Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby ramana » 29 Aug 2017 23:44

Very good summary of the narrative. Ties Congress role in 26/11 attack and why Col. Purohit jailed.

Looses ends are David Headley and why did Army arrest Purohit in first place?

http://postcard.news/really-lt-col-puro ... -jail/amp/

I am coming to the view David Headley was triple agent for MKN gang.

DCH bought saffron threads for 26/11 terrorists from Siddi Vinayak temple to lend credence to Saffron Terror false flag.
Despite airport security being connected to IN, he made multiple visits sometimes directly from Pakistan. But no arrest or suspicion by India.
Recall MKN remarks to Mulford in wikileaks that GOI has no interest in DCH but has to go through the motions?

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Kakkaji » 30 Aug 2017 01:02

ramana ji:

I feel that, somehow, SP was involved in plotting and implementing what happened to Col Purohit. His tentacles run deep in the Police in the Mumbai-Pune area. He is rumored to have strong links with the D-Company. He also has the brainpower (which the top level of Congress lack :wink: ) to weave such sinister plots.

Maybe Purohit got too close to revealing his links with D-company and the ISI.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby ramana » 30 Aug 2017 03:35

But if you see the objectives of Saffron terror canard and decimation of Indian Army and the DCH involvement, SP is small fry who cannot benefit from such a large plot.....

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sanju » 30 Aug 2017 08:25

On another note, everyone has forgotten Col. Purohit as there have been
a) riots "manufactured" for the arrest & conviction of BRR.
b) Pappu conveniently out of the country at the time of riots
c) All media targeting BJP and ratcheting up the volume

It is so easy for Congress to change the National discourse with targeted mayhem.

We as a nation are being taken for a ride.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby fanne » 30 Aug 2017 08:33

So if Col Purohit arrest can be summed in few words, this is the conspiracy(twitteratii please spread).
26/11 was a joint Napaki/con plan and host that on hindu terror. Col Purohit was active through MI and may have known this/or was major obstacle. He was removed so that 26/11 can go smoothly. Many witnesses were 'cleaned' in this operation bust Kasab being caught alive put paid to the plan.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby chetak » 30 Aug 2017 09:17

Sanju wrote:On another note, everyone has forgotten Col. Purohit as there have been
a) riots "manufactured" for the arrest & conviction of BRR.
b) Pappu conveniently out of the country at the time of riots
c) All media targeting BJP and ratcheting up the volume

It is so easy for Congress to change the National discourse with targeted mayhem.

We as a nation are being taken for a ride.


wasn't pappu "out of the country" even during the panchkula riots??.

Is there a pattern here??

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby shiv » 30 Aug 2017 09:26

chetak wrote:wasn't pappu "out of the country" even during the panchkula riots??.

Is there a pattern here??

That pattern would be very flattering to Pappu. Peace and stability only when he is in the country. The country needs him

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby chetak » 30 Aug 2017 09:50

ramana wrote:But if you see the objectives of Saffron terror canard and decimation of Indian Army and the DCH involvement, SP is small fry who cannot benefit from such a large plot.....


ramana ji,

SP's interests are mostly financial and said financial objectives once achieved, he parlays some of the profits on the political side and folks know that he is a big bagman with the ability to influence large players.

His forte is influencing international markets for commodities like sugar, food grains and pulses so that his favored players can buy, sell, stock and/or release stored stock.

He uses some big national players as well as very big international players who can invest big bucks and often influence sowing cycles by advance purchases that push prices up or down by manipulating the futures market.

That is why he has been squatting in the agriculture ministry for the longest time.

Huge swings in international prices in commodities often begin with subtle and innocuous remarks from the agri minister about the possible intentions of the govt of India in purchasing/not purchasing specific commodities.

His favorites would have already moved in the markets and taken preferred positions before those innocuous policy statements are made.

He knows that he will not get the agri min from the BJP, so he is not too interested in a cabinet berth except to promote his daughter's future by giving her invaluable administrative experience with nil responsibility.

Any ministry going to a non BJP party is now under very careful watch as is painfully well known to some previously incorrigible players. The sheer fear of MAD is also a very big factor in keeping them on the straight and narrow.

