Bharat Rakshak Forum Announcement

Hello Everyone,

A warm welcome back to the Bharat Rakshak Forum.

Important Notice: Due to a corruption in the BR forum database we regret to announce that data records relating to some of our registered users have been lost. We estimate approx. 500 user details are deleted.

To ease the process of recreating the user IDs we request members that have previously posted on the BR forums to recognise and identify their posts, once the posts are identified please contact the BRF moderator team by emailing BRF Mod Team with your post details.

The mod team will be able to update your username, email etc. so that the user history can be maintained.

Unfortunately for members that have never posted or have had all their posts deleted i.e. users that have 0 posts, we will be unable to recreate your account hence we request that you re-register again.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused and thank you for your understanding.

Regards,
Seetal

India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Picklu
BRFite
Posts: 1585
Joined: 25 Feb 2004 12:31

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Picklu » 18 Jun 2016 22:52

1. 'cause we are dharmik
More importantly,
2. breaking rules need both buyer and seller to be on the same page. No buyer within NSG will buy from us voiding all warranty jeopardizing all finance if we are outside and our items are not NSG certified

Gagan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9893
Joined: 16 Apr 2008 22:25

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Gagan » 19 Jun 2016 05:02

We aren't capitalist enough or mercantile enough to market out hard work well to make money for ourselves.
Hopefully that will be a shortcoming that will be fixed in the new era

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 18577
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Austin » 19 Jun 2016 07:13

Russian President Vladimir Putin reveals to India Today he is positive of finding a solution to India's entry into NSG and has been in touch with China about it

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/worl ... 95321.html


member_29350
BRFite
Posts: 119
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby member_29350 » 20 Jun 2016 06:41

http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/t ... 748864.ece

Lot of scare mongering in it; the only thing one can agree is the high cost of power much like Enron. other than that, it's a wash

There are several disturbing aspects to this agreement that deserve close public scrutiny. These include the arbitrary use of executive authority in selecting Westinghouse as a supplier, the international legal commitment made by the government to indemnify Westinghouse in the event of an accident, and the high expected cost of electricity from these reactors.


Notice he doesn't mention China though it's not like we have to follow the Chinese but still honesty requires who does and who doesn't want AP1000

In April, Toshiba, which acquired Westinghouse in 2006, announced a $2.3 billion write-down in its value, largely because of persistent concerns about the economic viability of Westinghouse’s AP1000 design. Of more than a dozen orders that Westinghouse expected from within the U.S. a decade ago, only four have materialised. Just last month, a utility called Florida Power and Light postponed its plans for two AP1000 reactors by at least four years. And in February, the Tennessee Valley Authority, a U.S. government company, cancelled its plans for two AP1000 reactors explaining that this was “the fiscally responsible action”.

Anujan
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6644
Joined: 27 May 2007 03:55

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Anujan » 20 Jun 2016 09:18

SSridhar wrote:

There are a few comments rebutting that author and I post one of them here:
I disagree with the author. He says that NSG membership does not materially alter our nuclear power generation as we have the waiver and foreign companies are willing to set up in India. This is true but we must remember that it is just a one-time waiver and what future holds we cannot predict now and therefore it is better to be inside NSG as a full member. While we need to quickly & massively expand nuclear power generation, NSG membership is also needed simultaneously. It is a political instrument for India which will de-facto establish us as a nuke power, something denied to us de-jure by NPT. After all, NSG was created solely to target us! As we take its our legitimate place in the high table among nations, these positions matter. Pakistan is no longer in our larger scheme of things. It is China and it knows it and therefore wants to bog us down within the quagmire of Indian subcontinent by equating with Pakistan. We cannot be like Hanuman oblivious to our own strength.


The second issue with NSG membership is that most high tech becomes commercially viable only if it is exported (and the export has high markups which in turn fuels more R&D). This is especially true in high tech and defence. The examples are numerous. For example, we subsidized Jaguars, Sukhois, Tanks from Russia and even MBB tried out their new designs on our Dhruv.

