Internal Security Watch

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pentaiah
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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby pentaiah » 02 Sep 2012 08:48

Boss log yours truly indicated this trend in 1999. that the first ISI cells were formed in the border of AP and Maharashtra (Aurangabad, Nanded Zaheerabad). I had mentioned the day will come when TSP would say all your terror is home grown.
The then HM LK was supposed to have given a presentation to Diplomats Big cats etc and white paper to follow....
It has full 13 yrs for us to realize the deep sh*t we are in now.

This time it was SMS lies about (IM) Minorities being killed in NE that set of property destruction, retribution and loot of public property

The number and the wide spread nature of the cells being nurtured by TSP and TBD (Terrorist Bangla Desh)
The media compromised and dont have the guts to call spade a spade the molly codling of IM for votes is going to bite back soon if not already

Next time a bogus SMS about radio active device going off some where in India will trigger panic of epic proportions

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 02 Sep 2012 09:09

A lot is being said, can't help but notice one IM 101 point, to catch a long distance train at the earliest from the crime spot and find shelter at a faraway location which is all pre-arranged, taking the train approach avoids being trapped in a police nakabandi

An approach is to mandate a photo id other than a passport while purchasing tickets and CCTVs in rail stations

if news channels need to stick to truth and reality and substantiate their reports else can be held liable, can that not apply to friday mass sermons in Mosques? The Azad maidan violence was just a trailer of the propaganda war, which has takers in the audience of these 'sermons', so sermons need be based on substantiated facts else they are liable to be arrested similar to what the Raza Academy is facing, it can be preventive in nature and not after the fact, at least hit on the sermon giver's credibility with the audience

lets see how many such disgraced sermon givers will be demoted by the audience after that and collect statistics

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sum » 02 Sep 2012 09:11

There was a actual encounter and trap set by police and not just pre-emptive arrests by the CCB. Myust say good work here:
Youths planned to kill scribes: FIR

The ACP, K N Jithendranath, Central Crime Branch, Special Enquiries, the complainant, stated that he received “credible” information regarding the conspiracy hatched to assassinate a columnist on August 26.

The sources told him they belonged to Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) and some of them were hiding near Marappa Garden, JC Nagar and possessed arms and ammunition.

The ACP sent a team to Hubli and deployed another to keep a watch on the youths in Bangalore. Abdul Hakeem Jamadar and Shoaib Ahmed Mirza alias Chotu used the stolen bike ( KA-27-E-1035) and reconnoitred in Basaveshwarnagar, Shankar Mutt, Cunningham Road, Queen’s Road and JC Nagar areas.

On August 29, the police laid a trap as the youths were to come near Shankar Mutt with the objective of assassinating the journalist, added the FIR.

Two youths wearing helmets and riding a bike came arrived at Maruthinagar where the journalist was expected to make a visit. Abdul Hakeem Jamadar tried to escape when the police surrounded them, while Shoaib Ahmed Mirza alias Chotu “took out a 7.65 mm auto pistol (bearing number 711117 PETRO AND BERATA made in Italy) fire arm and pointed towards the police”, the FIR states.

The police pounced him and he fell down. “The duo admitted that they were members of LeT and HuJI,” the FIR further states. They tipped the police about their three associates in J C Nagar, stated the FIR.

The police rushed to the house in Munireddy Palya around 3.30 pm and secured Muthi-Ur-Rehman Siddiqui, Riyaz Ahmed Byahatti, Mohammad Yusuf Nalband and Aizaz Ahmed Mirza, the FIR stated.


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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby member_23629 » 02 Sep 2012 09:52

vasu raya wrote:if news channels need to stick to truth and reality and substantiate their reports else can be held liable, can that not apply to friday mass sermons in Mosques? The Azad maidan violence was just a trailer of the propaganda war, which has takers in the audience of these 'sermons', so sermons need be based on substantiated facts else they are liable to be arrested similar to what the Raza Academy is facing, it can be preventive in nature and not after the fact, at least hit on the sermon giver's credibility with the audience

lets see how many such disgraced sermon givers will be demoted by the audience after that and collect statistics


In Singapore, police video-tapes all sermons at mosques to keep a tab on rabid Moulvis and what they are telling the faithfools. They have also found a solution for blaring Aazaan from mosques five times a day -- they have given a radio to all Muslims and Moulvis are required to call for Azaan over FM radio!!

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vijayk » 02 Sep 2012 09:58

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/youth ... 120901.htm

The Civil Liberties Monitoring Committee in its memorandum condemned the arrest of Muslim youths from different parts of India [ Images ] and expressed that the police action is based upon malicious intention and dishonesty.
Click!

"These arrests are the result of nexus between anti-Muslim police groups of Hyderabad and Bangalore working with the support of Hindutva outfits. This committee believes that the main intention of these arrests is to divert the attention of people from the court verdict against the criminals of Gujarat genocide and ongoing genocide of Muslim in Assam," it said.


"As per reliable sources the police arrested these youths in illegal manner, detained and tortured them, and then, as per the practice, after completing these formalities declared them arrested," it claimed.

Those who are arrested belong to journalism, medicine and science and technology fields as well as students. By this way Muslims will be looked with suspicion in journalism, and in scientific institutions, and their future will be in the dark in these fields and they will be denied job opportunity in future, it added.

