Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 29th May 2012

asprinzl · Post by **asprinzl** » 09 Jul 2012 06:06

Q:Can Pakistan become the next Syria?
A: Pakistan at present is worse than Syria. Pakistan is already a lost cause. It is a failed state. The relevant media outlets, talking heads and political rats don't mention it or refuse to mention it but Pakistan is a failed state. The powers that be refuse to mention it because they would be in a quandry for a solution. So they all sing a certain song.
Avram

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 09 Jul 2012 06:08

asprinzl wrote:Q:Can Pakistan become the next Syria?
A: Pakistan at present is worse than Syria. Pakistan is already a lost cause. It is a failed state. The relevant media outlets, talking heads and political rats don't mention it or refuse to mention it but Pakistan is a failed state. The powers that be refuse to mention it because they would be in a quandry for a solution. So they all sing a certain song.
Avram

Nope. The present situation is favorable to the westerners and the next credible option for regime change is either an overt army coup or an islamist overtake.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 06:22

Virupaksha wrote: Nope. The present situation is favorable to the westerners and the next credible option for regime change is either an overt army coup or an islamist overtake.

My take on this is that an army coup is unlikely. There will be a "democratic" Islamic takeover. I am guessing that a democratic Taliban government will be elected and supported by the likes of the lawyer supporters of Qadri, the donors of Sunni-Wahhabandi LeT, and they will strike a deal with the USA to keep Iran in check. The USA can discard Pakistan after Afghanistan and one remaining hope is the pestilential Shias of Iran. Pakistan can help squeeze Iran from the east.

Despite India's pain, India may be getting less relevant to Pakistan's survival as the political leaders of the world move from the Aryan Invasion Theory to the OIT when they see that Pakistan's ain't gonna actually defeat India and India ain't gonna attack Pakistan - a threat that has always made Pakistan behave well with the west while they seek support against India.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 09 Jul 2012 06:28

We also should not forget a qazi takeover in the short term. This will have to be replaced with the qabila guards taking over in the medium term though.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 09 Jul 2012 07:02

SSridhar wrote:
krithivas wrote:Didn't the No-bright Moron Secretary of State claim/allude that the Sikh massacre was engineered by Indian Army?

LeT hand in massacre of J&K Sikhs in 2000: Jundal
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 752888.cms
Albright is another case. But, many Indian WKKs tried to tarnish our own Army. They should all be legally proceeded with for deliberately spreading misinformation.

It was Klinton Sahib in the preface to Madame Secretary book "The Mighty and the Almighty"
half bright always wrong and was right choice for Tweedledee Tweedledum Klinton.

During my visit to India in 2000, some Hindu militants decided to vent their outrage by murdering thirty-eight Sikhs in cold blood.
If I hadn’t made the trip, the victims would probably still be alive. If I hadn’t made the trip because
I feared what religious extremists might do,
I couldn’t have done my job as president of the United States.
The nature of America is such that many people define themselves—or a part of themselves—in relation to it,
for or against. This is part of the reality in which our leaders must operate.

Introduction to The Mighty and the Almighty
by William J. Clinton, 42nd President of the United States

ArunK · Post by **ArunK** » 09 Jul 2012 07:17

shiv wrote:
Virupaksha wrote: Nope. The present situation is favorable to the westerners and the next credible option for regime change is either an overt army coup or an islamist overtake.
My take on this is that an army coup is unlikely. There will be a "democratic" Islamic takeover. I am guessing that a democratic Taliban government will be elected and supported by the likes of the lawyer supporters of Qadri, the donors of Sunni-Wahhabandi LeT, and they will strike a deal with the USA to keep Iran in check. The USA can discard Pakistan after Afghanistan and one remaining hope is the pestilential Shias of Iran. Pakistan can help squeeze Iran from the east.

