Boston Bombing Followup Thread

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shiv
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by shiv »

The theory that all criminals like high school shooters to Boston Bombers result from a similar "aetiology" (root cause) wherein some event or force misleads the young person is:
1. A simplification of a difficult issue
2. A deliberately secular explanation
3. An elegant way out like "One God" or "Unified theory"

It is right in many ways for the Boston bombers

Troubled childhood. Need to emigrate. Aggressive father not at home. Possible discrimination by peers because of odd name/accent/behaviour.

So these things can be explained as the "root cause" for any criminal behaviour.

However that still leaves the question open. Why are so many people from Muslim backgrounds implicated in random terrorist attacks involving bombs and possible suicidal intent while having a history of believing in Islamic supremacy and Islamic grievances.

Secular academia simply do not do research into this subject.

Did those guys who were implicated in school shootings, and the Batman theater shooting also come from an Islamic background? No they did not. That means that Islam is not connected with all terrorist acts. Does that mean that Islam is unconnected with all terrorist acts? No. There is a connection that secular societies do not want to address.

Remember that a tree trunk is a common origin for all branches. A broken family and childhood trauma may be the tree trunk causing the branches of criminal behaviour. But do not forget that multiple roots may have given rise to the tree trunk that branched into criminal behaviour.

If one of those roots is Islam it must be researched by sociologists and psychologists. It is not science to dismiss a possible connection as fake
Satya_anveshi
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Satya_anveshi »

harbans wrote:So much for the average Joe rep that the Czech Prez has to say this:
The Czech ambassador to the United States has put on record his alarm that during the hunt for the Boston Marathon bombing suspect so many Americans on social media appeared to confuse his own country - in central Europe - with Chechnya - a republic in south-west Russia.

As the identities of Chechen brothers Dzokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev - the suspects in Monday's attack which killed three and injured over 150 - filtered across the internet, many people tweeted that the pair were from the Czech Republic.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 81341.html
Could be by design or mix up by people - Waco,Tx happens to be Czech settlement area.
SaiK
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by SaiK »

however, a terror case is a terror case no matter which religious background they come from, and how and what their intentions are. it is difficult to correlate two terror events caused by unlike bad forces and background, and then blame the larger section. I guess that is not what the anti-jihadics think.

for a good cause, again, this is a bad analysis. they look at the number of terrorists coming from each segment, and attribute certain value. if the value of one is greater than the other, the labeling starts, and remains till the number of incidents related to each segment changes.. meaning, say the type of religious background people doing one type of crime or terror is more of from islam or other nutcase faiths.

i have also seen, a whole caste was tainted as rapist after repeated dilli rapes. this is aam human nature.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Bade »

Shiv, no one has dismissed the roots of many such acts of terrorism in Islamism. Clearly, an event like 9/11 has clear connections to Islamism. Similarly the Mumbai terrorist attacks or the Parliament attack.

If you look at the US ones, the one in an Army barrack by Nidal Hassan is also perhaps rooted in Islam, but due to the nature of US society and its outlook to the world can have multiple interpretations. But then we had so many non-islamic inspired ones too, like the Oklahoma bombing which was even more successful than the first wtc one, but carried by a xtian 400% local. The DC snipers again with a dual heritage. Each such event was terrorism on US soil and all have to be looked individually, but it is possible they have some overlapping strains, but not all due to single common reason than spans them all. Such a derivation or conclusion would be fake science too.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Philip »

Yes,he now has "throat injuries" and may not be able to speak!!! A man who walked out on his own from a boat ends up an ICU case.What gives? The FBI has many Qs to answer.From the report below,it is obvious that the "foreign govt." that requested a check on him must have been Russia.Russia has been the subject of numerous Chechen terror attacks,the worst,the school seige at Beslan.Now,we have seen in the past how Britain willingly gave asylum to terror groups like the LTTE,Russian mafia,Kashmiri separatists,Khalistanis,Islamist extremists,etc.,so as to use these entities as assets for their intel agencies aimed at destabilising the states where the asylum seekers came from.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/ap ... i-tsarnaev

FBI faces questions over previous contact with Boston bombing suspect
Agency admits it interviewed Tamerlan Tsarnaev in 2011 'at request of foreign government' but did not find 'terrorism activity'

The FBI's previous contacts with one of the alleged Boston bombers have come under intense scrutiny as questions were raised about whether it missed vital clues that could have prevented the attack, which killed three people and injured more than 170.

The bureau admitted that it had interviewed Tamerlan Tsarnaev in 2011 "at the request of a foreign government", presumed to be Russia, which was concerned that he was a "follower of radical Islam". The FBI said that it did not find any "terrorism activity" and appears not to have had any further contact with him since.

