India-Russia: News & Analysis

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 16 May 2018 22:25

@Philip
I know all that. My issue was with you stating that the Ferry had to traverse Ukrainian territory.
That is nonsense unless you consider Crimea to be Ukrainian territory.

You reproduced what western media propagated. Thats all.
Have a nice day.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Philip » 16 May 2018 22:42

Understood!

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 17 May 2018 10:17

India-Russia summit: How a phone call between Modi and Putin started it all
As India and China gave the final touches to their informal summit in Wuhan senior officials from India and Russia firmed up the idea for an informal summit between Modi and Putin. Despite the next annual summit scheduled in India in October, persons familiar with the development told ET this was done with an eye on firming up strategic partnership amid fast changing geo-politics.

The two leaders, who share good personal chemistry, gave the green signal after senior officials of both sides finalised the date and venue for the informal summit.


The informal summit in Sochi on May 21 will be somewhat similar to the Wuhan summit. Modi and Putin will be engaged in a one-on-one interaction soon after the PM arrives in the resort city on the morning of May 21. This will be followed by a lunch where both leaders will be accompanied only by senior officials from both sides. Thereafter, the two leaders will be engaged in another tete-a-tete including interaction through a possible walk. Modi is expected to return on the night of May 21.

Modi and Putin had one-on-one meeting last year through a walk in St Petersburg where Modi was present for the annual summit followed by his keynote address at as guest of honour at the St Petersburg International Economic Forum (SPIEF) in June last year.

The two leaders are expected to focus on the broad trends in current geo-politics – the North Korean situation, Iran nuclear deal, West Asia and Afghanistan – besides ideas to ramp up bilateral strategic & defence ties and economic partnership between the two countries. Special emphasis will be on significance of a multipolar world, rule of international law, sanctions as tool of global politics as well as Free Trade, officials told ET. The two sides are expected to offer a broad sense sense of the dialogue through press conferences following the meetings.

However, given one-on-one meet and wide array of issues, the agenda is open-ended and broad at the Sochi Summit. The two leaders could focus on a variety of subjects and are expected to give directions to their officials in expanding partnership.

The venue of the Summit -- Sochi -- is a resort city along the Black Sea famous for hosting international meets and the Winter Olympics. Sochi is hosting a number of international conferences and bilateral meets this week covering wide range of areas from nuclear energy to Eurasian Economic Union.



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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Philip » 17 May 2018 21:26

I admire the will of Putin and his support staff who execute the plans like the Crimea bridge built 6 months ahead of time. "Triumph of will".Adolf Hitler too- and one is not comparing Putin with Hitler(!), dragged Germany out of the gutter into prosperity and strength.Churchill too defied the Nazi juggernaut , Stalin defeated Hitler at Stalingrad, the turning point in the war.Such leaders were able to walk the talk.
We in India have Mr.Modi who is trying to do something similar.There is great vision, and push, but our babus often don't pull their weight because our govts. and administrators take the "chalta hai" route.The govt. should be as forceful in achieving results as we see in certain countries.

I was sent a phenomenal clip of Boeing's plant manufacturing hundreds of 737s a yr., the assembly line clip is a revelation.Will India ever reach that level? Kalyani say that they can manufacture 250 155mm party pieces a year.Great going.Putin gets results becos he is single-minded in reaching his goal.Much to be learnt from these examples.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Cain Marko » 18 May 2018 09:03


THe site is under construction. But it is quite well known in some Catholic circles that the famous Prophecies of Fatima suggest that Russia will be the one to "bring balance to the Force".....

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 18 May 2018 10:36

Cain Marko wrote:

THe site is under construction. But it is quite well known in some Catholic circles that the famous Prophecies of Fatima suggest that Russia will be the one to "bring balance to the Force".....


You can find the same in link below the site was working till yesterday

Famous Saints' Prophecies About the Future of Russia

These prophesies are from Orthodox Saints , Our Lady of Fatima which called for conversion of Russia during WW2 or just start of it happened exactly 50 years later.