The potentiality to personally embarrass the PM as well as the BJP during the run up to 2019 is too big for MAD to ignore and at the very same time, the run up also needs large amounts of Vitamin M, for various parties, which can come from such incumbents becoming acquisitive.

baboo(n)s with previous "pehchan" of ministers have been weeded out and sent back to their parent states or some even compulsorily retired in the public interest.

Unfortunately, deeply entrenched congi pasand termites still abound in the system, causing an appreciable drag in the implementation of many projects/policies.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby vish_mulay » 30 Aug 2017 10:29

SP is the most vindictive politician India has ever seen. Just check what he did to the Agashe family. He made sure the owner who did not submit his sugar mills to SP, died pauper in jail and his children are left destitute. Mind you Agashe family was extremely well connected and had lot of resources but nothing saved them from SP. Once he sets his eye on something, nothing comes in his way to obtain it. Its a known fact that he is the largest land owner in MH if not India or for that matter world. Most of the graze land in Mawal region of Pune is own by him through benamis. I firmly believe he is the main villain in this whole saga. MH ATS was manned by police officers who all climbed in the force when he was CM. I know for a fact that he has so many contacts that his bottom level operatives also know when IT is coming to raid.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Marten » 30 Aug 2017 11:00

vish_mulay wrote:SP is the most vindictive politician India has ever seen. Just check what he did to the Agashe family. He made sure the owner who did not submit his sugar mills to SP, died pauper in jail and his children are left destitute. Mind you Agashe family was extremely well connected and had lot of resources but nothing saved them from SP. Once he sets his eye on something, nothing comes in his way to obtain it. Its a known fact that he is the largest land owner in MH if not India or for that matter world. Most of the graze land in Mawal region of Pune is own by him through benamis. I firmly believe he is the main villain in this whole saga. MH ATS was manned by police officers who all climbed in the force when he was CM. I know for a fact that he has so many contacts that his bottom level operatives also know when IT is coming to raid.

+1 -- Folks forget he was INC in Maharashtra before it moved to family hands. All D co contacts have been carefully nurtured while the shooters of Julio the secular shot down every other gang, mostly targeting CR, even hitting 5 brothers of a don even though they had nothing to do with the business and were leading under the radar lives. Even IT used to be a tool for SP. Every available arm of the govt would function for the benefit of SP and his clan, and then for the others. My guess is that at least 75% of the public funds in Mumbai, Pune corporations used to be siphoned away by these chaps.

He has also encouraged, over the years, local industry who with his help found clearances and funding more easily at a simpler cost *(10/20/30% depending on how much schitt they were in). Even large business groups are fronts for the hawala trade that was protected and nurtured by the C system. Sahara is well known as a front (imagine how the same green bodies happily handed over Ambavane and later, the entire Lavasa tracts to folks supported by SP). Even road contracts were similarly fronted (Navayuga?). Look at agribusinesses in Mh, and you will find his finger in literally every large pie (Dynamix for ex). There are contracts even in the cable business as well that are cornered by local mafia now. The earlier hafta business is entirely corporatized under the governance of SP. There has been good done for MH, but at a cost. Whether that cost was immoral or not is left to Amitbhai (who from rumor settled with SP so he would gracefully retire and squeeze MNS, and in return his daughter would be allowed to retain her foothold). In short, SP fronted a powerful mafia organization that was integrated into the local state govt. Heh.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby shravan » 30 Aug 2017 17:33

Image
Lieutenant Colonel Shrikant Prasad Purohit dons uniform for the first time after being granted bail by SC in 2008 Malegaon bomb blast case.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby chetak » 30 Aug 2017 17:41

^^^^^^^

He should have been promoted to full colonel. Even now, it is not too late.

As always, my heart goes out to these OG guys. They always face the brunt in every conflict situation and suffer the maximum amount of personnel losses.
Last edited by chetak on 30 Aug 2017 19:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby prahaar » 30 Aug 2017 18:18

^^
Pawar clan is notorious for going after the enemies. Recently heard of someone in Ahmednagar who crossed Ajitdada and landed up in jail via some old karmas.

Furthermore, it is impossible for SP to not detect or be unawares about all the people moving around in their backyard (Nashik Deolali Wester MH region).

