Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby disha » 11 Jun 2020 01:22

RonyJ, if one thinks deeply based on the short video you posted:

1. Nepal (or rather its constituent assembly) looks like an idiot and a lap dog of the Chinese and it also shows Nepalese (or rather its constituent assembly's) perfidy.

2. People who put out that video are bunch of morons. They attribute Tibet to China! There are nuances and the video misses it by the proverbial mile.

3. Further, for the narrator, India is bad and evil. Small nuances on words matter on such sensitive topics. Of course, Indian journalism itself leaves much to be desired.

Ricky'ji, I am glad that you have posted a long winding perspective of a technocrat from Nepal.

My point is, even in their long winding gas bagging, they are *not* allowed to throw away thousands of years of civilizational relations over a few lice laden rice from Cheen. It is this junking of our cultural and civilizational history that is frustrating me. I also lament and blame the Indian idiots who are throwing away our cultural moorings and our history.

The rest of the details may be important and nuanced but also leads to information overload for people like me. If the nuances matter, then unilaterally changing the map (cartographic aggression) to limpodurah is *not* what a nation will do. It can be peacefully discussed over a cup of chai. India and Nepal are not going anywhere and neither they are each other enemies! (At least until now with the extent of perfidy shown by the idiots of the Nepalese constituent assembly)

The point of the issue is simple for me. What are the headwaters of the Mahakali river? It is the KalaPani springs. Or is it? Suddenly coming back and saying that it originates from limpudurah which is firmly in Indian territory is aggression. It is meant to create a pain point for India and we know who is behind that. If Nepal (or its constituent assembly) wants to be the idiots and Chinese stooge well they can be but they will suffer the consequences.

And I think my take here is binary, any Nepali or Indian taking the side of Nepal in this is a Cheeni Stooge. At least that needs to be candidly pointed out.

Edited: For better grammar and perspective.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Prem » 11 Jun 2020 02:01

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-ne ... g0dBJ.html
In Nepal’s map tactics, a reflection of China’s growing footprint in Kathmandu

As Nepal’s parliament took the first step on Tuesday to formalise the country’s new political map that has set up a row with India, foreign minister Pradeep Gyawali made another request to New Delhi for dialogue.Gyawali told news agency AP that Kathmandu wanted to sit across the table with India for formal negotiations so that the two countries “with a very unique type of partnership” could develop a more inspiring relationship.New Delhi hasn’t responded to requests for foreign secretary-level talks made after Prime Minister KP Sharma Oli cabinet hurriedly passed a new political map that counts Indian territories of Kalapani, Lipulekh and Limpiyadhura as its own.Senior government officials told Hindustan Times that Kathmandu shouldn’t expect any dialogue on the three Indian territories either.Nepal, and PM Oli have a track record of trying to steer the India-China rivalry to his advantage. But increasingly, analysts in Kathmandu concede that China’s influence over Kathmandu was rising rapidly.According to the latest available data, China has again surpassed India as top investor in Nepal in the first quarter of 2019-20 with a total pledge of $ 88 million FDI representing 93 per cent of total committed FDI of $95 million. Britain came next with $ 1.85 million followed by India’s $ 1.76 million.Nepal is also getting a second Chinese cement plant being set up with $ 140 million investment; the first was Hongshi Cement.Nepal has also been nudging Beijing to build projects worth an estimated $ 3 billion via a grant, not the soft loan that China has agreed to. If Nepal does eventually sign off on the soft loan, it would dwarf other Chinese loans including the ones extended to build Pokhara international airport and the Trishuli 3A hydropower project.
The Chinese influence was on display earlier this year also when its mission in Kathmandu rebuked the Nepal media on February 19, and accused The Kathmandu Post editor of “ulterior motives” because the newspaper had published an article critical of China’s handling of the coronavirus virus. The public reprimand, ironically, coincided with Democracy Day of Nepal. But there were no protests from the Oli government who is seen to pursue a “nationalist” agenda.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KJo » 11 Jun 2020 02:56

My question is why couldn't we do what China managed to do in Nepal? We have a lot lot more in common with the Nepalese. Yet China is the benefactor and India is the big bad enemy. We need to do some introspection here.

