Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby sampat » 10 Aug 2009 00:35

kittoo wrote:
yvijay wrote:^The comments in the article posted by Acharya above, really opened my eyes. I never thought Nepalis had that much hatred for India. "Hating India more than pakistan", "supporting china in case of war" and "killing Indians" -- ****** Unbelievable. I don't what has India done to deserve these shitty neighbours.

I too was thinking the same. Even with all the long cultural ties, why so much hate? Just because India is big or because India is in news there constantly for supporting them? I mean since Nepalis are fighting so much with each other, India had to choose some side right? Now why the general public hate? Does the public love Maoists so much?


Because there has been lot of propaganda against India, sponsored by friendly dragon. Some people think that India is behind everything bad that happens in Nepal. In fact, people believe in paki lies that India creates trouble in Sri lanka, Bangladesh and all other neighboring countries. I even met a guy who attributed defeat of LTTE as defeat of India :roll:

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby svinayak » 10 Aug 2009 00:58

sampat wrote: I even met a guy who attributed defeat of LTTE as defeat of India :roll:

They look at LTTE as a creation of India and a Hindu entity

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Kailash » 10 Aug 2009 12:06

For once, sovereignty is the issue

There seems to be some logic to this argument. Any comments?

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Hari Seldon » 10 Aug 2009 12:22

Seems like PRC investments have paid off in creating a nepali version of the RAPE class in kathmandu. The inglis speaking anti india venom spewers fit the profile to a tee.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Anabhaya » 12 Aug 2009 23:49

The Maoist chief said he had tried to tackle the Army Chief row on the basis of consensus with other parties. "But the parties received some telegrams from abroad and then they changed." Asked from where it came, he said "it is an open secret", without naming India. :)

He said while in office he tried his level-best to stop foreign interference in Nepalese politics but "the Army chief episode showed how big is the foreign influence in Nepal."

Prachanda said India had supported the dialogue between Maoists and other political parties after King Gyanendra assumed direct power in 2005. But New Delhi "lost its warmth" towards the Maoists when elections resulted in his assumption of office of the Prime Minister in August 2008.


Prachanda says India wrong to think he is closer to China

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby svinayak » 13 Aug 2009 02:11


Nepalese foreign Minister felicitated

http://www.hindu.com/2009/08/12/stories ... 690400.htm

NEW DELHI: Nepalese Foreign Minister Sujata Koirala was felicitated by Delhi Study Group president Vijay Jolly at a function here on Tuesday.

Speaking on the occasion, Mr. Jolly called for a strong alliance among India, Nepal and Bhutan to address both security and climate change issues, adding that 80 lakh people of Nepalese origin living in India had become part of the country’s composite culture.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby putnanja » 18 Aug 2009 02:11


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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Ben Thomas » 19 Aug 2009 14:44



Though I am not particularly a fan of Hindu, I do agree with the article.
No country should be taken for granted.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby chetak » 19 Aug 2009 14:52

sampat wrote:
kittoo wrote: quote="yvijay" ^The comments in the article posted by Acharya above, really opened my eyes. I never thought Nepalis had that much hatred for India. "Hating India more than pakistan", "supporting china in case of war" and "killing Indians" -- ****** Unbelievable. I don't what has India done to deserve these shitty neighbours.

I too was thinking the same. Even with all the long cultural ties, why so much hate? Just because India is big or because India is in news there constantly for supporting them? I mean since Nepalis are fighting so much with each other, India had to choose some side right? Now why the general public hate? Does the public love Maoists so much? /quote

Because there has been lot of propaganda against India, sponsored by friendly dragon. Some people think that India is behind everything bad that happens in Nepal. In fact, people believe in paki lies that India creates trouble in Sri lanka, Bangladesh and all other neighboring countries. I even met a guy who attributed defeat of LTTE as defeat of India :roll:



I meet a lot of nepali airline pilots flying in India who routinely spew venom against India and the Indians.

These are middle and upper class blokes who are astounded and avaricious of all that India has to offer.

The middle and upper class are the most virulent in their hatred.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby shravan » 21 Aug 2009 21:52

India to give Rs 2,000 cr assistance to Nepal

SILIGURI: Financially hit Nepal is going to get an assistance of Rs 2,000 crore from India as aid package for different development programs. The package, appreciated by the Nepal policy makers, however is being considered by a large section of them as New Delhi’s move to curb the possibility of growing Nepal-China friendship.
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At this juncture, in order to turn around, the previous Nepal Prime Minister, and architect of Nepal’s political transformation, and Maoist chief Puspa Kumar Dahal (Prachanda) was about to sign a "Comprehensive Treaty" with China. This would have replaced the "Peace and Friendship Treaty (1960)" between Nepal and China. The proposed comprehensive treaty was supposed to have a large financial aid package built in.

