Internal Security Watch

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Kashi
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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Kashi » 24 Apr 2017 19:10

Very sad to see 24 of our bravehearts fall to the enemies of the nation and the people.

Some reports say that another 6-7 are missing, the toll could go even higher.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby SaiK » 24 Apr 2017 19:59

300 maoists attacks, and it is not even a hot topic for BRF.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Sachin » 24 Apr 2017 20:07

Karthik S wrote:Time for the kadi ninda govt to act, this is too high a number to ignore. All the talks about "oh these are our people and our weapons are meant for our enemies" will not work now.

Hope there is public pressure on Modi to ensure that a good response is given. Off course the "seculars" would claim that this is the biggest naxal attack, and such attacks have only increased when Modi came to power. But here if such claims can force GoI to take strong actions against the Naxals I would prefer hearing such comments. All said and done, I feel that Chattisgarh's state police is doing a very shoddy job. How are their intelligence gathering capabilities? In any state where Naxalism was a problem, and which was also ruthlessly put down the core work always was done by the state police and its CID wings. CRPF only supplied the additional man power.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Karthik S » 24 Apr 2017 20:14

Sachin wrote:
Karthik S wrote:Time for the kadi ninda govt to act, this is too high a number to ignore. All the talks about "oh these are our people and our weapons are meant for our enemies" will not work now.

Hope there is public pressure on Modi to ensure that a good response is given. Off course the "seculars" would claim that this is the biggest naxal attack, and such attacks have only increased when Modi came to power. But here if such claims can force GoI to take strong actions against the Naxals I would prefer hearing such comments. All said and done, I feel that Chattisgarh's state police is doing a very shoddy job. How are their intelligence gathering capabilities? In any state where Naxalism was a problem, and which was also ruthlessly put down the core work always was done by the state police and its CID wings. CRPF only supplied the additional man power.


I feel it's high time we ask the military to deal with this naxalism. I don't see it any different from terrorism in that both get their inspiration from an ideology. Anyone who picks up a gun against Indian security forces should be treated as an enemy of the state. I am losing patience on NM on this regard. It's really frustrating that we don't have another alternative. As usual, most of his ministers have tweeted same old things that only infuriates you further.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby shyamal » 24 Apr 2017 20:33

Can they not clean 500 mts of forest each side of this proposed road first? Just to stop ambushes?
http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... TEQmL.html

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Aditya_V » 24 Apr 2017 21:00

Sachin wrote:
Karthik S wrote:Time for the kadi ninda govt to act, this is too high a number to ignore. All the talks about "oh these are our people and our weapons are meant for our enemies" will not work now.

Hope there is public pressure on Modi to ensure that a good response is given. Off course the "seculars" would claim that this is the biggest naxal attack, and such attacks have only increased when Modi came to power. But here if such claims can force GoI to take strong actions against the Naxals I would prefer hearing such comments. All said and done, I feel that Chattisgarh's state police is doing a very shoddy job. How are their intelligence gathering capabilities? In any state where Naxalism was a problem, and which was also ruthlessly put down the core work always was done by the state police and its CID wings. CRPF only supplied the additional man power.


Thats because they have their hand tied behind their backs, since they can't recruit locally, Maoists have blown most of the schools and SC orders have stated only 10th pass is essential. SO no Tribal can join Police force. This is the long haul, we need to track thier recurits and trainers, especially JNU gangs travelling to Chattisgarh

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby tushar_m » 24 Apr 2017 21:03

Best option is to use Drones + Attack choppers (LCH) to decimate naxals from Our country.

CRPF need some good equipment ASAP. They work in some of the most unpredictable environment.

Let them have a sqd. of htt40(gun+freefall bombs) & then see what they do to naxals.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby arshyam » 24 Apr 2017 21:32

It's difficult terrain, for starters. Not sure how effective heli gunships will be against small numbers of terrorists huddled under trees. Not to mention collateral damage, which is why our CI troops don't want to use air power.

Having said that, how can GoI shut down these John Dayal types providing open support to such terrorists? How are they able to get money for finance? TimesNow is showing a clip where some college student types shouting for azadi for Bastar, Kashmir, etc. Hope the intel agencies are on the lookout for future "leaders".