FBI agents were scrambling to review a six-month visit to Russia by 26-year-old Tsarnaev last year, during which he stayed with his father in Dagestan and is reported to have visited the family's ethnic home of Chechnya.
Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Photograph: Corbis

In Boston, special agents trained in the interrogation of high-value suspects were waiting to question the surviving 19-year-old suspect, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, who remained in a serious condition in hospital on Saturday.

He was brought late on Friday night to Beth Israel Deaconess medical center – the same hospital where earlier in the day his brother Tamerlan died after a shootout with police. The Massachusetts governor Deval Patrick said on Saturday that Dzhokhar was in a serious but stable condition and was "not able to communicate yet".

As questions were raised about how well known the brothers were to federal investigators, their mother, Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, said that the FBI had spoken to the family on multiple occasions. In an interview broadcast by Russia Today before the end of the manhunt on Friday, Tsarnaeva, a naturalised US citizen, said FBI agents had spoken to her in the past.
Tamerlan Tsarnaev - American Life of Boston bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev. Photograph: AP

"They were telling me that Tamerlan was really an extremist leader and they were afraid of him. They told me whatever information he is getting, he gets from these extremists' sites." Tsarnaeva, speaking from Dagestan, claimed that the FBI were monitoring her son "at every step", and had been "controlling" him for three to five years. She did not give specific dates.

The White House said Barack Obama had spoken to the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, as the manhunt came to an end on Friday. "President Putin expressed his condolences on behalf of the Russian people for the tragic loss of life in Boston," the White House said in a statement.

Obama "praised the close co-operation that the United States has received from Russia on counterterrorism, including in the wake of the Boston attack," the White House said.
'Off the hook'

But there were concerns in Congress that the FBI appeared not to have maintained contact with Tamerlan Tsarnaev. Representative Peter King of New York, a Republican member of the House homeland security committee, asked whether the FBI could have done more. "Did they move too quickly by letting this guy off the hook?" said King, quoted in Newsday. "Should they have looked more carefully?"
BOSTON, MA - APRIL 20: People gather at a makeshift memorial for victims near the site of the Boston Marathon bombings a day after the second suspect was captured. People gather at a makeshift memorial for victims near the site of the Boston Marathon bombings a day after the second suspect was captured. Photograph: Mario Tama/Getty Images

With a week-long manhunt for the suspects now over, and Boston getting back to normal following a virtual lockdown of the city on Friday, questions were also being raised about the approach of federal prosecutors to the surviving suspect.

Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was not read his Miranda rights, the process under US law that would have informed him of his right to remain silent, when he was detained. Ordinarily that would mean that any confession would be inadmissible at trial, but Carmen Ortiz, US attorney for Massachusetts, cited a public safety exception that is intended to prevent the public from immediate danger. The exception would allow investigators to question Tsarnaev about possible accomplices or networks that might have conspired in the attacks.

Republican senators Lindsey Graham and John McCain supported the decision not to read Tsarnaev his Miranda rights, and called for him to be classified as an "enemy combatant".

An expansion of the public safety exception to Miranda by the Obama administration is the subject of controversy, and civil rights advocates expressed concern about how it would be applied. The American Civil Liberties Union said the exemptions should not be "open-ended" and that America "must not waiver from our tried and true justice system".
US attorney Carmen Ortiz speaks during a news conference after the arrest of a suspect of the Boston Marathon bombings in Watertown, Massachusetts. US attorney Carmen Ortiz speaks during a news conference after the arrest of a suspect of the Boston Marathon bombings in Watertown, Massachusetts. Photograph: Matt Rourke/AP

US prosecutors are considering how best to press charges against Tsarnaev, given his medical condition. They might wait for him to recover sufficiently to be taken to the federal courthouse in south Boston, or they might even request a federal judge comes to the hospital to charge him at the bedside. US officials said a special interrogation unit specialised in dealing with high-value suspects were waiting to question him.

On Friday the FBI took two men and a woman in New Bedford, Massachusetts, into custody and are questioning them about their links to Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

The federal public defender's office in Massachusetts said it has agreed to represent Tsarnaev once he is charged. Miriam Conrad, public defender for Massachusetts, told the Associated Press that he should have a lawyer appointed as soon as possible because there are "serious issues regarding possible interrogation."

Once federal investigators are allowed access to Tsarnaev, they will be keen to quiz him on his connections – in the US, in Dagestan, where his father lives, and Chechnya, where Tamerlan Tsarnaev is thought to have visited last year.

Much of the investigation is likely to focus on the activities of the elder brother. The FBI has revealed that in 2011 Tamerlan was interviewed by its agents at the request of an unnamed foreign government – widely assumed to have been Russia – who asked the bureau to look into whether Tamerlan, then 24, had extremist connections.

In a statement, the FBI said that the foreign government had information that Tamerlan Tsarnaev was a "follower of radical Islam and a strong believer, and that he had changed drastically since 2010 as he prepared to leave the United States for travel to the country's region to join unspecified underground groups".
No evidence of terrorism

In response to the request, the FBI scoured Tamerlan Tsarnaev's telephone records, online history, associations with other people, movements and educational history, and agents interviewed him and his relatives. But the bureau found no evidence of terrorism activity either at home or abroad. It passed on its findings to the foreign government.

