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Indus Water Treaty

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Falijee » 10 Mar 2017 23:44

CROSS POSTED FROM S.T.F.U.P

Pakistani Newspaper Admits "Water Mismanagement "

Tarbela, Mangla dams to be empty within 24 Hours.

LAHORE: (Daily Dunya) – Tarbela and Mangla dams will be empty within next 24 hours as Tarbela Dam is left with only 30,000 acre feet of water while Mangla has 40,000 acre feet of water left, reported Daily Dunya.According to Zulfiqar Mehto’s report, both the major dams are almost empty now in Pakistan due to less than expected rain during the winter season. The investigation into the matter brought to the fore the fact that due to the absence of Kalabagh or any other major dams, we have let 12 million acre feet of water, equivalent to the capacity of two large dams, to fall into the sea during 2016-17 water year. Then, after this admission, they have the "nerve" to accuse India of stealing "their water" :evil:
It has also been learnt that 19% water shortage was recorded for wheat and other crops of the ongoing season. Indus River System Authority (IRSA) has already sent the alert to Punjab and Sindh governments regarding lack of canal water for the Khareef season’s crops like cotton etc. The water supply to both the provinces has been decreased from Thursday. The supply from Mangla Dam has been reduced to 22,000 cusec from 28,000 cusec while the supply from Mangla Dam has been reduced to 28,000 cusec from 32,000 cusec.
Ministry of Water and Power has told Dunya News that the water reserve in Tarbela Dam is now 30,000 acre feet now while that in Mangla is 40,000 acre feet. The level will drop to dead level on Saturday after which the provinces will be provided with water supply on daily basis from the normal flow of the river. :roll:

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 11 Mar 2017 06:52

That gross mismanagement of its water resources, overuse of water, wastage etc are the causes for problems and that India has never violated IWT causing problems for Pakistan have been accepted at various times by Pakistani ministers, politicians, PICs, and editors of newspapers. At the same time, it is the intention of Pakistan to continue to create problems under IWT because of the 'enduring hostility' of that country with us. That is why, this problem, known by the name Pakistan, cannot be a part of any solution. Pakistan must cease to exist in its fabricated form & content.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby manjgu » 11 Mar 2017 12:13

Ssridhar .... this news about empty mangla / tarbela ... does this mean there is no power generation ? or very low levels of power generation. I mean there is no corresponding news of power outrage in Pakistan ( i mean apart from what is normal?). How should one read this news??

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 11 Mar 2017 14:35

manjgu, there is chronic power shortage in Pakistan and more so at this point of the year. Hydel power generation may ease somewhat as summer sets in. But, Pakistanis are used to this after about two decades of suffering. Pakistan has also added a number of Independent Power Producers whose long-time outstanding bills were cleared by Nawaz Sharif last year, IIRC. So, they may be generating as much as they can now. They account for almost half the power, I guess. Y-o-Y, the situation may be better this year because of IPPs, in terms of deficit. I think Pakistan needs about the same amount of energy, 15000MW, that my state of TN needs or a few thousand MWs more. That's all.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Peregrine » 11 Mar 2017 15:24

SSridhar wrote:manjgu, there is chronic power shortage in Pakistan and more so at this point of the year. Hydel power generation may ease somewhat as summer sets in. But, Pakistanis are used to this after about two decades of suffering. Pakistan has also added a number of Independent Power Producers whose long-time outstanding bills were cleared by Nawaz Sharif last year, IIRC. So, they may be generating as much as they can now. They account for almost half the power, I guess. Y-o-Y, the situation may be better this year because of IPPs, in terms of deficit. I think Pakistan needs about the same amount of energy, 15000MW, that my state of TN needs or a few thousand MWs more. That's all.
SSridhar Ji :

I have been instructed by the Esteemed State of Tamil Nadu to sue you for Defamation of Character of the Esteemed State of Tamil Nadu for being mentioned in the same sentence as Cwapistan (Acch Thoo) as well being considered equal or better than the Esteemed State of Tamil Nadu. I have however Interjected and Apologized with all the Force & Weight at my Command and stated that with All Respect & Reverence I Tender a Humble Apology on your behalf. Please be careful in your comparisons.