Despite India's pain, India may be getting less relevant to Pakistan's survival as the political leaders of the world move from the Aryan Invasion Theory to the OIT when they see that Pakistan's ain't gonna actually defeat India and India ain't gonna attack Pakistan - a threat that has always made Pakistan behave well with the west while they seek support against India.

* Contrary to popular belief that the people of Pakistan are begging the Army to step in and save them -- Mushy proclaimed this in Aspen -- the actual sentiment in the country is aginst this. Apparently NOBODY wants the Army to come out of the Barracks. Expect public chaos of the kind never seen before -- a la Egypt & Syria -- if coup happens.
* Zardari's term runs out next Sept I believe. However, he is not expected to last his full term. Polls are likely to be conducted later this year.
* If an election were to be held today, Imran Khan would sweep the polls. Imran has the support of the Mullah brigade.

Take this for what it is worth. These are not my predictions. I am just summarizing what I have been watching on Pakistani News programs.

krithivas · Post by **krithivas** » 09 Jul 2012 07:29

It is my hope and prayer that BR becomes an integral part of India's institutional memory that would eventually ferret out the garbage that is dumped on India (in this case by No-bright Moron and the great Lewinsky lover liar).

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 09 Jul 2012 08:23

RamaY wrote:By answering this type of questions, I secure my position
Pakistan is a western dog, my CT theory in OT thread not withstanding.
Currently the international system is heavily skewed towards USA/EU combine. For pakis to be the next Syria, this system has to collapse.
If history is an indicator of the future, it will take another world war for a new system to comeup.
All Bharat can do now is to create the conditions for next world war, and side with the victors one way or the other.

asprinzl wrote:Q:Can Pakistan become the next Syria?
A: Pakistan at present is worse than Syria. Pakistan is already a lost cause. It is a failed state. The relevant media outlets, talking heads and political rats don't mention it or refuse to mention it but Pakistan is a failed state. The powers that be refuse to mention it because they would be in a quandry for a solution. So they all sing a certain song.
Avram

I am now more confused than before!
If it is a failed state where is the mention of 'catastrophe' from the madam and CNN/blogs/twitter coverage?
I do not see tanks rolling and shelling of the capital city?
No mention of nuclear weapons when Pakistan has the most unsafe nuclear arsenal in the world.

I feel that only if an Islamic country is an enemy of Israel will it be branded a terrorist country or a failed state. Pakistan seems to be escaping that. I am sure Mossad knows how many Pakistani terrorist leaders plan destruction of Israel on a daily basis every minute of their lives. So why the exception handling?
Is Israeli lobby the key to declaring Pakistan a terrorist state? If so India has failed.

ManuT · Post by **ManuT** » 09 Jul 2012 08:39

abhishek_sharma wrote:Peace with Islamists: Tavleen Singh

Recommended.

---
from the article

On the day that the Foreign Secretaries of India and Pakistan met in Delhi last week, I had a personal cross-border encounter that left me worried about whether there can ever be peace with the Islamist republic next door. I use the word Islamist consciously because I believe we will not be able to talk to Pakistan purposefully until we first understand that the mindset of that country has gone from Islamic to Islamist. I say this with sadness because as a proud Punjabi, whose origins lie on that side of the border, I have always believed that the innate pragmatism and sense of humour of the average Punjabi would eventually vanquish the militant mullahs and military men who have poisoned the air of Pakistan. I believe this less today.

My cross-border encounter happened on Nidhi Razdan’s show. I was in the NDTV studio in Delhi with two Indian panelists and from Pakistan she invited a former air vice marshal called Shahzad Choudhury and a former diplomat called Akram Zaki. When Nidhi asked my view on the talks between the foreign secretaries held that morning I told her truthfully that I believed 26/11 was an act of war, and should not be discussed as mere terrorism, since we have confirmation that Pakistani military men were involved in planning it.

