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India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

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chetak
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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chetak » 24 Dec 2016 02:16

A panwala said that India's fast breeder program was purposely delayed by the US sitting on Germany to delay the coolant pumps for the liquid sodium.

After hectic efforts by the GOI, they have only recently been shipped to India.

Bagal Mein Churi, Muh Mein Ram by obama.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby SSridhar » 24 Dec 2016 04:03

I won't discount that. The reactor was supposed to have gone critical three years back and the Establishment has been unable to offer a credible explanation for the delay.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arshyam » 24 Dec 2016 08:29

If it should have gone critical three years before, the pumps should have been made available, installed, tested much earlier. Puts it in squarely UPA territory. Not looking to score a political point, but MMS was reported to have slow things down to get the nuke deal. Who knows how much 'reverse pressure' was put by GoI itself on BARC/IGCAR in the hope of a few carrots from the US?

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chetak » 24 Dec 2016 10:27

arshyam wrote:If it should have gone critical three years before, the pumps should have been made available, installed, tested much earlier. Puts it in squarely UPA territory. Not looking to score a political point, but MMS was reported to have slow things down to get the nuke deal. Who knows how much 'reverse pressure' was put by GoI itself on BARC/IGCAR in the hope of a few carrots from the US?



The fast breeder seems to be a particularly touchy subject with many countries who have all assumed an anti India stance on this project.

Lots of burnol being used by these folks.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby rgosain » 24 Dec 2016 14:21

The Stuxnet virus was found in a lot of Seimens sourced hardware and process control software and affected a number of Indian entities, therefore it would be advisable to reengineer the pumps and the control software before testing on the plant, in the same way that the GSLV had to be done. India would then be in a commercial position to sell systems that are stuxnet and trogan free.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arun » 25 Dec 2016 10:02

chetak wrote:A panwala said that India's fast breeder program was purposely delayed by the US sitting on Germany to delay the coolant pumps for the liquid sodium.

After hectic efforts by the GOI, they have only recently been shipped to India.

Bagal Mein Churi, Muh Mein Ram by obama.


Certainly possible but then again as I had pointed out on the previous page of this thread, our Nuclear Power Generation establishment is not exactly know to keep up with timelines going by the under construction reactor projects at Rawatbhata and Kakrapar:

arun wrote:Presuming not a case of tardy web site updating by NPCIL or my not keeping upto date on reactor commissioning, there seems to be some problems with the 700 MwE PHWR’s coming up at RAPS Rawatbhata and KAPS Kakrapar.

RAPS Unit 7 which was supposed to be commissioned in June 2016 followed by RAPS Unit 8 in December 2016, respectively show 3 of 11 and 2 of 11 milestones complete:

RAPS

KAPS Unit 3 which was supposed to be commissioned in June 2015 followed by KAPS Unit 4 in December 2015, more ominously carries the message ”Under Review” under the heading Expected Date of Commercial Operation:

KAPS

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Sanatanan » 26 Dec 2016 12:42

On 23 Dec 2016
chetak wrote:A panwala said that India's fast breeder program was purposely delayed by the US sitting on Germany to delay the coolant pumps for the liquid sodium.

After hectic efforts by the GOI, they have only recently been shipped to India. {emphasis mine}

Bagal Mein Churi, Muh Mein Ram by obama.


I believe both Primary and Secondary Liquid Sodium Cooling Pumps for PFBR were indigenously developed and manufactured. Both have been installed.

References:

1) Kirloskar - cascade Oct Dec 2013 (The year that was 2013 -)
http://www.kirloskarpumps.com/Control/Content/Pdf_220201495043AM2013.pdf

Kirloskar Brothers Limited (KBL) handed over its technological marvel to the first-of-its-kind 500MW Prototype Fast Breeder Reactor (PFBR) project in India underway by Bharatiya Nabhikiya
Vidyut Nigam Limited (BHAVINI).

Dr. Prabhat Kumar, Chairman & Managing Director, BHAVINI flagged off the “1st Primary Sodium Pumps (PSP)” from the 100 year old Kirloskarvadi plant of Kirloskar Brothers Limited. The three PSPs manufactured in Kirloskarvadi – one of India’s oldest industrial townships – weigh 135 tonnes and handle 516,000 litres of liquid sodium per minute at Kalpakkam Nuclear Plant. At 590
rpm (rotations per minute). These technological marvels will handle 400 °C to 550 °C working temperature of liquid sodium.

The PFBR setup has two types of Sodium Pumps. In the primary circuit, Primary Sodium Pump, installed in the main reactor transport the reactor core heat to secondary system. In the secondary circuit, Secondary Sodium Pumps feed the liquid Sodium back to reactor pool after taking away the heat through Heat Exchanger to light water, so as to convert it in to steam. These Secondary Sodium Pumps are installed outside the reactor vessel.

It is a privilege that India is the third country to enter the Second Stage of Nuclear Cycle and KBL is the only Indian company to develop such critical application pumps.

Speaking on the occasion Mr. Sanjay Kirloskar, Chairman & Managing Director, Kirloskar Brothers Limited said: “It gives me immense satisfaction to see Kirloskar Brothers at the forefront of technological advancements taking place in the Nuclear Power space. The vertical, single stage, top suction pumps are nothing but an alternate to imports. Today I can proudly say: we can.”


2) DESIGN, MANUFACTURING AND TESTING OF SECONDARY SODIUM PUMP
[url]https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263545160_DESIGN_MANUFACTURING_AND_TESTING_OF_SECONDARY_SODIUM_PUMP
[/url]

3) PROJECT STATUS OF PROTOTYPE FAST BREEDER REACTOR (PFBR) UNDER CONSTRUCTION AT KALPAKKAM, INDIA
https://www.iaea.org/NuclearPower/Downloadable/Meetings/2014/2014-05-19-05-23-TM-NPTD/india.5.pdf

Status seems to be as of May 2014
See pages 13 1nd 14 regarding inatallation of the pumps.

May be the panwala belongs to some Department of Disinformation, if such an entity indeed exists :)

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chetak » 27 Dec 2016 11:16

Sanatanan wrote:On 23 Dec 2016
chetak wrote:A panwala said that India's fast breeder program was purposely delayed by the US sitting on Germany to delay the coolant pumps for the liquid sodium.

After hectic efforts by the GOI, they have only recently been shipped to India. {emphasis mine}

Bagal Mein Churi, Muh Mein Ram by obama.


I believe both Primary and Secondary Liquid Sodium Cooling Pumps for PFBR were indigenously developed and manufactured. Both have been installed.

References:

1) Kirloskar - cascade Oct Dec 2013 (The year that was 2013 -)
http://www.kirloskarpumps.com/Control/Content/Pdf_220201495043AM2013.pdf

Kirloskar Brothers Limited (KBL) handed over its technological marvel to the first-of-its-kind 500MW Prototype Fast Breeder Reactor (PFBR) project in India underway by Bharatiya Nabhikiya
Vidyut Nigam Limited (BHAVINI).