According to US travel records, Tsarnaev arrived at Moscow's Sheremetyevo airport on 12 January 2012, returning on 17 July. He spent time in Makhachkala, Dagestan, that summer. "It was 40C and he was wearing these American boots," said Larissa Abakarova, who maintains a shop across the street from the home of the parents of Tsarnaev. "He was stylish, kind, good-looking. I'm in shock."
School number one, which Boston bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev attended as a child, in Makhachkala. School number one, which Boston bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev attended as a child, in Makhachkala, Dagestan. Photograph: Reuters

A neighbour, Vyacheslav Kazakevich, said the Tsarnaevs' parents would travel regularly between the neighbouring republics of Dagestan and Chechnya, where several relatives live, including an aunt. He said that Tamerlan visited Chechnya, just an hour's drive from Makhachkala, during his trip to Russia in early 2012. "All their roots are there. They had no ties to rebels or to wahhabi," he said, using the accepted Russian term for Islamist fundamentalists.

In the Russia Today interview, the suspects' mother, Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, claimed they had been set up by the FBI. But by Friday evening, the Tsarnaevs had been questioned by the Federal Security Service, sources said. Zubeidat Tsarnaeva shut off her phone and her husband rarely picked his up after that.

At around 6pm on Friday, a relative drove the two away – some said to Chechnya, others to a secret location in Makhachkala. "She was sobbing last night as she left, you could hear it," said the neighbour, Larissa Abakarova. "She was in hysterics."

By Saturday, more than 50 victims of the Boston bombing remained in hospital, with three in a critical condition.
ramana
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by ramana »

Philip
GD was also questioning how the suspect pictures look so bad.
Theo_Fidel

Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Theo_Fidel »

SwamyG wrote:Speaking one's mind in a courteous and civil manner, should not be construed as preaching. Well, we can accuse others of propaganda, paranoia, CTs and what no. Going back to our tradition, a little introspection and self-realization would do us all good and reduce the 'nuisance'. Until then time to keep hoping for 'pak hand'. So how many people now have expected, prayed, predicted and hoped in these dhaagas, now? And BRF was doing its own version of crowd-sourcing - it always does. Discussion forums have that characteristic. Nothing wrong, nothing right. Inherent nature.
Swamyg,

It is not wrong to post ones opinion. Other than threats and bad language.

But what was being done was posting actual pictures of real people based on essentially racial profiling or PC term for bigotry or racism. I wonder how it would be if it was your son circled with a big red cross hairs type circle as a suspect because of the color of his skin. One is expected to use a filter and be careful before posting such nonsense. These are real world consequences. One is reminded of the kid who blithely taped a gay student, revealed his name and youtubed the tape and claimed innocence. What manner of taking responsibility for your actions is this.

Think man, before you defend the indefensible.

That said anmol should be allowed to post his opinion again, everyone needs a second chance. :)
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

he might stage a recovery, but only after certain cleanups are done for the inevitable joint congressional enquiry commission that is coming.

not all 3 letter agencies might be in on the deal. so equalization has to be done before the joint interrogation committee convenes in session else it will shouting matches in the background "you guys never told us xyz" at director level.
Satya_anveshi
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Satya_anveshi »

Agree with Theo ji who made multiple posts asking to desist from aiding the racial profiling and risking others.

Legal Deception is one of the critical powers of Law Enforcement Agencies. Unfortunately, it is also one of the most used power in the U.S especially complicated by the fact that the domestic law enforcement and international will enforecement/empire management collide so often and spectacularly.

Due to this complication, they are also liable to Fu(kup royally and when they do, folks needs to be think if they are aiding any such f'ups.

Further, as this is Bharat Rakshak forum, last thing that should happen here is risk our own...exactly opposite of our supposed objective. To be fair, anmol realized this and expressed sorry but posts should have been deleted immediately with extreme urgency.
Theo_Fidel

Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Theo_Fidel »

shiv wrote:If one of those roots is Islam it must be researched by sociologists and psychologists. It is not science to dismiss a possible connection as fake
I'm of the view that we should not give an out to the muslim folks for their actions. Putting the blame on their religion allows them to shield their horrific behavior all the way from misogyny, to racism to bigotry and intolerance.

Muslims behave this way because large chunks of them are poorly brought up bigots with low socialization, inability to deal with the woman question and childhood scars inflicted by abusive parenting. We should call them for what they are all the way from bigots to racists. People brought up that way are very likely to behave in this manner, esp. as they have active groups recruiting amongst them with mosque money.