P.S. 1. INSTALLED CAPACITY (IN MW) OF POWER UTILITIES IN THE TAMIL NADU=25393.90 MW

2. INSTALLED CAPACITY OF ELECTRIC GENERATION IN CWAPISTAN : 24,906 MW

So There! Humph!!
Cheers Image

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 11 Mar 2017 15:39

Peregrine Ji, my apologies. Don't tell our new CM that I made such an awful comparison.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby manjgu » 11 Mar 2017 21:31

Seridhar..i meant what amount of electricity is being generated at Mangla/Tarbela as against its normal operating levels? with the kind of water levels being reported can hydro power be generated at these two dams..was my question..not overall in porkistan...

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Indus Water Treaty

Postby Peregrine » 12 Mar 2017 01:28

SSridhar wrote:Peregrine Ji, my apologies. Don't tell our new CM that I made such an awful comparison.
SSridhar Ji :

My Lips will remain sealed! Please ensure such infractions are not made again!
Cheers Image

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 12 Mar 2017 04:51

manjgu, normally, there would be no generation much before water level reaches the dead storage level. This is especially so in these Himalayan river systems where sedimentation load is high and turbine fans are damaged by them. We know that the sedimentation on the Tarbela extends 30 Kms backwards and Tarbela generators are particularly vulnerable. To answer your question, there would have been zero generation of power for sometime now. But, the usual generation has always been 50% or less of installed capacity for a long time, AFAIK.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby manjgu » 12 Mar 2017 20:47

thanks Ssridhar..what i was reading somewhere ..that India even with its existing infra on the western rivers can adversely control the flow of water in this season... more than in the other season.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Rishi Verma » 16 Mar 2017 13:27

http://m.timesofindia.com/india/india-f ... 662557.cms

NEW DELHI: India has fast-tracked hydropower projects worth $15 billion in Kashmir in recent months, three central and state officials said, ignoring warnings from Islamabad that power stations on rivers flowing into Pakistan will disrupt water supplies.


Disrupting water is not good enough, I always have proposed building pig farms along the rivers and subsequently send the entire population of Pakistanis to hell.

Ready market for pork in China.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 19 Mar 2017 11:44

The World Bank is keen on resolving Indus divide - Nagesh Prabhu, The Hindu
After her recent visit to India and Pakistan, World Bank Chief Executive Officer Kristalina Georgieva reiterated that the Bank was keen on resolving the disagreements between the two nations over the interpretation of the Indus Waters Treaty (IWT) following the construction by India of two hydroelectric power plants. Though the two nations have had no fresh conflict over the sharing of river waters for more than five decades, differences cropped up after Pakistan opposed the construction of the Kishenganga (330 MW) and Ratle (850 MW) power plants by India on the Jhelum and Chenab in Jammu and Kashmir, over which Pakistan has unrestricted rights under the treaty.

Why did the Bank intervene?

Even before Partition, the Indus had created problems among the states of British India. The problems became international after the creation of two nations as the political boundary was drawn right across the Indus basin. The World Bank (then IBRD), under the presidency of Eugene Black, helped in 1952 to settle the dispute between the two nations on the sharing of the Indus river basin waters. He had said the escalation of the dispute would damage the economic development of the Indian subcontinent. After eight years of hard negotiations, Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru and President Ayub Khan signed the IWT on September 19, 1960. The Bank is also a signatory to the treaty. The IWT is a complex instrument, comprising 12 articles and eight annexures. It sets forth provisions of cooperation between the two countries in their use of the rivers, known as the Permanent Indus Commission (PIC).

Has there been any violation?


According to the IWT, India has control over three eastern rivers of the Indus basin — the Beas, the Ravi and the Sutlej — and Pakistan has control over the three western rivers — the Indus, the Chenab and the Jhelum. All six rivers flow from India to Pakistan. Among other uses, India is permitted to construct power facilities on these rivers subject to regulations laid down in the treaty. India had asked the bank for appointment of a neutral expert following Pakistan’s objections to two projects, while Pakistan demanded the formation of a court of arbitration, alleging that India had violated the treaty. In December 2016, the Bank announced a ‘pause’ and asked both parties to resolve the issue amicably by the end of January 2017.

What stand did the Bank take?


