Tibet watch

[vsunder]

This Book document how the US armed the Tibetans and then pulled the rug from under them. JLN's ambivalence to the whole thing and much more.

Orphans of the Cold War

[Avinash R]

UK calls Dalai Lama to talk on human rights
Tuesday , May 13, 2008 at 04:07:05

Dharamsala, May 13: Tibetan spiritual leader the Dalai Lama will address the Foreign Affairs Committee of the British Parliament on May 22 on human rights issues including those in China.

The Tibetan leader has agreed to a request in this regard by the Foreign Affairs Committee, his office said in Dharamsala on Tuesday.

The meeting with the British Parliamentary committee will take place in Boothroyd room, portcullis house, the office of the Dalai Lama said.

The UK Foreign Affairs Committee is scrutinising the foreign and commonwealth office human rights annual report focussing on issues and countries where human rights are an area of concern.

"Given the particular interest in china's human rights record in 2008, the committee has requested the Dalai Lama to speak on a range of human rights issues when he visits UK in May and the noble laureate has agreed to this request," his office quoting the UK's committee said.

The Dalai Lama will meet UK Prime Minister Gordon Brown on May 23, the sources said.

The Dalai Lama's office said, "Prime Minister Gordon Brown will meet the Tibetan leader in his capacity as a spiritual leader but no doubt it would be an opportunity to discuss recent situation in Tibet."

During his nine-day tour of UK, the Dalai Lama will deliver a series of public talks and confer teachings, they said.

[shyamd]

Apparently it was intelligence officers from the political division who negotiated with the Tibetan govt in exile.

[sanjaychoudhry]

How Big was Tibet Really? What was Really lost?

Link

[quote]Tibet’s misfortune today is because of Indian inaction and more specifically because of JAWAHAR LAL NEHRU. The quintessential idiot that he was he refused to see the dangers to India from a hostile, imperialistic foreign power occupying a benign, friendly neighbour. Any other country in India’s place would have moved Heaven and Earth to maintain that buffer, even Pakistan did so with respect to Afghanistan when it was invaded by the USSR but not peaceful, gandhian(sic!) India.

Jawaharlal Nehru is truly a “world leaderâ€

[Rye]

Can we not get into the whole if-my-aunt-was-tall-strong-and-handsome scenarios about the past. We had one leader in those times, for better or worse, and it was JLN. Time to get used to that notion and work with the present.

[nkumar]

Rye, you are well versed in Indian history and the blunders committed by JLN but there are many others who don't know anything about it except the usual greatness of JLN, Gandhi and others. There are many including in my own family. During the recent focus on Tibet, many of my friends were clueless how we lost Tibet to China. I have guided some of my friends to read Tibet thread and they lurk here from time to time. This kind of info helps newbies and many lurkers. You have the easy option of ignoring such news for you are already well versed in such matters, let other ignorant folks see the light.

[vsudhir]

nkumar is right.

The importance of countering propaganda and faslsehoods cannot be underestimated.

Establishment memory may or maynot be long. We cannot afford to have Dilli forget the lessons of history (lest it repeat itself). Why hasn't Delhi opened the govt archives to historians and academics? Why are the offical records of the minutiae of the 1947-50 and the 1962, '65 and '71 wars still classified under OSA?

Maybe it has something to do with one fmly wanting to prtect the burnished public image of its founder? Maybe, you think?

[Karan Dixit]

Dalai Lama Demands 'Genuine Autonomy' For Tibet


link

[Philip]

EXcerpt from the earthquake news .

"Anger, too, is growing about the poor quality of buildings. In Mianzhu, an apartment block collapsed on itself. The flats had been built using contributions from a local work unit, a group of workers organised by the Communist Party at a factory or office. Residents searching for survivors said it was because corrupt officials had demanded so much in kickbacks that the building fell. The neighbouring buildings had not collapsed, including one which housed cadres from the Communist Party. "Show me the structural steel in that building," said one woman, whose mother is missing in the rubble. "It all went into some official's pocket," she spat."

