Beheading of Indian Soldiers in Aug 2011 and Aman ki Asha

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 31 Jan 2013 07:57

ramana wrote:SS, i have decided not to read "The Hindu" anymore.
Its no longer the nationalist paper the founder created.

Three generations of my family (from grandpas on both sides) have been loyal subscribers and readers.

Ramana, I stopped The Hindu about six years back, though my mother was saddened. She, however, realized and understood the reason and completely agreed with me. However, I do read it online because one has to know what one's enemies are up to. I now consider reading the Hindu as equivalent to reading the DT, Dawn or The Nation.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 31 Jan 2013 08:24

I read the lot as one must know the mind of the enemy/apologist to defeat it.In many respects it is an excellent gatherer of news .For example yesterday's news about new Chinese dams being built on the B'putrs in Tibet which will affect India.None of the other papers carried this important piece of news.It is the Opinion columns in the Hindu and their collection of prize of quislings and apologists for India who are the "drops of dung in the pot of milk",so to speak! Frontline too has had many excellent features on the defence services,DRDO,etc. The task is to defeat the arguments and slanted features and viewpoints.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 31 Jan 2013 09:16

This is the same guy (mentioned by B Raman) who knew about P Swamis article in advance by a day.

partha · Post by **partha** » 31 Jan 2013 09:28

^
What does UN docs even mean here? What clever use of words by this chap. Many people will fall for that. He is making it appear as if UN conducted an investigation and prepared the docs. These docs are simply complaints by the Pakis.

Sri · Post by **Sri** » 31 Jan 2013 10:12

Publication in Hindu gives credence to UN report. Something Khar couldn't achieve

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 31 Jan 2013 10:15

partha, he will now say that the UN docs do not mention anything about TSP soldiers beheading Indian troops at all. Naturally true if one can believe that complaints to defunct UNMOGIP are UN documents. Who is the audience he is targetting with these falsified clever-by-half tweets ? Hardly 0.1% of TSPizens have access to Internet and a negligible fraction of them would be on twitter. Why is this twitturbation ?

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 31 Jan 2013 10:48

Philip wrote:I read the lot as one must know the mind of the enemy/apologist to defeat it.In many respects it is an excellent gatherer of news .

Agree. "The Hindu" is in my to be replaced list for nearly a year or so. But I am looking for another alternative, and I cant stand junks like ToI etc. Deccan Herald is what I have in my mind. I clearly see a very pro-Paki, anti-Majority community bias in "The Hindu" these days.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 31 Jan 2013 12:25

@orsoraggiante
Still wondering about Praveen Swami's UNMOGIP sources...black in the lentil,

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 03:18

SSridhar wrote:No, he won't. There seems to be a method in their madness.

Plus, that would be 2 strikes against them in less than a month, the previous one being that ridiculous Vivekananda op-ed, for which they had to apologize

What's egregious is that the UNMOGIP article appearing the same day that MI released a report about the ISI bounty for our jawan's heads

Praveen Swami, S. Varadarajan, N. Ram and several others at the Chindu are traitors - pure & simple

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 03:22

X-posting:

Btw, KanchanGupta and others challenging Chindu/SVaradarajan in Twitter on why Swami's drivel appeared on Page 1, while the Indian Army's rebuttal appears on Page 10

http://serious--fun.blogspot.in/2013/01 ... enial.html

Svaradarajan also claimed on Twitter to B. Raman that Swami did not get the Grandmother fairytale from the Paki journalist Wajahat Khan. Instead, it was the other way around. He claims that Chindu had such a scoop (from where? - no one knows), which they told a news anchor about (Karan Thapar?), who then leaked it to Wajahat Khan.

Of course, all this doesnt explain the fact that the Grandmother story was a lie

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 03:24

SSridhar wrote:
ramana wrote:SS, i have decided not to read "The Hindu" anymore.
Its no longer the nationalist paper the founder created.