The only way that I see is to encourage a pro-Hindutva party like the BJP. I am sure there is a sizable number of Nepalese who haven't sold their souls.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby kit » 11 Jun 2020 03:39

KJo wrote:My question is why couldn't we do what China managed to do in Nepal? We have a lot lot more in common with the Nepalese. Yet China is the benefactor and India is the big bad enemy. We need to do some introspection here.

The only way that I see is to encourage a pro-Hindutva party like the BJP. I am sure there is a sizable number of Nepalese who haven't sold their souls.


India has been helping Nepal for decades , the Chinese are the new people in town and the Maoists seem its fit to cuddle up to them to retain power. Actually Nepal is digging it's own ditch , how deep will it go...GOI is just watching the tamasha.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 05:33

I think we should take some if the blame too. I agree Nepal are digging their own grave but we could've stopped them from doing so. You don't let your neighbor run a meth lab when you have children in your own house. They were firmly in our influence zone and we let them slip away either out of sheer incompetence or sheer stupidity or both.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KL Dubey » 11 Jun 2020 06:21

m_saini wrote:I think we should take some if the blame too. I agree Nepal are digging their own grave but we could've stopped them from doing so. You don't let your neighbor run a meth lab when you have children in your own house. They were firmly in our influence zone and we let them slip away either out of sheer incompetence or sheer stupidity or both.


I'm sure there is a lot more to the depth of Indian influence in Nepal than info gleaned from a few newspaper reports and some recent dramas by the Nepalis. Tomorrow if India shuts down all connections and help to Nepal, they are well and truly screwed. China is behind a 9 km high barrier wall and can't do a whole lot except low-level mischief (tactical brilliance).

If things get really bad, there is nothing preventing us from annexing Nepal. Its only significant usable natural resource is water (particularly for hydroelectric power). At the moment there is little market for exporting hydropower, and whatever little can be exported will go to India using Indian-built projects.

Nepal is not a viable country and will always be an Indian dependency. Its only real road to prosperity is as an Indian state. "If you want equal/fair treatment, become part of India." Sooner or later someone in the India goremint needs to tell it as it is.

Time to change the dialogue on Nepal to "being part of India" versus "negotiations between friendly neighbors". Similar to changing the Kashmir dialogue to "taking back PoK". All negotiations and discussions with India henceforth should have the topic of "full economic and political integration".

The current status bar is "70% economically integrated and 1% politically integrated" (according to the Nepalis, we already have Kalapani :lol: )

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby sudarshan » 11 Jun 2020 06:30

KL Dubey wrote:Tomorrow if India shuts down all connections and help to Nepal, they are well and truly screwed. China is behind a 9 km high barrier wall and can't do a whole lot except low-level mischief (tactical brilliance).


Cheen reportedly building tunnels under Himalayas, incl. Sagarmatha (Everest)?

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KL Dubey » 11 Jun 2020 06:37

^^Source ?

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 06:39

Yes, if we shut down all connections they are screwed. But we can't ever do that, can we? A lot of lives will be affected and possibly destroyed by such an action and everyone from our loony media to the champions of freedom US would pressure us to eventually lift those. And then there is more bad blood between us. Powerful nations can't beat up on weaker nations without looking like a bully. There are subtler ways of exercising that influence and we seem incapable of doing that. For example we could use the threat of those shut downs and effect a political change from commies to someone sensible but we seem to think that's beneath us.