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nam » 24 Apr 2017 21:43

It's obvious that there has break in discipline to have 150 men in one place. Plus no MPV which could have been used as pillbox.

Lets first see how many CRPF bosses are fired for this. Loss of 27 IA men would have caused loss of command for battalion, brigade leads and court martial for immediate commanders.

Needless to say the IPS guys will be transferred to a cosy place and in everything will be forgotten. After all the dead are some poor village fellows.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby nam » 24 Apr 2017 21:45

tushar_m wrote:Best option is to use Drones + Attack choppers (LCH) to decimate naxals from Our country.

CRPF need some good equipment ASAP. They work in some of the most unpredictable environment.

Let them have a sqd. of htt40(gun+freefall bombs) & then see what they do to naxals.


Forget LCH, even if they had used 4-5 MPVs they could have used it as pillbox to defend and respond with LMG. We spend money for nonsense, but dont have money to buy MPVs

Atleast the Pakis put in full effort. They beg, steal, borrow.. I could not but feel envy to see Pakis use MRAPs in their COIN.

Americans would have given couple 100 of MRAPs from Afghanistan for cheap. But we dont want basis things.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 24 Apr 2017 22:32

tushar_m wrote:Best option is to use Drones + Attack choppers (LCH) to decimate naxals from Our country.

CRPF need some good equipment ASAP. They work in some of the most unpredictable environment.

Let them have a sqd. of htt40(gun+freefall bombs) & then see what they do to naxals.


Super tucano, or an armed HTT type armed with machine guns and rockets will be ideal. The forces are fighting a proper counter insurgency campaign against a heavily armed adversary that attacks en-masse. They should take advantage of air superiority at least to break up ambushes like these. Even if they do not get to the ambush site in time to prevent casualties, they can inflict casualties on the maoists, hinder their efforts to pilfer weapons etc. The same platform can also be used for persistent patrolling of LoC/IB.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Sachin » 24 Apr 2017 23:00

Aditya_V wrote:Thats because they have their hand tied behind their backs, since they can't recruit locally, Maoists have blown most of the schools and SC orders have stated only 10th pass is essential. SO no Tribal can join Police force

Then modify the state police recruitment laws. I don't think there is an all-India rule which says every police man should have to be 10th pass. Then there are also options like "Home Guards" available, to kind of recruit people on daily wages basis. I am a bit surprised that when such attacks happen it is only the CRPF which gets hit, never heard stories of Chattisgarh Police personnel being attacked. Has the state completeley given up the job of anti-naxal operations to CRPF?

sudeepj wrote:The forces are fighting a proper counter insurgency campaign against a heavily armed adversary that attacks en-masse.

I am not an expert. But looks like the intelligence gathering mechanism in Chattisgarh is pathetic. It is more of the standard IT-vity game of "throwing more bodies". CRPF men most likely would not be even from the same area, they are just large group of men. Consider forces like Andhra Pradesh "Grey hounds". These folks were all men from Andhra pradesh police only. But with proper training, and the state also focused on good intelligence gathering. See how TN police or KL police finished of Naxalism, it is not just using brute force. But using good intelligence gathering mechanism. I feel that Chattisgarh government has happily outsourced the naxal problem fix to CRPF and expects others to do the dirty job.

Karthik S wrote:I feel it's high time we ask the military to deal with this naxalism. I don't see it any different from terrorism in that both get their inspiration from an ideology.

I humbly disagree. Honestly, I don't wish to see IA having to work against another group of terrorists. They already have their hands full. Naxal problem, IMHO can be brought under control if the states which have this problem itself takes some responsibility. What NM, should do is to make the Chattisgarh CM to take some ownership to get this issue fixed up. That state cannot just pass the buck to the CRPF or any other central government agency to fix the state's issues. Please correct me if I am wrong. When was there such a massive attack against Chattisgarh's own police force? Do they even exist? Because I don't even hear the name of this police force (be it crime investigation, quelling riots or any anti-naxal initiatives). This issue cannot be fixed quickly, but the state should have some short term and long term plans. And the central government can provide help, guidance and expertise.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 24 Apr 2017 23:08

