not win battle of Haldighati. Did the war stop when Pratap left? Now did he win the broader "war" t...
by peter
09 Sep 2017 23:05
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Assume there were 50 authors who revised Mahabharata repeatedly in various centuries or millenniums. They wrote N observations of stellar phenomenon. What date distribution do you expect for these N observations? Can you clarify your question ? Sure. There are many astronomical observations in Maha...
by peter
30 Aug 2017 05:57
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

I am afraid you are misrepreseting Oak. You need to provide dates for and I quote you here: "Adi parva nakshatras or the nakshatras of Janamejaya's recordings of these events". If you can't provide dates for the above then your assertion "we get an entirely different set of dates&quo...
by peter
28 Aug 2017 00:10
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Talk is cheap please prove the assertion in bold. they are already provided for in this thread. Which is why you have the likes of Mr. Oak arguing for a 9000 BC timeframe for the Mahabharata and few pages before that, the Aryabhatta's 3000 BC date. ... I am afraid you are misrepreseting Oak. You ne...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 23:41
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

There is a minimum set. I think you are having some parsing issues. These 13 observations are from chapters pertaining to peace mission, battle preparations, actual battle, and Bhishmas' death. If you used observations 0 and 1 they would not give you the date of the war unambigously. The number of ...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 23:28
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

No. I am claiming I have looked at the other astronomical references and these 13 observations is the minimum set. Rest of the observations also show the same date as these 13. But I do invite you to find a list which contradicts the date provided by these 13 observations. there is no minimum or ma...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 13:21
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Not ignoring. Onus is on you to provide the list. So you are claiming ignorance of all the nakshatras in the texts ? If so, then your case for Nakshatras weakens even further. No. I am claiming I have looked at the other astronomical references and these 13 observations is the minimum set. Rest of ...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 11:15
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Are you even serious? This sequence is from sequential chapters of Mahabharata war. No picking and choosing as time of the observations is flowing in a single direction: forward. Yes,yes. One sequence of Nakshatras. What about reconciling ALL the Nakshatras ? Why are you ignoring that point. Not ig...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 10:01
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Had you tried to figure out the date of these 13 observations this question might have answered itself for you. But since you can't , it seems, or won't I will answer it. Mahabharata has other references about Kaliyuga and the change from previous yuga. The dates of these observations line up in a ...
by peter
27 Aug 2017 08:42
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Since you know math can you tell us what would be the probability of 13 observations matching a single date? If it was random guesses by Mahabharat writers, 2000 years later, one would imagine *all* the observations given above would not line up in a tight span of a few months in one particular yea...
by peter
26 Aug 2017 20:47
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

You have made it clear that you have not read Mahabharata. That is fine. Just FYI above observations are a sequence that start from the date of arrival of Krishna at Hastinapur to Bhishma's death. These observations represent stellar phenomenon separated by many months. Have you considered "wh...
by peter
26 Aug 2017 11:52
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Srijoy ji, Since you have said using math and equations you can tell us the time when these observations from mahabharata might have happened can you please help us with dates? The list of observations from mahabharata: 0 Departure of Krishna to Hastinapur on peace mission on Revathi. 1 Purnima in ...
by peter
26 Aug 2017 05:28
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

... How will you match 13 observations if you were the author 1000 years after the war and you had to backfit the plausible sequence ? I can do it quiete easily, using math: Using various equations determining the orbital motion of various planetary and interstellar bodies, in relation to earth, pl...
by peter
04 Aug 2017 19:27
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

During our earlier exchange many weeks ago I had posted verses from Rg Veda describing heliocentric knowledge amongst Rig Vedic Rishis. Did you read it? Arybhatta was one author. There are literally hundreds of astronomical texts that have survived. To just pick on one, Arybhatta's , and think that...
by peter
31 Jul 2017 21:06
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Rudimentary: Vedic people knowing heliocentric concept ? When did heliocentricity reach the western civilisation? Conventional history states that western world discovered heliocentrism around 15th century. Don’t know of the vedic world. However, it is clear that during the golden age of Indian civ...
by peter
30 Jul 2017 23:36
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

As we have seen earlier in the case of your assertion to the effect that no astronomy existed in Vedas IVC demise is also showing your shallow comprehension. Have you heard of a river known as Saraswati? How is this river described in Vedas? How is this river described in Mahabharata? How did this ...
by peter
27 Jul 2017 21:58
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

.... sorry to burst your religion-inspired babble but analysis of sudden pulses of migration in world history (over 100-200 year period) show extensive alliances, massive warfare across several fronts, etc. Ofcourse, you are gonna argue all the other world parallels that hold for rest of the world,...
by peter
27 Jul 2017 19:38
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