The unpopularity of the regime is growing.It also puts the PRC on a temporary backfoot with the Tibetan unrest.Time to take advantage of the situ.Once the Olympics are over,we will see flames coming out of the mouth of the dragon.

[sanjaychoudhry]

Can we not get into the whole if-my-aunt-was-tall-strong-and-handsome scenarios about the past. We had one leader in those times, for better or worse, and it was JLN. Time to get used to that notion and work with the present.

Rye, as others have made clear, BRF has to cater to posters and lurkers of all levels of competence, including newbies. It does not exist to serve just five or six posters who have been hanging around for years and have become jaded. Just ignore the posts that are below your level of competence.

[Rye]

All this "new information" on Nehru was repeated in an earlier version of this exact same thread a month ago, so...I am not stopping anyone from posting anything. Only complaint is in making every freaking thread a whinefest.

Nehru effed up in a lot of things, no disagreement on that, but if there are a series of links to articles on that, we can avoid derailing the Tibet thread with that stuff constantly.

[Rye]

Now Tibet is not so Far by Tenzin Tsundue in outlookIndia

[Karan Dixit]

China's reaction to the Tibet unrest drew international condemnation and heaped pressure on Beijing ahead of the Olympic Games in Beijing in August, with activists disrupting the global relay of the Olympic torch.


http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News ... 75,00.html

[ashkrishna]

OT, but rye sir, despite his horrible blunders is it not true that Nehru had a huge role to play in instilling respect for democratic institutions in the Indian mindset? Isnt it this aspect that seperates us from china today?

I am not a supporter of the NG family, but to dismiss Nehru as a dreamer in toto is not fair.

[Rye]

ashkrishna-ji, I think Nehru was human like everyone else, but was just trying to end the digression on Nehru one way or another by being in violent agreement.

[Karan Dixit]

MADRID (AFP) - A Spanish court hearing a genocide case against seven top Chinese leaders, including former president Jiang Zemin and former prime minister Li Peng, heard testimony on Monday from three Tibetan monks.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080519/wl ... 0519181750

[Karan Dixit]

The situation is complicated by the vast perception gap between the public in the West and in China.

Many in the West are sympathetic toward the Dalai Lama, respecting him as a Nobel Laureate and a man of peace. There is concern too about the plight of China's Tibetan minority.

Just a few days ago, the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Tibet released a report which called for an independent UN investigation into the protests and the crackdown which followed.

It called on the Chinese government to provide more information about detainees, account for those killed and release those who protested peacefully.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7409427.stm

[Philip]

The Dalai Lama's fears for Chinese "ethnic engineering" in Tibet.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/may/24/tibet.china

Tibet could be 'swamped' by mass Chinese settlement after Olympics, says Dalai Lama· Buddhist leader fears attempt to dilute identity

· Meeting with Brown helpful despite problem
Julian Borger, diplomatic editor The Guardian, Saturday May 24 2008 Article history

Tibetan spiritual leader His Holiness the Dalai Lama interviewed in London. Photograph: David Levene/Guardian

The Dalai Lama claimed yesterday that Beijing was planning the mass settlement of 1 million ethnic Chinese people in Tibet after the Olympics with the aim of diluting Tibetan culture and identity.

Tibet's exiled spiritual leader also claimed that some of Asia's most important rivers which flow from the Tibetan plateau are being polluted and diminished by careless industrialisation and unplanned irrigation.

The Dalai Lama made the claims in an interview with the Guardian after a meeting yesterday with Gordon Brown at Lambeth Palace. He said the talks had been detailed and the prime minister had been helpful "in spite of his difficulties". The Dalai Lama said: "He met me and he showed genuine concern and he wants to help."

Downing Street said the discussion focused on talks due next month on Tibet's future between Tibetan representatives and Beijing officials. The prime minister is said to have stressed the importance of the Dalai Lama's pledge to oppose violence, not seek Tibetan independence, nor support a boycott of the Beijing Olympics.