On the Indian side we agreed about the need for justice to be done to bring closure to 26/11. The Pakistani panelists disagreed belligerently. The former air vice marshal said ‘how long will you continue milking 26/11’ which was so offensive a remark that it left little room for sweet talk. I said I was disgusted but in a polite tone but it was not polite enough for the Pakistani diplomat. He started yelling that they wanted only to talk about the future and not the past and had not come to talk to people ‘stuck in 2008’. One of them then accused the Indian Home Minister of deliberately sabotaging the talks by bringing up Abu Jundal.

Is there any point in talking to Pakistan until the wise denizens of South Block first recognise that this country has changed?

...
1. The ideology of Islamism has certain fundamental rules and the first is that you must kill those you think have insulted the Prophet Mohammed or the Koran.

2. The second is that you must hate Americans, Jews and Hindus and blame them for causing all the trouble in the Islamic world.

3. You then have to accept that the only way for peaceful coexistence in the world is for Islam to prevail.

In a Pakistani context what is frightening is that my old friend, Imran Khan, who hopes to become the next prime minister of his benighted country, shares this worldview and regularly blames everything that has gone wrong in his country on America. What is even more disturbing is his choice of friends. He shares the stage with such vicious Islamists as Hafiz Mohammad Saeed and Lieutenant General Hamid Gul. When General Gul was head of the ISI in the late eighties he started the process of exporting jihadi terrorism to India and when I met him some years ago proudly admitted creating the Taliban. So if polls in Pakistan indicate that Imran Khan has the support of more than seventy per cent of the population what does it tell us?

...
There will be another round of talks between our foreign secretaries soon and then at some point in the not too distant future our Prime Minister will go to Islamabad on a mission of peace and we will continue fooling ourselves into believing that what happened on 26/11 was just another terrorist incident. Only when we recognise that it was an act of war will we begin to start evolving a new strategy to do to deal with the Islamist republic next door.

---

http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/left-r ... ial/238372

My only comment is that the pakis on the panel were stonewalling as if AQ Khan is building a bomb. Why now?

ManuT · Post by **ManuT** » 09 Jul 2012 08:52

sanjaykumar wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwyMZRP9 ... re=related

Must watch.

Not in English but indicates the older generation still has a very different perspective. Pakistan's best hope is that this constituency will not be around in some more years. The generational change will free India of its Pakistan obligations, so they can be treated as an Iran or Oman.

The guy says there was no need to 'save' Sailkot and Lahore had Pakistan not inturded in 65. It was safe as it is.
Pakis are not used to see some one talking sense, though the demograhpic is against the old man as you mention.

In the second part, one place it is off where it gets into North vs South view of the Kashmir problem.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 08:58

Virupaksha wrote:We also should not forget a qazi takeover in the short term. This will have to be replaced with the qabila guards taking over in the medium term though.

I believe that when we talk of "qazi takeover" or "qabila guard takeover" we need to look at this from the point of view of a qazi or qabila guard who has to control and channel 180 millon people. I don't mean to be disrespectful of MK Gandhi but Gandhiji was a sort of "qazi" who led 300 million people. Those 300 million did not fight against him because he appealed to them (more or less). There is no such qazi figure in Pakistan.

That leaves only the qabila guards. They have the US's support but they do not have the support of the qaum and a section of qazis are against them. "People's rule" (democracy) will probably be the only way forward, but I am guessing that people's rule will put in an Islamist government. Anyone who believes that an openly Islamist but elected government in Pakistan will be better than the Taliban (for India) is no less naive in his thoughts than the common or garden variety WKK/Aman Ki Tamasha Nazi.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 09 Jul 2012 09:55

Shiv ji,

I meant supreme court (qazi) controlled interim govt - which will be taken over by kabila guards as you said.

and I couldnt understand what you said.

Could you explain a bit more.

pradeepe · Post by **pradeepe** » 09 Jul 2012 10:15

abhishek_sharma wrote:Peace with Islamists: Tavleen Singh

Recommended.