However, since signing of new Nepal China friendship treaty could not materialize mainly due to the resignation of Mr Dahal, India has taken a strategic move to come closer to Nepal with this aid, as assessed by Nepal’s political observers.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby AmitR » 21 Aug 2009 23:27

chetak wrote:The middle and upper class are the most virulent in their hatred.


Maybe it is time for Indians to do a bit of introspection as to why we do not have good relationship with any of our neighbours.

What causes this deep level of distrust and hatred for India?
What are the main historical reasons for this distrust?
What can be done to remove this enmity and hatred?

I have always believed that most Indians have a holier than thou attitude (like all other nationalities but accentuated).
One easy example is right here in BRF, where we never fail to call a person a Paki or American agent/sales man the moment he/she starts to counter our arguments logically. This clearly displays our koop manduk (frog in the well) mentality and poor understanding of cultural differences that exist within this community.

Just as we hate to be under the thumb of the Americans, Nepalese, Sri Lankans, Bangladeshis also dislike Indian influence in their country. It does not help that we do not have any consistent foreign policy guidelines. We have a reactive policy making style that shows us in poor light and makes us look like weak nation. Contrast this with China and you will get the picture.

Some members keep on harping about our deep cultural relations and shared history with our neighbours. None of these matter in any real terms. If such things would have mattered Taiwan and China would be one nation.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Gagan » 22 Aug 2009 05:06

AmitR wrote:Maybe it is time for Indians to do a bit of introspection as to why we do not have good relationship with any of our neighbours.

What causes this deep level of distrust and hatred for India?
What are the main historical reasons for this distrust?
What can be done to remove this enmity and hatred?

Maybe we should ask the question,
With which nation are these nations in question pally with?

The answer is obviously, none.
The appear to be close to china because then they can play India vs China and make some money. These are all a ring of failed and failing states. India was one of them not too long ago, hell Indian thought process in the smaller towns and kasbas is mostly still the same as theirs - that of a failing state, except that India is now improving rapidly - which is why we are gloating.

India will not have very good relationships with any of them until they individually get up and describe a path of development for themselves based on their own individual strengths.

Unhappy nations are perennially grumpy, and their ire gets directed at the affluent neighbor always.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby AmitR » 22 Aug 2009 08:02

Gagan wrote:With which nation are these nations in question pally with?
The answer is obviously, none.
The appear to be close to china because then they can play India vs China and make some money. These are all a ring of failed and failing states. India was one of them not too long ago, hell Indian thought process in the smaller towns and kasbas is mostly still the same as theirs - that of a failing state, except that India is now improving rapidly - which is why we are gloating.

India will not have very good relationships with any of them until they individually get up and describe a path of development for themselves based on their own individual strengths.

Unhappy nations are perennially grumpy, and their ire gets directed at the affluent neighbor always.


Gagan you have written the same pathetic hyperbole that surrounds every discussion when we discuss our neighbours.

You assume that all the Indian neighbours are failed state.

Can you define what a failed nation is?
What are the parameters that you use to define a failed nation?
I quote from wiki.

*loss of physical control of its territory, or of the monopoly on the legitimate use of physical force therein,
*erosion of legitimate authority to make collective decisions,
*an inability to provide reasonable public services, and
*an inability to interact with other states as a full member of the international community.


India has lost more territory to it's neighbours than any other nation in the recent time. Both Pakistan and China are squatting over a large part of our territory even as we discuss this. There is little or no government control over a large swath of tribal areas where Maoists are ruling. So India is a failed state as per this criteria.

If the criteria is economic then India is not much better off than most of it's neighbours. In fact, we have one of the largest numbers of people living below the line of property. If the criteria is quality of governance then remember we have been voted one of the most corrupt countries in the world consistently and rank one of the worst in HDI behind some of our so called failed nation states.

By whatever yardstick, India is and will be in the foreseeable future a borderline case of failed nation, so no need to thump your chest and act like a 800 pound gorilla when you are little more than a langur amongst the monkeys.

Every sovereign nation has a choice to act as per it's own national interest. In this case our neighbours feel that China provides better opportunity for their growth and there is a good reason for that.

And just cause you don't know, Sri Lanka was the more developed and better off than India till the time we started meddling there using LTTE. No wonder that they hate us so much, just as we hate the Pakistanis for sending Jihadis to India.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Gagan » 22 Aug 2009 08:39

There is a huge difference between a failed state and an impoverished underdeveloped and therefore unhappy one.
Neither of India's neighbours except Pakistan, are at the level of a somalia.
All of these nations, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Nepal were/are afflicted by internal strife. India was just like them not too long ago.
Nepal and Sri Lanka enjoyed good relations with India all these years, now, nepal after being raked with the maoist civil war, is begining to be anti- India. Bangladesh truned on us shortly after it gained independence, remained hostile throughout its military rule and upto the rule of Khaleda Zia.