None of us are experts.. if the solutions were as easy as 'recruit more locals', people whose lives depended on it would have already done it! Lets not be over smart and be disrespectful. Chattisgarh/Sukma has been the heart of the heart or naxal territory. Such casualties are to be expected as the door of the castle is kicked in.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 24 Apr 2017 23:22

Actually, given CRPF is going to be engaged in counter insurgency for the foreseeable future (next 10 years at least), I dont see why they should not start a few coin-air support squadron with turbo prop aircraft. Something like we already manufacture such as the PC7 or the soon to come HTT can be ideal. Long loiter times, precise rules of engagement, accurate weapons.. We can wrap up the insurgencies at a much faster pace than we are doing right now.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby rsingh » 24 Apr 2017 23:23

x post from pol drama thread:
CRPF has to use cheap toy drones to scan 5Km radius constantly. If I were CRPF officer I would have bought this with my money. I am as frustrated as everybody. Give security (sector by sector on grid) to private companies who will be paid for law and order (under strict rules of engagements) and the see how such leeches disappears. Sala punching bag bana rakha hei Bh-arat ko

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby rsingh » 24 Apr 2017 23:25

sudeepj wrote:None of us are experts.. if the solutions were as easy as 'recruit more locals', people whose lives depended on it would have already done it! Lets not be over smart and be disrespectful. Chattisgarh/Sukma has been the heart of the heart or naxal territory. Such casualties are to be expected as the door of the castle is kicked in.


That is language of defeated victim. Not good enough.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby rsingh » 24 Apr 2017 23:28

No noise from peacniks,commies or NGO. CRPF life doesn't matter. Sale khadi or og bindi laga ke baith jayge NDTV par.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Bheeshma » 25 Apr 2017 00:00

Does CRPF have any Helis? Rudras would be ideal to take out these vermins. Heck go with agent orange if required.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby brvarsh » 25 Apr 2017 00:36

"If Army gets involved.." - No it should not get involved if nothing else for simple precedence. Naxals are not the thing that CRPF can not control and eliminate. No attack can ever happen if the the attacking group knows they can be encircled in a few minutes time. CRPF must be backed by air that the scale of attack can trigger.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 25 Apr 2017 00:42

rsingh wrote:
sudeepj wrote:None of us are experts.. if the solutions were as easy as 'recruit more locals', people whose lives depended on it would have already done it! Lets not be over smart and be disrespectful. Chattisgarh/Sukma has been the heart of the heart or naxal territory. Such casualties are to be expected as the door of the castle is kicked in.


That is language of defeated victim. Not good enough.


Right.. people whose only experience of a tactical situation is the nukkad luka-chipi coming up with harebrained "ideas" for people who are actually experts, and whose lives actually depend on their tactics.. that is what victors should do. Carry on.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Chandragupta » 25 Apr 2017 00:50

Recon UAVs and simply following SOPs laid down by the CRPF itself can save a lot our good men. I have to say that Rajnath Singh as HM has simply failed to sort out Naxals. We need an iron fist to squat the maoists. At the very least, let our men have good equipment. They don't even have basic supplies there in the jungles.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 25 Apr 2017 00:59

The most recent violence has not happened in a vaccum. There are moves and counter moves going on, and the avg. newbie here should read about the strategic moves before engaging in useless anger. Its as if in WW II, the news of 2000 allied casualties came in, and we go into mourning without knowing the context that D-Day has just happened and the allies have invaded Europe.

http://www.openthemagazine.com/article/ ... or-maoists

On THE NIGHT OF February 4th, two armed Maoist guerrillas abducted Suriyam Buccha from Merwahi village in Chhattisgarh’s Sukma district. The village is situated in a dense forest, about 18 km from Dornapal town. In the absence of a road, one can only reach there by foot or on a motorcycle. By the time Buccha’s wife and two children followed them to the forest, his abductors had killed him by cutting his chest open with sharp-edged weapons. As his wailing family looked on, the Maoists put an Improvised Explosive Device (IED) under his body. It was meant as a trap for police personnel who would come later to retrieve his body. But after much pleading by his family, the guerrillas relented and removed the bomb before disappearing deeper into the forest.