Read only the exceprt posted later. The problem we have in India is that everyone needs to be personally convinced that pakistan is a problem. Every intellectual worth his/her salt is an expert and has a solution to the paki problem. Simple solutions like starting with thinking that pakistan IS the problem is too easy an answer and doesnt justify the daily wanking and tonnes of disposed twisted panties lying in their closets. A widow here an orphan there a few families broken in between are all gut wrenching but required in the best interests of world piss.

The chief culprit is the gutless GoI that fails to form a coherent strategy and gives room for all this hot air to come in.

So in the meantime we need the billion+ people to be convinced that TSP is the problem. Until then peace is just a hug away bro..

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 10:32

Virupaksha wrote:
I meant supreme court (qazi) controlled interim govt - which will be taken over by kabila guards as you said.

Ah OK. I was looking at qazi as mullah because mullahs are qazis in Islam. Didn't see it as vakil-e-azam==qazi. I personally don't believe the legal community of shitland have and positive clout. They have only negative/spoiler clout.

But in a sense I think you are right in the model of governance that Pakistan now has. Nobody has complete control. Everyone controls some part of the whole. This makes a change from the earlier "Army can always exert full control". Army needs war with India to exert control because everyone supports the army over war with India. If India does not fight back the army loses its single biggest excuse for holding power and then has to explain its support for USA. US support for he army and army support for US is centered around holding India back. If India is not an issue, the US loses influence over the army and the army loss its main excuse for controlling the country. Provoking war with India is crucial for the army's power AND for Pakistan's unity AND it gives the US a tool to bribe the Paki army to make it "behave"

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 10:35

pradeepe wrote: So in the meantime we need the billion+ people to be convinced that TSP is the problem. Until then peace is just a hug away bro..

I am nowadays beginning to worry about peace with Pakistan. Security is such good business. So many men and women can be employed in security related issues it is better to have continued hostility with someone for the next 30-40 years at least. If that makes shitland go bust - so be it. We are not asking them to screw themselves.

Rohit_K · Post by **Rohit_K** » 09 Jul 2012 10:45

Gunmen attack at army camp in Gujrat kills seven

ISLAMABAD: Gunmen opened fire on an army camp near Islamabad on Monday, killing seven security personnel and wounding five others, the military said.

The attack happened near the industrial city of Wazirabad, less than 150 kilometres (100 miles) southeast of the capital.

“At least seven security personnel including a police official embraced shahadat (martyrdom) and five others were injured due to firing by unknown assailants near Wazirabad,” the military said in a statement.

A rescue party had reportedly camped by a river to look for the body of a pilot missing in a helicopter crash in May, the statement said, and the camp came under attack from “unknown assailants”.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 09 Jul 2012 10:52

shiv wrote:
pradeepe wrote: So in the meantime we need the billion+ people to be convinced that TSP is the problem. Until then peace is just a hug away bro..
I am nowadays beginning to worry about peace with Pakistan. Security is such good business. So many men and women can be employed in security related issues it is better to have continued hostility with someone for the next 30-40 years at least. If that makes shitland go bust - so be it. We are not asking them to screw themselves.

Absolutely in Johanesburg SA all the white army soldiers now run security business supplying personal guards , home monitoring and escort service of different kind though.

Yes indeed war, army and armaments are the way to ornaments for SHQs of middle men and suppliers.

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 09 Jul 2012 10:57

asprinzl wrote:Q:Can Pakistan become the next Syria?
A: Pakistan at present is worse than Syria. Pakistan is already a lost cause. It is a failed state. The relevant media outlets, talking heads and political rats don't mention it or refuse to mention it but Pakistan is a failed state. The powers that be refuse to mention it because they would be in a quandry for a solution. So they all sing a certain song.
Avram

Not they Syria way. But I feel, that it may splinter into smaller nation states.

lakshmikanth · Post by **lakshmikanth** » 09 Jul 2012 11:22

Singha wrote:that style of roof is called bengaldar roof and seen in old temples of bengal. why did the pakis adopt it?
http://www.indianetzone.com/43/architec ... hnupur.htm

I thought it was called the Naulakha: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naulakha_Pavilion . As expected the Mughals stole it from something Indic. Can these guys can be good at anything other than loot and plunder?