Three generations of my family (from grandpas on both sides) have been loyal subscribers and readers.
Ramana, I stopped The Hindu about six years back, though my mother was saddened. She, however, realized and understood the reason and completely agreed with me. However, I do read it online because one has to know what one's enemies are up to. I now consider reading the Hindu as equivalent to reading the DT, Dawn or The Nation.

We stopped buying Chindu too. Sadly, my dad switched to TOI

I still read the occasional online article, esp by TSS (for edification) and selected Op-Ed pieces (to keep the enemy closer)

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 04:52

Jhujar wrote:
venug wrote:That Swami should hang his head low for planting news, shame on him.
Courstesy Hindu , he is having good time in Islooland, enjoying Paki hispitality.

S. Varadarajan was the Track-II diplomat sent to Pakistan when the editor was N. Ram. Now that Varadarajan is the editor, Praveen Swami is the new Track-II guy. Passing the baton. The current set of articles by Swami might be the coming-out-party for him

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 01 Feb 2013 06:02

The police and other executive institutions are firmly in the kitty of the regime. They unleash and weild those institutions including the press to effective use to undermine nationalistic hold outs.

The army/armed forces are the last bastion of institution/s that is/are standing in the way of the khilafat II for the regime. There has been consistent and relentless effort to undermine this pillar on a sustained basis.
Census of armed forces based on religion was one of the first shot across the bow, (controversies with the chief, desecration of amar jawan, etc) which has continued to now culminate in hit pieces by strategic journalists. Do not know how long this institution can withstand such sustained effort to undermine it.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Feb 2013 06:57

What the 'peace park' talks over Siachen and the Government's reaction to the barbaric beheading have shown is that there is a deep schism between the Army and the INC-led Government. But for the strong words coming from the Army, GoI would have acted completely and insanely against national interests. GoI has not made any course corrections and instead it seems to feel that through planted stories and lifafa journalists (somebody even mentioned a hunk-trap story), they could influence public opinion in favour of their agenda even if the fair name of the armed forces and indeed the entire nation is tarnished. The casual reference by the union home minister to 'Hindu terror' and the support for the same by his various ministerial colleagues fall in the same mould. India is certainly going through a very dangerous period where the enemy from within is doing all the damage than the enemy from without.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 01 Feb 2013 11:52

Hmm.. I did not understand how this letter was published in "The Hindu"
Vishwaroopam ban
That an educated and experienced person like Kamal Hassan did not realise all these days that “secularism” in India means appeasing the minorities is surprising. Once the censor board clears a film, it should be allowed to be released. If not, why waste money on a censor board?

K.V. Rajan, Chennai
Mr. Rajan should have taken a lottery yesterday, he may have hit a jackpot (so lucky!).

. And BTW, today The Hindu reports that their subscribership has gone up

.

JohnTitor · Post by **JohnTitor** » 01 Feb 2013 13:24

RajeshA wrote: Disclaimer: I do not mean to hurt the feelings of Muslims. Terrorists have no religion.

Unless they are hindu.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 16:21

SSridhar wrote:What the 'peace park' talks over Siachen and the Government's reaction to the barbaric beheading have shown is that there is a deep schism between the Army and the INC-led Government. But for the strong words coming from the Army, GoI would have acted completely and insanely against national interests. GoI has not made any course corrections and instead it seems to feel that through planted stories and lifafa journalists (somebody even mentioned a hunk-trap story), they could influence public opinion in favour of their agenda even if the fair name of the armed forces and indeed the entire nation is tarnished. The casual reference by the union home minister to 'Hindu terror' and the support for the same by his various ministerial colleagues fall in the same mould. India is certainly going through a very dangerous period where the enemy from within is doing all the damage than the enemy from without.