"The police statements on these arrests are nothing but a bundle of lies. The Bangalore police chief said that police arrested these youths when they were asleep and a pistol was in their hand. Now the big question is that whether they were sleeping with a pistol in their hands and how can they carryout their "operation" with a pistol?," the statement asked.

Police also said that computers, laptops, cell phones, hard disks have been recovered from them. It is a matter of common sense that these are the essential materials in day to day life, these are not dangerous weapons, it said.

Civil Liberties Monitoring Committee demands that the Prime Minster of India intervene and order high-level enquiry on these arrests and stop the arresting of innocent Muslim youths, it appealed.


Look! How well they are using the arguments provided by SICKULAR PAID MEDIA to poke in the eyes of Indians. BRAVO! The CON LADY's agents in NDTV, CNN will be proud of them.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Nihat » 02 Sep 2012 11:30

What garbage this civil liberties committee is espousing. I just logged on to their website and it seems to be no more than a organized blog with articles condemning everything under the sun which is even perceived to be against Muslims , 90% of that website is all about false propaganda and I can see how this would help even well educated Muslims harbor radical feelings. Nothing good is posted here about national integration, cases of inter community bonding etc etc, its all bull crap. Where does one launch a complain against pseudo-radical stuff like this on the net.

Also, I wish some of the guys here would give it a little rest , I mean all the talk about Islamist taking over, civil war , second partition in the Internal security thread (are you serious). I agree we have an internal security problem in that even well educated and well established Muslims are now popping up in acts of terror and it is not confined to ghettos as was the popular belief of most. Muslim radicalization has very little to do with poverty or for that matter a sense of victim hood, there are much more material reasons involved, add to that the prospect of getting political and NGO's patronage and we have a deadly cocktail at our hands.

The solution is not going to be some major demographic change or declaring India a Hindu state , that would be massively counter productive. What we must do is cut the patronage that they get and expose groups live Civil liberties movement for what they are, declaring them traitors by law and putting them to death (unfortunately all this requires political will), good intelligence , targeted arrests (don't care if police stereotype Muslims in some cases). the majority does not have to declare war , but state institutions have to wake up and protect every law abiding citizens interests. The arrest of those who damaged the Amar Jawan memorial is a good case in point , it shows the police are not afraid to act , the arrest of these well educated terror suspects also great news, the police should continue to go after these people relentlessly, this is the only realistic way we can deal with such problems. It's similar to why people spit and urinate on the road, because no one stops them and people defend their actions by saying there are not enough toilets (how stupid is that). take action and teach the few a lesson as a larger point to society and pockets in the Muslim community in general, that you cannot get away with anti-national acts or any association with them.

Another thing worth pointing out is that this particular forum is read by so many people, I recommend reading it to most people I meet because people here speak the truth and are not apologists , in much the same way , would it kill some of you to have a perspective along with your opinions, I means terms like RoP , Islamist takeover , Muslim mentality etc are just brushing the whole community with one stroke. I'm a Muslim , do you think I'll take over the damn forum and radicalize it too , or have have other fellow Islamist s help me secularize the forum. It takes only 0.10% of the community population i.e. roughly 1,00,000-1,50,000 people to turn extremists for this nation to go to hell, we should have more faith in the Idea of India.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby kshatriya » 02 Sep 2012 13:23

SSridhar wrote:
I am waiting for some arrests in TN.


Sridharji, Why do you think there will be arrests in TN ?

The arrested did have Chennai maps.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby SSridhar » 02 Sep 2012 14:27

kshatriya wrote:Sridharji, Why do you think there will be arrests in TN ?

Because, the arrested were in touch with certain people in Vellore, Vaniyambadi etc and two teams of Bengaluru police had come to these two towns.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nawabs » 02 Sep 2012 14:34

Violence in Lucknow over theft of religious books

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/violence-in- ... 3-242.html
A shop and a motorcycle were burnt in the old city area in Lucknow on Saturday when a mob went on a rampage after discovering that some holy Muslim books had been stolen, police said.

The incident took place in Mishri ki Bagia area of Thakurganj. Identifying the thieves as Sushila and Rajeshwari, the mob attacked their houses and staged a sit-in there.

The protesters charged the police with protecting the two women and alleged that they were drug addicts.

A sack full of religious books was also recovered, following which angry residents blocked traffic on the busy Hardoi road.

A large posse of police has been deployed in the area, Senior Superintendent of Police (SSP) RK Chaturvedi said, adding that the situation was now under control and that two criminals, Shamim and Shakeel, had been apprehended.

A warning has also been issued to the local station officer to ensure that no drug business was allowed in the area.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 02 Sep 2012 14:35

varunkumar wrote:In Singapore, police video-tapes all sermons at mosques to keep a tab on rabid Moulvis and what they are telling the faithfools. They have also found a solution for blaring Aazaan from mosques five times a day -- they have given a radio to all Muslims and Moulvis are required to call for Azaan over FM radio!!


That idea is commendable, if it was acceptable to Singaporean muslims, acceptance is desh isn't an uphill task. In this context I support the GoI's program of distributing phones to all below poverty line, with Sibal's diktat to have phone EM emissions be reduced to 10%, they can get rid of chinese handsets as well for good.