To bring the cost of N-power down, we need to be more than just consumers. Westinghouse reactors for example need to be manufactured in India, with joint development, ownership of IP and export contracts. Yes, the waiver gives us the ability to buy stuff, but we need to think beyond and need to make and export stuff.

Secondly, I think it is a net positive if Pakistan joins NSG. So far, they have not faced consequences (and indeed they had no incentive) to behave well. If joining NSG holds them to a higher standard of non-proliferation, it squeezes them strategically (no free nukes to Saudia for example, their mischief potential for nuke cooperation with Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Burma etc get gets stymied). As if now, they are happily proliferating, happily building more nukes. Let them get into NSG and show everyone what a farce this whole non-proliferation regime is.

Every outcome is favorable for India, if India gets into NSG. If NSG gets strengthened, gets serious and excludes Pakistan, its a win. If NSG gets demolished because Pakistan gets in and makes a mockery of international non-proliferation regime, that is a win too.

Aditya_V
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8730
Joined: 05 Apr 2006 16:25

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Aditya_V » 20 Jun 2016 09:43

Anujan wrote:


Secondly, I think it is a net positive if Pakistan joins NSG. So far, they have not faced consequences (and indeed they had no incentive) to behave well. If joining NSG holds them to a higher standard of non-proliferation, it squeezes them strategically (no free nukes to Saudia for example, their mischief potential for nuke cooperation with Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Burma etc get gets stymied). As if now, they are happily proliferating, happily building more nukes. Let them get into NSG and show everyone what a farce this whole non-proliferation regime is.



Tell me one instance where Pakistan has played by the rules or has been punished for breaking the rules, has China ever been punished for literally pissing on NSG, NPT etc.... Its better Pakis are out for H&D, they never follow rules and are never punished for Breaking rules.

By all logic for the Genocides from 1947, 71 and continuing today thier Miltary and bureaucrats should have been executed for crimes against humanity.

Every outcome is favorable for India, if India gets into NSG. If NSG gets strengthened, gets serious and excludes Pakistan, its a win. If NSG gets demolished because Pakistan gets in and makes a mockery of international non-proliferation regime, that is a win too.


I think you are just pulling our leg and trying to get us worked up with these lines.

Only win for us if we exponentially increase our capabilities that no one should be ignoring our sensitivities.

srin
BRFite
Posts: 1209
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:13

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby srin » 20 Jun 2016 11:04

A question - what's the relative advantage of reserving sites for specific countries/companies (like Jaitapur for Areva) instead of auctioning sites for nuclear parks with competing bidders ? For solar parks, the auctioning system has resulted in good price discovery, so wondering what prevents us from doing that for nuclear sites too ?

Anujan
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6644
Joined: 27 May 2007 03:55

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Anujan » 20 Jun 2016 12:23

As far as official position is concerned, India should not have any objections to any other countries joining NSG provided they have impeccable non-proliferation credentials. We are not competing with anyone here, certainly not Pakistan.

Whats the disadvantage Pakis have in not being part of NSG? China already supplies them with reactors. They already have the bomb. They havent signed FMCT or CTBT. The only stick everyone can beat them with is to deny western reactors (which they cannot afford to buy or interested in buying anyway).

If they are part of NSG and still continue their nuclear shenanigans, one of two things will happen: Either Pakis face consequences for that or NSG loses all its credibility and gets exposed as the sham cartel that it is.

Our objectives of joining NSG and Pakistan's objectives of joining NSG are totally different. We have requirement for nuclear power, a serious program to build and operate nuke reactors and an industrial base to produce nuke components and conduct nuclear research. Pakis just want equal==equal. India dropping its objection to Pakis joining NSG now forces China's hands, they can now gravely insist that Pakistan's application be considered on merit (have they separated civil/mil facilities with inspections for civil reactors? Have they provided full accountability for each and every one AQ Khan supplied materials to? there is quite some distance to cover there).

