India-US Strategic News and Discussion

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby archan » 12 Jan 2014 01:20

CRamS wrote:Guys, I just saw a puke worthy viewpoint by Ajay Shukla on UnDyTv. The guy is either a total moron or a paid mouthpiece of US.

Ajay Shulka was claiming that DK wanted to accept some form of plea but MEA put a spanner in the works. And he says that was done to protect MEA turf instead of watching for Indian interests. With idiots like him on Indian media, do we need any condescending US newspaper editorials?

^ kindly word your posts better and go easy on the cuss words.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby archan » 12 Jan 2014 01:23

Madhusudhan wrote:Looking through those Facebook pages, there is one post from Feb of 2013 saying that her stay has been extended by 1 year. If so, the expulsion is just about moving their return date ahead by less than one month. Not much of a response really.....

We don't know if the same person has been expelled, unless I missed something. Either way, completing one's term vs getting thrown out especially after being shown to be extremely poor at their own work (i.e. diplomacy, and the usage of diplomatic language) are not the same thing IMHO. Regardless whether there was 1 month left or 1 day left.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Madhusudhan » 12 Jan 2014 02:00

@archan.. agreed that it was a strong reaction.. But given everything DK had to go through, it just doesn't feel like true reciprocity yet.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby saip » 12 Jan 2014 02:01

I think her husband was expelled as he is of the same grade as DK. Obviously the above female diplomat outranks her husband.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby saip » 12 Jan 2014 02:03

I believe all OCIs should send the tumblr link to their Congressman/Senators

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby CRamS » 12 Jan 2014 02:26

Lets not be facetious here about DKputting her kids in an American school in Delhi etc as someone joked earlier, but I think one must look at the human angle too. I mean poor DK has had to leave her young kids behind and heaven knows how she is going to manage her family. Will they move to India? I hope this doesn't end up in some kind of a personal tragedy.

I mean, SR and her hubby are pretty soon going to realize the travails of existence in US. Once they are on their own, they will see the reality of life in US. Likewise, DK is sure going to miss her life in US, and assuming her kids move to India, its not going to be easy. It will be ultimate irony if both DK and SR look back nostalgically at the quite reasonable arrangement they had given the circumstances both were born into. Thats the beauty of the Indian way, one does find a quiescent state of equilibrium based on the cards you are dealt with. (I am of course not justifying poverty or exploitation, just a statement of fact that US imposing its laws in the Indian context does more harm than good).

And does anybody think the self righteous whites who so ostensibly care so much for the "exploited maid", the pompous WP/NYT editorial toadies, the frauds at the US embassy in Delhi, the Preet Barara Uncle Toms types will spare a thought for them once the dust settles?

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 02:37

Singha wrote:>> National Coalition of South Asian Organisations (NCSO), which comprises of nearly four dozen rights bodies.
seems to be quite the sunrise industry if south asians themselves have 4 dozen bodies devoted to human rights alone.

If one goes through the member orgs of the coalition from here, it paints a very strange picture. There must be lot more than the 48 SA orgs by the way. All these are setup so that the children can write something on the lines of "I have lead ..., I have raised $..., I have volunteered ... hrs." on their resume while applying for Ivy leagues. It is very difficult to get into Ivy leagues what with grade infaltion at the HS level, an activist administration headed by assorted Ivy league lawyers/Public policy/Political Science kinds. They are very good at playing politics - tactically brilliant, photogenic on the Idiot Box, bombastic but taking the country to cleaners in the long run. :((
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby sivab » 12 Jan 2014 03:03

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 694831.cms

Devyani case: Sangeeta's in-laws had worked with expelled US diplomat

The parents-in-law of Sangeeta Richard, the domestic help at the centre of the India-US diplomatic spat, worked with US diplomat Wayne May who was expelled by India for his role in the Devyani Khobragade episode. This seems to be the main reason why May is said to have gone out of his way to facilitate the "evacuation'' of Sangeeta's husband Philip and children by arranging T-visas (trafficking) for them.

Many have wondered as to why US authorities approved surreptitious evacuation of Sangeeta's family even at the cost of antagonizing a strategic partner. India had said May was responsible for the unilateral action by the State Department in evacuating the family and the subsequent arrest of Khobragade. May left India on Saturday.