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Kakkaji » 30 Aug 2017 21:00

Despite all this torture and injustice, Veer Purohit is standing up with pride in his uniform and a smile on his face. Someone like me would have become a physical and mental wreck a long time ago.

Makes me want to cry.

Col Purohit and his wife are the type of people that are holding up the sky above India. They are the answer to Iqbal's riddle: "कुछ बात है कि मिटती नहीं हस्ती हमारी"।

इस वीर को मेरा शत शत प्रणाम।

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sanju » 31 Aug 2017 00:25

+1008^

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby IndraD » 31 Aug 2017 00:30


Suresh S
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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Suresh S » 31 Aug 2017 00:44

Kakkaji wrote:Despite all this torture and injustice, Veer Purohit is standing up with pride in his uniform and a smile on his face. Someone like me would have become a physical and mental wreck a long time ago.

Makes me want to cry.

Col Purohit and his wife are the type of people that are holding up the sky above India. They are the answer to Iqbal's riddle: "कुछ बात है कि मिटती नहीं हस्ती हमारी"।

इस वीर को मेरा शत शत प्रणाम।


You cry watching that video of Colonel, sahib,s wife. I agree with u kakkaji. It is because of people like these that India has survived the last 1000 years of slavery with it,s culture damaged but intact. It will rise again and achieve it,s glory once again thanks in no small part to colonel purohit,s of India.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby sudeepj » 31 Aug 2017 04:28

Mukesh.Kumar wrote:
SRoy wrote:That SOB paid for his karma. Good riddance.


SRoyji for a moment just consider that Karkare may not have known the truth. He may have been honestly laboring under the impression that Col. Purohit was a terrorist and trying to beat the information or of him. Kind of domestic false flag.

Its the root in the system that stays at the top that had set Indian against Indian. I maybe wrong on this but I would not jump to name calling a police officer who tried to stop an AK-47 carrying berserk terrorist only with a service revolver.


Mumbai Police postings have long been known to be sold to the highest bidder. If the Ajit Doval - Vicky Malhotra incident does not make this clear, nothing will. They didnt have the guts to charge Doval, but achieved a mission kill. Later this was spun as a misinformation by the enemy/honest mistake on part of Mumbai police.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby ramana » 31 Aug 2017 04:36

IndraD wrote:https://twitter.com/Sahadev214/status/902854222059683841



Mukesh,
Watch this on twitter and realize the horror.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sanju » 31 Aug 2017 06:33

I can personally attest to the fact that there are elements in the police, have a grudge against army officer/jawan. Especially when they are retired or are on vacation. It is only a matter of time before some retd officer takes the law in his own hands and gives it back to the policeman.

I have noticed the younger police officer / jawan give respect as compared to the jaded ones.

The incident like the one that happened in Trivandrum decades ago needs to be repeated for the realignment. One needs commanding officers with the necessary 'nads.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Suresh S » 31 Aug 2017 06:57

The reason police do not like the army in general is because the police is corrupt to the core and army generally is not. The army in general has a low opinion of the police and rightly so. Not talking about exceptions to the rule in both .

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Pathik » 31 Aug 2017 07:36

Marten wrote:
vish_mulay wrote:SP is the most vindictive politician India has ever seen. Just check what he did to the Agashe family. He made sure the owner who did not submit his sugar mills to SP, died pauper in jail and his children are left destitute. Mind you Agashe family was extremely well connected and had lot of resources but nothing saved them from SP. Once he sets his eye on something, nothing comes in his way to obtain it. Its a known fact that he is the largest land owner in MH if not India or for that matter world. Most of the graze land in Mawal region of Pune is own by him through benamis. I firmly believe he is the main villain in this whole saga. MH ATS was manned by police officers who all climbed in the force when he was CM. I know for a fact that he has so many contacts that his bottom level operatives also know when IT is coming to raid.

+1 -- Folks forget he was INC in Maharashtra before it moved to family hands. All D co contacts have been carefully nurtured while the shooters of Julio the secular shot down every other gang, mostly targeting CR, even hitting 5 brothers of a don even though they had nothing to do with the business and were leading under the radar lives. Even IT used to be a tool for SP. Every available arm of the govt would function for the benefit of SP and his clan, and then for the others. My guess is that at least 75% of the public funds in Mumbai, Pune corporations used to be siphoned away by these chaps.

