India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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ramana
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ramana »

We need folks to extract the Drain Inspector's report and make it easy to quote.


We are just following famous footsteps only.
JNU and thie ilk dumbedown the others and we are treading the Mahatma's path.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by UlanBatori »

I was able to do that using Adobe Acrobat. It wouldn't extract (gave error) but I was able to delete the pages ahead and behind it. Any suggestions on posting it? I can email it to you (in a minute)

OK, pls check your mail.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 06 Mar 2014 07:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

UlanBatori wrote:Wendy's menial sepoys :eek:
This article needs to be posted in full on here




Wendy’s Menial Sepoys

By Kalavai Venkat / In Commentary / March 3, 2014


Rajiv Malhotra brilliantly tweeted, “Can’t be bothered by menial sepoys, only senior ones” thereby brushing aside one of Wendy’s Children that attempted to abuse him. One couldn’t have put it better and it is usually a waste of time to respond to every leftist ignoramus who attempts to make a livelihood by abusing Hinduism. However, Malhotra’s term, “Wendy’s Menial Sepoys,” is not only a catchy meme but effectively categorizes an unscrupulous crowd of cowardly liars. In this article, I am going to analyze the behavior of such menial sepoys by using one of them as an example.

Penguin India recently voluntarily withdrew Wendy Doniger’s The Hindus: An Alternative History after reaching an agreement with a litigant. Shefali Chandra, an associate professor of history at (the 30th ranked in history, second tier) Washington University in St. Louis, was outraged. She alleged that “the United States has been shaping the contours of Hinduism (…) from the perspective of upper caste and conservative interests.”

Chandra also alleged that during the 2006 California Textbook Trial, Hindu-American parents attempted to overthrow the school textbooks because they had been authored “by anti-Hindu scholars and that it favored colonial stereotypes on Hinduism.” She asserted that the information Hindu-Americans disputed was “hardly insulting” and accused them of using “the terminology of ‘hurt’ and ‘embarrassment’ to shape the knowledge of Hinduism and India.”

What is the truth?

California textbook standards (see section 6.6) advocate portraying “the origins of Christianity” as the fulfillment of “the Jewish messianic prophecies” and recounting “the life and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth as described in The New Testament.” It is highly irresponsible to portray delusional prophecies as history. It is disingenuous to recount the origins of Christianity according to the narrative of The New Testament and create the false impression that the gospel stories are historical accounts. In truth, The New Testament was repeatedly modified and books added to and subtracted from it until the 27 books that constitute it were canonized in 367 CE (Ehrman, Bart: Truth and Fiction in the Da Vinci Code, p. 93).

Ehrman informs us: “The practice of Christian forgery has a long and distinguished history. We know of Gospels and other sacred books forged in the names of the apostles down into the Middle Ages – and on, in fact, to the present day (Ehrman, Bart: Lost Scriptures – Books That Did Not Make It Into the New Testament, p. 3).” He adds, “There are more differences among (The New Testament) manuscripts than there are words in The New Testament (Ehrman, Bart: Misquoting Jesus – The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why, p. 10).”

As Ehrman points out in Lost Christianities – The Battle for Scripture and the Faiths We Never Knew, in the early centuries of the Common Era, heretical and Gnostic schools of Christianity, whose teachings were very different from those of orthodox Christianity (which includes today’s Catholicism, Protestantism, Evangelism, etc.), dotted the landscape. Orthodox Christianity eventually prevailed by violently suppressing the rival schools.

Textbooks do not allow these historical realities to be portrayed. Instead, they require portraying Christianity in such a manner as to strengthen the religious indoctrination students receive at home and in their parochial churches. The Sermon on the Mount is presented as if a historical Jesus delivered it even though scholarly research has shown that it was borrowed from Buddhism and incorporated into The New Testament probably centuries after the time Jesus is alleged to have lived. The portrayal of Jesus and Christianity is highly sanitized and none of the negative aspects of that religion such as its inherent anti-Semitism or the advocacy of genocide of non-believers is mentioned.

