India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 06 Mar 2012 15:17

shiv wrote: Ah! That is why United Queendom is a "permanent" member, like Suresh Kalmadi as permanent head of IOC.

An exception that proves the rule. What UK has going for it is thermonukes + historical inertia + military & political alliance.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 06 Mar 2012 15:25

Pranav wrote:
shiv wrote: Ah! That is why United Queendom is a "permanent" member, like Suresh Kalmadi as permanent head of IOC.
What UK has going for it is thermonukes + historical inertia + military & political alliance.

And the huge iceberg looming ahead is the Scottish Independence Referendum Vote. We should use the iceberg and sink the damn ship, and take over their seat in the P5.

In fact if GoI had any brains we would be financing Alex Salmond's campaign. Indians should be investing in the next two years big time in Scotland urging people that Scotland is going to be not only be financially viable but solidly prosperous.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 06 Mar 2012 18:04

India gives the finger to US and tests the the A5 and H-bomb on the same day. We launch a surprise attack with 500 Brahmos missiles on China National Highway 219 (G219) and liberate Aksai Chin or whatever they call it.Once it cuts off Pakistan Gilgit-and NA's will fall like ripe apples. India will have "earned" the seat as it has altered the security situation in the world.
I wish!

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 06 Mar 2012 20:26

btw while we think of H-bomb as a 2 stage device. it can be made 3-stage for a gargantuan yield. the tsar bomba was one such.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 07 Mar 2012 03:16

Altair wrote: 1. India-Pakistan wars are more like communal riots with tanks and heavy arty

Isn't that a spectacular own goal? Portraying Indo-Pak wars as a Hindu vs Muslim thing. That is what the pakis have always tried to do.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Mar 2012 06:34

nachiket wrote:
Altair wrote: 1. India-Pakistan wars are more like communal riots with tanks and heavy arty

Isn't that a spectacular own goal? Portraying Indo-Pak wars as a Hindu vs Muslim thing. That is what the pakis have always tried to do.

It is a Hindu Muslim thing. It may have been started by Djinnah and the Muslim league but who is going to ask about that now? Why do you think the western media keep saying "Hindu India" is controlling Muslim majority ashmir and Pakistan, a nuclear armed state accuses India of human rights abuses in Kashmir. If that is not a Hindu Muslim affair what is it?

If I start a fight with you it does not matter whether you hate me or not, everyone will say "nachiket and shiv are fighting". It's enough if I hate you enough to start a fight. Of course I could fear you enough to start a fight and then "prove" that you are fighting with me and that you hate me. That is what Pakis are doing. It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 07 Mar 2012 14:30

Why the Heck are we exercising with these perverts at all,especially when their political amd military bosses have done nothing for 20 years?! Their track record in Iraq,Af-Pak,etc. is simply despicable.Murder,rape,torture are the norm for US forces and this despicable and debased character should not rub off onto our valiant jawans.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... demic.html

Panetta, Gates, Rumsfeld Face New Suit Over U.S. Military Rape ‘Epidemic’
by Jesse Ellison Mar 6, 2012
In a lawsuit filed Tuesday, the U.S. military’s top brass are accused of refusing to take action on sexual assault in the ranks and ignoring congressional mandates. Jesse Ellison reports.

Now Klay is leading seven other women in a lawsuit against Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta, his predecessors Robert Gates and Donald Rumsfeld, and six current and former heads of the Marine Corps and Navy. The suit, filed on Tuesday morning by D.C. attorney Susan Burke, alleges that despite more than 20 years of claims to the contrary, military leadership not only has refused to take action to address rape, sexual assault, and harassment within its ranks, but also has unlawfully failed to comply with congressional mandates pertaining to the issue. “Each plaintiff suffered directly from Defendants’ unlawful conduct,” the suit states, “which created and maintained a hostile environment for servicemembers reporting rape, sexual assault and sexual harassment.”

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 07 Mar 2012 14:55

shiv wrote:It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.

One can understand their game, but why is Bharat Karnad espousing such a view, thus lending credence to it?