You give the example of Srilanka and the LTTE, to this day, Sri lanka enjoys good relations with india. Is it a coincidence that Srilanka is a rapidly developing nation, and is one of the most developed SAARC nations?
Take the case of Nepal. Is it a coincidence that when they it is least progressive, right after the maoist takeover, that it is the most anti india too?
Bangladesh - similar behaviour all these years under the military rule and under KZ. Only under S Hasina Wazed, and the previous military rule did relations thaw, and it seems to coincide with bangladesh now looking inwards and starting to develop faster.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby AmitR » 22 Aug 2009 09:00

Gagan wrote:All of these nations, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Nepal were/are afflicted by internal strife. India was just like them not too long ago.
Nepal and Sri Lanka enjoyed good relations with India all these years, now, nepal after being raked with the maoist civil war, is begining to be anti- India. Bangladesh truned on us shortly after it gained independence, remained hostile throughout its military rule and upto the rule of Khaleda Zia.

You give the example of Srilanka and the LTTE, to this day, Sri lanka enjoys good relations with india. Is it a coincidence that Srilanka is a rapidly developing nation, and is one of the most developed SAARC nations?
Take the case of Nepal. Is it a coincidence that when they it is least progressive, right after the maoist takeover, that it is the most anti india too?
Bangladesh - similar behaviour all these years under the military rule and under KZ. Only under S Hasina Wazed, and the previous military rule did relations thaw, and it seems to coincide with bangladesh now looking inwards and starting to develop faster.


The anti India feeling in Nepal goes way back than the Maoist insurgency that you are talking about.
Even when it was a Kingdom the feeling was same. Only difference is that now the Maoists are more vocal about it.

Bangladesh has always being anti-India.

Sri Lankans do not trust Indians, they are taking the aid of China to build their country and will be a key pearl in the Chinese string.
Not sure where you get this idea of Lanka India bhai bhai.

Pakistan and China, I'd better not say anything.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Aug 2009 09:53

IMO, it is the elites in the neighboring countries with the most outward antipathy to India. And with good reason. PRC doesn't threaten the same elites in quite the same way - PRC is quite willing to deal with the elites in their terms - e.g. no strings aid a good part of which by mutual understanding goes into the elites' coffers, no overt rhetoric about/concern for/relationship to the people of the said country etc.

I doubt the same level of anti-Yindianism exists among the commoners (except in TSP and perhaps BD).

If it does, we're screwed. Rightly so. As long as the neighbors don't allow outside powers (US, PRC etc) missile bases, sub bases, N bases on their soil directed against India, Dilli can live with their antagonism.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby AmitR » 22 Aug 2009 10:15

Hari Seldon wrote:IMO, it is the elites in the neighboring countries with the most outward antipathy to India. I doubt the same level of anti-Yindianism exists among the commoners (except in TSP and perhaps BD).

If it does, we're screwed. Rightly so. As long as the neighbors don't allow outside powers (US, PRC etc) missile bases, sub bases, N bases on their soil directed against India, Dilli can live with their antagonism.


Trust me friend, the antipathy is deeply rooted even amongst the common man in our neighboring countries.
You can go and talk to any Paki, Nepali, Bangladeshi or Sri Lankan all of them have a deep sense of antipathy towards India.
Unfortunately our media machinery and government PR hides this behind the "taller than mountain and deeper than ocean" religious, cultural and historical ties. Hindi Chini Bai Bai.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Aug 2009 10:26

OK. Diagnosis is one thing. How about treatment?

Why the antipathy against India? Are we eyeing their territory? Interfering in their internal affairs?

Part of the mosaic is the fact that folks feel freer to vent against a relatively peaceful neighbor that will not rain fire on them should it get displeased. If any of these mighty pipsqueaks try their antics against a PRC, they will end up with their nuts in a vice.

IMO, India has already lost its periphery. Its only a question of time before BD hosts PLAN sub bases alongside Gwadar,Ceylon hosts PLAN bases, and Burma hosts PRC missile bases now.

What solution do you propose?

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby harbans » 22 Aug 2009 10:44

I would agree with Amit to an extent. There were major negative feelings all round our neighborhood enmasse till very recently. As mentioned before SL was one of the fastest growing economies, not just in the subcontinent but in Asia, till they caused the Tamil problem. I would not blame India for the LTTE problem. Why even Pakis and BDs used to boast Toyotas and Hondas while we had Austin Morris and Fiat 1950s to show. There was a feeling in theneighbourhood that they'd be much more successful if India adopted a succesful model. Till a decade back even SE Asia used to look down on the SDRE traveller from India. Not any longer, things are changing. Economic clout does achieve a lot, and with success the bring in 'friends'. Today people are again looking in surprise as India catches up with China. Wait till the base year calculation in GDP is revised..by 2011 we'll possibly be a 3 trillion USD economy, growing at 10% while China's bubble could be bursting. Imagine if China grows 3% and India 10% from that stage for just 3 years..we'd be on par with China by 2015. What do you think the world will be saying then? Who do you think then the Nepalese will go for then? China? What do you think Pakis and BDs say even today when people abroad ask them where they from? Not China, not Pakistani, not BD..that is if they can get away with it. Travel today to Japan, Korea, Taiwan there is a difference in the way people deal once they know you're from India..so it's not really all that bad. Theres no better PR than economic success. JMT/

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby AmitR » 22 Aug 2009 11:12

Hari Seldon wrote:OK. Diagnosis is one thing. How about treatment?