Surprisingly I came to know yesterday while reading Russians has been Orthodox christians for 1000 years and communist was around 75 years

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRohs0AY6-4

Looking at the way practicing Christinity is dying in West with being Secular is the way of life with integration of Islam , The rise of Christinity in Russia after decades under communism is exactly what the Orthodox Saints have predicted including Falling in to Communism.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Cain Marko » 18 May 2018 11:24

Yes. Roosland has been bastion of orthodox church for long time. It is interesting to see the efforts to build bridges by Putin and Francis over last few years. Many are waiting for Francis visit to Moscow as harbinger of the said prophecy in some catholic circles..

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 18 May 2018 11:37

Orthodoxy and Roman Catholic has the least possible differences among all christian denominations , except Pope being the head of all the RC church versus each country has its own Bishop in Orthodoxy there is no difference between the two

So there is a conversation started between the two lead by Pope Francis Patriarch Kirill but I dont expect 1000 years of difference would just diminish by them but atleast the process has started. Both are working to Save Christinity in Sryia from the Jihadist.

Russian Church Vows to Help Rebuild Christian Syria

The ties between Russia and Syria are ancient — The Russian Orthodox Faith came from Antioch, Syria, where the disciples of Jesus were first called Christians (Acts 11:26).


Perhaps one of the reason why Putin intervened in Sryia , When these Mohomedian Jihadist started killing Christians mostly Orthodoxy and Murdering /beheding Nuns and West was just too happy to go along as long as those Saudi Sunnis Mohamedian Jihadist were kept happy

Russian orthodoxy has asked for ban on Abortion in Russia https://russia-insider.com/en/pro-life- ... es/ri23482
Something no one would dare even say in Western Political discourse but then there is more significant Moral and Spiritual degradation in Western Countries compared to Orthodoxy ones.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 19 May 2018 13:45

As India Goes Military Shopping in Russia, US Reminds of Moscow Sanctions

US officials said the major defence purchase by India from Russia would attract sanctions under the Countering America's Adversaries through Sanction Act (CAATSA), which was signed into law by US President Donald Trump in August 2017 and went into effect in January this year
Washington: At a time when India plans to purchase five S-400 Triumf air defence systems for around $4.5 billion from Russia, the US on Saturday said its friends and allies should take into consideration the law under which any significant purchase of military equipment from Moscow would attract American sanctions.

US officials said the major defence purchase by India from Russia would attract sanctions under the Countering America's Adversaries through Sanction Act (CAATSA), which was signed into law by US President Donald Trump in August 2017 and went into effect in January this year.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Russian President Vladimir Putin will hold an informal summit in the Russian city of Sochi on Monday, and official sources said the possible impact of the US sanctions against Russia under CAATSA on Indo-Russia defence cooperation may also figure during the talks between the two leaders.

"CAATSA is a feature and we need to take it seriously. The (Trump) administration is always bound by US law. This is a US law. I'm hoping that not just India, but all of the partners that we engage with will understand that we will have to evaluate any potential large defence purchase from Russia seriously because that's what the law demands of us," Tina Kaidanow, Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Political-Military Affairs, told reporters during a conference call on Saturday.

Kaidanow travels to India next week, during which she will hold talks on defence trade and peacekeeping, which are among two key areas of the rapidly growing US-India partnership as envisioned in the administration's Indo-Pacific strategy.

Referring to the conversation that the US is having with India and other countries on CAATSA, Kaidanow said the US wants this to be a positive discussion, not framed on the negative.

"We are going to have to continue to have that conversation with both our Indian counterparts and others about how do we deal with the CAATSA issue. But, I will tell you again, it is US law. We need to take it seriously. Our partners need to take that into consideration as they make their decisions. I can't stress that enough," Kaidanow said.