Textbooks sanitize the portrayal of Islam too. As I show in my article, California Schools Proselytize for Allah, textbooks portray the claims of the alleged revelation to the prophet Muhammad as historical fact. Muhammad’s intolerant acts of destruction of pagan places of worship are inexplicably presented as acts of forgiveness and his pagan opponents are falsely demonized. Violent jihad is rebranded as the striving to “resist temptation and overcome evil.”

Various Christian churches and an Islamic outfit took an active part in defining the standards and textbook content to ensure that the portrayal of their respective religions is sensitive and that they aren’t subject to critical scrutiny. The said Islamic group even insisted on including anti-Semitic canards in textbooks to falsely implicate the Jews for the crucifixion of Jesus which could very well have been a cruci-fiction. No Hindu organization was consulted by the state until they petitioned demanding equality very late in the textbook adoption process.

Not only that, a very different yardstick was used to portray Hinduism. It was portrayed as the religion of invaders. The likes of Stanley Wolpert, who argues, “(The Aryan invasion) was the most important invasion in all of India’s history, since the Aryans brought with their Caucasian genes a new language – Sanskrit – and a new pantheon of gods (see section 4.14 of the CAPEEM complaint),” were made the arbiters of the content on Hinduism. Who but a white supremacist and an ignoramus would argue that an alleged invasion is all important because it brought ‘Caucasian genes’ into India? Anyone who has studied Genetics 101 would laugh at Wolpert’s Neanderthal-like belief in the existence of ‘Caucasian genes.’

Hinduism is portrayed as oppressing women whereas Islam is portrayed as having conferred upon women marital rights, right to education, and right to control the earnings from their work, to make contracts, and to serve as witnesses in court. Goddess Kāḻi is portrayed as “bloodthirsty.” A textbook, after summarizing the story of The Rāmāyaṇa, recounts the Hindu belief that wherever the story of Rāma is discussed Hanuman is present there, and mockingly asks the students to look around and see whether there is a monkey in the classroom. In The Bible, Jesus asserts, “For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them (Matthew 18:20).” Textbooks, after a discussion of The Bible, don’t ask the students to look around and see whether there is a crucified convict in the classroom. The effect of selectively directing such ridicule at Hinduism is the alienation of Hindu students from their religious traditions.

Does any of this look like a portrayal of Hinduism “from the perspective of upper caste and conservative interests” as Wendy’s Menial Sepoy alleges? Contrary to her claims, the Hindu contention was well supported by distinguished academics. Over 30 academics such as the eminent archaeologist B. B. Lal wrote the Department of Education explaining why there is no evidence for Aryan Invasion Theory (AIT). Professor Metzenberg, a distinguished biologist, wrote the Department that the genetic evidence doesn’t support AIT. Aren’t Hindu-Americans entitled to demand that their religion be portrayed using the same yardstick applied to portray Christianity and Islam? Why can’t one demand that the portrayal of religions have a factual basis? Perhaps Chandra is irked because unlike Wendy’s Menial Sepoys Hindu-Americans who valiantly fought for textbook revision didn’t kneel down in abject submission in front of their white masters.

It is unlikely that Chandra was unaware of these well-documented facts. Why then did she lie through the teeth to demonize Hindus? Her behavior is typical of Wendy’s Menial Sepoys. It is best understood when we see them as the native fifth column. In his brilliant essay, The Cultures of Christianities, David Eller points out that the imperial Christian mission created a native fifth column in societies it set out to conquer (Loftus, John W. (ed.): The Christian Delusion: Why Faith Fails, pp. 29-30). This native fifth column’s job is to continually attack and weaken the native culture thereby paving the way for its eventual evangelization. When they falsely denounce Hindus’ reasonable demands, Wendy’s Children and Wendy’s Menial Sepoys are acting as the fifth column to reinforce the imperial Christian West.