May worked as the chief of the embassy's security service representing US' Bureau of Diplomatic Security. He was also looking after issues related to trafficking. The diplomatic security service was responsible for the arrest and handcuffing of Khobragade before she was handed over to US marshals. There is suspicion that the counselor, who has put in more than 27 years of service, may have used his influence with the diplomatic security in New York to ensure that Khobragade was subjected to the ``standard operating procedure'' after she was picked up from outside her children's schools.

May's conduct is said to be primarily the reason for the government's assessment that the US embassy had acted in "bad faith''. The action by May disregarded prior legal processes in India, including a case of cheating against Sangeeta's husband and a non-bailable warrant against Sangeeta, which insisted that the dispute between Khobragade and Sangeeta had to be contested in an Indian court. Sources here though said the government is not looking at the alleged role of May's wife in procuring air tickets for the Sangeeta's family.

External affairs minister Salman Khurshid on Saturday blamed the US for what he described as a 'mini- crisis'' saying that the incident could have been avoided if the US had warned foreign secretary Sujatha Singh and other senior Indian officials who were in the US just before Khobragade's arrest on December 12. In a television interview, he said India's "immediate, immediate'' concerns had been addressed.

Later talking to reporters, he said there was "no stand-off'' between India and the US. "There is no reason now to feel any immediate concern about any outcome that might be adverse or particularly disturbing in nature," he said. Khurshid and Singh met Khobragade at South Block on Saturday. She told journalists that the government and her lawyer would speak on her behalf.

Speaking to Devil's Advocate on CNN-IBN, Khurshid also said there was going to be no rethink on withdrawal of privileges to the US embassy staff "at least for now''. India has said the decision to withdraw diplomatic privileges and pull out barricades from outside the embassy was reciprocal, and not retaliatory, measure.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Lilo » 12 Jan 2014 03:30

^ Now there must be photos of Richard's parents (who served the Mays) obliviously grooming or feeding Paco the May's TFTA pet dog and getting snapped in the process by the Mays.
By next day May's extended family and her Massa diplomatic peer group would have already compared and established anatomical superiority of their TFTA Massa dog Breed fattened on a daily protein diet as compared to the SDRE Richard's parents able to afford meat only once a week , on their Facebook wall comments.

Edit: Ohh wait !
The gardener in the pic posted could in fact be the old father of Richards !!
Someone should confirm this with the May's.
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby chandrasekhar.m » 12 Jan 2014 03:39

sivab wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Devyani-case-Sangeetas-in-laws-had-worked-with-expelled-US-diplomat/articleshow/28694831.cms

Devyani case: Sangeeta's in-laws had worked with expelled US diplomat

The parents-in-law of Sangeeta Richard, the domestic help at the centre of the India-US diplomatic spat, worked with US diplomat Wayne May who was expelled by India for his role in the Devyani Khobragade episode. This seems to be the main reason why May is said to have gone out of his way to facilitate the "evacuation'' of Sangeeta's husband Philip and children by arranging T-visas (trafficking) for them.

Many have wondered as to why US authorities approved surreptitious evacuation of Sangeeta's family even at the cost of antagonizing a strategic partner. India had said May was responsible for the unilateral action by the State Department in evacuating the family and the subsequent arrest of Khobragade. May left India on Saturday.

May worked as the chief of the embassy's security service representing US' Bureau of Diplomatic Security. He was also looking after issues related to trafficking. The diplomatic security service was responsible for the arrest and handcuffing of Khobragade before she was handed over to US marshals. There is suspicion that the counselor, who has put in more than 27 years of service, may have used his influence with the diplomatic security in New York to ensure that Khobragade was subjected to the ``standard operating procedure'' after she was picked up from outside her children's schools.

May's conduct is said to be primarily the reason for the government's assessment that the US embassy had acted in "bad faith''. The action by May disregarded prior legal processes in India, including a case of cheating against Sangeeta's husband and a non-bailable warrant against Sangeeta, which insisted that the dispute between Khobragade and Sangeeta had to be contested in an Indian court. Sources here though said the government is not looking at the alleged role of May's wife in procuring air tickets for the Sangeeta's family.