--------------------------------

Ok, on using international sites such as youtube, facebook or twitter for propaganda purposes must be addressed by the GoI, the solutions aren't complicated, at times we observe that BR website is teeming with web crawlers, all GoI has to do is create its own crawlers and have these websites comply with letting the crawlers execute on their sites or even help them. GoI can build its own analytics database. It might take few months for the first crawl to catch up, after which the information would be more or less in realtime. The crawling applies to all videos public or private since it is similar to the way content is screened by the website itself. They don't allow certain content to be uploaded even if the user wants it to be private. The search words or phrases used by the GoI will be confidential since it can relate to ongoing investigations.

Another requirement is to mandate all content uploaded in India be mirrored in India so that Indian jurisdiction applies, similarly have these websites comply that they internally tag the uploaded content by country and time, so if GoI feels the need, it can block the content by countries or even based on the time when these are uploaded at its gateways or have the websites do the honors.

an observation is the time of uploading could coincide with communal tensions or war time or precede few months before the actual events happen

Bottom line, GoI can always threaten to go the China route of banning these websites if they don't comply.

we know data can be searched, now, how can video and audio content be searched is a tech question, it will apply to all the CCTV audio visual data as well.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby shyamd » 02 Sep 2012 14:43

Expect to hear women arrested too. They receive training in pak as well

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nakul » 02 Sep 2012 14:49

The first step to address the solution is identify the right problem. The frothing at the mouth jihadi is not a geek. He gets his info from the local mullah/ video distributor / mosque. It is these centers of dissipation that need to be monitored. We can't go after every photoshop artist located anywhere in the world. The security concerns arise from the foot soldiers and their guardians which are located in India, not the artists and their idols from history.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby SSridhar » 02 Sep 2012 14:50

Nihat wrote:What garbage this civil liberties committee is espousing. I just logged on to their website and it seems to be no more than a organized blog with articles condemning everything under the sun which is even perceived to be against Muslims

There are Kerala-based organizations like Popular Front which fight for the noble cause of "a new India of equal rights to all Indians" but according to Shariah. Then there is a very noble party espousing the cause of democracy, People's Democratic Party, which actually wants a Caliphate under the notorious Naseer Abdul Maudany who is now cooling his heels in Parapana Agrahara. Then there is the National Development Front of Kerala. In TN, we had Manitha Neethi Pasarai (Garrison for Human Rights) which had many members from SIMI. All innocuous-sounding names but very dangerous indeed.

I suggest everyone interested in internal security to read this dated but well compiled (by T.S.Subramanian) article on the 'bases' being set up.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby SSridhar » 02 Sep 2012 14:55

varunkumar wrote:In Singapore, police video-tapes all sermons at mosques to keep a tab on rabid Moulvis and what they are telling the faithfools.

Even in Saudi Arabia, there are restrictions on what the kutbah can contain. But, in India, it will be a violation of freedom of speech.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby pentaiah » 02 Sep 2012 15:05

Singapore is also flooded with TBDs

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby member_23629 » 02 Sep 2012 15:21

I wish some of the guys here would give it a little rest , I mean all the talk about Islamist taking over, civil war , second partition in the Internal security thread (are you serious).


Tell that to the Kashmiri pandits and the Bodos. This is a typical Hindu disease of pooh-poohing every threat to their race until they and their families get personally threatened -- as long as it is the goose of far-away Hindus that is getting cooked, the rest of the Hindus, especially the urban ones, tend to remain frivilous and treat Hindus warning them of the problem as crackpots. This keeps happening on this board too.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby member_19686 » 02 Sep 2012 18:18

varunkumar wrote:
I wish some of the guys here would give it a little rest , I mean all the talk about Islamist taking over, civil war , second partition in the Internal security thread (are you serious).


Tell that to the Kashmiri pandits and the Bodos. This is a typical Hindu disease of pooh-poohing every threat to their race until they and their families get personally threatened -- as long as it is the goose of far-away Hindus that is getting cooked, the rest of the Hindus, especially the urban ones, tend to remain frivilous and treat Hindus warning them of the problem as crackpots. This keeps happening on this board too.

He says he is Muslim so in this case its not "Hindu disease".

Nothing new, the so called "moderate" Muslims were saying the same things to Hindus leading up to Partition. Once their fellow momeens decided to halal the kaffirs these "moderates" were nowhere to be seen.

Remember "partition is not going to happen" "you should stay put" & the rest of shibboleths they fed to Hindus and Sikhs till the last moment.

But trust us this time it will be totally different!

Even though the events and behavior pattern are eerily similar to what happened leading up to 1947.

Just a coincidence that whenever a state approaches Muslim majority Hindus are either genocided (Kashmir) or slowly ethnic cleansed (Assam), nothing to see here fellows just be merry and repeat secular shibboleths till the sword falls on your own neck. How dare you discuss any measures of self preservation.

May be these fake moderates should put an ounce of that effort into reforming their own community instead of advising Hindus on what to do.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby RamaY » 02 Sep 2012 19:27

Civil Liberties Monitoring Committee (CLMCI) is a leading Human Rights Organistaion of India based in Hyderabad.

CLMCI is a voice of the voiceless, and works for the cause of the protection of civil liberties and democratic rights of all the Human Beings.

Professor. Rehena Sulthana is the President of the Organization and Mr. Lateef Mohd Khan is the General Secretary.