Anujan
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6644
Joined: 27 May 2007 03:55

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Anujan » 20 Jun 2016 12:24

srin wrote:A question - what's the relative advantage of reserving sites for specific countries/companies (like Jaitapur for Areva) instead of auctioning sites for nuclear parks with competing bidders ? For solar parks, the auctioning system has resulted in good price discovery, so wondering what prevents us from doing that for nuclear sites too ?


At some level, every international agreement is about money. We have to give baksheesh to the gatekeepers.

Anujan
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6644
Joined: 27 May 2007 03:55

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Anujan » 20 Jun 2016 12:27

Aditya_V wrote:I think you are just pulling our leg and trying to get us worked up with these lines.

Only win for us if we exponentially increase our capabilities that no one should be ignoring our sensitivities.


I honestly am not pulling anyone's legs. Where is the sensitivity in this? They already have nukes. They already have aircraft-based delivery and missile based delivery. They have tactical nukes. They are arming ships with nukes (probably to strike our ports or carrier battle groups, US had a "sanction" against them for modifying anti ship missiles). They are probably going to rent or buy a nuke sub from China. How does Pakis getting into NSG make it worse?

Think about it this way, if India has a chance to supply Pakistan with ICBMs and help them with integrating nuke warheads to it, India should do it. For free.

Pakis are already a headache to India. We should encourage them to become a headache to the world.

member_29172
BRFite
Posts: 375
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby member_29172 » 20 Jun 2016 22:06

Anujan, your viewpoint is very misguided. NSG and MCTR is for responsible countries. Existence of a basketcase like china is already a travesty, inclusion of pakistan, even more so. pukistan has access to reactors and nuke tech, agreed, but NSG would give a greater and easier access to piggistan to all that sweet sweet uranium spread across the world. Those nukes are specifically pointed at us and given the condition of those ****** and their joke of a country, the larger the supply of nukes and uranium, the greater the chance of it falling into the hands of local terrorist gangs.

Think a little before passing these off easily. India has pretty much given easy access to these two basketcases while completely ignoring the national interests in various international organisations and forums, its about time that practice is discontinued.

India should rightfully veto and block basketcases like china and piggistan from entering organisations that can be potentially dangerous to the civillians of India and the world at large.

In the end, neither china, nor pakistan is run by their respective citizens. Its run by egomaniac cartoons sitting at the top who are more worried about their H&D than about their own people. The hold of the deepstate and national religion (islam and communism) is quite strong in both the countries.

kit
BRFite
Posts: 1944
Joined: 13 Jul 2006 18:16

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby kit » 20 Jun 2016 22:26

Anujan wrote:
Aditya_V wrote:I think you are just pulling our leg and trying to get us worked up with these lines.

Only win for us if we exponentially increase our capabilities that no one should be ignoring our sensitivities.


I honestly am not pulling anyone's legs. Where is the sensitivity in this? They already have nukes. They already have aircraft-based delivery and missile based delivery. They have tactical nukes. They are arming ships with nukes (probably to strike our ports or carrier battle groups, US had a "sanction" against them for modifying anti ship missiles). They are probably going to rent or buy a nuke sub from China. How does Pakis getting into NSG make it worse?

Think about it this way, if India has a chance to supply Pakistan with ICBMs and help them with integrating nuke warheads to it, India should do it. For free.

Pakis are already a headache to India. We should encourage them to become a headache to the world.



this is a version of Nehru s mentality when he gave away the NSG status to china as well as a permanent seat in UNSC

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46104
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 21 Jun 2016 03:29

NaMo to meet XI Jinping at Tashkent on sidelines of SCO meet.

NSG meet is later in Seoul.

In end its India and China to resolve.
Others will pretend to make pleas etc.

chanakyaa
BRFite
Posts: 970
Joined: 18 Sep 2009 00:09
Location: Hiding in Karakoram

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chanakyaa » 23 Jun 2016 05:37

WTF with this misinformation on Al-retard-jaljeera??