The Dalai Lama said he feared the Chinese authorities could take a tougher line on Tibet after the Olympics, and possibly flood it with Han Chinese, the world's largest ethnic group.

The Dalai Lama said he had been informed by Tibetan residents that large areas of empty land had been marked out, as if for construction, in the past two years. "Then last year we received information - after the Olympics 1 million Chinese are going to settle in the autonomous region of Tibet," he said, adding the information came from a "military source" in Tibet.

"There is every danger Tibet becomes a truly Han Chinese land and Tibetans become an insignificant minority. Then the very basis of the idea of autonomy becomes meaningless."

There has been an increasing influx of Chinese settlers into Tibet in recent years as transport has improved, but the exact figures are a matter of dispute. According to an official census in 2000, there were 2.4 million Tibetans in the region and 159,000 Han Chinese. The government in exile says there are many more Chinese if migrant workers and soldiers are counted. The Dalai Lama has said there is a Han majority in Lhasa, the regional capital.

China has denied carrying out any deliberate settlement policy aimed at the dilution of Tibetan culture and points instead to the benefits brought to the region by economic development and investment.

The Dalai Lama claimed over-settlement and over-exploitation of Tibet was threatening the quality and flow of rivers flowing out of the Tibetan highlands, including the Yangtze, the Yellow River, the Indus, the Mekong and the Ganges.

"Due to carelessness these waters have been polluted and also reduced, and I think billions of people's lives depend on these rivers," the Dalai Lama said. "[There has been] mining without proper care, deforestation ... irrigation without proper planning. In some valleys, new diseases have developed which some specialists believe is the result of water pollution."

Lhasa is now relatively quiet since protests were put down by Chinese troops in March, and the Dalai Lama has threatened to resign if the unrest turns to violence. But he said the Tibetan commitment to non-violence might not outlast him.

"Now there are signs of frustration among Tibetans, not only young monks," the 72-year-old Buddhist leader said. He said Tibetans were now telling themselves: "While the Dalai Lama remains, we have to follow his advice. That means non-violence. After him, we ourselves will take appropriate action."

The next talks between representatives of the Dalai Lama and China are scheduled for Beijing on June 11. On Wednesday, envoys of the Tibetan leader visited the Chinese embassy in London to offer his condolences for the dead from this month's earthquake in Sichuan.

Asked what he thought Gordon Brown should tell the Chinese president, Hu Jintao, when he attends the Olympic closing ceremony in August, the Dalai Lama said: "If within two months it gets more positive then the prime minister must give encouragement and appreciation. If things get worse, the prime minister will have to speak out."

[Karan Dixit]

New Delhi, May 26: Exiled Tibetan students marched to the United Nations office in New Delhi on Monday and submitted an appeal seeking international attention towards their cause.


link

[Mahendra]

Quit India notice to 5 foreign Tibet marchers

[darshan]

Quit India notice to 5 foreign Tibet marchers
27 May 2008, 0006 hrs IST,Shobhan Saxena,TNN

NEW DELHI: In a strange move, at a time when the government is promoting "Come to India — Walk with the Buddha" to attract foreign tourists to Buddhist circuit in the country, five foreigners have been given Quit India notice to leave the country within seven days "for participating in a religious activity".

James Petersen, Lex Pelger and David Huang from US, Maryla Cross from UK and Paul Christians Buntz from Norway were given the notices for "violating the visa rules" by Pithoragarh SP Puran Singh Rawat on Friday as they reached Banspatan in Uttarkhand's border district with the Tibetan marchers who have been walking towards Tibet since March 10.

While 19 Tibetans were jailed on Friday, the foreigners were detained for a while, given the notice and asked to leave the area immediately.

On Monday, even as the Tibetans were released from Pithoragarh jail, the five foreigners were desperately trying to get in touch with their embassies and trying to figure out the meaning of the notice.

Speaking to TOI from Nainital, James Petersen, a writer from Montana who has been with the "Tibetan Shanti March" since the beginning, said, "I can't understand why the world's biggest democracy has to deport people for taking part in a peace rally. I didn't know that you could be deported from India for taking part in the teachings of your guru. Does this mean all the people coming to India for religious and spiritual reasons can be deported if they take part in any activity?"