Buccha’s killing is not a lone case. In the past few months, Maoists have killed hundreds of civilians in their areas of influence along the entire Red corridor, especially in the Dandakaranya Special Zone Committee (DKSZC), of which Bastar division (now divided into seven districts, including Sukma) is a part. “Every day we come across such killings by Maoists in remote villages where no First Information Report (FIR) has been filed,” says Vivek Shukla, deputy superintendent of police in Sukma. Three days before killing Buccha, Maoists held hostage the entire villages of Burdikarka and Dhanikarka in the neighbouring Dantewada district and severely beat up dozens of villagers. People from these two and another village called Gadmiri had recently held a mass protest against Maoists. In a kangaroo court held by Maoists that night, a villager of Burdikarka called Samo Mandwi was pulled out and killed. Mandwi had, a few days earlier, taken part in a police recruitment programme. On March 5th, Maoists killed Kalmu Podiya in Sukma’s Rabripara village on charges of being a police informer. On March 3rd, they slit the throat of a young man called Mahender in Dhurawas village on similar charges.

The killings are seen as a sign of desperation as the Indian state pushes deep into the Maoist heartland, pressing thousands of security forces, who are for the first time now entering villages that have remained cut off for decades. In the entire Bastar division, roads and mobile networks are being built on a war footing. In areas where the Maoist writ has run large for at least three decades, road construction is going on in full swing, even at night, under a heavy security cover. In the past, construction companies were reluctant to bid for work due to the fear of a Maoist backlash. But now, in Chhattisgarh at least, no tender for road construction has gone unfulfilled.

...
THE MAOISTS ENTERED Bastar for the first time in June 1980. The newly founded CPI-ML (People’s War)—which later merged with another Maoist group in 2004 to become the CPI (Maoist)—led by its Andhra-based leader, Kondapalli Seetharamaiah, formed seven squads to create a rear base where safe guerrilla zones could be created. Four of these pitched camp in areas that are now in Telangana: Khammam, Karimnagar, Warangal and Adilabad. Three other squads went across the Godavari river, one of them to Gadchiroli in Maharashtra, while two of them went to Bastar (then a part of Madhya Pradesh). ... By the early 2000s, Maoists had turned the entire Bastar division into a guerrilla zone.

.....

In response to Judum, in 2005 Maoists uprooted electric poles and destroyed transformers wherever they existed in their strongholds. “Imagine, I had almost 24-hour access to electricity in Chintalnar in 1986. More than 30 years later, I have to have my dinner under a solar lantern,” says a villager. In response to Judum, Maoists uprooted electric poles and destroyed transformers wherever they existed in their strongholds. “Imagine, I had almost 24-hour access to electricity in Chintalnar in 1986. More than 30 years later, I have to have my dinner under a solar lantern,” says a villager. It is in 2005 that Jagargunda was cut off as well. [b]The Maoists demolished all government buildings in Jagargunda and damaged the Mallevaju Bridge on the Dornapal-Jagargunda road, cutting off access. From Chintalnar onwards, in the absence of any security personnel, Maoist guerrillas would come out unhindered and operate freely. But now with the road construction, the axis of control has changed. The Maoists have retreated from the road.

...

[/b]


Instead of disrespecting CRPF soldiers by coming up with harebrained stupidity "..If I were him, I would have bought a drone.." assuming that you are the only smart one around do something useful. Such as engaging the supporters of Naxalism on social media with facts and figures.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 25 Apr 2017 01:02

Here is a map of the area, to match names with physical locations:
Image

The midday attack, which occurred between the Burkapal-Chintagufa area in the Maoist hotbed of Bastar.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby ramana » 25 Apr 2017 01:33

sudeepj are you on Twitter?