India's embarrassing North Korean connection
....
On Monday, the NSG begins a week-long meeting in Seoul, South Korea, to decide on the membership of both India and Pakistan.
...

Anujan
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6644
Joined: 27 May 2007 03:55

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Anujan » 23 Jun 2016 07:59

That is a hatchet job. India and NoKo are not allies. In fact, if Noko were nearby, they'd be enemies.

Noko transferred their ding-dongs to Pakistan. AQ Khan, in return, transferred nuke technology to NoKo. (Without state knowledge they claim, using military C130, which surprisingly, nobody asked why it was flying to NoKo).

On top of that Korean scientists were present in the Chagai hills test and there are strong indications that NoKo shared plutonium designs with Pakistan (tested in NoKo) and Pakis are building their plutonium stockpile now. There are also strong indications that Paki scientists are involved in TN tests in NoKo (recall that Pakis only tested a U bum.). As recently as 1 year back, 2 NoKo diplomats in Tehran made repeated trips to Pakistan, and Pakistan "re-exported" nuke materials from China to NoKo

Given all these, it takes a special kind of stupid to think India and NoKo are allies. Especially when we have commercial and defense tie ups with SoKo and Japan (two countries directly threatened by NoKo).

habal
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5880
Joined: 24 Dec 2009 18:46

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby habal » 23 Jun 2016 14:01

that is ISI propaganda piece and everyone is faithfully reproducing it repeatedly. Kindly ignore such hit jobs and it wilk die it's own death.

Screambowl
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 96
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Screambowl » 23 Jun 2016 14:23

habal wrote:that is ISI propaganda piece and everyone is faithfully reproducing it repeatedly. Kindly ignore such hit jobs and it wilk die it's own death.


Correct!
ISI while stealing and assembling nuclear tech. diverted the attention towards Chinese nuclear program by giving some fissile material to Chinese, intentionally to avoid any detection of their activities by the west.


I remember since the day India tested Agni last months, Pakistan started playing it's propaganda game of destabilisation in Indian subcontinent. That was actually not because of Agni test, but they were trying to create hurdles for India's NSG ambition. Now the NoKo. Its ISI's Infowar.

Screambowl
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 96
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Screambowl » 23 Jun 2016 16:18

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/a ... 764078.ece
NATIONAL

SEOUL, June 23, 2016
Updated: June 23, 2016 17:22 IST
NSG to hold unprecedented special session to discuss India's membership

SSridhar
Forum Moderator
Posts: 20644
Joined: 05 May 2001 11:31
Location: Chennai

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby SSridhar » 23 Jun 2016 16:36

That im itself is a blow to China because it constantly claimed India was not on the agenda. But, China would claim that it was not a 'regular' but a 'special' session and its claim was correct ! China is repeatedly making a fool of itself.

Manish_Sharma
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3337
Joined: 07 Sep 2009 16:17

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Manish_Sharma » 23 Jun 2016 17:50

Last night shyam saran and another arun shourie LOOK ALIKE retired diplomats were criticizing NaMo govt. :

a.) saran ~ "The govt should push it and its ok, but not push so much that it becomes make or break. Gradually we will get there it takes time.

b.) Second diplomat ~ We never allowed PM to be directly exposed to such intense lobbying like the govt. is doing now; if it fails it will be big blow to country's image.

Supratik
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4437
Joined: 09 Nov 2005 10:21
Location: USA

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Supratik » 23 Jun 2016 17:55

They are Congress era relics. Used to laid-back chalta hai. Will have egg on their face if India makes it to NSG after MTCR.

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 00:15

Chinese stooges: Brazil, NZ, Austria, Ireland and Turkey are said to be obstructing India's entry on the basis of signing NPT.

IMVHO I did expect NZ here. It is playing second fiddle to Aus. and the chinese influence on Aus is immense. So NZ is the trojan here. Same with Turkey., a chinese trojan and ummah birader.

But why Brazil, Austria and Ireland? Will they change stance at last minute for isolating China/Turkey?