India welcomed the Bank’s neutral stand, while Pakistan sought intervention of the Bank after being unable to find an amicable solution to the dispute through the commission. Given that India has remained the Bank’s single largest borrower since its inception with cumulative borrowings from IBRD and IDA touching $103 billion, the bank did not perhaps want to upset it.

With buoyancy in foreign exchange reserves, the Bank needs India more than the other way round and this has created some anxiety in the Bank circles about the future direction of their relationship.


Why is the Bank playing a role again?

This is because India and Pakistan are important partners and clients of the Bank. In South Asia, Pakistan ($2,280 million) received the highest lending from the Bank after India ($3,845 million) during the fiscal 2016. Moreover, there are not too many borrowers with a credible record like India.

The Bank maintained its aid could be effectively used if both nations kept the peace and ensured better management of the waters, on which lakhs of farmers depend. As both nations have failed to resolve the dispute amicably, the Bank CEO has initiated a dialogue. Changing its stance, India has agreed to attend a meeting of the commission in Lahore next week. Like in the 1950s, Bank officials are again playing the role of mediator.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby komal » 19 Mar 2017 12:28

SSridhar wrote:The World Bank is keen on resolving Indus divide - Nagesh Prabhu, The Hindu
After her recent visit to India and Pakistan, World Bank Chief Executive Officer Kristalina Georgieva reiterated that the Bank was keen on resolving the disagreements between the two nations over the interpretation of the Indus Waters Treaty (IWT) following the construction by India of two hydroelectric power plants. Though the two nations have had no fresh conflict over the sharing of river waters for more than five decades, differences cropped up after Pakistan opposed the construction of the Kishenganga (330 MW) and Ratle (850 MW) power plants by India on the Jhelum and Chenab in Jammu and Kashmir, over which Pakistan has unrestricted rights under the treaty.

Why did the Bank intervene?

Even before Partition, the Indus had created problems among the states of British India. The problems became international after the creation of two nations as the political boundary was drawn right across the Indus basin. The World Bank (then IBRD), under the presidency of Eugene Black, helped in 1952 to settle the dispute between the two nations on the sharing of the Indus river basin waters. He had said the escalation of the dispute would damage the economic development of the Indian subcontinent. After eight years of hard negotiations, Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru and President Ayub Khan signed the IWT on September 19, 1960. The Bank is also a signatory to the treaty. The IWT is a complex instrument, comprising 12 articles and eight annexures. It sets forth provisions of cooperation between the two countries in their use of the rivers, known as the Permanent Indus Commission (PIC).

Has there been any violation?


According to the IWT, India has control over three eastern rivers of the Indus basin — the Beas, the Ravi and the Sutlej — and Pakistan has control over the three western rivers — the Indus, the Chenab and the Jhelum. All six rivers flow from India to Pakistan. Among other uses, India is permitted to construct power facilities on these rivers subject to regulations laid down in the treaty. India had asked the bank for appointment of a neutral expert following Pakistan’s objections to two projects, while Pakistan demanded the formation of a court of arbitration, alleging that India had violated the treaty. In December 2016, the Bank announced a ‘pause’ and asked both parties to resolve the issue amicably by the end of January 2017.

What stand did the Bank take?


India welcomed the Bank’s neutral stand, while Pakistan sought intervention of the Bank after being unable to find an amicable solution to the dispute through the commission. Given that India has remained the Bank’s single largest borrower since its inception with cumulative borrowings from IBRD and IDA touching $103 billion, the bank did not perhaps want to upset it.

With buoyancy in foreign exchange reserves, the Bank needs India more than the other way round and this has created some anxiety in the Bank circles about the future direction of their relationship.


Why is the Bank playing a role again?

This is because India and Pakistan are important partners and clients of the Bank. In South Asia, Pakistan ($2,280 million) received the highest lending from the Bank after India ($3,845 million) during the fiscal 2016. Moreover, there are not too many borrowers with a credible record like India.

The Bank maintained its aid could be effectively used if both nations kept the peace and ensured better management of the waters, on which lakhs of farmers depend. As both nations have failed to resolve the dispute amicably, the Bank CEO has initiated a dialogue. Changing its stance, India has agreed to attend a meeting of the commission in Lahore next week. Like in the 1950s, Bank officials are again playing the role of mediator.