When specifically asked if she sees the possibility of US imposing sanctions on India, if it goes ahead with its defence deals with Russia, the senior US official said that everyone should read that legislation carefully and understand its intent.

"The intent is not to sanction our partners. The intent is to emphasise how important it is that Russia's malign behaviour all over the world is countered and by virtue of purchasing large-scale Russian system, what you're doing is enabling that kind of behaviour. That's the intent of the legislation," she said.


India is not going to allow its defence engagement with Russia to be dictated by any other country, the sources said earlier this week, adding New Delhi has been lobbying with the Trump administration on the issue.


Kaidanow sought to clarify that the message was intended not just for India but for all its partners as they contemplate these purchases. She underscored the "positive incentives" to buy American products which are "good" and address relevant security needs besides making their forces interoperable in certain instances. :rotfl:

"Think about what you're doing when you purchase Russian product. It has a distinctly negative byproduct and that is you are creating an environment in which they are better able to do some of the things that we know are problematic," Kaidanow said.
:lol:

She acknowledged the US understands the historic defence relationship between India and Russia.

"We understand all of that. It's a function of what are we talking about? Are you buying, a single truck; are you buying a large scale system ... these are things we're going to talk about," she said.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 19 May 2018 13:52

New U.S. Sanctions Pose Dilemma for India’s Defense
“India is now between the devil and the deep blue sea. If India opts to do business with Russia, it loses out on spares and services from the U.S. on equipment already purchased such as the Boeing P-8I maritime patrol aircraft and the Lockheed Martin C-130J,” said a senior MoD official. However, with no “force majeure” clause in those contracts, U.S. defense companies will be considered defaulters according to India’s Defense Procurement Procedure, resulting in heavy fines.

“This issue brings us back to the issue of trust that took so long to build between the two nations,” said an Indian MoD official. He noted that India has not yet signed two foundational agreements for defense cooperation with the U.S.: the Communications Compatibility and Security Agreement, previously known as the Communications and Information Security Memorandum of Agreement, and Basic Exchange and Cooperation Agreement. The two are necessary for India to access communication security equipment on imports from the U.S. and sharing geospatial information, respectively. “India never fully trusted the U.S.,” the official added.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 19 May 2018 15:21

Putin likes leaders coming to Moscow to massage his ego.
Erdogan, Assad, Netanyahu, all have earned much by paying homage to him. Its a good decision by Modi to pay him a visit.
Modi should act smart. He needs to balance between China, Russia and US.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Vips » 19 May 2018 22:21

So India = Syria or Israel or Egypt? What next India = Vanuatu or Tuvalu? Unless you respect yourself nobody is going to respect you.
To consider Russia and China are not on the same page in strategic matters is like living on hope and fresh air only. No matter what leverage India uses Russia cannot afford to and will not favor India if it impinges in China's interest. As China's wealth/power increases further there is never ever going to be a balance there.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 00:02

Vips wrote:So India = Syria or Israel or Egypt? What next India = Vanuatu or Tuvalu? Unless you respect yourself nobody is going to respect you.
To consider Russia and China are not on the same page in strategic matters is like living on hope and fresh air only. No matter what leverage India uses Russia cannot afford to and will not favor India if it impinges in China's interest. As China's wealth/power increases further there is never ever going to be a balance there.


Why such emotions.
And no, India doesnt have the economy and mil-industry of US, doesnt have the economy of China and doesnt have the mil-industry of Russia. So yes, India will have to play on all sides.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Vips » 20 May 2018 02:03

Yes we may play all sides and will be neither here nor there. With respect to the US, Russia may throw some crumbs of support but when it comes to china are they going to support ? - Nada, Nyet, No.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Philip » 20 May 2018 04:23

Russia is not in a marriage with China, nor is there any formal military alliance.No equiv. of even our erstwhile friendship treaty with the Sovs.This current friendship does not mean that in any Sino-Indian spat it will take China's side. Moreover, the kind of military assistance it is providing us and offering us is far superior to what it is selling or offering to China whom it sees as a potential rival in mil. exports tx. to its reverse- engineering without an agreement with an OEM.