CLMCI has been working for the past five years in Hyderabad. CLMCI is a civil liberties organization working against the Human rights violations of the general public and the minority community in particular. CLMCI have conducted several seminars, press and public meetings upholding the constitutional rights and democratic rights of people. Also, they conducted and participated in several Fact Finding Missions at state level and national level on extra judicial killings and police excesses. Thus we monitor in preserving and protecting the civil liberties by educating and advocating in the public and by filing petitions in the courts for the deserving people.

Fighting for Rights

Mr. Lateef Mohd Khan:
He was selected by the government as a school teacher, and has ever since then earned his living teaching high school children science.

His teachers’ union inducted Lateef into left liberal politics. He joined the AP Civil Liberties Committee with legendary human rights activists like Kannabiran and Balagopal, and took part in several of their fact-finding enquiries, mainly into fake encounter killings of alleged Naxalites. In the wake of the 2002 Gujarat carnage, the Gujarat police alleged terror links between men detained under POTA in Gujarat and covert terrorists in Hyderabad. The police in both States joined hands to detain Muslim youth from Andhra Pradesh. Lateef felt that many civil liberties organisations were hesitant to take up strongly the cause of these Muslim youth, because of allegations of their links with Pakistan’s ISI. He therefore established a fraternal civil liberties organisation, calling it the Civil Liberties Monitoring Committee, focussed specifically on the injustices faced by Muslims.

Lateef antagonised the police more and more as he fearlessly took them on in many ways. He petitioned for a CBI enquiry into the role of the Hyderabad police in the infamous encounter killings of Sohrabuddin and his wife Kauser, for which the Gujarat police was already indicted. He urged the High Court that murder charges be filed against police officials who had fired indiscriminately and unprovoked after the Mecca Masjid bomb explosions in 2007. When around 25 Muslim youth were illegally abducted and tortured by the police, he helped build a national coalition which used the courts and media to end further abductions. Most of the youth were released on bail as a direct result of these endeavours, and some have even been acquitted. With Teesta Setlavad and me, he also filed a suit for compensation by the police for the torture of the young men.

Address:

Civil liberties Monitoring Committee
Moral building, quadribagh, Amberpet,Hyderabad,A.P.India 5000013.

Phone:- 040-27427860, 27403392
Fax :- 040-27427860, 27403392

Mobile Numbers: - 9391051586,

Mail id: - clmci@hotmail.com, civillibertiesindia@gmail.com


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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby brihaspati » 02 Sep 2012 21:19

Nihat wrote
Also, I wish some of the guys here would give it a little rest , I mean all the talk about Islamist taking over, civil war , second partition in the Internal security thread (are you serious).

People were criminally lied to - about the intentions and role of Islamism, during the buildup to the Partition. Hence people no longer trust assurances of everything being different this time around.

I agree we have an internal security problem in that even well educated and well established Muslims are now popping up in acts of terror and it is not confined to ghettos as was the popular belief of most. Muslim radicalization has very little to do with poverty or for that matter a sense of victim hood, there are much more material reasons involved, add to that the prospect of getting political and NGO's patronage and we have a deadly cocktail at our hands.


Muslim radicalization always had very little to do with poverty - at the leadership level. However, the basic dynamics is still strongly driven by certain well-defined biological hungers, for which the theology provides freedom from sense of guilt which is otherwise there in almost all other religions. But for the non-Muslim - the more important question is not what drives the Islamist violence, but what it manifests as- and there is always a consistent and repeated pattern to such violence.

The solution is not going to be some major demographic change or declaring India a Hindu state , that would be massively counter productive. What we must do is cut the patronage that they get and expose groups live Civil liberties movement for what they are, declaring them traitors by law and putting them to death (unfortunately all this requires political will), good intelligence , targeted arrests (don't care if police stereotype Muslims in some cases). the majority does not have to declare war , but state institutions have to wake up and protect every law abiding citizens interests. The arrest of those who damaged the Amar Jawan memorial is a good case in point , it shows the police are not afraid to act , the arrest of these well educated terror suspects also great news, the police should continue to go after these people relentlessly, this is the only realistic way we can deal with such problems. It's similar to why people spit and urinate on the road, because no one stops them and people defend their actions by saying there are not enough toilets (how stupid is that). take action and teach the few a lesson as a larger point to society and pockets in the Muslim community in general, that you cannot get away with anti-national acts or any association with them.


I too don't think demographic change or declaring India as particular ideological state is the onlee possible solution. But then on the other hand, why is that going to be massively counterproductive? The advanced liberal societies of the world seem to have no problems with such theological states as Saudi Arabia - and even our gloriously secular Indian regimes do not have any problem in shaking hands with Saudi theologians known for their extreme vituperative and intolerant religious statements. If a Vatican state, or such Latin American countries where various Christian churches dominate the organs and character of the state and are known to have been in cahoots with extremely brutal repressive regimes, or a Saudi Arabia, or Malaysia, or Indonesia have had no massive counter-productive upsurge [I have specifically chosen economies that are touted as doing very very well, very biz-doable, investment-worthy - all the while slowly and surely tightening the screws on non-Muslims] - why is it going to be massively counterproductive for India? Or is it going to be massively counterproductive onlee if it turns away from the proselytizing branches of the Abrahamic?

Don't get me wrong - I am only trying to understand, why it is such a no-no only for India - when there seems to be no problem with similar exclusive ideology dominated state characters.