Speaking of loot and plunder, Naulakha architecture was also a favorite of the briturd bigot and famous racist author Rudyard Kipling.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 09 Jul 2012 11:59

The only group among vazirs, kabila guards, mullahs & the nobles who does not have any direct overt representation in running the kabila at the highest level are the mullahs. Since the mullahs are used by all the rest to control the kabilaites, this is an inconsistent arrangement and is bound to fail. The mullahs are doing their duty of controlling but are not being given their due rights.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 09 Jul 2012 13:08

2 day conference of all Jihadi groups active in JK was organized in Pindi. About 1000 attended with speeches soliciting recruits and money for intensifying JK jihad.

Seems the new ISI chief is settling into his job.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/405671/jiha ... awalpindi/

“Our commanders in Kashmir and Afghanistan say they will carry out big attacks if they are provided with resources. They have the spirit but they are facing a shortage of supplies.”

in Pindi was it inside or just outside GHQ?

partha · Post by **partha** » 09 Jul 2012 13:26

^
supplies = political or diplomatic or moral?

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 09 Jul 2012 13:38

rajanb wrote:
asprinzl wrote:Q:Can Pakistan become the next Syria?
A: Pakistan at present is worse than Syria. Pakistan is already a lost cause. It is a failed state. The relevant media outlets, talking heads and political rats don't mention it or refuse to mention it but Pakistan is a failed state. The powers that be refuse to mention it because they would be in a quandry for a solution. So they all sing a certain song.
Avram
Not they Syria way. But I feel, that it may splinter into smaller nation states.

Which then raises more thougths about the Pakis going the Syria way. Isn't what has happened in Baluchistan the Syria way? The Hindus, sikhs, Christians, Ahenadis, Shias, the Syria way? And the Baluchis identifying the Pakjabis off a bus and executing them, in retaliation?

Paki is a witches brew, and which way the brew boils over only the future will tell us.

Depends now if you are a country is a friend of the west. Different strokes for different countries.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 09 Jul 2012 14:49

Pakistan shuns its Nobel ‘God particle’ link

Islamabad: Even as Indian are outraged over the lack of recognition to its physicist Satyendra Nath Bose, who had done pioneering work on the Higg boson, Abdus Salam, Pakistan's only Nobel laureate, who helped lead to the apparent discovery of the subatomic " God Particle" last week, is no hero at home.

Salam, died in 1996, who also guided the early stages of the country's nuclear program, faded decades ago as Muslim fundamentalists gained power finds no or little mention in school textbooks in Pakistan.

All because he belonged to the Ahmadi sect, which has been persecuted by the government and targeted by Taliban militants who view its members as heretics.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 09 Jul 2012 14:55

Kaira defends dual nationality bill

LALAMUSA:Defending the dual nationality bill, Information minister Qamar Zaman Kaira said on Sunday that the bill was tabled for all those Pakistanis who live away from Pakistan but whose hearts beat for their country.

The proposed constitutional amendment aimed at allowing Pakistanis having dual nationality to hold public office was not meant to benefit any individual, he said.

So who is going to benefit from this? IK?

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 09 Jul 2012 15:21

Altair wrote: I am now more confused than before!

Pakistan has developed an unconventional ruling system. Somewhere similar to Turkey. Its neither following the conventional method laid by the west and adopted by majority asians, nor it is a single family dictatorship. So if that is the standard then it is a 'failed' state. Otherwise by no means pakistan is a failed state (yet). It has more problems than many other nations but not to the extend of falling apart. They have support from many powerful nations and that is another important reason why they will not literally 'fail' in near future.