He has also encouraged, over the years, local industry who with his help found clearances and funding more easily at a simpler cost *(10/20/30% depending on how much schitt they were in). Even large business groups are fronts for the hawala trade that was protected and nurtured by the C system. Sahara is well known as a front (imagine how the same green bodies happily handed over Ambavane and later, the entire Lavasa tracts to folks supported by SP). Even road contracts were similarly fronted (Navayuga?). Look at agribusinesses in Mh, and you will find his finger in literally every large pie (Dynamix for ex). There are contracts even in the cable business as well that are cornered by local mafia now. The earlier hafta business is entirely corporatized under the governance of SP. There has been good done for MH, but at a cost. Whether that cost was immoral or not is left to Amitbhai (who from rumor settled with SP so he would gracefully retire and squeeze MNS, and in return his daughter would be allowed to retain her foothold). In short, SP fronted a powerful mafia organization that was integrated into the local state govt. Heh.


SP also orchestrated the 93 serial blasts with D

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby IndraD » 31 Aug 2017 13:23

Suresh S wrote:The reason police do not like the army in general is because the police is corrupt to the core and army generally is not. The army in general has a low opinion of the police and rightly so. Not talking about exceptions to the rule in both .

also police envy reputation enjoyed by army while they are dissed as leper of society.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby chetak » 31 Aug 2017 13:52

IndraD wrote:
Suresh S wrote:The reason police do not like the army in general is because the police is corrupt to the core and army generally is not. The army in general has a low opinion of the police and rightly so. Not talking about exceptions to the rule in both .

also police envy reputation enjoyed by army while they are dissed as leper of society.


Here is what the Army thinks of the police. It couldn't be plainer than this.

whatsapp forward

Army to the Rescue:

The state of Haryana had experienced similar situations (Dear Baba riots)
earlier, but had refused to learn, basically because political compulsions
dominate law and order. Votes are more important than a few lives. The
government was playing to the galleries, keeping the so-called godman and
his supporters in good humour, while hoping that the situation would remain
in control. Panchkula was on lockdown, almost a police state, with
thousands of security force personnel to ensure law and order, with
residents too scared to even venture out.

With the court pronouncing the godman guilty, mayhem commenced. State
police forces were incapable of even escorting the accused to the
helicopter, which was to move him to prison. It was a small army column
which was pressed into service. The move was incident free however, for
even as the region exploded in violence, the accused accompanied by his
so-called daughter traveled in comfort in a state helicopter.

There have been claims that there was an escape plan to take the accused to
a safe location, with representatives of the state police involved,
thwarted solely because the army was involved. Within a short time, the
mass of security forces lost control of the situation in Panchkula and
Sirsa. Almost 70 companies of CRPF, SSB, RAF and thousands of state police
proved incapable, with local police even abandoning their posts and running
away.

This was witnessed in earlier incidents over the past few years, yet the police
officers refused to learn, refused to retrain and reorganize their forces. News reports mention that the state administration in panic, requested army columns, which had been requisitioned, to move in. The army had less than a dozen columns in the region. In a short time, it controlled the violence,
secured the colonies and restored order. The reason is that the army had
reconnoitered the area, war-gamed the situation and planned the movement of columns.

It was prepared, while others were not. Residents claim that it was the army which saved the day, otherwise, there would have been excessive damage and losses. It is surprising that despite such open display of panic, the state police authorities claimed in subsequent press conferences that they had led from the front and were in control of the situation.

Led who was the question, as the state police were nowhere to be seen. Even in Sirsa, where the main dera was located, the mass of police and other security agencies were incapable of handling the situation. It was again
the army which was stepped in. The taxpayer pays for maintaining massive
state and central police forces, but if they are incapable of even holding the fort for a few hours, ensuring the safety and security of residents, is
maintaining and equipping them essential? The Haryana Chief and Home
Secretaries, responsible for the security of the state and its people, have
remained underground till date.