Another thing worth pointing out is that this particular forum is read by so many people, I recommend reading it to most people I meet because people here speak the truth and are not apologists , in much the same way , would it kill some of you to have a perspective along with your opinions, I means terms like RoP , Islamist takeover , Muslim mentality etc are just brushing the whole community with one stroke. I'm a Muslim , do you think I'll take over the damn forum and radicalize it too , or have have other fellow Islamist s help me secularize the forum. It takes only 0.10% of the community population i.e. roughly 1,00,000-1,50,000 people to turn extremists for this nation to go to hell, we should have more faith in the Idea of India.


Support your sentiments wholeheartedly. Problem is a cold hard look at historical patterns which never deviate when it comes to how Islamists gain power over a land.

(1) when they are numerically a minority - they will hide their organizations, or pretend peaceful cohabitation. This has been such core experience of the Islamist movement, that it is enshrined in the Islamist texts - starting with the justifications of two revealing incidents, the so-called "satanic" revelations by which temporarily the founder allowed pretension of going along with "pagan" worship - and the so-called period of hidden proselytization before the migration.

Even in Yathrib, the first two years were pretended peaceful coexistence with the Jews who had founded and dominated the oasis network.

This is repeated throughout Islamist history. Initially the prospect of Islam's innate program of elimination of all other cultures through violence is laughed away. This pretended peace is then used to gain access and allies in non-Muslim societies. There are of course individuals who happen to be born into Muslim families, but who do not entirely subscribe to Islamist teachings. But they are usually an insignificant minority - whose net impact on the overall role played by the theologian network and its control over Islamist society - is never tangible or real.

Ibn Sina - always stayed away from Mahmud, and had serious disagreements with most mullahs he came across - but Ibn Sina had no impact on the course of Islamist violence, which was unleashed in India and Afghanistan. Same is the case until even Maulana Azad.

You have to understand the overall control of the mullahcracy in organizing islamic societies and the pervasively ideologically corrupting influence of the theological memes - to see why dissent will always be ineffective.

(2) When it comes to jihad, its not that all of a Muslim society goes out to rape and pillage. But the majority also do not do anything to prevent such genocide of non-Muslims living among them or as neighbours. This is the repeated story in all acts of large scale organized Islamic violence. They are always planned way before -along very predictable lines of tactical moves, whicha re laid out in the core text and accompanying ahadith.

Even to protect voices like yours from within the "Muslim", who will have no power to stop the full mobilization of Islamism - we need to be aware of the consistent pattern of islamist mobilization, and such mobilization does not lie with the small-time foot-soldiers or even this and that mosque that gets funding - which you are pointing to as solution. The problem lies with the whole educational and institutional networks by which both mullahcracy and the theological textual interpretations are reproduced and continued. The institution of islamism has as its sole target - the elimination of the non-Muslim. That institution has to be dismantled.

We do not have to define what India should be, but we can define what it cannot be - and we cannot allow it to be a Islam majority land, because historical experience does not allow us to trust any promise from any Muslim voice as to future intentions. Every Islam majority land inevitably turns towards elimination of all other cultures and knowledge base.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sum » 02 Sep 2012 21:28

I suggest everyone interested in internal security to read this dated but well compiled (by T.S.Subramanian) article on the 'bases' being set up.

Damn.....already was pretty depressed about the state of affairs staring at Indian unity in the future based on the events of last month ( Azad Maidan, Assam riots, NE exodus due to IM threats, 15 educated people being rounded up etc) and this article pushed me into full blown depression almost assuring that the future is very, very grim indeed on the internal security front.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby svinayak » 02 Sep 2012 21:34

sum wrote:
I suggest everyone interested in internal security to read this dated but well compiled (by T.S.Subramanian) article on the 'bases' being set up.

Damn.....already was pretty depressed about the state of affairs staring at Indian unity in the future based on the events of last month ( Azad Maidan, Assam riots, NE exodus due to IM threats, 15 educated people being rounded up etc) and this article pushed me into full blown depression almost assuring that the future is very, very grim indeed on the internal security front.

Many people realised this 15 years ago. Start building and suporting the national security groups

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 02 Sep 2012 21:37

brihaspati wrote:the theology provides freedom from sense of guilt which is otherwise there in almost all other religions


Crux of the issue Brihaspatiji, thats where they are missing the moral compass wrt to non-muslims

Nakul saab, arsenic contamination is usually treated at the source of the water, not on the distribution side, we should try and address both ends, what gets into the information pipes leading into the country, and what comes out to the local mohalla

when you say an obscure geek uploads content you are totally missing the propaganda machineries with vested interests that drive them

SSridharji, when does first amendment starts allows hate speech or exaggeration/unsubstantiated facts? on an individual basis it maybe ok, but when masses are involved who take it out on society it can be construed as hate speech, why tie ourselves in knots?