Exactly being done even of the RW loudmouths too.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby Raja Bose » 25 Apr 2017 01:42

I don't know how accurate the reports are but it might have similarities with the Dantewada ambush where lax security led to the ambush. In this case some reports claim the jawans were having lunch when the ambush happened. We need a force along the lines of RR for tackling this Naxal terrorism. Paunchy IPS babus can't do the job. There are exceptions like Vijay Kumar but he is gone now. The operational conditions and terrain are extremely harsh and IPS babus cannot fathom the fact that you can't just treat the CRPF deployment in these areas like a regular police bandobast and police chowki type camps. The chattisgarh police is riddled with Naxal informers so CRPF needs its own intel network on the ground like what BSF built in early days of Kashmir insurgency.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby rsingh » 25 Apr 2017 01:50

sudeepj wrote:
rsingh wrote:
That is language of defeated victim. Not good enough.


Right.. people whose only experience of a tactical situation is the nukkad luka-chipi coming up with harebrained "ideas" for people who are actually experts, and whose lives actually depend on their tactics.. that is what victors should do. Carry on.


I knew this is last refuge for people like you. I am sitting 7000 km from India. I sent fortune to india (to help my family ) but Euro went to GOI. What do you want I leave everything here and fight? Sal what the hell you people doing there? Corruption everywhere ek 90 Euro ka toy drone tak nahi buy kar sakte? Seen fighter like you. Local goons disturb your sis and you will say this will happen but will peakout within 2-3 years so no problem. shabash

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby ramana » 25 Apr 2017 01:53

Usually when such an incident happens we post actual press reports to read and analyze.

This time we have a stream of commentary.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby rsingh » 25 Apr 2017 02:00

sudeepj wrote:The most recent violence has not happened in a vaccum. There are moves and counter moves going on, and the avg. newbie here should read about the strategic moves before engaging in useless anger. Its as if in WW II, the news of 2000 allied casualties came in, and we go into mourning without knowing the context that D-Day has just happened and the allies have invaded Europe.

http://www.openthemagazine.com/article/ ... or-maoists

On THE NIGHT OF February 4th, two armed Maoist guerrillas abducted Suriyam Buccha from Merwahi village in Chhattisgarh’s Sukma district. The village is situated in a dense forest, about 18 km from Dornapal town. In the absence of a road, one can only reach there by foot or on a motorcycle. By the time Buccha’s wife and two children followed them to the forest, his abductors had killed him by cutting his chest open with sharp-edged weapons. As his wailing family looked on, the Maoists put an Improvised Explosive Device (IED) under his body. It was meant as a trap for police personnel who would come later to retrieve his body. But after much pleading by his family, the guerrillas relented and removed the bomb before disappearing deeper into the forest.

Buccha’s killing is not a lone case. In the past few months, Maoists have killed hundreds of civilians in their areas of influence along the entire Red corridor, especially in the Dandakaranya Special Zone Committee (DKSZC), of which Bastar division (now divided into seven districts, including Sukma) is a part. “Every day we come across such killings by Maoists in remote villages where no First Information Report (FIR) has been filed,” says Vivek Shukla, deputy superintendent of police in Sukma. Three days before killing Buccha, Maoists held hostage the entire villages of Burdikarka and Dhanikarka in the neighbouring Dantewada district and severely beat up dozens of villagers. People from these two and another village called Gadmiri had recently held a mass protest against Maoists. In a kangaroo court held by Maoists that night, a villager of Burdikarka called Samo Mandwi was pulled out and killed. Mandwi had, a few days earlier, taken part in a police recruitment programme. On March 5th, Maoists killed Kalmu Podiya in Sukma’s Rabripara village on charges of being a police informer. On March 3rd, they slit the throat of a young man called Mahender in Dhurawas village on similar charges.

The killings are seen as a sign of desperation as the Indian state pushes deep into the Maoist heartland, pressing thousands of security forces, who are for the first time now entering villages that have remained cut off for decades. In the entire Bastar division, roads and mobile networks are being built on a war footing. In areas where the Maoist writ has run large for at least three decades, road construction is going on in full swing, even at night, under a heavy security cover. In the past, construction companies were reluctant to bid for work due to the fear of a Maoist backlash. But now, in Chhattisgarh at least, no tender for road construction has gone unfulfilled.