External affairs minister Salman Khurshid on Saturday blamed the US for what he described as a 'mini- crisis'' saying that the incident could have been avoided if the US had warned foreign secretary Sujatha Singh and other senior Indian officials who were in the US just before Khobragade's arrest on December 12. In a television interview, he said India's "immediate, immediate'' concerns had been addressed.

Later talking to reporters, he said there was "no stand-off'' between India and the US. "There is no reason now to feel any immediate concern about any outcome that might be adverse or particularly disturbing in nature," he said. Khurshid and Singh met Khobragade at South Block on Saturday. She told journalists that the government and her lawyer would speak on her behalf.

Speaking to Devil's Advocate on CNN-IBN, Khurshid also said there was going to be no rethink on withdrawal of privileges to the US embassy staff "at least for now''. India has said the decision to withdraw diplomatic privileges and pull out barricades from outside the embassy was reciprocal, and not retaliatory, measure.

Why would the government not look into the wife who allegedly bought tax-exempt tickets for the Richards' family when that is only reserved for Embassy staff. "Stupidity is not an excuse to break the law" anywhere, not just the US. Perhaps this can be an excuse to remove such a ticket quota altogether for everyone from the Embassy.

And since there is suspicion that this guy could have influenced that the SOP be applied to DK in all its cruelty, we shouldn't have let him go so easily, if there were any grounds of arresting him.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 03:45

At the risk of termed a MUTU, at least some one bit of Alicia May's banter is simple humor (correcting the bit which came out not quite right as pointed out by Mort below) bitching and blowing off steam - especially that part where she says she has diplomatic immunity in reply to how much damage two Hil... girls can do. I do take offence at the veggie jokes though. I would like to invite her to my town(a university town) or any other university town and face the music. Most campus towns have a large number of vegetarians - about 10% where as it is about 3% of the US population. Of course, I too miss satvik vegetarian food - food in India simply tastes much much much better than the same here in US. All these GMO stuff completely fscked up the taste. Oh the meat that goes into hamburgers - don't talk about it, don't even talk about it.
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 12 Jan 2014 03:58

:x ^^^No it's not humorous. Mrs. May is in India on official business and not holiday. She is there as a representative of the US govt. and not as a private citizen. She is being paid by the American taxpayer for food, living and expenses on top of her salary. Saying or doing anything offensive in public about your host country is a no-no. The DoS has rules about this with social media because anything you say may be used against you. I can't believe people are so eff-ing stupid.

She and her colleagues may have caused financial damage to the US on the order of billions of Dollars. WTF!?

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 04:00

Supratik wrote:India draws extreme opinions from western visitors. Some hate it while others love it so much that they go native.

Ambassador Moynihan for example and his daughter Myra Moynihan as well.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2014 04:02

I think Wayne May might have EJ connections. It just doesn't make sense for a two bit policeman to bring the two countries to such a diplomatic stalemate.

matrimc, Regardless of Ms May's banter its hows a very demeaning outlook towards the host countnry. She should examine why is she in India and ask for a transfer back.


The Facebook posts show a repeated pattern of contempt for the country she is posted to.
Her own admission of soliciting customers for some one who smuggled in pearls shows she is an "accessory to fact" which her so called strict policeman husband should have cautioned her.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Raja » 12 Jan 2014 04:04

I would love to see the look on her face if tomorrow morning there were protestors with billboards of her comments in front of the embassy and the entire thing spreads like a wildfire. Would certainly go a long way in exonerating DK as a face saving measure by the Obama government.

If MEA had real balls and wit, they would have already passed it to media hush hush style.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby sanjaykumar » 12 Jan 2014 04:22

Unfortunate incident. I am sure they are busy taking down FB pages in all the world'scapitals.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Sanjay » 12 Jan 2014 04:41

If May was in charge of Dip Sec, he had full immunity.

You cannot arrest somebody with full immunity - especially if you know they have full immunity.

It would be a breach of the VCCR. India has observed it to the letter and rightly so.

Vengeance has to come against vulnerable consular officials.

Whether we like it or not, India could not have done better.

(1) PB looks like an idiot (I mean what imbecile starts an incident then tries to bargain it down to a misdemeanour ? - plead guilty for no jail term after all of that drama: smacks of prosecutorial intimidation of a defendant).