It has had a far longer military, political and strategic relationship with India which believe you me, it will not damage unless India jumps onto a bandwagon which is anti-Russia either overtly or covertly.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 12:21

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/998049319075926016
@ANI
Follow Follow @ANI
More
It's very important & different kind of meeting b/w PM Modi & President Putin. Difference is President Putin invited PM to come to visit him & discuss various issues almost within 2 weeks of him becoming President of Russia for 4th time: Pankaj Saran, Indian Ambassador to Russia

We expect talks to begin at 1 o'clock local time in delegation format followed by lunch hosted by Pres just for PM. We expect them to be together for a few hrs. It's great opportunity for personal chemistry b/w them to discuss different ssues: Pankaj Saran, Indian Envoy to Russia

In a few months time President Putin himself will be traveling to India for the regular summit. This frequency of meetings is another important aspect of our relations with Russia: Pankaj Saran, Indian Ambassador to Russia

Iran is very important subject. There's been recent development with regard to nuclear agreement with Iran. I'm sure it'll come up for discussion b/w Russia & India because they have relations with Iran of different kinds & have big stakes in Iran: P Saran, Indian Envoy to Russia


ISIS threat, international terrorism, how we need to tackle it, will come up for discussion. Besides India being victim of terrorism from so many yrs, Russia also has been a victim & is concerned about spread of terrorism within its own country: P Saran, Indian Envoy to Russia

Russia is already participating in the construction of the Kudankulam Nuclear Power Plant. It has committed to building 6 plants in Kudankulam. We have signed an agreement with Russia to construct more units in India: Pankaj Saran, Indian Ambassador to Russia

They'll also discuss situation in Afghanistan & Syria, because whole problem in Syria is related to conduct of international terrorism & it's a problem the region faces: Pankaj Saran, Indian Ambassador to Russia on PM Modi's informal summit with President Putin in Sochi on May 21
Last edited by Austin on 20 May 2018 12:27, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby srin » 20 May 2018 12:24

Parasu wrote:Putin likes leaders coming to Moscow to massage his ego.
Erdogan, Assad, Netanyahu, all have earned much by paying homage to him. Its a good decision by Modi to pay him a visit.
Modi should act smart. He needs to balance between China, Russia and US.


It is Putin who needs to balance between China and India, no ?

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 12:38

Vips wrote:Yes we may play all sides and will be neither here nor there. With respect to the US, Russia may throw some crumbs of support but when it comes to china are they going to support ? - Nada, Nyet, No.

When it comes to China, is US going to support us?
Did it give a single statement in support of India during Doka la ?!
Xi Jinping is Trump`s friend. He tweets his gratitude every alternate day.
Trump mocked Modi publicly twice in two weeks in February.

So, we are all alone when it comes to China. Better to play all sides, including Russia.
srin wrote:It is Putin who needs to balance between China and India, no ?

What does India have to offer other than arms imports?! Chinese economy is 5 times that of India.
India needs to play its cards well.
I am all support for Modi`s diplomacy. Lets hope it gets India some visible benefits.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 12:47

It's very important & different kind of meeting b/w PM Modi & President Putin. Difference is President Putin invited PM to come to visit him & discuss various issues almost within 2 weeks of him becoming President of Russia for 4th time: Pankaj Saran, Indian Ambassador to Russia


Nonsense.
The meeting is happening due to Russian pressure on India. After FGFA balloon puncture, angry Russia made very public postures making out with al-bakis.
This came at the same time when Trumpism is also active in US. With India already having a downturn wrt China, Modi probably decided it is not ok to be in bad books of all major powers. The Modi visit is preceded by numerous visits of NSA and other ministers.
The meeting was probably asked for by the Indian side.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 12:57

^^ You claim to know more than Pankaj Saran on who requested for the meeting and why .......Indian Russian relations are far greater and deeper then 1-2 deals failing or 1-2 succeeding , its an institutionalised system working for more than 60 years.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 15:02

Austin wrote:^^ You claim to know more than Pankaj Saran on who requested for the meeting and why .......Indian Russian relations are far greater and deeper then 1-2 deals failing or 1-2 succeeding , its an institutionalised system working for more than 60 years.