Neither has made a statement nor offered to resign, despite failure
commencing at their table. It is the same army which the government has
lowered in status and reduced in privileges that brought peace and succor,
while others vanished in panic.

The Justice Mathur pay commission had graded the IPS and IAS as the
crème-de la-crème of the nation and the armed forces notches below, solely
based on the commonality of an entrance exam.

The combination of the creme-de la-creme (IAS and IPS) has failed the
nation every time, while the army has ensured safety and security. It has
respect and gratitude of the nation but faces apathy of the government. The
army, as always, quietly did its task, restored peace and moved back to the
barracks, while the IPS suddenly seemed to find its voice, conducted press
conferences, claimed success and normalcy.

They attempted to project a few specific incidents of courage, but if their
own personnel left the ground, was it courage or poor leadership?

Admission of failures, lack of decision making, poor leadership and
unpreparedness was missing from the press conferences, so also the
admission that the army saved the day, while their own forces ran for
safety.

No army officer gave a statement; after all the army has been ensuring
national security since independence, which the nation knows and the
government takes for granted.

(The writer is a retired Major-General of the Indian Army.)

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Mukesh.Kumar » 01 Sep 2017 22:49

ramana wrote:
IndraD wrote:https://twitter.com/Sahadev214/status/902854222059683841



Mukesh,
Watch this on twitter and realize the horror.


Thank you Ramanaji. Will do

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Muns » 03 Sep 2017 12:33

Lt Col Shrikant Prasad Purohit gets to don his Army uniform: Purohit was falsely implicated, says former Deputy Director General of Military Intelligence.

http://www.india-aware.com/lt-col-shrik ... elligence/

“I am very proud to belong to the army. This is the only institution that has withstood the ripples of time. I want my younger son to join the army,” he is learnt to have told the assembled officers and men. Purohit insists he has full faith in the army.

Lt.Colonel Purohit said: “I want to wear my uniform. It is outermost layer of my skin. I am wedded to it. I am very happy to get back into the service of the best organisation in the country if not the world, the Indian Army.” “I have two families — the Army and my family which includes my wife, my two sons, sister and mother. I cannot wait to return to them.”

Lt. Colonel Purohit, for the first time spoke about the torture he was subjected to while he was in jail for nine long years.

He recalls with a shudder the treatment meted out to him by the Maharashtra Anti-terror Squad. It was worse than, according to him, the way “even the terrorists were treated”.

“First, they beat me for 5-7 days. Then, they left me alone for two days so that the swelling subsided,” Purohit said, adding that he was “thrashed again for 8-9 days”.

He alleged that the ATS was enjoying “beating up” an army officer. “They wanted to have fun at my expense. God help any army officer who gets picked up by police.”

Recounting his ordeal, Purohit said that they hung him upside down, continued beating him, “despite realising that my leg was broken”.

However, initially, it was not established if Colonel Purohit was indeed tortured. “The JJ hospital report said there was nothing wrong with me,” Purohit said, “when I got a court order and got more tests done, it was proved that I was tortured.”

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Gyan » 03 Sep 2017 13:02

fanne wrote:So if Col Purohit arrest can be summed in few words, this is the conspiracy(twitteratii please spread).
26/11 was a joint Napaki/con plan and host that on hindu terror. Col Purohit was active through MI and may have known this/or was major obstacle. He was removed so that 26/11 can go smoothly. Many witnesses were 'cleaned' in this operation bust Kasab being caught alive put paid to the plan.


This theory would become another version of Home grown terrorism or false flag operations in hands of Pakis. Keep it simple, Pakis did it, UPA wanted to blame Saffron terror for it.

Though you might be correct. USA hinted at this when India failed to intercept terrorists on High Sea. Mumbai Police was disarmed just prior to attacks.