There's a lot of things preventing us from annexing Nepal, economic sanctions for one. Sure we can militarily annex them any day but that doesn't mean we can without paying a huge price in another domain. Someone posted an article about how Nepal offered to merge with us after independence but our favorite dynasty prevented that out of the generosity of their hearts. Just another one of the many time bombs they've left behind.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby sudarshan » 11 Jun 2020 06:45

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/ ... ia-reports

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chin ... -ljrb69vnt

Two reports above, saying "tunnel under consideration." And one saying "nice try," below.

no-china-isnt-going-to-build-a-tunnel-under-everest

Now that I think about it, the "nice try" article makes more sense. I had naively assumed that the tunnel would be at sea level, of course it isn't going to be, the land on both sides is already way above sea level, working at that height is a nightmare.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby vimal » 11 Jun 2020 07:38

Anyone with half a brain-cell in Nepal would know that this move is suicidal for Nepal. The thing to dwell on is not how to punish Nepal, rather,

- How China is able to control governments and make them bend to their will and even make them pass such legislations.
- Why India's foreign and intelligence services cannot prevent such coups and come off as total amateurs.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KL Dubey » 11 Jun 2020 08:00

m_saini wrote:Yes, if we shut down all connections they are screwed. But we can't ever do that, can we?


We can, and we have done trials of that in the past. In fact, the blockade done by Modi Sarkar was extremely effective.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Nepal_blockade

A lot of lives will be affected and possibly destroyed by such an action and everyone from our loony media to the champions of freedom US would pressure us to eventually lift those. And then there is more bad blood between us. Powerful nations can't beat up on weaker nations without looking like a bully.


That's what people said about Art 370 and Sikkim. And they will keep saying that after PoK, Nepal, etc.

There are subtler ways of exercising that influence and we seem incapable of doing that.


We have been doing that over the years. The end goal of the "subtlety" is to one day take the gloves off and achieve the goal of integration. These guys are not some foreign country, they are part of Bharat. That time is drawing closer.

For example we could use the threat of those shut downs and effect a political change from commies to someone sensible but we seem to think that's beneath us.


Seems like you are 25 years late to the party. We've been there and done that. It hasn't worked.

There's a lot of things preventing us from annexing Nepal, economic sanctions for one. Sure we can militarily annex them any day but that doesn't mean we can without paying a huge price in another domain. Someone posted an article about how Nepal offered to merge with us after independence but our favorite dynasty prevented that out of the generosity of their hearts. Just another one of the many time bombs they've left behind.


I don't know how serious these offers were and who offered. It's irrelevant now. In the future, the simple truth is that Nepal is not viable economically or politically as a sovereign country without huge Indian inputs. It will remain a basket case and dependency, so might as well make it a state with equal rights, representations, and no Commies.

Sanctions etc seem laughable. A democratic country bringing under its fold an area ravaged by authoritarian rule (Ranas, Commies) will not bring anything except noises here and there for a few months before things go back to normal. It will take a few years to integrate some of the more recalcitrant Nepalis, but proper "divide and rule" policies including demarcation of smaller provinces will do the trick. The key point is they are not foreigners, they just need some tough love.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby chanakyaa » 11 Jun 2020 08:00

Looks like these knuckleheads are prepared to go all into ICJ to get few mountains. If you walk through the entire area on Google Earth, noting comes up as striking for Nepal to pick up a fight.

There is precedent to settling Kalapani (Nepali View)

It has been more than 70 years since the signing of India - Nepal Treaty of Peace and Friendship (1950). If you are 30-40 year old in the Nepal, you don't have any perspective or appreciation for how beneficial partnering with India has been. On a side note, with all the tourism coming to a standstill (esp. western tourism) due to coronavirus, I'm sure all the dollars and euros have stopped going to politician's coffers. Wonder if that is causing some tactical burnol pain, which Hans may be offering to fill the gap.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KL Dubey » 11 Jun 2020 08:08

^^I for one hope the Chinese will be foolish enough to jump into the picture, because that will only accelerate integration by India. The justification is simple, unlike Banditji's Tibetan follies we are not going to wait for Nepal to fall. Proper management of the narrative is all that is needed. Just look at the picture today: the most backward country in south Asia, run by head-in-ass Commies, and in danger of being overrun by pandas, bats, and pangolins. If we manage the narrative correctly, who do you think the West will be supporting ?

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KL Dubey » 11 Jun 2020 08:15

sudarshan wrote:Now that I think about it, the "nice try" article makes more sense. I had naively assumed that the tunnel would be at sea level, of course it isn't going to be, the land on both sides is already way above sea level, working at that height is a nightmare.