Dr. Prabhat Kumar, Chairman & Managing Director, BHAVINI flagged off the “1st Primary Sodium Pumps (PSP)” from the 100 year old Kirloskarvadi plant of Kirloskar Brothers Limited. The three PSPs manufactured in Kirloskarvadi – one of India’s oldest industrial townships – weigh 135 tonnes and handle 516,000 litres of liquid sodium per minute at Kalpakkam Nuclear Plant. At 590
rpm (rotations per minute). These technological marvels will handle 400 °C to 550 °C working temperature of liquid sodium.

The PFBR setup has two types of Sodium Pumps. In the primary circuit, Primary Sodium Pump, installed in the main reactor transport the reactor core heat to secondary system. In the secondary circuit, Secondary Sodium Pumps feed the liquid Sodium back to reactor pool after taking away the heat through Heat Exchanger to light water, so as to convert it in to steam. These Secondary Sodium Pumps are installed outside the reactor vessel.

It is a privilege that India is the third country to enter the Second Stage of Nuclear Cycle and KBL is the only Indian company to develop such critical application pumps.

Speaking on the occasion Mr. Sanjay Kirloskar, Chairman & Managing Director, Kirloskar Brothers Limited said: “It gives me immense satisfaction to see Kirloskar Brothers at the forefront of technological advancements taking place in the Nuclear Power space. The vertical, single stage, top suction pumps are nothing but an alternate to imports. Today I can proudly say: we can.”


2) DESIGN, MANUFACTURING AND TESTING OF SECONDARY SODIUM PUMP
[url]https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263545160_DESIGN_MANUFACTURING_AND_TESTING_OF_SECONDARY_SODIUM_PUMP
[/url]

3) PROJECT STATUS OF PROTOTYPE FAST BREEDER REACTOR (PFBR) UNDER CONSTRUCTION AT KALPAKKAM, INDIA
https://www.iaea.org/NuclearPower/Downloadable/Meetings/2014/2014-05-19-05-23-TM-NPTD/india.5.pdf

Status seems to be as of May 2014
See pages 13 1nd 14 regarding inatallation of the pumps.

May be the panwala belongs to some Department of Disinformation, if such an entity indeed exists :)


I am verifying this.

It may take a bit of time but we are all working towards the same goal on this forum.

no need to be snide.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chetak » 27 Dec 2016 12:59

^^^^^^^
@Sanatanan

You were right. 8)

kirloskar has won the global tender, beating out established western companies in the process. The US pressure however is unmistakable.

The customer is happy with the end product from kirloskar as they seem to have met all specs in the tender.

system and loop tests are currently going on and criticalality may, repeat may, be some months away, touch wood.

The delay seems to have been caused because of some other suppliers within India who had to depend on imported raw material.

FBRs two and three are also in the pipeline, for two, it has started civil works, apparently well under way and for three, maybe ground breaking has commenced.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arun » 28 Dec 2016 06:57

X Posted from the “Indian Foreign Policy” thread.

I wonder what the PRC Spokesperson meant when she said “The UN Security Council has explicit regulations on whether India can develop ballistic missiles capable of carrying nuclear weapons.”?:

Foreign Ministry Spokesperson Hua Chunying's Regular Press Conference on December 27, 2016
2016/12/27

Q: Further to India's successful test of a continental ballistic missile yesterday that can reach most part of Asia and Europe, I would like to have your reaction.

A: We have noted reports on India's test fire of Agni-V ballistic missile. The UN Security Council has explicit regulations on whether India can develop ballistic missiles capable of carrying nuclear weapons. China always maintains that preserving the strategic balance and stability in South Asia is conducive to peace and prosperity of regional countries and beyond.

We also notice reports, including some from India and Japan, speculating whether India made this move to counter China. They need to ask the Indian side for their intention behind the move. On the Chinese part, China and India have reached an important consensus that the two countries are not rivals for competition but partners for cooperation as two significant developing countries and emerging economies. China is willing to work alongside regional countries including India to maintain the long-lasting peace, stability and prosperity of the region. We also hope that relevant media can report in an objective and sensible manner and do more things to contribute to the mutual trust between China and India and regional peace and stability.
Clicky

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Sanatanan » 28 Dec 2016 16:48

@ chetak
Thanks.

I had not at all meant to be disrespectful.

My apologies if you saw my post as a snide remark.

I was unhappy to note that when the high tech sodium pumps had been indigenously manufactured, credit for the supply of the same was being ascribed to a foreign country.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby chetak » 03 Jan 2017 19:57

Sanatanan wrote:@ chetak
Thanks.

I had not at all meant to be disrespectful.

My apologies if you saw my post as a snide remark.

I was unhappy to note that when the high tech sodium pumps had been indigenously manufactured, credit for the supply of the same was being ascribed to a foreign country.


No issues, saar. my panwalla had to scramble, to confirm. :)

we all live and learn. Thanks for the catch.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby arun » 05 Jan 2017 13:18

arun wrote:Presuming not a case of tardy web site updating by NPCIL or my not keeping upto date on reactor commissioning, there seems to be some problems with the 700 MwE PHWR’s coming up at RAPS Rawatbhata and KAPS Kakrapar.

RAPS Unit 7 which was supposed to be commissioned in June 2016 followed by RAPS Unit 8 in December 2016, respectively show 3 of 11 and 2 of 11 milestones complete:

RAPS

KAPS Unit 3 which was supposed to be commissioned in June 2015 followed by KAPS Unit 4 in December 2015, more ominously carries the message ”Under Review” under the heading Expected Date of Commercial Operation:

KAPS


Finally news of some movement on the 700 MW PHWR reactors coming up at the Kakrapar Atomic Power Station in Gujarat (KAPS 3 & KAPS 4).

"The construction of two 700 MW PHWRs at KAPS is at an advanced stage. The commissioning activities of the first unit has begun. The trial run of the first unit is expected to happen sometime during the middle of next year," B.C.Pathak, Executive Director (Projects), told IANS here over phone from Mumbai.

Speaking to IANS, Vineet Kumar, Station Director of the two units (3 and 4 at KAPS) said, "We have started the commissioning activities. It will be done in stages and various milestones have to be crossed."

"We will be doing the hydro test first in May-June 2017. The next step will be hot conditioning of the unit, which would happen around two-and-a-half months after the hydro test," Kumar added.

After that the systems have to be drained and dried.

"The fuel loading is expected to happen in October 2017 and the reactor's criticality (first time starting of the nuclear fission process) is slated to happen in November 2017," Kumar said.

According to Kumar, the unit is expected to start commercial operations early 2018.

As to the status of the other 700 MW unit Pathak said the 4th unit at KAPS would start 6-7 months after the third unit. ………………..