...
THE MAOISTS ENTERED Bastar for the first time in June 1980. The newly founded CPI-ML (People’s War)—which later merged with another Maoist group in 2004 to become the CPI (Maoist)—led by its Andhra-based leader, Kondapalli Seetharamaiah, formed seven squads to create a rear base where safe guerrilla zones could be created. Four of these pitched camp in areas that are now in Telangana: Khammam, Karimnagar, Warangal and Adilabad. Three other squads went across the Godavari river, one of them to Gadchiroli in Maharashtra, while two of them went to Bastar (then a part of Madhya Pradesh). ... By the early 2000s, Maoists had turned the entire Bastar division into a guerrilla zone.

.....

In response to Judum, in 2005 Maoists uprooted electric poles and destroyed transformers wherever they existed in their strongholds. “Imagine, I had almost 24-hour access to electricity in Chintalnar in 1986. More than 30 years later, I have to have my dinner under a solar lantern,” says a villager. In response to Judum, Maoists uprooted electric poles and destroyed transformers wherever they existed in their strongholds. “Imagine, I had almost 24-hour access to electricity in Chintalnar in 1986. More than 30 years later, I have to have my dinner under a solar lantern,” says a villager. It is in 2005 that Jagargunda was cut off as well. [b]The Maoists demolished all government buildings in Jagargunda and damaged the Mallevaju Bridge on the Dornapal-Jagargunda road, cutting off access. From Chintalnar onwards, in the absence of any security personnel, Maoist guerrillas would come out unhindered and operate freely. But now with the road construction, the axis of control has changed. The Maoists have retreated from the road.

...

[/b]


Instead of disrespecting CRPF soldiers by coming up with harebrained stupidity "..If I were him, I would have bought a drone.." assuming that you are the only smart one around do something useful. Such as engaging the supporters of Naxalism on social media with facts and figures.


I am not disrespecting any body. i am angry at their equipment and bhdhizivi like you. my friend use toy drone and it is cheaper then pair of shoes. control with mobile. You can easily see what is happening around you. Point. that is biggest weakness CRPF an dI try to give solution. Where is stupidity here. And what makes you think you are all knowing super human ? You are ready to suffer for 10 years till it dies natural death. Now think carefully and then write what you have to. Do not shit around with defeated mentality.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby ramana » 25 Apr 2017 02:01


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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby sudeepj » 25 Apr 2017 02:04

ramana wrote:sudeepj are you on Twitter?

Exactly being done even of the RW loudmouths too.


Yes, I am.

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Re: Internal Security Watch

Postby ramana » 25 Apr 2017 02:16


Surya
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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby Surya » 25 Apr 2017 07:46

Did the Naxalite INSAS rifles jam?

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby Philip » 25 Apr 2017 12:26

The catastrophe in Chattisgarh where the CRPF were virtually wiped out by Naxals,at least 25 dead,commander missing,is a stunning reminder that all is not well in India's "Red Belt",and that we are actually in a grave crisis internally. The Week's expose that in Nagaland,there is a de-facto separate govt. in charge using the "Bible and Bullet" ruling the roost, shows that much is amiss at the MHA and its understanding of the insurgency problem affecting the NEastern states and how to deal with the Naxals.

Yes,no doubt they're recg. some moral and logistic help from China and Pak,whoever,but what are we doing about the repeated attacks ad nauseum by the Naxals in the countryt? Some time ago the IAF was reportedly loath to use air power against them,but are not the valiant CRPF jawans our brothers? Is the life of a CRPF jawan inferior to that of the other gallant soldiers in other uniforms? They ALL serve the motherland and there should be no distinction made when it comes with dealing with India's enemies,whether they're internal or external.

This govt. will fast lose credibility if it cannot contain the Paki terrorists and stone pelters in J&K,Naxals across India and the NEastern rebel movements.
AS far as the Naxals go,it is past time to use max force to exterminate them.The GOI has the resources,the manpower and tech capability to do so and must do so,and use every asset of air power to identify locations of Naxal bases,and destroy them along with their cadre, if further disastrous defeats do not hit us every morning as we read the news. It is clear that the CRPF yet again has been found wanting and therefore better minds should take control of the war against the Naxals.

https://www.telegraphindia.com/1170425/ ... P7wi9KGOM8
Maoists kill 25 jawans
Our Special Correspondent

A handout photo shows wounded security personnel being treated in an army helicopter en route to a hospital after the attack in Sukma, Chhattisgarh. (AFP/The defence ministry)

April 24: At least 25 CRPF troops were killed in the middle of a meal this noon in Chhattisgarh's Sukma in a belt known as "the Maoist Tora Bora", a reference to the Taliban hideout in Afghanistan.