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 00:16

Either way - China CPC stands nanga. Completely.

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 00:18

Picklu wrote:While importing is ok with waiver and every seller will compete for hard cash, exporting is not possible without full membership of NSG.

That is where the game is and we are being myopic pooh-poohing ...

The whole strategy of China is to delay our entry while it masters the manufacturing of low level high volume components and get a strong foot hold in the nuclear market ahead of us.


That is why India needs to create its own marketplace. NCG.

JE Menon
Forum Moderator
Posts: 6393
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby JE Menon » 24 Jun 2016 00:20

>>1. 'cause we are dharmik

We weren't when we tested...

>>More importantly,
2. breaking rules need both buyer and seller to be on the same page. No buyer within NSG will buy from us voiding all warranty jeopardizing all finance if we are outside and our items are not NSG certified

What about non NSG states?

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 02:42

^^^ Non NSG states will be more than happy to deal with us. There are several and world is a big place., look at my list on the NCG thread. Several Africa/LatAm countries are there., which are not in NSG currently.

Those countries will be more than happy to join the NCG and some of them will be more than happy for Indians to come and start 'manufacturing' (see Namibia).

India is like a baal-Hanuman with no knowledge of its own strength!

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 02:44

Classic Modi play., turns out China is the last holdout. Even Brazil turned around and started supporting and NZ was never in picture. Turkey stated that it will support both India and Bakis candidature as well - except that Bakis were not on table.

gakakkad
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4351
Joined: 24 May 2011 08:16

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby gakakkad » 24 Jun 2016 05:01

Chinese stooges: Brazil, NZ, Austria, Ireland and Turkey are said to be obstructing India's entry on the basis of signing NPT. IMVHO I did expect NZ here. It is playing second fiddle to Aus. and the chinese influence on Aus is immense. So NZ is the trojan here. Same with Turkey., a chinese trojan and ummah birader.


btw austria!=australia...austria happens to be among the most racist countries in existence..hitler was in fact an austrian..they don't even give token sh!t about political correctness...post ww2 people were so busy defanging the germans that forgot about Österreich... they even have contempt towards Hungarians...its funny how such insignificant little country dares to bark against an incipient superpower..

Cosmo_R
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3147
Joined: 24 Apr 2010 01:24

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Cosmo_R » 24 Jun 2016 05:29

disha wrote:Classic Modi play., turns out China is the last holdout. Even Brazil turned around and started supporting and NZ was never in picture. Turkey stated that it will support both India and Bakis candidature as well - except that Bakis were not on table.


It's about cornering the dragon India/US tag team. That was the diplomatic game plan. :)

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5681
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby disha » 24 Jun 2016 06:12

gakakkad wrote:
Chinese stooges: Brazil, NZ, Austria, Ireland and Turkey are said to be obstructing India's entry on the basis of signing NPT. IMVHO I did expect NZ here. It is playing second fiddle to Aus. and the chinese influence on Aus is immense. So NZ is the trojan here. Same with Turkey., a chinese trojan and ummah birader.


btw austria!=australia...austria happens to be among the most racist countries in existence..hitler was in fact an austrian..they don't even give token sh!t about political correctness...post ww2 people were so busy defanging the germans that forgot about Österreich... they even have contempt towards Hungarians...its funny how such insignificant little country dares to bark against an incipient superpower..


Without the austro-hungarian empire as a chip on the soldiers., you can pretty much say the same about Australians :-).

And I do always feel that all Australian PMs are manchurian candidates! Just look at K. Rudd.

No - I did NOT confuse between Austria and Australia. I just was speculating on NZ. Why is NZ amping up but Aussies are quiet on the nookular front?

Screambowl
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 96
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Screambowl » 24 Jun 2016 08:23

disha wrote:Chinese stooges: Brazil, NZ, Austria, Ireland and Turkey are said to be obstructing India's entry on the basis of signing NPT.