+1. This is a "retain power at all costs, even if it means sleeping with the enemy" mentality. Mir Jafar conniving with Clive comes to mind. And countless other examples of Indians colluding with the British to undermine other Indians for short term, regional gains. We all know how that turned out

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 01 Feb 2013 16:24

Sachin: they allow one of these comments every now and then, to demonstrate "impartiality". If they receive 400 negative comments and 10 positive ones, they will publish 9 positive ones and 1 negative comment. They think they are being very clever

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 01 Feb 2013 18:37

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 01 Feb 2013 23:55

Prem Kumar wrote: +1. This is a "retain power at all costs, even if it means sleeping with the enemy" mentality. Mir Jafar conniving with Clive comes to mind. And countless other examples of Indians colluding with the British to undermine other Indians for short term, regional gains. We all know how that turned out

No sir, it is not sleeping with the enemy. It is a band of enemies converging together to fleece the gravy train. Convenience to rape, loot and pose. When one mistakes the real enemy to be elsewhere then confusion for solution dominates, the response would be paralysis of the society. The actual enemy is within and thriving through facade of being one amongst us.

There was some semblance of Indians colluding with others in earlier times. Now even that pretense is unnecessary. It is S.Asians in powerful positions colluding with others to be arrayed against Indians.

Well, for the part of Indians, they tout Bhagavad Gita mindlessly, without understanding how it helps resolve the conundrum of who the real enemies are. Indolence, confusion and inaction will yield the society just desserts.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 02 Feb 2013 01:46

Prep for 2014 started: PM and now -
Too early to have normal Pak ties, says Antony

India: No closure of 26/11 case till Pak acts

Khurshid joins in

SBajwa · Post by **SBajwa** » 02 Feb 2013 02:23

To RajeshA,

Sir!! that was a good write up on punishment for naPakis. I am a man of simble stuff! I say

1. catch them.
2. impale them facing their side for slow death.
3. once dead pour some petrol and burn.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 02 Feb 2013 06:52

We are over thinking it.

In 65 or 71 I forget, the yahoos created a huge lashkar to invade, loot and pillage India. A couple of IAF aircraft strafed them just as they were about to cross the border for gazwa e behind. The yahoos turned back, ran away, looted and pillaged towns and villages in Pakistan and returned to their cave complexes.

Best way to punish pakis is to make sure nobody crosses the border. They will take care of themselves. This is the most humane, dharmic, *and* effective way.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 02 Feb 2013 07:05

Anujan wrote:We are over thinking it.
Best way to punish pakis is to make sure nobody crosses the border. They will take care of themselves. This is the most humane, dharmic, *and* effective way.

Yindoo fauj have too many spare Russian Shilkas which will be very effective to make Poaq Shilkas and Poak fries whenever Inbreds try.OTOH i think Tunguska in striaght mode might do better job to open the door for joy heavenly whore house .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDQlVPKCcjU

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 02 Feb 2013 07:15

Agreed, Anujan ji.

I just don't know what the most humane, dharmic and effective way is to get the Indian government to abandon Aman ki Tamasha and refocus along the lines you suggest. Perhaps we have to compromise on being humane.

On the one hand we have the Indian government and Aman ki Tamasha, and on the other hand we have beheaded Indian soldiers, Pakistan giving China the Gwadar port, Hina Khar proclaiming Pakistan will not respond to a billion Indians, Hafiz Saeed becoming Pakistan's de facto Foreign Affairs Minister, Musharraf sharing bed time stories about a night in Indian territory, etc.

It just occurred to me that while we enjoy theories in BENIS of Pakistan GUBO-ing, the single largest GUBO gangbang in the Guinness Book of Records might have included leaders of the UPA and INC.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 02 Feb 2013 08:07

Election is in September 2013. After that it is either modi or yuvraj. Neither of whom were born in Pakistan. So relax.

I think the present dispensation is the last generation who were born pre partition and therefore who still believe India and Pakistan are the same country and as big brothers we should be the ones who should compromise.