Regards the 700 MW units of RAPS 7 and RAPS 8 at the Rajasthan Atomic Power Station in Rawatbhata, the following was disclosed:

According to Pathak work at the 7th and 8th units (700 MW) at RAPS are also progressing well with the erection of major components.

The two project sites are humming with activity and the project schedule is being compressed to complete it at the earliest.


From here:

Trial run of India's first 700 MW reactor in 2017

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Gerard » 25 Jan 2017 03:31

US wanted ‘nuclear emissary’ to reduce India-Pakistan tensions, CIA papers reveal

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom ... 0001-1.pdf

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ricky_v » 10 Feb 2017 17:45

challakere is back in news after the original piece from toi dated 19/12/15; posted here in full
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/bengaluru/Challakere-nuclear-facility-fuels-villagers-health-fears/articleshow/50240899.cms
ULLARATHI KAVAL (CHITRADURGA DIST): That a nuclear facility is coming up in their midst is no secret to the villagers of Challakere taluk in Chitradurga district, about 200 km from Bengaluru. They have been protesting against the facility for five years on fears that uranium is harmful to the villagers, crops and the environment.
The issue is back in the spotlight after key niche American journal Foreign Policy carried an article this week about India building a top-secret nuclear city to produce weapons which would upgrade the country to a nuclear power and unsettle neighbours Pakistan and China. Ullarathi Kaval is an agglomeration of 22 villages and is 18 km from Challakere.
Challekere's residents strongly believe - without conclusive evidence, though - that the nuclear plant of Bhabha Atomic Research Centre may be used to make bombs. The Department of Atomic Energy and senior officials in New Delhi have said the Challakere campus is a 'special material enrichment' facility meant for civilian nuclear plants.
Villagers believe the bomb theory because Barc claimed it had secured clearance from the ministry of environment, forest and climate change, but didn't share its contents saying it's a secret document. When villagers didn't relent, Barc pasted an unsigned notice saying the clearances had, indeed, been granted, but couldn't be disclosed.
Atomic scientists privy to the developments told TOI enriched uranium will also have military use. "Every nation has to take care of its military needs and the research will also be to enhance military capabilities," a scientist said, without confirming if Challakere will be used for military purposes.
A retired officer of the armed forces said: "Whether weaponization happens in Challakere or in the Andaman Islands, it is not something that's disclosed." Challakere is considered a strategic location as it's at a safe distance from Pakistan and China. Besides, Karnataka and its neighbours have huge deposits of uranium. Villagers' immediate concern is their safety, not the national security.
During a visit on Friday, TOI found the road leading to Barc's proposed plant had a lot of land on either side with little of agriculture. Dodda Ullarathi, Chikka Ullarathi, Chitranayakanahalli, Valase - the names of villages change, but not the activity. The groundnuts are barely helping the farmers, corn isn't growing well, barring some small patches of isolated land, farmers, a majority of whom belong to backward classes, are heavily dependent on sheep and cattle. "We had drought in 70 of the past 100 years. What else do you expect to see here," asks Doddaullarathi Kariappa, a farmer leading the protest. Other farmers gather around him and echo his voice in a signal that the fight is collective.
"We are not against development. We are proud if India develops scientifically. We've people who have gone on to study medicine or gained employment in top offices in Delhi. Our primary concern is farmers' safety and livelihood," G Hanumantharaya, general secretary, Challakere Amrut Mahal Kaval Horata Samithi, says. "These grasslands meant for grazing are ecologically sensitive, and the use of uranium is hazardous for us. We know what happened in Japan," he says. T Basavaraju, another farmer, says it's the Barc's duty "apprise the locals of the facility, gain our confidence and take care of our livelihood". Hanumantharaya says: "They have provided us scientific evidence that our lives will not be harmed and our children will not be born with deformity. Many media reports say how this can impact us, but none states it is safe!"
What 'foreign policy' says
(When completed in 2017, Challakere facility would be) the subcontinent's largest military-run complex of nuclear centrifuges, atomic-research laboratories, and weapons- and aircraft-testing facilities. But another, more controversial ambition, according to retired Indian government officials and independent experts in London and Washington, is to give India an extra stockpile of enriched uranium fuel that could be used in new hydrogen bombs, also known as thermonuclear weapons, substantially increasing the explosive force of those in its existing nuclear arsenal."

There was talk by the pakistani foreign ministry alluding to the same two days ago. The main investigation was carried out by :
Centre for public integrity (CPI), by the looks of it another global anti-nationalistic outlet and foreign policy along with Stockholm International Peace Research Institute .

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby kit » 10 Feb 2017 18:06

let the pakis have their shivering moment .. Challlakere could well be India's Area 51 :mrgreen:

Image

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ranjan.rao » 10 Feb 2017 20:58

along with the shiver, the funding/FCRA checks of these organizations should be done and they should be made to pay a visit to NIA, do we hear any such thing elsewhere?

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prasannasimha

Postby prasannasimha » 10 Feb 2017 21:34

This Challakere protests are run by one Leo Saldhanha who is a ne'er do well Info babu trying to earn money from his Master's

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Uttam » 10 Feb 2017 22:11

Kalpakkam to have two more prototype fast breeder reactors: Govt
NEW DELHI: The Department of Atomic Energy will construct two Prototype Fast Breeder Reactors (PFBR) of 600 MW each at Kalpakkam in Tamil Nadu, besides the present one of 500 MW capacity which is expected to go fully functional by October, the government said today.

"All the construction activities of PFBR have been completed and the integrated commissioning activities have started. PFBR is expected to go fully functional by October 2017.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Hiten » 04 Mar 2017 19:41

How To Design A Nuclear Power Reactor, the A, B, C, Ds

http://www.spansen.com/2017/03/how-to-d ... r-a-b.html

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Neshant » 04 Mar 2017 23:35

* Deleted *
Last edited by SSridhar on 05 Mar 2017 06:57, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: That does not belong here

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby RoyG » 05 Mar 2017 04:27

shyamoo wrote:I'm not sure where we stand with regards to MSR ( molten salt reactors ). They are more efficient.

Once we have sufficient reserves of U-233, we can build the 3rd generation reactors in earnest. Then we can tell everyone to kiss our musharaff.


Research started not too long ago. We may take this route instead.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Sanatanan » 06 Mar 2017 17:10

Hiten wrote:How To Design A Nuclear Power Reactor, the A, B, C, Ds

http://www.spansen.com/2017/03/how-to-d ... r-a-b.html


I have not yet had a chance to listen fully to the one-and-a-half hour long video of Dr Banerjee's lecture.
However, on a perusal of the set of slides given in the above linked blog page I feel that Dr Banerjee, at Slide 15, has clubbed Nat U, Th and LEU as outputs of "Chemical processing/refining of U and Th concentrates" (refer image below). LEU requires an Uranium enrichment facility unless it is proposed to be bought from IAEA's "LEU Bank" https://www.iaea.org/OurWork/ST/NE/NEFW/Assurance-of-Supply/documents/Factsheet_LEU_Bank.pdf which is limited to enrichment of about 4.5%.