MOST:- It helped Congress retain Delhi in elections which was hot bed of Large scale property manipulations by Son in Law of tens of thousands of crores.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Neela » 03 Sep 2017 13:58

As long as there is no price to pay, you will see Col Purohit's saga being repeated elsewhere.
@tehseenp
Satya Pal Singh who was responsible for the Pune German Bakery Bomb Blast is all set to be promoted to become a Union Minister.
6:59 PM - 2 Sep 2017

( This, when he was appointed Mumbai commisioner by Congress. )

You see, this can only happen when consequences are lacking.There is no VISIBLE smear campaign against either ATS personnel or Gen Kapoor after 9 years.
There is no counter strike to what happened in 2008. No one being dragged into the headlines for injustice to Col Purohit.
The issue is being ring fenced to just the Col Purohit's bail & reinstatement.



Granted, dragging Army into this could be counter productive, but that does not absolve their passive stance. A knuckle rap is needed though.

ATS personnel are expendable! when at fault. Col. Purohit was tortured. Those who tortured him are easy prey now. Unless these persons are publicly arrested, families shamed even their kids & extended families dragged in ( even if innocent) , you will see filthy dogs like Tehseen continue unabated. It will also send a messge to the existing ATS personnel. And more importantly, it will restore confidence in units like DGMI , TSD where personnel go into tricky missions . They must be made aware their backs are covered.


The counter strike should at the same time when Col.Purohit's innocence is making the headlines.

And Tehseen should be dragged into courts like that clown Kejriwal.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sachin » 06 Sep 2017 19:18

Suresh S wrote:The reason police do not like the army in general is because the police is corrupt to the core and army generally is not. The army in general has a low opinion of the police and rightly so.

IndraD wrote:also police envy reputation enjoyed by army while they are dissed as leper of society.

Mainly two reasons. Army works in isolation and they generally do not deal with civilains in a day to day basis. No country deliberately would try to down play the might and pride of its Army. Due to the isolation, corruption in Army or malpractises of any sort do not really come out.

So go ahead, make the Army do the policing in India. Give a decade (maximum), you would see them getting equally corrupt, and bigger bulleys. And let us not even talk about lobbying which happens to reach the top echelons of the forces. Grovelling to politicians is not an art which only IAS, IPS folks know.

Sanju wrote:It is only a matter of time before some retd officer takes the law in his own hands and gives it back to the policeman.

Great. And then the retired officer can also stand trial in a civilan court and face "civilian" justice (and some really vile lawyers).

The incident like the one that happened in Trivandrum decades ago needs to be repeated for the realignment. One needs commanding officers with the necessary 'nads.

You seem to want every one out there just grovel in front of the army. If you feel "might is right", then don't feel bad that at times Army folks also land up in situation where their "might" not really yield results. There was a case of a Para Cmdo officer who pulled out his pistol and threatened an entire fishing village with men folks having the oars in hand. You can imagine what would have happened to this officer if shots were fired and people killed. This happened in Northern Kerala, and incident narrated to me by the said officer. And he later did say that the Police came in acted as if the officer was "being arrested" and a case charged. The Para Cdo officer also was smart enough not to throw the rule book of "police man cannot arrest army officer", for he also knew that things were going out of his control. Solid beatings using oars would have been more harmful.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sanju » 06 Sep 2017 19:52

Sachin wrote:
Sanju wrote:It is only a matter of time before some retd officer takes the law in his own hands and gives it back to the policeman.

Great. And then the retired officer can also stand trial in a civilan court and face "civilian" justice (and some really vile lawyers).

The incident like the one that happened in Trivandrum decades ago needs to be repeated for the realignment. One needs commanding officers with the necessary 'nads.

You seem to want every one out there just grovel in front of the army. If you feel "might is right", then don't feel bad that at times Army folks also land up in situation where their "might" not really yield results. There was a case of a Para Cmdo officer who pulled out his pistol and threatened an entire fishing village with men folks having the oars in hand. You can imagine what would have happened to this officer if shots were fired and people killed. This happened in Northern Kerala, and incident narrated to me by the said officer. And he later did say that the Police came in acted as if the officer was "being arrested" and a case charged. The Para Cdo officer also was smart enough not to throw the rule book of "police man cannot arrest army officer", for he also knew that things were going out of his control. Solid beatings using oars would have been more harmful.


What makes you think that I want some one to take the law in their own hands? People when pushed will certainly do things that they normally wouldn't.