The generation born after partition have no such historical baggage. This is the last dying gasp of "we are birathers onlee"

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 02 Feb 2013 09:52

Sorry, it doesn't work that way.

Ideas, specifically ideas that have been institutionalized by being held dear to the agendas of policymakers over generations... invariably outlast those generations. Absent a genuine and highly visible catastrophic outcome (like Hiroshima), those ideas will persist regardless of context, and despite all lesser indications that they are unworkable. They acquire a mass of their own, and begin to accrete credibility through the sheer virtue of having been around so long.

The top brass in TSPA today weren't even born at the time of the '48 war. Kiyani himself is only 60, and was a raw 2nd-laftan at the time of '71. None of them has given up on Kashmir jihad. Many who have never seen Delhi still dream of green flag over Red Fort. It's an institutionalized idea.

The Americans, despite everything they've experienced over the last two decades, still direct foreign policy towards shadowboxing against a nonexistent Soviet-style enemy. They still see Islamism as a willing subaltern that can be harnessed to threaten emerging challengers among non-Western nation states, and they're going full speed ahead with outsourcing their Afghan problem to Pakistan.

And so it will be with India. Rahul baba has already cited Hindu Terrorism as the most alarming security threat this country faces (as a genuine opinion, expressed in private to a foreign diplomat... not as an election stump statement.) Rest assured, where Aman ki Tamasha is concerned, the fun has only just begun. Forget beheading of soldiers... even 26/11 was clearly no Hiroshima moment.

There is a reason why old ideas are in fact MORE powerful than ideas of the current generation, where large institutions are concerned. They don't have to be defended or risk-managed. They were articulated by the gurus and prophets of yore, who are long gone and lionized into heroes and cannot be spoken ill of. And because of the auto-hypnosis that occurs in large institutions, those old ideas come to be seen as far more reliable than the uncertainty proffered by upstart or maverick thinkers who dare to challenge them.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 02 Feb 2013 10:36

1.2 billion people counting cant take down named terrorists just in a neighboring country.
just think of Shaeed Bghat singh et had to travel across oceans to do the right thing
where has that kind patriotism gone.....

unless of course the powers be colluding

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 02 Feb 2013 10:47

^^^
Rudradev ji,

agree with the above thesis. long-standing institutions with certain aims and objectives do not relinquish the set way of thinking unless those institutions are forced to do so with the threat of violence, or unless they simply perish through sheer force of some earth-shattering event.

but new ideas can take shape in places where the institutions do not have the "strong hold". in such places, newer ideas can take shape, and usually have the time to germinate, and entrench themselves as self-regenerating memes within that localized population.

the current regime is making a terrible blunder by continuously insisting on moving the "Red Line" to ever lower bars. every so called "Laxman Rekha" has been crossed by external threats, and every such incident has been explained away. by habituating the central apparatus of the Rashtra to such repeated behavior, they have already become trapped in the death-race to the bottom of the pyramid. the externals will never really stop crossing these red lines, because on previous occasions, no retaliation was meted to them. they will continue to escalate relentlessly, and the regime, already used to explaining away every such incident with whispers/shouts/sneers of sweet nothings, will continue on the same path.

the problem with this is that with every incident, if the Regime does plan on holding the perpetrators to some "red line", the eventual response to that future "red line" will have to be much greater than what it would have been if they had responded aptly to a previous "red line".

so the dynasty is actually making a terrible blunder. they are pushing themselves into a corner. if they persist on the current path, their own eventual response to Paki provocations has to be overwhelming. the sooner they give a fitting response, the less is the threshold of "action" that they have to initiate.

K Mehta · Post by **K Mehta** » 02 Feb 2013 16:03

x-posting
This is just a hunch, but are the beheadings linked to the piglet pest removal spree that was going on?
I mean the army raked up a lot of numbers, so there can be a response from the jihadi kamandus, either uniformed or non-uniformed. And the attack happened in a different sector than the shooting and shelling.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 02 Feb 2013 16:23

SBajwa wrote:To RajeshA,

Sir!! that was a good write up on punishment for naPakis. I am a man of simble stuff! I say

1. catch them.
2. impale them facing their side for slow death.
3. once dead pour some petrol and burn.