Slides 58 and 59 merely state that AHWR300-LEU will use LEU without specifying the enrichment level. Before now, I recollect having seen some descriptions of AHWR (perhaps of more recent design than the one described in this lecture ?) indicating that the required U235 enrichment in the so-called "LEU" to be about 19.5% consistent with weapons related terminology where LEU is defined as enrichment up to 20%. If indeed it is at this level, import from IAEA will not be possible and may have to be obtained through indigenous efforts only. Even then use of 19.5% enrichment for a 300 MWe thermal neutron reactor. to me, seems non-optimum in terms of fuel cost which will be recurring; LWRs of 300 MWe capacity may require U235 enriched to only about 3.6 to 4.5%.
Image

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby vasu raya » 19 Mar 2017 21:13

http://www.rediff.com/news/special/whats-giving-indias-nuclear-scientists-jitters/20170319.htm

Scientists are puzzled by what caused the mysterious nuclear leak at the Kakrapar Nuclear Power Plant in Gujarat last year, reveals Pallava Bagla.

The Kakrapar nuclear plant in Gujarat

In a highly guarded Indian nuclear reactor complex, toughened radiation resistant pipes have contracted 'small pox'.

As a consequence, literally in a plot similar to a Bollywood thriller Indian scientists are burning the midnight oil to unravel the mysterious nuclear leak at the Kakrapar Nuclear Power Plant in Gujarat.

This 21st century atomic pot boiler is actually unfolding through the hard work of scientists, who actually share a wall with the famous property where renowned Bollywood film star Raj Kapoor used to live.

Here, they are working overtime to find out the real cause of the cryptic leaks at twin reactors in southern Gujarat.

To avoid any panic and any further accidents, the Indian nuclear watchdog -- the Atomic Energy Regulatory Board (AERB) -- has shut down the affected plants till the cause has been found.

Nuclear experts say pipes, made from a rare alloy, have contracted what seems like 'small pox' and this contagion has spread all over the critical tubes in two Indian Pressurised Heavy Water Reactors (PHWR) at Kakrapar in Gujarat.

And, to make matters worse, after more than a year into the investigation, the teams of scientists really do not understand what has gone wrong.

It was on the morning of March 11, 2016, and as fate would have it exactly five years after the Fukushima reactors in Japan started exploding, unit number 1 of the 220-MW PHWR at Kakrapar developed a heavy water leak and had to be shut down in an emergency.

The indigenously built nuclear plant suffered a heavy water leak in its primary coolant channel and a plant emergency was declared at the site.

No worker was exposed and no radiation leaked outside the plant, confirmed India's Department of Atomic Energy.

India's nuclear operator, the Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited, said 'reactor had shut down safely' and 'no radiation leaked out.'

NPCIL confirmed that safety systems had functioned normally.

The atomic thriller really begins when experts are trying to find out why a leak recognition system failed, in the first place it should have given an alarm.

"There is a leak detection system in place in all PHWRs, but in this case it failed to detect the leak on March 11, 2016," confirms AERB Chairman S A Bhardwaj.

AERB speculates that the crack developed so rapidly that the electronic leak detection system just did not had the time to react.

Subsequent investigations revealed that the leak detection system was fully functioning and the operator had "NOT shut it down" to cut costs.

Nothing in the core of a nuclear reactor can be done in a jiffy and several weeks after the first leak, the initial probe using a specially designed tool revealed that four big cracks had formed on a coolant tube which led to the massive leak.

The discovery of the crack was only the beginning of the mystery, further efforts to find the root cause established that the outside of the tube, the part which was not exposed to high temperature heavy water, was also for some unexplained reason 'corroded.';

This was a stunning discovery, since the outside of the failed tube was exposed only to high temperature carbon dioxide and there had been no recorded case of a similar corrosion having been seen on the outside of any tube.

It is also very hard to access this part since the space was very tiny in the annulus.

The AERB then ordered that all the tubes made out of a special alloy of zirconium-niobium be checked on the outside, to their surprise, they discovered that the contagion of the 'nodular corrosion' or what in layman's language can also be described as 'small pox-like' was very widespread in many of the 306 tubes.

Tubes made from the same batch and used at other Indian reactors continue to operate faithfully, without corrosion.

The needle of suspicion now pointed to the carbon dioxide, a gas known to be very stable in high radiation environments.

A further postmortem revealed that Unit-2 which is twin of the affected reactor had also been affected by a similar leak on July 1, 2015 almost ten months before Unit 1 had a sudden appalling failure in March 2016.

Investigations into why Unit-2 failed were ongoing, but no conclusive result had been found.

This literally back-to-back failure of two fully functional nuclear reactors befuddled the engineers.

Unrelenting in trying to find out the root cause, the AERB ordered that the entire assembly and not just the affected tube be safely pulled out and brought to India's foremost nuclear laboratory, the Bhabha Atomic Research Centre in Mumbai for detailed failure analysis.

It is this laboratory located at Trombay in Chembur, Mumbai, that shares geography with India's famous Bollywood Kapoor family.

In addition, since India operates another 16 similar nuclear plants, a full-fledged investigation was carried out on the coolant channels of all atomic power plants and lo-and-behold the investigating team found that the 'smallpox'-like corrosion was confined only to the two units that operated at Kakrapar.

While this gave NPCIL a sigh of relief, it increased the complexity on trying to unravel the true cause of the leaks at Kakrapar.

Bhardwaj says the investigators are wondering if the carbon dioxide used in Kakrapar may have been contaminated which caused the 'nodular corrosion' on the outside of the pipes.

The source of the carbon dioxide was further back traced and it seems only the Kakrapar plant was sourcing its gas from a 'naptha cracking unit' and possibly it has some contamination of hydrocarbons.

No conclusive evidence on the contamination has been forthcoming and forensic analysis is still under way.

As it turns out nuclear engineers are masters of book-keeping especially when ageing of equipment is concerned and a more detailed check in the history of the plants revealed that in 2012 two tubes had been extracted from the Kakrapar plant as part of routine maintenance and had been safely stored in a safe warehouse.

When these were re-examined in 2017, the investigators were surprised that the 'small pox'- like corrosion on the exterior of the tube was not present.

This now makes the investigators suspect that something went wrong after 2012.

Meanwhile, the AERB and the atomic energy establishment has also reached out to the vast global nuclear community to try and help resolve this mystery.

The global watchdog, the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna, and ten other global forums have been informed that a mysterious leak is dogging Indian reactors at Kakrapar and if the global community could be of some help.

The international community is as much at a loss in explaining the failures as are the Indian teams.