Their behavior follows a pattern. It always seeks to demonize and weaken Hindus and Hinduism while strengthening the Christian evangelizing mission and imperial designs. As I showed in my critique, The Doniger Book Controversy, Wendy Doniger shamelessly claimed that the vicious Christian canard about Thomas’ visit to India is a historical fact. This canard has been instrumental in legitimizing the forced conversions of India’s natives. Martha Nussbaum falsely claimed that Hindus had issued death threats to Jeffrey Kripal for his abusive portrayal of Hinduism. However, Aravindan Neelakandan proves that Kripal admitted that he has never received any threats. Arvind Kumar demonstrates that Nussbaum is a repeat offender:

“Nussbaum (falsely) alleged that Hindus threatened violence against the employees of Harvard University Press in order to prevent the publication of her book. A phone call to the number listed on the website of Harvard University Press in order to verify this charge resulted in the veracity of her claim quickly evaporating. The person who answered the phone repeatedly denied that any such incident had taken place and even laughed at it and brushed off the claim.”

Wendy’s Children and Wendy’s Menial Sepoys abandon all scruples to demonize the Hindus when Hindus refuse to be the native informants subservient to their imperial masters. It must be quite lucrative for the members of the fifth column when they don’t let ethics come in the way of fulfilling imperial agenda. However, an honest person would seek a better way to earn one’s livelihood than to prostitute oneself to imperial agendas and turn oneself into the lickspittle of one’s imperial handlers.
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Kalavai Venkat is a Silicon Valley-based writer, an atheist, a practicing orthodox Hindu, and author of the forthcoming book What Every Hindu Should Know About Christianity.
shiv
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

Can't resist reposting a terrific quote from the end of the article posted above
Wendy’s Children and Wendy’s Menial Sepoys abandon all scruples to demonize the Hindus when Hindus refuse to be the native informants subservient to their imperial masters. It must be quite lucrative for the members of the fifth column when they don’t let ethics come in the way of fulfilling imperial agenda. However, an honest person would seek a better way to earn one’s livelihood than to prostitute oneself to imperial agendas and turn oneself into the lickspittle of one’s imperial handlers.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Gus »

Crucified convict. That's something that'll stick in my mind.

Currently reading the book zealot by reza aslan. Very interesting book that tells about Jesus the nazarean as against Jesus the Christ.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ramana »

Zealot is a good book to read. Anujan recommended it.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Anantha »

Her lowness sakshat Wendy D has a farticle in tomorrow's NY times

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/06/opini ... ef=opinion
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

Anantha wrote:Her lowness sakshat Wendy D has a farticle in tomorrow's NY times

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/06/opini ... ef=opinion
Wendy Doniger has lost it completely. She is creating a mythical enemy whom she is fighting. Anyone who says anything that she disagrees with is lumped into a group whom she calls "hindutva-vadis" and says:
The Hindutva-vadis are the ones who are attacking Hinduism; I am defending it against them.
:rotfl:

LOL She is defending Hinduism?

She is defending what she claims is Hinduism by speaking up against some people whom she disagrees with.

Her utter brainlessness shows out in two comments in the article.

1. She counters the accusation that she has Christian missionary zeal by saying that she "grew up" in a jewish household. "professor" Doniger does not seem to know that what a person says or does in life is not stamped into permanence by the environment in which one grows up. Just because she grew up in a Jewish environment does not exclude her work from having a Christian missionary zeal

2. The second in fact is an insight into her ignorance of a simple Sanskrit derived word which she has learned to hate based on her political preferences. Why would Doniger get a political preference in India? Most likely because she has hobnobbed with and has been encouraged by non-BJP Indians.

She says she is fighting "Hindutva-vadis". She described "Hindutva" as "Hinduness". A better translation would be "the state of being Hindu" The suffix "-vadi" means "practitioner of " or "exponent of"

So Wendy Doniger is an opponent of those who are "practitioners of the state of being Hindu" (Hindutva-vadis) . If one is a practicing Hindu then Doniger will fight you. That is exactly correct. The woman is dumb.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

I have used my previous post to respond to Doniger's article in NYT:

The title "Banned in Bangalore" is a cheap attention grabbing title for an article by a person whose book was withdrawn by her publisher and not banned. Wendy Doniger makes two basic errors in her article, which sounds like a bad case of sour grapes

1. She counters the accusation that her work displays Christian missionary zeal by saying that she "grew up" in a Jewish household. Doniger does not seem to know that what a person says or does in life is not stamped into permanence by the environment in which one grows up. Growing up in a Jewish environment does not exclude her work from having a Christian missionary zeal.