Why the antipathy against India? Are we eyeing their territory? Interfering in their internal affairs?

Part of the mosaic is the fact that folks feel freer to vent against a relatively peaceful neighbor that will not rain fire on them should it get displeased. If any of these mighty pipsqueaks try their antics against a PRC, they will end up with their nuts in a vice.

IMO, India has already lost its periphery. Its only a question of time before BD hosts PLAN sub bases alongside Gwadar,Ceylon hosts PLAN bases, and Burma hosts PRC missile bases now.

What solution do you propose?


Harbans has posted a response as I was typing mine so I will try to put his ideas in perspective.

Analysis is exactly what I proposed in my original reply to Gagan's simplistic view of failed state.
I am taking out Pakis and BDs from this discussion as they have a Jihadi antipathy towards India.

1) Meddling in others affair without long term strategy or vision.

India has meddled in neighboring countries since a long time. Unfortunately, the policies lack a sense of direction and continuity. India needs to create policies that are consistent and long term in nature. Right now we have knee jerk policy towards everything. For years when the Maoists were fighting the Nepal government, India did not provide any strong diplomatic or military support to the Nepal government. Once the Maoists came to power India woke up and started the machinations to remove Prachanda from power and succeeded. While this worked in short term, it has immensely hurt India's image in Nepal as it was construed as a clear meddling in internal affairs of Nepal.

India's support to LTTE in Sri Lanka is well known. It after the assassination of Rajiv Gandhi India did a u-turn (Mussharaf's u-turn). Sri Lankan's will never forget or forgive India for what LTTE has done to their country. Once China extended their hand to Sri Lanka, India suddenly woke up and is now trying to woo Sri Lanka. A total failure of our foreign policy.

Either we should go the whole way or just stop meddling.

2) Lack of political courage.

Can someone even count the number of attacks that have taken place in India in the last 10 years?
What has been India's response, what have we done? Zero, Zilch nothing.

We are still waddling around with our heads inside our ass trying to figure out what we need to do to solve this problem once and for all. Power respects power, if you don't have one or the courage to use it when it is needed you cannot get respect.
Compare China's response to Islamic terror and India's pussyfooting. No one dare question China's methods. Most of the people in our neighboring countries think of Indians as "Baniyas" literally translated a cheap profit mongering coward. And our lack of action has consolidated this view over the years. Mumbai attacks is a classic case of this pussyfooting. No amount of economic power will get you this courage. We need a more balanced approach of carrot and stick in that order.

Besides this there is a feeling of India taking the giants share of resources like river water and ee zones etc.
But crux of the matter is that this situation is of India's own making. Our humpty-dumpty way of working will lead to an eventual fall only.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Gagan » 22 Aug 2009 15:12

I don't agree that any of these nations around India really hate india as Amit suggests. Ask the average nepali about India will get you the response that they love-hate india because although it is very close economically, yet it is a bully - that bully part is probably not right. India is the only nation they deal with. Nepal is not going to get into a love-hate affair with somalia for gods sake. This 'hatred' for india does not stop people from any SAARC country from making a beeline into india for better education or for work does it, or from making money out of Indian tourists in there?

It is somewhat like the pakistanis "hatred" for Jews, its funny because the paks have never seen a jew in their lives in pakistan, but hate them to death. Take that paki out of pakistan and put him in the US, and watch him reform.

You have to accept that because India is a neighbor, there will be a love-hate relationship with the neighbors. The common man in each of these nations does not have an opinion about India. It is the leadership that does.

But the basic premise of what I say stands, nations which are developing fast are more likely to be actively engaging with India and benefiting mutually and will have a positive vibe in their relations with India. Nations that are not developing and actively engaged with india,will be sulking around in the corner and then getting aid donated to their leaders by the likes of china to be "anti-india".