Similar societies elsewhere have behaved similarly. The Jim crow south was famous for fire bombing little black children, lynching teenagers and assassinating black leaders. South african society was similar as well. But the biggest group of racist bigots in the world are muslim. They must change their child rearing and parenting philosophy if there is to be change.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by habal »

Philip wrote:Yes,he now has "throat injuries" and may not be able to speak!!!
this is why discussing american incidents is pointless, self-defeating activity. they are rogues within a nation or plot within a nation of rogues. Whatever the case be, they cause and resolve such matters, the mother said FBI entrapped her kids, the FBI then slits his throat. So it's all in the house. How is this related to the Indian situation ? Just a waste of time in my humble opinion.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Rangudu »

I've known of cases where someone shot in the head was able to walk to a hospital. Reports say that this guy had a bullet wound through his throat and had lot a lost of blood. Adrenaline can make you do many things, so a sudden will to live can enable you to climb/jump off a boat. That doesn't mean that you have a lesser risk of dying from the loss of blood.

Wherever these guys learned their trade, the intention was that there would be no escape. Once cornered, as a jihadi you are taught to take out as many of the other side as possible and die in a blaze of 'glory'. Given that the older bro is the primary jihadi, it's not surprising that the younger guy couldn't find it in him to do it in the end.
shiv
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by shiv »

Theo_Fidel wrote:
Muslims behave this way because large chunks of them are poorly brought up bigots with low socialization, inability to deal with the woman question and childhood scars inflicted by abusive parenting. We should call them for what they are all the way from bigots to racists. People brought up that way are very likely to behave in this manner, esp. as they have active groups recruiting amongst them with mosque money.
What you are doing here is secularizing Islam. This is what has always happened up until now. I am calling for a change from this standard practice that you say must be continued.

If Islam demands parental behavior and upbringing that amounts to people being "poorly brought up bigots with low socialization, inability to deal with the woman question and childhood scars inflicted by abusive parenting." it must not be rationalized as "Oh this can happen to anyone who is brought up this way". Islam gets free rein to do what it wants and if Islam is doing that it must at the very least be documented rather than saying "oh this can happen to anyone"
shiv
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by shiv »

Rangudu wrote:I've known of cases where someone shot in the head was able to walk to a hospital. Reports say that this guy had a bullet wound through his throat and had lot a lost of blood. Adrenaline can make you do many things, so a sudden will to live can enable you to climb/jump off a boat. That doesn't mean that you have a lesser risk of dying from the loss of blood.

Wherever these guys learned their trade, the intention was that there would be no escape. Once cornered, as a jihadi you are taught to take out as many of the other side as possible and die in a blaze of 'glory'. Given that the older bro is the primary jihadi, it's not surprising that the younger guy couldn't find it in him to do it in the end.
Rangudu at this stage what is the proof that the older guy was the jihadi and this guy less so. That is just speculation, and one guy is dead so anything can be said of him
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by JE Menon »

There were two explosions in the boat set off by dzokhar as per bbc. He tried to go out in style but failed it seems
Rajiv Lather
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Rajiv Lather »

This is the Boston followup thread, last time I checked Boston is a city in the United States. Two Americans living in the States kill and maim many fellow Americans... and so on. And yet some people here have trouble as to why acts of omission and commission of the American government are being discussed here.
Last edited by Rajiv Lather on 21 Apr 2013 12:00, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Rajiv Lather »

I know I may be sounding like a broken record by now, but you are requested to check up two things:

1. At what time the print and online media outed the news of two suspects, with black and white caps, the white one being worn reversed, and carrying backpacks ? And at what time are the pics and video finally released by the FBI ?

2. Please watch the press conference of the FBI where they released the pics and carefully observe the body language of those behind the mics.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

Sources tell Fox News that investigators are exploring potential links between Boston bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev and extremist group Caucasus Emirate, purportedly led by Doku Umarov, a Chechen Islamic militant in Russia, whose ordering of attacks on civilians earned him nickname of Russia's Usama bin Laden.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Rajiv Lather »

Singha wrote:Sources tell Fox News that investigators are exploring potential links between Boston bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev and extremist group Caucasus Emirate, purportedly led by Doku Umarov, a Chechen Islamic militant in Russia, whose ordering of attacks on civilians earned him nickname of Russia's Usama bin Laden.
Continuation of use of media to spread more disinformation - why would Caucasus Emirates or other Chechen rebels be attacking the United States, one of their main backers ? Have they looked at a world map ?
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Satya_anveshi »

Uncle's press conf is curious - he validates they are chechens and they are of jihadi persuation even though he claims he last met them in 2006 (that is seven years ago). Even then calls them losers. The younger one would have been 12 years at that time / Older one 19.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

there could be different factions of chechens and unkil may have supported some other faction or sold this one down the river.
or maybe like any good bakpaki he wants american money but hates america :)
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Raja Bose »

Unkil bolis, Ombaba all seem to treat this as some 2-man isolated incident. I wonder what gives? And all the pictures of black kitted shakinaw warriors just underlines the fact that they couldn't track one injured 19 year old for 3 days and only caught him by accident after officially giving up the search. Next time someone lectures SDRE police/military on how XYZ militant slipped away or why did it take 48 hours to do Mumbai ops, they would do well to remember this incident.