SBajwa ji,

I would welcome when our differences rise to become a hotly-debated national issue, with every Indian taking sides.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 02 Feb 2013 22:56

India has only three friends: Indian Army, Indian Air Force and Indian Navy.

The GOI does its best to undermine them and leads to disasters:1962, IPKF and Aman ki Tamasha...
When they support them it gives the best results:1965 Ind0-Pak war, 1971 Creation of Bangla Desh, 1999 and Op Parakram

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 02 Feb 2013 23:24

It is troubling because why should any sensible government not support it's own armed forces? India is not even like TSP where there is great mistrust between it's armed forces and civilian government because of backstabbing and repeated coups. Too bad we have to name more than one instance when our government let down people who are ready to die for the nation.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 03 Feb 2013 02:29

The fallacy is in the assumption that GOI stands for Gowrment of India while its real nature is Gorging Over India.

Right Now They Act Like
Gora Over India
Ghori Of India
Gaan..O india
Gang Of India
I Forgot.. Gangu-Dins Of India spreading Gangrene Over India body.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 03 Feb 2013 02:48

INC under Viceroy Sonia Gandhi, Local Manager of Phoren Sarkars, has become a mafia den of "Islamists 'n' Christianists". If INC wants to regain the standing it had during Independence or under PM Lal Bahadur Shastri, PM Indira Gandhi and PM Narsimha Rao, then it has to force this ruling dynasty and their coterie out of the party, and again become Indian National Congress.

Next year INC is going to get a real good drubbing. But again they will make the Deputy Viceroy MMS the scapegoat and Sonia Maino Gandhi and Ralph Maino Gandhi will escape any responsibility. Since the party is not going to get rid of them, it also means that the party will remain in the wilderness for at least the next 15 years till 2029.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 03 Feb 2013 02:55

No Need to get rid of the Din-Asti. They ought to remain in politics as necessary evil. Their existence,force can be used for right purpose.

Balance can work out to be for the Good Of India.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 03 Feb 2013 04:57

venug wrote:It is troubling because why should any sensible government not support it's own armed forces? India is not even like TSP where there is great mistrust between it's armed forces and civilian government because of backstabbing and repeated coups. Too bad we have to name more than one instance when our government let down people who are ready to die for the nation.

Probably because some governments do not think themselves Indian instead see themselves as some "universal citizens" who are carrying the burden of civilizing Hindu India.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 03 Feb 2013 12:04

US conducted ‘intensive counselling’ during LoC crisis
Haley Bhi Koi Shak Hai ?

WASHINGTON: The United States was involved in “intensive counselling” during the recent crisis along the Line of Control, urging both India and Pakistan to revive direct talks, says the State Department.Last month relations between India and Pakistan deteriorated rapidly after clashes along the LoC left several soldiers dead.The Indian media highlighted a report claiming that Pakistani forces had decapitated an Indian soldier but later some Indian newspapers reported that Indian troops too had decapitated Pakistani soldiers.Last week, Pakistan also submitted a report to the United Nations, detailing how Indians had disfigured Pakistani soldiers in the LoC clashes.However, relations between the two countries have improved since, with both sides restoring people-to-people contacts and cross-border trade.Asked if the United States had played a role in reducing tensions between India and Pakistan during this crisis, State Department’s spokesperson Victoria Nuland told reporters that it had, through US ambassadors in both Delhi and Islamabad.The two ambassadors, she said, had been “intensively counselling direct dialogue. And we’re very gratified that that was restarted.”

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 03 Feb 2013 12:27

^ I would say both the US & PRC.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 Feb 2013 20:43

As usual the US is claiming exclusive discredit.