There are more than 130 claims for the dating of Mahabharata and about dozen for the dating of Ramayana. Most of them (but not all) claim 'astronomy evidence' as their basis. One such researcher claims that Mahabharata has 215+ , and Ramayana has 575+ astronomy references/observations/descriptions....
by peter
29 Jun 2017 21:16
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

This is getting funny. Have you heard of Rig Veda? Do you what model exists in Rig Veda? Do you understand the quotations given above? Do you know who Lagadha is ? Do you know if he came before or after Aryabhat? Was aryabhat the first person to practice astronomy in India? Aryabatta's book is the ...
by peter
29 Jun 2017 21:11
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

What have you been reading or rather not reading? Before Aryabhat there were many observers ...... the aryabhatiya itself says the planets move in epicycles. Not only is it wrong, its a dead giveaway of a heliocentric model. the epicyclic motion stated by Aryabhatta might also explain why he though...
by peter
29 Jun 2017 20:44
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

If we believe man to be an animal then turf war over hunting grounds would be common. Lions have a king, so do gorillas and the wolves. Besides you don't easily carry pots around. You come back to them. Of course. I mentioned hunter gatherers in my post - they are like wolves. But these animals do ...
by peter
29 Jun 2017 20:38
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

...... It must be noted too that ancient Indians were wrong about stellar observations in one critical way: they did not have a heliocentric world. Aryabhatiya clearly shows a geocentric model with epicycles as their concept of stellar motion. What have you been reading or rather not reading? Befor...
by peter
28 Jun 2017 22:12
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Would these arguments suggest kingships only emerged after man became vegetarian? So long he consumed fish and lipids and other meats he remained king less? All these arguments of the type no evidence for this or that is in the category :"Absence of Evidence does not imply ....." Man did ...
by peter
28 Jun 2017 21:26
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

http://science.sciencemag.org/content/336/6089/1696 Early Pottery at 20,000 Years Ago in Xianrendong Cave, China Pots and Crocks The invention of pottery allowed for more secure storage of food than was provided by baskets or hide pouches, and the vessels could also be used in cooking. The earliest...
by peter
28 Jun 2017 20:08
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

....For e.g., i can find actual, 2000 year old documents manual for making certain kinds of bronze in Roman empire 100 times more frequently and easily than Indian history. Since you are a metallurgist? would you know how Indian steel reached damascus? Would you also know how Indian lohars made the...
by peter
01 Oct 2016 05:58
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

This prof believes in AIT it seems. Rigveda is 1400 BC according to her. Are there no trained linguists who can topple the AIT camp linguistically too? A victory has to be complete. Complete victory is a noble goal but it is not going to come without making sure linguistic theories are trashed. The...
by peter
30 Sep 2016 11:10
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Origin of Sanskrit search is noble indeed. Though "linguistic theories about language connected with AIT are dead" is a wrong statement. Simple example. Vedanga Jyotish an ancient astronomical text has configurations of sky which can be reliably dated to before 1000 BC. But on "lingu...
by peter
09 Sep 2016 21:07
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

...The exact origins of Sanskrit, which interest me are still murky and I will continue to work on that - but effort put in to diss linguists is wasted effort because linguistic theories about language connected with AIT are dead. Further arguments about "How to argue against Invasionsists&quo...
by peter
05 Jun 2016 12:12
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Your example on Tamil chor, sore is intriguing. Do you know more such examples? How about in Kannada? The name for guava: some will say "seebekayi". Others say "chepekayi". That aside there is, even today in Gujarat an area where people say "ha" instead of "sa&quo...
by peter
05 Jun 2016 06:30
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

shiv saar, please do finish your book! I am sure it would be very valuable in putting some sense into the "AIT" debate. Thanks Rajesh. Every time I start editing my work - I feel dissatisfied with the completeness of some things and am simply trying to learn more. And in the meantime a lo...
by peter
04 Jun 2016 06:18
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

Shiv: is the AIT-logic the following? 1) Avesta is written in a Sanskrit-like language 2) Avesta cannot be understood/translated without Sanskrit 3) Therefore Avestan is a different language, that's older than Sanskrit 4) QED Are there features in "Avestan" that makes linguists believe th...
by peter
03 Jun 2016 08:45
Forum: Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum
Topic: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2
Replies: 5308
Views: 649595

Re: Out-of-India - From Theory to Truth: Part 2

shiv wrote:
peter wrote:Trolling eh? Let us keep the environment cool and not point fingers please.

The way to show up trolls is to warm up the environment and see how they respond.

Do you like to fight? It is time to let this go.

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