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 07 Mar 2012 16:18

RajeshA wrote:
shiv wrote:It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.
One can understand their game, but why is Bharat Karnad espousing such a view, thus lending credence to it?

The way I understand him is that He feels India ought to enter Big player game and must behave as such. Pakistan is a Non-Issue in the Big league things.
May be I read him wrong but it is my first opinion while meeting him personally.

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 07 Mar 2012 16:25

Singha wrote:btw while we think of H-bomb as a 2 stage device. it can be made 3-stage for a gargantuan yield. the tsar bomba was one such.

It is at these times that I wish we had the Blackjacks

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 07 Mar 2012 16:41

Altair wrote:
shiv wrote:It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.
RajeshA wrote:One can understand their game, but why is Bharat Karnad espousing such a view, thus lending credence to it?
The way I understand him is that He feels India ought to enter Big player game and must behave as such. Pakistan is a Non-Issue in the Big league things.
May be I read him wrong but it is my first opinion while meeting him personally.

Altair ji,

Even previously when shiv saar went to listen to Bharat Karnad, that was the impression he brought back. That is one thing, and IMHO he is entitled to that view, and I wouldn't call it less nationalistic or less intelligent.

However the comparison of Indo-Pak conflict with that of a communal riot with tanks is shooting one's foot, leg and ass off! It is needless!

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 09 Mar 2012 01:01

http://www.democracynow.org/2007/7/26/o ... _hillhouse

Interesting video about the use of private contractors in the CIA. It seems about 50% of the CIA employees have less than 5 years of experience.

The fact that the private sector has such as big influence is some what consistent with the soft treatment China gets in the US media versus India. The PRC has worked to cultivate a positive image and create centers to influence opinion and policy; elements of the US multinationals are beholden to the PRC.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 09 Mar 2012 02:50

FYI, I was told today that 25 calls need to be placed on an issue before it is noted and considered. Useful piece of info for those writing letters etc to do it in groups if you can. Work together.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 09 Mar 2012 03:20

RajeshA wrote:
shiv wrote:It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.
One can understand their game, but why is Bharat Karnad espousing such a view, thus lending credence to it?

Our anglophone classes just love to put things in pithy clever phrases, e.g., communal riots with tanks, 26/11 attackers didn't come with visas, etc. Truth or sober analysis is usually a far lower priority.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 09 Mar 2012 04:59

http://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-says-aim ... 44267.html
Pentagon says aims to keep Asia power balance

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States is shifting more military muscle, including another aircraft carrier, to the Pacific to protect the status quo in a region facing China's growing clout, the Pentagon's second-ranking official said on Thursday.In coming years, 60 percent of U.S. Navy ships will be in the Pacific, up from 52 percent now, including a net increase of one carrier to six, Deputy Defense Secretary Ashton Carter told an industry conference hosted by Credit Suisse and McAleese and Associates, a consultancy.The U.S. Army and Marine Corps are also working on stepped-up rotations, "so they'll be seeing more of the U.S. Army in the Asia Pacific region not less," Carter said.Elaborating on military priorities that President Barack Obama announced in January, Carter said U.S. forces had played a crucial role in preventing conflict in the Pacific region for roughly the last 60 years."We don't want that to change. We want to continue to have that role and that's really what our investments are aimed at," Carter said when asked whether the goal was to pre-empt, deter or hedge against China.Navy planned to achieve the buildup using new ships as they roll out of shipyards.
Beijing in recent years has asserted territorial claims in the South China Sea and East China Sea more aggressively.In response, the United States is laying the groundwork for a more widely distributed footprint in Asia through strengthened alliances and partnerships, including with Australia, Singapore and the Philippines.Carter cited a range of upgrades and new programs that he said were directed to the region, including radar sets, antisubmarine warfare improvements and development of a new long-range, nuclear-capable bomber. The programs were largely outlined in a five-year spending request that Obama sent to Congress last month.The United States also is moving to protect fixed bases in the region, he said. Such installations are increasingly vulnerable to Chinese ballistic missiles, according to the Pentagon.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Mar 2012 08:16

RajeshA wrote:
shiv wrote:It has always suited the US for that to continue because that communal riot has kept the brainless Mussalmaans of Pakistan dependent on the US and doing the US's job.
One can understand their game, but why is Bharat Karnad espousing such a view, thus lending credence to it?