India operates 18 PHWR reactors and over the years it has accumulated some 348 years of operating experience of these unique nuclear plants powered using natural uranium and in all these years, the Department of Atomic Energy asserts no radiation related death has taken place at any nuclear plant and no radiation has ever leaked out of the Indian PHWRs.

In addition to it, 29 PHWRs are today functional in Canada, Argentina, Romania, China, South Korea and Pakistan and none have reported any issue like the 'small pox'-like corrosion on any of its nuclear plants.

Bharadwaj says right now there are only hunches but teams at BARC are exposing the Zircalloy tubes to carbon dioxide spiked with various contaminants and they are being placed in a high radiation environment to accentuate the aging process to try and determine the exact cause of the two processes -- 'small pox'-like nodular corrosion and the development of cracks in the coolant tubes.

These could be linked or independent, says Bhardwaj, who feels that in the next few months, the root cause will definitely be deciphered till then the reactors will remain shut.

India currently operates 22 nuclear reactors with an installed capacity of 6,780 MW and hopes to ramp up nuclear output to 32,000 MW by 2032.

Meanwhile, the continuing nuclear mystery is giving the vast Indian nuclear establishment and its atomic sleuths 'nuclear jitters'.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 30 Mar 2017 06:51

Do they have pictures of the Nodular Corrosion spotted on the Zirconium-Niobium tubes?

good that the problem is confined to the Kakrapar units and not systemic.
So its something unique to the plant.
And its not the radiation but contaminant with CO2 and the high temperature. And something that develops in 3 to 4 years.

probably some inter-granular precipitates of alloying elements are corroding preferentially.

They should do chemical analysis.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby SSridhar » 09 Apr 2017 16:14

Global nuclear giants go bust, should India celebrate? - PTI
The global nuclear industry is going through a virtual meltdown on both sides of the Atlantic Ocean.

This is happening even as India is investing heavily in nuclear energy. This collapse of atomic giants offers New Delhi a new opportunity and many in the Indian atomic establishment are silently celebrating this premature death of suitors who were wooing to put tens of atomic plants in India estimated to cost at least $150 billion.

"This atomic meltdown is a blessing in disguise" was how a top government official described the unfolding scenario.

In addition, in these changed circumstances, if the Indian private industry plays its cards right, it could also provide an opportunity to the country to become a hub for low cost suppliers of nuclear technology.
A little far-fetched but who knows how energy games get played in the future.

In a way the diplomatic noose that had been tightened around India's neck to buy super expensive French and American nuclear reactors has on its own been loosened if not shed at all.

As part of the protracted global negotiations on admitting India back into the nuclear commerce club, a kind of barter deal had happened and India had committed itself to buy French and American reactors, but now that the commercial operations of at least two of the foreign giants is floundering, India need not back down from its commercial commitments.

India can retain the moral high ground of wanting to buy the French and American reactors but since the companies themselves are in trouble no deals can be inked. India can once again hope to forge its own nuclear path free of shackles of forced imports of untested technologies.


The American atomic giant Westinghouse Electric Company, LLC filed for 'bankruptcy' a week ago, last year the French nuclear giant Areva went through a similar process.

Both these companies had shown aggressive interest in setting up atomic power plants soon after the Indo-US civilian nuclear deal was inked. Both wanted a large chunk of the nuclear commerce worth billions of dollars that India was holding out as a promise once New Delhi was extricated from the atomic dog-house as a consequence of the landmark Indo-US civilian nuclear deal.

All along as negotiations were going on around the Indo-US civilian nuclear deal, there was a small but influential group in the Indian nuclear establishment that was most uncomfortable at importing so many different types of reactors.

This group felt that since India had mastered the making of Pressurised Heavy Water Reactors (PHWR's) the effort should ideally be to multiple this technology while alongside India's futuristic reactors the Prototype Fast Breeder Reactor which uses plutonium as its main fuel and the Advanced Heavy Water Reactor that uses thorium as its main fuel could be promoted.


Jairam Ramesh, the engineer-turned-influential politician in the United Progressive Alliance government, was an early opponent of importing so many different types of reactors.

Towards mastering the PHWR, India on its own first enhanced the capacity of these reactors from 220 MW to 540 MW by constructing two of them at Tarapur in Maharashtra and then the same reactor has been modified to enhance the capacity to 700 MW with four units already under construction at Kakrapar and Rawatbhatta.

Among imported reactors India successfully started commercial operation of two 1000 MW units at Kudankulam in Tamil Nadu these are made with Russian help. In the Indian nuclear establishment some felt the Russian reactors and the Indian three stage program was more than enough to ensure long term energy security for the country.

Mastering several different technologies is a complex task and there was a lot of consternation among several senior scientists that if the entire Indo-US civilian nuclear deal were to be implemented then at least three new reactor types would have to mastered.

These included Areva proposing to put six atomic plants each of 1650 MW capacity at Jaitapur in Maharashtra. Westinghouse was wanting to sell at least 6 reactors of 1200 MW each to be put up at Kovadda in Andhra Pradesh -- these were initially proposed to be put up at Mithivirdi in Gujarat but land acquisition issues forced Westinghouse to opt for a different site.

General Electric was proposing to put a mega nuclear park as well. Each of these three different reactors are very different from each other and an entirely new set of people would have to be trained to safely operate these.

Typically each new reactor operates for 60 years and then it takes another couple of decades to safely decommission them hence the investment of human resources is a commitment of at least a century.

With Westinghouse filing for bankruptcy it is highly unlikely that India would order any reactors from them anytime soon. The idea was to order in one go 6 nuclear plants that would be delivered on a 'turnkey' basis. Now that Westinghouse itself says it can only supply the technology for the nuclear island and does not want to undertake any construction activity.

Despite the fact India has already committed to pay Rs 100 crore to Westinghouse while ordering the AP 1000 reactors. These orders may obviously go into cold storage till Westinghouse and Toshiba its parent company in Japan iron out their differences.

Similarly, Areva the French giant that owned all the nuclear technology for the EPR 1650 MW reactor having been almost dissolved and the affairs taken over by 'Electricite de France' or EDF the French electricity utility, these reactors for which quite a bit of ground work was already done at Jaitapur has also been cold shouldered since no buyer government would want to get involved when a messy fight is ongoing in the French public sector companies on ownership of the atomic plants.

On its own General Electric has been dragging its feet on bidding for reactors in India since its lawyers felt India's nuclear liability law was more 'people friendly' as opposed to the usual global nuclear liability law that is 'industry friendly'.

In this scenario India is left with no other option but to multiply its indigenous fleet of 700 MW PHWR's and simultaneously expand its collaboration with Russia to buy at least 20 more Russian plants similar in nature but probably more advanced than the reactors operating at Kudankulam.

After India was admitted into the nuclear fold to allow global nuclear commerce all restrictions at importing uranium have already gone and if India seeks to multiply manifold its own home grown reactors that should not be difficult.

In addition since the co-operation with Russia is blossoming more light water reactors could well be ordered from Russia.