IMVHO I did expect NZ here. It is playing second fiddle to Aus. and the chinese influence on Aus is immense. So NZ is the trojan here. Same with Turkey., a chinese trojan and ummah birader.

But why Brazil, Austria and Ireland? Will they change stance at last minute for isolating China/Turkey?


Inclusion of Brazil to me looks like misinformation.
Another link says this : http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... sjTOI.html
Contrary to initial reports, Brazil and South Africa were strong backers of India’s membership.

habal
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5880
Joined: 24 Dec 2009 18:46

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby habal » 24 Jun 2016 08:45

turkey is not chinese trojan, turks are very anti-china because they consider the uighurs as eastern turkistan. turks are munna birader. turkey is also a USA munna through and tbrough. If unkil asks them to stand, they stand .. if unkil asks them to unzip they drop their pants ...

srin
BRFite
Posts: 1209
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:13

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby srin » 25 Jun 2016 20:08

Other than supply of uranium, do we still need to master reprocessing technologies ? Is that the barrier to the three stage nuclear power ?

shyamoo
BRFite
Posts: 483
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby shyamoo » 25 Jun 2016 23:47

I'm not sure where we stand with regards to MSR ( molten salt reactors ). They are more efficient.

Once we have sufficient reserves of U-233, we can build the 3rd generation reactors in earnest. Then we can tell everyone to kiss our musharaff.

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8806
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arun » 21 Aug 2016 14:19

X Posted from the “Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)” thread.

I hope that this PR Chinese foot dragging on the issue of India’s membership of the NSG does not stay our hand if PR China’s flouting of the South China Sea arbitral award comes up at the early September G20 summit at Hangzhou, :

Question: Foreign Minister of China was here. NSG issue was raised during the meeting. Does India feel that it has made any progress in bringing China around to its view on this issue?

Official Spokesperson, Shri Vikas Swarup: As I had already mentioned after the meeting that H.E. Mr. Wang Yi had with the External Affairs Minister, the NSG issue was discussed in considerable detail by the two sides.

We once again underlined the importance that we attach to India’s membership in light of our clean energy requirements which were reinforced through the INDC’s in COP21. The Chinese side explained their perspective, but at the end both sides agreed that we must continue discussions so that we can narrow down the areas of divergence. And in this context, the head of Disarmament Affairs of the Chinese Ministry of Foreign Affairs, who was their lead negotiator in Seoul at the time of the NSG Plenary, would be visiting India to meet our Joint Secretary (Disarmament and International Security Affairs) Mr. Amandeep Gill. And we look forward to those discussions and to reaching better understanding with China on this very important issue.


From here:

Transcript of Weekly Media Briefing by Official Spokesperson (August 18, 2016)

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8806
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arun » 15 Sep 2016 10:14

X Posted from “Managing Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)” thread.

Official statements put out by our Ministry of External Affairs and Foreign Ministry of PR China regards meeting on India joining Nuclear Supply Group (NSG). PR Chinese procedural foot dragging evident via expedient of claiming that NSG must look at issue of membership of Non-Signatories to the NPT rather than membership of India:

Visit of Chinese delegation for talks on Disarmament and Non-Proliferation
September 13, 2016
A Chinese delegation led by Director General Wang Qun of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs visited India on 13 September 2016 for talks with an Indian delegation led by Amandeep Singh Gill, Joint Secretary (Disarmament & International Security) in the Ministry of External Affairs. The talk covered issues of mutual interest in the area of disarmament and non-proliferation.

As agreed by the EAM and the Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi in their meeting on 13 August, the two sides focused in particular on an issue of priority for India - membership of the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG).

The discussions were candid, pragmatic and substantive. The two sides agreed to meet for the next round on a mutually convenient date.