The whereabouts of seven other jawans were not known till tonight.

A part of the 74 battalion of the paramilitary force, which came under attack around 12.30pm, was entrusted with the task of protecting workers building a crucial road.

Once completed, the road linking Sukma town to Jagargunda, a distance of over 100km, is expected to play a key role in helping the security forces break the rebel domination over the territory.

Among the 25 confirmed casualties is Inspector Rabhubir Singh. Three of the dead hailed from Bengal: sub-inspector Krishna Kumar Das and constable Binoy Chandra Barman from Cooch Behar and constable Arup Karmakar from Nadia.

"Over 300 armed Maoists attacked us. We tried to retaliate but they snatched our arms, ammunition and wireless sets. We fired at them and I saw three-four Maoists succumbing to injuries on the spot," CRPF jawan Sher Mohammad told local media.

The encounter took place at Kala Pathar near Chintagufa at Sukma, 400km from state capital Raipur.


The gun battle is said to have lasted about an hour. Mohammad, who suffered injuries, alleged that the Maoists had first sent villagers sympathetic to them to pinpoint the location of the paramilitary troops.

Some jawans were reportedly making instant noodles and some others were cooking rice when the attack began, sources said
.

But Bastar inspector-general Vivekanand Sinha said, quoting preliminary reports, that the Maoists had ambushed a patrolling party of the CRPF near Burkapal village. :?: Around 90 CRPF jawans were on duty to sanitise the road that is being built in the area when the Maoists, divided into multiple groups, attacked the CRPF party.

As many as 90,000 personnel of the CRPF are now deployed in the Maoist strongholds in Chhattisgarh, Jharkhand and Andhra Pradesh.

This is the second attack in two months in the same region. Twelve CRPF personnel were killed on March 11 when Maoists had ambushed a CRPF patrol and looted their arms in Sukma.

A beleaguered Chhattisgarh chief minister, Raman Singh, called off his visit to Delhi and chaired a high-level meeting to take stock of the situation. In political circles, there is speculation that Singh may soon be given a gubernatorial assignment in the wake of the Chhattisgarh government's repeated failure to check the frequent Maoists attacks.

President Pranab Mukherjee, Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Union home minister Rajnath Singh condemned the attack. In a tweet, Modi termed the attack "cowardly" and "deplorable".

"The sacrifice of the martyrs will not go in vain. Condolences to their families," the Prime Minister tweeted.

Rajnath said minister of state for home Hansraj Ahir was heading to Raipur to supervise relief and rescue operations.
Last edited by ramana on 26 Apr 2017 00:49, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Added bold high lights ramana

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby Aditya G » 25 Apr 2017 13:04

After latest battle with Maoists, and perceived loss faced by CRPF, I would also now question the effectiveness of our civilian security agencies especially CRPF and IB.

In Kashmir and north east the army is essentially doing the heavy lifting and for years the whole security apparatus is getting a free ticket on back of the army hard work.

The Maoist war, JNU subversion and stone pelting is entirely in civvies domain. What the fck are they up to?

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby Aditya_V » 25 Apr 2017 13:26

But where a party 300-400 men hide, surely they must be going for some R&R. Why cant we use AIrcraft/intel tools to locate this party, cordon off entire villages in the belt before they can disburse and regroup before the next attack?

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby rkhanna » 25 Apr 2017 13:34

Lets not blame the CRPF for this. the situation on the ground is a whole lot of grey.

Let me give you an example. A cousin of mine recently finished shooting a movie deep in the middle of Naxal/Left Terror Territory in Chhattisgarh.

To get permission to shoot a CRPF company was deployed for "protection". The permission came after a Joint meeting with CRPF Commander, Local Politican Leader, Local Police Head and 2 Leaders of 2 different faction of Naxal Rebels all in attendence.