We are here to analyse. Not to believe everything stated by officials.
You are welcome to believe whatever you want. I cant care less.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 16:05

Yes but those analysis needs to be based on facts and on information provided by Indian official cant be based on imaginative thinking or fictional scenario's , Modi has has unoffical meeting with Xi and Merkel below.

But I agree with the assessment DT and Xi has close friends and they even manage to fix the so called trade dispute thing and I dont expect DT or any USG to stand up for us in any conflict heck they dont even stand up for us in any dispute with pakistan and call spade a spade

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Vips » 20 May 2018 18:52

Parasu wrote:
Vips wrote:Yes we may play all sides and will be neither here nor there. With respect to the US, Russia may throw some crumbs of support but when it comes to china are they going to support ? - Nada, Nyet, No.


When it comes to China, is US going to support us?
Did it give a single statement in support of India during Doka la ?!
Xi Jinping is Trump`s friend. He tweets his gratitude every alternate day.
Trump mocked Modi publicly twice in two weeks in February.


Why is US coming into the equation here? Are we dependent on US to deal with what will be a local border war?
Let me ask you the reverse - did Russia give a single statement in support of India? On the contrary at that time they haughtily advised us to talk with them and even become a part of the CPEC!!! Doklam proves the point that if you are strong and stand firm the Chinese will be reasonable. They like any logical entity will only respect power, no amount of currying favor or playing one side against the other is going to help you.

Remember and get this understood firmly - Russia, in a China Vs India scenario will happily play along and sacrifice our interests when we need them the most.But by the time we realize that it will be too late.

We need to come out of the outdated Non-aligned mentality. That left us neither here nor there. It is pathetic a continent sized country has this mind set. Show me one country the size of India which has tried to depend on others to protect its interest. Only solution is to gain rapid military strength.Mollycoddling other powers will only get you contempt. Only Strength gets you respect.

Dhobi ka kutta has only one result and fate - Naa Ghar Ka Naa Ghat Ka.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Vips » 20 May 2018 19:13

Philip wrote:Russia is not in a marriage with China, nor is there any formal military alliance.No equiv. of even our erstwhile friendship treaty with the Sovs.


You are right Russia is not in a marriage with China. Why does China need to marry when Russia is willing to be its concubine :lol:
China does not have any military alliance with Russia only because China has not asked for it and as for the so called friendship treaty that Russia has with India china knows it means diddly squat in a future China -India conflict.

Philip wrote:This current friendship does not mean that in any Sino-Indian spat it will take China's side.


It already did so by not asking china to vacate Doklam but by asking us to enter into 'negotiations' with china and also become a part of CPEC.

philp wrote:Moreover, the kind of military assistance it is providing us and offering us is far superior to what it is selling or offering to China whom it sees as a potential rival in mil. exports tx. to its reverse- engineering without an agreement with an OEM


What has it offered to us that is far superior to that offered to China? SU30? It gave SU35 to China - even when it knows these will be reverse engineered and will fly in the future in PAF. The only reason a nuclear submarine has not been given to China is because they have not asked for it.

Philip wrote:It has had a far longer military, political and strategic relationship with India which believe you me, it will not damage unless India jumps onto a bandwagon which is anti-Russia either overtly or covertly.