Frankly this tunnel under Everest and such stuff sounds like just BS to me.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 08:36

KL Dubey wrote:The key point is they are not foreigners, they just need some tough love.

This 100%. Just want us to get this mess under control with whatever means available.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby kit » 11 Jun 2020 12:30

vimal wrote:Anyone with half a brain-cell in Nepal would know that this move is suicidal for Nepal. The thing to dwell on is not how to punish Nepal, rather,

- How China is able to control governments and make them bend to their will and even make them pass such legislations.
- Why India's foreign and intelligence services cannot prevent such coups and come off as total amateurs.



China grants loans at high interest rates, buys the politicians and bureaucrats to follow it through.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Rsatchi » 11 Jun 2020 12:51

KL Dubey wrote:^^I for one hope the Chinese will be foolish enough to jump into the picture, because that will only accelerate integration by India. The justification is simple, unlike Banditji's Tibetan follies we are not going to wait for Nepal to fall. Proper management of the narrative is all that is needed. Just look at the picture today: the most backward country in south Asia, run by head-in-ass Commies, and in danger of being overrun by pandas, bats, and pangolins. If we manage the narrative correctly, who do you think the West will be supporting ?

Dubeyji
Not Just Banditji but the blame should fall on all our founding fathers, don't you think??
I mean there was a precedent of what 'New States' did to secure their borders:
1. USA buying Alaksa, Louisiana Territory and conquering Texas.
2. USSR consolidation in Central Asia
3. Chinese repeating the same in Tibet.
Imagine if we have secured: Nepal, Bhutan and supported Tibet in rebuffing Chini intrusion, and post '71 just assimilated Beedis as many were already in India. We would have had control of both sides of the Himalaya and the water-head

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 13:12

^ I think the major difference is that we didn't exactly win our independence. British got pummeled in ww2 and didn't have the stomach to deal with gandhi and his starve-unto-death strikes (for what they were worth), so they just gave it to us. Compare that to US who fought bloody battles against the british; chinese who fought the civil war under mao etc and there is no competition. The leaders they got out of those struggles, we never did. So no foresight, no strategic understanding etc in our leaders, just naive righteous delusions.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby vimal » 11 Jun 2020 13:28

m_saini, it would help to do a bit more research, maybe read up on some of the past threads before posting. Lurking is a good way to learn rather than getting your behind whooped sooner than later by making such inane posts.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 14:10

(duplicate)
Last edited by m_saini on 11 Jun 2020 14:12, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 14:11

Sir, you don't really believe that satyagraha and dandi march won us our freedom, right? Or that people like nehru and co had an inkling of strategic thought in them?
Besides, I'd prefer if you share your intricate knowledge on the subject so everyone can learn rather than making childish remarks on inane posts or getting my behind whooped.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby amar_p » 11 Jun 2020 15:51

m_saini, OT posts that fret & speculate over the past add nothing to the present or future dynamics with Nepal. Please take your stuff elsewhere.

Coming back to the topic, the raise of a communist party to power in Nepal would have already raised some antennas in MEA and RAW. There have been reports that Tabhleegi Jamaat congregations were organised first in Nepal. Nepal govt initially prohibited them to congregate and later let them happen. Many TJ foreign attendees transited from Nepal to India thanks to the porus borders earlier this year and attended the gatherings in Delhi, which got disbanded after Covid infections broke out. This would have been a second alert. Then some border control disputes and allegations back and forth. Then Indian Govt banned white labeled Palm Oil exports from Nepal to India which circumvented import regulations. And now this borders and maps dispute has taken the friction to an entirely different level. So things have been degrading between India and Nepal for some months now.

Nepal is not relevant to China's B&R initiative given its Himalayan border to the north and nearly all its borders to west, south and east are with India. They have nothing strategic to gain from siding with China, except for falling for Chinese loans and debt traps. Their economy is too small to be of any relevance to China's export driven economy. India has all sorts of choke points that Nepal must be all too aware of.