Please don't assign intentions to me where they are not there. I am aware of incidents where the Police went out of their way to cause trouble for the Army soldiers and the the person in charge did not follow the right actions. In Gods Own Country. And before you ask, I will not post that incident here.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Sachin » 06 Sep 2017 22:39

Sanju wrote:What makes you think that I want some one to take the law in their own hands? People when pushed will certainly do things that they normally wouldn't.

But were'nt you saying that some officer getting fed up and then venting their ire on policemen? Fine, they could have done that in all this 40-50 years of India's existence as an independent country. Other than in movies, where have such incident happen? And even if they happen the ex-defence folks are going to face the civil criminal justice system.

I am aware of incidents where the Police went out of their way to cause trouble for the Army soldiers and the the person in charge did not follow the right actions.

Neither I am asking for that. This is my 20th year in BRF, and I have realised that no organisation is a paragon of virtue. Some due to their nature of job, gets exposed fast and remain in constant bad light. A few escape, because they are no directly talking to the public or only appear in certain roles. I for sure have gotten over my craze for saying "Oh..let us hand it over to the forces, they are the ONLY best folks we have out there, and every one out there are sissies, corrupt and want to see the nation destroyed.".

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby negi » 07 Sep 2017 00:31

IPS as an institution needs reforms just like I rant about the services elsewhere , issue is their modus operandi and ethos haven't changed a lot since the British left India that is why public at large has this notion of keeping both the crooks as well as cops at arm's length ; in Massa and other countries the cops undergo a training in dealing with people to a level that even kids dial 911 if in danger here people dread the cops even if they are not in the wrong . Problem is exacerbated because the police comes under the 'state' and state governments are by and large more corrupt and penny pinching than the one's at center , condition of personnel below ACP level is deplorable , our ratio of cops to people is among the worse in the world so they are over worked and provided with very poor facilities and logistics ; this does not make for an attractive and a very respectable career path . Some major areas of reform which I see is like the armed forces the transfers of all IPS cadre across all the rungs should happen centrally and completely outside the purview of the state governments a government should not have any say at individual level who gets posted where just like the case with the 3 services (there are loop holes but still it is effective than what IPS has) , salaries of the traffic police and cops should be brought up to levels high enough to not push even good men towards the dark side . Recruitment into the police service should be centralized , the idea that men in a particular state's service have to be from the same state is the bane of all state government controlled institutions as this makes them prone to be misused by the government in power right now only the IPS officer postings are centralized but even there one can use jack with a minister to influence one's transfer such things need to be completely put to a stop.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby nachiket » 07 Sep 2017 02:34

Mukesh.Kumar wrote:
SRoy wrote:That SOB paid for his karma. Good riddance.


SRoyji for a moment just consider that Karkare may not have known the truth. He may have been honestly laboring under the impression that Col. Purohit was a terrorist and trying to beat the information or of him. Kind of domestic false flag.

Its the root in the system that stays at the top that had set Indian against Indian. I maybe wrong on this but I would not jump to name calling a police officer who tried to stop an AK-47 carrying berserk terrorist only with a service revolver.


SRoy wrote:Oh no. The "police officer" was playing Rambo.
"advanced incompetence is indistinguishable from malice". I hope we remember that adage.


What are you guys talking about? The police officer who grabbed Kasab's AK-47 and sacrificed himself while helping to capture him alive is ASI Tukaram Omble. Not Karkare. The whole country owes a huge debt of gratitude to ASI Omble. If Kasab hadn;t been captured alive the Congoons wouldn't have thought twice before blaming 26/11 on Hindu Terrorists.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Gagan » 07 Sep 2017 03:24

Kakkaji wrote:Despite all this torture and injustice, Veer Purohit is standing up with pride in his uniform and a smile on his face. Someone like me would have become a physical and mental wreck a long time ago.

Makes me want to cry.

Col Purohit and his wife are the type of people that are holding up the sky above India. They are the answer to Iqbal's riddle: "कुछ बात है कि मिटती नहीं हस्ती हमारी"।

इस वीर को मेरा शत शत प्रणाम।

Well said Kakkaji.
Salutations to Col Purohit

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Gagan » 07 Sep 2017 03:45

There is the common police,
then there is the armed state police,
then there are the central police forces (CRPF)
then there are the Armed Forces.