Bangladesh was anti Indian in bits and peices along its history. They seperated as part of Pakistan, then India liberated them and bonhomie persisted for several years until the army takeover. Somewhere along the way Islamism arrived. Bangladesh was never really a rapidly developing nation ever. Its leadership found cause to 'hate' india, its just the way politics was conducted in that country, each party accusing the other of being pro-india, and slowly India became demonized. India casts such an overwhelming shadow on its neighbours because of its size, that merely by being there if affects politics in its neighbouring states.
Nepal, Srilanka, Bhutan, and the Maldives were never anti Indian, their people never were anti indian. There was never such politics in any of them that demonized india. Except for bhutan, the remaining three were doing quite OK economically, in Sri Lanka's case they were leading the SAARC growth rates.
AmitR wrote:Sri Lankans do not trust Indians, they are taking the aid of China to build their country and will be a key pearl in the Chinese string.
Not sure where you get this idea of Lanka India bhai bhai.
By that account, as an Indian, do we trust the people or leadership of any nation? Here on BRF there is no dearth of people who will diss Russia over the gorshkov saga, some would even suspect it of jailing Netaji in siberia. My point is that if we can even mistrust Russia, a nation that has through its actions over several decades demonstrated that it is a friend of India, then who do we trust? A similar case is that of India and the US. All through the 50s and the 60s, India and the US cooperated widely, then 62 happened and later US policy shifted to engaging china, and being pro pakistan, and India drifted away. The politics in india developed in a manner where being a "CIA agent" was the ultimate political slur and was freely used in the 70s and the 80s. Today when India is rapidly developing, and since after the 90s do we see that much anti americanism around? Is it a coincidence that ever since india's been developing rapidly, it is a more happy - less grumpy nation and one that's actively engaging all nations in the world?

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Anabhaya » 25 Aug 2009 15:41

India gifts Nepal a Vizag window to West

For improved rail connectivity, two cross-border links will be constructed with Indian help along the border.

One of them, 18km long, will be between Jogbani in Bihar and Biratnagar in Nepal. The other, a 51km link between Jayanagar in India and Bijalpura in Nepal, will involve conversion from metre to broad gauge and an extension of the route to Bardibas, Nepal


Prachanda, Koirala discuss inclusion of Maoists in govt

Nepal abhors a vacuum

Political parties have not yet been able to elect the new chairperson for the constitution drafting committee of the constituent assembly. The post has been vacant for the two months since Madhav Kumar Nepal’s election as prime minister. Baburam Bhattarai, key ideologue of the Communist Party of Nepal-Maoist (CPN-M) has already announced his candidature, while 22 other parties, part of the government coalition, insist they must have someone from their side

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Brando » 28 Aug 2009 02:42

Gagan wrote:I don't agree that any of these nations around India really hate india as Amit suggests. Ask the average nepali about India will get you the response that they love-hate india because although it is very close economically, yet it is a bully - that bully part is probably not right. India is the only nation they deal with. Nepal is not going to get into a love-hate affair with somalia for gods sake. This 'hatred' for india does not stop people from any SAARC country from making a beeline into india for better education or for work does it, or from making money out of Indian tourists in there?

This is not necessarily true. There are quite a few Nepalis and Sri Lankans etc who dont like Indians at all. Bangladeshis also dont have a very good opinion about Hindu India. I have read various Nepali forums and met quite a few Nepalis who share a dislike for India, Indians and their attitudes. In Nepal most of them see India as neighbor who has unfairly taken advantage of them and tries to control their lives for the benefit of Indians. They have the same animosity towards India as being a bully as some Indians in India have against the US. Particularly the disparity of wealth in Nepal between Indians and Nepali people has caused much bad-blood between Indians and Nepali people. Also the attitude of Indians treating Nepali people as all "Ghurkas" has quite a few of them riled up. Also their own government openly was helping Indian businesses flourish while undermining Nepali ones. All these reasons have led to rising anti-India sentiment in Nepal among the common man. Also as for Nepal not have relations with any other country, the Chinese have made impressive inroads into their markets and their dependence on India is not what it once was.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby arun » 01 Sep 2009 07:38

Allegations that Nepal’s Prince Paras is in cahoots with Pakistan based Dawood Ibrahim and the ISI to counterfeit Indian currency, surfaces:

Nepal ex-prince kingpin of fake notes racket?

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Sriman » 04 Sep 2009 21:00

Indian priests at Pashupati beaten up

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/india ... rn/512967/

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Rahul M » 05 Sep 2009 10:37


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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Suppiah » 05 Sep 2009 17:13

Interestingly the Stalinist mass murderer/rapist goon propaganda yellow daily that never fails to identify 'sangh parivar' organisations by name, whether or not they are involved, without waiting for any proof, when it comes to Maoist eye-gougers, vaguely reports about some mysterious devotees 'manhandling' the priests. It often features interviews with these criminal murderers asking very polite questions as if they were interviewing Mahatma Gandhi.

Both IE and TOIlet has of course, not hesitated to name the criminals.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Sridhar » 05 Sep 2009 22:16

Are you referring to this stalinist rag?

http://beta.thehindu.com/news/national/article15786.ece?homepage=true

On Friday, 10-12 Maoist cadres, led by Punya Prasad Pandey (ex-member of Pashupati Area Development Trust/PADT) and Ramesh Dongel (ex-member of PADT), barged into the room, where the two Indian priests were doing the ‘anushthan,’ and assaulted them.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Suppiah » 06 Sep 2009 06:44

The news update section often carries raw feeds from agencies, before the yellow team has a chance to red wash them. You have to read the main section which is from the printed copy. Todays one also blacks it out, until SM Krishna named them and even then carries it only when quoting Krishna that is in lower pages.