What is worse is that the prize idiot PB decides to go public thus ensuring that there was no way DK could accept even if MEA didn't want her to.

(2) The blinkers have dropped - US standing in India could not be lower (India's standing in the US was never high so we lost nothing).

Obama seems like an anti-India president - which he is.

(3) SD looks pathetic.

The big loser in this is the US embassy in New Delhi - think of it your head of Dip Sec was responsible for the biggest possible reduction in security around the Embassy (the barricades - however we argue - were intended for protection of the embassy).

On the other point about the WRDs (whining racist diplomats), why wait for the MEA ?

Let us see if we can put a package together with a covering letter and send to the Indian media, post to facebook, e-mail to the SD and White House as well as to every political party in India.

I mean, has anyone sent it to NAMO or the CPM ?

What do we have to lose ?
Last edited by Sanjay on 12 Jan 2014 04:55, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 04:46

sanjaykumar wrote:I will however comment that it is not that the cows in Delhi are skinny, it is more the cows in America are obese.

To add to that the people who eat those cows are inheriting the characteristics too.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Nandu » 12 Jan 2014 04:56

Sanjay wrote:(1) PB looks like an idiot (I mean what imbecile starts an incident then tries to bargain it down to a misdemeanour ? - plead guilty for no jail term after all of that drama: smacks of prosecutorial intimidation of a defendant).


Actually, this is SOP for prosecutors in the US.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Nandu » 12 Jan 2014 05:01

Why aren't the FB posts with the dog on the tumblr site? Need a site with all the FB posts collected together so we can sent it appropriate people.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Sanjay » 12 Jan 2014 05:03

You are correct but strictly speaking it is a Yes and No in terms of being SOP.

It is SOP when you think you can't get a conviction on the larger charge or are at least uncertain.

It is also not something done after you create a diplomatic incident and ratchet up the stakes for everyone.

You also never ever go public with discussions. Attorneys should keep negotiations out of the public eye - it compromises the integrity of the process.

The practice is de facto in use in other jurisdictions but I can say this - our practice is to only advise clients to accept when they've already admitted to us they are guilty !

What PB did was exceeding stupid and reeks of a combination of hubris and incompetence.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 05:04

There are two explanations for the racist comments

1. Occam's razor: These people are really racist.

2. Chanakyan explanation (my mind may be very twisted to go looking for Chankayanness but just putting it forth anyways): If I am an American "agent" Diplomat/Consular officer posted in India and start behaving like a "Paki" who would contact me? Of course, the ones who think of all Indians as "hindoo kuttas" and teach the same to their children. Conveniently my embassy is right across the street from theirs :twisted:
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Vayutuvan » 12 Jan 2014 05:07

putnanja wrote:From what I hear, the US diplomatic corps entrance is not that hard. And not many people take up these exams either.

Moreover the pay scale is nothing to write home about. For example, top Police Officer with several years of seniority might be making between $50K-$60K.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Kati » 12 Jan 2014 05:17

Alice may is from texas, right?
good chance of her being a southern baptist = EJ.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby putnanja » 12 Jan 2014 05:29

Devyani case: Row shows India fell off Obama's map

...
The vehemence of India's response possibly surprised US, but India could hardly have done otherwise as the deliberation with which the US diplomatic security service acted almost suggests she was being made an example of.

Claims that authorities merely followed the book seem unconvincing as the view grows that US increasingly sees ties with India in transactional terms, with a crib list over market access and stalled reforms obscuring a larger confluence of interests.

...
A deadening of sensitivities has meant that mid-level officers dealing with a case like Khobragade did not think that a higher call is needed as the events could impact relations with an important partner in south Asia.
...
Despite the congealing ties, the nonchalance with which US treated the fallout of the case has not been fully explained, though some quarters see it as a reflection of just how far off India has fallen off the map for the Obama White House.

The audacious disregard of India's legal system and extraction of the maid's family in order to preempt anticipated reprisals against Khobragade's impending arrest points to a return to an older, and what was till recently was felt to be an obsolete, formulation of estranged democracies.
...