I am aware of the other side as well where hounding of anti corruption activists is happening in the name of upholding law, ultimately we are scamming ourselves and the Judicial system is nowhere to be seen.
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just a clarfication, IM 101 means Indian Mujahideen 101 and not Indian Muslim

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nakul » 02 Sep 2012 21:50

vasu raya wrote:[

Nakul saab, arsenic contamination is usually treated at the source of the water, not on the distribution side, we should try and address both ends, what gets into the information pipes leading into the country, and what comes out to the local mohalla

when you say an obscure geek uploads content you are totally missing the propaganda machineries with vested interests that drive them


It is the source that needs to be eliminated but in this case the source is not the geek. It is the theology of Islam. The rest are mere nodes propogating it. We don't need to ignore the nodes in our country while blaming those beyond our control. The fact is that these pictures were floating well before the Assam riots. Pakistanis were blaring loudly about injustice to their brethren in Burma. The exodus was orchestrated well after Assam riots began.

If the Congress govt is to be believed the social networking sites did not suddenly pop these pictures nor do they send SMSes. In the Mumbai case, the police intelligence have clearly identified the cause to be SMSes sent by Indians to Muslims before Friday prayers and the mullahs who called on the pious to defend their brothers. When this spread to other cities, they found it politically convenient to blame Pakistan. I don't believe for a second that the terror threats in other cities were orchestrated in a different way.

The photoshop can be carried out by any geek anywhere. Should we live in an atmosphere where a single sign of Muslims in strife cause massive unrest? How is this different from Pakistan where a single mullah's shout is enough to cause rabid jehadis to murder, pillage & loot?

The scene has demonstrated that the ISI can cause massive civil unrest just by channeling a few images. It is not the ISI (known) that presents a greater threat, it is their foot soldiers (unknown) in India that we have to worry about.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby brihaspati » 03 Sep 2012 00:29

What could have made the difference - was that if Indian Muslims came out to violently protest not only what happened to Muslim victims in Assam - but also to non-Muslim victims in Assam. Nothing ever comes out in protest from the entire spectrum of "progressive/secular/nationalist Indian Muslim" to the fanatical mullah - when its a matter of non-Muslim lives. No solidarity ever expressed for the Hindus or Sikhs murdered in Pakiland, or Hindus and Buddhists murdered in Myanmar, - but only "Muslim lives" are lamented and fought for in the streets or on the media by "liberal" voices of the "Muslim".

One gets the impression - that non-Muslim lives are not of any value - even to the articulate Indian Muslim voice. Where have I read a single sentence, a single speech reported in the media of any "Muslim" voice strongly condemning the violence on non-Muslim victims of the "troubles" in Assam? Never heard of any "riots" ever being fought protesting loss-of non-Muslim lives by the Muslims.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby brihaspati » 03 Sep 2012 00:41

There might be a 100 well-intentioned anti-violence mind lying quietly, but when the one violent mind can act out its fantasy with no protest or obstruction from the silent 100 - one can never verify the reality of any anti-violence mentality. The one successfully violent mind effectively encompasses the entire impact in reality of the 101 minds.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 03 Sep 2012 00:46

Ok Nakul saab, foreign hand or not a vulnerability was exposed and lets see the issue as a series of events than just Azad maidan violence And whats stopping the censoring of uploaded content within the country based on zip codes using geo location software? one of the requirements of the content uploaded from India into foreign websites is, it must be mirrored in India

Anyways, here is a news report,

http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-news/Bangalore/B-lore-Qaeda-s-online-content-inspired-youths-held/Article1-923346.aspx

Data aside, 26/11 got us SWAT teams and NSG centers, would the Azad violence wake up the metro police forces on controlling rioting mobs in the scale of 50,000 people? there was a police official lamenting about non-availability of formula on how many police are needed based on crowd size, large scale riot control exercises will help them figure out.

As a second step in these excercises, I will go with Nihat's number of 1 to 1.5 lacs of rioters rampaging across the nation and lets see pan India police coordination and intelligence information networks similar to how the military war games

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Prem » 03 Sep 2012 00:53

brihaspati wrote:What could have made the difference - was that if Indian Muslims came out to violently protest not only what happened to Muslim victims in Assam - but also to non-Muslim victims in Assam. Nothing ever comes out in protest from the entire spectrum of "progressive/secular/nationalist Indian Muslim" to the fanatical mullah - when its a matter of non-Muslim lives. orted in the media of any "Muslim" voice strongly condemning the violence on non-Muslim victims of the "troubles" in Assam? Never heard of any "riots" ever being fought protesting loss-of non-Muslim lives by the Muslims.


Apology for crudeness, but a say in up North ,There is better chance of catching fish in one' pee than expecting the above from "them".

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nakul » 03 Sep 2012 01:08

Please don't call me saab. I'venot earned it.

The issue is quite straight forward. The internet is a wild west. Jihadi propoganda has been around since the pre 9/11 days. Post 9/11, different sections of the world has reacted to it in different ways. We can see folks in Pakistan & Afghanistan take it up quite literally and believe all CTs.

In places like Germany & Spain, you have the few isolated ghazi going into his cellar and trying to get his 72.

In India, we have an environment where jihadis are passively supported by the community either by dissuading police citing communal harmony or by spreading lies about Islam being in danger when its quite clear that it is the 2nd most popular religion.

This environment is like a box of kerosene just waiting for its spark. Luckily, we have a low muslim population which does make it controllable. However, the state is not willing to lift a figer to control it before hand. While mullahs should have been warned beforehand to stop spouting hate speech on Friday prayers, we have the state apparatus blaming Pakistan for their mishandling.