Don't like the idea of India reverting to third party mediation in such matters.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 19 Mar 2017 17:24

komal wrote:
SSridhar wrote:The World Bank is keen on resolving Indus divide - Nagesh Prabhu, The Hindu


Don't like the idea of India reverting to third party mediation in such matters.

Unfortunately for us Indians, the IWT is one of the many vestiges of serious foreign-policy blunders of Nehru personally that we have to live with, at least for the time being. I am sure that India is biding its time. IWT is *NOT* going to survive for too long. It is an unnatural treaty.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby arun » 20 Mar 2017 08:04


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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Philip » 20 Mar 2017 12:42

Absolutely! The World Bank is a monstrous partisan organisation dedicated to furthering Western interests .Countries that followed its eco advice have seen their fortunes plummet.

Here,the WB is desperate to support the Pakis who stand to lose heavily economically,a failed terrorist state,which is being propped up by the US of A
.It is a despicable act os partisanship,which India must resist totally. What is within our rights in the treaty,using the excess waters is our business,not the Pakis or the WB at all.Furthermore,continued terrorist war-waging by the Pakis against India MUST bring with it penalties that hurt it. Eco,trade,vists,overflights,the works. The attempt also to make Gilgitstan its next province has been condemned even by the Kashmiris. Signing off Gwadar to the Chinese,allowing their troops to squat in tens of thousands there and in POK is intolerable.Mr.Modi has the mandate,past time to punish Pak by other means.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby pankajs » 20 Mar 2017 14:57

I don't think India/Modi will go all out to abrogate the treaty or spurn the WB. There are other milders but equally potent ways of dealing with the IWT and WB.

This past week, even as India was preparing to send a team to Bakistan for Indus commission meeting, there was a renewed push to get the Indus basin projects up faster. That is the way to kill the IWT. Technically it allows us to build as many RoR projects as rivers can support and as many as we can afford/build.

OTOH, WB does not dictate the issue resolution mechanism. So long as Bakistan is adamant on CoA and India only agreeing for NA, the process is frozen and there is zlich that the WB can do.

I think those twin strategies are enough to make the IWT dead in the medium to long term. No need for aggressive posturing.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 20 Mar 2017 15:13

India does not need to openly abrogate or withdraw from the IWT. We probably will never do that. We will make it ineffective. As an upper riparian, we have all the levers. Let us look at what China is doing in the Indo China Sea which belongs to humanity unlike the Indus system of rivers that only belongs to two countries. Or, even Brahmaputra for that matter (the non-existence of a treaty is no justification for China to do what its is doing). Possession is three-fourths of law, unfortunately. Nobody can force us to comply with the decisions of the CoA or the NA or even agree to the setting up of a CoA or an NA. The present stalemate is a good example. We have a right to not represent our case if a CoA or NA is constituted by the WB against our wishes, in spite of the IWT. Let the decision go ex-parte as it happened in the case of the Indo-China Sea between Philippines and China. Pakistan must be aware of India's position. The WB is not a UN body. The future run-of-river projects *MUST* be built with low-level sluice gates by India as the CoA on Kishenganga has been very unfair to us. Pakistan has been testing the patience and the rights of a very generous upper riparian and it will boomerang on it with devastating effect.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gagan » 20 Mar 2017 18:18

Step 1: Build all possible, or at least a majority of dams. This step is still not complete. There is NO dam on the Indus itself. There is one in Kargil on one of its tributaries (Chutak Dam on the Suru R - which makes 44 MW), but none on the Indus.

Step 2: If Pak does not behave, abrogate IWT out right. For now, deflect Paki Rona-Dhona by making full use of Neutral Expert, who will never be able to find fault with any dam project that India makes, as they are all ROR.

Step 3: If India does abrogate IWT, then build canals and Tunnels and divert the water to northern India. It will be quite an engineering feat, but diverting those rivers from the himalyan heights to the low lying plains is eminently doable

This is operation Jai Krishna, a 3 stage process to make Pakistan a desert cuntry like its four-fathers that started in the Daesaart :rotfl:

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gyan » 20 Mar 2017 18:26

I am not an expert here, but I am led to believe that we don't need to spend thousands of crores to tinker with Indus Water Treaty, just one 100km canal from Chenab to Indian Eastern RIver network to be used (only) in summers is adequate to crush their balls.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby chetak » 20 Mar 2017 19:06

Lots of rubbish talk among the pakis that India is now ready for "composite" dialogue and the IWT talks is just the tip of the surrender theme.