Really? It enabled and helped China power the thunder Bandar of Pakistan with engines it could not have got from anywhere else and remember this was even before India had bought any worthwhile equipment from the US.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby habal » 20 May 2018 19:34

DT making fun of modi's accent has cooled down dt-modi, you do not make fun of your strategic allies. dt is his own worst enemy. Modi feels now that he cannot rely on dt and Iran sanctions have given momentum to kickstart an alternate currency system which is a need for energy importer like India and putin feels he has an opening here.

much of Indo-us bonhomie was reliant on cheap saudi crude to replace iranian oil imports, since dt has distances himself from that deal we also will do as our benefit.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 21:19

Austin wrote:Yes but those analysis needs to be based on facts and on information provided by Indian official cant be based on imaginative thinking or fictional scenario's , Modi has has unoffical meeting with Xi and Merkel below.

Mid-february, India informed Russia about its FGFA decision. Since then Russia has been befriending Pakistan.
A rudimentary search gives numerous commentaries on what has been happening between the two countries.
Please inform yourself. Alternatively, you are welcome to believe every statement by every random diplomat.
https://thediplomat.com/2018/04/russia- ... outh-asia/
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-paki ... SKBN1GH27P
https://www.dailyo.in/politics/china-ru ... 23153.html
https://www.livemint.com/Politics/wcSec ... ussia.html
https://www.voanews.com/a/pakistan-russ ... 61453.html

But I agree with the assessment DT and Xi has close friends and they even manage to fix the so called trade dispute thing and I dont expect DT or any USG to stand up for us in any conflict heck they dont even stand up for us in any dispute with pakistan and call spade a spade

You agree with this statement because it suits your narrative. Russia cosying up to Pakistan doesnt suit you.
Anyway, I dont think you have anything to offer, other than -
Russia is so great, Russian arms are so good and India must suck up to Russia.
So, this will be my last reply to you.
Enjoy.
Ta

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Bart S » 20 May 2018 21:24

Parasu wrote:Anyway, I dont think you have anything to offer, other than -
Russia is so great, Russian arms are so good and India must suck up to Russia.
So, this will be my last reply to you.
Enjoy.
Ta


WRONG. If you scroll up the thread, there were some prophecies about Russia by 'famous saints' as well. :rotfl:

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 20 May 2018 21:31

Vips wrote:
Parasu wrote:
When it comes to China, is US going to support us?
Did it give a single statement in support of India during Doka la ?!
Xi Jinping is Trump`s friend. He tweets his gratitude every alternate day.
Trump mocked Modi publicly twice in two weeks in February.


Why is US coming into the equation here? Are we dependent on US to deal with what will be a local border war?

Let me ask you a reverse question. Why did the Chinese threat come into discussion ?!
I only said we should
Parasu wrote:Putin likes leaders coming to Moscow to massage his ego.
Erdogan, Assad, Netanyahu, all have earned much by paying homage to him. Its a good decision by Modi to pay him a visit.
Modi should act smart. He needs to balance between China, Russia and US.


And I explained why India needs to balance.
Parasu wrote:And no, India doesnt have the economy and mil-industry of US, doesnt have the economy of China and doesnt have the mil-industry of Russia. So yes, India will have to play on all sides.


Nothing to do with Chinese threat.
You brought up the chinese threat and stated that Russia wont support us. And I said, neither will US.
I also never said India must depend on any other foreign country. I only said that India needs to play on all sides.
I think you are confusing me with some of the other roos-lovers here.
My pragmatic position is that India should maintain good relations with Russia because it is dependent on the country for spares and armaments. And if massaging the ego of a totalitarian Putin helps in this, then its alright to indulge him.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 22:54

Parasu wrote:
Austin wrote:Yes but those analysis needs to be based on facts and on information provided by Indian official cant be based on imaginative thinking or fictional scenario's , Modi has has unoffical meeting with Xi and Merkel below.