The Saudis & Pakis will continue to spread jihadi teachings. We can't block each & every site for its nearly impossible. However, we can create an atmosphere where muslims are expected to act as Indians first. To give an example, FBI uses its force to keep an eye on the community around mosques and anyone suspected to be leaning towards jehadi propoganda is detained.

In India, we have Congress legitimizing terrorists by using Osama bin Laden's photos to gain votes in Bihar while teaming up with pro jehadi parties in Kerala for elections. The case of Owaisi threatening a third wave of radicalization would be familiar. A similar Muslim leader tore apart the fabric of the country in 1947. Jinnah was just one man. It was the thousands of muslims that were his soldiers terrorizing hindus.

Today, we have an ISI safely ensconed in Pakistan. But its foot soldiers drove the NE people to their homes. When we have a large population sympathetic to ISI's objectives, we are facing a problem of a more serious nature. Note how Pakistan was quickly blamed for 26/11 but its assets in India were never revealed to us. Only the Bangalore police seems to be taking some action. Apart from 1 - 2 arrests, Mumbai, Pune & Hyderabad police is letting them free.

While Mumbai police waited for Eid to catch the criminals, Hyderabad has an MLA who openly calls for radicalization. We can't stop the ISI from creating a spark if we continue to carry tins full of kerosene with us.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 03 Sep 2012 01:19

nakul wrote:We can't block each & every site for its nearly impossible.


while nodding in agreement with your post, handling the online hate propaganda is not just our problem alone, many nations have same issues

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Anindya » 03 Sep 2012 03:01

A similar Muslim leader tore apart the fabric of the country in 1947. Jinnah was just one man. It was the thousands of muslims that were his soldiers terrorizing hindus.


The problem is not just the radicalized support, but the inherent support from the rest of the community leaders for this kind of behavior.

Its not just folks like Owaisi, but also look at most of the major columnists from the community. Asghar Engineer, who is actually a closet Islamist hiding in the garb of an secularit, declared that the only solution was to unilaterally disarm the Bodos. Unfortunately, this is a well known Muslim league trick used to disarm the Hindus and Sikhs, and then killing them.

Abdi, known more for the circumstances of the dropped rape charges against him, wrote a vicious hate screed against Bodos (all Bodos). Not a word about the ethnic cleansing that Bangladeshis inherently display within their society.

The NCM acted as if it were beholden to the Bangladeshi Muslims and not us Indians at all.

The support for internal terrorism and rioters is worrisome and is something that many politicians will end up pandering to, for for purposes of vote bank politics.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby ramana » 03 Sep 2012 04:27

nakul et al, Nice analysis. How do you account for the Indian Railway trains being so much on time to provide evacuation? In three cities: Blore, Chennai, Hyderabad!

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby RamaY » 03 Sep 2012 04:29

And it is not that difficult to create Internet traffic from required source region if one has basic hackin skills

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby vasu raya » 03 Sep 2012 06:44

^^^

The proposal was instead of blanket bans, GoI should have fine tuned control on content lest we are bandied with China on media control, regarding geo-location,

1) within country GoI has total control over ISPs, even data connections over mobile phones can be traced, sat phones are controlled, so end user computer doesn't matter as well as any spoofing data they generate

2) outside the country, at least with the popular websites you can put the onus of tracking content sourcing locations on them

Just expand the mandate of cyber security, its not an intractable problem

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sum » 03 Sep 2012 08:11

How long before these border officials are transferred for their communal behaviour?

60 illegal migrants pushed back while trying to enter Manipur

At least 60 illegal migrant workers, who were trying to enter Manipur through Jiribam border check post at Manipur-Assam border, about 222 km west of here, were pushed back by state police, official sources said today.

Police personnel, led by officer incharge of Jiribam police station, Y Muhindro and foreigner police post officer incharge Tajudin Khan, halted several workers at Jiribam check post yesterday and verified their documents, the sources said.

Sixty workers, who could not speak Manipuri or any tribal dialect and appeared to be Bangladeshi nationals with no valid documents, were found at the other side of the check post in Assam, the sources said, adding they were not allowed to enter Manipur.

Official sources said the state government had already intimated the police about detection of 43 illegal migrants from Bangladesh and Myanmar on August 30 last during combing operations in Imphal east and Thoubal districts of Manipur.

Twenty four migrant Bangladeshis were found at Golapati Hatta area in Imphal east district during search operation, while 19 Myanmarese nationals were found at Lilong area in Thoubal district, sources said.

Earlier, official sources had said the 19 Myanmarese migrants were also from Bangladesh but they later clarified that they were from Arakan areas of Myanmar bordering Bangladesh.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Victor » 03 Sep 2012 08:14

brihaspati wrote: only "Muslim lives" are lamented and fought for.

But only in India, not in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen or Syria where hundreds of Muslims are killed daily by fellow Muslims simply for being a different type of Muslim.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Anindya » 03 Sep 2012 09:07

Hubli became terror hotbed in last decade

The arrests of five people on Wednesday with suspected links to Lashkar-e-Taiba and HuJI, indicate how deep-rooted the terror menace is in the commercial capital of North Karnataka.

Footprints of terror surfaced first in July 2000 when a bomb blast was reported at a church on Gadag Road. A special court in Bangalore convicted 23 activists of Hyderabad-based banned outfit Deendar Anjuman for their involvement in the serial blasts that rocked churches, including the Hubli one in 2008. This was also the first time that those accused of terror activities in the state had been convicted.