All have different training, different modes of action, and very different levels of political control.
The line should be drawn at the level of CRPF - and they should be able to control anything and everything internally - resorting to NSG if they need to deal with a situation.
The problem is political interference.
Sometimes, politicians WANT A RIOT TO HAPPEN, a few lives to be lost - they feel this will bring in public sympathy, and calm enraged public. These idiots feed the idiocy of the public - this is a sawab earning tactic by the politicians, and the poor people who lose life and property are the hapless vitcims.

The media needs to re-orient themselves to exposing all such politicians and political motives - clearly say (for example) Ram Rahim has immense political connections with almost every political party, and it is very likely that all these politicians will try to encourage violence at the time of his arrest.
Instead - we see what? Ram Rahim's FOLLOWERS (Oh! those lovely innocent, deeply hurt followers) are letting loose and upset that their messiah has been jailed (on rape charges)

Lets all admit this, the local police and state police are under political control and become an extension of the politicians in such situations. Then the Center or even the courts or some independent body needs to take over, impose some scripture in place so that even one loss of life can be prevented.
If both the state and center government are the same, then the center will either sit on it like the state, or act speedily on it like in the Ram Rahim case.
This seems to be still a work in progress in India. Each state and government are different in terms of who is brought to justice.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Suresh S » 07 Sep 2017 05:08

I see that some people without thinking things too much saying, sab karte han, police thori corrupt ha to kiya hua. Unfortunately nothing can justify the behaviour of Indian police.I do not think the Indian army soldiers and officers get a crore rupees per month.They are also not paid enough. Comparing Gold with cast iron, sure both are metals, we got that sir.

An incidence that tells u what is wrong with Indian police, to illustrate the case. This mind u is not an isolated incidence but the rule. Mid 1980,s Kolkota. In front of belle vue clinic crossing ,one of the busiest in the city, mid day.Thousand of vehicles jammed, why. A policeman in white uniform near the central traffic island stops a truck, causing traffic chaos. He opens the driver,s side door of the truck and sits by the side of the driver, forces him to pay bribe, gets down in full view of thousands of people in stranded traffic, with money in his hand , with everyone watching and puts the money in his pocket. The thug(or policeman) did not have the decency to even hide what he was doing. The whole episode with truck door open and the policeman with currency notes in his hand standing on the road in full view. An incidence I could never forget. I watched the entire episode from the footpath. felt like grabbing the big policeman thug and giving him the business and being careful be damned.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby nachiket » 07 Sep 2017 05:25

Police corruption is well known and unlikely to end anytime soon. There are horror stories of police corruption, cruelty, ineptitude and collusion with criminals from all over the country. Mumbai police acting like Dawood's hitmen and destroying every underworld don except him is well known. But talking about police corruption in this case can get us sidetracked. They were merely the catspaw of our elected overlords. Even the most corrupt of cops would not have dared treat a serving army officer like this without full backing from the UPA bigwigs. The buck stops with them. This whole vile plot needs to be laid bare in front of the whole country. And every UPA minister and party leader who was involved should get his/her just due. I'm hoping it will be done before those involved die of old age or worse are elected back again so they can resume their lies.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby Suresh S » 07 Sep 2017 05:29

Agree completely. This was a especially vile case in full view of thousands of people in the middle of the city during mid day.Talk about utter and total disrespect for the people of India who gave this bas*ard his uniform.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby ramana » 07 Sep 2017 21:00

Guys let me remind the objective of the thread is to discuss the Malegoan blasts and limits of fake secularism that implicated a serving Army officer to enable a terrorist attack on Mumbai.

If you want discuss Indian Police reforms there is a thread in Economic and Tech forum.
Although I think we need to bring this into the Strat forum as its moribund there and we anyway have the Internal Security thread here for a reason.

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Re: Malegaon blasts and the limits of fake secularism

Postby ramana » 07 Sep 2017 21:01

The canard of Saffron terror is still being promoted by Congress and its minions in the media.
Example the recent shooting death of Mrs. Gauri Lankesh where all and sundry are implicating Hindus with out evidence.

So Malegoan is not the alpha or omega of Congress lies on Saffron Terror.


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