This is how I see it currently.

If India Pakistan relations are a giant communal riot gone bad, efforts to control that communal riot could pay dividends to India (and Pakistanis, maybe not Pakistan).

It is possible to accept that partition itself occurred because of (then) irreconcilable differences between a "Muslims only" Muslim league political party and a pluralist (or secular) Congress party. But as is often stated, a large proportion of Muslims who voted for Pakistan stayed behind in India by choice or inability to move, while many who did not want Pakistan found themselves in Pakistan. This state was complicated by the murders of partition and the systematic genocide/elimination of Hindus and Sikhs from Pakistan in the ensuing years.

Pakistan today represents the "Muslim only" vision of the Muslim league and India continues to represent the structure mooted by the Congress party of the 1940s. The point I made yesterday about people being happier in India than in Pakistan was not done only for fun. I was serious, although the point was lost in some unnecessary stone throwing.

IF the descendants of Muslims who voted for Pakistan (but remained in India) are happier today than Pakistanis, and if the descendants of the people who did not vote for Pakistan continue to suffer in Pakistan, then it would be in their interest to make peace with India. The people who are opposed to them in Pakistan are those who expected to be better off in Pakistan. This latter group are the very people who seek a preservation of Pakistan and opposition to India. This represents an internal split in Pakistan.

The US is doing everything it can to preserve Pakistan. Those Pakis who want to preserve Pakistan not only need to fight India, they need to oppose any Pakistanis who may be unhappy about the state of affairs between India and Pakistan. US aid is not only helping the preservation of the "Idea of Pakistan" by opposing India, but it also helps to oppose those Pakis who would like to mend relations with India. The preservation of Pakistan as a state suits US interests, not Indian interests.

I think many people on BRF are unclear about what they want out of Pakistan. Some would like to see the state "collapse" - but that means nothing. Collapse is somewhat like what we are seeing now - with no single group in overall control. Others would like to see the retaking of PoK. That means that after PoK is taken it is OK for Pakistan to exist. Or there is a hope that Pakistan will somehow cease to exist after that. I disagree with that.

Pakistan as a state must dissolve and all of it or large parts of it need to be reintegrated with India under terms and agreements that are more like the relations between India and Nepal or Belgium and France.

abhischekcc · Post by **abhischekcc** » 09 Mar 2012 11:40

India and US appear to have a tacit agreement to destroy pakistan. Some days ago, GOI changed FEMA rules to allow FDI from pakistanis into Indian stock markets. This is to allow the paki elites to escape their nightmare of a country with their moneys, leaving the monkeys behind.

Once this is completed, the stage will be set for pakistan's dismemberment.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 09 Mar 2012 11:57

abhischekcc wrote:India and US appear to have a tacit agreement to destroy pakistan. Some days ago, GOI changed FEMA rules to allow FDI from pakistanis into Indian stock markets. This is to allow the paki elites to escape their nightmare of a country with their moneys, leaving the monkeys behind.

Once this is completed, the stage will be set for pakistan's dismemberment.

I do not think US would under any circumstances give India any benefit of Paki money. All that Paki money is US aid money. Why would US allow that to come to India?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 09 Mar 2012 12:03

In fact, all it does is allow Dawood Ibrahim types to reinvest thier Hafta money back in India legally.

Mukesh.Kumar · Post by **Mukesh.Kumar** » 09 Mar 2012 13:18

@ Aditya_V- That is not half as bad. By preventing Paki FDI are we preventing D' Company from putting funds back in India? In my opinion, not likely, given their global reach and despite monitoring of global fund flows, they can do it- Dubai being the most obvious money laundering point.On the contrary, by opening up India to Paki FDI:
1) Not only do we get the elite in Pakistan a stake in maintaining a peaceful India so that the economy can grow;
2) We get the finances back in the country. In future we can always freeze/ nationalize these assets using legal recourse once the money is invested in immovable assets.