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ParasuramanS » 12 Jan 2014 05:32

There is no such thing as a "strategic" partnership, only "strategic" self-interests. At the end of the day, India needs to look after itself. This whole episode (one of many such to come) where Indian citizens are brazenly kidnapped by foreign countries in the name of human rights violations is a symptom of the real bigger problem that we are blind to. At the moment, we are in a death spiral - where the Uniting India (UI) forces are loosing out to the Breaking India (BI) forces. Those that have not read Rajiv Malhotra's books need to do so NOW!

We need to start dismantling this empire of Breaking India forces that are being arrayed against us.

From Christian missionaries, to "HR" NGOs, all abetted by US congressional groups, EU bodies and Governments of the Nordic countries, to Saudi-funded "Islamic Study" groups, to Pakistani-funded "Mujahideen" factions, all the way to China-aided "Maoists" to create a Christianistan, Dalitistan, Mughalistan, Maoistan, Khalistan, etc.

The first step and most important step is to recognize the problem, and put up a strong defence -

1) Foreign relations on strict reciprocity (this includes # of missions, # of staff, site location of missions, as well types of activities allowed). This will solve 50% of the problem.

2) No foreign Governmental organizations or NGOs to be allowed operations under the garb of charity, religious education, etc. Cessation of financing operations, Visas, etc. Period. IF they want to aid, the financial assistance must be provided to the Govt. of India. A separate department can be set-up with completely auditable and traceable transparency (with even representatives of donor nations) to avoid concerns of corruption. If they refuse, you know why. It was never charity to begin with.

3) Automatic fines and bans for foreign organizations or corporations distributing BI literature or setting up online websites for India, whether be it "headless" maps, or hate-speech.

This will allow the UI forces (internal peace, communal harmony, economic growth, development of social equality, etc.) to have a steady-hand. One has a great hope that the above will come to represent what is known as the "MODI Doctrine". When one sees it this way, it is not hard to fathom why this one man has such an impressive range of forces arrayed against him. 2014 is a make-it/break-it election year.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby RCase » 12 Jan 2014 05:34

Is there anyway to get the religious affiliation of the Mays? What church did they attend? Anything out in public domain that would suggest they are born agains?

This thing is so incestuous ... DK hires maid, whose in-laws work for the guy who is turn working for BDS. Of the various maids, it seems too much of a coincidence to pick SR. Doesn't MEA do some kind of background check/ police verification etc. on SR for issuing of govt passport? Wouldn't it at least trigger some greater due diligence when a person has such connections with the receiving country?

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Rony » 12 Jan 2014 05:42

No backing down from Uncle Sam

India indulging in diplomatic heavy hitting is something not seen or heard in a long time. India's aggressive mien in the Devyani Khobragade row against the US stunned one and all.

Diplomacy at one level is also a game of shadows, even as smoke and mirrors takes it to the next level of competence by adding a mix of statecraft, intrigue and subterfuge.

Once the Rubicon is crossed and the Deep State gets involved, then gamers have to move to level 4, essentially Code Red.

My sense is that the deep state was definitely at the vanguard of the Devyani row. It was Code Red in the foreign office situation room.

How and why remains a mystery, for there is a complete clampdown on the whys and wherefores. What is interesting is why India took such a hard-line position on Devyani and why this problem became intractable. India's retaliation and the scaling up and intensity of the fusillade convinces me that this was no ordinary diplomatic incident.

Hostility

Equally it is clear that the foreign office, though the nodal point in the retaliatory fire was taking instructions from the National Security Advsior in this very sensitive matter.

The role played by the core foreign office team led by Sujatha Singh has been exemplary to say the least.
By upping the ante against the US mission in the capital, it was sending out a bold and brazen message that Devyani was a prized asset who needed to be brought back.

The whiff of rumours that Sangeeta Richard, Devyani's domestic help was a mole in her household created a flutter in the dovecotes.


I am not alluding to an inter play between George Smiley and Karla.

No, not just yet. For the uninitiated, these were two of the chief protagonists of spy novelist John Le Carre's books on the Cold War.

We may never ever get to know the whole truth about Devyani and Sangeeta Richard, but that there is a story beyond the apparent is undeniable.