Mid-february, India informed Russia about its FGFA decision. Since then Russia has been befriending Pakistan.
A rudimentary search gives numerous commentaries on what has been happening between the two countries.
Please inform yourself. Alternatively, you are welcome to believe every statement by every random diplomat.
https://thediplomat.com/2018/04/russia- ... outh-asia/
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-paki ... SKBN1GH27P
https://www.dailyo.in/politics/china-ru ... 23153.html
https://www.livemint.com/Politics/wcSec ... ussia.html
https://www.voanews.com/a/pakistan-russ ... 61453.html


That was ajai shukla report nothing to do with official stance of india or Russia about Fgfa cancelled in fact the nsa visited in April and nothing of that sort came up , IAAF chief said 2 weeks back the report was classified.

So it’s usual ajai Shukla quoting sources stuff , let officially goi say something either ways

But I agree with the assessment DT and Xi has close friends and they even manage to fix the so called trade dispute thing and I dont expect DT or any USG to stand up for us in any conflict heck they dont even stand up for us in any dispute with pakistan and call spade a spade
You agree with this statement because it suits your narrative. Russia cosying up to Pakistan doesnt suit you.
Anyway, I dont think you have anything to offer, other than -
Russia is so great, Russian arms are so good and India must suck up to Russia.
So, this will be my last reply to you.
Enjoy.
Ta


You can suck up to who ever you want to

But DT early on Bowed China when he backed down on Taiwan issue after making tall claim he was made to eat humble pie .

All this talk of trade war met the same fate , same with threats on disputed island

China knows this is a war US will never win and China will never loose , just the threat of trade war and dow jones fell 1000 points :lol:

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 22:55

:!:
Last edited by Austin on 20 May 2018 23:00, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Austin » 20 May 2018 22:59

ISIS claims responsibility for attack on Orthodox church in Chechnya
https://www.rt.com/news/427257-isis-res ... ny-attack/

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby nam » 20 May 2018 23:29

Vips wrote:Yes we may play all sides and will be neither here nor there. With respect to the US, Russia may throw some crumbs of support but when it comes to china are they going to support ? - Nada, Nyet, No.


Russia brought in India in to SCO to balance China. Chinese bought in their beggar client, to balance us. So Russians are much smarter than the Chinese.

We don't need Russian support words, we need Russian tech against the Chinese. As long as that is flowing, we are perfectly fine. Russians gave us nuke boat, potentially share hypersonic tech, all of these we openly say are against the Chinese.

I wonder what he Chinese are saying about this Russia habit of sharing tech with India!

We are now the 5th largest economy in the world and growing. Just like India , for Russia, relations are not black & white. Why would Russia spoil relation with a future 5 trillion economy?

We just need to make sure Russia is not an adversary and there is no reason for it to be one.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Viv S » 20 May 2018 23:46

Parasu wrote:When it comes to China, is US going to support us?
Did it give a single statement in support of India during Doka la ?!

Militarily, no. (We're not a treaty ally and will never be.) Diplomatically & logistically, yes. They're more than willing to get in the Chinese face in East and South East Asia, and have little reason to be any more restrained in South Asia.

Arunachal Pradesh is integral part of India: US Consul General
India Welcomes US ambassador In Tawang

On Doklam, I suspect their position ('talks' -> 'return to status quo') was arrived after discussions with the GoI - the build up (precipitated by Chinese moves) was on land claimed by China & Bhutan, and the GoI & MEA were attempting to suppress the war rhetoric to arrive at a diplomatic solution and a return to the status quo.

'US supports 'return of status quo' on Doklam issue'

Xi Jinping is Trump`s friend. He tweets his gratitude every alternate day.
Trump mocked Modi publicly twice in two weeks in February.

Trump is above all things a reality TV star - he's in it for the publicity and the big man office. Geopolitics is a little out of his wheelhouse, and his positions and statements are an aberration as far as the long term picture is concerned. Post-2020, the situation will likely to revert to a less loony institutionalized normal.

So, we are all alone when it comes to China. Better to play all sides, including Russia.