...and see the lack of any rona dhona on why it took so long. If this was in SDRE India, we would have a million talking head dumb$hits on TV piously blabbing away on incompetence of Indian security forces blah blah blah.... :roll:
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by manjgu »

@RajivLather..could u please interpret the body language for us. dont have access to the said video/pictures ! what do u infer..
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by manjgu »

and also the comment "Have they looked at the world map"?? could not understand what r u trying to convey?
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Altair »

Chechen mercenaries involvement in Syria would be a nice place to start.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

in other news...US is doubling its "non lethal" aid to syrian rebels to around $115 mil as announced by secy of state.
UK and France are working hard to lift the EU arms embargo on syrian confict , against objection from germany and say that they , in conjunction with Qatar can supply enough arms to make a change in the ground situation.

I dont think US will rest until entire europe is surrounded by hostile islamic regimes :lol: (with russia a benign neighbour now)

maybe thats the idea, keep EU fearful and insecure and a pliant customer for american MIC !

that way North Korea and TSP are also assured a secure existence just so that Soko and India cozy up to US for arms!

we can break this chakravyuh trap by making most of our own arms and watching the fun as flamesblow back in direction of the hand that fed it
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by ArmenT »

Rangudu wrote:I've known of cases where someone shot in the head was able to walk to a hospital. Reports say that this guy had a bullet wound through his throat and had lot a lost of blood. Adrenaline can make you do many things, so a sudden will to live can enable you to climb/jump off a boat. That doesn't mean that you have a lesser risk of dying from the loss of blood.
According to the BBC, investigators have been quoted saying that the wound to the neck may have been a failed suicide attempt on the part of the suspect.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22232196
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by prashanth »

Singha wrote:I dont think US will rest until entire europe is surrounded by hostile islamic regimes :lol: (with russia a benign neighbour now)
Singha wrote:maybe thats the idea, keep EU fearful and insecure and a pliant customer for american MIC !
that way North Korea and TSP are also assured a secure existence just so that Soko and India cozy up to US for arms!
Obviously, this policy has its blow-backs. As you yourselves have posted in this thread, the country is already having birth pangs of whatever. The bunnies world over are not so stupid as to not see through the deceit and have started acting, as demonstrated in Boston and Sep-11. In this crossfire between the MIC-politicos and the bunnies, it is the aam-joe/jane who suffers silently.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Philip »

Russians have foir ages lumped the Chechens into being "gangsters',responsible for many criminal activities.I do not know how many remember the days before Chechenya exploded.Ex Russian Air Force Maj-Gen. Djokar Dudayev was in the saddle.The BBC started several features on Chechenya and their people,"dressed to kill",etc.Suddenly,the Chechen war was with us,the BBC had been "ahead of the curve" or did it know beforehand.After a very bloody war,the Russians "hit" Djokar with a PGM that homed onto his cell phone.The Chechens then became mercenaries for pan-Islamist wars anywhere in the Islamic world,including J&K.Several murderous attacks in Russia took place.This has suited the western establishment who still live with a Cold War attitude.
Well knowing the mental attitude of Chechens,perhaps the most extreme from the Islamic world after the Pakis,why has the west consistently allowed them to enter as refugees?!

This Q is a serious one as allegatiosn that elemnets within the establishment hope to train and use them for anti-Russian attacks.Similarly,the Brits got caught ion Iraq when their "Arab terrorists" were caught with their pants down.They were held prisoner and only a combined US-UK special forces rescue attempt saved the day and further embarrassment.
Here are details ofn that story:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/were-briti ... -basra/994

Were British Special Forces Soldiers Planting Bombs in Basra?
Does anyone remember the shock with which the British public greeted the revelation four years ago that one of the members of the Real IRA unit whose bombing attack in Omagh on August 15, 1998 killed twenty-nine civilians had been a double agent, a British army soldier?

That soldier was not Britain’s only terrorist double agent. A second British soldier planted within the IRA claimed he had given forty-eight hours advance notice of the Omagh car-bomb attack to his handlers within the Royal Ulster Constabulary, including “details of one of the bombing team and the man’s car registration.” Although the agent had made an audio tape of his tip-off call, Sir Ronnie Flanagan, chief constable of the RUC, declared that “no such information was received” (http://www.sundayherald.com/17827).

This second double agent went public in June 2002 with the claim that from 1981 to 1994, while on full British army pay, he had worked for “the Force Research Unit, an ultra-secret wing of British military intelligence,” as an IRA mole. With the full knowledge and consent of his FRU and MI5 handlers, he became a bombing specialist who “mixed explosive and … helped to develop new types of bombs,” including “light-sensitive bombs, activated by photographic flashes, to overcome the problem of IRA remote-control devices having their signal jammed by army radio units.” He went on to become “a member of the Provisional IRA’s ‘internal security squad’—also known as the ‘torture unit’—which interrogated and executed suspected informers” (http://www.sundayherald.com/print25646).