Through the 40 day shoot the CRPF troops were shit scared throughout enforcing pack-up of sheet by 5pm each day. Why? Because at any moment one of the Naxal leaders could change their mind. OR a third naxal faction looking to earn a name could become defiant. Or the Villagers could just be bored. etc etc. ALL villagers worked formally or informally with the Naxals.

The NAXALs btw run things there. in 40 days over 100+kms of road was made while my cousin and his crew were shooting. The local cops said only possible if the naxals allow (and they take a BIG cut). Center/State Govt really dont have a say in this because well all Local Politicians are also hand and fist in it.

CRPF btw gets most likely caught in the politics and power struggles between Rebels + Different Rebel factions, Politicans and Local Cops. and as such are ALWAYS sitting ducks. One day a village that is friendly to them due to deals cut or previous understanding could sell them out and they are not prepared. They have ZERO autonomy to act or plan ops without interference.

BTW some of India's biggest Yellow Cake mines run through naxal territories. I dont even want to tell you what happens there.

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby Sicanta » 25 Apr 2017 14:04

rkhanna wrote:Lets not blame the CRPF for this. the situation on the ground is a whole lot of grey.

Let me give you an example. A cousin of mine recently finished shooting a movie deep in the middle of Naxal/Left Terror Territory in Chhattisgarh.

To get permission to shoot a CRPF company was deployed for "protection". The permission came after a Joint meeting with CRPF Commander, Local Politican Leader, Local Police Head and 2 Leaders of 2 different faction of Naxal Rebels all in attendence.

Through the 40 day shoot the CRPF troops were shit scared throughout enforcing pack-up of sheet by 5pm each day. Why? Because at any moment one of the Naxal leaders could change their mind. OR a third naxal faction looking to earn a name could become defiant. Or the Villagers could just be bored. etc etc. ALL villagers worked formally or informally with the Naxals.

The NAXALs btw run things there. in 40 days over 100+kms of road was made while my cousin and his crew were shooting. The local cops said only possible if the naxals allow (and they take a BIG cut). Center/State Govt really dont have a say in this because well all Local Politicians are also hand and fist in it.

CRPF btw gets most likely caught in the politics and power struggles between Rebels + Different Rebel factions, Politicans and Local Cops. and as such are ALWAYS sitting ducks. One day a village that is friendly to them due to deals cut or previous understanding could sell them out and they are not prepared. They have ZERO autonomy to act or plan ops without interference.

BTW some of India's biggest Yellow Cake mines run through naxal territories. I dont even want to tell you what happens there.


I have a question - are the villagers working for monetary benefits or is it ideological? Former would be easier to wean away. Plus what does indeed happen at these mines?

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby rkhanna » 25 Apr 2017 15:16

{I have a question - are the villagers working for monetary benefits or is it ideological? Former would be easier to wean away. Plus what does indeed happen at these mines?}

IMO - neither . its just their way of life. Most have family members with the rebels, alot of the older ones have been ex rebels themselves so are partial to them. The rebels inturn protect the villagers from other rebel factions / Police harassment / etc etc. The Rebels control the economy of the local areas so there is a co -dependence.

There is not much of Ideology left its business.

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby rkhanna » 25 Apr 2017 15:27

(Plus what does indeed happen at these mines?)

I think since 2008 a good 10 odd Kgs of Uranium has been caught being smuggled from mines in the North East. (google will bring up the articles). From Chaiwala talk says this is only the tip of the iceberg as the geography and Politico-Organized Crime nexus makes these mines a virtual black box of Information.

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Re: BSF, CRPF and other Paramilitary Forces Discussion

Postby tsarkar » 25 Apr 2017 15:39

^^ There are idle populations in villages would would do anything for a bottle of illicit booze paid for by Maoists. Mining companies pay extortion money to naxals on threat of kidnapping of staff & families. The money is used to pay off politicians. Its a thriving industry.

The Maoists are there to stay while Govt Administration is transient. So villagers know which side to throw their lot with. No/Few Govt Officers/Doctors want to work in those remote areas. There is a governance deficit and the maoists are filling the vacuum.

I'm curious how the Maoists acquire ammunition for their AK-47 and INSAS, unless there is massive pilferage of State and Central forces armories. One needs ammunition to practice to build and retain proficiency.


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