This sudden change in the wind direction with American and French nuclear companies all doddering has in way brought India back to where it was in 2004 before US President George Bush decided to shake hands and be friends with India in the nuclear power sector.

At that point India had its PHWR's and the Russian tech but what the country lacked was an assured supply of uranium fuel. India does not have sufficient native resources of uranium and if the nuclear program has to expand then importing uranium was the only option.

Today the supply of imported uranium fuel is well guaranteed under global law thanks to the atomic embrace but this melt down of nuclear giants has tilted the balance in India's favour.

Now without ever having to officially deny buying expensive French and American reactors, New Delhi can opt to expand its existing fleet of atomic plants on its own terms. This 'meltdown' is making the Indian nuclear establishment smile all the way.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Avtar Singh » 09 Apr 2017 17:27

Good news indeed.
Lets hope these american and french entities cannot get back on their feet soon
using chapter 11 type nonsense.

India should have stuck to its own reactors; Make in India..
avoiding all this "foreign muck".
May the good luck in this field continue...
Renewables with small local grids + nuclear backbone is the future.

Nuclear is also the required technology for space exploration.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Amber G. » 10 Apr 2017 03:51

This seems to be not posted yet - from news papers (eg From Hindu) and others..
India, Russia seal deal on

India formally takes over Kudankulam Unit 1's full operational control

(some excerpts
- Russia's ASE Group and the Nuclear Power Corporation of India Ltd have announced the "final acceptance" of unit 1 of the Kudankulam nuclear power plant. The two sides signed a joint statement yesterday confirming that ASE had met its contractual obligations to its customer for the Kudankulam 1 construction project.

- Kudankulam 1 entered commercial operation in December 2014, while unit 2 reached 100% of its operating capacity in January this year. Two further VVER-1000 units - Kudankulam 3 and 4 - are to be built at the site in a second construction phase, with more units to follow.

- "The warranty period of operation demonstrated the reliable and safe operation of the unit. Thus, the Indian customer has confirmed that ASE Group, which is the general contractor, has fully and qualitatively fulfilled all the tasks assigned to it. The further operation of unit 1 is the full responsibility of the Indian side."

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Cosmo_R » 10 Apr 2017 04:55

^^^Sounds a bit like Russki propaganda.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby rgosain » 10 Apr 2017 18:07

SSridhar wrote:Global nuclear giants go bust, should India celebrate? - PTI
The global nuclear industry is going through a virtual meltdown on both sides of the Atlantic Ocean.

This is happening even as India is investing heavily in nuclear energy. This collapse of atomic giants offers New Delhi a new opportunity and many in the Indian atomic establishment are silently celebrating this premature death of suitors who were wooing to put tens of atomic plants in India estimated to cost at least $150 billion.

"This atomic meltdown is a blessing in disguise" was how a top government official described the unfolding scenario.

In addition, in these changed circumstances, if the Indian private industry plays its cards right, it could also provide an opportunity to the country to become a hub for low cost suppliers of nuclear technology.
A little far-fetched but who knows how energy games get played in the future.

In a way the diplomatic noose that had been tightened around India's neck to buy super expensive French and American nuclear reactors has on its own been loosened if not shed at all.

As part of the protracted global negotiations on admitting India back into the nuclear commerce club, a kind of barter deal had happened and India had committed itself to buy French and American reactors, but now that the commercial operations of at least two of the foreign giants is floundering, India need not back down from its commercial commitments.

India can retain the moral high ground of wanting to buy the French and American reactors but since the companies themselves are in trouble no deals can be inked. India can once again hope to forge its own nuclear path free of shackles of forced imports of untested technologies.


The American atomic giant Westinghouse Electric Company, LLC filed for 'bankruptcy' a week ago, last year the French nuclear giant Areva went through a similar process.

Both these companies had shown aggressive interest in setting up atomic power plants soon after the Indo-US civilian nuclear deal was inked. Both wanted a large chunk of the nuclear commerce worth billions of dollars that India was holding out as a promise once New Delhi was extricated from the atomic dog-house as a consequence of the landmark Indo-US civilian nuclear deal.

All along as negotiations were going on around the Indo-US civilian nuclear deal, there was a small but influential group in the Indian nuclear establishment that was most uncomfortable at importing so many different types of reactors.

This group felt that since India had mastered the making of Pressurised Heavy Water Reactors (PHWR's) the effort should ideally be to multiple this technology while alongside India's futuristic reactors the Prototype Fast Breeder Reactor which uses plutonium as its main fuel and the Advanced Heavy Water Reactor that uses thorium as its main fuel could be promoted.


Jairam Ramesh, the engineer-turned-influential politician in the United Progressive Alliance government, was an early opponent of importing so many different types of reactors.

Towards mastering the PHWR, India on its own first enhanced the capacity of these reactors from 220 MW to 540 MW by constructing two of them at Tarapur in Maharashtra and then the same reactor has been modified to enhance the capacity to 700 MW with four units already under construction at Kakrapar and Rawatbhatta.

Among imported reactors India successfully started commercial operation of two 1000 MW units at Kudankulam in Tamil Nadu these are made with Russian help. In the Indian nuclear establishment some felt the Russian reactors and the Indian three stage program was more than enough to ensure long term energy security for the country.

Mastering several different technologies is a complex task and there was a lot of consternation among several senior scientists that if the entire Indo-US civilian nuclear deal were to be implemented then at least three new reactor types would have to mastered.

These included Areva proposing to put six atomic plants each of 1650 MW capacity at Jaitapur in Maharashtra. Westinghouse was wanting to sell at least 6 reactors of 1200 MW each to be put up at Kovadda in Andhra Pradesh -- these were initially proposed to be put up at Mithivirdi in Gujarat but land acquisition issues forced Westinghouse to opt for a different site.

General Electric was proposing to put a mega nuclear park as well. Each of these three different reactors are very different from each other and an entirely new set of people would have to be trained to safely operate these.

Typically each new reactor operates for 60 years and then it takes another couple of decades to safely decommission them hence the investment of human resources is a commitment of at least a century.

With Westinghouse filing for bankruptcy it is highly unlikely that India would order any reactors from them anytime soon. The idea was to order in one go 6 nuclear plants that would be delivered on a 'turnkey' basis. Now that Westinghouse itself says it can only supply the technology for the nuclear island and does not want to undertake any construction activity.

Despite the fact India has already committed to pay Rs 100 crore to Westinghouse while ordering the AP 1000 reactors. These orders may obviously go into cold storage till Westinghouse and Toshiba its parent company in Japan iron out their differences.

Similarly, Areva the French giant that owned all the nuclear technology for the EPR 1650 MW reactor having been almost dissolved and the affairs taken over by 'Electricite de France' or EDF the French electricity utility, these reactors for which quite a bit of ground work was already done at Jaitapur has also been cold shouldered since no buyer government would want to get involved when a messy fight is ongoing in the French public sector companies on ownership of the atomic plants.