The much-feared commander of that same “torture unit” was likewise a mole, who had previously served in the Royal Marines’ Special Boat Squadron (an elite special forces unit, the Marines’ equivalent to the better-known SAS). A fourth mole, a soldier code-named “Stakeknife” whose military handlers “allowed him to carry out large numbers of terrorist murders in order to protect his cover within the IRA,” was still active in December 2002 as “one of Belfast’s leading Provisionals” (http://www.sundayherald.com/29997).

Reliable evidence also emerged in late 2002 that the British army had been using its double agents in terrorist organizations “to carry out proxy assassinations for the British state”—most notoriously in the case of Belfast solicitor and human rights activist Pat Finucane, who was murdered in 1989 by the Protestant Ulster Defence Association. It appears that the FRU passed on details about Finucane to a British soldier who had infiltrated the UDA; he in turn “supplied UDA murder teams with the information” (http://www.sundayherald.com/29997).

Recent events in Basra have raised suspicions that the British army may have reactivated these same tactics in Iraq.

Articles published by Michel Chossudovsky, Larry Chin and Mike Whitney at the Centre for Research on Globalization’s website on September 20, 2005 have offered preliminary assessments of the claims of Iraqi authorities that two British soldiers in civilian clothes who were arrested by Iraqi police in Basra on September 19—and in short order released by a British tank and helicopter assault on the prison where they were being held—had been engaged in planting bombs in the city

See:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... icleId=972
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... icleId=982
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... icleId=981

A further article by Kurt Nimmo points to false-flag operations carried out by British special forces troops in Northern Ireland and elsewhere, and to Donald Rumsfeld’s formation of the P2OG, or Proactive Preemptive Operations Group, as directly relevant to Iraqi charges of possible false-flag terror operations by the occupying powers in Iraq (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... icleid=992).

These accusations by Iraqi officials echo insistent but unsubstantiated claims, going back at least to the spring of 2004, to the effect that many of the terror bombings carried out against civilian targets in Iraq have actually been perpetrated by U.S. and British forces rather than by Iraqi insurgents.

Some such claims can be briskly dismissed. In mid-May 2005, for example, a group calling itself “Al Qaeda in Iraq” accused U.S. troops “of detonating car bombs and falsely accusing militants” (http://siteinstitute.org/bin/articles.c ... category=0). For even the most credulous, this could at best be a case of the pot calling the kettle soot-stained. But it’s not clear why anyone would want to believe this claim, coming as it does from a group or groupuscule purportedly led by the wholly mythical al-Zarqawi—and one whose very name affiliates it with terror bombers. These people, if they exist, might themselves have good reason to blame their own crimes on others.
(This is a long report,read the link please for the full report.)


http://www.theinsider.org/news/article.asp?id=1556
British special forces caught dressed as Arab 'terrorists'

British soldiers have been caught posing as Arabs and shooting Iraqis in the occupied city of Basra in southern Iraq. A group of them was caught yesterday by Iraqi police. They were driving an Iraqi car, wearing Arab clothing, and carrying weapons and explosives.

The Iraqi police were patrolling the area looking for suspected "terrorists" or "insurgents", and they noticed that the men were acting suspiciously. Suddenly, without warning, the suspicious men started shooting at people, but the new Iraqi security forces managed to capture some of them before they could escape. Obviously, if these men had not been caught, the mass media would now be reporting the incident as just another attempt by evil "terrorists" to create civil war in Iraq.

There have been a number of incidents in this area and throughout Iraq in which police and civilians have been targeted and killed by "terrorists" or "insurgents". But this is the first time that any of those responsible have been caught in the act, and it is now clear that at least some of them are working directly for the occupying forces, as many Iraqis have openly suspected all along.

A few days ago, in a statement unreported in the corporate mass media, Iran's most senior military official specifically linked the instability in Iraq with agents of the US and its allies: "we have information that the insecurity has its roots in the activities of American and Israeli spies."

The post-war violence in Iraq is always been blamed on "Islamic extremists" or "rival ethnic factions". Yet in the history of the country, nothing like this has ever happened before. The problems began precisely when the US and UK seized control.

The Iraqi police arrested the men and put them in prison. Unfortunately the police never had a chance to question the men and find out exactly what they were doing, because within minutes the UK sent in six tanks and an elite SAS unit to break their terrorists out of jail.

During the illegal prison break Iraqi officials were held at gunpoint, much of the jail was demolished, and all of the other criminals and insurgents were set free. The US and UK do not hesitate to use violence and terror to achieve their objectives, no matter what the consequences.