Interestingly, India gets maximum number of tourists from the UK (16%) and US (15%), the two countries whose citizens have been given the deportation notice for "violating their tourist visa". Many of the tourists from these countries, where Buddhism is growing very fast as a religion, come to India for religious reasons. According to a study released by the Ficci in 2006, about 200,000 Buddhist tourists visit India every year, spending about $125 million in the country. This number could witness a sharp rise of 400% by 2012 and yield India $1 billion annually in the next four years, according to the Ficci study.

The government insists that the five have violated visa rules. "On tourist visa, you cannot take part in a religious activity. If we allow that, you will have people coming here to propagate their religion. It's only for travelling and sightseeing, etc. So, they have violated the visa rule by participation in the march," said Ashim Khurana, joint secretary (Foreigners) in the ministry of home affairs.

However, legal experts TOI spoke to said the notice in this case seems to be illegal. "The Quit India Notice is a very serious matter. It's used sparingly only in such cases where the person is a threat to the national security.

In this particular case, it seems to be totally wrong, biased and prejudiced. There is no law in the country which prevents people, including foreigners, from taking part in a protest march or a rally," said Shilpi Jain, a lawyer who deals with immigration and visa-related cases. Calling the notice a violation of Article 14 of the Constitution, Supreme Court lawyer Mandeep Singh Vinayak said, "There are certain rights like right to equality available to everyone citizens as well as the aliens travelling on valid visas."

Foreigners aren't supposed to be in some border areas, but the five were detained 70 km before the military zone — the Inner Line. While Petersen has been covering the march for a US magazine, Buntz works for a Norwegian TV channel and Huang, a California-based photographer, has been taking pictures of the march that has covered some 1,000 km already.

"Its strange that such innocuous activities can invoke a deportation order in India," says Petersen who has just three days to leave India or face a jail term for violating the visa rules.

Why does not GoI offer same treatment to EvanJehadis, BDs, terrorists, and Puke sympathizers?

[derkonig]

Why does not GoI offer same treatment to EvanJehadis, BDs, terrorists, and Puke sympathizers?

& bite the hand that feeds it?
The UPA will do no such thing.

[Nayak]

Berkshire couple educate Tibetans on nonviolence

By Amy Carr, Berkshire Eagle Staff
Article Last Updated: 05/27/2008 02:58:18 AM EDT

Tuesday, May 27
It began with violence.

Mary Gandler clung to a metal bar beside her bus seat, a group of Tibetans ripping at her waist, shouting for her to get off. But without their scheduled taxi after a tour of Tibet's oldest monastery, Mary and her husband, Everett, had no choice but to hitch a ride with a bus hired by Tibetan pilgrims.

"They were physically trying to throw us off, but we had no ride," the 67-year-old Great Barrington woman remembered. "I'm an older woman and they are clinging to my shirt. But we managed to stay on."

What had begun as a cultural exploration to celebrate Mary's 55th birthday quickly turned into an encounter the Gandlers would never forget. "We're in Tibet, and it's my birthday, and we've just had this horrible experience with Tibetans, who had always been very kind to us before," said Mary. "So it was like, what is going on here?"

The question gnawed at the couple, who grew increasingly fascinated by the outpouring of frustration and violence in a region caught between peace and conflict.

For the past 12 years, Mary, a retired psychologist, and Everett, a retired Rabbi, have been traveling to schools and monasteries near
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Dharamsala, India, one or two times annually to educate Tibetan refugees about active nonviolence and a resolve to freedom.

"Nonviolence is a people's movement, so Everett and I started giving seminars to anyone who would hear us," Mary said. "Young people coming into India are angry, sad, frustrated, and we're very concerned about that because if there are riots you can rebuild monasteries, but rebuilding character is another thing."

More than 100,000 Tibetans, including the exiled Dalai Lama, have made their homes in India, fleeing Tibet, which has been controlled by China since 1959. China contends Tibet has historically been a part of China, while Tibet maintains its roots are as an independent country.