I feel beyond a dumb ideological sucking up to China for questionable short term gains, Nepal has nothing much to gain from its current posturing. Just redrawing maps will not change ground realities. Our two populations have so much shared cultural heritage and history of peaceful coexistence that should give us confidence that we can bring Nepal to see reason. If India gets into a "we will show them their place" attitude and antagonises the misguided Nepalese leadership further, we will be playing into China's hands. Imagine their delight if Nepal becomes a second Pakistanish neighbour needling India day in day out !

My view would be that we should avoid jingoism and let MEA manage the situation using diplomatic channels and bring them around. Like patient parents would handle a truant teenager. And monitor future developments in Nepal very carefully and step up our engagement. Which of course doesn't mean accepting their map claims.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Rony » 11 Jun 2020 22:56

Are these true ?

When Rajiv Gandhi visited Nepal,Sonia Gandhi was not allowed into Pashupatinath Temple because she is Xtian. Even the King could not help. Rajiv imposed a blockade on Nepal to avenge this ‘slight’. This was the point when Nepal began to turn against India. @Swamy39
on @NewsX

@Swamy39 further said,which is known to many,that the Ranas wanted to merge Nepal into India. Nehru refused.
Subject to correction,the Khanate of Kalat (South-Western part of the Pakistani province of Balochistan) wanted to join India. Nehru refused.


https://twitter.com/tathagata2/status/1 ... 29184?s=20

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 11 Jun 2020 23:39

amar_p, I'd argue it's that same naive attitude of treating them like a "truant teenager" that got us into this mess. We're not their parents and the commies in power there are not some misguided youth in need of direction.
Let's get off our self-righteous pompous butts and treat them like a separate independent nation that they are and not some teenager who thinks mommy didn't love them enough.
Last edited by m_saini on 11 Jun 2020 23:56, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby greatde » 11 Jun 2020 23:40

If cultural connections was key to alliances, then India/Pak should have gotten along. Alliances work on give/take principle and we have possibly taken Nepal for granted, and it is seen by some arrogant posts here. Our eastern neighbor has first mover advantage, and has given investment there. Nepal thinks of our relationship as unfair or unbalanced, and now it has to be stopped from going towards hatred/hostility.
Last edited by greatde on 12 Jun 2020 00:27, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KJo » 11 Jun 2020 23:53

KL Dubey wrote:
We can, and we have done trials of that in the past. In fact, the blockade done by Modi Sarkar was extremely effective.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Nepal_blockade


I am not sure about how effective it was. Could be tactically brilliant, strategically foolish. Time will tell.

I was in an Uber last year in Toronto and the driver was Nepali. I usually like to ask them where they are from and converse, and when he found out that I was Indian he brought this up. He said the blockade cause them a lot of hardships and made them realize that they were too dependent on India for everything. So they had to look to other means and so are talking to China. And that India cannot "control" them.
In these situations I just listen rather than argue because there's more to be gained by letting people speak their minds. So if this guy is a representative sample of the Nepali population, then India-Nepal relations are not on a good footing.

But the point I made earlier is that we need to introspect brutally on why after all the help India has given Nepal forever, India is still "hated". Why doesn't China meet the same fate? Are we seen as pushovers who can be blackmailed? Telling ourselves that Nepal is our protectorate is useless if we give them freebies and they work against our interests. I'd rather take an openly "bad relations" situation like it is with Pakistan because we are open about who the enemy is. Now is Nepal our enemy or friend? Can't be both.

I think we are too caught up in right and wrong. We like to take a higher moral ground on everything. This has cost us dearly in the past, but we still don't learn. We need to learn to be more "chankian". Just talking about how powerful we are when we can't get piddly Nepal in our influence shows how powerful we really are.

@m_saini, good posts. I agree with you, they are not our bacchas. Treat them as any independent nation. Let them work with China and that's their own problem but if it is a threat to us, we should react as needed. We should also stop this free entry nonsense. If the Nepalis want to throw away 5000 years of common cultural and tradition, then they are free to and we don't need to care about it either.