Sangeeta Richards' links with the US Embassy, tenuous but laid bare by media and the alacrity with which her husband and kids were flown secretly to the US around the same time not only aroused suspicion, but convinced watchers that a bigger game was unfolding.

The fact India asked for the withdrawal of Wayne May from the US Embassy, for he was the man responsible for the evacuation of Sangeeta Richard's family meant that the wound runs deep on the Indian side.


Which brings us to the simple question of why India treated the US with such disdain? More importantly, why did India exert such pressure and display open hostility?

Prestige

Yes, India's diplomatic prestige was at stake.

A young Indian woman had been mal-treated by US Marshals.

In this jingoistically charged atmosphere, it wasn't plain and simple optics, but a sinister game of tit for tat.

India's anger, justified was progressively worse for the US than it has ever been for Pakistan where mind games are the norm. India has always had an uneasy relationship with the US, never trusting them implicitly, leaning towards socialist Soviet Union which have proved to be a friend in times of crises.

An undercurrent of anti-Americanism is embedded in the psyches of Indians.

Despite this as the underlying credo, India normally behaves like this with its immediate neighbour Pakistan.

Since Mrs' Gandhi's time George Griffin, then Political Counsellor, 33 years ago.

That was in retaliation against similar action being taken by the US against Prabhakar Menon, an Indian diplomat. Now, let us examine the larger issue of diplomatic immunity here.

And whether, the US behaves differently when confronted with reality, you know the proverb as old as the Aravali hills of the shoe being on the other foot.

So, let me draw a parallel here and take a dekko across the border. Raymond Allen Davis, a former US army and CIA contractor created a furore with his intemperate actions.

Almost three years ago, Davis reportedly killed two armed men in broad daylight in Lahore.

Although the US government stated that Davis was protected by diplomatic immunity because of his employment with the US consulate in Lahore, Davis was jailed and criminally charged by Pakistani authorities with double murder and the illegal possession of a firearm.

Further, a car coming to aid Davis killed a third Pakistani man in a "hit and run" while speeding on the wrong side of the road. Two months later, Davis was released after the families of the two killed men were paid $2.4 million as blood money. Judges acquitted him on all charges and Davis immediately left Pakistan.

Immunity

This incident raised Cain in Pakistan.

The US' asserted that Davis was protected under the principle of diplomatic immunity due to his role as an "administrative and technical official" attached to the Lahore consulate.

The US government claimed that Davis was protected under the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations and demanded he be released from custody immediately.
Sounds familiar.

Pakistan foreign minister Shah Mehmood Qureshi sensing the indignant mood at home said that Davis was not even a diplomat and as such cannot be given blanket diplomatic immunity.

Now let us understand the context here.

Devyani didn't shoot anyone down, she purportedly committed visa fraud and gave a wrongful declaration about her help.

Most importantly, a month after incident, US officials revealed Davis was a contractor for the CIA after it was reported in The Guardian.

Following this The Telegraph reported that Davis was acting head of the CIA in Pakistan.

Bottomline, India decided not take any prisoners this time.

Sen_K
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Sen_K » 12 Jan 2014 05:45

Alicia Muller's facebook page has now been taken down

ParasuramanS
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ParasuramanS » 12 Jan 2014 05:50

As per the above Dailymail article, Sangeeta Richards may well be a spy, and an Indian traitor. Not the hapless victim she was made out to be. This whisking out of the family is the smoking gun.

What happened to Rabinder Singh's family?

IFS and other Indian agencies better start checking links of staff and their relatives to foreign diplomats, and NGOs with utmost urgency! I wonder how much we are compromised.

Sanjay
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Sanjay » 12 Jan 2014 05:56

Sen_K wrote:Alicia Muller's facebook page has now been taken down


I am still of the view that the contents need to be shared with the Indian political parties and media.

Keep things simmering.

Amber G.
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Amber G. » 12 Jan 2014 05:57

Image
Yes, India's diplomatic prestige was at stake. A young Indian woman had been maltreated by US Marshals

Philip
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 12 Jan 2014 06:00

Tx Rony,that was a very well put description of the issue and the larger untold story.We've barely seen the tip of the iceberg.