2. Doniger displays a surprising ignorance of a simple Sanskrit derived word which she has learned to hate based on her political preferences. Why Doniger should have a political preference in India mystifies me. She says she is fighting "Hindutva-vadis". She describes "Hindutva" as "Hinduness". A better translation would be "the state of being Hindu". The suffix "-vadi" means "practitioner of"

So Wendy Doniger is an opponent of those who are "practitioners of the state of being Hindu" (Hindutva-vadis) . If one is a practicing Hindu then Doniger will fight you.

That is exactly the problem Madam. Your Freudian slip reveals your state of mind. You claim to "defend Hinduism" by fighting one group of Hindus whom you disagree with. Your views are biased and parochial. I expect neutrality from a scholar. Clearly you have missed that bus Prof. Doniger.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by JE Menon »

>>http://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg ... z2umZ0W7pi

So looks like LA Times have removed comments. Free speech anyone... as far as I know, the language and the analogies made by the posters there were far less virulent than those made by Doniger in the book...
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Neela »

Banned in Bangalore - I have a feeling that she is desperately trying to evoke sympathy.
But when I foolishly decided to set the matter straight — “Hey,” I wrote to an accuser, “I’m Jewish” — I was hit with a barrage of poisonous anti-Semitism. One correspondent wrote: “Hi. I recently came across your book on hindus. Where you try to humiliate us. I don’t know much about jews. Based on your work, I think jews are evil. So Hitler was probably correct in killing all jews in Germany. Bye.”
The above incident is possibly fake. She is using the holocaust and anti-Smitism,events which are well known, well published among readers and tries to portray that the mental outlook of the "Hindutwadis" is the same as that of the Hitler.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

JE Menon wrote:>>http://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg ... z2umZ0W7pi

So looks like LA Times have removed comments. Free speech anyone... as far as I know, the language and the analogies made by the posters there were far less virulent than those made by Doniger in the book...
I have started posting comments again and will eventually end up making the same points.

Goes to show how these media portals work hand in glove with the oiseaules whose tripe they publish.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by SanjayC »

JE Menon wrote:>>http://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg ... z2umZ0W7pi

So looks like LA Times have removed comments. Free speech anyone... as far as I know, the language and the analogies made by the posters there were far less virulent than those made by Doniger in the book...
The comments are there -- see the top right corner for link. My comment got published:
The problem is that everybody except Hindus are considered an authority on Hinduism. Jews, Christians, Muslims, all have declared themselves as experts on Hindu culture and religion and Hindus who say that the interpretation of these "scholars" are just a caricature of the real thing, are cursed as "Hindu fundamentalists." However, for Christianity, Islam and Judaism, only practicing scholars are allowed to write about them and considered an authority. This privilege is not assigned to Hindus for Hinduism, where non-Hindus as a matter of right try to grab the intellectual leadership.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by vishvak »

Neela wrote:Banned in Bangalore - I have a feeling that she is desperately trying to evoke sympathy.
But when I foolishly decided to set the matter straight — “Hey,” I wrote to an accuser, “I’m Jewish” — I was hit with a barrage of poisonous anti-Semitism. One correspondent wrote: “Hi. I recently came across your book on hindus. Where you try to humiliate us. I don’t know much about jews. Based on your work, I think jews are evil. So Hitler was probably correct in killing all jews in Germany. Bye.”
The above incident is possibly fake. She is using the holocaust and anti-Smitism,events which are well known, well published among readers and tries to portray that the mental outlook of the "Hindutwadis" is the same as that of the Hitler.
The bolded part is the goal apparently. Mixing up European hatred here.