The official explanation for the illegal jail break is that somebody thought the British men might be taken away by a gang of Iraqi resistance fighters and never seen again. This is blatantly nonsense, of course, because the entire prison was entirely surrounded by British tanks and troops. With the full force of the British military at hand, the terrorists were rescued quickly and easily.

As further details emerge, the Western media increasingly presents conflicting reports about the nature and sequence of events, and the official British sources cited without question in mainstream news coverage are indicative of a classic disinformation exercise.

When local people saw what was happening the area began to erupt with angry anti-British protests.


SOURCE

The Guardian, "British tanks storm Basra jail to free undercover soldiers", front page, 20 September 2005.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0, ... 33,00.html
British tanks storm Basra jail to free undercover soldiers
British troops used tanks last night to break down the walls of a prison in the southern Iraqi city of Basra and free two undercover British soldiers who were seized earlier in the day by local police.
An official from the Iraqi interior ministry said half a dozen tanks had broken down the walls of the jail and troops had then stormed it to free the two British soldiers. The governor of Basra last night condemned the "barbaric aggression" of British forces in storming the jail.
Aquil Jabbar, an Iraqi television cameraman who lives across the street from the jail, said dozens of Iraqi prisoners also fled in the confusion.
...
In a day of dramatic incidents in the heart of the British-controlled area of Iraq, the two undercover soldiers - almost certainly special forces - were held by Iraqi security forces after clashes that reportedly left two people dead and threatened to escalate into a diplomatic incident between London and Baghdad.
The soldiers, who were said to have been wearing Arab headdress, were accused of firing at Iraqi police when stopped at a road block.
...
Muhammad al-Abadi, an official in the Basra governorate, told journalists the two undercover soldiers had looked suspicious to police. "A policeman approached them and then one of these guys fired at him. Then the police managed to capture them."
...


FURTHER READING

BBC News, "Iraq probe into soldier incident", 20 September 2005.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle ... 264614.stm
...
Both men were members of the SAS elite special forces, sources told the BBC's Richard Galpin in Baghdad.
...
Mr Reid said surveillance had established the men were being moved to another location, while at the same time an angry crowd posed an obstacle to the departure of the six-strong team.
...
Almost simultaneously, a separate operation was staged to rescue the men from the place where they had been moved to.
...
Richard Galpin said al-Jazeera news channel footage, purportedly of the equipment carried in the men's car, showed assault rifles, a light machine gun, an anti-tank weapon, radio gear and medical kit.
...


Al-Jazeera, "The occupation forces are the real perpetrators of bomb attacks in Iraq?", 14 September 2005.
http://www.aljazeera.com/cgi-bin/conspi ... asp?id=257
Iran�s top military commander accused the United States and Israel of planning the non-stop bomb attacks that killed thousands of civilians in Iraq.
Brigadier General Mohammad-Baqer Zolqadr, the deputy commander of Iran�s Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC), told a gathering of senior officials, that the U.S. needs those attacks to justify the continuation of its military presence in Iraq.
�The Americans blame weak and feeble groups in Iraq for insecurity in this country. We do not believe this and we have information that the insecurity has its roots in the activities of American and Israeli spies,� Zolqadr said.
�Insecurity in Iraq is a deeply-rooted phenomenon. The root of insecurity in Iraq lies in the occupation of this country by foreigners�.
...


Washington Post, "British Smash Into Iraqi Jail To Free 2 Detained Soldiers", front page, 20 September 2005.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00572.html
BAGHDAD, Sept. 19 -- British armored vehicles backed by helicopter gunships burst through the walls of an Iraqi jail Monday in the southern city of Basra to free two British commandos detained earlier in the day by Iraqi police, witnesses and Iraqi officials said. The incident climaxed a confrontation between the two nominal allies that had sparked hours of gun battles and rioting in Basra's streets.
An Iraqi official said a half-dozen armored vehicles had smashed into the jail, the Reuters news agency reported. The provincial governor, Mohammed Walli, told news agencies that the British assault was "barbaric, savage and irresponsible."
...
In London, authorities said the two commandos were released after negotiations. But the BBC quoted British defense officials as saying a wall was demolished when British forces went to "collect" the men.
The killing of the New York Times reporter took place six weeks after an American freelance journalist, Steven Vincent, was kidnapped and killed in Basra, allegedly after being taken away in a marked police car. ...
...
Iraqi security officials on Monday variously accused the two Britons they detained of shooting at Iraqi forces or trying to plant explosives. Photographs of the two men in custody showed them in civilian clothes.
...
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by SaiK »

I just can't imagine how these two brainless bros could shoot an officer dead in front of MIT,and consider an escape plan executed. It was all written from then. Had they not shot the affsar for no reason, and stole the vehicle, I am pretty positive, they could have escaped.. somewhere, or even sneaked into Canada or Mexico.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

one munna is dead, the other is unable to talk. and everyone in govt is running around declaring the suspects acted alone, with just 2 days of investigation logged.