New Delhi
September 13, 2016

Clicky


China Supports the Notion of Two-Step Approach within the Nuclear Suppliers Group to Explore a Non-Discriminatory Formula Applicable to all Non-NPT States

2016/09/13

On September 13, 2016, China and India held a fresh round of arms control consultation in New Delhi. The consultation was co-chaired by Ambassador Wang Qun, Director-General of Arms Control Department of the Chinese Foreign Ministry, and Mr. Amandeep Singh Gill, Joint Secretary for Disarmament and International Security of the Indian Ministry of External Affairs. The two sides exchanged views on issues of common concern in this field.

On the question of non-NPT states' participation in the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), given that it is an issue of major concern to India, China, for its part, shared with India the recent developments as it sees within the Group in relation to the question. China also shared with India its principled positions and views on the above question. In the meantime, China listened to and had the inputs from India on this issue, and indicated that it will bring such views and inputs back to the Group for its consideration. China hopes the above inputs will help facilitate the relevant discussions within the Group.

The two sides realized that the question of the non-NPT states' participation is, in essence, a multilateral issue, and can only be subject to multilateral solution by the Group. Bilateral exchanges should serve to facilitate the relevant discussions within the Group.

China pointed out that the issue of the non-NPT states' participation in the NSG raises new questions for the Group under the new circumstances, and the crux of the above question is how to address the gap between the existing policies and practices of the non-NPT states and the existing international non-proliferation rules and norms based on the NPT as the cornerstone. China wishes to see early commencement of an open and transparent inter-governmental process to undertake, in accordance with the mandate adopted by the NSG at its Seoul Plenary meeting, a comprehensive and thorough study on the question of the non-NPT states' participation in the NSG in various aspects. China has hitherto not yet taken a position on any country-specific membership in the category of the non-NPT states. And China supports the notion of two-step approach within the Group to address the above question, i.e., at the first stage, to explore and reach agreement on a non-discriminatory formula applicable to all the non-NPT states, and to proceed to take up country-specific membership issues at the second stage. China, for its part, expressed its readiness to actively participate in the above process within the Group.

The two sides also had in-depth discussions on issues related to cyber security and the work of the Conference on Disarmament.

The two sides believed that the consultation is positive, candid, pragmatic and constructive. The two sides expressed the wish to intensify their exchanges on the relevant issues. They also agreed to hold the next round of consultation in China in due course, to be decided through diplomatic channels.

Clicky

SSridhar
Forum Moderator
Posts: 20644
Joined: 05 May 2001 11:31
Location: Chennai

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby SSridhar » 15 Sep 2016 13:13

arun wrote:
China Supports the Notion of Two-Step Approach within the Nuclear Suppliers Group to Explore a Non-Discriminatory Formula Applicable to all Non-NPT States
Clicky

That is a very unfortunate title. the two-step process is China's creation based on frivolous principles and non-existent membership conditions just in order to stall India's admission and/or pave the way for its protege, Pakistan's admission, something that is unthinkable otherwise. the title connotes as if the two-step approach was a unanimous decision taken at the plenary and somehow China is supporting it.

Amber G.
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5410
Joined: 17 Dec 2002 12:31
Location: Ohio, USA

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Amber G. » 16 Sep 2016 08:01

IMO, no matter what China does, twists or turns, try to play by "principals", it is loose loose for China and win-win for India (and its friends like US and others)... For all practical purposes India already benefits from all it can benefit as it can do business with all which it is interested doing business in - in current setup... China may turn and twist and some how save face but it has shown itself as Paki supporter out in open and lost quite a bit of its clout in the group. It could no longer stay in background and let someone else do it's dirty work to oppose India. IMO Modi played these cards very well to show that it is not the majority which wants to exclude India it is virtually China only.

Now let us see how long China supports terrorists like Hafiz out in open after learning this.

Kashi
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2163
Joined: 06 May 2011 13:53

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Kashi » 16 Sep 2016 09:24

Amber G. wrote:IMO, no matter what China does, twists or turns, try to play by "principals", it is loose loose for China and win-win for India (and its friends like US and others)...


A little premature to go that far don't you think?


Return to “Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: anishns, Falijee, Lalmohan, VTanMay, Vyas and 18 guests