They are here to stay and torment us for many more years to come.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 09 Jul 2012 16:33

abhijitm wrote:
Altair wrote: I am now more confused than before!
Pakistan has developed an unconventional ruling system. Somewhere similar to Turkey. Its neither following the conventional method laid by the west and adopted by majority asians, nor it is a single family dictatorship. So if that is the standard then it is a 'failed' state. Otherwise by no means pakistan is a failed state (yet). It has more problems than many other nations but not to the extend of falling apart. They have support from many powerful nations and that is another important reason why they will not literally 'fail' in near future.

They are here to stay and torment us for many more years to come.

- And torment they will.
- Even if they fall apart,there will continue to be a strong entity that is intent on causing trouble to India. And that entity will find backers to assist it.
- An entity that has nuisance at its main selling point will find numerous ways of creating trouble. For India, it means dealing with multiple fronts where nuisance needs to be handled -
Siachen, J&K, equipment, security along borders etc . It is more expensive for India to maintain this. And if it bleeds India, isn't that a part victory?

This quote from a few posts above is quite pertinent ;

The chief culprit is the gutless GoI that fails to form a coherent strategy and gives room for all this hot air to come in.

The fact that GoI has not gone after those who have been causing this trouble for decades is prime reason we have to deal with so many fronts. All terror and trouble roads leads to a few groups within TSP. They have not been made any less comfortable. In fact, we seem to over think this and want to help them too.

Trouble from the western side of India is not new - what 700 years now? The only thing that seems to have happened consistently is that a) we have lost lives b) border where trouble originates has moved more and more eastward.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 09 Jul 2012 17:00

7 Security Personnel Killed in Pakistan

Suspected militants attacked a security forces camp near the city of Gujrat in Pakistan’s Punjab province today, killing six soldiers and a policeman.

Five soldiers were injured in the pre-dawn attack, officials said.

TV news channels reported that the security personnel were attacked by a group of gunmen shortly after they had offered their morning prayers. {Allah-o-Akbar. The jihadists have confirmed once again that they are more pious than the PA and Allah is on their side}

The gunmen, who were using cars and motorcycles, fled after the shooting. The military confirmed the incident and the casualties in a brief statement.

It said seven security personnel, including a police official, were killed and five others were injured “due to firing by unknown assailants near Wazirabad”, a town located 12 km from Gujrat city.

The security personnel were part of a small rescue party that had camped on the bank of the Chenab river to search for the body of a pilot mission since a military helicopter crashed on May 23, the statement said.

The attack occurred hours after thousands of supporters of the Defa-e-Pakistan Council arrived in Gujrat as part of a “long march” to protest the government’s decision to reopen NATO supply routes to Afghanistan.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 09 Jul 2012 17:00

Eight killed in attack on army camp in Gujrat

At least eight security personnel including seven soldiers and a police cop were killed and three others injured when unknown miscreants attacked an army camp here in Gujrat on early Monday morning.
According to the Inter-Services Public Relations (ISPR), unidentified militants at 5:30am stormed an army camp established near River Chenab in Gujrat.
As a result firing by miscreants, six troops and a policeman were killed on the spot while three sustained wounds. The militants had also planted a time device at the camp which exploded with a big bang but no further losses were reported.
The attackers managed to flee from the scene after the incident.
The bodies and injured were shifted to Combined Military Hospital (CMH) Gujranwala for medical aid where another troop succumbed to his wound raising the death toll to eight.
After the unfortunate incident, police parties were rushed to the scene and issued strict instructions to search for the attackers.
It should be mentioned that the said army camp was established one month earlier to search an army major who went missing during a helicopter crash in the area.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 17:01

Neela wrote: Trouble from the western side of India is not new - what 700 years now?

Neelaji, what trouble exactly are you referring to "from the western side of India" for 700 years?

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 09 Jul 2012 17:16

SSridhar wrote:"The security personnel were part of a small rescue party that had camped on the bank of the Chenab river to search for the body of a pilot mission since a military helicopter crashed on May 23, the statement said."