Modi's first foreign trip was to Nepal in 2014 and I thought things would turn but it seems like it's only gotten worse. Our Nepal policy is a disaster right now and no one seems to know what the plan is.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 12 Jun 2020 02:06

KJo wrote:
I think we are too caught up in right and wrong. We like to take a higher moral ground on everything. This has cost us dearly in the past, but we still don't learn. We need to learn to be more "chankian". Just talking about how powerful we are when we can't get piddly Nepal in our influence shows how powerful we really are.


This, a 100%.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby disha » 12 Jun 2020 04:14

KJo wrote:Modi's first foreign trip was to Nepal in 2014 and I thought things would turn but it seems like it's only gotten worse. Our Nepal policy is a disaster right now and no one seems to know what the plan is.


KJo, check out the panic in Indian polity when Stalin's daughter decided to defect. And think what a non-career US Ambassador to India could achieve.

Point is, we need to ensure that the MEA Babus incl. the "high commissioners" have skin in the game for ensuring that India's strategic interests are fulfilled. For several of the babooze it is a sinecure.

Going forward, India has to silently work on trifurcation of Nepal. Nepal has outlived its independent role and cannot be any more independent. It can become a protectorate of India or a protected-state like Bhutan. Basically a vassal state with a local police force.

The same goes for Bangladesh and Sri Lanka. And Balochistan and Sindh.

However, even outlining such vision is considered extremely radical in MEA. If they are above to have the vision, they can work a road map and a plan out.

Rambling further:

If India is in the UN security council, it helps. Or it can take over from fUK. For that fUK really needs to be broken up with the administration passing to India.

fUK needs to become a vassal state of India as well. EIC needs to be truly revived and put in place in fUK. Company Bahadur's flag needs to fly in fUK. Bold policies need to be pursued.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Prem » 12 Jun 2020 05:45


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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby ParGha » 12 Jun 2020 06:50

m_saini, KJo -- Over 50,000 Nepalis serve in the Indian Army, Assam Rifles and SFF loyally and bravely, so the relationship between India and Nepal cannot be compared to the usual relationship between independent and sovereign nations. Worsening of relationships will not only have implications for Indo-Nepalese security, but also internal and external security implications.

One must avoid hamfisted policies like embargoes where possible, and attack the true source of troubles.

Even with the recent souring of relations, I believe that given a plebiscite to join the Indian Union as an equal state, the vast majority of Nepalis will happily vote to join the Union. But that takes Sardar Patel-like humility, vision and courage.

Edit: removed blue-on-blue.
Last edited by ParGha on 12 Jun 2020 16:28, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby m_saini » 12 Jun 2020 08:54

ParGha sir, if you read my above replies, I'm specifically against embargoes.

Besides, Arthashastra isn't about advancing dharma, It's just the "science of politics." Infact, Kautilya wanted religion to be secondary to the state. Kautilya actually considered religion to be an obstacle to the royal power that must be overcome. Kautilya wrote, "Hindrances to gain are: passion, anger, nervousness, pity, shyness, ignobleness, haughtiness, a sympathetic nature, regard for the other world, piousness" Kautilya did not want religious power, religious practice, or religious concern to compete with the state for power and authority and did not want a religious ethic to interfere with military greatness. He only liked religion when he could make it useful to the state. It isn't about using "artha" to advance "dharma", it's the other way around. He recommended "that no means were on the far side scope of a ruler to expand his territory or obtain power as well as the unscrupulous ethics of permitting torture, trickery, deceit, and spying as legitimate suggests, to realize territory, wealth and power."


And let's not kid ourselves, they are not happily going to join the union. This line of thinking is actually the exact reason why they won't. Also nobody is an equal citizen in India practically.

Edited: Unnecessary noise. blue on blue.
Last edited by m_saini on 12 Jun 2020 21:56, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Nihat » 12 Jun 2020 13:55

Bihar: One dead, two injured in firing in Sitamarhi near India-Nepal border, confirms Sashastra Seema Bal IG of Bihar sector. Locals allege it was caused due to firing from Nepal side.