What GOI needs to do is:
1) To set up a mechanism to track the sources of the money- a first step towards step 2 mentioned above;
2) Ensure the right kind of investment- This money should not go directly into media, education, etc.

What do you think?

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 16 Mar 2012 02:52

Some photos from Yudh Abhyas 2012.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... sj#slide/1

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 16 Mar 2012 08:04

US threatens sanctions against India over Iran oil

WASHINGTON: The Obama administration is threatening to impose sanctions on India over its continued economic ties with Iran amid disagreements between Washington and New Delhi over how much and how soon the latter is reducing oil imports from the (in US eyes) pariah nation.

India has "failed" to reduce its purchase of Iranian oil and if it doesn't do so, President Barack Obama may be "forced" to impose sanction, unnamed administration officials were cited as telling Bloomberg wire service. A decision in this regard could come as early as June 28, they added, implicitly offering New Delhi a ten- week window to show a decline in Iranian oil imports.
...
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However, India has informally conveyed to Washington that it has advised its refineries, many of which are geared towards processing Iranian crude, to seek alternate supplies and gradually reduce their dependence on Iran. That process may take some time to kick in since annual crude contracts with Iran are April to March, so the reduction will start to show from next month.
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The Obama administration itself is in a bind over squeezing too hard and tightening oil supplies across the world. While Washington has offered to wean India and other countries from Iranian oil by arranging supplies from Saudi Arabia and Iraq, that could come at its own expense and rising oil prices. Already, gas prices are close to $ 4 a gallon at US pumps, and it is a well-acknowledged fact that the fortunes of US politicians running for high office is linked to pain (or otherwise) at the pump.

Manny · Post by **Manny** » 16 Mar 2012 08:51

The US could never do something like this against China. Cause China is economically strong.

India is economically a weakling because of the Sonia, Rahul, Robert govt and the socialistic/leftist desi culture who destroyed the Indian republic by voting for the Nehru Feudals into perpetuity.

So the US can push India around a lot more.

Its not about what the US is doing.. its what Indians and their leftist culture has allowed others to dictate to India.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Mar 2012 09:15

I feel we are doing a bad thing by attempting to 'partially' comply with the US cabal's sanction plans on Iran.

whatever X we do, US is not going to be happy and is going to Ungli us saying you did X, why not 1.3X ? the bar is going to keep on rising.

a simple statement that we will disregard western plans and go our own way with iran would have been fine, along with a dare that west was free to fight and destroy iran if they could and install a puppet should they choose to. the US would threaten sanctions, but we could retaliate by saying that will result in selective blacklisting of US cos from any form of entry in retail, power sector and the lucrative defence deals they are hoping to bag in the next decades..what we have signed is just the appetizer.
ultimately the US would not impose sanctions because our buying or not buying from Iran is not a huge factor in the survival of the iran govt and the cons of sanctioning India are much more.

we should call their bluff just like the chinese and russians do periodically. the emperor needs to be told he is naked instead of courtiers bowing and pretending he is wearing a purple robe.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 16 Mar 2012 10:57

Singha ji,

India should simply say, that "we would be willing to do something, which is against our economic (Assured Access to Oil) and strategic interests (Assured Access to CAR and Afghanistan), only if either US has a UNSC resolution requiring sanctions on Iran, or if USA can offer something to offset our losses (say Central Asian Energy through a Free Baluchistan)."

As in all these years USA has not made a similar sacrifice for India (Pakistan), India too need not make sacrifices for USA (Iran).

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 16 Mar 2012 13:29

Lol, it will be interesting to see where this goes. I think this is just mere poking India because there are plenty of countries still trading with Iran and legally doesn't stand much ground because India complies with te UN sanctions not US.

If they want to sanction us then it's their loss.
I think this threat also has something to do with the nuke deal.

nvishal · Post by **nvishal** » 16 Mar 2012 15:27

Manny wrote:India is economically a weakling

Not true. India is still a domestic market. It is not dependent on other countries expect for energy imports. Much of indian consumerism is still limited to kanda, batata and shakar.

member_20617 · Post by **member_20617** » 16 Mar 2012 15:29

Obama has said at a recent press conference that the USA would like to sort out this issue by negotiating with Iran but if this fails then there are other softer options he would try until June/July 2012. He said that he does not want a war with Iran but it will be the last option for him.