We pay such a price for deracination when we ignore that it was Christian Europe behind hatred for Jews, Roma, gypsies & barbaric genocides. Secularism doesn't mean we opt to be confused.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by CRamS »

Guys, I mentioned on this August forum aeons ago, but to understand the contempt and hatred that India's elite have of BJP and any inkling of Hindu nationalism, look to the west. This b!@#$ch Wendy Doniger's op-ed in NYT offers the obvious clue. Look at her gall, she mocks Sanathana Dharama as a Brahmin cultist belief, and poses as a champion of the "other Hinduism". Believe me, in one stoke, she has many unsuspecting Hindus on her side, who have their own peeves against their upper caste Hindu brethren (and that probably explains why many Hindus are ostensibly rushing to read her book). See the classic colonial arrogance. Like US kills and slaughters in Iraq in the name of "bringing democracy" and "eliminating WMD". And what of India's elite, they have to follow like menial sepoys as MlhotraJi put it, to earn their fame. And ironically many of them are probably Brahmin and upper caste bloody cowards. So there you have it, a set of white colonial gangsters and their brown-assed menial sepoys looking at Hindus askance and pontificating what about them is authentic and what is not.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ShauryaT »

My comment on "Banned in Banglore"
The comment by Ms. Donniger that she is the one trying to save the real Hinduism made me go LOL. How can the NY Times be so naive to publish such an article, one that is clearly out there to find publicity for her works. It is the humble submission of this practitioner of Dharma and an Indian that, Ms. Donniger is not using the words Hindutva, Hinduism and Hindu some basic definitional terms in a manner that is already adjudicated on what they mean by the Supreme Court of India. The article is downright derogatory to a billion Indians and is nothing more than an ill informed political argument. An argument which she does not understand, for she is neither a Hindu nor an Indian. If she really wanted to fight for her works, she would have appealed through the courts in India. Freedom of the press, is never without limits. This debate is an old one in all democracies, on where the balance lies. Does one really expect the same type of adjudications on where the balance holds the same way in all societies for all times. India itself has a robust free press and yes the courts have sometimes ruled against some works considered by many to be an overreach by the courts but it is for Indian courts to decide the legal course, an option that Ms. Donniger did not pursue. Shame that NY Times chose to provide space to such drivel with a completely FALSE title that the book was "banned". It was not. It was withdrawn by the publisher.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ramana »

MsDoniger looks at Hindu religion through Fraudian framework* which might be appropropiate for Abrahmic derivatives but does not apply here.

She has the Fraudian hammer and wants to nail the Hindus when she should be using some other tools.


*Fraudian framework was created by Sigmund Freud who looked everything thorough sexual repression lens which was true of Abrahamic derivatives.
- Even the women in US were the last ones to get the righ to vote.
- And the Equal Rights Amendment was never ratified.
- No US woman elected to the highest office yet.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by habal »

Nobody knew of her silly book before it was banned. Now it has given her free publicity, so she wrote in her attention-seeking article that she is in 'high spirits', & sipping her favorite brand perhaps. Is it the Congi dirty tricks dept at play here, since they take almost no blame for banning the book and the 'hindootvawadis' are getting all the blame here.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ShauryaT »

I propose that we all tweet this issue and go to the NY Times and post our comments.

I tweeted the following:

"Banned in Bangalore is a lie" - Register your outrage at http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/06/opini ... ef=opinion

I am also posting the link to this page in the comments, hope it is OK.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Vayutuvan »

Neela wrote:Banned in Bangalore - I have a feeling that she is desperately trying to evoke sympathy.
But when I foolishly decided to set the matter straight — “Hey,” I wrote to an accuser, “I’m Jewish” — I was hit with a barrage of poisonous anti-Semitism.
The above incident is possibly fake. She is using the holocaust and anti-Smitism,events which are well known, well published among readers and tries to portray that the mental outlook of the "Hindutwadis" is the same as that of the Hitler.
Neela, no, it is not fake. IIRC, that exchange was between MissMarple and Bennedose in the LA Times article comments. So MissMarple == Wendy Doniger (nee O'Flaherty), so of (northern) Irish origin and may be swayed by the perfidious albino ... err Albian.

After Bennedose asked whether MissMarple is a Paki she shut up. Might have gone to LA Times crying antisemitism so they took off the comments offline for a time. If the comments are back ,then their review did not find any antisemitism. I hope she understands the following.