This is the right way! Ambush some military vehicle, then wait for the rescue team, then halaal them!

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 09 Jul 2012 17:43

shiv wrote:
Neela wrote: Trouble from the western side of India is not new - what 700 years now?
Neelaji, what trouble exactly are you referring to "from the western side of India" for 700 years?

The Mughal empire came to establsihed in India from the Western side. Pakistan derives its strength from those events. It even claims to be the heirs to the Mughal empire.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 09 Jul 2012 17:56

Altair wrote:I feel that only if an Islamic country is an enemy of Israel will it be branded a terrorist country or a failed state. Pakistan seems to be escaping that. I am sure Mossad knows how many Pakistani terrorist leaders plan destruction of Israel on a daily basis every minute of their lives. So why the exception handling?
Is Israeli lobby the key to declaring Pakistan a terrorist state? If so India has failed.

Altair garu,

Who is mortal enemy of Pakistan? Why Pakistan doesn't fight or support war with any other country except India? That is the reason why even Israel doesn't care much about Pakistan.

Pakistan's existence is for one and only one reason. Constraining, Hurting and if possible destroying India.

Yet, our WKK brigade wants to do incest with Pakis. The real fight with Pakistan must start from within Bharat.

Another key characteristics of the WKKs is that they do not shed a single tear when millions of mango-pakis are suppressed, killed, starved if the perpetrator is TSPA, Taliban, Israel, Iran, KSA, UK, USA, China, Afghanistan and even Russia. The WKKs only cry if it is India that disciplines Pakistan. Aaak Thoo onlee

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 09 Jul 2012 18:03

Dipanker wrote:Eight killed in attack on army camp in Gujrat

For a moment my stripes and stars undie got twisted reading this headline

There IS a town called Gujrat, Pakistan west of Sialkot.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 09 Jul 2012 18:22

Pakistan harms India more than any other country but Pakistan has harmed every country. If we see the Pakistan Role in Global terrorism we get the entire list of countries.
How many times have been there a mention of Pakistan harming Israelis?
Is Pakistani ISI/Military selectively excluding Israelis in this target list for the fear of reprisal?
Is it because they are scared of Mossad?
I am looking for a weak-link which can be exploited.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 09 Jul 2012 18:35

RamaY wrote:
Who is mortal enemy of Pakistan? Why Pakistan doesn't fight or support war with any other country except India? That is the reason why even Israel doesn't care much about Pakistan.
Pakistan's existence is for one and only one reason. Constraining, Hurting and if possible destroying India.
Yet, our WKK brigade wants to do incest with Pakis. The real fight with Pakistan must start from within Bharat.
Another key characteristics of the WKKs is that they do not shed a single tear when millions of mango-pakis are suppressed, killed, starved if the perpetrator is TSPA, Taliban, Israel, Iran, KSA, UK, USA, China, Afghanistan and even Russia. The WKKs only cry if it is India that disciplines Pakistan. Aaak Thoo onlee

There is no reason to believe that this is just applicable to current Pakistani state. Any failed entity that comes out of a break-up is bound to carry over hostilities.
I remember reading about Mitosis as a kid. Bacteria(?) first duplicate DNA and then split making sure the chromosomes are carried over into the children. Pakistan is not failing any time soon. But when it does, the chromosomes will be carried over. Why should the concomitant hate suddenly vanish?

Interesting point regarding mango Pakis and you are right. Never ever seen WKK whine over the state of mango Paki. But for the Pakis ( and our Prime minister ) , muslims of India are a disenfranchised lot.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 Jul 2012 19:29

Neela wrote:
shiv wrote: Neelaji, what trouble exactly are you referring to "from the western side of India" for 700 years?
The Mughal empire came to establsihed in India from the Western side. Pakistan derives its strength from those events. It even claims to be the heirs to the Mughal empire.