How foolish can these guys get??

I have a strong feeling that the ongoing IWT talks, when concluded, will hit them like a mule kick to their stomach.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gagan » 20 Mar 2017 19:19

The poor pakis are trying to clutch at straws.
One theme they had was, evil Mooodi is going to lose in UP, that is what their CONgressi, AAP-turd agints were telling them. They had calculated that evil Mooodi will have no choice but to resume composite dialogue with them once he loses UP.

Their latest boast is that evil Mooodi used the "Hindoooo" thing and used "Pak dushmani" in UP elections.

These good for nothing folks! No one in the world gives a Phuck about them! They have to do terrorism to get the world's attention !

But India needs to have a plan to link the Indus to one of the great lakes in the Leh Valley, then link those to the Jhelum, and then to the Chenab.
Stepwise if possible, bring the Indus water down to the plains of north india. I would say, re-invigiorate the Saraswati using Indus waters. Now that is a grand plan

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby ranjan.rao » 20 Mar 2017 23:02

SSridhar wrote:India does not need to openly abrogate or withdraw from the IWT. We probably will never do that. We will make it ineffective. As an upper riparian, we have all the levers. Let us look at what China is doing in the Indo China Sea which belongs to humanity unlike the Indus system of rivers that only belongs to two countries. Or, even Brahmaputra for that matter (the non-existence of a treaty is no justification for China to do what its is doing). Possession is three-fourths of law, unfortunately. Nobody can force us to comply with the decisions of the CoA or the NA or even agree to the setting up of a CoA or an NA. The present stalemate is a good example. We have a right to not represent our case if a CoA or NA is constituted by the WB against our wishes, in spite of the IWT. Let the decision go ex-parte as it happened in the case of the Indo-China Sea between Philippines and China. Pakistan must be aware of India's position. The WB is not a UN body. The future run-of-river projects *MUST* be built with low-level sluice gates by India as the CoA on Kishenganga has been very unfair to us. Pakistan has been testing the patience and the rights of a very generous upper riparian and it will boomerang on it with devastating effect.

SS sir you summarized it fantastically. We have the template of Chinese response to SCS ruling. Modi's statement is quite apt, blood and water shouldnt flow together

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Prem » 20 Mar 2017 23:13

Don't blame me if you go to sleep at work


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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Prem » 21 Mar 2017 07:24


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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Prem » 21 Mar 2017 07:55

https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/193666 ... S-steps-in
ISLAMABAD: In a major development on the issue of lingering water dispute between Pakistan and India in accordance with the 1960 Indus Waters Treaty (IWT), the US has decided to arrange secretary level talks between the two countries in Washington next month for resolving issues relating to two controversial hydropower projects.These projects are 330MWs Kishanganga hydroelectric project and the under-construction 850 MWs Ratle hydroelectric project in occupied Jammu & Kashmir on which Pakistan has serious reservations.Briefing the media here on Monday, Federal Minister for Power and Khawaja Asif said: “The US has intervened and decided to help both the countries to resolve the issue. There will be secretary level talks on the Ratle and Kishanganga hydropower projects between both the countries in Washington on April 11-13 2017.”
The minister said on the controversial Kishanganga and Ratle hydroelectric projects, Pakistan was seeking international court of arbitration (ICA) through the World Bank whereas India wanted to resolve it through neutral experts.Under the Indus Waters Treaty (IWT), New Delhi has to share all the details of any hydropower project on the rivers on which Pakistan has water rights under the IWT.“No design of these projects has been shared with Pakistan, which is a violation of the treaty,” said the minister. Islamabad has serious reservations over the designs of these projects and believes they would impede the water flow to Pakistan. Asif also hailed India’s decision to take part in the current Indus Water commission talks on the IWT and hoped that the meeting would help resolve the standing issues between the two neighboring countries. Asif said during the current Indus Water Commission dialogues in Pakistan, three ongoing hydroelectric projects on Chenab in Held Kashmir including 1000MWs Pakal Dul project, 120MWs Miyar and 48MWs Lower Kalnai hydropower project will come under discussion. This two-day (March 20-21) Indus Water Commission meeting is taking place after almost two years, with the last round held in May 2015.This was the last-ditch effort of the Pakistani government to decide the issue with consensus, as for the last few years every time talks between both the countries on these two projects with Indian water commission have failed to reach any conclusion. The World Bank had earlier declared the formation of court and appointment of neutral expert, but ironically it announced a “pause” in both the separate processes initiated by Pakistan and India to allow the two countries to consider alternative ways to resolve their disagreements.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Bheeshma » 21 Mar 2017 09:04

Another BS article by pakis or is there any truth in it? Why should India let US mediate in IWT?