In March, with the eyes of the world on China as the country prepares to host the 2008 Olympic Games, deadly riots and demonstrations tarnished the traditional torch relay in several countries around the world.

Through their recently certified, self-funded non-governmental organization Active Nonviolence Education Center, the couple aims to illuminate individual power.

"Sometimes I say to my students, 'What do you think a nonviolent arm looks like?' " said Everett, a wiry man in his late 70s who was once jailed in Georgia with Martin Luther King Jr. "And of course they say, Ghandi's arm. But then I show them a cover of the New York Times Magazine with four Huskies who look like young Schwarzeneggers. So it's getting them to see it can be both. How morality can gain muscle to affect politics."

Martin Luther King Jr. The Dalai Lama. Mary and Everett Gandler.

Though the local couple has met both historical figures multiple times, they do not regard their efforts with the same esteem. Rather, they look at more than a decade of service as a modest and realistic effort toward a monumental goal.

"We come in and we do our road show, and it's a big hit," said Everett. "But we say, you need someone who can handle this all year round. You need to build a community and ask people, 'What do you think you can do to maintain your language, culture and economy? What can you do to make it harder for this conflict to go on?' "

On Sept. 1, just after the conclusion of the Olympics, the Gandlers will return to India to check on their program and preach active nonviolence. With each visit, they brief the Dalai Lama on their program.

Though their mission stemmed from a moment of violence, the Gandlers hope it will conclude with a peaceful resolution. "We don't know what it will be like when we go back, with the eyes of the world no longer on China," said Mary. "The task still is getting this message into Tibet. But we'll keep showing them that they can make a difference. Whether it's posting a video online or writing a letter, the goal is to let each person know they have more power than they think they do."

The road to hell are paved with good intentions.

[Rye]

derkonig wrote:

& bite the hand that feeds it? The UPA will do no such thing.

What exactly is the issue with throwing FOREIGN (brit/euro/american) tibetan protestors out of India to "ease china's fears" (presumably with an unstated quid pro quo)?

[vsudhir]

'Bad KARMA':Actress Sharon stone blames Tibet mistreatment for China Quake (Video)

[Karan Dixit]

I listened to her entire statement. She did not say the quake was result of bad Karma. She simply asked a question. The reply she received from Tibetan spirituals made her cry. Tibetans want to go and help Chinese. Even though Chinese have killed millions of innocent Tibetans.

I am a man and I am not supposed to cry. But the reply of Tibetan spirituals made me sentimental as well.

[Karan Dixit]

Nottingham, May - His Holiness the Dalai Lama, who is currently visiting Britain, on Sunday expressed his appreciation for Prime Minister Yasuo Fukuda's series of remarks on Tibet, in an exclusive interview with The Yomiuri Shimbun. "We very much appreciate them," His Holiness the Dalai Lama said in the interview in this city in central England.


link

[vsudhir]

Sharon Stone apologises for China quake 'karma' remark

Power, by definition, is the ability to influence the actions of others. Chinkil has barely bared the intent and extent of its power. Hollywood elite that can and does routinely slam the white house wets its pants when mentioning China. Artistes, activists, and other such professional gadflies shall now take china's name with revenrence, thus decrees Beijing. The parallels with these same bleeding hearts getting all sensitive and reverential when mentioning islam cannot be missed.

It'll get much worse before it gets better. Kaliyuga is upon us. Well and truly so.

[ramana]

The Chinese quake has taken the Tibetian cause of the radar. Add to that the PRC politicians are using the quake to remake their image. And Tibetians dont want to appear to exploit the PRC problems.

[Karan Dixit]

The Chinese quake has taken the Tibetian cause of the radar. Add to that the PRC politicians are using the quake to remake their image. And Tibetians dont want to appear to exploit the PRC problems.

Yep and Chinese are using earthquake to settle the old score with Sharon Stone. What is interesting is that entire US media repeated the Chinese spin and this is what made her apologize.