1. Firstly hindutvavadis do not have any reason to be antisemitic. May be she is confused by the use of Swastika. Then we know that she is completely shallow to write anything even remotely to do with hinduism.

2. I have never come across (even as far back as 50 years back) even somebody who is not literate in English sense (but quite well versed in smakritam classics in telugu and hindi and modern literature at that time, denying holocaust.

By the way even if somebody did engage in holocaust denial or antisemitism it is not a crime as it would be covered under free speech in US.

Whichever way we look at it, she does not have a case. I think she is angling for more publicity so that she can eke out a few bucks from Amazon sales of the book. The unfortunate fact in US is that Teachers/Professors are screwed in preference to Wall Street Investment Pankers and Doccus. If a society screws teachers, they would have a bunch of illiterates on their hands to run the country and bunch of quacks to treat their sick.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ramana »

Sure. Can also say

Doniger is a Fraudian scholar!
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ramana »

Matirmc, You mean she got slapped by sleeping pill!!!

Great job Doc!!!

Its an "anmol" moment in many ways!!!

She can figure out the duality of my comment.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by chetak »

matrimc wrote:{quote="Neela"}Banned in Bangalore - I have a feeling that she is desperately trying to evoke sympathy.
But when I foolishly decided to set the matter straight — “Hey,” I wrote to an accuser, “I’m Jewish” — I was hit with a barrage of poisonous anti-Semitism.
The above incident is possibly fake. She is using the holocaust and anti-Smitism,events which are well known, well published among readers and tries to portray that the mental outlook of the "Hindutwadis" is the same as that of the Hitler.{/quote}


Neela, no, it is not fake. IIRC, that exchange was between MissMarple and Bennedose in the LA Times article comments. So MissMarple == Wendy Doniger (nee O'Flaherty), so of (northern) Irish origin and may be swayed by the perfidious albino ... err Albian.

After Bennedose asked whether MissMarple is a Paki she shut up. Might have gone to LA Times crying antisemitism so they took off the comments offline for a time. If the comments are back ,then their review did not find any antisemitism. I hope she understands the following.

1. Firstly hindutvavadis do not have any reason to be antisemitic. May be she is confused by the use of Swastika. Then we know that she is completely shallow to write anything even remotely to do with hinduism.

2. I have never come across (even as far back as 50 years back) even somebody who is not literate in English sense (but quite well versed in smakritam classics in telugu and hindi and modern literature at that time, denying holocaust.

By the way even if somebody did engage in holocaust denial or antisemitism it is not a crime as it would be covered under free speech in US.

Whichever way we look at it, she does not have a case. I think she is angling for more publicity so that she can eke out a few bucks from Amazon sales of the book. The unfortunate fact in US is that Teachers/Professors are screwed in preference to Wall Street Investment Pankers and Doccus. If a society screws teachers, they would have a bunch of illiterates on their hands to run the country and bunch of quacks to treat their sick.
[Edited]
Last edited by ramana on 06 Mar 2014 20:54, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ramana
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

matrimc wrote: Whichever way we look at it, she does not have a case. I think she is angling for more publicity so that she can eke out a few bucks from Amazon sales of the book.
Yes - in fact she does admit in the article that
1. The removal of the book was a black moment
and
2. The book's rank in Amazon is "heaven".

Nevertheless I think most of us have seen how far Rushdie's book got despite much greater publicity. It got exactly nowhere.

But we have work to do. Polite criticisms of the article must be posted. My comment seems to have appeared online in the last hour or so.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by A_Gupta »

My comment on the NYT:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/06/opini ... d=11286222
Arun

Wendy Doniger and her students' depiction of Hindus is equivalent to someone taking the Catholic Mass and the idea of transubstantiation, and the general warfare is said will occur when Jesus returns; and thereby depicting European culture as one of a sublimated cannibalistic and genocidal people.