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Kashi » 21 Mar 2017 09:32

First thing that needs to be ascertained is if indeed there "will be secretary level talks on the Ratle and Kishanganga hydropower projects" between India and Pakistan in Washington DC "on April 11-13".

If there ARE such talks then a host of questions arise-
First of all which secretaries are participating in this "meeting"?
Why are secretary level talks being held in DC instead of Delhi-Isloo?
If IW commission is meeting today in Isloo, what is the need for the "secretary level talks on the Ratle and Kishanganga hydropower projects" in DC in April?
If it's the foreign secretaries that are supposed to meet, why would they discuss Indus waters, when a separate commission is already established for that purpose?
Has GoI said anything on this?

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby SSridhar » 21 Mar 2017 12:33

Bheeshma wrote:Another BS article by pakis or is there any truth in it? Why should India let US mediate in IWT?

It could be WB which is also headquartered in Washington DC.

Ironically, the IWT was mediated by the US through the WB in any case. Eisenhower wanted to help the US ally, Pakistan, and at the same time he also wanted to remove the misunderstanding between himself (Secretary Dulles) and Nehru. He thought of multiple benefits.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby sarang » 21 Mar 2017 18:26

US has decided?
Who is US to decide anything?

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby arun » 21 Mar 2017 18:48

Prem wrote:https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/193666-Pak-India-water-dispute-US-steps-in
ISLAMABAD: In a major development on the issue of lingering water dispute between Pakistan and India in accordance with the 1960 Indus Waters Treaty (IWT), the US has decided to arrange secretary level talks between the two countries in Washington next month for resolving issues relating to two controversial hydropower projects.These projects are 330MWs Kishanganga hydroelectric project and the under-construction 850 MWs Ratle hydroelectric project in occupied Jammu & Kashmir on which Pakistan has serious reservations.Briefing the media here on Monday, Federal Minister for Power and Khawaja Asif said: “The US has intervened and decided to help both the countries to resolve the issue. There will be secretary level talks on the Ratle and Kishanganga hydropower projects between both the countries in Washington on April 11-13 2017.”


If the Mohammadden Terrorist fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan's Minister for Power ,Khawaja Asif, is to be believed then I am shocked that Government of India has permitted the US to intervene in a bilateral affair between US and the Islamic Republic like the IWT. Given that Pakistani's are inveterate liars, I am more inclined to believe this claim of US involvement is a fabrication by the Islamic Republic. Anyway mid April is not to far way. Wait and watch.

Gagan
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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gagan » 21 Mar 2017 19:32

India allows free junkets to these madarsa educated Pakis to come into J&K to "review" the design of the various dams in J&K.
Since Pakistan has only one project in POK - the Neelum-Jhelum project, while India has some 4-5 projects ongoing, the Pakis have gotten to come into J&K at very regular intervals on essentially GoI sponsored junkets.

India needs to stop this nonsense outright.
J&K is part of India, and no Pakis need to be allowed to visit or oversee or verify Indian dam projects. If the Indus Water Treaty mandates such a thing, then this part needs to be suspended because of terrorism from Pakistan.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gagan » 21 Mar 2017 22:09

SSridhar wrote:It could be WB which is also headquartered in Washington.

Most probably a meet in WB HQ
That for Pakis is == massa interdicting. The rest will be lies and playing to the media to assuage people back home.