The tactic used by Chinese regime is a typical tactic used by forces of evil - they simply make good people appear just as evil.

Added later:
Chinese regime has played the same pressure tactic on Richard Gere for years now. Chinese has to realize one thing, there are lots of people who are willing to take some financial loss to preserve their principles.

[Nayak]

'Bad KARMA':Actress Sharon stone blames Tibet mistreatment for China Quake (Video)

Christian Dior has dropped Stone from it's ads in China !!

[Karan Dixit]

Instead of apologizing she should have sued some of these media that were misrepresenting facts.

[Philip]

The Chinese rabid reaction to Ms.Stone and cancelling her film shows serves to further highlight the Tibetan cause.China's intolerance at any criticism to its inhuman actions in Tibet can be compared with Nazi Germany.China is fast beconing Asia's Nazis for the 21st century.It's relentless military ambitions and covert bases expansion is a red light for democracies worldwide.

[Karan Dixit]

New Delhi, May 31 (IANS) In a gesture of gratitude to the Indian government and its people for their continued support, more than 200 Tibetan students from across the country cleaned the Delhi University (DU) campus Saturday. They plan to celebrate Sunday as Thank You India day.

link

[Karan Dixit]

It is beyond dispute at various periods of its long history that Tibet came under differing degrees of foreign influence: the Mongols, the Gurkhas of Nepal, the Manchu emperors of China and the British rulers of India all played their parts. At other periods in the plateau's history, it was Tibet which exercised power and influence over its neighbours - including China.

It would be hard to find any state in the world today that has not been subjected to foreign domination or influence at some era in its history. In Tibet's case the degree and duration of foreign influence and interference was relatively limited.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7411011.stm

[Prasad]

The Hindu - Five questions on the Tibetan issue

http://www.thehindu.com/2008/06/04/stor ... 501100.htm

Mao Siwei - The writer is the Consul General of China in Kolkata. Not quoting any part of the article because I'm not sure about the copyright stuff.

[sanjaychoudhry]

It is beyond dispute at various periods of its long history that Tibet came under differing degrees of foreign influence: the Mongols, the Gurkhas of Nepal, the Manchu emperors of China and the British rulers of India all played their parts. At other periods in the plateau's history, it was Tibet which exercised power and influence over its neighbours - including China.

It would be hard to find any state in the world today that has not been subjected to foreign domination or influence at some era in its history. In Tibet's case the degree and duration of foreign influence and interference was relatively limited.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7411011.stm

In November 1665, on Aurangzeb's orders, a Mughal expedition was launched from Kashmir for Tibet. It forced the ruler of Greater Tibet to be a feudetory of the emperor and submit to Islam.

India thus has as much right to claim Tibet as part of India as the Hans. The latter's claim over Tibet is a mere hoax that is designed to offer some kind of historical legitimacy to illegal invasion and occupation.

[shyamd]

Sorry to not report this earlier:

The Chinese government has assigned 2 officials to negotiate with his highness the Dalai Lama. The 2 are Zu Weikun, chief of the Workers Department 7th Bureau ( Tibetan affairs dept which was created in 2005) as well as an official known only as Sita, a Tibetan who heads the Workers Department second bureau and has been in charge of keeping an eye on the Tibetan community in Europe from their offices in Switzerland. But alongside talks initiated by the two, the State Security ministry had the Tibetan Research Centre (TRC) disseminate a report on links between the Tibetan government in exile at Dharamshala in India and the radical movement Tibetan Youth Congress (TYC). The TYC militants are openly and increasingly challenging the Dalai Lama’s “third wayâ€

[ramana]

Shyamd, How much of above is PRC propagandu and paranoia?

The thirteenth Dalai Lama also had to flee from Tibet in 1910 from Chinese oppression and went back after the Chinese monarchy collapsed. It was in that period that Tibet was free for about 37 years and internationally recognized. The statehood for modern Tibet is on that basis.

[shyamd]

The last part is from an internal report published by the state security bureau, they may want to give the political leaders what they want to hear.