I think the govt is playing all sides for sure but while keeping in mind that Russia has a different equation with China, than the US & Japan.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby SBajwa » 21 May 2018 00:22

Media (just Zee news yet) is reporting the following deals on table.

1. $4 billion for five S-400 missile defense (talks going on for 2 years now)
2. 40 more SU-31 MKIs.
3. N number of T90 tanks

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Cain Marko » 21 May 2018 00:25

Viv S wrote:. Post-2020, the situation will likely to revert to a less loony institutionalized normal..

You really think so Viv? Who will challenge Trump? Note that most presidencies since Carter tend to be two terms.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 21 May 2018 02:31

Viv S wrote:Trump is above all things a reality TV star - he's in it for the publicity and the big man office. Geopolitics is a little out of his wheelhouse, and his positions and statements are an aberration as far as the long term picture is concerned. Post-2020, the situation will likely to revert to a less loony institutionalized normal.

Trump may be a ***** star for all I care. He is the US president. He is dictating American policy.
His pressure on India on trade issues is counterproductive. The biggest objective of any Indian govt is to maintain high growth rate and alleviate poverty.

I think the govt is playing all sides for sure but while keeping in mind that Russia has a different equation with China, than the US & Japan.

We are getting ahead of ourselves. First we need to destroy Pakistan. If playing on all sides with all powers help, then so be it.
Frankly, I dont mind India warming up to Chipandas in return for China ending its support for the Pakis.
That is why I included china in the list of countries India should engage with.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Parasu » 21 May 2018 02:33

SBajwa wrote:Media (just Zee news yet) is reporting the following deals on table.

1. $4 billion for five S-400 missile defense (talks going on for 2 years now)
2. 40 more SU-31 MKIs.
3. N number of T90 tanks

Isnt this an informal summit?!
So, how could deals be signed?!

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby Vips » 21 May 2018 04:00

Parasu wrote:I only said we should , Putin likes leaders coming to Moscow to massage his ego.
Erdogan, Assad, Netanyahu, all have earned much by paying homage to him. Its a good decision by Modi to pay him a visit.
Modi should act smart. He needs to balance between China, Russia and US.


You wrote that india needs to balance between China, Russia and US. Why should we balance and for what? So that Russia would hypothetically take care of our interests and help us should a situation inimical to us arises , right? I pointed out with respect to China it a non starter, as playing all sides will give you the feeling that all is well for us but in reality it will not be so, the Russian action is a foregone conclusion.

Parasu wrote:And I explained why India needs to balance.
And no, India doesnt have the economy and mil-industry of US, doesnt have the economy of China and doesnt have the mil-industry of Russia. So yes, India will have to play on all sides.


Well you may try and we will see where it gets us.

Parasu wrote:My pragmatic position is that India should maintain good relations with Russia because it is dependent on the country for spares and armaments. And if massaging the ego of a totalitarian Putin helps in this, then its alright to indulge him.


Remember that Putin is not doing us any favors by giving us the spares . We are paying $$ for the same. Putin is not exactly in a position to turn down cash. As for armaments - Well there are alternate sources available.

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Re: India-Russia: News & Analysis

Postby rgosain » 21 May 2018 04:32

With oil prices heading back up to 100 and the need to mitigate CO2 emissions, nuclear once again starts to look attractive,and this is where advancing Khondalukan can be beneficial to the Russians in the long term, once the sanctions kick in.

Here is a thing. Was CAATSA steered by the PRC. There is a long history of US sanction legislation favouring the PRC over India, from the Glenn amendment to the Clintons giving waivers to the PRC to proliferate in the 90s.
It is ironic, that the PRC which has a far deeper and extensive relationship than India with Russia regarding military sales, is exempt from CAATSA in the same manner, as, it is exempt from many of anti-Iran sanctions that target the Iranian oil industry, even though India's share is much lower.

This is never highlighted by the GOI or the media .


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