Khwaja Asif is an expert in loud mouth bakwaas anyways

Pakis and their hallucinations won't stop

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby vasu raya » 22 Mar 2017 00:03

Gagan wrote:But India needs to have a plan to link the Indus to one of the great lakes in the Leh Valley, then link those to the Jhelum, and then to the Chenab.
Stepwise if possible, bring the Indus water down to the plains of north india. I would say, re-invigiorate the Saraswati using Indus waters. Now that is a grand plan


Gaganji, would be nice if you could put a map to this and any tunnels rail or road already built or being built. Doubling these tunnels as water ducts is probably the only fastest way to be concurrent to CPEC related efforts.

Outside of IWT,
there is the wastage of water into the Sea in Pakistan and
recovering the deficit in Brahmaputra waters created by Chinese dams, maybe Pak can negotiate with their all weather friend on that account.

Gagan
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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Gagan » 22 Mar 2017 00:22

Vasu Raya ji,
There are nothing on the ground as yet.
I can give a link to all the existing, under construction and future planned projects, that I have marked on google earth.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby Cosmo_R » 22 Mar 2017 01:41

"An Indian government source told Hindustan Times, “As of now, we have not decided anything. We will take a call after the 10-member team headed by Indus water commissioner PK Saxena returns from Islamabad.”

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... V6zxJ.html

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby ragupta » 22 Mar 2017 01:54

Indus water only if they vacate POK. That must be the point to put across.

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Indus Water Treaty

Postby Peregrine » 22 Mar 2017 04:24

X Posted on the STFUP Thread

Water storage capacity of big dams goes down

LAHORE: The Lahore Chamber of Commerce and Industry (LCCI) has expressed concern over severe water scarcity in the biggest dams of the country, saying the crisis will directly hit agriculture and power sectors.

In a statement, LCCI President Abdul Basit, Senior Vice President Amjad Ali Jawa and Vice President Nasir Hameed Khan said Pakistan was an agrarian country and it could not afford water shortage at any cost. However, no strategy has been evolved to tackle the major issue.

They said the country depended on only two major dams – Tarbela and Mangla – and it was a matter of concern that water storage capacity of the two reservoirs had significantly reduced.

“The ongoing water crisis is the result of a dispute over Kalabagh Dam while around 12 million acre feet of water is being wasted into the sea, which is equal to the capacity of the two big dams,” added the LCCI office-bearers.

They said as per World Bank analysis, “our storage capacity has gone down to 150 acre feet. India has improved its per capita storage up to 200 acre feet, which will improve further once under-construction dams start giving results.”

“The country is faced with damaging floods every two to three years, which adversely impact the economy,” the officials added. They urged the government to take steps for water conservation and its effective use, adding that it would reduce capital and operational costs.

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Indus Water Treaty

Postby Peregrine » 22 Mar 2017 04:39

X Posted on the STFUP Thread

India, Pakistan discuss Indus Waters Treaty dispute in Islamabad

Indian and Pakistani experts on Monday opened round-table talks in Islamabad over water disputes between the two neighbours, even as tensions between them remain high.

Pakistan’s minister for water and power, Khawaja Asif, welcomed the Indian delegation for the two-day talks, saying he hopes the discussions will move forward in anticipation of continued talks on April 12 in Washington.

The 10-member Indian delegation, led by Indus Water Commissioner PK Saxena, held a closed-door meeting with the Pakistani side.

Both sides signed the Indus Waters Treaty in 1960, brokered by the World Bank, to share the vast water resources from the Indus River system, which supplies water to both countries. The treaty requires annual meetings but none have been held since May 2015 because of tense relations between New Delhi and Islamabad.

“Respect and implementation of this agreement ... is in the interest of both countries and this region,” Asif told reporters, adding that the Islamabad meeting would focus on three Indian projects for generating hydroelectric power on the Neelum and Jehlum rivers that flow through the disputed Kashmir.

Pakistan, a country of 180 million people with a largely agriculture-based economy, fears the projects could severely deplete its water resources. Many worry the dispute could further escalate tensions between the nuclear-armed rivals.

Pakistan last September requested World Bank mediate in the matter but the organization later backed out, forcing Pakistan and India to resume direct negotiations.

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Re: Indus Water Treaty

Postby vasu raya » 22 Mar 2017 05:01

Those Dove nano sats launched by ISRO recently I believe have altimeters and cover the whole of Earth's land mass on a daily basis, can ISRO lease their imagery to measure the water levels in all the areas of interest e.g., Tibet, TSP, Afghan, Bangla all year round?


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