On its own General Electric has been dragging its feet on bidding for reactors in India since its lawyers felt India's nuclear liability law was more 'people friendly' as opposed to the usual global nuclear liability law that is 'industry friendly'.

In this scenario India is left with no other option but to multiply its indigenous fleet of 700 MW PHWR's and simultaneously expand its collaboration with Russia to buy at least 20 more Russian plants similar in nature but probably more advanced than the reactors operating at Kudankulam.

After India was admitted into the nuclear fold to allow global nuclear commerce all restrictions at importing uranium have already gone and if India seeks to multiply manifold its own home grown reactors that should not be difficult.

In addition since the co-operation with Russia is blossoming more light water reactors could well be ordered from Russia.

This sudden change in the wind direction with American and French nuclear companies all doddering has in way brought India back to where it was in 2004 before US President George Bush decided to shake hands and be friends with India in the nuclear power sector.

At that point India had its PHWR's and the Russian tech but what the country lacked was an assured supply of uranium fuel. India does not have sufficient native resources of uranium and if the nuclear program has to expand then importing uranium was the only option.

Today the supply of imported uranium fuel is well guaranteed under global law thanks to the atomic embrace but this melt down of nuclear giants has tilted the balance in India's favour.

Now without ever having to officially deny buying expensive French and American reactors, New Delhi can opt to expand its existing fleet of atomic plants on its own terms. This 'meltdown' is making the Indian nuclear establishment smile all the way.
[/quote

Thanks for putting this up, karma or wot..
Exactly twenty five years ago GWB's dad, GHB tightened the NSG rules that made it mandatory for countries to be a NPT member(NNW) if they wanted access to nuclear power technology.
The target of this was India, where a sustained campaign of broad sanctions, technology denials, sabotage, was lead first by the GHB administration followed more intensely by the WJC administration assisted by assorted non-proliferationistas, many of whom were sponsored by the PRC, who were intent on containing India. The mantra of cap, roll-back, eliminate and sign-up to the NPT was pushed by the US and China, both of whom were now in an overt, strategic nexus by 1996, even though both France and the PRC were still testing devices. The other participants in this campaign were Australia who rammed through the CTBT at the UN in 1996, and Japan who combined sanctimony and victimhood to intimidate India, thus by 1997, India had more technology denials and sanctions upon it than Iran, Iraq and Cuba.
Today, it is Westinghouse that faces a cap, roll-back and eliminate by its creditors, but there are ways for India to go ahead with this deal on a turn-key basis, and it is this - the NpT will have to accommodate India as a NWS, if the nuclear industry wants future access. Had the NSG not targeted India, it is possible that Westinghouse would have been in India much earlier.

The local yellowcake industry were shut down by MMS/SG and the VAtican who wanted to make India dependent upon the import lobby

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 12 Apr 2017 02:31

Thanks for putting this up, karma or wot..
Exactly twenty five years ago GWB's dad, GHB tightened the NSG rules that made it mandatory for countries to be a NPT member(NNW) if they wanted access to nuclear power technology.
The target of this was India, where a sustained campaign of broad sanctions, technology denials, sabotage, was lead first by the GHB administration followed more intensely by the WJC administration assisted by assorted non-proliferationistas, many of whom were sponsored by the PRC, who were intent on containing India
. The mantra of cap, roll-back, eliminate (CRE) and sign-up to the NPT was pushed by the US and China, both of whom were now in an overt, strategic nexus by 1996, even though both France and the PRC were still testing devices. The other participants in this campaign were Australia who rammed through the CTBT at the UN in 1996, and Japan who combined sanctimony and victimhood to intimidate India, thus by 1997, India had more technology denials and sanctions upon it than Iran, Iraq and Cuba.

Today, it is Westinghouse that faces a cap, roll-back and eliminate by its creditors, but there are ways for India to go ahead with this deal on a turn-key basis, and it is this - the NPT will have to accommodate India as a NWS, if the nuclear industry wants future access. Had the NSG not targeted India, it is possible that Westinghouse would have been in India much earlier.

The local yellowcake industry were shut down by MMS/SG and the VAtican who wanted to make India dependent upon the import lobby


Great post..

Now Toshiba the parent company of Westinghouse also says it will go under. Reports ~$6B loss for last quarter!!!!

http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/11/investi ... se-crisis/

....

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 12 Apr 2017 02:33

arshyam wrote:If it should have gone critical three years before, the pumps should have been made available, installed, tested much earlier. Puts it in squarely UPA territory. Not looking to score a political point, but MMS was reported to have slow things down to get the nuke deal. Who knows how much 'reverse pressure' was put by GoI itself on BARC/IGCAR in the hope of a few carrots from the US?



Lusting for foreign carrots while plenty of local gajar was available. In fact they poured weed killer over our nuclear gajar fields!

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Prem » 12 Apr 2017 05:26

ramana wrote:
Thanks for putting this up, karma or wot..[
Now Toshiba the parent company of Westinghouse also says it will go under. Reports ~$6B loss for last quarter!!!!http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/11/investing/toshiba-earnings-delisting-westinghouse-crisis/....


Signs of Qudarati Karmic Natija; From Hyde To Toshiba all fell pretty fast one by one whether the Villains in Massaland or Nippon Bhatija.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 12 Apr 2017 05:46

Translate please!

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Shankk » 12 Apr 2017 06:15

ramana wrote:Lusting for foreign carrots while plenty of local gajar was available. In fact they poured weed killer over our nuclear gajar fields!


I understand the first part but what is the later part?

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby Prem » 12 Apr 2017 07:23

ramana wrote:Translate please!

I was referring to the literally end game starting from Senator Hyde to Helm to Vanvas of NPAs to Toshiba . When SOKO won the Nuclear power plant bid in Emirate, it was very obvious that Japanese shenanigans produced SOKO as competitor and pretty much ruined any realistic revenue prospect and growth for WHouse. Strange that most of antagonistic forces trying to mess Indian Nuclear program are now either dead or gone irrelevant. Only Halfbright still warm like burnt coal.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby tandav » 12 Apr 2017 13:11

vasu raya wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/special/whats-giving-indias-nuclear-scientists-jitters/20170319.htm

Scientists are puzzled by what caused the mysterious nuclear leak at the Kakrapar Nuclear Power Plant in Gujarat last year, reveals Pallava Bagla.


Nuclear experts say pipes, made from a rare alloy, have contracted what seems like 'small pox' and this contagion has spread all over the critical tubes in two Indian Pressurised Heavy Water Reactors (PHWR) at Kakrapar in Gujarat.

snipped...

The atomic thriller really begins when experts are trying to find out why a leak recognition system failed, in the first place it should have given an alarm.

many non technical parts Snipped...

AERB speculates that the crack developed so rapidly that the electronic leak detection system just did not had the time to react.

snipped...