Paras,I've been saying the same for years.Dubya Bush and his EJ team were allegedly using the post codes to send in huge largesse to scores of dubious "Christian" organisations,esp. in the tribal and backward areas.The GOI in the last decade particularly,took their eye off the covert infiltration by the US using EJ groups.The result,we get quislings like Udayakumar who tried to sabotage the KKNM N-plant,was found in the same house where explosives killed 8 people recently,and who is being wooed by none other than the AAP who are the recipients of much moolah from the Ford Foundation,a CIA benami entity!

The tendency of any expat/diplomats,ours included,when posted abroad is to club together with "folks from home",to avoid being homesick.The social and lifestyle differences and habits of the nation posted to remains a source of curiosity and sometimes amusement.Some hate it ,some love it.However,racial bigotry is predominantly the perogative of the white species,esp. WASPs,with the "Ugly Americans" leading the way.They do not in general understand another nation's culture or religion,neither want to do so,nor respect the laws of the land.The "yellow plate" is seen as a sign of invulnerability that absolves the individual of virtually any crime.I quoted an instance where the young son of a v. high ranking US diplomutt,boasted about his planned drug smuggling using the diplomatic pouch.His crony,another Yanqui,was known to be involved heavily in the racket (never caught).A bottle of duty-free hooch is considered enough to make any native salivate and grovel.Natives in lesser well-off nations long to be invited to embassy functions and soirees.

We too often display our inferiority,wanting to join exclusive clubs of the white man,where native multi-millionaires ,corporate giants,rub shoulders with ordinary seamen from tramp steamers,who can barely rub two coins together get temp. club membership! Unfortunately,some of our species ,politicos especially,have this lust for "white meat".Lays are easy to come by and some are easily compromised in honey traps,especially if the spouse of the victim is from an orthodox background.If in our country,legions have prostituted themselves at the altar of firang largesse,who can blame them for treating us with a degree of contempt? The embassy club scam is a shining example where our Delhiwallah worthies lapped up what was on offer.

The disgusting blogs however expose the exceptionally low intellectual level and GK of US diplomats.British diplomats are much better trained and made to acclimatise to native conditions.The British Foreign Office and its superb diplomacy is one reason why they were able to create a global empire upon which the "sun never set".Protocol is strictly followed.The current British ambassador spent several months before taking up his post,travelling incognito in India to get a feel of the country and interacted with many Indians across the spectrum to understand our culture and society.Contrast this with the cheap blogs of the Yanquis.Beneath contempt!

PS:Conspiracy against India,XCpts:

http://promoteliberty.wordpress.com/201 ... -in-india/

In India’s case this “standardised data coding” has been married to IMA’s survey. This has been used to such a degree that even the diverse language groups of India have been divided into PIN codes. The ability to send evangelists that are familiar to language and culture greatly facilitates the speed at which conversion can happen. It is also cost effective since tactics can be formed at home base. This also enables any Christian missionary organisation anywhere in the world to source any ethno-cultural or ethno-linguistic data on India at the click of the mouse. So let’s say if one of Bush’s Christian evangelical cronies wants to check out which missionary organisation is working with the Banjaras in Nalgonda, Khammam and Krishna districts in Andhra Pradesh, all he has to do is plug into this highly guarded database. It will tell him how many Banjaras were converted to Christianity over a specified period, the names of Indian Christian researchers working in community and which evangelical ministry coordinating the exercise of “saving souls”. Just about any detail he wants is available on demand. Obviously, it flows the other way as well. So assuming that somebody at the CIA headquarters wants information on a particular district or region all that needs to be done is to call up Bush’s mentor Rev Billy Graham. Graham will in turn log into databases maintained by a network of American Evangelical Missions. All this can happen in seconds and this is how technology has made evangelical activities so potentially dangerous.


The “spying out” missions that generated the vast ethnographic data of the Indian people also involved detailed study of Dr KS Singh’s ‘People of India Project’ that was launched in 1985 by the Anthropological Society of India (ASI). Under Singh’s leadership, the ASI undertook an ambitious project to chart one of the most far-reaching ethnographic studies in the 20th century. Five hundred scholars spent over 26,000 field days to compile information for these volumes. This gigantic research work came handy for American and Indian strategists to draft their evangelical plans for India. According to Luis Bush, “Never before has this kind of information on India been so carefully surveyed, prepared, well published and distributed…We do not believe it is accidental. God is allowing us to “spy out the land” that we might go in and claim both it and its inhabitants for Him.”