0 + 0 = 2
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

Two pioneering researchers of brain disease among athletes in violent sports recommended Saturday that investigators conduct special autopsy tests on amateur boxer Tamerlan Tsarnaev to determine whether the Boston Marathon bombing suspect could have been affected by boxing-related brain damage.

The researchers expressed serious doubt the disease — chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE — could have factored in the wave of violence that led to Tsarnaev’s death early Friday in a firefight with police.

But they suggested investigators would be remiss if they did not autopsy Tsarnaev’s brain for signs of CTE. The disease can only be diagnosed through post-mortem forensic tests of the brain.

“I hope to God they do the special testing,’’ said Dr. Robert Cantu, a clinical professor of neurosurgery at Boston University School of Medicine.

Both Cantu and Dr. Robert Stern, cofounders of the Center for the Study of Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy at BU, were personally touched by the tragedy. They have friends and relatives who remain hospitalized from injuries suffered in the Marathon bombings.

Both researchers said they considered CTE when they learned of Tsarnaev’s boxing background. Tsarnaev, 26, had fought most of his life after his father introduced him to the sport as a child. He won numerous regional titles in New England Golden Gloves competition and advanced to the national championships in 2009.

Athletes as young as 17 have been diagnosed with CTE. Many other young athletes have been diagnosed with the disease after they committed suicide or engaged in other aberrant behavior.

The most common effects of CTE among young patients involve emotional instability and lack of impulse control.

By many accounts, Tsarnaev underwent a significant personality change in recent years. Family members said he was charged with physically abusing his wife, and a gym owner said Tsarnaev stunned onlookers within the last two weeks when he acted out of character by behaving disrespectfully at the facility.

Despite those circumstan-ces, the BU researchers said, the highly deliberate and premeditated nature of the bombing attacks did not fit the profile of a patient with CTE.

“Is it possible that some changes might have gone on in his overall functioning due to his boxing and potentially related brain disease? Yes,’’ said Stern, a BU professor of neurology and neurosurgery. “Anything is possible. But to then jump to the disease leading to well-planned behavior like this, I couldn’t go there.’’

Dozens of football and hockey players as well as wrestlers have been diagnosed with CTE, which was long described in medical literature as boxing-related “dementia pugilistica’’ until scientific breakthroughs this century.

Stern said it’s not unreasonable to wonder whether a perpetrator of such egregious and seemingly senseless violence as the Marathon bombings experienced brain abnormalities.

“We can’t think of their brains as being normal,’’ he said. “But there are too many people who do such bizarre and terrible acts that it’s unlikely it’s all due to one terrorist gene or disease.’’

Routine autopsies do not include the generally expensive testing for CTE. And even if evidence of CTE were discovered in Tsarnaev’s brain, it would not prove a link between the disease and his recent actions, the researchers said.

But the historic significance of the Marathon bombings and the devastation they wrought should compel investigators to conduct the tests, according to the researchers.

“Am I suggesting it because I think he has the disease? No,’’ Stern said. “But would it lead to a complete picture [of his brain]? Yes.’’

Cantu said, “If they don’t do it, something could be missed.’’
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by member_22872 »

Singha ji, As per CBS FBI analyst, the younger brother got shot the previous night in the leg and he tried to kill himself(could be after his brother's death) by shooting through his mouth. But apparently the bullet badly wounded his neck than killing him.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... _ztMtty9fY

helicopter video of a MRAP type thing with a steel rod going near the boat to push the plastic sheet off, then atleast 3 flash grenades were thrown in
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

the BMW buddies are being rounded up incl the famous terrorista#1 bmw 330

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -time.html
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by SaiK »

well, if they are going to hang him soon (if he survives the hospital, and answers questions), and no miranda, then india paints itself bad on supporting terrorism, by enabling kasab to have lived so long. why can't we learn? we have copied many constitutional setup from british. we need to copy certain things from massans too. am i treated bad for saying this?

i know this what is happening is more eye-for an-eye.. but that is how it turns out finally. kasab's end was all pre-drawn. and there would not have been any other option in any sane mind. then, why not take quick decisions [at least by month if not hours or days]?

instead of india bashing, we need india correcting threads.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Singha »

he will get his miranda 48 hrs after he is able to talk..atleast thats what the law says apparently.
some kind of arrangement for public defender lawyer , education him on right to remain silent will make one expects.
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by SaiK »

http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/21/us/boston ... index.html

Mujahideen of the Caucasus Emirate Province of Dagestan!?!
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Re: Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Post by Satya_anveshi »

Singha wrote:one munna is dead, the other is unable to talk. and everyone in govt is running around declaring the suspects acted alone, with just 2 days of investigation logged.

0 + 0 = 2
Good Catch! They may be placing their belief and utmost trust in Chechen rebels, Taliban /ISI / Pakistani Army/Al-quaida etc statements that they had no links with the duo or they just know it.
Both will mean mean more questions.
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