Russia and China may reluctantly agree with USA for soft options but I think they will veto the war option at UNSC if it ever comes to that stage.

A war with Iran will block oil supplies which are vital to all major economies and will damage the world economy very badly. With the current recession not abating in any shape or form, the Western powers would not want to make it even worse.

As far as India is concerned, USA and Saudi Arabia are trying to influence India by offering more oil from SA to compensate for not buying any Iranian oil. I also think UPA ministers recent visits to SA are to be seen in this light. USA and Saudi Arabia may also want to know India’s position in case there is a war.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 16 Mar 2012 20:38

putnanja wrote:US threatens sanctions against India over Iran oil

WASHINGTON: The Obama administration is threatening to impose sanctions on India over its continued economic ties with Iran amid disagreements between Washington and New Delhi over how much and how soon the latter is reducing oil imports from the (in US eyes) pariah nation.

India has "failed" to reduce its purchase of Iranian oil and if it doesn't do so, President Barack Obama may be "forced" to impose sanction, unnamed administration officials were cited as telling Bloomberg wire service. A decision in this regard could come as early as June 28, they added, implicitly offering New Delhi a ten- week window to show a decline in Iranian oil imports.
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Old Article but was predicted before

http://www.wnd.com/2009/05/98486/

OBAMA POLICIES STRAIN INDIA
Relations with U.S. seen as degenerating
Published: 05/18/2009 at 11:08 PM
India
Relations between the United States and India may be degenerating due to a shift in U.S. policy by the Obama administration toward Pakistan and China, a change from Bush administration practice that could affect India’s standing in South Asia, according to a report from Joseph Farah’s G2 Bulletin.

U.S. and South Asian analysts warn that bilateral ties between the two countries may begin to suffer due to differing perceptions on Pakistan, Afghanistan, China and Iran, as well as issues over India’s nuclear weapons arsenal and civil nuclear cooperation between the two countries.

One analyst observed that Democrat administrations tend to favor Pakistan while Republican presidents favor India. In the decade since agreement on a U.S.-India Strategic Partnership, the initiative has leveled off in terms of progress. It also is the case since the signing in October of the U.S.-India Nuclear Deal in which the U.S. is to provide assistance to India’s civilian nuclear energy program.

The agreement came with considerable opposition due to previous U.S. concern that India would divert nuclear technology for weapons development. There also was concern that the agreement would reverse U.S. non-proliferation efforts that only would serve to encourage such countries as Iran and North Korea to develop weapons based on their nuclear development programs.

The strain already is apparent on India. The U.S. policy shift not only toward Pakistan but also China has caused a shift in the strategic landscape in South Asia. The change also will affect India’s strategic autonomy and interests.

Robert Blackwill, who was U.S. ambassador to India from 2001 to 2003, has warned that there is a “steady decline in our bilateral ties,” and the relationship will require “hard work and skillful diplomacy” to keep the “U.S.-India relationship on its current plateau.”

Blackwill sees the problems based on differing perceptions on Pakistan, Afghanistan, China and Iran, India’s nuclear weapons, civil nuclear cooperation, in addition to protectionism, climate change and the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, or CTBT. India refuses to sign it.

Observers believe that nuclear weapons provide a country such as India “big power” status and that India’s rulers won’t realize it if they don’t have nuclear weapons or if their status is low in a global nuclear hierarchy.

More directly, however, the U.S.-India Strategic Partnership has been altered just within the first 100 days of the Obama administration in terms of China’s global economic and strategic primacy and Pakistan strategic, political and military primacy at the regional level in South Asia.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 16 Mar 2012 20:41

Same thing for another country wont be repeated

Observers believe that nuclear weapons provide a country such as China “big power” status and that China’s rulers won’t realize it if they don’t have nuclear weapons or if their status is low in a global nuclear hierarchy.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 16 Mar 2012 20:57

A must watch lecture on method of "American control of Indian narrative" . - by Rajeev Malhotra.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Mar 2012 21:13

Lilo wrote:A must watch lecture on method of "American control of Indian narrative" . - by Rajeev Malhotra.