Hubli earned the dubious tag of being the terror hotbed in 2008, when police arrested Mohamed Ghouse, 23, alias Riazuddin Naser from Hyderabad, the South India commander of LeT. Ghouse had befriended Asadullah Abubakar, a final-year student of ayurvedic medicine at Hubli, and the two later befriended Mohamed Asif, a final-year medical student of KIMS, Hubli, before they were arrested.

During interrogation, they said they frequently held meetings and trained sympathizers at a nearby forest. The confessions indicated that they had made Hubli the main centre for their operations in Karnataka.

According to sources, Hubli is a safe hideout for these elements because it's a central point for three states - Maharashtra and Goa on the west, Andhra Pradesh in the east - and hence it is easier to get in and out of the city. Another factor that has worked well with terrorists is the large forest cover that surrounds Hubli.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby kshatriya » 03 Sep 2012 10:55

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 231042.cms

East Delhi violence under control

NEW DELHI: The situation in east Delhi's Mayur Vihar, where one person was killed and many people were injured following a mob that went on a rampage after two men on a two-wheeler were injured when police tried to forcibly stop them, is under control, police said on Monday.

The situation is under control, said a police officer.

Police are planning to detain some of the people responsible for the violence in Mayur Vihar phase-III and its adjoining Khoda colony area, situated in Ghaziabad.

We will detain the culprits soon, said the officer.

One person was killed and many people including 15 policemen were injured here on Sunday as police fired at a mob which went on a rampage after two men on a two-wheeler were injured when police tried to forcibly stop them.

The protesters set fire a police booth, a DTC bus and many other vehicles in Mayur Vihar phase-III, police and witnesses said.

While police refused to say if the man was killed in the police firing, residents insisted it was so.

Police said that the two-wheeler was stopped at the checkpoint as both riders were not wearing helmets.

They were drunk and fled when a traffic policeman tried to stop them. They also indulged in an argument with the policeman, said a police officer.

A witness, however, said when the vehicle did not stop at the check point, a traffic officer threw a stick at them, which hit them and making them fall on the road.

One of the two injured was identified by police as Kamruddin, in his 20s, who was in critical condition at Lal Bahadur Shastri hospital.

The police officer said a mob collected at the spot and started pelting stones at the police team. They also set a DTC bus, a mini truck, a car, three bikes and the police booth on fire.

Police said that they had to fire shots in the air and use tear gas to restrain the crowd.

Following the incident, around 20 companies (1,600 men) of Delhi Armed Police have been deployed in and around the Mayur Vihar area, across the Yamuna.

To avoid further tension, roads to the area have been blocked by police and pickets set up every 500 metres. Ambulances and fire tenders have been stationed for any emergency situation.

Further probe into the incident is on, added the officer.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Anindya » 03 Sep 2012 11:19

About a week ago, a man called Khokon Ghosh was beheaded in full public view in a local train in Murshidabad district. Any news of what happened here, from people who live in WB? This kind of public beheadings and murders are a bad sign.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Sachin » 03 Sep 2012 11:20

One more terror suspect arrested in Bangalore
Hailing from Nanded, he had gone into hiding in the city after the first set of arrests

The Central Crime Branch of the Bangalore police arrested one more person as part of its ongoing anti-terror investigation. With this, the number of arrests has gone up to 13.

Twenty-two-year-old Mohammed Akram — with aliases such as Khalid and Imran Khan — was allegedly arrested late on Saturday evening from the busy Majestic area, which is the city’s main transit point.

He was allegedly trying to flee the city.

The police claim to have recovered a foreign-made 7.65 mm pistol, 16 live rounds as well as other incriminating material from him. Mr. Akram allegedly told the police that he is from Nanded in Maharashtra (where the Maharashtra Anti-Terrorism Squad recently arrested four men).

Revealing these details at a press conference here on Sunday, Bangalore Police Commissioner B.G. Jyothi Prakash Mirji said Akram had managed to evade arrest so far and had gone into hiding after the first set of arrests where 11 men were taken into custody on charges of plotting to assassinate some politicians and journalists.

For the first time since the August 29 operation came to light, Mr. Mirji confirmed that those arrested by the Maharashtra ATS and those arrested by the Bangalore police were part of the same alleged terror module. However, he refused to comment on whether the Maharashtra ATS and the Bangalore CCB were working together.

Referring to articles in a section of the media, Mr. Mirji appealed to journalists to exercise restraint and caution in reportage.

He said the case was an extremely serious one but it “should not be used to incite communal sentiments.”


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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sum » 03 Sep 2012 12:04

They were drunk and fled when a traffic policeman tried to stop them. They also indulged in an argument with the policeman, said a police officer.

A witness, however, said when the vehicle did not stop at the check point, a traffic officer threw a stick at them, which hit them and making them fall on the road.

One of the two injured was identified by police as Kamruddin, in his 20s, who was in critical condition at Lal Bahadur Shastri hospital.

The police officer said a mob collected at the spot and started pelting stones at the police team. They also set a DTC bus, a mini truck, a car, three bikes and the police booth on fire.

Somehow when no names were taken and large scale rioting against police was mentioned, suspected a "certain minority" had to crop up somewhere.

Else every DDM worth his salt would have been quating the caste/sub-caste/home address of the accused bikers and the rioters.


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