The question that will rattle not only the Indian government, but also outrage the Indian citizens is whether the American-funded “spying missions” carried out by Indian and foreign missionary agencies through more than a decade has resulted in the preparation of a ‘Strategic Index of India’ at the CIA headquarters?

ramana
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2014 06:15

Rony, The writer Sandeep Bamzai uses colorful language to describe a simple issue as AmberG pointed out.
It could be fluff article to puff up MEA which still has a lot to do.

And NSA getting credit is nice but thats his job.

He has failed in two ways:
- As NSA being the apex of all the intel agencies he let the Richards family exfiltrate out of India which enabled Wayne May to have DK arrested by his cohorts in BDS and subjected to custodial rape as teach a lesson. Minimum he should have alerted the Delhi Police exit control folks as case was pending and US was ratcheting.
- Second besides being NSA he was former Secy MEA, i.e head of the IFS cadre. Under his watch one of his juniors : a female and a disadvantaged member was subjected to arrest and gross humiliation. What did he do and what did he not do?

KLNMurthy
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 12 Jan 2014 06:18

dear anmol, can you ping me at brf dot murthy at gmail? thanks

ParasuramanS
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ParasuramanS » 12 Jan 2014 06:22

Shivshankar Menon is highly over-rated. How stupid does one need to be to land in a fiasco such as Sharm el-Sheikh? Even the most junior BRFite will know the terrain enough to understand that the statement was completely unacceptable.

In additon to Shivshankar Menon, Nirupama Rao is the other airhead that should take the blame.

ramana
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2014 06:31

ParaS, Its not about blame but accountability.

The whole MEA had given this non-reciprocal freebies to US diplomats all the while their own consular officials were being subjected to law suits etc in NYC. Why were the NR facilities given and since when?
Moreover as seen from the Mays' couple Facebook postings they were undeserving of the courtesies extended to them having a sneering/condescending attitude towards India and Indians.

In the repeated Prisoner's Dilemma, Ackermann shows that evolution of cooperation occurs when tit for tat strategy is used.
Yet MEA strategy seems to be "aah bhains mujhe maar!' Come and beat me please!

Can the MEA Secy explain to the public why those non-reciprocal facilities were given and who was responsible for it?

And what caused the delay to remove the barricades, which Shashi Tharoor a Minister says were put in unilaterally by the US Embassy, till after DK arrest?

All that India did so far is to remove these and not yet retaliated in equal measure.

Bade
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Bade » 12 Jan 2014 07:00

This ally business began a long time ago with the Clinton visit as I recall.
http://hindu.com/2000/09/09/stories/01090005.htm
NEW YORK, SEPT. 8. Describing India and the United States as ``natural allies'', the Prime Minister, Mr. A. B. Vajpayee, set the context and tenor of his forthcoming parleys with the U.S. President, Mr. Bill Clinton, next week, asserting that an Indo- U.S. partnership was ``important, above all, for Asia''. Addressing an influential gathering of opinion makers, soon after his arrival here, Mr. Vajpayee also said an Indo-U.S. partnership was necessitated by ``our many common interests in the region'' which ``demand it from us''.

In a detailed address which reaffirmed and highlighted afresh the specific policy contours of the Government's approach to international strategic and regional issues, Mr. Vajpayee told the Asia Society, which he was addressing for the second time since he became Prime Minister, that it was his belief that when the history of the Indo-U.S. partnership was written, the six- month period between March and September 2000, beginning with Mr. Clinton's visit to India and culminating with his present return visit would be ``seen as the defining moment''.

anmol
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby anmol » 12 Jan 2014 07:03

KLNMurthy wrote:dear anmol, can you ping me at brf dot murthy at gmail? thanks

done.

KLP Dubey
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby KLP Dubey » 12 Jan 2014 07:06

Irrelevant post about DK's husband deleted.

It has been stated earlier as well that unless information related to the husband which is germane to the case is available, no speculation on the topic will be permitted - rohitvats.
Last edited by rohitvats on 13 Jan 2014 13:04, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: irrelevant and speculative post about DK's husband deleted


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