If you click on your link and read it again, you will notice the quoted sentence has vanished.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Sridhar » 06 Sep 2009 08:17

Indeed it has! Incredible, the lengths the editors of this newspaper will go to further their agendas.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby SSridhar » 14 Sep 2009 15:58

Engaging Nepal

There are huge problems that India has to manage vis-a-vis Nepal. The Maoists, the Chinese influence, the faction-ridden Nepali political parties, the poverty, lack of opportunities, ISI's network which reaches upto the powerful sections of the society etc. etc.

Nirupama Rao arrives in Kathmandu

Rao is scheduled to visit tomorrow the famous Pashupatinath temple in Kathmandu, where two newly-appointed Indian priests were beaten up by a group of Maoists demanding their replacement by local 'pujaris'. The incident had drawn strong condemnation from India.

She is also likely to meet leaders of various political parties, including opposition Maoist chief Prachanda.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Stan_Savljevic » 14 Sep 2009 16:28

Because no Indian paper has yet to cover this trip, posting from a shady/unreliable source
Nepal’s Foreign Minister Mrs. Sujata Koirala after completing a highly “successful six day visit” to the northern neighbor China, that brought hearts into the mouth of the Southern neighbor India, arrived home, evening September 13, 2009. To add, while FM Sujata was on a trip to China, a highly aggrieved Indian envoy to Nepal Rakesh Sood went to see Prime Minister and virtually warned him not to sign any agreement with China that may bear negative impact in the historic Nepal-India ties.

Be that as it may, Sujata told reporters at the Tribhuwan International Airport that China was very much confident that Nepali political actors were themselves capable of drafting the new constitution and bring an amicable end to the peace process on their own. A cheerful Sujata told journalists that China has promised us to increase financial support from 1 Billion rupees to 1.5 billion rupees per annum.

“On my meet with the Public Security Minister of China, Meng Jianzhu, we were assured that China will help fully facilitate the Armed Police Force and General Police force of Nepal”, she said adding, “They have invited our home minister to visit China to further discuss the matter”. “We have also signed an agreement wherein it is mentioned that the Chinese side will construct a dry port in Tatopani, Sindhupalchok district; donate garbage container vehicles and other equipments and construct three flyover bridges in Kathmandu”, she informed.

She said China was very positive towards Nepal’s demand for 77 Billion rupees (1 Billion US Dollar) as Soft loan to Nepal. The amount will be used to establish Special Economic Zone in Kavre district, upgrade western tourism city Pokhara's domestic airport to an international airport and to construct road networks across the country. “I requested the Chinese side to grant tariff free status to 497 Nepali products which will help Nepal decrease trade deficit between the two countries, to which China responded positively”, the Foreign Minister said.

Mrs. Koirala during her six day trip to China met with Chinese Deputy Prime Minister, Foreign Minister and other high ranking Chinese government officials. However, the Chinese President and Prime Minister declined her request to see them. This is loaded with meaning.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby SSridhar » 15 Sep 2009 10:49

Nepal-India for frank talks
Excerpts
While border problems that surfaced in June in Dang district wherein Nepali land was allegedly encroached upon by the Sashastra Seema Bal, has resulted in a trust deficit; India, has been seriously concerned about the circulation of fake Indian currencies and the recent assault on its two priests by Maoists in the Pashupatinath temple premises.

Ms. Rao, who is here on a two-day visit, is to visit the temple on Tuesday. She is expected to meet the priests.

Sources in the Foreign Ministry here said Ms. Rao’s visit was also aimed at doing the groundwork for the coming visit here by India’s Commerce Minister to finalise the agreement on Treaty of Trade and Agreement of Cooperation to Control Unauthorized Trade, which was initialised during Mr. Nepal’s visit to India.

A whole range of issues such as an extradition treaty, fake currency, border problems, operation of direct flights from Kathmandu to six Indian cities, the Naumure Project and others will be discussed in depth when a Home-Secretary-level meeting will be held here in November first week.


I hope that apart from Naumure, the Pancheshwar project, part of the Mahakali, will also be expedited. It is a 6000 MW hydropower project that will help India & Nepal a great deal.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Adrija » 15 Sep 2009 14:11

India's support to LTTE in Sri Lanka is well known. It after the assassination of Rajiv Gandhi India did a u-turn (Mussharaf's u-turn). Sri Lankan's will never forget or forgive India for what LTTE has done to their country. Once China extended their hand to Sri Lanka, India suddenly woke up and is now trying to woo Sri Lanka. A total failure of our foreign policy.


India's support to LTTE is well known? Are you aware of the instititionalized anti-Tamil policies the Sri Lankans followed right from the time of their independence, and which were instituted by their first prime minister SWRD Bandarnaike (incidentally, whose wife Srimavo was the world's first female PM and such a "dear friend" of India), which till the LTTE came on the scene the Tamils used to protest on constitutional grounds and fetched them diddly-squat?