Sorry Neela. You are telling me that Pakistan's strength is from its history of ruling India for 700 years? I think you are just trying to defend an indefensible point. If Pakistan's strength is from the history of the last 700 years what can anyone do now?

You said:

The fact that GoI has not gone after those who have been causing this trouble for decades is prime reason we have to deal with so many fronts. All terror and trouble roads leads to a few groups within TSP. They have not been made any less comfortable. In fact, we seem to over think this and want to help them too.

Trouble from the western side of India is not new - what 700 years now? The only thing that seems to have happened consistently is that a) we have lost lives b) border where trouble originates has moved more and more eastward.

If Pakistan ruled India for 700 years and gets its strength from those 700 years of ruling India, whom should the government "go after" to turn back the clock? There is no need to answer if you don't want to. I don't want to get into an argument, but all you did was have a rant and wrote some stuff that is fundamentally contradictory. If I was Paki I would be laughing at your argument. You are stating Pakistan's case and you are doing a good job.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 09 Jul 2012 19:58

Shiv-ji,

All I said was that Pakistan derives its strength from events earlier. Nowhere did I mention that Pakistan ruled India.
To clarify what I said earlier, IMO, Pakis think that if the earlier invading armies could do it, it should be possible for them too. And they will not stop trying.And even if a new entity is born out of a break-up, it will continue that goal.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 09 Jul 2012 20:06

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 09 Jul 2012 20:17

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/peace ... s/971606/0

On the day that the Foreign Secretaries of India and Pakistan met in Delhi last week, I had a personal cross-border encounter that left me worried about whether there can ever be peace with the Islamist republic next door. I use the word Islamist consciously because I believe we will not be able to talk to Pakistan purposefully until we first understand that the mindset of that country has gone from Islamic to Islamist. I say this with sadness because as a proud Punjabi, whose origins lie on that side of the border, I have always believed that the innate pragmatism and sense of humour of the average Punjabi would eventually vanquish the militant mullahs and military men who have poisoned the air of Pakistan. I believe this less today.

My cross-border encounter happened on Nidhi Razdan’s show. I was in the NDTV studio in Delhi with two Indian panelists and from Pakistan she invited a former air vice marshal called Shahzad Choudhury and a former diplomat called Akram Zaki. When Nidhi asked my view on the talks between the foreign secretaries held that morning I told her truthfully that I believed 26/11 was an act of war, and should not be discussed as mere terrorism, since we have confirmation that Pakistani military men were involved in planning it.

On the Indian side we agreed about the need for justice to be done to bring closure to 26/11. The Pakistani panelists disagreed belligerently. The former air vice marshal said ‘how long will you continue milking 26/11’ which was so offensive a remark that it left little room for sweet talk. I said I was disgusted but in a polite tone but it was not polite enough for the Pakistani diplomat. He started yelling that they wanted only to talk about the future and not the past and had not come to talk to people ‘stuck in 2008’.

The ideology of Islamism has certain fundamental rules and the first is that you must kill those you think have insulted the Prophet Mohammed or the Koran. The second is that you must hate Americans, Jews and Hindus and blame them for causing all the trouble in the Islamic world. You then have to accept that the only way for peaceful coexistence in the world is for Islam to prevail.

Imran Khan, who hopes to become the next prime minister of his benighted country, shares this worldview and regularly blames everything that has gone wrong in his country on America. What is even more disturbing is his choice of friends. He shares the stage with such vicious Islamists as Hafiz Mohammad Saeed and Lieutenant General Hamid Gul.

It should tell us a great deal. But, the high officials who make foreign policy in South Block are impervious to changes on the ground, so our response to Pakistan is to carry on as usual. There will be another round of talks between our foreign secretaries soon and then at some point in the not too distant future our Prime Minister will go to Islamabad on a mission of peace and we will continue fooling ourselves into believing that what happened on 26/11 was just another terrorist incident. Only when we recognise that it was an act of war will we begin to start evolving a new strategy to do to deal with the Islamist republic next door.