From the above, I hope that when I say that while Doniger's book should not have been banned in India, the offhand way in which opposition to her ideas is termed as "Hindu fundamentalist" is deeply offensive. I have suspended my subscription to the New York Times for two weeks for providing Doniger a platform to spread her propaganda.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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Couple of things I noticed (I havent brought myself enough strength to read the farticle by Shmt. Doniger):

Notice the title of the farticle: Banned in Bangalore. That is a marketing message to the American middle classes and it builds on the outsourcing meme :- "My job went to Bangalore". The rather coy usage of Bangalore instead of India tells me that Shree Doniger motorma is nothing but a racist attention seeking wretch. Its a subliminal message meant to invoke negative reactions from the American audience of NYT. Thus Yeevil Yindooo took your job and now look what the yeeevil yindoo did to me, he banned my book.

This theme is again repeated with the obviously fake story of another yeevil yindooo piling up Anti-semitic remarks on Shmt. Doniger. Like Ramana saar said, this is an attempt to draw a fake moral equivalence between Desert religions and Sanatana Dharma. Desert religions, by virtue of being originated in the desert, have a certain zero sum game mentality embedded in them, which turns each one of them into a cult. Cults jostling for space hate each other and it is clear from the history of these religions that they did exactly that. To this day they hate each other with such virulence that it removes any essence of humanity that may exist in their followers.

Sanatana Dharma has nothing to do with any of this, and it should be obvious to any student who has an average IQ and an open mind. Sanatana Dharma is based on Vasudeva Kutumbagam, the world is my family. Many paths lead to the same truth. There is no place for fundamentalism here. Infact any kind of cultishness should be banned in a country that has this principle in its constitution. Like Shiv saar says: Hindutva roughly translates to Hindu + asthithvam i.e. state of being a follower of Sanatan Dharma. The state of being accepting of all paths (including the cultish one) is falsely equated to fundamentalism by Wendy and her children. This is extremely unbecoming of a scholar of Hinduism who is assumed to know elementary sanskrit in the least.

Wendy should be lucky that her tiff is with us unwashed heathen savages. We chose to talk to her, she refused. Then we talked to her publishers they refused, finally we did the most uncivilized thing we could: Went to a court for a civil case. But that an Indian unwashed court and maybe does not count. She is still free to write more garbage, which I am sure she will.

If the tiff it was with one of the civilized 100% halaal desert religion of the most recent variety, she would be in hiding and would be watching out for her neck and making sure it still has a head on top of it.

Armchair general idea: What we really need is a site like http://www.indiafacts.co.in which acts as a factual barometer on what is bull$hit and whats not. It has to have an approved list and a black list, with each book in the black list having its own point by point rebuttal and reasoning as to why it deserves to be there.
Last edited by member_22733 on 06 Mar 2014 21:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by rgsrini »

A_Gupta,
Good comment. But I think we need to keep it a lot simpler if we want to get to a larger section of the readers. I suspect if the normal reader will understand "transsubstantiation" and the link it to "cannibalism". We have to make direct reference to blood & body of Christ, and say that pseudo-scholars Wendy's interpretation of Hinduism is like interpreting the christian practice as Cannibalism.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Satya_anveshi »

FYI only -
I did not read the book nor I think I will in near to medium term (I will definitely not spend a penny on it). But I am perplexed by the general reaction to the book given that I read the below on the former prominent BR member's blog a while ago (at least 6 to 9 months ago if not before):
reading Wendy Doniger's book now.
This should be interesting.
after a few days:
Doniger's book is worth a read.
I feel this is coming really close to my own perceptions about "Hinduism" - though ofcourse I can't claim any level of scholarship Wendy has. :roll: :shock:
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by Vayutuvan »

And being a drunkard in the church. They are "sinning".
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by A_Gupta »

Thanks, rgSrini, noted for future use.
Satya_anveshi wrote:FYI only -
I did not read the book nor I think I will in near to medium term (I will definitely not spend a penny on it). But I am perplexed by the general reaction to the book given that I read the below on the former prominent BR member's blog a while ago (at least 6 to 9 months ago if not before):....
We have a problem here. :)
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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more interesting is the NYT pick comments. almost all of them are the apologetic crap that makes one throw up.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

Veering off topic slightly. A lot of people, that includes Wendy Doniger and assorted evangelists in South India claim that "Sanatana Dharma" has imposed itself on some charming older religion.