Even the Rajiv- Jayawardene accord (and previously the agreements by L B Shastri) emphasized the legitimate rights of Tamils as citizens of that country, which the Sri Lankan government has even now yet to accede to

Disparaging India and her policies is all very good- everyone has freedom of speech in this country- but it may perhaps be worthwhile to let some knowledge interfere with your speech..... at least occasionally :mrgreen: . A lot of India's interventions have come about only as a last resort, and even then have been aimed at allowing citizens of the country exercise their democratic rights (Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Nepal).

Just as an aside, Indira amma's strategem of getting RAW to train and arm the LTTE is exactly what some jingoes scream we should be doing in Pakistan :twisted:

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Muppalla » 15 Sep 2009 14:30

Adrija wrote: A lot of India's interventions have come about only as a last resort, and even then have been aimed at allowing citizens of the country exercise their democratic rights (Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Nepal).


This is a true statement. I wish India behaved jingoistically from the word go in 1947 so that we would have seen all these countries similar to Sikkim today. BR strategy forum would have 10% less threads.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Adrija » 15 Sep 2009 17:41

1) Meddling in others affair without long term strategy or vision.

India has meddled in neighboring countries since a long time. Unfortunately, the policies lack a sense of direction and continuity. India needs to create policies that are consistent and long term in nature. Right now we have knee jerk policy towards everything. For years when the Maoists were fighting the Nepal government, India did not provide any strong diplomatic or military support to the Nepal government. Once the Maoists came to power India woke up and started the machinations to remove Prachanda from power and succeeded. While this worked in short term, it has immensely hurt India's image in Nepal as it was construed as a clear meddling in internal affairs of Nepal.


Au contraire, I would posit that India has an extremely consistent vision which has guided its dealings in its immediate neighbourhood. These are based on (1) a long term intent of promoting democracy, (2) being conscious of its overwhelming presence and hence tolerant of the jabs which come its way.

Let's use Nepal as an example, as you have done.

Way back in 1950s, Nehru hosted HH Maharaj Tribhuvan and got his throne back from the Rana dynasty on the condition that he introduce multi-party democracy. HH Tribhuvan got the throne back, and then basically he and his son HH Maharaj Birendra danced around, including conducting some "partyless" democracy or whatever it was called.

Rajiv's imposition of the trade blockade (in the late 80s) was precipitated by the dismissal of even that government, and was lifted on the condition conducting multi-party elections. So Koirala and his ilk came to power.

Even in the recent past, India's policy towards Nepal was aimed at bringing the Maoists into the democratic mainstream, and also ensuring adequate representations of the Madhesis. One can argue with the way/ efficiency MMS conducted the affair but at least the guiding principle was constant. So if Prachanda came to power, so be it- the truth about democracy (also proven many times in India, and which guides our approach to even internal insurgency) is that Prachanda either had to become a part of the establishment legitimately, or be cast aside........ as it happens, it turned out to be latter in this particular case.

Same approach guided us in Bangladesh. As it happens, democracy also does throw up elements hostile to India (and as the overwhelming big brother in the region, that is inevitable) as in the case of Gen Ershad and Begum Zia. Had India tried to subvert that, the feeling would have gained strength and hence worsened, so India "lived" with it till things got better. They will also get worse, that is an unavoidable cycle :((

Certainly we can do this better, and one clear area in my mind is to articulate the red lines a bit better to the younger siblings in the neighbourhood. The BSF incident was clearly one such for me at least :(

One red line we HAVE made clear is the lack of tolerance of letting in other parties. That of course doesn't work with Pakistan, nothing does, but that is because China, KSA and Unkil are much more powerful than us..........

But these are our neighbours, and we cannot run away from them nor wish them away. Ongoing friction is inevitable, but it would be wonderful if the ruling elites in these countries learn to work with us, and we also work with more sensitivity at times

Sorry for the long post, the pot shots just got to me

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby SSridhar » 16 Sep 2009 09:49

Security Concerns raised with Nepal: Ms. Nirupama Rao
“I reiterated India’s security concerns and the use of Nepalese territory for anti-India activities,” she said. “The Nepalese side unequivocally reiterated its commitment that such activities will not be allowed.”

The Home Secretaries of both countries will hold talks here on November 6 and 7 to address all “bilateral security” issues.

Ms. Rao, who also met Home Minister Bhim Rawal, said she was assured by the Nepal government that cases of counterfeit currency would be investigated.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Stan_Savljevic » 16 Sep 2009 15:09

Read that Prachanda wanted to avoid Ms. Rao and hence took off to Hong Kong, where he was supposed to have been feted by the CCP elites. He claims to have gone there for discussion with Nepali Maoists. Unfortunately, there is a small splinter group of Nepali expats in HK, with whom he could have conducted a meeting. Weird logic, in any case. This is NOT the first time Prachanda was off to HK. The last time when he infamously made a trip to HK, there was violence aplenty between the Madhesis and YCL.