The discovery of the crack was only the beginning of the mystery, further efforts to find the root cause established that the outside of the tube, the part which was not exposed to high temperature heavy water, was also for some unexplained reason 'corroded.';

This was a stunning discovery, since the outside of the failed tube was exposed only to high temperature carbon dioxide and there had been no recorded case of a similar corrosion having been seen on the outside of any tube.

The AERB then ordered that all the tubes made out of a special alloy of zirconium-niobium be checked on the outside, to their surprise, they discovered that the contagion of the 'nodular corrosion' or what in layman's language can also be described as 'small pox-like' was very widespread in many of the 306 tubes.

The needle of suspicion now pointed to the carbon dioxide, a gas known to be very stable in high radiation environments.

A further postmortem revealed that Unit-2 which is twin of the affected reactor had also been affected by a similar leak on July 1, 2015 almost ten months before Unit 1 had a sudden appalling failure in March 2016.

snipped...

Unrelenting in trying to find out the root cause, the AERB ordered that the entire assembly and not just the affected tube be safely pulled out and brought to India's foremost nuclear laboratory, the Bhabha Atomic Research Centre in Mumbai for detailed failure analysis.

snipped...

Bhardwaj says the investigators are wondering if the carbon dioxide used in Kakrapar may have been contaminated which caused the 'nodular corrosion' on the outside of the pipes.

The source of the carbon dioxide was further back traced and it seems only the Kakrapar plant was sourcing its gas from a 'naptha cracking unit' and possibly it has some contamination of hydrocarbons
.

No conclusive evidence on the contamination has been forthcoming and forensic analysis is still under way.

As it turns out nuclear engineers are masters of book-keeping especially when ageing of equipment is concerned and a more detailed check in the history of the plants revealed that in 2012 two tubes had been extracted from the Kakrapar plant as part of routine maintenance and had been safely stored in a safe warehouse. When these were re-examined in 2017, the investigators were surprised that the 'small pox'- like corrosion on the exterior of the tube was not present. This now makes the investigators suspect that something went wrong after 2012.

The international community is as much at a loss in explaining the failures as are the Indian teams.

Bharadwaj says right now there are only hunches but teams at BARC are exposing the Zircalloy tubes to carbon dioxide spiked with various contaminants and they are being placed in a high radiation environment to accentuate the aging process to try and determine the exact cause of the two processes -- 'small pox'-like nodular corrosion and the development of cracks in the coolant tubes.


Meanwhile, the continuing nuclear mystery is giving the vast Indian nuclear establishment and its atomic sleuths 'nuclear jitters'.


Queries and Path forward

1) Do they have test samples of the CO2 batch that was used in the reactor in long term storage for forensic audit testing just like they kept the Zr-Nb tube in 2012.
2) Why did they use the Naptha cracker CO2. Its well known that Catalytic crackers streams such as Naptha cracking gases contain significant amounts of trace CO, H2O, H2, hydrocarbons as sidestream byproducts which cannot be separated to high purity standards required in the nuclear industry.
3) For instance it is prohibited to use Petrochemical origin CO2 from say Naptha Cracking as food grade CO2 in edibles such as drinking soda/baking soda etc. Why wasn't the proper protocol not followed here in sourcing Nuclear grade CO2.
4) open source the nodular growth micrographs and the raw data of the CO2 (spectrographic test reports) and characteristics of the Zr-Nb alloy used. I can guarantee that the issue will be pinpointed by MatSci experts in India itself. Reward the outside expert who solves this handsomely Rs 1-2 Crores atleast.

If the CO2 is the iussue definitely some heads in the procurement/vendor side should roll for this, an expensive asset such as a Nuclear power station scuppered to save on CO2 costs by sourcing it from an unapproved source which would not meet Nuclear CO2 standard where contaminants would have to be less than ppb or even ppt levels.

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 13 Apr 2017 02:05

tandav wrote:

2) Why did they use the Naptha cracker CO2. Its well known that Catalytic crackers streams such as Naptha cracking gases contain significant amounts of trace CO, H2O, H2, hydrocarbons as sidestream byproducts which cannot be separated to high purity standards required in the nuclear industry.
3) For instance it is prohibited to use Petrochemical origin CO2 from say Naptha Cracking as food grade CO2 in edibles such as drinking soda/baking soda etc. Why wasn't the proper protocol not followed here in sourcing Nuclear grade CO2.


4) open source the nodular growth micrographs and the raw data of the CO2 (spectrographic test reports) and characteristics of the Zr-Nb alloy used. I can guarantee that the issue will be pinpointed by MatSci experts in India itself. Reward the outside expert who solves this handsomely Rs 1-2 Crores atleast.

If the CO2 is the issue definitely some heads in the procurement/vendor side should roll for this, an expensive asset such as a Nuclear power station scuppered to save on CO2 costs by sourcing it from an unapproved source which would not meet Nuclear CO2 standard where contaminants would have to be less than ppb or even ppt levels.



I think you just solved the problem. I didn't see the CO2 sourced from naphtha cracking plant which the scientists admitted.

Can we go to the Naphtha Cracking Plant CO2 MSDS for purchasers?

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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby SaraLax » 13 Apr 2017 08:20

ramana wrote:
tandav wrote:
3) For instance it is prohibited to use Petrochemical origin CO2 from say Naptha Cracking as food grade CO2 in edibles such as drinking soda/baking soda etc. Why wasn't the proper protocol not followed here in sourcing Nuclear grade CO2.
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4) open source the nodular growth micrographs and the raw data of the CO2 (spectrographic test reports) and characteristics of the Zr-Nb alloy used. I can guarantee that the issue will be pinpointed by MatSci experts in India itself. Reward the outside expert who solves this handsomely Rs 1-2 Crores atleast.

If the CO2 is the issue definitely some heads in the procurement/vendor side should roll for this, an expensive asset such as a Nuclear power station scuppered to save on CO2 costs by sourcing it from an unapproved source which would not meet Nuclear CO2 standard where contaminants would have to be less than ppb or even ppt levels.



I think you just solved the problem. I didn't see the CO2 sourced from naphtha cracking plant which the scientists admitted.

Can we go to the Naphtha Cracking Plant CO2 MSDS for purchasers?


BARC (or was it NPCIL ?) itself has said that this particular failure in Nuclear plant pipes has not been found in any of the other nuclear plants in the other regions of India but for this Kakrapar plant in Gujarat. Did this sourcing of CO2 from Naptha Cracker sources (i.e petrochemical origin CO2) for the Kakrapar plant in Gujarat - happen because there are lots of Petrochemical refineries & allied plants operating along Gujarat coast (Reliance, Essar, IOC & etc) ?.

ramana
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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Postby ramana » 13 Apr 2017 10:27

Tandav, Can you show a document that prohibits CO2 from naphtha plants usage on food grade applications?


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