I think there are a few facts that need to be looked at that show that Sanatana Dharma and the Vedic knowledge are the earliest known socio-religious entities in India.

1. The age of the Rig Veda. Plenty has been said about it in another thread and in other places. The Rig Veda itself is older than the disappeared Saraswati and the Harappan civilization which places it prior to 1800 BC

2. This point is a little more difficult and requires a little more reading. read this link - 600 pages onlee

http://www.sriaurobindoashram.org/ashra ... .php?id=30

I am raking up a controversial issue on BRF. But if you read the work by Aurobindo you find that all translations of the Rig Veda are utter bulls#it. The Rig Veda as per Aurobindo's scholarly analysis when translated in the vulgar manner we have seen reads like a nonsensical work by multiple maniacs. But interpreted the way Aurobindo does it - the Rig Veda simply reveals the fundamental basis of the Hindu view of creation and the universe in terms of realization of the absolute and the means to do that.

Sanatana Dharma is older than the Dogniggers of the world will admit - but they cannot know because it requires to be read the way Aurobindo indicates. And yu need to read that to know. Or else you wil read Grifiiths vulgar translation which looks exactly as Aurobindo says - the work of a bunch of madmen who were writing much nonsense.
Last edited by shiv on 06 Mar 2014 22:28, edited 1 time in total.
ramana
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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KLP Dubey keeps saying the RIg Veda is not written by man.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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What is curious to me is that Shmt Doniger and her Indian house ni**ers have not responded to any to the factual errors that were pointed out in her book. Instead just went on to accuse anyone and everyone as yindooooo phundamentalist.

Standard defense of a petty criminal: "I was framed by some yeevil folks".
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

ramana wrote:KLP Dubey keeps saying the RIg Veda is not written by man.
In fact I am reading another book which basically agrees with what Dubey says in terms of the Veda being "sounds"

It is a very difficult read and I am afraid that it is difficult to make sense of even one line of the book. But if you persist - things start falling into place and it is an amazing book. The thing to do is to skim over parts that make no sense - much gets repeated later and gradually starts making sense. It is easy to dismiss the book as utter nonsense which it is not. I am reading it in parallel with Aurobindo. I bet Ms Doniger has no insight into knowledge the way some of these guys have gone. This is a different universe. A totally different paradigm of scholarship.

http://hinduonline.co/DigitalLibrary/Sm ... ersEng.pdf
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by shiv »

Gus wrote:more interesting is the NYT pick comments. almost all of them are the apologetic crap that makes one throw up.
I have started countering silly replies
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ShauryaT »

shiv wrote: Sanatana Dharma is older than the Dogniggers of the world will admit - but they cannot know because it requires to be read the way Aurobindo indicates. And yu need to read that to know. Or else you wil read Grifiiths vulgar translation which looks exactly as Aurobindo says - the work of a bunch of madmen who were writing much nonsense.
Correct. Sri Aurobindo rightfully IMO, and by his own admittance has sought to reinterpret the Rig claiming that Sayana, the last known compiler of the Vedas from the 12th century time frames, was too focused on the Brahamanas (the rituals) part of the vedas, doing disservice to the Samhitas. Hence the entire debate on the original meaning of the Rig. Another person who's translated works I like is David Frawley, who does similar inspired works of the Rig.
Last edited by ShauryaT on 06 Mar 2014 22:40, edited 1 time in total.
ramana
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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shiv, Thanks for the two gems. Will read and get enlightened.
KLP Dubey good job.

ShauryaT, You mean Brahmanas not Brahmans.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

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ramana wrote:KLP Dubey keeps saying the RIg Veda is not written by man.
All practitioners are agreed that the Vedas are without origin. In human parlance the works of god. Now, what and who these gods are is left to imaginations, vicar and anubhuti.
Last edited by ShauryaT on 06 Mar 2014 22:44, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: India Media role in contempt and derision about India

Post by ShauryaT »

ramana wrote:shiv, Thanks for the two gems. Will read and get enlightened.
KLP Dubey good job.

ShauryaT, You mean Brahmanas not Brahmans.
Yes, corrected the same. Thanks.
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