YCL seems to have become a bugbear in the Nepali politics. YCL is supposed to be a student organization with Maoist credentials, but seems like YCL is the conduit for gun-running since many Maoists' arms have been held under lock (two keys, one with UN and another with the Maoists). A new general has taken over the army, from the Gurung caste, Chattra Man Singh Gurung. Some claims that he would be more sympathetic to the Maoists joining the regular army. The Maoists have been insistent on being equals to the Nepali army and as long as Rookmangal Katwad was around, that was parried aside. Nepal indeed has a big problem in that their army is NOT equally representative in any sense. Many of the feeder castes to the Maoists actually have close to zero representation in the Nepali army, with it being dominated by three-four castes.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Stan_Savljevic » 19 Sep 2009 09:03

A fortnight after the Chinese Embassy in Kathmandu and the representatives of Ministry of Education signed a Memorandum of Understanding (MoU) on scholarship scheme, the Indian Ambassador to Nepal Rakesh Sood also declared September 18, 2009, that India too will gradually increase the number of students studying in India under the Indian government scholarship grant program.

Fresh from HK after meeting the CCP honchos, we have:
The Unified Maoists’ party Chief Pushpa Kamal Dahal alias Prachanda has in a threat loaded statement made September 18, 2009 has asked the ruling coalition partners to swiftly hand over power to the Maoists’ Party. “We have had enough of the Madhav Kumar Nepal led government, if he does not quit power after the end of Dashain-Tihar Festivals, we will be forced to declare another fierce uprising, which will be another Peoples’ Revolt. Unless we ensure and bag victory, our revolt will continue ad infinitum,” he said adding, “This time the reactionaries will be obliterated by the Maoists from the country’s political scene.”

“I warn you, if you think that you will continue to be in the power taking repressive measures, you will have fate akin to what King Gyanendra have had”, Prachanda added. “If you still have love for the motherland and respect to Nepali Nationalism, you, the defeated and peoples’ rejected ministers should resign immediately”, he suggested the defeated ones.

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Re: Nepal News and discussion

Postby Stan_Savljevic » 21 Sep 2009 11:12

Some realignment of the multi-party coalition headed by Madhav Kumar Nepal, who is not super-popular btw, is being predicted. Fresh from his HK trip, Prachanda has been seen dabbling alliances and coaxing people to realign. UML leader Khanal has been tip-toeing to the chinese and apparently also visited Nepal. Regarding GP Koirala, most folks say all that he wants is to see Sujata Koirala, the current FM as DPM. The power of the chinese inside Nepal is over-stated and India still holds many cards in this game. The next three to four months is going to either witness a major tumult inside Nepal, esp with the deadline for the constitutional authority arriving very soon, or the chinese influence is going to be a storm in a teacup and fall by the wayside as has been the case for many years. Either way, no point sitting and watching this game. Time to take out the maoists softly, or hard if necessary. I am sure the Indian babus are watching this with more keener eyes than it seems like.
A day after Nepal’s Prime Minister Madhav Kumar Nepal left for New York to address the 64th General Assembly of the United Nations, the Unified Maoists’ Party chief Pushpa Kamal Dahal, the Nepali Congress President Girija Prasad Koirala and the United Marxist Leninists’ Chairman Jhala Nath Khanal are all set to hold a meeting to discuss possible ways to end the current political dispute.

From saag, http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/%5Cnot ... te542.html
It looked that the “big three”, the Maoists, the Nepali Congress and the UML would find some common ground when they met on 16th September to end the protracted deadlock and pave the way for taking the on going peace process to its logical end. The issue mainly was- how to deal with the alleged “unconstitutional move of the President over the sacking of the then Army Chief” and at the same time how to keep the President out of the political controversy that has unnecessarily been created.

One suggestion that was almost agreed to was for the Maoists to withdraw their unilateral move for discussion ( Prastav) presented to the House on May 20 and instead a “joint sankalpa prastav” of the three parties could be discussed in the house and a resolution passed.

But Prachanda fresh from his tour of Hongkong of five days after meeting his supporters, besides the Chinese leaders threw cold water on the proposal. He declared at the airport itself on 17th September that his party is not ready to budge an inch until its demand of the President’s unconstitutional move is rectified. He added that this issue must first be addressed even if it involves an amendment to the Constitution.

The author suggests that we should let the oiseaules stew in the shit they manufactured, but I have a different take.
But more surprising is that while India is being blamed for everything going badly in Nepal, yet many expect India to play a pro active role to engineer a consensus as it had done way back in 2005. To me it makes good sense for India not to get involved again. The suggestion that another 12 point agreement be re-engineered should not be countenanced and instead let the Maoists who were responsible for creating the current crisis, find a way out and convince other political parties for a “national unity government” led them not by coercion but by persuasion.


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