Brilliant

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 16 Mar 2012 21:18

Very good. This was an article in 2001-2004 in the rediff.

Now it is a video and very good to explain to many Indians.

Lot of these are cold war era policies but they are still being sponsered by third parties.

Which other country would be interested in keeping these 'India studies'' going on

The major ones would be Pakistan and China. The money is still being given to these studies.

Earlier it was coming from the US depts and now the money is coming from these countries.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 16 Mar 2012 21:23

Its interesting that folks in India while claiming to be opposed to the US support the Amercian narrative of India by suppressing the Indian narrative as being Hindu oriented or not being pseudo-secular enough !!!

What to say of those in the US that do it too?

M_Srini had coinded the term MUTU to describe them all.

MUTU= More Unkilly than Unkil.

Note use of K instead of C

An uncle is a popular figure in folklore of having good thoughts about the nephew. The word avuncular is used often for genial persons.

Hower "Unkil" is Shakuni mama type who wants to throttle the nephew!

arun · Post by **arun** » 16 Mar 2012 21:25

putnanja wrote:US threatens sanctions against India over Iran oil

Meanwhile ...................

Govt. clears the way for hassle free payments to Iran for crude oil

45% of payment will be in INR and the budget passed today has waived taxes on this payment for Iranian crude.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 16 Mar 2012 22:30

This Indian kid is being punished for trying to keep a watch on his belongings. Racism someone

http://news.yahoo.com/dharun-ravi-found ... -news.html

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Mar 2012 22:37

^^^ seriously?

praksam · Post by **praksam** » 16 Mar 2012 22:38

Jarita wrote:This Indian kid is being punished for trying to keep a watch on his belongings. Racism someone

http://news.yahoo.com/dharun-ravi-found ... -news.html

Just check the comments,You'll get the Idea

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/1 ... 53616.html

http://www.facebook.com/InSession

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2012/0 ... in_ru.html

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 16 Mar 2012 23:02

^^^ All those racist commentators can be targeted for bias intimidation now. "Animal farm" anyone. The following comment is appropos

This is truly a sad day in American Justice. The jury got this one so wrong.

I have for many years felt the gay rights movement deserved its equality. I've argued on their behalf, I've addressed letters to our political leaders... I've written articles at their request in support of legislation. Today, seeing the extreme prejudice with which the gay community treated this case, has shown me the fool I have been.

The gay rights movement is not about equality. It is about forcing everyone to believe, see and feel as they do, with no moral compass, no hint of respecting others interfering in their self gratifying goals.

A few weeks back I publically disagreed with Governor Christy's veto of the Gay Marriage law... Today I see his wisdom.

This movement must be stopped. Here and now. It must be prevented from forcing itself into our university dorm rooms and destroying lives. It must be marginalized and shown for the immoral cult movement that it is. I'm a democrat, but our republican leaders are right, this movement and its headlong rush to elevate itself and its people above the rights of others are pursuing an adjenda of "unnatural" and "detrimental, and ultimately destructive values that are cuastic to the very foundations of civilization."

It's time for the majority to unite and demand legislation to show this movement for what it is and force it back into the shadows. It's time to fight back and protect kids like Dharun Ravi from predators on what is supposed to be a safe college campus. It's time to be heard and to be hard louder than the often maniacal comments on the other side.

As to the defense fund for Dharun, our company would be honored to launch and sponsor a website to promote that cause if his defense team feels it appropriate.

Tyler's death was a tragedy brought about by M.B. Dharun's conviction just adds a second trajedy on top. Yes, the devil is dancing in New Brunswick tonight.... And M.B may be lining up your child as his next target.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 16 Mar 2012 23:35

if it was a white guy who did it, the reaction wouldn't be so strong. you'd have Fox news bombarding 24/7 about how it was just an immature jerk who was playing around. this is a good lesson for Indians though. if they think they will get the same treatment as the locals, this should be a good eye opener. nothing of the sort. I feel sorry for the guy. hopefully, he'll still make something of himself in life.