Not sure what to make of this and the reasons behind it but it's certainly unprecedented as far as memory serves. The communist government in Nepal is a real and present danger to India and should be dealt with accordingly. It hardly represents the sentiment and brotherhood between citizens of the countries though

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby mody » 12 Jun 2020 16:03

Earlier the Nepalese army was considered to be pro-India. Has that changed and have the commies managed to purge all the pro-India elements from the army and replaced them with commie-Maoists?

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby deejay » 12 Jun 2020 16:26

mody wrote:Earlier the Nepalese army was considered to be pro-India. Has that changed and have the commies managed to purge all the pro-India elements from the army and replaced them with commie-Maoists?


Kindly wait for some time. More news on this will get us some clarity.

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby fanne » 12 Jun 2020 16:40

Please don’t be Ajay Shukla on br wait for more news

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby Gyan » 12 Jun 2020 17:34

India should remain Calm. Oli is trying to instigate Nepalese population against India. Remain Calm and Bring Back Hindu Monarchy (backed by Nepalese military). Make Chinese Communists pay 10,000 times for killing Indians at an appropriate time. No need to Rush but neither can it go unanswered

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby uddu » 12 Jun 2020 17:54

Gyan wrote:India should remain Calm. Oli is trying to instigate Nepalese population against India. Remain Calm and Bring Back Hindu Monarchy (backed by Nepalese military). Make Chinese Communists pay 10,000 times for killing Indians at an appropriate time. No need to Rush but neither can it go unanswered


Remaining calm and at the same time, going all out attack against the communist party of Nepal and also their leaders. We must expose them for acting on behalf of the Chinese Communist regime. We must also be very positive statement on the people to people ties and how it will be kept good. The CCP wants to provoke a response from India towards Nepal and then intervene on their behalf and grab Nepal seems to be the idea. The Nepalese communists are doing CCP's bidding. Also the Chinese grabbing Nepalese land must be prime news on all channels and how the communist regime is silently allowing the same. https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 775_1.html

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby eklavya » 12 Jun 2020 18:07

As Nepal paints itself into a corner on Kalapani issue, India must tread carefully

Three, China and Nepal reached a border agreement in 1961. Article 1 in the agreement describes the western extremity of the China-Nepal border and this conforms to the alignment claimed by India. The Chinese-Nepalese border starts from the point where the watershed between the Kali River and the Tinker River meets the watershed between the tributaries of the Mapchu(Karnali) River on the one hand and the Tinker River on the other, thence it runs south-eastward along the watershed.

One should note the word “starts” which is important in view of what follows. In subsequent demarcation, Pillar No 1, which marks this starting point at the western extremity, is located at Tinker Pass, well east of Lipulekh Pass. This cannot be refuted as this is in the formal documents. Buddhi Narayan Shrestha, who has been responsible for putting out justification for the new claims against India, is unable to deny it either. But he now says that the trijunction at this end has not been determined and that notionally it would be pillar number zero on the boundary! This is the first time one has heard of the concept of a “number zero border pillar”! This is ex post facto justification and the dishonesty behind it is glaring. A Nepali diplomat has repeated this same specious argument,

“Given the situation in 1961, Nepal and China fixed pillar No 1 at Tinker Pass with the understanding that pillar number zero (trijunction of Nepal, India and China) would be fixed later.” He has not adduced any evidence that this indeed was the “understanding” reached with China in 1961.


Very important and informative article, with all the key facts and figures. Turns out that the Nepali government officials have four fingers on each hand: 0, 1, 2, 3, 4. :)

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Re: Nepal and Bhutan News and discussion

Postby KJo » 12 Jun 2020 23:16

Being calm is well and good (and something we should be at all times), but I am concerned that we may not have a plan or a long term vision. Are we planning to split up Nepal? Are we supporting/funding a pri India Hindutva party? Are we planning on strong-arming and threatening Nepal to behave? I hope the GoI has a plan even if it is not publicized.

We cannot allow Nepal to leech off us while behaving like someone with a short-man syndrome (the bravado). Pakis have a superiority complex because they think the "invaded and conquered the Hindus and ruled them for 1000 years". Now even Nepalis have a superiority complex. Time to cut them down to size.


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